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Brexit increasingly dominates views of Johnson – politicalbetting.com

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  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Dominic Raab on his conversation with the PM on Friday - 48 hours from Kabul falling.

    "We discussed the matter, I agreed to come back on Sunday"

    https://twitter.com/tamcohen/status/1430412726833139718
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    edited August 2021
    I see the US Supreme Court has decided US foreign policy can be set by district court judges that cannot read the law correctly now.

    https://twitter.com/mjs_DC/status/1430319026425716743?s=19

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu
  • Nigelb said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Ah, the curse of the new thread:

    kjh said:


    Part 2:

    Here is something from my memory of moving to the Grammar school and the various speech days I attended and says something about making decisions at 11:

    About 10 - 15 of us moved to the Grammar school to do our A levels. Myself and another on the Arts side were fast streamed because we performed at the very top of the Grammar school boys, but also all those who transferred were in the top quartile of the Grammar school. Now clearly although there will changes in academic ability as one gets older (and that is one of the reasons I object to Grammar schools) it will not be to that extent, which appears ridiculous. The explanation is simple. Actually the numbers who were capable of moving across was not 10 - 15 but more like 30. Only the very best moved across. Social engineering was taking place already because of decisions made at 11. At speech day it was clear that there were a huge number of boys in the Grammar school getting 1 - 4 O levels which would put them at about the 50% point at the Secondary school. They should have been learning with people of their own ability and on subjects they could thrive on rather than struggling.

    The overlap in ability at 11 (one assumes if the 11 plus is accurate and I see no reason why it should not be broadly accurate) is minimal. The overlap at 16 based on a test at 11 appears to be massive.

    And clearly just to answer @HYUFD point, although it has been covered by many before, even with this overlap the selection process at 11 will still ensure the Grammar school has most of the most able students and the Secondary will have a lot less plus the secondary school will have all of those that are academically challenged. So the grammar school will always perform better but it doesn't make them better schools. Only if they started with the same pupils could you judge which is the better school.

    That's very interesting.

    And one of the things that I think is so difficult about the grammar schools debate is that people on both sides each say things that are absolutely correct.

    My personal bugbear with the grammar school system is the fact that a September baby was more than twice as likely to pass the Eleven Plus than an August one. And the fact that people mature at different ages: there are plenty of people who burn brightly at eleven, and are dullards at sixteen; and there are plenty who bloom academically only in their mid-teens.

    You therefore need to have annual promotion and relegation from grammar schools, to ensure that people are with the most appropriate educational cohort. At which point the question becomes... hang on, isn't it easier to just stream?

    And then there's the geography question. In low population density areas, the nearest grammar could be a long, long way away from the average kid. Whereas in large towns with public transport, that simply isn't an issue.
    You need don't need promotion and relegation, most grammars have entries at 13 and 16 already.

    If you want to get into Oxbridge or a top Russell Group university you are statistically far more likely to do so from a grammar than the average comp, hence for sixth form in particular many bright late developers will move to grammars
    The maths of why this is both true and meaningless just goes over your head doesn't it?
    I think the solution to the grammar/comprehensive debate is perhaps having more large and better funded 6th form colleges. There are way too many schools (including a number of grammars) with inadequate 6th form provision, and the advantages in offering a full range of subjects, and specialist subject teachers at A Level are undeniable.
    And they provide a great escape option for those who are academically inclined and might otherwise be stuck in a poor comprehensive.
    One problem with that is schools without sixth-forms find it harder to recruit teachers (as we tend to enjoy teaching A-levels more than GCSE, particularly in those subjects which are compulsory up to the end of Y11). Sixth-form colleges tend to have worse terms for teachers than schools and so are not that popular either. I suspect the net result of your proposal would be to make teachers even harder to come by, and an exodus of those that could into the private sector.

    A better solution, used in some areas already on an ad hoc basis, is for small groups of neighbouring schools to pool their sixth form provision, allowing pupils from one school to do one or more subjects at a nearby school. There are some logistic challenges, but it can be made to work.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708
    IanB2 said:

    CNN: While President Joe Biden's withdrawal of troops by August 31 is inevitable, the speed at which the situation descended into chaos, and the White House's lack of contrition and flexibility has left allies spinning.

    As America's allies -- most notably in Europe -- see it the United States is walking away, washing its hands of a crisis it played a large part in creating, and with scant regard for the problems that doing so creates elsewhere.

    “To me, this shows is the end of one geopolitical era, which was about creating a liberal international order, and the beginning of a new one, which is about the competition between China and America," said Mark Leonard, director of the European Council on Foreign Relations.

    [David Lidington adds:] “One of the consequences of the defeat in Afghanistan is the lack of confidence in the West, which can only be a good thing for China and Russia who can offer their support with zero regard for rule of law or human rights,"

    The reputational cost to the West of what's happening in Afghanistan won't be fully known for some time. What is clear for now is that if America's allies want the option to serve their own interests globally, they need to accept that as things stand, they are inadequate. That means countries that have for so long relied on the stability of the US commitment to promoting Western values will need to rethink their foreign policy.

    Kind of ridiculous to think the Bush/Cheney wars were anything to do with a "liberal international order".

    They wanted to punish some brown people for 9/11 then nobody else could work out how to end them without looking weak.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    What does this guy know, eh?

    Grocery shoppers face less choice as the boss of one of Britain’s biggest supermarket chains said food shortages were the worst he has known. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/food-shortages-worst-i-have-seen-says-supermarket-chief-c3km3q7vg?utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1629865787
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,700
    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,178
    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    This is the ‘hidden variable’ paradox, right? The example usually given is the university where men appeared to be more likely to be accepted than women; bring the hidden variable of subject into play and it was found that individual women were more likely to be accepted than individual men in both English and Engineering; it was just that English was hugely more popular than Engineering and both subjects had dramatically different gender-patterns of application. Thus overall women were less likely to be accepted, because they were mostly applying for English, rather than for being female.

    I’m not sure how this relates to HY’s posts, which fail from a mixture of dishonesty (wanting the stats to prove his views) and ignorance (of statistics)?
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745
    edited August 2021
    Good morning everyone; not as bright today, and 13.8.

    Do I gather Mr HYUFD, our favourite Essex Man, is 'otherwise engaged' today?

    A small grumble; in the great scheme of things, anyway. My preferred soft drink has been unavailable for some weeks. I now discover it's made in RoI. 'Nuff said!
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it.

    Keep holding your nose...
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,845
    Test
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,069

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533

    Good morning everyone; not as bright today, and 13.8.

    Do I gather Mr HYUFD, our favourite Essex Man, is 'otherwise engaged' today?

    A small grumble; in the great scheme of things, anyway. My preferred soft drink has been unavailable for some weeks. I now discover it's made in RoI. 'Nuff said!

    Good morning. Light drizzle and about 13 degrees C for my morning run in Cambridge. No rain was forecast, and I hope it stops, as I'm taking the little 'un to Go Ape later ...
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,519
    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    Pagan2 said:

    DavidL said:

    Hmm, I failed my 11+. The school appealed because I was clearly the top in my entire year group. It wasn't (with all due modesty) particularly close. The appeal was refused on the basis that I had failed so badly the appeal could not be allowed.

    I went to private school and then a comprehensive that had recently been a grammar school instead. I got 6 highers in one year and left school at 16 to go to do an Honours law degree. Since then I have had a reasonably successful career in the law. This is my most recent work: https://news.stv.tv/west-central/serial-rapist-faces-life-sentence-after-attacking-three-women

    It would take a bit of persuading given my personal history to explain why grammar schools and the 11+ was or is a good idea.

