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One Current Leader. And One Future One? – politicalbetting.com

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  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,360
    Excellent article as always.

    A Labour MP can't go to their own conference because of intimidation, not from the extreme right but from the left of centre, and the leadership does not deny this is true.

    And this is now so taken for granted that it is not making banner headlines across the UK and the world.

    Nationally the Labour party project an image of simply not comprehending the liberal agenda.

    The liberal agenda can espouse progressive causes, but what counts as progressive is often not self-evident; the starting point of a liberal society is the conviction that progress comes about through an open society with freedom of thought and persuasive argument. Without that both in theory and practice you don't get to first base.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    Cyclefree said:

    In response to @kinabalu - "I'd start with this question: What should the balance be between self-ID and medical certification in the process for changing gender?

    Then based on the answer to this proceed to 2 more:

    - What medical and other resource is required to make the process humane and efficient?
    - On what grounds should female only activities and spaces be able to exclude transwomen?"

    I think this structure can generate a good debate and a good policy for any political party."

    This is a not bad approach. And my answer to the first question is this.

    - There is nothing to stop any man calling himself a female name or dressing in women's clothes. There is absolutely no reason for the law to get involved at all.
    - If gender dysphoria is a medical condition, then before someone can claim to suffer from it, there must be a medical diagnosis. We do not permit people to declare themselves suffering any other sort of medical condition without diagnosis. Why should this be an exception?
    - If transition is the answer to for an individual with this condition - and note that it is often not the answer, especially for children - then once transition has happened, a gender recognition certificate can be given.
    - The medical and other resources available to those suffering from this condition are very poor. The waiting times are very long indeed. This does cause suffering to people needing help. THIS is where the focus should be - on increasing the resources and reducing waiting times and providing support and help in the interim. It is notable that this is not what the trans activists are campaigning about.
    - It is not for women to justify why they need female-only spaces. This should be the default assumption. The burden should be the other way around. Are there any circumstances when people born male should be given access to female-only spaces and female-only sports. And my answer is only for those who have fully transitioned (and not even for those in the case of sport, because of the irreversible effects of puberty in a male).
    - So women have to right to loos, refuges, changing rooms, sport, single sex wards, intimate care being provided by a woman, rape counselling by a woman, female only prisons etc. If they wish to allow a man in, that is their choice not that of the man. In no circumstances should a man or transwoman guilty of offences against women, girls and children be allowed into a female-only space.

    The sad part is that the above would be characterised as "evil" and "bigoted" by some parties in this debate.

    One thing to add - in some schools that play full contact Rugby and other sports with similar issues, they assess team membership by size. This is because some boys turn into hulking brutes at age X - and would wipe out their classmates. Same reasoning as weight classes in boxing.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Leon said:

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless

    But your Brexit buddies keep telling us it is done.

    Not half way through.

    Complete.

    Whole.

    Delivered.

    And it's a shitshow...
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    kjh said:

    Cyclefree said:



    MattW said:

    Thanks for the Header, Ms Cyclefree.

    I trust that things are improving at yours.

    Husband still unable to swallow. Or eat. Even taking the pills - cut in half - is painful. And now specks of blood, presumably from the injury, are being coughed up.

    So he's going to try and get an ENT referral via his GP.

    Who knew walnut halves could be so dangerous!
    You both have had a terrible time and a salutary warning about walnut halves, which coincidentally my wife loves to eat
    I shall be more careful. I own a Walnut tree, so do consume quite a few!
    So do I. Doesn't produce any nuts though. Any advice on how the prune/manage one?
    Interesting. Ours just started "fruiting" (is that the right term?) a few years ago and hasn't stopped since. We get hundreds of nuts. I am told it is quite good to be fairly savage with pruning, but we never have been. I planted it myself and it has been there almost twenty years I guess. I am not sure whether they have to cross pollenate, so maybe to do with you not having others in vicinity perhaps?
    I have an absolutely huge walnut tree (at the base it has a large hollow), that produces enormous amounts of nuts, but I never see any of them, other than the ones the squirrels drop from the tree. The b******ds.
    Given how the little bastards eat my spring bulbs, I hope they are suffering like my husband is.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Leon said:

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless

    But your Brexit buddies keep telling us it is done.

    Not half way through.

    Complete.

    Whole.

    Delivered.

    And it's a shitshow...
    The world is changing rapidly and the UK's foreign policy looks in better shape than France's.
  • Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    What tosh.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Leon said:

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless

    But your Brexit buddies keep telling us it is done.

    Not half way through.

    Complete.

    Whole.

    Delivered.

    And it's a shitshow...
    Also, nobody wants to live in a tent in the garden for a generation or whatever it’s supposed to take for the sunlit uplands etc
  • MrEdMrEd Posts: 5,578
    On topic, I think Truss is well positioned, especially given members' positive views of her. However, she has to get to the members' vote in the first place and, to me, Truss is not visible enough when it comes to the general population nor is the Foreign Sec post likely to help that. In particular, I think there will be enough 'Red Wall' Tory MPs who would be worried that a PM Truss is not going to appeal to their voters given her economic liberalism and general manner. There are also enough of them who, if they unified behind one candidate, could get that candidate to the final round.

    Personal view is that the next leader of the Tory party is likely to come from outside the Cabinet and from a working class / working class style background.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895

    Brexit is like buying a perfectly sound house and knocking down a supporting wall to create more space for a “breakfast bar”.

    Digging out the basement for a swimming pool, only for the entire structure to collapse.

    And not only do you not get your pool, you have to rebuild to the original specs...

    Years wasted and millions spent, to end up where you started.

    It's not the worst metaphor for Brexit
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    malcolmg said:

    Yeh. She’s definitely next.
    She’s awful though. Like a smugger, more articulate Boris.

    Same sort of dodgy romantic history, too, according to that leaked Whip’s document.

    Sounds a bit cheesy to me.
    She is also crap
    She is thick as mince, to use a Malcolmism.
    And she exudes superficiality and insincerity.
    Thick as mince I see used an awful lot and it really just seems to be a deeply unpleasant comment aimed at a politician, or person, someone doesn’t like. She’s clearly not thick. Very few people really are.
  • Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    So AUUKUS was nothing about being out of the EU then.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    @dixiedean - "How often do we discuss, in depth, the women assaulted or murdered by their partners, the children abused by relatives?
    And what is to be done about it? Very rarely."

    I have done my best.

    https://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2021/07/29/two-lessons-learnt/ - on child abuse.

    https://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2021/03/14/one-womans-perspective/ - on violence against women.
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,257
    edited September 2021
    Taz said:

    malcolmg said:

    Yeh. She’s definitely next.
    She’s awful though. Like a smugger, more articulate Boris.

    Same sort of dodgy romantic history, too, according to that leaked Whip’s document.

