@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
Shortly before my daughter was born I read Germaine Greer's The Whole Woman. The chapter that made the greatest impression on me was the one where she rejected any idea of a special role for fathers that was distinct from that of mothers. The role of a father was no different from that of a mother - to love and care for their child.
And, mostly, that's how I view the two sexes. Men and women are both people, and I don't think there's anything fundamentally different between the two sexes, except for what we've been taught, or except for those things that are part of the sexual dimorphism (bell curve for height, muscle mass, body fat, etc and different roles in sexual reproduction).
So I wouldn't see an interest in trainspotting as being a male trait (just a weird trait). I don't see what it would have to do with genitalia at all.
Bettelheim will be disappointed then. 😟. There’s need to rewrite all the fairy tales if Greer is right on that.
So I guess we’re going to have men with cervical and ovarian cancer and women with testicular cancer. I hope they screen appropriately - because gender = sex has consequences.
They do. They're doctors not fucking imbeciles.
Sometimes they change your sex in their records when you don’t ask them to:
So I guess we’re going to have men with cervical and ovarian cancer and women with testicular cancer. I hope they screen appropriately - because gender = sex has consequences.
They do. They're doctors not fucking imbeciles.
Yes, and hence the occasional use of phrases such as "people with cervixes" and "people who menstruate" and the manufactured outrage in response to them.
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
My younger ****** age ** now wants to be called They or Them, and identifies as genderqueer, even though she clearly fancies boys, has slept with boys, and is quite obviously heterosexual
I do fear this is a lefty madness we have enforced on an entire generation which we will later look back on, and we will shudder
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
My younger ****** age ** now wants to be called They or Them, and identifies as genderqueer, even though she clearly fancies boys, has slept with boys, and is quite obviously heterosexual
I do fear this is a lefty madness we have enforced on an entire generation which we will later look back on, and we will shudder
So. Having slept with boys, and clearly fancies boys makes you obviously heterosexual? A nation of bisexuals sigh, boomer Granddad. Get with the programme. Nothing sadder than a former radical libertine who now isn't.
So I guess we’re going to have men with cervical and ovarian cancer and women with testicular cancer. I hope they screen appropriately - because gender = sex has consequences.
They do. They're doctors not fucking imbeciles.
Haven’t you missed the point though? Just look at the nhs link above. If you are a trans man registered as male you will not automatically receive reminders/requests to present for screening. If you are registered as female you will. Of course the former can still gain access - but clearly some will fall through the net. Of course overall the numbers are small - but if they grew...?
Also this is just the well known and established screening. If the Govt announced new gender specific mass screening programmes then there is a question of awareness for those not automatically contacted due to registration status.
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
I have a huge problem with this. Norman? FFS!!!
Normana was the name of the daughter of one of Harry Enfield's Tory characters.
Funny you should mention Harry Enfield, because reading this thread made me think of this sketch, and look it up on YouTube
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
My younger ****** age ** now wants to be called They or Them, and identifies as genderqueer, even though she clearly fancies boys, has slept with boys, and is quite obviously heterosexual
I do fear this is a lefty madness we have enforced on an entire generation which we will later look back on, and we will shudder
So. Having slept with boys, and clearly fancies boys makes you obviously heterosexual? A nation of bisexuals sigh, boomer Grandad. Get with the programme. Nothing sadder than a former radical who now isn't.
Whuh? Sod off
I also have a very close friend with a daughter who "transitioned" to being a boy at the age of 12-13, including full on hormones, drugs, breast-suppressing clothes, and the whole shebang, and is now doing surgery, and now there is evidence of deep regret and the whole family is shattered and at war and the grandparents died, estranged
Is that good?