    For me who went to a comprehensive the good idea would have been I would have gone to a school where those who felt academic achievement was a dirty thing wouldn't have been able to make my school life a misery because I tried. I offer an example my school bag got doused in lighter fuel and set light too burning all my notes for the year.....this was in class...the teacher just looked up and sighed and went put it out and dont be silly. This was mid 80's
    That, fortunately, happens a lot less than it used to. Ofsted has got a lot of things wrong, and it has been a terrible example of institutional schizophrenia, but it has swept up the really awful don't care schools that were too common for too long.

    @NorthofStoke made a really good point earlier- the change to school admissions got tangled up with some hippy-dippy ideas about how to run schools which has hindered the debate ever since.

    And yes, pupils who go to grammar schools tend to do better in school and later life. But that's because of who they are, not really because of the school they go to. Equivalent children in all-comprehensive areas have pretty much the same outcomes for employment and income in their mid-20s.

    https://ffteducationdatalab.org.uk/2019/06/long-term-outcomes-do-grammar-schools-make-a-difference/

    For me, the question comes down to this. At the time of the Butler Act, rationing was all the rage and relatively expensive academic secondary education was a scarce resource. It made sense to ration it via the 11+. What's the scarce resource that needs carefully managed access now, and what are Conservatives doing denying access to it?
    24% of state secondary schools are still inadequate or requires improvement even now and only 19% of state schools are outstanding.
    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/state-funded-schools-inspections-and-outcomes-as-at-31-march-2020/main-findings-state-funded-schools-inspections-and-outcomes-as-at-31-march-2020

    On your link 32% of grammar pupils went to a Russell Group university compared to only 23% of matched pupils and just 6% of pupils overall elsewhere.

    They also earnt more than pupils in non selective authorities, albeit about the same as matched pupils in their first jobs
    How many times are you going to repeat that stat without understanding it is nonsense. It is true but only because you have selected at 11. If you prevent those that have no hope of going to university from going to the grammar school and put them all in another school it will skew the figures for both schools. Even if the comp out performs the grammar school on equally academic pupils the manipulation at 11 of shoving the non academic into one school skews the figures. You are not comparing like with like. The real test is what the outcome is for equally talented pupils and you are not providing that stat.
    We have not had a single fully comprehensive educated PM yet, from 1964 to 1997 we had nothing but grammar school and mainly Oxford educated PMs which says enough in itself. The biggest gainers from the scrapping of grammars was the privately educated who now dominate the top ranks of the law, medicine and politics and other professions as they have less competition.

    I have already said on the link 32% of grammar school pupils went to Russell Group universities compared to only 23% of equally academically matched pupils at comprehensives

    All that says is that children of privilege become PM
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    edited August 2021
    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    My wife, usually a gentle person, watched that bit of the TV news and remarked that she couldn't get worked up over the problems animals faced vs those of people.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,173

    Test

    icles
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,519
    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    My local coop is full of signs saying “sorry for the reduced choice during this time”. That doesn’t mean “empty shelves” of course - it means reduced choice.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    And David Lammy doesn't think much of the PM!

    Will the revelations never end?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516
    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516
    Scott_xP said:
    still grieving I see
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,519

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,685
    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    Nice try @kjh, my degree was in philosophy and even I know about Simpson’s paradox.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 23,156
    TimT said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I don't do any Crypto investing.

    Maybe it's "the future" but from what I've read it's more likely it's a lot of bollocks built on sand.

    I think it's very important (and I speak as a man who bought Bitcoin at $3), to put quotes around the word "investing".

    Buying a productive asset - bonds, shares, real estate - is investing. It is purchasing a share of something that produces something of economic value. As a shareholder/bondholder/landholder, you are anticipating getting a share of that economic output. That is investing.

    Buying bitcoin or any other crypto is not investing, because Bitcoin does not produce anything of economic value. It is speculation. It is a bet (and it is a bet) that someone will want to pay more for your bit of paper in the future than you just paid.

    With that said, I recently bought some Monero (my first Crypto purchase for about seven years). So, I'm guilty too.
    Yes, speculation - so I steer well clear.

    It's the 21st century version of Dutch tulips.
    Yes, but you should really consider putting $25 into Monero.

    Why?

    1. The rise of Bitcoin was the consequence of the Dark Web, where people bought illegal items (stolen credit card numbers, drugs, databases of passwords). This created demand for the underlying currency (the more transactions there are, the more currency there needs to be in existence to facilitate it), and that price rise started the whole crypto wave.

    2. It turns out, however, that Bitcoin is nowhere near as anonymous as people thought. Indeed, it turns out that it is all to easy to track people using Bitcoin for nefarious purposes. As a result, the Dark Web is moving towards Monero.

    3. The purpose of Monero was to create a truly anonymous crypto currency.

    4. The total value of Monero in existence is less than 0.4% of that of Bitcoin.

    I see no reason why the total value of Bitcoin should be $200bn+, as there is next to no real economic activity associated with it. But I sure as shit can see demand for a truly anonymous cryptocurrency being big. I wouldn't be surprised if Monero (if they can pair it with Lightning) was valued at more than Bitcoin five years from now.
    How does one buy $25 worth of Monero?
    Good question. It is not difficult to get a google answer to it, but the google answer is unlikely to be sufficient.

    If a platform, will the platform still be around in 5-10 years time when you hope to get a payoff? What are the chances it gets hacked and tokens stolen?
    If its a "cold" wallet, how likely are you to keep it safe and remember how to access when it is now only $25 and the payoff is many years down the line?
    Are both the platform and monero likely to be compliant with future FCA and UK banking rules, or will the money have to be spent on the "sly".

    For me ending up as the man with £210m crypto in a Newport rubbish tip, or the guy down to his last two password attempts for $240m, and suffering regret forever is something worth avoiding!

  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745

    HYUFD said:

    kjh said:

    HYUFD said:

    Pagan2 said:

    DavidL said:

    Hmm, I failed my 11+. The school appealed because I was clearly the top in my entire year group. It wasn't (with all due modesty) particularly close. The appeal was refused on the basis that I had failed so badly the appeal could not be allowed.

    I went to private school and then a comprehensive that had recently been a grammar school instead. I got 6 highers in one year and left school at 16 to go to do an Honours law degree. Since then I have had a reasonably successful career in the law. This is my most recent work: https://news.stv.tv/west-central/serial-rapist-faces-life-sentence-after-attacking-three-women

    It would take a bit of persuading given my personal history to explain why grammar schools and the 11+ was or is a good idea.

    For me who went to a comprehensive the good idea would have been I would have gone to a school where those who felt academic achievement was a dirty thing wouldn't have been able to make my school life a misery because I tried. I offer an example my school bag got doused in lighter fuel and set light too burning all my notes for the year.....this was in class...the teacher just looked up and sighed and went put it out and dont be silly. This was mid 80's
    That, fortunately, happens a lot less than it used to. Ofsted has got a lot of things wrong, and it has been a terrible example of institutional schizophrenia, but it has swept up the really awful don't care schools that were too common for too long.

    @NorthofStoke made a really good point earlier- the change to school admissions got tangled up with some hippy-dippy ideas about how to run schools which has hindered the debate ever since.