    Sounds a bit cheesy to me.
    She is also crap
    She is thick as mince, to use a Malcolmism.
    And she exudes superficiality and insincerity.
    Thick as mince I see used an awful lot and it really just seems to be a deeply unpleasant comment aimed at a politician, or person, someone doesn’t like. She’s clearly not thick. Very few people really are.
    Ok, then; Liz Truss is not terribly smart (though seems politically cunning).
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,528
    Taz said:

    On topic:

    Julia Hartley-Brewer
    @JuliaHB1
    ·
    3h
    I see #TransWomenAreWomen is trending.
    Trans women are trans women - biological males living as women. They are not a subset of women.

    Adult human females are not cis women.
    We are not a subset of women.
    We are not the vagina variant.
    We are WOMEN.

    #YouCantBeOffendedByTheTruth

    She needs a few bearded men to come along now and mansplain feminism to her
    Don't worry, they'll be wearing dresses and self-ID as women for the day. Can't be mansplaining then.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    eek said:

    isam said:

    Just got a letter from our energy firm saying our bills are going up £127 a year.

    Tenner a month, so what?

    wait for next week's letter
    and the one after that.

    Any energy firm predicting the price of electricity and gas this winter is a fool likely to be losing money.
    Gas firm say we can fix the price at £60 a year higher than current tariff

    I fixed them with the electricity firm, eon, and they said if the price of energy falls we can get out of it

    Who knows? But I thought it would be worse. The girl on the phone blamed Asia using more gas than ever before
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,679

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    I'm trying to help you and Scott and Gardenwalker overcome your intrinsic sadness. You will be sad, bitter and angry for the rest of your lives if you don't grasp this point. Brexit is a long term move.

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    It is an optimistic (and quite good) metaphor, but @Leon is dead right that it wasn't about seeing results immediately, but much more about the long term.

    The rewards (if they exist) will be up the road, and the pain (which certainly exists, although not so bad) is here and now.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    Sean_F said:

    A good article, Cyclefree. I don't know why it should be so hard to call out and condemn threats of violence against MPs who are women. You don't get a pass for threatening to kill and rape people by being on the "progressive" side of any debate.

    I don't know why either.

    But it says something important about the current Labour Party and the current Labour leader. None of it good, to my mind anyway.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Brexit is like buying a perfectly sound house and knocking down a supporting wall to create more space for a “breakfast bar”.

    Digging out the basement for a swimming pool, only for the entire structure to collapse.

    And not only do you not get your pool, you have to rebuild to the original specs...

    Years wasted and millions spent, to end up where you started.

    It's not the worst metaphor for Brexit
    I prefer breakfast bar as Brexit is an essentially naff and retro pursuit by people who lack taste.
  • Looking forward to the reasons that will be offered for this.
    Sorry, 'reasons'.

    Marc Mulholland
    @katheder
    "Goods imports from Britain to the Republic have fallen by a third as a result of Brexit while Irish exports to Britain have increased by 26 per cent."

    https://twitter.com/katheder/status/1439957736704335875?s=20
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Leon said:

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.

    In about 5-10 years the losses from Brexit will be impossible for even you to ignore.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,209

    malcolmg said:

    Yeh. She’s definitely next.
    She’s awful though. Like a smugger, more articulate Boris.

    Same sort of dodgy romantic history, too, according to that leaked Whip’s document.

    Sounds a bit cheesy to me.
    She is also crap
    Wow, your political analysis is on fire today. What is your view on the fat little man man described by his QC as (you know the rest Malc!)?
    A Titan among pygmies
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,270
    edited September 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    @HTAnews @FT @JudithREvans Interesting part of this is that horticulture is one of the few sectors that has ALREADY experienced checks and controls of the kind that UK govt delayed again earlier this month...and it's been v painful. £30m-£50m a year even before full port-side checks come in. 2/2 https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1439970824182763521/photo/1

    Do you ever get down that your enormous anti Brexit output has no effect
    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.
    Completely meaningless. Every single Yougov poll on this since August 2017 (bar one in January 2018) - which was long before we actually left - has said we were wrong to leave. Indeed the lead for 'wrong to leave' is now less than it was in some polls in 2020 or as far back as 2018. But that doesn't matter. The longer we are out the more we move away from the EU. There will never now be a majority for rejoin in the foreseeable future.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162
    MaxPB said:

    Taz said:

    On topic:

    Julia Hartley-Brewer
    @JuliaHB1
    ·
    3h
    I see #TransWomenAreWomen is trending.
    Trans women are trans women - biological males living as women. They are not a subset of women.

    Adult human females are not cis women.
    We are not a subset of women.
    We are not the vagina variant.
    We are WOMEN.

    #YouCantBeOffendedByTheTruth

    She needs a few bearded men to come along now and mansplain feminism to her
    Don't worry, they'll be wearing dresses and self-ID as women for the day. Can't be mansplaining then.
    Good point
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    I'm trying to help you and Scott and Gardenwalker overcome your intrinsic sadness. You will be sad, bitter and angry for the rest of your lives if you don't grasp this point. Brexit is a long term move.

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.
    I’m actually leaving the country.
    Hopefully things will have improved when (if?) I return.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895

    I prefer breakfast bar as Brexit is an essentially naff and retro pursuit by people who lack taste.

    Maybe the example Sean was actually looking for was Grand Designs.

    The guy who bought a property, spent 10 years and his marriage building a replacement which is still not complete, and if it ever is he will have to immediately sell to recoup some of his losses.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Leon said:

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.

    In about 5-10 years the losses from Brexit will be impossible for even you to ignore.
    Hahahahaha. Just when I think you cannot get any more ridiculous you go and trump all your previous stupidity.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    algarkirk said:

    Excellent article as always.

    A Labour MP can't go to their own conference because of intimidation, not from the extreme right but from the left of centre, and the leadership does not deny this is true.

    And this is now so taken for granted that it is not making banner headlines across the UK and the world.

    Nationally the Labour party project an image of simply not comprehending the liberal agenda.

    The liberal agenda can espouse progressive causes, but what counts as progressive is often not self-evident; the starting point of a liberal society is the conviction that progress comes about through an open society with freedom of thought and persuasive argument. Without that both in theory and practice you don't get to first base.

    There has been a separation, in "Liberalism" between those that think that making identity groups happy is the prime goal and those that think universal rights and responsibilities on an equal basis is the goal.

    See Roy Jenkins response to the Salman Rushdie affair and many other examples.
  • Scott_xP said:

    @HTAnews @FT @JudithREvans Interesting part of this is that horticulture is one of the few sectors that has ALREADY experienced checks and controls of the kind that UK govt delayed again earlier this month...and it's been v painful. £30m-£50m a year even before full port-side checks come in. 2/2 https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1439970824182763521/photo/1

    Do you ever get down that your enormous anti Brexit output has no effect
    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.
    Completely meaningless. Every single Yougov poll on this since August 2017 (bar one in January 2018) - which was long before we actually left - has said we were wrong to leave. Indeed the lead for 'wrong to leave' is now less than it was in some polls in 2020 or as far back as 2018. But that doesn't matter. The longer we are out the more we move away from the EU. There will never now be a majority for rejoin in the foreseeable future.
    So the settled will of the people is that we were wrong to leave.

