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The changed perceptions of government performance since GE2019 – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,219
edited August 2021 in General
imageThe changed perceptions of government performance since GE2019 – politicalbetting.com

If it hadn’t been for the fight against COVID the above changed perceptions in this Ipsos MORI polling would be quite worrying for ministers. For since the baseline, the last general election in December 2019 there has been one overwhelming priority for the government and that has been the impact of coronavirus.

Read the full story here

«1345

Comments

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984
    First.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,984
    Hurrah for Ipsos MORI.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,811
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    First.

    First when adjusted for false positives.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,228
    Fpt
    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,755
    FPT

    Max I think what you’re missing, is the lack of office has also meant the end of office politics. While I have once had someone scream down the phone at me that I’m a “fucking c**t” on a recorded phone line, generally most people are fairly cordial on email, IM and the phone. Even the most obnoxious knobheads struggle to get their sarcastic disdain across when it’s not person to person. Dunno what end of banking you’re in but the dodgier / corrupt practices are also far harder to do in this brave new world, which is a big plus in my book.

    For the office politics reason alone, I’d be perfectly happy never to go in again. Though there are of course many other reasons not to. That said, I’m not remotely ambitious anymore. I just wanna cruise it for 5-10 years. Do my job competently and professionally, engage cordially with the people I need to get things done and have time for the other things in life. And I long ago stopped using work as a crutch for a social life. For the reasons you describe, it’s far better to be friends with people who don’t even understand your job.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    If I am reading this right, on almost every issue the optimists were disappointed and the pessimists pleasantly surprised. Nothing is ever as good or as bad as you expect it to be.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,303
    ydoethur said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    First.

    First when adjusted for false positives.
    Ah, the recurrent myth. :smile:

    @TheScreamingEagles is as genuine as anyone here (low bar, I know).
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    edited August 2021
    OT -- the Racing Post (from June) on how football came from Scotland.

    The debt England and all other football nations owe Scotland for developing game
    Why Football’s Coming Home would be better suited to Scottish terraces

    ...
    The Scottish game was so evidently superior to the English game that when clubs in England turned professional they sought players in Scotland. In the first season of the Football League – 1888-89 – Preston won the double. Unbeaten throughout the season they became known as the Invincibles. Eight of the 11 regulars were Scots.
    https://www.racingpost.com/sport/the-debt-england-and-all-other-football-nations-owe-scotland-for-developing-game/495248
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    What that says to me is people are more confident of their views on hypothetical's than they are at weighing up what they think of real life
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    It would be very interesting if you could go back in time and do the same thing for past governments. I strongly suspect none has ever outperformed expectations.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    edited August 2021
    Also for the EU question the two questions are different, which probably explains the huge difference. In 2019 it seems they were asked if it was likely that the government would take the country out of the EU, in 2021 it was about whether they had done a good or bad job of it.
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,755
    Apologies I meant to star out more expletives in that last post than I did. I blame the wine and the distraction of the skateboarding.
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,774
    RobD said:

    It would be very interesting if you could go back in time and do the same thing for past governments. I strongly suspect none has ever outperformed expectations.

    Thatcher's govt probably exceeded expectations, in both directions.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,165
    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,137
    Allie Hodgkins-Brown
    @AllieHBNews
    ·
    23m
    Thursday’s FINANCIAL TIMES: “WHO seeks halt on Covid boosters as poorer nations struggle for jabs” #TomorrowsPapersToday
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    rottenborough said:

    Allie Hodgkins-Brown
    @AllieHBNews
    ·
    23m
    Thursday’s FINANCIAL TIMES: “WHO seeks halt on Covid boosters as poorer nations struggle for jabs” #TomorrowsPapersToday

    Didn't they also want the UK to stop after vaccinating the elderly?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,165
    geoffw said:

    RobD said:

    rottenborough said:

    Allie Hodgkins-Brown
    @AllieHBNews
    ·
    23m
    Thursday’s FINANCIAL TIMES: “WHO seeks halt on Covid boosters as poorer nations struggle for jabs” #TomorrowsPapersToday

    Didn't they also want the UK to stop after vaccinating the elderly?
    The WHO talking about their generation.

    They can't explain.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,228
    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
    I think it depends on the site. This particular site was obviously not very suitable for putting up turbines as the ground turned out to be like a Swiss cheese, and they ended up using thousands of tons of concrete and grout. I've not run the numbers, but knowing that sort of terrain it's certainly not inplausible.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    RobD said:

    rottenborough said:

    Allie Hodgkins-Brown
    @AllieHBNews
    ·
    23m
    Thursday’s FINANCIAL TIMES: “WHO seeks halt on Covid boosters as poorer nations struggle for jabs” #TomorrowsPapersToday

    Didn't they also want the UK to stop after vaccinating the elderly?
    Yes, it made no difference. The vaccines have been purchased, they will get used.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,165
    theProle said:

    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
    I think it depends on the site. This particular site was obviously not very suitable for putting up turbines as the ground turned out to be like a Swiss cheese, and they ended up using thousands of tons of concrete and grout. I've not run the numbers, but knowing that sort of terrain it's certainly not inplausible.
    400 years vs 7-9 months is not plausible. That requires hundreds of times the concrete of an average turbine.