It's not good. My honest opinion - drunk, at 1am - this girl was just mildly autistic, possibly bisexual, but she had a very neurotic mother who encouraged the weird full on trans stuff, and the result is catastrophic for all, including the child
That's just my opinion. But I have witnessed the damage this trans ideology can do to young people and their families up-close and it is not good
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
My younger ****** age ** now wants to be called They or Them, and identifies as genderqueer, even though she clearly fancies boys, has slept with boys, and is quite obviously heterosexual
I do fear this is a lefty madness we have enforced on an entire generation which we will later look back on, and we will shudder
Well at least she has not yet gone so far as to become a LD
So I guess we’re going to have men with cervical and ovarian cancer and women with testicular cancer. I hope they screen appropriately - because gender = sex has consequences.
They do. They're doctors not fucking imbeciles.
Sometimes they change your sex in their records when you don’t ask them to:
So I guess we’re going to have men with cervical and ovarian cancer and women with testicular cancer. I hope they screen appropriately - because gender = sex has consequences.
They do. They're doctors not fucking imbeciles.
Haven’t you missed the point though? Just look at the nhs link above. If you are a trans man registered as male you will not automatically receive reminders/requests to present for screening. If you are registered as female you will. Of course the former can still gain access - but clearly some will fall through the net. Of course overall the numbers are small - but if they grew...?
Also this is just the well known and established screening. If the Govt announced new gender specific mass screening programmes then there is a question of awareness for those not automatically contacted due to registration status.
Absolutely. Which is why the male/female is a pointless binary. But some are desperate to preserve it.
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
My younger ****** age ** now wants to be called They or Them, and identifies as genderqueer, even though she clearly fancies boys, has slept with boys, and is quite obviously heterosexual
I do fear this is a lefty madness we have enforced on an entire generation which we will later look back on, and we will shudder
So. Having slept with boys, and clearly fancies boys makes you obviously heterosexual? A nation of bisexuals sigh, boomer Grandad. Get with the programme. Nothing sadder than a former radical who now isn't.
Whuh? Sod off
I also have a very close friend with a daughter who "transitioned" to being a boy at the age of 12-13, including full on hormones, drugs, breast-suppressing clothes, and the whole shebang, and is now doing surgery, and now there is evidence of deep regret and the whole family is shattered and at war and the grandparents died, estranged
Is that good?
It's not good. My honest opinion - drunk, at 1am - this girl was just mildly autistic, possibly bisexual, but she had a very neurotic mother who encouraged the weird full on trans stuff, and the result is catastrophic for all, including the child
That's just my opinion. But I have witnessed the damage this trans ideology can do to young people and their families up-close and it is not good
Night night
I will have to check the legality of that before replying. However, your automatic conflation of bisexuality and being trans seems somewhat strange.
@LostPassword I also have some difficulty with the promotion of surgery to chop bits off when I was brought up with the ideal that we should be proud of and accepting of who we are, regardless of if it’s not the ideal (society or personal). I do however appreciate that maybe I just don’t understand because I don’t experience gender dysmorphia.
I don't understand. I'd like to think I was capable of understanding. That I could be persuaded.
However, I see the way in which Rosie Duffield is treated. I see the way in which all my friends on Facebook spit venom at the mention of JK Rowling or Joanna Cherry, and I feel that the only place where I can safely express my lack of understanding is on a pseudonymous blog on political betting.
I start to sound to myself like some washed up old comedian who might have complained a few years ago about not being allowed to make jokes about fags anymore. I do worry that maybe I am becoming one of the middle-aged bigots that I couldn't understand as a youngster. But if my daughter ever told me that she thought she was a man I cannot help but expect that I would believe she had lost her mind. I remember explaining to her as a small child that while she could be whatever she wanted to be when she was an adult, that didn't include being a zebra. Well, she's never going to be a man either. Not really. It doesn't really harm anyone for her to pretend if she would want to, but some things are just the way they are.
So, my daughter is 13, and one of her friends has asked to be called Norman, and says she now identifies as a man.
All the 13 year old girls think this is fine, and normal. And if she wants to be called Norman, good for her him, and I'm totally OK with respecting that choice.