    Thanks for confirming.
  • SCOOP: Boris Johnson having dinner tomorrow night at the Australia Ambassador's residence instead of with his own ambo Karen Pierce. Really doubling down on this alliance in the face of France's protests

    https://twitter.com/tarapalmeri/status/1439980908430364679?s=21
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637
    edited September 2021
    isam said:

    Just got a letter from our energy firm saying our bills are going up £127 a year.

    Tenner a month, so what?

    Thats for now, A further increase of 20% in April to the cap is likely according to Martin Lewis on top of the 12.9% increase next week
  • eekeek Posts: 28,077
    MaxPB said:

    Taz said:

    On topic:

    Julia Hartley-Brewer
    @JuliaHB1
    ·
    3h
    I see #TransWomenAreWomen is trending.
    Trans women are trans women - biological males living as women. They are not a subset of women.

    Adult human females are not cis women.
    We are not a subset of women.
    We are not the vagina variant.
    We are WOMEN.

    #YouCantBeOffendedByTheTruth

    She needs a few bearded men to come along now and mansplain feminism to her
    Don't worry, they'll be wearing dresses and self-ID as women for the day. Can't be mansplaining then.
    If they are wearing dresses surely they are transplaining

    Don't worry I'll get my own coat.
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    I'm trying to help you and Scott and Gardenwalker overcome your intrinsic sadness. You will be sad, bitter and angry for the rest of your lives if you don't grasp this point. Brexit is a long term move.

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.
    I am well over any sadness. I actually now find it very funny that are folk such as yourself that actually still believe in it, and want to justify it. It really is very amusing, so I thank you, not later, right now for providing the comedy. It is almost as silly as your belief in extra terrestrial visitors. You will look foolish for the rest of your life if you don't grasp this point: Brexit was pointless.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162
    eek said:

    MaxPB said:

    Taz said:

    On topic:

    Julia Hartley-Brewer
    @JuliaHB1
    ·
    3h
    I see #TransWomenAreWomen is trending.
    Trans women are trans women - biological males living as women. They are not a subset of women.

    Adult human females are not cis women.
    We are not a subset of women.
    We are not the vagina variant.
    We are WOMEN.

    #YouCantBeOffendedByTheTruth

    She needs a few bearded men to come along now and mansplain feminism to her
    Don't worry, they'll be wearing dresses and self-ID as women for the day. Can't be mansplaining then.
    If they are wearing dresses surely they are transplaining

    Don't worry I'll get my own coat.
    I’m here all week

    Try the fish.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    edited September 2021
    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    It is an optimistic (and quite good) metaphor, but @Leon is dead right that it wasn't about seeing results immediately, but much more about the long term.

    The rewards (if they exist) will be up the road, and the pain (which certainly exists, although not so bad) is here and now.
    It was an analogy, not a metaphor, and a randomly bad one at that, proving nothing. We should have given such nonsense up back with the golf club membership and divorce failed analogies of 2016. It’s all just Swiss Toni.
  • StockyStocky Posts: 10,113
    edited September 2021
    Cyclefree said:

    In response to @kinabalu - "I'd start with this question: What should the balance be between self-ID and medical certification in the process for changing gender?

    Then based on the answer to this proceed to 2 more:

    - What medical and other resource is required to make the process humane and efficient?
    - On what grounds should female only activities and spaces be able to exclude transwomen?"

    I think this structure can generate a good debate and a good policy for any political party."

    This is a not bad approach. And my answer to the first question is this.

    - There is nothing to stop any man calling himself a female name or dressing in women's clothes. There is absolutely no reason for the law to get involved at all.
    - If gender dysphoria is a medical condition, then before someone can claim to suffer from it, there must be a medical diagnosis. We do not permit people to declare themselves suffering any other sort of medical condition without diagnosis. Why should this be an exception?
    - If transition is the answer to for an individual with this condition - and note that it is often not the answer, especially for children - then once transition has happened, a gender recognition certificate can be given.
    - The medical and other resources available to those suffering from this condition are very poor. The waiting times are very long indeed. This does cause suffering to people needing help. THIS is where the focus should be - on increasing the resources and reducing waiting times and providing support and help in the interim. It is notable that this is not what the trans activists are campaigning about.
    - It is not for women to justify why they need female-only spaces. This should be the default assumption. The burden should be the other way around. Are there any circumstances when people born male should be given access to female-only spaces and female-only sports. And my answer is only for those who have fully transitioned (and not even for those in the case of sport, because of the irreversible effects of puberty in a male).
    - So women have to right to loos, refuges, changing rooms, sport, single sex wards, intimate care being provided by a woman, rape counselling by a woman, female only prisons etc. If they wish to allow a man in, that is their choice not that of the man. In no circumstances should a man or transwoman guilty of offences against women, girls and children be allowed into a female-only space.

    I agree with nearly all of that.

    Where you say "my answer is only for those who have fully transitioned" sounds like you are defining some female spaces as being for those without a penis, i.e. that is the defining factor rather than being female (gender) or female (sex).
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Crisis? What crisis..?

    🚨🚨BREAKING🚨🚨 UK natural gas wholesale price has settled at 189.65 pence per therm, the highest ever closing price (we have a higher intra-day price last week, but this is the highest closing price). That's ~$26 per mBtu, or an eye-watering $150 per barrel of oil equivalent https://twitter.com/JavierBlas/status/1439986043554607104/photo/1
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,174
    A Forum Research poll puts the Canadian People's Party on 10.3%. EKOS and Mainstreet Research had them on 9% in their latest polls. The polls really are all over the place.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_2021_Canadian_federal_election
  • Looking forward to the reasons that will be offered for this.
    Sorry, 'reasons'.

    Marc Mulholland
    @katheder
    "Goods imports from Britain to the Republic have fallen by a third as a result of Brexit while Irish exports to Britain have increased by 26 per cent."

    https://twitter.com/katheder/status/1439957736704335875?s=20

    Those are terrifying figures for NI Unionists.