    In some it is quicker still. This calculation made it 47 days:

    https://www.windpowerengineering.com/wind-turbine-carbon-payback-times-shorter-than-expected-finds-new-study/
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,419
    theProle said:

    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
    I think it depends on the site. This particular site was obviously not very suitable for putting up turbines as the ground turned out to be like a Swiss cheese, and they ended up using thousands of tons of concrete and grout. I've not run the numbers, but knowing that sort of terrain it's certainly not inplausible.
    Old tin-streaming or gruffy ground?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,228
    MaxPB said:

    RobD said:

    rottenborough said:

    Allie Hodgkins-Brown
    @AllieHBNews
    ·
    23m
    Thursday’s FINANCIAL TIMES: “WHO seeks halt on Covid boosters as poorer nations struggle for jabs” #TomorrowsPapersToday

    Didn't they also want the UK to stop after vaccinating the elderly?
    Yes, it made no difference. The vaccines have been purchased, they will get used.
    Hasn't the WHO actually got half a point for once? The pandemic is over in a UK context - virtually no one is dieing. Even if we get an autumn wave, it's only really going to be cases, not admissions or deaths (we've just demonstrated that with wave 3).

    In terms of net lives saved, wouldn't it be far better for us to donate most of our stock to Covax than use them for boosters or kids?
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html

    How many qualified signatories this time?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    France no longer amber-plus and green list expands

    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58079107
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,492
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html

    is this the same people who confidently predicted there would be 100,000 cases by now?
  • moonshinemoonshine Posts: 5,755
    rottenborough said:

    Allie Hodgkins-Brown
    @AllieHBNews
    ·
    23m
    Thursday’s FINANCIAL TIMES: “WHO seeks halt on Covid boosters as poorer nations struggle for jabs” #TomorrowsPapersToday

    I appreciate that manufacturing is hard, and manufacturing of biological agents doubly so. But it’s quite a disappointment that we’re still talking about vaccination supplies as a zero sum game. All this funny money, trillions of it. And we’re still sat here weighing up the lives of a 50 year old African and an 80 year Westerner.
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,228
    edited August 2021
    Carnyx said:

    theProle said:

    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
    I think it depends on the site. This particular site was obviously not very suitable for putting up turbines as the ground turned out to be like a Swiss cheese, and they ended up using thousands of tons of concrete and grout. I've not run the numbers, but knowing that sort of terrain it's certainly not inplausible.
    Old tin-streaming or gruffy ground?
    Tin, lead and copper workings I think - it's an area riddled with them.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,137
    BigRich said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html

    is this the same people who confidently predicted there would be 100,000 cases by now?

    Yep.

    "Lead author and Independent SAGE member Professor Christina Pagel"

    iSAGE can sure move quickly on to new terrain when one of their predictions or prescriptions implodes without pausing for breath.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    rottenborough said:

    BigRich said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html

    is this the same people who confidently predicted there would be 100,000 cases by now?

    Yep.

    "Lead author and Independent SAGE member Professor Christina Pagel"

    iSAGE can sure move quickly on to new terrain when one of their predictions or prescriptions implodes without pausing for breath.
    They are an utter joke.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,481
    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
    I think it depends on the site. This particular site was obviously not very suitable for putting up turbines as the ground turned out to be like a Swiss cheese, and they ended up using thousands of tons of concrete and grout. I've not run the numbers, but knowing that sort of terrain it's certainly not inplausible.
    400 years vs 7-9 months is not plausible. That requires hundreds of times the concrete of an average turbine.

    In some it is quicker still. This calculation made it 47 days:

    https://www.windpowerengineering.com/wind-turbine-carbon-payback-times-shorter-than-expected-finds-new-study/
    Got a geologist mate who does this for a living. Assess sites for turbines.
    Clearly this site shouldn't have been chosen. Will question him tomorrow.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,137
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html

    Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells has become Angry of Ivory Towers.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830
    Foxy said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    I think that figure for the carbon cost of a wind turbine is way off. The New Scientist reckons on 7-9 months. Unless your windfarm uses a 1000 times more concrete than average, the figures are wrong.

    https://www.newscientist.com/lastword/mg24332461-400-what-is-the-carbon-payback-period-for-a-wind-turbine/
    Well, the whole point of the story is that it was an exceptional case...
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    BigRich said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    More letter writing to the Lancet...

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9861827/Group-scientists-criticise-No10-unacceptable-delay-vaccinating-children-against-Covid.html

    is this the same people who confidently predicted there would be 100,000 cases by now?
    Lots of people, none of who would describe model outputs as confident predictions. And the government.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,303
    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,173
    edited August 2021
    Tomorrow’s announcement today:

    A number of key destinations as well as international travel hubs will be removed from the red list – India, Bahrain, Qatar and the UAE. India’s placement on the red list was the subject of substantial controversy after MPs accused Boris Johnson of delaying its inclusion in the spring as cases rapidly rose and the new Delta variant emerged.

    Mexico, Georgia, Réunion and Mayotte are to be added to the red list. More countries will also be added to the green list where travellers can go regardless of vaccine status. New green list countries are Austria, Germany, Slovenia, Slovakia, Latvia, Romania and Norway. All changes come into effect at 4am on Sunday 8 August in England.

    Government at least has had the atlas out and finally worked out the difference between Reunion and France.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    IanB2 said:

    Tomorrow’s announcement today:

    A number of key destinations as well as international travel hubs will be removed from the red list – India, Bahrain, Qatar and the UAE. India’s placement on the red list was the subject of substantial controversy after MPs accused Boris Johnson of delaying its inclusion in the spring as cases rapidly rose and the new Delta variant emerged.