    And yes, pupils who go to grammar schools tend to do better in school and later life. But that's because of who they are, not really because of the school they go to. Equivalent children in all-comprehensive areas have pretty much the same outcomes for employment and income in their mid-20s.

    https://ffteducationdatalab.org.uk/2019/06/long-term-outcomes-do-grammar-schools-make-a-difference/

    For me, the question comes down to this. At the time of the Butler Act, rationing was all the rage and relatively expensive academic secondary education was a scarce resource. It made sense to ration it via the 11+. What's the scarce resource that needs carefully managed access now, and what are Conservatives doing denying access to it?
    24% of state secondary schools are still inadequate or requires improvement even now and only 19% of state schools are outstanding.
    https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/state-funded-schools-inspections-and-outcomes-as-at-31-march-2020/main-findings-state-funded-schools-inspections-and-outcomes-as-at-31-march-2020

    On your link 32% of grammar pupils went to a Russell Group university compared to only 23% of matched pupils and just 6% of pupils overall elsewhere.

    They also earnt more than pupils in non selective authorities, albeit about the same as matched pupils in their first jobs
    How many times are you going to repeat that stat without understanding it is nonsense. It is true but only because you have selected at 11. If you prevent those that have no hope of going to university from going to the grammar school and put them all in another school it will skew the figures for both schools. Even if the comp out performs the grammar school on equally academic pupils the manipulation at 11 of shoving the non academic into one school skews the figures. You are not comparing like with like. The real test is what the outcome is for equally talented pupils and you are not providing that stat.
    We have not had a single fully comprehensive educated PM yet, from 1964 to 1997 we had nothing but grammar school and mainly Oxford educated PMs which says enough in itself. The biggest gainers from the scrapping of grammars was the privately educated who now dominate the top ranks of the law, medicine and politics and other professions as they have less competition.

    I have already said on the link 32% of grammar school pupils went to Russell Group universities compared to only 23% of equally academically matched pupils at comprehensives

    All that says is that children of privilege become PM
    Deleted
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    Now that Pen Farthing’s staff have been cleared to come forward under LOTR I have authorised MOD to facilitate their processing alongside all other eligible personnel at HKIA. At that stage, if he arrives with his animals we will seek a slot for his plane.

    https://twitter.com/BWallaceMP/status/1430327318434754568?s=20

    How, exactly, does he plan to get his animals through the queues of people waiting at the airport?
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    edited August 2021

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    My local coop is full of signs saying “sorry for the reduced choice during this time”. That doesn’t mean “empty shelves” of course - it means reduced choice.
    Do they have shaved parmesan?

    That is all ye know on earth,
    And all ye need to know.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,519

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I know many people in manufacturing and delivery problems are very real so I don’t believe that one bit.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    Now that Pen Farthing’s staff have been cleared to come forward under LOTR I have authorised MOD to facilitate their processing alongside all other eligible personnel at HKIA. At that stage, if he arrives with his animals we will seek a slot for his plane.

    https://twitter.com/BWallaceMP/status/1430327318434754568?s=20

    How, exactly, does he plan to get his animals through the queues of people waiting at the airport?
    More importantly, why is the Lord of the Rings the key document for deciding UK policy?
  • DavidL said:

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    Now that Pen Farthing’s staff have been cleared to come forward under LOTR I have authorised MOD to facilitate their processing alongside all other eligible personnel at HKIA. At that stage, if he arrives with his animals we will seek a slot for his plane.

    https://twitter.com/BWallaceMP/status/1430327318434754568?s=20

    How, exactly, does he plan to get his animals through the queues of people waiting at the airport?
    More importantly, why is the Lord of the Rings the key document for deciding UK policy?
    They could do a lot worse..
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I know many people in manufacturing and delivery problems are very real so I don’t believe that one bit.
    you dont have to, but it's true. The only shortage I have had has been from a supplier who got too much of his work force pinged and had to take a week out, but I had stock to cover the gap.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    DavidL said:

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    Now that Pen Farthing’s staff have been cleared to come forward under LOTR I have authorised MOD to facilitate their processing alongside all other eligible personnel at HKIA. At that stage, if he arrives with his animals we will seek a slot for his plane.

    https://twitter.com/BWallaceMP/status/1430327318434754568?s=20

    How, exactly, does he plan to get his animals through the queues of people waiting at the airport?
    More importantly, why is the Lord of the Rings the key document for deciding UK policy?
    They could do a lot worse..
    The eagles are coming, the eagles are coming.

    You could be right.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,685

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I don’t I’ve ever had a business without supply shortages, delivery problems or staffing & skills issues.

    Indeed, it’s usually the case that I get them all at once.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,951
    edited August 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    Nice try @kjh, my degree was in philosophy and even I know about Simpson’s paradox.
    Well you're obviously a smarty pants then :)
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I know many people in manufacturing and delivery problems are very real so I don’t believe that one bit.
    To be fair, just because one person or firm doesn't have any problems doesn't mean there aren't any.
    The opposite also applies. If one person or firm has problems doesn't mean everyone has.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,519

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I know many people in manufacturing and delivery problems are very real so I don’t believe that one bit.
    you dont have to, but it's true. The only shortage I have had has been from a supplier who got too much of his work force pinged and had to take a week out, but I had stock to cover the gap.
    That may be so but that doesn’t mean there aren’t problems outside of people being “shit at their jobs”.

    I haven’t blamed anything on Brexit mind but to suggest that these are problems based solely on people’s ability is ridiculous.

    I wonder how much stock of fresh food co-op is able to hold to “cover gaps” hmm.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Scott_xP said:
    Rich employers, who’ve been relying on exploiting Eastern European labour for years, having to face reality.

    Mind the wage gap
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,845
    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
    When there is no milk or bread thats shortages.. when the little darlings can't get their favourite brand of cereal they cry out in pain....

    They should think about the people like those that our charity 'Horsham matters' supports with basic items that most of these whiners would turn their noses up at.

    Scott n paste needs a reality check. He is like a broken record

    There was always going to be short term problems. Most have been caused by covid..eg Drivers unable to take HGV tests...
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,948

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    more victim blaming, then?
  • paulyork64paulyork64 Posts: 2,507

    darkage said:

    I don't do any Crypto investing.

    Maybe it's "the future" but from what I've read it's more likely it's a lot of bollocks built on sand.

    That's what i thought when all my poker playing associates told me about bitcoin back in the day...and now they are all multi-millionaires and never have to work a day in their life....

    And that's what i thought when an employee left to go and work on blockchain tech 5 years ago and is now a multi-millionaire and never have to work a day in their life....

    And yet I still think it is....
    They might simply have been riding the best part of the bubble.

    I'm sure virtual currency has a role to play in the future but I've no desire to speculate on it, particularly since it all seems rather contrived.
    I know next to nothing about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. However, they obviously have some potential actual use for people as a currency, IE, if you were trying to flee the taliban right now, bitcoin would be a very useful thing to have. It is probably a bubble that will burst at some point, but you can definetely make money whilst the market is rising, and a lot of people have. I would buy bitcoin in the same way as you might bet on a horse.






    That sensible advice right up until the moment the market peaks (which none of us know) and then it becomes terrible advice.
    Yes, what you really want in that situation is crypto pegged to USD. There are a few versions of these, some (USDT, USDC) involving trusted parties but others (DAI) not really. Unfortunately the most popular one is USDT (Tether) which involves a trusted party that's obviously fraudulent. But even USDT is probably much better than cash or banking if you live in Afghanistan right now, provided they don't turn off the internet.
    If a cryptocurrency was pegged to USD it would make it useful as a transactional tool but pointless for speculation. They (not sure who they are) need the hype to keep the myth alive.
  • MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    My local coop is full of signs saying “sorry for the reduced choice during this time”. That doesn’t mean “empty shelves” of course - it means reduced choice.
    Do they have shaved parmesan?

    That is all ye know on earth,
    And all ye need to know.
    At the local Coop - ?
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 3,948

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    "i'm alright, Jack?"
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516
    rcs1000 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I don’t I’ve ever had a business without supply shortages, delivery problems or staffing & skills issues.

