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Both the coming by-elections present problems for LAB – politicalbetting.com

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  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,139
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Still more. On and on it comes. Tucker Carlson on Fox

    The US Navy - nuclear submariners - has encountered unidentified craft travelling at "hundreds of knots" underwater


    The fastest submarine does about 40 knots


    https://twitter.com/PelagiusRobert/status/1394205145597087746?s=20

    Tucker Carlson? Fox??

    The channel that tells the audience every day that Trump won a landslide. That channel?
    Indeed. Which is relevant.

    You now have liberal US media - the NYT, CNN, 60 minutes - and Trumpite US media - Fox, NYPost - eagerly buying into the same narrative: there is something Out There. Plus Obama? Rubio. The CIA

    What's more it seems carefully stage managed. The Navy video was leaked, within hours it was confirmed by the Pentagon, a few hours later Fox is up and running with a coherent (if surreal) take

    Something is definitely happening, it's just quite hard to work out cui bono and WTAF
    I wish these aliens would visit us in north London. Lovely part of the world. Yet they never show up!

    P.S. UFO special report on NewsNight (straight up - there is!)
  • Options
    AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    I didn't realise how deep in the shit Bill Gates was. He is deep in the shit.
  • Options
    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    edited May 2021
    TOPPING said:

    Helen Miller
    @MsHelicat
    ·
    4m
    Wednesday's i: PM faces backlash over local lockdowns #TomorrowsPapersToday



    Here we go again. Tiers and local lockdowns. Be interesting to see the scale of Tory rebellion.

    Local lockdowns don't work, everybody just goes to the surrounding towns.
    I wondered about that. Will people in Glasgow just pop over to wherever is not Glasgow.
    If the Government are going to start going down lockdown routes again, local or otherwise, they've got to show a damn site more evidence than rising case numbers and a small increase of people turning up in hospital. Especially as these things were assumed by the scientists within the "routemap", but the vaccines were meant to mean that in general the line would hold. At the last count Bolton had 18 people in hospital with Covid. At the peak(s) they had about 150. Wouldn't be surprised if their case numbers come down as rapidly as they've risen.
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489
    Alistair said:


    David Paton
    @cricketwyvern
    Replying to
    @cricketwyvern
    Daily admissions (as opposed to the 7-day average) drop to 59, lowest since 1st Sept.
    Deaths averaging the lowest since 7th Sept and both still falling.

    But forget about that, let's continue the full-on scare campaign to persuade the Govt to delay lifting of restrictions.

    I take it every thing was fine after the first of September last year?
    This is the thing. Raw numbers are not that relevant for the long term, it's direction of travel. In September, we saw cases etc rising again and local restrictions by the end of the month. This time, nothing we do seems to increase numbers so far, in any significant way. Particularly we can't increase hospitalisations and deaths. And we know why: vaccination. I'm still happy to wait until 21 June - we have an unlocking road map with (just) long enough between each step to make sure that we're still good. But I'm really pretty convinced that we will be. I'd also be pretty relaxed if we did 21 June now, to be fair. There's enough evidence now on vaccines to be pretty sure we'd be fine.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,002

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Good Lord



    EXCL: Keir Starmer is in talks with a production company about a fly on the wall documentary tracking his leadership

    Some aides see it as a way of getting a broader section of the public to engage with him

    https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/1394564641850896386?s=21

    Can't go any worse than the Jezza one, where the guy following him started off as a self confessed fan and they ended up banning him because he asked one toughish question and Jezza had a meltdown.
    Keir ‘Interesting’ Starmer
    Anyway he is already done a fly on the wall documentary series when he managed Whitbury-Newtown Leisure Centre.
    It can’t be allowed to happen. Can’t his wife talk some sense into him?

    I’d vote Labour if he promised not to make this show
  • Options
    alex_alex_ Posts: 7,518
    Selebian said:

    Alistair said:


    David Paton
    @cricketwyvern
    Replying to
    @cricketwyvern
    Daily admissions (as opposed to the 7-day average) drop to 59, lowest since 1st Sept.
    Deaths averaging the lowest since 7th Sept and both still falling.

    But forget about that, let's continue the full-on scare campaign to persuade the Govt to delay lifting of restrictions.