    Mexico, Georgia, Réunion and Mayotte are to be added to the red list. More countries will also be added to the green list where travellers can go regardless of vaccine status. New green list countries are Austria, Germany, Slovenia, Slovakia, Latvia, Romania and Norway. All changes come into effect at 4am on Sunday 8 August in England.

    That statement is inaccurate. The green list is a list of countries where travellers can return from without quarantine. New Zealand is on the green list, good luck going there.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    The great replacement theory....
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    All nations have political problems, and I'm not about the predict the collapse of the USA, but their mainstream politics seems pretty f*cked up thesedays.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,820
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html

    I think that reflects badly on Cummings. Whether in half jest or seriousness it is not the done thing to blurt out personal confidences like that
  • state_go_awaystate_go_away Posts: 5,820
    moonshine said:

    FPT

    Max I think what you’re missing, is the lack of office has also meant the end of office politics. While I have once had someone scream down the phone at me that I’m a “fucking c**t” on a recorded phone line, generally most people are fairly cordial on email, IM and the phone. Even the most obnoxious knobheads struggle to get their sarcastic disdain across when it’s not person to person. Dunno what end of banking you’re in but the dodgier / corrupt practices are also far harder to do in this brave new world, which is a big plus in my book.

    For the office politics reason alone, I’d be perfectly happy never to go in again. Though there are of course many other reasons not to. That said, I’m not remotely ambitious anymore. I just wanna cruise it for 5-10 years. Do my job competently and professionally, engage cordially with the people I need to get things done and have time for the other things in life. And I long ago stopped using work as a crutch for a social life. For the reasons you describe, it’s far better to be friends with people who don’t even understand your job.

    Isn't office politics kinda fun? Its a bit ironic this site wants them gone
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,689
    moonshine said:

    Apologies I meant to star out more expletives in that last post than I did. I blame the wine and the distraction of the skateboarding.

    Very good post actually.

    WFH suits many but some find it a drag. It all depends on what sort of person you are and what your job is.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,253
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    The great replacement theory....
    Republicans have replaced their brains with sawdust.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,689
    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    Unbelievable. But maybe it was always there. Maybe all of that small state libertarianism he used to major on was a front. Or maybe this stuff is insincere and just rolled out to stimulate the new crazy base. God knows.
  • ExiledInScotlandExiledInScotland Posts: 1,530
    state_go_away said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html

    I think that reflects badly on Cummings. Whether in half jest or seriousness it is not the done thing to blurt out personal confidences like that
    Cummings is making himself unemployable. Sad.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited August 2021
    ExiledInScotland said:

    state_go_away said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html

    I think that reflects badly on Cummings. Whether in half jest or seriousness it is not the done thing to blurt out personal confidences like that
    Cummings is making himself unemployable. Sad.
    making......i think more accurately "made".

    Who is going to trust him with anything?
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,640
    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    Please show us an EU country anywhere near us in the medal table

    😊😊😊
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,228
    state_go_away said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html

    I think that reflects badly on Cummings. Whether in half jest or seriousness it is not the done thing to blurt out personal confidences like that
    It also has a ring of truth.

    I can't say I'm a fan of either side in the Carrie/Dom war, but on balance I'd rather Dom had won this one. Carries enthusiasm for turning the Tories into the greens will do a lot more damage to the country than Dom having bust ups with Sir Humphrey.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    Finally got around to reading my copy of Philip Matyszak's Forgotten Peoples of the Ancient World. Highly recommended. Not indepth at all, but intriguing potted histories of 5-10 pages of many vaguely recalled historical peoples, and the snippets that have filtered through to the modern day in things as small as names and references.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,473
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    ExiledInScotland said:

    state_go_away said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html

    I think that reflects badly on Cummings. Whether in half jest or seriousness it is not the done thing to blurt out personal confidences like that
    Cummings is making himself unemployable. Sad.
    making......i think more accurately "made".

    Who is going to trust him with anything?
    The thing is, I don't think DC cares. Let's face it, he's rich enough that he doesn't actually need to work again, and the idea of being a new aristocrat, gentleman-scholar probably appeals to his worldview.

    But his fury with the system in general and Johnson in particular is something to behold. Bottom line is that he got played something rotten, didn't he?
  • theProletheProle Posts: 1,228
    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    Maybe we could level the playing field by calculating the numbers of medals/golds per entrant? That's surely a fairer metric.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,591
    edited August 2021
    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,640
    Need to crack on with it. Cases and deaths are rising.

    Need to vaccinate 12 to 17 by end August. Then third doses for everyone by end Dec.
  • occasionalranteroccasionalranter Posts: 292
    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    What about the Welsh, northern Irish and Scots ? You just dig the hole a little deeper every time you post on this.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,481
    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    Unbelievable. But maybe it was always there. Maybe all of that small state libertarianism he used to major on was a front. Or maybe this stuff is insincere and just rolled out to stimulate the new crazy base. God knows.
    Feel sorry for decent conservatives. Who the heck do they vote for if they are small state, secular, live and let live types?
  • Stark_DawningStark_Dawning Posts: 9,714
    Stuartinromford said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    ExiledInScotland said:

    state_go_away said:

    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Dominic Cummings has claimed that Boris Johnson said his partner Carrie was driving him 'crackers' and suggested finding her 'a job with lots of foreign travel'.