    But they also give the numbers to HMG to suspend the NIP on the grounds that it has severely diverted trade.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637
    Redfield & Wilton Strategies
    @RedfieldWilton
    ·
    28m
    Westminster Voting Intention (20 Sept):

    Conservative 41% (+2)
    Labour 35% (–)
    Liberal Democrat 8% (-1)
    Green 7% (+1)
    Scottish National Party 4% (–)
    Reform UK 3% (-2)
    Other 2% (-1)

    Changes +/- 13 Sept
  • On topic, this is a great header and I can't really find a single thing I disagree with in it. I do hope that Cyclefree is wrong about Starmer as I would genuinely like to see a viable and electable Labour Leader. I hope Davey can lose the hang ups about the EU as there is a great deal I agree with in the Lib Dem policies (though there is also still a great deal I don't agree with). But I do fear that currently all our politicians are interested in is avoiding saying or doing anything that might upset one section of society or another. They have forgotten that being a great and successful politician relies upon taking a position on a matter of principle and defending it through force of your argument rather than simply trying not to offend anyone.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,209

    I can’t find any evidence that Daisy Cooper used the word “chestfeeding”.

    I hope it isn’t astroturfing from our resident Tory apologists.

    Would not be a surprise if it was
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    I'm trying to help you and Scott and Gardenwalker overcome your intrinsic sadness. You will be sad, bitter and angry for the rest of your lives if you don't grasp this point. Brexit is a long term move.

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.
    I’m actually leaving the country.
    Hopefully things will have improved when (if?) I return.
    And are you voting with your feet for the EU, or for Aukus?
  • On topic, this is a great header and I can't really find a single thing I disagree with in it. I do hope that Cyclefree is wrong about Starmer as I would genuinely like to see a viable and electable Labour Leader. I hope Davey can lose the hang ups about the EU as there is a great deal I agree with in the Lib Dem policies (though there is also still a great deal I don't agree with). But I do fear that currently all our politicians are interested in is avoiding saying or doing anything that might upset one section of society or another. They have forgotten that being a great and successful politician relies upon taking a position on a matter of principle and defending it through force of your argument rather than simply trying not to offend anyone.

    I am tempted to agree, but I also wonder whether the country could do with several years of dull uneventful managerial politics.
  • Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That is so funny
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,257
    edited September 2021

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    I'm trying to help you and Scott and Gardenwalker overcome your intrinsic sadness. You will be sad, bitter and angry for the rest of your lives if you don't grasp this point. Brexit is a long term move.

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.
    I’m actually leaving the country.
    Hopefully things will have improved when (if?) I return.
    And are you voting with your feet for the EU, or for Aukus?
    I’m off to earn more and pay less tax.

    Mind you, I always expected New York to be one of the net beneficiaries of Brexit.
  • malcolmg said:

    malcolmg said:

    Yeh. She’s definitely next.
    She’s awful though. Like a smugger, more articulate Boris.

    Same sort of dodgy romantic history, too, according to that leaked Whip’s document.

    Sounds a bit cheesy to me.
    She is also crap
    Wow, your political analysis is on fire today. What is your view on the fat little man man described by his QC as (you know the rest Malc!)?
    A Titan among pygmies
    Still a fanboy then? Judge a man by the company he keeps, or the people he admires
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,209
    Taz said:

    malcolmg said:

    Yeh. She’s definitely next.
    She’s awful though. Like a smugger, more articulate Boris.

    Same sort of dodgy romantic history, too, according to that leaked Whip’s document.

    Sounds a bit cheesy to me.
    She is also crap
    She is thick as mince, to use a Malcolmism.
    And she exudes superficiality and insincerity.
    Thick as mince I see used an awful lot and it really just seems to be a deeply unpleasant comment aimed at a politician, or person, someone doesn’t like. She’s clearly not thick. Very few people really are.
    She makes a good show of it then.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,929

    Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That's a quite subtle, but very effective putdown.

    It also a - not very subtle - indication that the Germans will not allow the French to derail an EU-Australia FTA.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Scott_xP said:

    Brexit is like buying a perfectly sound house and knocking down a supporting wall to create more space for a “breakfast bar”.

    Digging out the basement for a swimming pool, only for the entire structure to collapse.

    And not only do you not get your pool, you have to rebuild to the original specs...

    Years wasted and millions spent, to end up where you started.

    It's not the worst metaphor for Brexit
    I prefer breakfast bar as Brexit is an essentially naff and retro pursuit by people who lack taste.
    It is like eating a Mars Bar, and using the rolled-up wrapper as a buttplug.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Just in: Supreme Court will hear direct challenge to Roe v. Wade in Mississippi case on December 1.
    https://twitter.com/Arianedevogue/status/1439983473473855496
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,279
    edited September 2021

    Looking forward to the reasons that will be offered for this.
    Sorry, 'reasons'.

    Marc Mulholland
    @katheder
    "Goods imports from Britain to the Republic have fallen by a third as a result of Brexit while Irish exports to Britain have increased by 26 per cent."

    https://twitter.com/katheder/status/1439957736704335875?s=20

    Those are terrifying figures for NI Unionists.

    But they also give the numbers to HMG to suspend the NIP on the grounds that it has severely diverted trade.
    Plus to restore Westminster direct rule in NI which they will do if the EU do not remove the Irish Sea border or agree to its suspension and the Unionists then withdraw from the Stormont executive until they do, which Donaldson has said they will now
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,460
    edited September 2021
    Will Evergrande default....

    https://youtu.be/7UoiO51BIIo

    Crazy solution they have come up with so far promising things like free property or car park spaces in the future, rather than money they owe.

    Real estate is 20% of.China GDP.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,270
    edited September 2021

    On topic, this is a great header and I can't really find a single thing I disagree with in it. I do hope that Cyclefree is wrong about Starmer as I would genuinely like to see a viable and electable Labour Leader. I hope Davey can lose the hang ups about the EU as there is a great deal I agree with in the Lib Dem policies (though there is also still a great deal I don't agree with). But I do fear that currently all our politicians are interested in is avoiding saying or doing anything that might upset one section of society or another. They have forgotten that being a great and successful politician relies upon taking a position on a matter of principle and defending it through force of your argument rather than simply trying not to offend anyone.

    I am tempted to agree, but I also wonder whether the country could do with several years of dull uneventful managerial politics.
    Oh I think you are right there but that still needs the political leaders to adopt defendable and reasoned positions on all the things that can and will derail us. Right now we have one 'leader' who seems to be incapable of coherent thought and two others who seemed to be frightened by their own shadows. Walk quietly and carry a big stick (metaphorically and intellectually) would be a welcome change right now.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,209

    SCOOP: Boris Johnson having dinner tomorrow night at the Australia Ambassador's residence instead of with his own ambo Karen Pierce. Really doubling down on this alliance in the face of France's protests

    https://twitter.com/tarapalmeri/status/1439980908430364679?s=21

    Oh whoopee
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,929

    Exclusive: @EU_Commission President @vonderleyen reacts to the AUKUS fallout. “One of our member states has been treated in a way that is not acceptable,” she tells me. “We want to know what happened and why.”