    Indeed, it’s usually the case that I get them all at once.
    Oh Ive had all of them over my career, but my statement relates to the current moment and at present I dont have them. Next quarter might be different who knows, but at present Im good.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,519

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I know many people in manufacturing and delivery problems are very real so I don’t believe that one bit.
    To be fair, just because one person or firm doesn't have any problems doesn't mean there aren't any.
    The opposite also applies. If one person or firm has problems doesn't mean everyone has.
    You’re right. However the insinuation was that problems only exist because the Co op guy is shit at his job, which is of course ridiculous.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
    When there is no milk or bread thats shortages.. when the little darlings can't get their favourite brand of cereal they cry out in pain....

    They should think about the people like those that our charity 'Horsham matters' supports with basic items that most of these whiners would turn their noses up at.

    Scott n paste needs a reality check. He is like a broken record

    There was always going to be short term problems. Most have been caused by covid..eg Drivers unable to take HGV tests...
    WERE always going to be......

    Please.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    rcs1000 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I don’t I’ve ever had a business without supply shortages, delivery problems or staffing & skills issues.

    Indeed, it’s usually the case that I get them all at once.
    If you don't have these things surely you are not pushing the business hard enough or maximising its potential? These are the parameters against which any manager works.
  • edmundintokyoedmundintokyo Posts: 17,708

    darkage said:

    I don't do any Crypto investing.

    Maybe it's "the future" but from what I've read it's more likely it's a lot of bollocks built on sand.

    That's what i thought when all my poker playing associates told me about bitcoin back in the day...and now they are all multi-millionaires and never have to work a day in their life....

    And that's what i thought when an employee left to go and work on blockchain tech 5 years ago and is now a multi-millionaire and never have to work a day in their life....

    And yet I still think it is....
    They might simply have been riding the best part of the bubble.

    I'm sure virtual currency has a role to play in the future but I've no desire to speculate on it, particularly since it all seems rather contrived.
    I know next to nothing about bitcoin and cryptocurrencies. However, they obviously have some potential actual use for people as a currency, IE, if you were trying to flee the taliban right now, bitcoin would be a very useful thing to have. It is probably a bubble that will burst at some point, but you can definetely make money whilst the market is rising, and a lot of people have. I would buy bitcoin in the same way as you might bet on a horse.






    That sensible advice right up until the moment the market peaks (which none of us know) and then it becomes terrible advice.
    Yes, what you really want in that situation is crypto pegged to USD. There are a few versions of these, some (USDT, USDC) involving trusted parties but others (DAI) not really. Unfortunately the most popular one is USDT (Tether) which involves a trusted party that's obviously fraudulent. But even USDT is probably much better than cash or banking if you live in Afghanistan right now, provided they don't turn off the internet.
    If a cryptocurrency was pegged to USD it would make it useful as a transactional tool but pointless for speculation. They (not sure who they are) need the hype to keep the myth alive.
    Weirdly the big problem for DAI (which the non-trusted-party version of a stablecoin) turns out to be that the process where you put up other cryptocurrencies to print USD-pegged coins is brilliant for speculating on the value of the collateral, with the result that they find it hard to keep the value of their USD-pegged coin low enough.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,745
    edited August 2021

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
    When there is no milk or bread thats shortages.. when the little darlings can't get their favourite brand of cereal they cry out in pain....

    They should think about the people like those that our charity 'Horsham matters' supports with basic items that most of these whiners would turn their noses up at.

    Scott n paste needs a reality check. He is like a broken record

    There was always going to be short term problems. Most have been caused by covid..eg Drivers unable to take HGV tests...
    WERE always going to be......

    Please.

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I know many people in manufacturing and delivery problems are very real so I don’t believe that one bit.
    To be fair, just because one person or firm doesn't have any problems doesn't mean there aren't any.
    The opposite also applies. If one person or firm has problems doesn't mean everyone has.
    You’re right. However the insinuation was that problems only exist because the Co op guy is shit at his job, which is of course ridiculous.
    This is another anecdote but the son of a friend, who is a senior manager with a major supermarket, is reporting, according to the friend, that he is at his wits end trying to ensure his stores are stocked. Never, the report we got was, have things been so difficult.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    more victim blaming, then?
    LOL hows a CEO a victim ? he runs the show. If he didnt secure his supply chain or recruit and retain his drivers who's problem is that ?

  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    In an ever changing World it's nice to have some stable, familiar fixed points of reference.

    PB Brexiteers have still "had enough of experts"...

    Happy days
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,685
    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    Nice try @kjh, my degree was in philosophy and even I know about Simpson’s paradox.
    Well you're obviously a smarty pants then :)

    rcs1000 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I don’t I’ve ever had a business without supply shortages, delivery problems or staffing & skills issues.

    Indeed, it’s usually the case that I get them all at once.
    Oh Ive had all of them over my career, but my statement relates to the current moment and at present I dont have them. Next quarter might be different who knows, but at present Im good.
    I’m staggered you don’t have skills shortages right now - in LA, Phoenix and London, the labour market is incredibly tight.

    Which is both good (wages are rising) and bad (we’re going to offshore a whole bunch of back office functions, because our business model isn’t based around paying $85k for a remote working bookkeeper).
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    “ Which is caused by Brexit.”

    Simply untrue. There is a 100,00 shortfall of which 14,000 is claimed to be due to Brexit
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited August 2021
    Scott_xP said:

    In an ever changing World it's nice to have some stable, familiar fixed points of reference.

    PB Brexiteers have still "had enough of experts"...

    Happy days

    “ In an ever changing World it's nice to have some stable, familiar fixed points of reference.”

    The Guardian & David Lammy! :D
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,206

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    Now that Pen Farthing’s staff have been cleared to come forward under LOTR I have authorised MOD to facilitate their processing alongside all other eligible personnel at HKIA. At that stage, if he arrives with his animals we will seek a slot for his plane.

    https://twitter.com/BWallaceMP/status/1430327318434754568?s=20

    How, exactly, does he plan to get his animals through the queues of people waiting at the airport?
    Put the Rhino in front?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516
    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    Nice try @kjh, my degree was in philosophy and even I know about Simpson’s paradox.
    Well you're obviously a smarty pants then :)

    rcs1000 said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    I’m sure you’d do a better job mate. Please submit your CV.
    Probably would. But I run manufacturing not retail and currently I dont have any supply shortages, delivery problems or skills shortages.
    I don’t I’ve ever had a business without supply shortages, delivery problems or staffing & skills issues.

    Indeed, it’s usually the case that I get them all at once.
    Oh Ive had all of them over my career, but my statement relates to the current moment and at present I dont have them. Next quarter might be different who knows, but at present Im good.
    I’m staggered you don’t have skills shortages right now - in LA, Phoenix and London, the labour market is incredibly tight.

    Which is both good (wages are rising) and bad (we’re going to offshore a whole bunch of back office functions, because our business model isn’t based around paying $85k for a remote working bookkeeper).
    Well I dont

    That might all change next ear. But the only areas that I can see an issue on is service engineers in London where salaries are going silly, but we tend to look after our people and on machine programmers for CNC milling centres where I need another one soon and the market is a bit tight.

    But we take on apprentices and move people around with training so currently were coping
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    edited August 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    Nice try @kjh, my degree was in philosophy and even I know about Simpson’s paradox.
    I used a similar example on here last time i waded into the debate and even after breaking it down some people still thought it showed my hyptohetical Grammar school setup where less children got to go to University was better for getting kids to Uni.
  • QuincelQuincel Posts: 4,042
    Scott_xP said:
    The greatest headline, Brexit or otherwise, is clearly this:


  • TazTaz Posts: 15,069

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
    When there is no milk or bread thats shortages.. when the little darlings can't get their favourite brand of cereal they cry out in pain....