    The Prime Minister's former chief adviser also said that Mr Johnson offered him a peerage when he left No 10.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9862213/Dominic-Cummings-claims-Boris-wanted-Carrie-job-lots-foreign-travel.html

    I think that reflects badly on Cummings. Whether in half jest or seriousness it is not the done thing to blurt out personal confidences like that
    Cummings is making himself unemployable. Sad.
    making......i think more accurately "made".

    Who is going to trust him with anything?
    The thing is, I don't think DC cares. Let's face it, he's rich enough that he doesn't actually need to work again, and the idea of being a new aristocrat, gentleman-scholar probably appeals to his worldview.

    But his fury with the system in general and Johnson in particular is something to behold. Bottom line is that he got played something rotten, didn't he?
    It demonstrates Boris's incredible knack of making people believe what he, Boris, wants them to believe about himself. Boris is the ultimate establishment figure, and he's never going to exile himself from that because of all the money and comfort it will ultimately bring him. But he clearly persuaded Don he was a fellow drain-the-swamp revolutionary. Dom fell for it hook, line and sinker.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Malmesbury said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kjh said:

    StuartDickson said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    ydoethur said:

    Foxy said:

    ydoethur said:

    OldKingCole said:

    IanB2 said:

    All sub 15C 0700 temps this week, after a long run of warm mornings up to 21C. Have we seen the best of the summer already?

    12.6C here. At least it's sunny, and I think the forecast is optimistic after the weekend.

    So possibly Good Morning is appropriate.

    And Ydoethur, two (so far) teachers in my family plan to continue to do so, although another has left the classroom to become an Ed Psych. Currently just finished, satisfactorily, the first year.
    So we have @Nigelb with 100% out, me with 67% out, and you with 33% out.

    We need somebody with 0% here to complete the set.

    Incidentally, I am seriously pissed off with Essex after yesterday. How on earth did you win from the position five overs out?
    Do other countries have such ferocious attrition of teachers? Or is it a British problem? Apart from the staffing issues it seems very wasteful.

    Or is it like the loss of Foundation Doctors a symptom of much deeper malaise within the system?
    Difficult to compare with other countries because teacher systems tend to be quite idiosyncratic. So for example in France it is expected a large number of graduates go into teaching, are assigned to a school, do it for 2-3 years and then do something else. But in the USA, where many state systems would be roughly comparable, around 8% a year leave teaching whereas a ‘natural’ rate would be about 3%. That’s a bit lower than ours but it’s not ridiculously different.

    https://www.epi.org/publication/u-s-schools-struggle-to-hire-and-retain-teachers-the-second-report-in-the-perfect-storm-in-the-teacher-labor-market-series/

    There are reasons for it. First of all, it’s bloody hard work, and not jus pt because of the nature of the beast. Teachers are the only profession I know where hard work is almost a fetish, so you will (true story) hear a primary school teacher boast that she takes her marking everywhere, even to her daughter’s swimming lessons. Such an attitude does bring pressure on the others and to those who don’t know how to find their own pace and stick to it, can be fatal.

    There is also far too much pointless meddling by non-experts in media and the government which makes it very difficult to do effectively. Spielman is the epitome of this with her comical ineptitude designed to generate click bait in the Mail, but it affects most of the DfE. Woodhead was of course another example. It’s rather demoralising to be told you’re useless and lazy by functionally illiterate lowlifes who work 37 hour weeks in cosy offices when working 60 hour weeks under tough conditions.

    And, of course, a lot go into teaching with high ideals and/or the expectation of short hours and long holidays and find the reality so different they just can’t take it. Woodhead, again, being an example, although he was forced out of teaching for other reasons.

    But I think ultimately teaching in the British way is just very hard to do. To encourage discussion, thought, creativity and do it among 30 people a significant minority of whom don’t want to be there and can actually be violent is very, very tough. To do it on average 4.6 times a day forty weeks a year is even harder.
    "Teachers are the only profession I know where hard work is almost a fetish" - try solicitors or accountants, both obsessed with chargeable hours and presenteeism.
    What confuses me is all the folk around here who claim to have high-powered jobs, but spend all day on an obscure blog. I think most of you are actually sitting in stained string vests, surrounded by pizza boxes and still living off the Bank of Mum and Dad.

    At least I have an excuse. I have ridiculously long holidays, an easy time at work and I am not the chief income earner (hurrah for feminism!!)

    Incidentally, “presenteeism” is the pest of our age: lots of people holding positions just for the sake of it but being horrifically poor at their actual jobs. Eg The Clown.
    Snap. I'm retired and spend a fraction of the time of others and still spend too much time here, as my wife tells me. There are several who tell us they have full time jobs who appear here full time. Confused.
    My favourite is the one who claims to be a high-powered lawyer, but spends every waking hour on this blog and is unaware that some of his posts break the SRA Code of Conduct for Solicitors, RELs and RFLs and the SRA Code of Conduct for Firms.

    His mum serves him bowls of Heinz tomato soup to keep his pecker up.
    What is interesting is the way that various organisations have engaged in a ruthless hunt for bloggers in their ranks and silenced them.