But I don't really understand why she thinks she's a man. She has no male characteristics that I can divine, and has no male friends. (Not that many 13 year old girls have male friends.)
So, what is the male-ness that she thinks she possesses?
I have a huge problem with this. Norman? FFS!!!
Normana was the name of the daughter of one of Harry Enfield's Tory characters.
Funny you should mention Harry Enfield, because reading this thread made me think of this sketch, and look it up on YouTube
Luke Akehurst @lukeakehurst · 4h It's disappointing that Andy McDonald would distract from a successful conference by grandstanding like this. He hasn't been a high profile member of the shadow cabinet so his departure enables Keir to promote a heavier hitter, one who understands collective responsibility.
===
I think PB may dispute the "successful conference" tag there!
It depends what the function of conference is. Party rally with flags and lights and cult of the Dear Leader?, or a serious discussion over policies, and with decision making powers?
Labour conferences have long been more like the latter.
If that’s a serious observation, you haven’t been looking
Just went to check the Labour manifesto to see if this guy was right Starmer was not honouring a pledge made in it (or during his leadership campaign - maybe he said he supported it then, but his 10 generic pledges don't as far as I can see), since he refers to this issue as the 'latest of many', and the Labour site has under 'additional manifestoes':
Youth Manifesto Charter for the Arts Race and Faith Manifesto Environment Manifesto Manifesto for Disabled People Workers' rights manifesto Regional manifestoes Housing manifesto
Kudos, I suppose, but it seems like too many.
You can't just point at something and make a manifesto for it!
The seven energy suppliers wot went bust recently is going to mean an extra £30 added onto everyone’s bills from next April.
And that’s just 7 companies, 1.5m customers. Talk of 40 or more going under. By my calculations, next years energy bills could end up being on average, £150-200 more as a result of this mess.
The triumph of market competition! Higher prices for all ☹️
The £30, or even the £200, is likely far less than we have benefited per annum from having the most open market system for the last decade.
Since switching services came in here, the initial saving has been about 25-35% over standard pricing (that's the number my Ts have saved when I help them do it over the last decade and a bit), which is multiple times the cost we will be suffering now.
On the Daily Mail or the Guardian being evil or not, I listened to the Panorama about Martin Bashir / Princess Diana.
And the Mail was the one on the trail of the cover up at the BBC over the activities of Martin Bashir, and the internal enquiry, and was excoriated into silence.
Comments
I don’t think she is.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56942480.amp
I do fear this is a lefty madness we have enforced on an entire generation which we will later look back on, and we will shudder
A nation of bisexuals sigh, boomer Granddad.
Get with the programme. Nothing sadder than a former radical libertine who now isn't.
Also this is just the well known and established screening. If the Govt announced new gender specific mass screening programmes then there is a question of awareness for those not automatically contacted due to registration status.
The only other Yorkshireman sketch:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jY4tD2Hbg_A
I also have a very close friend with a daughter who "transitioned" to being a boy at the age of 12-13, including full on hormones, drugs, breast-suppressing clothes, and the whole shebang, and is now doing surgery, and now there is evidence of deep regret and the whole family is shattered and at war and the grandparents died, estranged
Is that good?
It's not good. My honest opinion - drunk, at 1am - this girl was just mildly autistic, possibly bisexual, but she had a very neurotic mother who encouraged the weird full on trans stuff, and the result is catastrophic for all, including the child
That's just my opinion. But I have witnessed the damage this trans ideology can do to young people and their families up-close and it is not good
Night night
However, your automatic conflation of bisexuality and being trans seems somewhat strange.
Since switching services came in here, the initial saving has been about 25-35% over standard pricing (that's the number my Ts have saved when I help them do it over the last decade and a bit), which is multiple times the cost we will be suffering now.
And the Mail was the one on the trail of the cover up at the BBC over the activities of Martin Bashir, and the internal enquiry, and was excoriated into silence.
I think I may have jumped threads