    They should think about the people like those that our charity 'Horsham matters' supports with basic items that most of these whiners would turn their noses up at.

    Scott n paste needs a reality check. He is like a broken record

    There was always going to be short term problems. Most have been caused by covid..eg Drivers unable to take HGV tests...
    The shortage of,drivers is global and has been discussed here before. Turkmenistan is short by a third. It is tiresome that every bad bit of news is just put down to Brexit.

    As for Scott he howls away here, bombarding the forum with endless posts most of which are rightly ignored. You’d think he’d have better things to expend his fury on.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    Do you seriously want Scotland not to develop a viable oilfield in the North sea creating over 1000 jobs and a badly needed income flow of tax revenues? It's a genuine question. The SNP slogan used to be "It's Scotland's Oil". And now they want to keep it in the ground so we can import it from elsewhere instead? I am genuinely bewildered by this.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    This is the issue with anecdotes. When it comes to the 'health' of an area wrt footfall, much depends on when you go - or for that matter, where you go.

    I've often got to know new places by walking through them. However, I freely admit that I've got the wrong impression of them by taking the 'wrong' streets through them. returning later, going down another street gives a vastly different impression.

    As for High Streets: their 'health' in terms of shops has been generally decreasing for a decade or more. As a country, we need to reevaluate the purpose of our town centres, and consider changing more retail into livable residential.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    DavidL said:

    Roger said:

    So, many, many congratulations to France here. More 1st vaccinations and more completes than the UK, as of today.
    But you might be left wondering how they've managed it, given that the populations are almost exactly the same and they've delivered fewer doses? (1/5)


    https://twitter.com/PaulMainwood/status/1430261812126261251?s=20

    You and francis who have devoted their posting lives to proving how much better the British are than the French -and everyone else for that matter- will have to take early retirement
    Read the thread.

    By the way - which animals do you think the RAF should be evacuating before women & children from Kabul? You posted in favour of an ex-Marine advocating that a few days ago...(but I suspect, once again, you hadn't done research...)
    On TV he said he had arranged the charter of a plane and wasnt relying on the RAF to get them out. He said he just needed a slot allocating and was pleading for one.
    Now that Pen Farthing’s staff have been cleared to come forward under LOTR I have authorised MOD to facilitate their processing alongside all other eligible personnel at HKIA. At that stage, if he arrives with his animals we will seek a slot for his plane.

    https://twitter.com/BWallaceMP/status/1430327318434754568?s=20

    How, exactly, does he plan to get his animals through the queues of people waiting at the airport?
    More importantly, why is the Lord of the Rings the key document for deciding UK policy?
    Leave Outside The Immigration Rules
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    Yesterday was my first visit to a Scottish city since autumn 2019. (Although I’ve been here since the beginning of the month I’ve been only in the rural west highlands, which is stowed out by the way, and even more stunningly gorgeous than ever, if you can get away from the gawkers.)

    Perth was like a ghost town yesterday. My family blamed the good weather, so that might be an explanation. But the lack of Homo sapiens was not actually the prime problem, it was the urban decay. Absolutely tragic. You’re maybe like a frog in slowly warming water David: the changes are so incremental you don’t notice. Yesterday for me was an epiphany: Brexit has fucked the country.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Latest Ros Atkins video on US kit left behind:

    https://twitter.com/BBCRosAtkins/status/1430427305227194368?s=20
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    This is the issue with anecdotes. When it comes to the 'health' of an area wrt footfall, much depends on when you go - or for that matter, where you go.

    I've often got to know new places by walking through them. However, I freely admit that I've got the wrong impression of them by taking the 'wrong' streets through them. returning later, going down another street gives a vastly different impression.

    As for High Streets: their 'health' in terms of shops has been generally decreasing for a decade or more. As a country, we need to reevaluate the purpose of our town centres, and consider changing more retail into livable residential.
    I agree with all of that and I am not suggesting that the long term trends for retail are healthy. I was just slightly surprised at Stuart's example. Dundee is now reaching the point that there are a lot of items (such as a decent suit or a good pair of shoes) you simply cannot buy in the town and I frankly question whether coffee shops and hairdressers alone are enough of a draw to bring people in. Perth are not in that category, at least not yet. Indeed I suspect that they are now taking some of the Dundee market.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533
    Scott_xP said:

    In an ever changing World it's nice to have some stable, familiar fixed points of reference.

    PB Brexiteers have still "had enough of experts"...

    Happy days

    My goodness! A comment from Scott that isn't a tweet! Some sign of independent intelligence. ;)

    Is Twitter down? ;)
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    DavidL said:

    Do you seriously want Scotland not to develop a viable oilfield in the North sea creating over 1000 jobs and a badly needed income flow of tax revenues? It's a genuine question. The SNP slogan used to be "It's Scotland's Oil". And now they want to keep it in the ground so we can import it from elsewhere instead? I am genuinely bewildered by this.
    It's really very simple.

    Westminster wants to do it, so.....
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Hmm, I failed my 11+. The school appealed because I was clearly the top in my entire year group. It wasn't (with all due modesty) particularly close. The appeal was refused on the basis that I had failed so badly the appeal could not be allowed.

    I went to private school and then a comprehensive that had recently been a grammar school instead. I got 6 highers in one year and left school at 16 to go to do an Honours law degree. Since then I have had a reasonably successful career in the law. This is my most recent work: https://news.stv.tv/west-central/serial-rapist-faces-life-sentence-after-attacking-three-women

    It would take a bit of persuading given my personal history to explain why grammar schools and the 11+ was or is a good idea.

    Huh? How old are you David?? The 11+ was abolished in Scotland in the early 1960s. I certainly didn’t imagine you to be 70 years old! And still not retired?
    I sat it in Germany in an Army school which operated under the English system but I don't think you can be right Stuart. When I went to Harris Academy in Dundee (which I left in 1977) my year was the first "comprehensive" year and the year above us had been selected on a grammar school basis. The school very much still had that grammar school ethos and performed really well academically.
    - “In Scotland, the qualifying exam or "quali", similar to the English 11-plus, was abolished in 1957.”

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/primary-youngsters-to-take-11-plus-style-1004643
    I don’t think that article is correct. It would seem that from 1962 most schools started sitting the new Ordinaries, leading to the growth of ‘omnibus’ schools, but it wasn’t until 1965 that selection was recommended to be phased out, and not until 1981 that it was completed.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Oxford-Companion-Scottish-History-Reference/dp/0199693056?asin=0199234825&revisionId=&format=4&depth=1

    Check pages 565-66.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    This is the issue with anecdotes. When it comes to the 'health' of an area wrt footfall, much depends on when you go - or for that matter, where you go.

    I've often got to know new places by walking through them. However, I freely admit that I've got the wrong impression of them by taking the 'wrong' streets through them. returning later, going down another street gives a vastly different impression.

    As for High Streets: their 'health' in terms of shops has been generally decreasing for a decade or more. As a country, we need to reevaluate the purpose of our town centres, and consider changing more retail into livable residential.
    Especially as a lot of shops were converted from residential in the first place.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,138
    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    My local coop is full of signs saying “sorry for the reduced choice during this time”. That doesn’t mean “empty shelves” of course - it means reduced choice.
    Do they have shaved parmesan?

    That is all ye know on earth,
    And all ye need to know.
    As it happens, I had to shave my own parmesan last night as I couldn't get the usual packet of pre-shredded.