    Nightjack was an interesting case - but others have reported concerted attempts to shut them down. Often by rewriting Professional Standards to make any kind of reporting/blogging an offence....
    I can understand why the Law Society might be concerned with a member who publishes a blog post saying they want to find out who an opponent is and where they live, and they have friends who are capable of giving them a visit.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,008
    edited August 2021
    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    Unbelievable. But maybe it was always there. Maybe all of that small state libertarianism he used to major on was a front. Or maybe this stuff is insincere and just rolled out to stimulate the new crazy base. God knows.
    Feel sorry for decent conservatives. Who the heck do they vote for if they are small state, secular, live and let live types?
    They can vote for the US Libertarian party which even in 2020 got 1.8 million votes.

    In 2016 it did even better and its candidate Gary Johnson came third with 4 million votes and 3% of the popular vote.

    However Libertarianism is not really conservativism but a mixture of small state economics from the right and social liberalism from the left
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    occasionalranter said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    What about the Welsh, northern Irish and Scots ? You just dig the hole a little deeper every time you post on this.
    I apply the Duck Test to anything branded as “British”. Amazing how often it turns out to be nothing of the sort.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    theProle said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    Maybe we could level the playing field by calculating the numbers of medals/golds per entrant? That's surely a fairer metric.
    Or per capita, or as a function of GDP. Cos let’s be honest here, the top states are simply buying medals. It is an ugly, ugly business.
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,640
    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,008
    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    It is Team GB competing not England.

    The Commonwealth has also won more golds than the EU
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Fails Duck Test.

    Thank you for getting into the spirit HY! Good chap. 😃
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
    I’m not in Sweden and I’m not tired dad.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,955
    IanB2 said:

    Tomorrow’s announcement today:

    A number of key destinations as well as international travel hubs will be removed from the red list – India, Bahrain, Qatar and the UAE. India’s placement on the red list was the subject of substantial controversy after MPs accused Boris Johnson of delaying its inclusion in the spring as cases rapidly rose and the new Delta variant emerged.

    Mexico, Georgia, Réunion and Mayotte are to be added to the red list. More countries will also be added to the green list where travellers can go regardless of vaccine status. New green list countries are Austria, Germany, Slovenia, Slovakia, Latvia, Romania and Norway. All changes come into effect at 4am on Sunday 8 August in England.

    Government at least has had the atlas out and finally worked out the difference between Reunion and France.

    On the BBC they were busily rounding people up to abuse the UK Govt, in this case a French MEP and a talk-o-chap from the travel industry.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,481
    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    Unbelievable. But maybe it was always there. Maybe all of that small state libertarianism he used to major on was a front. Or maybe this stuff is insincere and just rolled out to stimulate the new crazy base. God knows.
    Feel sorry for decent conservatives. Who the heck do they vote for if they are small state, secular, live and let live types?
    They can vote for the US Libertarian party which even in 2020 got 1.8 million votes.

    In 2016 it did even better and its candidate Gary Johnson came third with 4 million votes and 3% of the popular vote.

    However Libertarianism is not really conservativism but a mixture of small state economics from the right and social liberalism from the left
    With the added disadvantage that many of their positions are on the shady side of sanity.
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,295
    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    Unbelievable. But maybe it was always there. Maybe all of that small state libertarianism he used to major on was a front. Or maybe this stuff is insincere and just rolled out to stimulate the new crazy base. God knows.
    Feel sorry for decent conservatives. Who the heck do they vote for if they are small state, secular, live and let live types?
    They can vote for the US Libertarian party which even in 2020 got 1.8 million votes.

    In 2016 it did even better and its candidate Gary Johnson came third with 4 million votes and 3% of the popular vote.

    However Libertarianism is not really conservativism but a mixture of small state economics from the right and social liberalism from the left
    With the added disadvantage that many of their positions are on the shady side of sanity.
    Compared with the position that Donald Trump is a suitable candidate for President, they would have to be pretty extreme to be worse.
  • londonpubmanlondonpubman Posts: 3,640
    StuartDickson said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
    I’m not in Sweden and I’m not tired dad.
    Time for you to have a rest.

    💤
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,295
    StuartDickson said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
    I’m not in Sweden and I’m not tired dad.
    I can believe that you are not in Sweden: I’ve been there enough times to know how expensive it is to get as drunk as your comments seem to show you are.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,481
    Fysics_Teacher said:

    dixiedean said:

    HYUFD said:

    dixiedean said:

    kinabalu said:

    Nigelb said:

    Newt Gingrich is the latest on Fox to go full great replacement theory: The left is bringing immigrants to the United States “to get rid of the rest of us”
    https://twitter.com/existentialfish/status/1422907573817290755

    The US right is falling back on the racist tropes of the 19thC.

    Unbelievable. But maybe it was always there. Maybe all of that small state libertarianism he used to major on was a front. Or maybe this stuff is insincere and just rolled out to stimulate the new crazy base. God knows.
    Feel sorry for decent conservatives. Who the heck do they vote for if they are small state, secular, live and let live types?
    They can vote for the US Libertarian party which even in 2020 got 1.8 million votes.

    In 2016 it did even better and its candidate Gary Johnson came third with 4 million votes and 3% of the popular vote.