    Full interview airs at 7pCET @CNNi and tonight @PBS (listings vary).


    https://twitter.com/camanpour/status/1439969457229766662?s=21

    Perhaps she needs to be sent Macron’s speech on Astra Zeneca.

    The Australians should just pull out of the EU trade talks.
    The Australians want an EU FTA.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    rcs1000 said:

    Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That's a quite subtle, but very effective putdown.

    It also a - not very subtle - indication that the Germans will not allow the French to derail an EU-Australia FTA.
    As usual, the Germans have chosen exports as their foreign policy objective.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,528
    rcs1000 said:

    Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That's a quite subtle, but very effective putdown.

    It also a - not very subtle - indication that the Germans will not allow the French to derail an EU-Australia FTA.
    And once again we can see that Germany will take no economic pain to pursue foreign policy goals.
  • Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That is so funny
    Quite agree! All that talk that making unilateral military deals with Australia could only be done by countries free from EU bondage has been comprehensively knocked into a cocked hat. What larks!
  • Taz said:

    malcolmg said:

    Yeh. She’s definitely next.
    She’s awful though. Like a smugger, more articulate Boris.

    Same sort of dodgy romantic history, too, according to that leaked Whip’s document.

    Sounds a bit cheesy to me.
    She is also crap
    She is thick as mince, to use a Malcolmism.
    And she exudes superficiality and insincerity.
    Thick as mince I see used an awful lot and it really just seems to be a deeply unpleasant comment aimed at a politician, or person, someone doesn’t like. She’s clearly not thick. Very few people really are.
    It is very often psychological projection.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    isam said:

    Just got a letter from our energy firm saying our bills are going up £127 a year.

    Tenner a month, so what?

    Thats for now, A further increase of 20% in April to the cap is likely according to Martin Lewis on top of the 12.9% increase next week
    So fix the tariff is a no brainer? B Gas are saying prices will go up 1st Oct
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,209
    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    It is an optimistic (and quite good) metaphor, but @Leon is dead right that it wasn't about seeing results immediately, but much more about the long term.

    The rewards (if they exist) will be up the road, and the pain (which certainly exists, although not so bad) is here and now.
    Unadulterated bollox. It will be all pain and no gain. More like poking yourself in the eye with a stick.
  • isam said:

    Just got a letter from our energy firm saying our bills are going up £127 a year.

    Tenner a month, so what?

    Thats for now, A further increase of 20% in April to the cap is likely according to Martin Lewis on top of the 12.9% increase next week
    I have a fixed rate 2 year contract I signed on the 1st September with EDF, and at the time it was 40% higher than my previous one but it is fixed until September 23
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637
    Scott_xP said:

    Just in: Supreme Court will hear direct challenge to Roe v. Wade in Mississippi case on December 1.
    https://twitter.com/Arianedevogue/status/1439983473473855496

    Wow Biden needs to flood SC if that goes the wrong way
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,813

    Scott_xP said:

    Crisis? What crisis..?

    🚨🚨BREAKING🚨🚨 UK natural gas wholesale price has settled at 189.65 pence per therm, the highest ever closing price (we have a higher intra-day price last week, but this is the highest closing price). That's ~$26 per mBtu, or an eye-watering $150 per barrel of oil equivalent https://twitter.com/JavierBlas/status/1439986043554607104/photo/1

    We have completely bolloxed our own gas production and relied too much on renewables to replace it without putting in place systems to cope when renewables can't meet demand. This has all been driven by politics not practicality and we are now being found out.
    Indeed. There's an element of hard luck in this w.r.t. electricity generation (AIUI there are some nuclear plants running at reduced capacity due to maintenance, as well as the fire affecting one of the continental interconnectors,) but ultimately if the country doesn't build enough capacity to survive without (or, at any rate, with greatly reduced usage of) imported gas - including sufficient to buffer fluctuations in renewable generation - then there are going to come times when we have to pay a hefty premium to access gas on the world market.

    I see no reason at this stage to doubt the Government when it suggests that there won't be a collapse in supply, but one way or another we'll have to pay a lot of money to maintain it - either directly through higher bills, or indirectly through the effects of Government having to intervene to support the energy sector (which can only mean some combination of tax rises, more borrowing and spending cuts.)
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,679
    lol

    The Lancet, which published the infamous, lying, Covid-Wuhan letter denouncing "lab leak theories as conspiratorial racism" has, 19 months later, published an article suggesting a 180 degree handbrake turn. Incredible


    "On July 5, 2021, a Correspondence was published in The Lancet called “Science, not speculation, is essential to determine how SARS-CoV-2 reached humans”.1 The letter recapitulates the arguments of an earlier letter (published in February, 2020) by the same authors,2 which claimed overwhelming support for the hypothesis that the novel coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic originated in wildlife. The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”.

    "The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists.3 The 2021 letter did not repeat the proposition that scientists open to alternative hypotheses were conspiracy theorists, but did state: “We believe the strongest clue from new, credible, and peer-reviewed evidence in the scientific literature is that the virus evolved in nature, while suggestions of a laboratory leak source of the pandemic remain without scientifically validated evidence that directly supports it in peer-reviewed scientific journals”. In fact, this argument could literally be reversed. As will be shown below, there is no direct support for the natural origin of SARS-CoV-2"

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02019-5/fulltext#bib1

    So, when will Richard Horton resign, and when does Peter Daszak get dragged before a court?
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,695

    kjh said:

    Cyclefree said:



    MattW said:

    Thanks for the Header, Ms Cyclefree.

    I trust that things are improving at yours.

    Husband still unable to swallow. Or eat. Even taking the pills - cut in half - is painful. And now specks of blood, presumably from the injury, are being coughed up.

    So he's going to try and get an ENT referral via his GP.

    Who knew walnut halves could be so dangerous!
    You both have had a terrible time and a salutary warning about walnut halves, which coincidentally my wife loves to eat
    I shall be more careful. I own a Walnut tree, so do consume quite a few!
    So do I. Doesn't produce any nuts though. Any advice on how the prune/manage one?
    Interesting. Ours just started "fruiting" (is that the right term?) a few years ago and hasn't stopped since. We get hundreds of nuts. I am told it is quite good to be fairly savage with pruning, but we never have been. I planted it myself and it has been there almost twenty years I guess. I am not sure whether they have to cross pollenate, so maybe to do with you not having others in vicinity perhaps?
    I have an absolutely huge walnut tree (at the base it has a large hollow), that produces enormous amounts of nuts, but I never see any of them, other than the ones the squirrels drop from the tree. The b******ds.
    Can't you put a net over it? I realise you say it's 'huge'.
    :smiley: When I say huge, I do mean huge. It is significantly taller than my house (150% ish), the canopy is 20 metres in diameter (just paced it out) and the trunk a metre in diameter at the base. It isn't your French farmers type walnut tree, it's bloody big! You can't reach any nuts to pick. You have to wait for them to fall. I have built an insect/mammal house beneath it from pallets and the squirrels use it as a dinning room table. It is covered in walnut husks, hazelnut husks, sunflower seeds and marigold seeds.