    I can report that I made it through the night.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    Yesterday was my first visit to a Scottish city since autumn 2019. (Although I’ve been here since the beginning of the month I’ve been only in the rural west highlands, which is stowed out by the way, and even more stunningly gorgeous than ever, if you can get away from the gawkers.)

    Perth was like a ghost town yesterday. My family blamed the good weather, so that might be an explanation. But the lack of Homo sapiens was not actually the prime problem, it was the urban decay. Absolutely tragic. You’re maybe like a frog in slowly warming water David: the changes are so incremental you don’t notice. Yesterday for me was an epiphany: Brexit has fucked the country.
    Ok, if it was the first time in a while I could see why the decline would be more obvious. But these trends have very little or anything to do with Brexit and a lot more to do with the Amazon warehouses in Dunfermline and Glenrothes.
  • kjhkjh Posts: 11,951
    Alistair said:

    rcs1000 said:

    kjh said:

    I would just like to comment on @rcs1000 and @Northern_Al posts of last night. Covered what I was trying to say in numerous posts much much more sustintly.

    With regard to Simpsons paradox I think you are right @rcs1000 HYUFD misuse of stats seems to be an example of this. Great example given also. Made much clearer than my explanation.

    I had never heard of this before, although in my defence I did little stats at uni, instead focusing on logic.

    Nice try @kjh, my degree was in philosophy and even I know about Simpson’s paradox.
    I used a similar example on here last time i waded into the debate and even after breaking it down some people still thought it showed my hyptohetical Grammar school setup where less children got to go to University was better for getting kids to Uni.

    You can but try.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    My local coop is full of signs saying “sorry for the reduced choice during this time”. That doesn’t mean “empty shelves” of course - it means reduced choice.
    Do they have shaved parmesan?

    That is all ye know on earth,
    And all ye need to know.
    As it happens, I had to shave my own parmesan last night as I couldn't get the usual packet of pre-shredded.

    I can report that I made it through the night.
    Respect.
  • Morning all!

    There truly is some absolutist bollocks spoken when it comes to Brexit and the battleground seems to be shortages. It is a demonstrable fact that we are suffering uncontrolled shortages in the UK supply chain. Uncontrolled means that finding a fully stocked supermarket does not in any way disprove that it exists - it is simply what "uncontrolled" means. So Brexiteer sneering of "my shelves are full so its a remoaner lie" demonstrates their personal stupidity.

    Why this is happening is multi-faceted. There are *global* supply shortages of all kinds of things. As we are once again talking grocery I know of grossly extended lead times on everything from staple ingredients to cardboard impacting producers in the EU. So the pressure on the UK supply chain is not entirely brexit related and trying to claim it is demonstrates the personal stupidity of the #FBPE person.

    Here is the problem. The impacts are worse - a lot worse - in the UK. We haven't yet implemented the bulk of our new trading arrangements between GB and the EU. There is a calm before the storm as full paperwork and standards checks kick in. Not that we have bothered with the infrastructure needed to carry out these checks at our border control posts.

    We already have a big reduction in GB - EU traffic with ROI/NI now bypassing GB and so many EU hauliers simply refusing (or pricing themselves out of contention) to come to the GB. Which adds throttling of capacity and thus supply problems on top of the global ones. Then you add on the EU vehicles which are not in the UK making drops to and from their final destination which creates a shortage of both vehicles and drivers. Then you add on the EU workforce who aren't here any more (despite more people registering to stay than expected there is now a big shortage - how many people were here...?)

    Is all of this down to brexit? Of course not - Covid and IR35 add to the problems. But we now have a major structural problem which we're about to make worse and there is absolute denial from the Brexit/Tory voters that is Brexit related. Unlike the PB loons who insist there are no shortages most people have eyes and a brain. But they blame 100% Covid.

    We will find out...
  • Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
    When there is no milk or bread thats shortages.. when the little darlings can't get their favourite brand of cereal they cry out in pain....

    They should think about the people like those that our charity 'Horsham matters' supports with basic items that most of these whiners would turn their noses up at.

    Scott n paste needs a reality check. He is like a broken record

    There was always going to be short term problems. Most have been caused by covid..eg Drivers unable to take HGV tests...
    The shortage of,drivers is global and has been discussed here before. Turkmenistan is short by a third. It is tiresome that every bad bit of news is just put down to Brexit.

    As for Scott he howls away here, bombarding the forum with endless posts most of which are rightly ignored. You’d think he’d have better things to expend his fury on.
    Sometimes something happens to you that is so dramatic and upsetting to you that you just cannot get past the anger and hurt

    You want to express your despair 24/7, and find an outlet that you can continously submit articles entirely around that issue that has caused upset

    The fact that others ignore your ramblings, or object, cannot overcome the need to express yourself incessantly and so it will continue and frustratingly, without success

  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,173
    edited August 2021
    DavidL said:

    Do you seriously want Scotland not to develop a viable oilfield in the North sea creating over 1000 jobs and a badly needed income flow of tax revenues? It's a genuine question. The SNP slogan used to be "It's Scotland's Oil". And now they want to keep it in the ground so we can import it from elsewhere instead? I am genuinely bewildered by this.
    Not keen on a party of government neither I nor my country voted for getting their palms greased by oil companies. Also not minded to take the views of folk who seven years ago were telling me ‘Scottish’ oil was finished too seriously on this issue.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    edited August 2021
    DavidL said:

    Do you seriously want Scotland not to develop a viable oilfield in the North sea creating over 1000 jobs and a badly needed income flow of tax revenues? It's a genuine question. The SNP slogan used to be "It's Scotland's Oil". And now they want to keep it in the ground so we can import it from elsewhere instead? I am genuinely bewildered by this.
    Leave it in the ground pre-independence.
    Pump up the black gold to heart’s content post-independence.

    We don’t want the turds spending it on Trident, HS2 and paying for Tony Blair’s final colonial hurrahs. After all, Maggie spaffed all our cash up the wall during the 1980s, while our neighbours in Norway have the best pensions on the planet.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Maybe 18-21 year olds will have to work, instead of loafing about, thinking about intersectional gender theory whilst big business pays Eastern European men school leaver wages to support their families
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,830

    DavidL said:

    Do you seriously want Scotland not to develop a viable oilfield in the North sea creating over 1000 jobs and a badly needed income flow of tax revenues? It's a genuine question. The SNP slogan used to be "It's Scotland's Oil". And now they want to keep it in the ground so we can import it from elsewhere instead? I am genuinely bewildered by this.
    Not keen on a party of government neither I nor my country voted for getting their palms greased by oil companies. Also not minded to take the views of folk who seven years ago were telling me ‘Scottish’ oil was finished too seriously on this issue.
    You didn’t vote for the SNP then?
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 36,109
    Taz said:

    endless posts most of which are rightly ignored.

    None so blind as those who will not see...
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Hmm, I failed my 11+. The school appealed because I was clearly the top in my entire year group. It wasn't (with all due modesty) particularly close. The appeal was refused on the basis that I had failed so badly the appeal could not be allowed.

    I went to private school and then a comprehensive that had recently been a grammar school instead. I got 6 highers in one year and left school at 16 to go to do an Honours law degree. Since then I have had a reasonably successful career in the law. This is my most recent work: https://news.stv.tv/west-central/serial-rapist-faces-life-sentence-after-attacking-three-women

    It would take a bit of persuading given my personal history to explain why grammar schools and the 11+ was or is a good idea.