    However Libertarianism is not really conservativism but a mixture of small state economics from the right and social liberalism from the left
    With the added disadvantage that many of their positions are on the shady side of sanity.
    Compared with the position that Donald Trump is a suitable candidate for President, they would have to be pretty extreme to be worse.
    Fair point well made.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    BREAKING: Texas reports more than 19,000 new coronavirus cases, biggest one-day increase since February 2

    Or according the twat from the BBC, Texas has 185 new cases....
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Fysics_Teacher said:

    StuartDickson said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
    I’m not in Sweden and I’m not tired dad.
    I can believe that you are not in Sweden: I’ve been there enough times to know how expensive it is to get as drunk as your comments seem to show you are.
    I’m stone cold sober. Play the ball not the man.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,731
    StuartDickson said:

    Fysics_Teacher said:

    StuartDickson said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
    I’m not in Sweden and I’m not tired dad.
    I can believe that you are not in Sweden: I’ve been there enough times to know how expensive it is to get as drunk as your comments seem to show you are.
    I’m stone cold sober. Play the ball not the man.
    So, what is your argument?

    Anyone competing under the banner "Team GB" must be English as no True Scot would do such a thing?
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,295
    StuartDickson said:

    Fysics_Teacher said:

    StuartDickson said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    kle4 said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    The joke bombed the last time you tried it as its too ridiculous to believe you are serious. 'Doesn't matter how you look at it', like, you mean, how there are separate teams and it is the teams that are counted together, that way of looking at it? The way every nation on earth looks at it?
    Funny how England won the gold medal at the 1908 Olympic hockey, Ireland the silver and Scotland/Wales joint bronze, but all four medals are somehow rebranded as “Team GB” (sic).

    Soviet cheating = bad
    East German cheating = bad
    English cheating = good

    So childish.
    It must be getting late in Sweden. Time for bed methinks? 👍
    I’m not in Sweden and I’m not tired dad.
    I can believe that you are not in Sweden: I’ve been there enough times to know how expensive it is to get as drunk as your comments seem to show you are.
    I’m stone cold sober. Play the ball not the man.
    How? I’ve no idea what you are tying to say or the point you think you are making, except possibly England = bad?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Police have arrested 11 people as they continue a hate crimes investigation into social media messages sent after the Euro 2020 final.

    The UK Football Policing Unit received 600 reports of racist comments sent to England's black players after the defeat and judged 207 to be criminal.

    Of these, 123 were posted by people overseas, while 34 came from the UK.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-58094408
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,295
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Police have arrested 11 people as they continue a hate crimes investigation into social media messages sent after the Euro 2020 final.

    The UK Football Policing Unit received 600 reports of racist comments sent to England's black players after the defeat and judged 207 to be criminal.

    Of these, 123 were posted by people overseas, while 34 came from the UK.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-58094408

    So 50 came from Ireland?
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,955
    edited August 2021
    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    This prompted me to look at my cost. My current fixed price dual fuel deal has been 18 months I think at £74 per month (British Gas Green Online). Looks like the new one will be £90-95 per month, and I want a long fix to dodge the incoming rises which are arriving soon. To be fair the rises are only going to be 10-12%, whilst wholesale prices are up by 120% for gas and 50% for electricity, so really 10-12% is quite modest and energy is very cheap (imo ridiculously cheap) anyway.

    Interestingly looking back, when I moved into the current house in 2013 dual fuel bills were £125 per month, and it is now also 10% bigger due to a conservatory. That 50%+ real terms cut per unit is half due to steady investment and perhaps half due to switching. My specific energy usage is now some way below 100 kWh per sqm per year (for a 200sqm house).

    1 - Agree that market tampering has been unhelpful recently.
    2 - Ofgem has been very clear that it is wholesale prices.
    3 - These days renewables are very cost competitive.

    I'm inclined to view it a little like vaccine refuseniks. We have known this is coming down the road for at least 20 years, and we all had the option to address it or not. That does not help with these thing being society-wide questions - we need a market balance which encourages significant investment by individuals.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,955
    MattW said:

    theProle said:

    Fpt

    rottenborough said:

    Big_G_NorthWales said:

    theProle said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    Wait, Steve Baker just called Brexit a political fiasco.

    Politicians need to level with the public about the scale of change needed in our lives so we don’t have another political fiasco like Brexit


    I think what he's saying is that Brexit happened as a powerful movement, against the wishes of the majority of politicians because the establishment had spent the last 30 years doing stuff people didn't like and blaming the EU, whilst a cosy concensus of the "mainstream" ensured we never got a vote on it (because if we did they knew they would lose).

    The green idocy is going the same way. People want their gas central heating and their economical diesel cars (even the No10 spokeswoman it seems). They'd quite like cheap electricity. But without their consent (there has never been an election with a credible party against this) the government has promised to take all this stuff away from them.

    If they carry on as they are, setting future targets which are going to be very painful for large chunks of the population, then when they bite claiming they are unchangeable and immutable like some sort of divine decree, net zero is going to become the new Brexit. We'll moan about it for a bit, a pressure group will force the government's hand, and as soon as the people get a real democratic say, the silent majority of the population will decide that enough is enough, and will tear the elite a new arsehole - just like happened with Brexit.
    As I mentioned earlier today my energy deal runs out this month and even the best 2 year fix I could find saw my daily unit rate for electricity and gas rise by 50%

    And this is just the start, as from October further rises are on the way

    I really do not think the politicians have even started to understand just how the unimaginable costs involved in their green agenda are going to be paid by the majority of taxpayers
    Don't think your rise is green related. There's a worldwide wholesale price issue for this winter.
    Its three things.