    Re chilli to deter squirrels, that does work and it doesn't affect birds (they are immune to the effect). I had a squirrel chewing the lead of the roof of my orangery. Cost me a fortune to repair, but coating with chilli spray works, but have to keep doing it until it left.
  • Richard_TyndallRichard_Tyndall Posts: 32,270
    edited September 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    @HTAnews @FT @JudithREvans Interesting part of this is that horticulture is one of the few sectors that has ALREADY experienced checks and controls of the kind that UK govt delayed again earlier this month...and it's been v painful. £30m-£50m a year even before full port-side checks come in. 2/2 https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1439970824182763521/photo/1

    Do you ever get down that your enormous anti Brexit output has no effect
    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.
    Completely meaningless. Every single Yougov poll on this since August 2017 (bar one in January 2018) - which was long before we actually left - has said we were wrong to leave. Indeed the lead for 'wrong to leave' is now less than it was in some polls in 2020 or as far back as 2018. But that doesn't matter. The longer we are out the more we move away from the EU. There will never now be a majority for rejoin in the foreseeable future.
    So the settled will of the people is that we were wrong to leave.

    Thanks for confirming.
    The settled will was decided in a vote. As I said at the time, once we were out I would say not a single word against another vote on us rejoining. That is how we settle things, by votes not opinion polls. Indeed, personally I would welcome a vote on joining EFTA. But just as Mike was wrong for all those years claiming that people 'didn't give a monkeys' about the issue of EU membership based on the polling at the time, so you and the rest of the 'unreconciled' are wrong if you think the country is going to vote to rejoin now or at any time in the foreseeable future. And the longer we stay out the greater that gulf will become.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Crisis? What crisis..?

    🚨🚨BREAKING🚨🚨 UK natural gas wholesale price has settled at 189.65 pence per therm, the highest ever closing price (we have a higher intra-day price last week, but this is the highest closing price). That's ~$26 per mBtu, or an eye-watering $150 per barrel of oil equivalent https://twitter.com/JavierBlas/status/1439986043554607104/photo/1

    We have completely bolloxed our own gas production and relied too much on renewables to replace it without putting in place systems to cope when renewables can't meet demand. This has all been driven by politics not practicality and we are now being found out.
    By my maths thats ≈ 6p a kwh.

    I'm paying my supplier ≈ 4.5p from memory.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 81,460
    edited September 2021
    Leon said:

    lol

    The Lancet, which published the infamous, lying, Covid-Wuhan letter denouncing "lab leak theories as conspiratorial racism" has, 19 months later, published an article suggesting a 180 degree handbrake turn. Incredible


    "On July 5, 2021, a Correspondence was published in The Lancet called “Science, not speculation, is essential to determine how SARS-CoV-2 reached humans”.1 The letter recapitulates the arguments of an earlier letter (published in February, 2020) by the same authors,2 which claimed overwhelming support for the hypothesis that the novel coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic originated in wildlife. The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”.

    "The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists.3 The 2021 letter did not repeat the proposition that scientists open to alternative hypotheses were conspiracy theorists, but did state: “We believe the strongest clue from new, credible, and peer-reviewed evidence in the scientific literature is that the virus evolved in nature, while suggestions of a laboratory leak source of the pandemic remain without scientifically validated evidence that directly supports it in peer-reviewed scientific journals”. In fact, this argument could literally be reversed. As will be shown below, there is no direct support for the natural origin of SARS-CoV-2"

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02019-5/fulltext#bib1

    So, when will Richard Horton resign, and when does Peter Daszak get dragged before a court?

    Its quite incredible given the numerous scandals Horton just carries on untouched, controlling one of the eading medical journals of record.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 10,691
    malcolmg said:

    Omnium said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    It is an optimistic (and quite good) metaphor, but @Leon is dead right that it wasn't about seeing results immediately, but much more about the long term.

    The rewards (if they exist) will be up the road, and the pain (which certainly exists, although not so bad) is here and now.
    Unadulterated bollox. It will be all pain and no gain. More like poking yourself in the eye with a stick.
    I fail to see quite what you're criticising - I certainly left open precisely the outcome you suggest.

    I've not tried poking myself in the eye with a stick.
  • isam said:

    Just got a letter from our energy firm saying our bills are going up £127 a year.

    Tenner a month, so what?

    Thats for now, A further increase of 20% in April to the cap is likely according to Martin Lewis on top of the 12.9% increase next week
    A £10 a month is a lot of money for many people. :rage:

  • Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That is so funny
    Quite agree! All that talk that making unilateral military deals with Australia could only be done by countries free from EU bondage has been comprehensively knocked into a cocked hat. What larks!
    I do not recall anyone saying that

    Indeed AUKUS actively seeks military cooperation from allies including France and Germany but they will not be part of AUKUS due to confidential nuclear and intelligence information in the group

    However, it is quite funny how Germany have ignored France and their strop
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    ...
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    Scott_xP said:

    I prefer breakfast bar as Brexit is an essentially naff and retro pursuit by people who lack taste.

    Maybe the example Sean was actually looking for was Grand Designs.

    The guy who bought a property, spent 10 years and his marriage building a replacement which is still not complete, and if it ever is he will have to immediately sell to recoup some of his losses.
    I wouldn't pick Grand Designs as an analogy if I were you - whilst that example happens, most of the time you have people who are woefully underprepared and unrealistic about the costs, but do at the end of the day end up with something approach their dream house and consider it worth it.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162
    Leon said:

    lol

    The Lancet, which published the infamous, lying, Covid-Wuhan letter denouncing "lab leak theories as conspiratorial racism" has, 19 months later, published an article suggesting a 180 degree handbrake turn. Incredible


    "On July 5, 2021, a Correspondence was published in The Lancet called “Science, not speculation, is essential to determine how SARS-CoV-2 reached humans”.1 The letter recapitulates the arguments of an earlier letter (published in February, 2020) by the same authors,2 which claimed overwhelming support for the hypothesis that the novel coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic originated in wildlife. The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”.

    "The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists.3 The 2021 letter did not repeat the proposition that scientists open to alternative hypotheses were conspiracy theorists, but did state: “We believe the strongest clue from new, credible, and peer-reviewed evidence in the scientific literature is that the virus evolved in nature, while suggestions of a laboratory leak source of the pandemic remain without scientifically validated evidence that directly supports it in peer-reviewed scientific journals”. In fact, this argument could literally be reversed. As will be shown below, there is no direct support for the natural origin of SARS-CoV-2"

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02019-5/fulltext#bib1

    So, when will Richard Horton resign, and when does Peter Daszak get dragged before a court?