    Huh? How old are you David?? The 11+ was abolished in Scotland in the early 1960s. I certainly didn’t imagine you to be 70 years old! And still not retired?
    I sat it in Germany in an Army school which operated under the English system but I don't think you can be right Stuart. When I went to Harris Academy in Dundee (which I left in 1977) my year was the first "comprehensive" year and the year above us had been selected on a grammar school basis. The school very much still had that grammar school ethos and performed really well academically.
    - “In Scotland, the qualifying exam or "quali", similar to the English 11-plus, was abolished in 1957.”

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/primary-youngsters-to-take-11-plus-style-1004643
    I don’t think that article is correct. It would seem that from 1962 most schools started sitting the new Ordinaries, leading to the growth of ‘omnibus’ schools, but it wasn’t until 1965 that selection was recommended to be phased out, and not until 1981 that it was completed.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Oxford-Companion-Scottish-History-Reference/dp/0199693056?asin=0199234825&revisionId=&format=4&depth=1

    Check pages 565-66.
    That fits with my experience of it being phased out in Dundee in the middle 70s. The Dundee Council of those days was pretty left wing and unlikely to have been laggards in this.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,980
    Good morning, everyone.

    I, for one, strongly support the firm border policy of Melian and Thingol.
  • DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    Yesterday was my first visit to a Scottish city since autumn 2019. (Although I’ve been here since the beginning of the month I’ve been only in the rural west highlands, which is stowed out by the way, and even more stunningly gorgeous than ever, if you can get away from the gawkers.)

    Perth was like a ghost town yesterday. My family blamed the good weather, so that might be an explanation. But the lack of Homo sapiens was not actually the prime problem, it was the urban decay. Absolutely tragic. You’re maybe like a frog in slowly warming water David: the changes are so incremental you don’t notice. Yesterday for me was an epiphany: Brexit has fucked the country.
    The devastation of retail shopping has nothing to do with Brexit but everything to do with online shopping
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,557
    O/T it looks as though Biden's ratings have plunged firmly into negative territory now (as he deserves).
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,173

    Taz said:

    Taz said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    My god, even the Grauniad is against Brexit! Who’d of thunk it. How many readers left now, three, four?
    Like a scratched record. Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty and has a picture of an empty shelf surrounded by full ones.
    When there is no milk or bread thats shortages.. when the little darlings can't get their favourite brand of cereal they cry out in pain....

    They should think about the people like those that our charity 'Horsham matters' supports with basic items that most of these whiners would turn their noses up at.

    Scott n paste needs a reality check. He is like a broken record

    There was always going to be short term problems. Most have been caused by covid..eg Drivers unable to take HGV tests...
    The shortage of,drivers is global and has been discussed here before. Turkmenistan is short by a third. It is tiresome that every bad bit of news is just put down to Brexit.

    As for Scott he howls away here, bombarding the forum with endless posts most of which are rightly ignored. You’d think he’d have better things to expend his fury on.
    Sometimes something happens to you that is so dramatic and upsetting to you that you just cannot get past the anger and hurt

    You want to express your despair 24/7, and find an outlet that you can continously submit articles entirely around that issue that has caused upset

    The fact that others ignore your ramblings, or object, cannot overcome the need to express yourself incessantly and so it will continue and frustratingly, without success

    Not really getting an ‘ignore’ vibe from the 24/7 moaning by BJ & Brexit fanbois about ScottP’s posts.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    edited August 2021
    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Hmm, I failed my 11+. The school appealed because I was clearly the top in my entire year group. It wasn't (with all due modesty) particularly close. The appeal was refused on the basis that I had failed so badly the appeal could not be allowed.

    I went to private school and then a comprehensive that had recently been a grammar school instead. I got 6 highers in one year and left school at 16 to go to do an Honours law degree. Since then I have had a reasonably successful career in the law. This is my most recent work: https://news.stv.tv/west-central/serial-rapist-faces-life-sentence-after-attacking-three-women

    It would take a bit of persuading given my personal history to explain why grammar schools and the 11+ was or is a good idea.

    Huh? How old are you David?? The 11+ was abolished in Scotland in the early 1960s. I certainly didn’t imagine you to be 70 years old! And still not retired?
    I sat it in Germany in an Army school which operated under the English system but I don't think you can be right Stuart. When I went to Harris Academy in Dundee (which I left in 1977) my year was the first "comprehensive" year and the year above us had been selected on a grammar school basis. The school very much still had that grammar school ethos and performed really well academically.
    - “In Scotland, the qualifying exam or "quali", similar to the English 11-plus, was abolished in 1957.”

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/primary-youngsters-to-take-11-plus-style-1004643
    I don’t think that article is correct. It would seem that from 1962 most schools started sitting the new Ordinaries, leading to the growth of ‘omnibus’ schools, but it wasn’t until 1965 that selection was recommended to be phased out, and not until 1981 that it was completed.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Oxford-Companion-Scottish-History-Reference/dp/0199693056?asin=0199234825&revisionId=&format=4&depth=1

    Check pages 565-66.
    Ta. I googled like a Trojan last night, and got bloody nowhere. We need a comprehensive, readable history of Scottish education. The last comprehensive publication only covered the period from the Middle Ages to 1908.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    DavidL said:

    Do you seriously want Scotland not to develop a viable oilfield in the North sea creating over 1000 jobs and a badly needed income flow of tax revenues? It's a genuine question. The SNP slogan used to be "It's Scotland's Oil". And now they want to keep it in the ground so we can import it from elsewhere instead? I am genuinely bewildered by this.
    Not keen on a party of government neither I nor my country voted for getting their palms greased by oil companies. Also not minded to take the views of folk who seven years ago were telling me ‘Scottish’ oil was finished too seriously on this issue.
    But exploit or not exploit? Its a binary question.
  • Scott_xP said:

    Taz said:

    Starts off with the flawed premise the shelves are empty

    Like I said, this guy clearly doesn't know as much as the PB brain trust...

    Steve Murrells, chief executive of the Co-operative Group, said it was reducing some ranges as the industry’s ability to get food to shops was hit by post-Brexit migration rules and Covid-19.

    “The shortages are at a worse level than at any time I have seen,” he said.
    so he's not very good at his job then ?
    more victim blaming, then?
    LOL hows a CEO a victim ? he runs the show. If he didnt secure his supply chain or recruit and retain his drivers who's problem is that ?

    *giggles* stop being silly. How does the CEO of Co-op have the ability to "secure his supply chain"? Does his company make every item they sell? Does his company supply every item used in the production of every item they sell? Its a free market, so when stuff gets bought by his business from another business who buy stuff from a whole pile of different businessesd who buy theirs from even more businesses, how specifically would YOU Mr @Alanbrooke as CEO "secure your supply chain"? Details please.

    This Brexiteer absolutism does make some very clever people look profoundly stupid.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,069

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    Yesterday was my first visit to a Scottish city since autumn 2019. (Although I’ve been here since the beginning of the month I’ve been only in the rural west highlands, which is stowed out by the way, and even more stunningly gorgeous than ever, if you can get away from the gawkers.)

    Perth was like a ghost town yesterday. My family blamed the good weather, so that might be an explanation. But the lack of Homo sapiens was not actually the prime problem, it was the urban decay. Absolutely tragic. You’re maybe like a frog in slowly warming water David: the changes are so incremental you don’t notice. Yesterday for me was an epiphany: Brexit has fucked the country.
    The devastation of retail shopping has nothing to do with Brexit but everything to do with online shopping
    To diehard remainers everything bad is due to brexit, to diehard brexiteers everything good is because of Brexit.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    Yesterday was my first visit to a Scottish city since autumn 2019. (Although I’ve been here since the beginning of the month I’ve been only in the rural west highlands, which is stowed out by the way, and even more stunningly gorgeous than ever, if you can get away from the gawkers.)