    1) The government discovered that the retail energy markets were working as intended - i.e. regular switchers got the best deals. They decided that this was unfair on those who couldn't be bothered to switch, and so introduced price caps which mean there are no-longer good deals around for diligent switchers.

    2)Global commodities prices are up for pretty much everything (I wonder how much this is relating to lots of countries having printed a load of cash for Covid).

    3)We've deliberately gone for expensive electricity from wind + massive amounts of conventional backup rather than cheap coal or gas baseload. Everyone is pretending that wind is competitive, but that's only because we've tilted the playing field until it is.

    Incidentally, an amusing story I heard recently - there is a moderate onshore windfarm near me, built on ground which was extensively shallow mined for lead and copper in the early Victorian era. In order to get the required ground stability for the towers, they poured a lot of concrete into holes in the ground. The site engineer did the maths - apparently the turbines should have nicely offset the co2 from the concrete foundations in around 400 years time...
    This prompted me to look at my cost. My current fixed price dual fuel deal has been 18 months I think at £74 per month (British Gas Green Online). Looks like the new one will be £90-95 per month, and I want a long fix to dodge the incoming rises which are arriving soon. To be fair the rises are only going to be 10-12%, whilst wholesale prices are up by 120% for gas and 50% for electricity, so really 10-12% is quite modest and energy is very cheap (imo ridiculously cheap) anyway.

    Interestingly looking back, when I moved into the current house in 2013 dual fuel bills were £125 per month, and it is now also 10% bigger due to a conservatory. That 50%+ real terms cut per unit is half due to steady investment and perhaps half due to switching. My specific energy usage is now some way below 100 kWh per sqm per year (for a 200sqm house).

    1 - Agree that market tampering has been unhelpful recently.
    2 - Ofgem has been very clear that it is wholesale prices.
    3 - These days renewables are very cost competitive.

    I'm inclined to view it a little like vaccine refuseniks. We have known this is coming down the road for at least 20 years, and we all had the option to address it or not. That does not help with these thing being society-wide questions - we need a market balance which encourages significant investment by individuals.
    One further point is that BG have overestimated by Elec usage by 100% (huge solar array), and my gas by 10%.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    Simon Gleave, head of sports analysis, Nielsen Gracenote says: "Great Britain have closed the gap with the Rio and London Olympics and now have 48 medals after 12 days of competition compared to 49 in 2016 and 48 in 2012.

    "However, at both of those Olympics, sailing, taekwondo and triathlon were still going on in the last four days of the Games so expect 2021 to fall behind again on total medals won."
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,971
    edited August 2021
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Police have arrested 11 people as they continue a hate crimes investigation into social media messages sent after the Euro 2020 final.

    The UK Football Policing Unit received 600 reports of racist comments sent to England's black players after the defeat and judged 207 to be criminal.

    Of these, 123 were posted by people overseas, while 34 came from the UK.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-58094408

    So we had a moral panic here in the UK over just 34 messages. Okay.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    edited August 2021
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Simon Gleave, head of sports analysis, Nielsen Gracenote says: "Great Britain have closed the gap with the Rio and London Olympics and now have 48 medals after 12 days of competition compared to 49 in 2016 and 48 in 2012.

    "However, at both of those Olympics, sailing, taekwondo and triathlon were still going on in the last four days of the Games so expect 2021 to fall behind again on total medals won."

    Again, I would draw attention to the high ratio of gold to silver medals for Japan and Australia. 

    Rank    Country         Gold    Silver  Bronze  Total
    1       China           32      22      16      70
    2       USA             25      31      23      79
    3       Japan           21       7      12      40
    4       Great Britain   15      18      15      48
    5       Australia       15       4      17      36
    6       ROC             14      21      18      53
    7       Germany          8       8      16      32
    8       France           6      10       9      25
    9       Italy            6       9      15      30
    10      Netherlands      6       8       9      23
    If this means they have less strength in depth than other countries, then so be it. But if it instead means that Japan and Australia are better at turning their contenders into champions, then if we could emulate that then we'd be in the top three countries for gold medals, and possibly the top two. Take Australia's gold and silver medals: they have 19, of which 15, or 80 per cent, are gold. Britain has 33, and 80 per cent would mean 26 gold medals (and 7 silver).

    Obviously life is not like that but it does suggest there might be more to play for.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    edited August 2021
    Not a bad heat in the women's 4x100m relay. A new British record, finishing in front of USA and Jamaica, and Dina Asher-Smith's leg held up.

    Jamaica's B-team, of course, and they did stop to make a cup of tea at the last changeover.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,971
    Can anyone explain how the world record for the women's 4x100 metres relay can be 40.82 secs when the world record for the women's 100 metres is 10.49 secs?
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,314
    I'm seeing many highly uniformed takes about SARSCoV2 variants, by comedians, politicians, scientists and whatnot. There are four 'variants of concern' (alpha-delta). They all emerged in mid-late 2020.

    Delta is currently the most concerning. It spread in India in the spring and has become dominant globally since. There have been no 'variants of concern' emerging in 2021 so far (lambda and delta+ are not it).

    Uniformed speculations about variant emergence may well attract retweets and likes, but this is not helpful at all. We've got enough on our hands without having to deal with uninformed nonsense.