    Back onto conspiracies now you have stopped blobbing about dolphins ?
  • Scott_xP said:

    Just in: Supreme Court will hear direct challenge to Roe v. Wade in Mississippi case on December 1.
    https://twitter.com/Arianedevogue/status/1439983473473855496

    Wow Biden needs to flood SC if that goes the wrong way
    One of the many things Biden needs to do to stop America becoming the Trump Towers Fascist State.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873

    Scott_xP said:

    Just in: Supreme Court will hear direct challenge to Roe v. Wade in Mississippi case on December 1.
    https://twitter.com/Arianedevogue/status/1439983473473855496

    Wow Biden needs to flood SC if that goes the wrong way
    Doesn't Roberts have a history of trying to weasel around tricky rulings by focusing on technical matters?
  • Australia and Germany have signed a declaration of intent about cooperation on military space technology, so it looks like the Germans are giving le strop a Gallic shrug.

    https://twitter.com/BundeswehrGI/status/1439969260365811712

    That is so funny
    Quite agree! All that talk that making unilateral military deals with Australia could only be done by countries free from EU bondage has been comprehensively knocked into a cocked hat. What larks!
    I do not recall anyone saying that

    [...]

    A habitual skipper of Leon's posts I take it.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637

    Scott_xP said:

    Just in: Supreme Court will hear direct challenge to Roe v. Wade in Mississippi case on December 1.
    https://twitter.com/Arianedevogue/status/1439983473473855496

    Wow Biden needs to flood SC if that goes the wrong way
    The Rules Committee is right now debating a bill to codify Roe vs. Wade. The House is planning to vote on it this week in response to SCOTUS allowing Texas to ban abortion after 6 weeks.
  • England's joint mens and womens cricket tour of Pakistan next month is off
  • kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I prefer breakfast bar as Brexit is an essentially naff and retro pursuit by people who lack taste.

    Maybe the example Sean was actually looking for was Grand Designs.

    The guy who bought a property, spent 10 years and his marriage building a replacement which is still not complete, and if it ever is he will have to immediately sell to recoup some of his losses.
    I wouldn't pick Grand Designs as an analogy if I were you - whilst that example happens, most of the time you have people who are woefully underprepared and unrealistic about the costs, but do at the end of the day end up with something approach their dream house and consider it worth it.
    They did have perhaps my all time favourite on the other night which was the Carpenter with the Japanese wife who built his own timber framed hexagonal house on the edge of the Cambridgeshire fens. He went through so much pain to get there but in the end the house was simply breathtaking. Real vision and a stunning result.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    Scott_xP said:

    Those that want to re-join will have to make their case.

    When we are once again the sick man of Europe, which may be by Christmas, the case will make itself.
    Evidence?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,929
    On topic, I rather like Ms Truss, and think she would make a good PM.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    rcs1000 said:

    Exclusive: @EU_Commission President @vonderleyen reacts to the AUKUS fallout. “One of our member states has been treated in a way that is not acceptable,” she tells me. “We want to know what happened and why.”

    Full interview airs at 7pCET @CNNi and tonight @PBS (listings vary).


    https://twitter.com/camanpour/status/1439969457229766662?s=21

    Perhaps she needs to be sent Macron’s speech on Astra Zeneca.

    The Australians should just pull out of the EU trade talks.
    The Australians want an EU FTA.
    But not a Pan European one, given rules 1, 3, 5 and 7 of the University of Woolamoloo.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,637

    isam said:

    Just got a letter from our energy firm saying our bills are going up £127 a year.

    Tenner a month, so what?

    Thats for now, A further increase of 20% in April to the cap is likely according to Martin Lewis on top of the 12.9% increase next week
    A £10 a month is a lot of money for many people. :rage:

    Especially those losing £20 a week on 1.10.21
  • Scott_xP said:

    ...

    Genuine :lol:
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,214
    Leon said:

    lol

    The Lancet, which published the infamous, lying, Covid-Wuhan letter denouncing "lab leak theories as conspiratorial racism" has, 19 months later, published an article suggesting a 180 degree handbrake turn. Incredible


    "On July 5, 2021, a Correspondence was published in The Lancet called “Science, not speculation, is essential to determine how SARS-CoV-2 reached humans”.1 The letter recapitulates the arguments of an earlier letter (published in February, 2020) by the same authors,2 which claimed overwhelming support for the hypothesis that the novel coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic originated in wildlife. The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”.

    "The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists.3 The 2021 letter did not repeat the proposition that scientists open to alternative hypotheses were conspiracy theorists, but did state: “We believe the strongest clue from new, credible, and peer-reviewed evidence in the scientific literature is that the virus evolved in nature, while suggestions of a laboratory leak source of the pandemic remain without scientifically validated evidence that directly supports it in peer-reviewed scientific journals”. In fact, this argument could literally be reversed. As will be shown below, there is no direct support for the natural origin of SARS-CoV-2"

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02019-5/fulltext#bib1

    So, when will Richard Horton resign, and when does Peter Daszak get dragged before a court?

    Correspondence = "Our readers’ reflections on content published in the Lancet journals or on other topics of general interest to our readers. These letters are not normally externally peer reviewed."

    https://www.thelancet.com/what-we-publish
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873

    kle4 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I prefer breakfast bar as Brexit is an essentially naff and retro pursuit by people who lack taste.

    Maybe the example Sean was actually looking for was Grand Designs.

    The guy who bought a property, spent 10 years and his marriage building a replacement which is still not complete, and if it ever is he will have to immediately sell to recoup some of his losses.
    I wouldn't pick Grand Designs as an analogy if I were you - whilst that example happens, most of the time you have people who are woefully underprepared and unrealistic about the costs, but do at the end of the day end up with something approach their dream house and consider it worth it.
    They did have perhaps my all time favourite on the other night which was the Carpenter with the Japanese wife who built his own timber framed hexagonal house on the edge of the Cambridgeshire fens. He went through so much pain to get there but in the end the house was simply breathtaking. Real vision and a stunning result.
    That's one of my favourites!

    That said, whilst it makes for interesting TV I do feel like the presenter should yell at some of these people that paying for a project manager who knows what they are doing will probably save you more money and time in the end than deciding to muck in yourself.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,679

    Leon said:

    lol

    The Lancet, which published the infamous, lying, Covid-Wuhan letter denouncing "lab leak theories as conspiratorial racism" has, 19 months later, published an article suggesting a 180 degree handbrake turn. Incredible


    "On July 5, 2021, a Correspondence was published in The Lancet called “Science, not speculation, is essential to determine how SARS-CoV-2 reached humans”.1 The letter recapitulates the arguments of an earlier letter (published in February, 2020) by the same authors,2 which claimed overwhelming support for the hypothesis that the novel coronavirus causing the COVID-19 pandemic originated in wildlife. The authors associated any alternative view with conspiracy theories by stating: “We stand together to strongly condemn conspiracy theories suggesting that COVID-19 does not have a natural origin”.