    Perth was like a ghost town yesterday. My family blamed the good weather, so that might be an explanation. But the lack of Homo sapiens was not actually the prime problem, it was the urban decay. Absolutely tragic. You’re maybe like a frog in slowly warming water David: the changes are so incremental you don’t notice. Yesterday for me was an epiphany: Brexit has fucked the country.
    The devastation of retail shopping has nothing to do with Brexit but everything to do with online shopping
    So, what problems has Brexit caused?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Defence secretary Ben Wallace has confirmed that if Pen Farthing arrives at the airport with his animals, officials would "seek a slot for his plane".

    The former Royal Marine is trying to leave Afghanistan with 68 staff and 200 cats & dogs from a shelter.
    https://bbc.in/3kpTa62


    https://twitter.com/BBCBreakfast/status/1430412915543363584?s=20
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,040

    ydoethur said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Hmm, I failed my 11+. The school appealed because I was clearly the top in my entire year group. It wasn't (with all due modesty) particularly close. The appeal was refused on the basis that I had failed so badly the appeal could not be allowed.

    I went to private school and then a comprehensive that had recently been a grammar school instead. I got 6 highers in one year and left school at 16 to go to do an Honours law degree. Since then I have had a reasonably successful career in the law. This is my most recent work: https://news.stv.tv/west-central/serial-rapist-faces-life-sentence-after-attacking-three-women

    It would take a bit of persuading given my personal history to explain why grammar schools and the 11+ was or is a good idea.

    Huh? How old are you David?? The 11+ was abolished in Scotland in the early 1960s. I certainly didn’t imagine you to be 70 years old! And still not retired?
    I sat it in Germany in an Army school which operated under the English system but I don't think you can be right Stuart. When I went to Harris Academy in Dundee (which I left in 1977) my year was the first "comprehensive" year and the year above us had been selected on a grammar school basis. The school very much still had that grammar school ethos and performed really well academically.
    - “In Scotland, the qualifying exam or "quali", similar to the English 11-plus, was abolished in 1957.”

    https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/scottish-news/primary-youngsters-to-take-11-plus-style-1004643
    I don’t think that article is correct. It would seem that from 1962 most schools started sitting the new Ordinaries, leading to the growth of ‘omnibus’ schools, but it wasn’t until 1965 that selection was recommended to be phased out, and not until 1981 that it was completed.

    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Oxford-Companion-Scottish-History-Reference/dp/0199693056?asin=0199234825&revisionId=&format=4&depth=1

    Check pages 565-66.
    Ta. I googled like a Trojan last night, and got bloody nowhere. We need a comprehensive, readable history of Scottish education. The last comprehensive publication only covered the period from the Middle Ages to 1908.
    Perhaps such a history could have the pages dealing with Curriculum for Excellence edged in black?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,533

    Morning all!

    There truly is some absolutist bollocks spoken when it comes to Brexit and the battleground seems to be shortages. It is a demonstrable fact that we are suffering uncontrolled shortages in the UK supply chain. Uncontrolled means that finding a fully stocked supermarket does not in any way disprove that it exists - it is simply what "uncontrolled" means. So Brexiteer sneering of "my shelves are full so its a remoaner lie" demonstrates their personal stupidity.

    Why this is happening is multi-faceted. There are *global* supply shortages of all kinds of things. As we are once again talking grocery I know of grossly extended lead times on everything from staple ingredients to cardboard impacting producers in the EU. So the pressure on the UK supply chain is not entirely brexit related and trying to claim it is demonstrates the personal stupidity of the #FBPE person.

    Here is the problem. The impacts are worse - a lot worse - in the UK. We haven't yet implemented the bulk of our new trading arrangements between GB and the EU. There is a calm before the storm as full paperwork and standards checks kick in. Not that we have bothered with the infrastructure needed to carry out these checks at our border control posts.

    We already have a big reduction in GB - EU traffic with ROI/NI now bypassing GB and so many EU hauliers simply refusing (or pricing themselves out of contention) to come to the GB. Which adds throttling of capacity and thus supply problems on top of the global ones. Then you add on the EU vehicles which are not in the UK making drops to and from their final destination which creates a shortage of both vehicles and drivers. Then you add on the EU workforce who aren't here any more (despite more people registering to stay than expected there is now a big shortage - how many people were here...?)

    Is all of this down to brexit? Of course not - Covid and IR35 add to the problems. But we now have a major structural problem which we're about to make worse and there is absolute denial from the Brexit/Tory voters that is Brexit related. Unlike the PB loons who insist there are no shortages most people have eyes and a brain. But they blame 100% Covid.

    We will find out...

    It may be a 'demonstrable fact' that we are suffering uncontrolled shortages in the UK supply chain: it's just that many of us are not seeing much sign of it in the shops. I've just been in my local Co-Op; one empty shelf (the 'sales' shelf which is often empty), and none of my favourite lemon yoghurts - which they often didn't have anyway. There was plenty of the short shelf-life items I'd expect to have shortages of first, such as fruit and bread.

    The only thing of note was that two of the three local petrol stations were out of fuel a few weeks ago (and before you say 'absolutist bollocks' to me, I mentioned that on here).

    That's the problem with trying to make this into a big issue: if people don't see much of a change (perhaps due to brilliant work by the supermarkets and distributors to shuffle things around), then it just seems like people screeching at the skies for political reasons.

    It'l become a political issue if people really start noticing shortages. And at the moment, much of the anecdata on shortages appears to follow political lines. Remainers are seeing thousands of empty shelves and Russian-style queues of starving children; Brexiteers are seeing shops full of bounty and goodness. The rest of us just go 'Meh.'
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Taz said:

    DavidL said:

    Scott_xP said:

    On Brexit as the damp smell in English politics - can be endured but not ignored; cost of fixing it gets higher the longer you postpone thinking about it.
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/24/brexit-failure-remainers-shelves-empty-eu

    A lot of empty shelves in Tesco yesterday. When I asked a member of staff why, she blamed the shortage of drivers. Which is caused by Brexit.

    Perth High Street is like something out of the apocalypse. Quite unnerving for someone familiar with the bustling, young, joyful affluence of Scandinavian cities. I’ve witnessed that High Street declining for three decades, but yesterday was a step-change. It must be soul-destroying for the few staff left manning those deserted retail spaces. Costa coffee looked like something out of a war zone.
    I was in Perth last weekend and it was bustling. Like Dundee the loss of Debenhams is a major blow, especially after the loss of McEwans a few years ago now, but there is plenty of money in Perth and the shops seem to be doing fine. Dundee has much more of a problem with the Overgate centre.
    Yesterday was my first visit to a Scottish city since autumn 2019. (Although I’ve been here since the beginning of the month I’ve been only in the rural west highlands, which is stowed out by the way, and even more stunningly gorgeous than ever, if you can get away from the gawkers.)

    Perth was like a ghost town yesterday. My family blamed the good weather, so that might be an explanation. But the lack of Homo sapiens was not actually the prime problem, it was the urban decay. Absolutely tragic. You’re maybe like a frog in slowly warming water David: the changes are so incremental you don’t notice. Yesterday for me was an epiphany: Brexit has fucked the country.
    The devastation of retail shopping has nothing to do with Brexit but everything to do with online shopping
    To diehard remainers everything bad is due to brexit, to diehard brexiteers everything good is because of Brexit.
    I am not a diehard remainer. I seriously swithered about voting Leave, and only really made my mind up during the final weeks.

    I am however a diehard Scot. I strongly dislike seeing my country fucked by the Union. The damage is now blatant, exposed for all to see.
This discussion has been closed.