    Spreading SARSCoV2 variant fear and despair threatens the mental helth of many and is likely to fuel vaccine hesitancy. Enough! Enough of this. Get a grip.

    https://twitter.com/BallouxFrancois/status/1423085061818265600
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    edited August 2021
    Tokyo's heat and humidity are causing problems for the women golfers (men played last week) and football matches might be postponed. The golf tournament might be shortened to 54 holes because storms are forecast for the weekend. This may be important for betting positions.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/58085748
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,971
    DecrepiterJohnL said:

    Andy_JS said:

    Can anyone explain how the world record for the women's 4x100 metres relay can be 40.82 secs when the world record for the women's 100 metres is 10.49 secs?

    Three running starts in the relay. 100 per cent standing start in the 100m.
    Thanks.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,139
    MattW said:

    IanB2 said:

    Tomorrow’s announcement today:

    A number of key destinations as well as international travel hubs will be removed from the red list – India, Bahrain, Qatar and the UAE. India’s placement on the red list was the subject of substantial controversy after MPs accused Boris Johnson of delaying its inclusion in the spring as cases rapidly rose and the new Delta variant emerged.

    Mexico, Georgia, Réunion and Mayotte are to be added to the red list. More countries will also be added to the green list where travellers can go regardless of vaccine status. New green list countries are Austria, Germany, Slovenia, Slovakia, Latvia, Romania and Norway. All changes come into effect at 4am on Sunday 8 August in England.

    Government at least has had the atlas out and finally worked out the difference between Reunion and France.

    On the BBC they were busily rounding people up to abuse the UK Govt, in this case a French MEP and a talk-o-chap from the travel industry.
    Interesting that we are adding Mexico to the red list while I waas just allowed to swam into the United States from there without being checked at all, while America won't allow people to come in straight from the UK.

    It's a strange world sometimes.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,139
    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    Please show us an EU country anywhere near us in the medal table

    😊😊😊
    They have better things to spend hundreds of millions or billions of public money on than chasing bits of coloured metal.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,046
    Fishing said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    Please show us an EU country anywhere near us in the medal table

    😊😊😊
    They have better things to spend hundreds of millions or billions of public money on than chasing bits of coloured metal.
    Those wine lakes or butter mountains aren’t going to build themselves.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,175
    Fishing said:

    londonpubman said:

    StuartDickson said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    felix said:

    Selebian said:

    Scott_xP said:

    UK recorded 29,312 coronavirus cases in last 24 hours.
    Here’s how we compare to other countries:

    🇬🇧 UK - 29,312

    🇫🇷 FRANCE - 1,996
    🇩🇪 GERMANY - 1,776
    🇪🇸 SPAIN - 4,954
    🇮🇹 ITALY - 3,185

    🇺🇸 USA - 15,081
    🇧🇷 BRAZIL - 20,503
    🇮🇳 INDIA - 30,549
    🇮🇩 INDONESIA - 33,900
    (Data: @who)
    https://twitter.com/mrmikecowan/status/1422939172902514688

    Leaving aside different points in cycle etc, on a 7 day basis, Spain and France are very comparable to UK according to OWID. OWID also suggests Spain and France reporting is massively variable on a single day basis.

    It's a nonsense stat anyway, to make any kind of point about how well countries are doing. But taking a single day (with likely different reporting lags between countries) speaks of dubious motivation.
    Scott'n paste orgasms whenever he senses gloom and doom for the UK v EU. Notice how he's avoiding the Olympic Medal table.
    Didn't someone post on this before and note that the EU are way ahead of us on medals? :wink:
    It was the idiot Dickson who pretended it was one country with no limits on the number of competitor entries. BDS is a serious illness and apparently there is no vaccine or cure.
    Swings and roundabouts. Yes, the EU gets more competitors per event (which in most cases makes zero difference to podium places), but on the other hand the EU misses out on loads of relay and team podium placing.

    It doesn’t matter how you look at it, the English are getting utterly thrashed by the EU at this Olympics.
    Please show us an EU country anywhere near us in the medal table

    😊😊😊
    They have better things to spend hundreds of millions or billions of public money on than chasing bits of coloured metal.
    Great argument - if you like fake news.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,533
    edited August 2021
    Pret, McColls and Welcome Break in minimum wage fail

    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58083889

    Some of the example companies "named and shamed" are on the face of it extremely unfair. John Lewis, one case, 4 years ago. That is clearly a mistake, and probably some weird edge case, where their accounting software bugged out. A huge organisation making a single balls up 4 years ago isn't exactly trying to pull a fast one on workers.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 72,303
    Billion dollar arsonist in the US navy…

    USS Bonhomme Richard fire: Suspect identified as 20-year-old Navy sailor
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-58091854
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    Mens 4x100m relay -- GB through after running second behind Jamaica but USA did not qualify (only sixth in their heat).
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,462
    FrancisUrquhart said:

    Pret, McColls and Welcome Break in minimum wage fail

    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58083889

    Some of the example companies "named and shamed" are on the face of it extremely unfair. John Lewis, one case, 4 years ago. That is clearly a mistake, and probably some weird edge case, where their accounting software bugged out. A huge organisation making a single balls up 4 years ago isn't exactly trying to pull a fast one on workers.

    The report covers 2011 to 2018 which makes it hardly timely but cock-ups don't help when you are at the supermarket till and it is employers' responsibility to get it right. From your link:-

    The government acknowledged that many of the breaches were not intentional, but said the minimum wage laws were meant to ensure that a fair day's work received a fair day's pay.
    https://www.bbc.com/news/business-58083889
This discussion has been closed.