    "The statement has imparted a silencing effect on the wider scientific debate, including among science journalists.3 The 2021 letter did not repeat the proposition that scientists open to alternative hypotheses were conspiracy theorists, but did state: “We believe the strongest clue from new, credible, and peer-reviewed evidence in the scientific literature is that the virus evolved in nature, while suggestions of a laboratory leak source of the pandemic remain without scientifically validated evidence that directly supports it in peer-reviewed scientific journals”. In fact, this argument could literally be reversed. As will be shown below, there is no direct support for the natural origin of SARS-CoV-2"

    https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(21)02019-5/fulltext#bib1

    So, when will Richard Horton resign, and when does Peter Daszak get dragged before a court?

    Its quite incredible given the numerous scandals Horton just carries on untouched, controlling one of the eading medical journals of record.
    Yes. Has he got some hold over the owners, or something? He has publicly disgraced himself, and devalued his journal, several times.

    It is sad. The Lancet was a great British - and global - institution. Now it has to be read through a prism, like it is the Guardian or the Daily Express. What do they really mean? What agenda are they pushing? Does this benefit their Chinese backers?

    Once a scientific journal reaches that level it needs a thoroughly deep clean. And, of course, a new editor.

    The fact Horton knowingly published the original Daszak letter, with all its lies about "no conflict of interest" is a resignation matter by itself. No question.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,585
    rcs1000 said:

    On topic, I rather like Ms Truss, and think she would make a good PM.

    It's a dream situation for Labour and the Lib Dems though. Tories elect Truss? Racist Tories snub Rishi! Tories elect Rishi? Sexist Tories snub Truss! The fun they'll have - I bet they're salivating at the outrage they can concoct.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,174
    "5 Things To Watch In Canada’s Big Election
    By Nathaniel Rakich"

    https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/5-things-to-watch-in-canadas-big-election/
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,929
    edited September 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    Just in: Supreme Court will hear direct challenge to Roe v. Wade in Mississippi case on December 1.
    https://twitter.com/Arianedevogue/status/1439983473473855496

    Wow Biden needs to flood SC if that goes the wrong way
    The Rules Committee is right now debating a bill to codify Roe vs. Wade. The House is planning to vote on it this week in response to SCOTUS allowing Texas to ban abortion after 6 weeks.
    You cannot legislate to legalise abortion at a Federal level, because the Supreme Court would overturn it on a jurisdictional basis. (Which may, of course, be the goal of the Democrats.)

    What you could do is pass a bill that would prevent States from imposing burdens on people going to other States to get abortions, as that is Interstate Commerce, and therefore under the remit of the Federal Government. (This would, of course, effectively nullify the Texas law, as that imposes penalties of firms or individuals that allow Texans to travel to other states for abortions.)

    Abortion should be legalised in the US democratically, as it has been in the rest of the developed world. It is not the job of judges to conjure laws out of the constitution.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Our gas bill on leaving our old house is £1250! When I told the girl at eon, she said if no one from eon read the meter for a year we can complain and maybe not pay. They didn’t, so we could be in luck. Is this right?

    My gf swears she sent them the readings but every bill is an estimate, though the electrics a reading in June
  • Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Scott_xP said:

    I don't spend much time chasing up opinion poll results but I believe that current opinion, as measured by reasonable polling companies, is that while Rejoin does not yet have a majority, having left is considered a mistake.

    New polling for B4B. 53% think Brexit has created more problems than it has solved. Only 15% think it has solved more problems than it has created.

    Excluding don't-knows, that is a staggering 78% to 22% thinking Brexit has been a net negative. ~AA


    https://www.cityam.com/new-poll-53-per-cent-of-uk-thinks-brexit-deal-has-created-more-problems-than-it-solved/
    I'll try again. Think of Brexit as a massive and brave personal decision, like, say, selling your home, buying a derelict new house, with the intention of totally doing it up, because it has great potential


    A close relative of mine did this in Cornwall. Found a really grotty rundown six bedroom house being used as temporary shelter for migrant workers. He saw the potential (location, sea views, etc), and bought it; many of us thought he was mad. We continued to think he was mad as the refurb began, the house was so awful his family had to camp in the garden, then slowly expanded as they revamped room after room. SLOWLY

    If you'd asked them, six months into the project, as they discovered dry rot in the basement and rats in the attic, whether the move was - so far - net negative or net positive, he and his family would have ruefully admitted: net negative. They were shivering without power, and eating takeaway pizza

    Now, five years later, they live in a large, stunning house with a fantastic garden, in a great location, with glorious views of the sea. They probably spent £300k on the house, £300k on the refurb, it must be worth £1.5m now, if not a lot more. They doubled their money, easily, and they adore their house

    Brexit is like that. Like buying a shitty house, but seeing the potential. Asking opinions halfway through the move is basically pointless




    A nice try, but a ridiculously optimistic metaphor. Equally it could be like the fabled American who bought London Bridge. I expect, as I said in a previous post, it will be somewhere in between. Pointless, but perhaps not as bad as some of us feared.
    I'm trying to help you and Scott and Gardenwalker overcome your intrinsic sadness. You will be sad, bitter and angry for the rest of your lives if you don't grasp this point. Brexit is a long term move.

    You can thank me later. In about 5-10 years.
    I am well over any sadness. I actually now find it very funny that are folk such as yourself that actually still believe in it, and want to justify it. It really is very amusing, so I thank you, not later, right now for providing the comedy. It is almost as silly as your belief in extra terrestrial visitors. You will look foolish for the rest of your life if you don't grasp this point: Brexit was pointless.
    It's OK. We just have to wait a bit- maybe until Leon is a full time resident of St Matthais's Home for the Elderly Dyspepsic. Given the age profile of the Brexit Bulge Generation, and the lack of effort to persuade or reassure the young, this ain't gonna stick. I know it's not polite to mention this, but hey-ho.

    It's just a shame that we have to go through this pointless farrago now.
  • ajbajb Posts: 145

    While all the focus is on these small enwrgy companies, much bigger world economic issue unfolding...

    Incredible story...

    https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/evergrande-gave-workers-a-choice-loan-us-cash-or-lose-your-bonus-121092000049_1.html

    Shit hitting fan shortly.

    An interesting one. I assume that, although your employer can require you to do many things asan employee, lending them money is not one f them, at least in the UK. But I'm not quite sure which law actually says that. It nearly came up at my employer, because the CFO got frustrated at people not writing down what they'd used the company credit card (singular) for, and said that if we didn't, we'd have to use our personal ones and claim back in expenses. Which would be lending the company money to buy things, in effect. Fortunately in our case it didn't come to that...
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