    I take it every thing was fine after the first of September last year?
    This is the thing. Raw numbers are not that relevant for the long term, it's direction of travel. In September, we saw cases etc rising again and local restrictions by the end of the month. This time, nothing we do seems to increase numbers so far, in any significant way. Particularly we can't increase hospitalisations and deaths. And we know why: vaccination. I'm still happy to wait until 21 June - we have an unlocking road map with (just) long enough between each step to make sure that we're still good. But I'm really pretty convinced that we will be. I'd also be pretty relaxed if we did 21 June now, to be fair. There's enough evidence now on vaccines to be pretty sure we'd be fine.
    As discussed previously there also seems to be an inbuilt assumption that the current variant of interest is particularly dangerous. Just because it apparently is more transmissible. Transmissibility and dangerousness are not actually the same thing. What evidence is there even that the latest variant (as opposed to another one, perhaps UK variant transported by UK citizens - the traffic is not all one way) is responsible for all the deaths in India?
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Good Lord



    EXCL: Keir Starmer is in talks with a production company about a fly on the wall documentary tracking his leadership

    Some aides see it as a way of getting a broader section of the public to engage with him

    https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/1394564641850896386?s=21

    Can't go any worse than the Jezza one, where the guy following him started off as a self confessed fan and they ended up banning him because he asked one toughish question and Jezza had a meltdown.
    Keir ‘Interesting’ Starmer
    Anyway he is already done a fly on the wall documentary series when he managed Whitbury-Newtown Leisure Centre.
    Fly on the wall documentary re: Keir Starmer COULD be quite riveting. IF they can find the right fly.
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,292
    Alistair said:

    I didn't realise how deep in the shit Bill Gates was. He is deep in the shit.

    He is a lot more interesting than I ever realised....
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658
    Alistair said:

    I didn't realise how deep in the shit Bill Gates was. He is deep in the shit.

    Don't feel too bad for Bill Gates. Even after Melinda takes him to the cleaners, in WA State divorce court (no pre-nup & a community-property state) he'll still have a LOT of moolah.

    Plenty to maybe even buy his own island! And invite Bill Clinton and Prince Andy for "conferences" on world "affairs" and etc, etc.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,424
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,489
    From previous thread, on pollution from driving versus walking, I've looked it up and it is a nonsense comparison - doing a full life cycle analysis (and taking pessimistic assumptions*) on greenhouse gas from food calorie production against only the CO2 emissions from burning fuel in a car for the equivalent distance.

    I recall the PhD student being fairly convincing on this, but I probably should have pushed harder (still, it was only a mock more or less a throwaway line/reference in the introduction).

    So, keep walking, folks :smile:

    *damn scientists, tweaking the assumptions to get the answer they want!
  • Options
    lloydylloydy Posts: 36

    This evening's Covanecdote: One of my colleagues got phoned by his GP surgery to come in for his second jab early. Just over the 8 week mark.

    I'm still waiting for Bozo to get in touch. Tomorrow is 8 weeks and 2 days.

    10 week anniversary for me tomorrow.
    I'm having my AZ jab on Saturday. It was supposed to be the 27th, but they brought it forward. Presumably they are getting all the AZs out of the way to Pfizer the youngsters.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658
    Selebian said:

    From previous thread, on pollution from driving versus walking, I've looked it up and it is a nonsense comparison - doing a full life cycle analysis (and taking pessimistic assumptions*) on greenhouse gas from food calorie production against only the CO2 emissions from burning fuel in a car for the equivalent distance.

    I recall the PhD student being fairly convincing on this, but I probably should have pushed harder (still, it was only a mock more or less a throwaway line/reference in the introduction).

    So, keep walking, folks :smile:

    *damn scientists, tweaking the assumptions to get the answer they want!

    FYI, returned about half a hour ago from WALKING to the store for some groceries. Like I've done every few days for a LONG time, before & during the pandemic.

    SO how many other PBers do the same, on a regular basis?

    BTW number of times I've ordered a food delivery from Amazon, Whole Foods, local grocery or anywhere else this millennium = zero.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Not that I know but is there any implication/relevance for film speed?
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,167
    Personally I think Batley will be a narrow Labour hold and Chesham and Amersham a narrow Tory hold, of course the more the Labour vote falls in the latter, the better for the LDs.

    Incidentally a university contemporary of mine will be the ReformUK candidate in Chesham and Amersham
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Not that I know but is there any implication/relevance for film speed?
    These objects also do not trigger sonic booms and have no visible propulsion units or heat plumes - whatever they are they seem to have a new propulsion system
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195

    isam said:

    isam said:

    Good Lord



    EXCL: Keir Starmer is in talks with a production company about a fly on the wall documentary tracking his leadership

    Some aides see it as a way of getting a broader section of the public to engage with him

    https://twitter.com/hzeffman/status/1394564641850896386?s=21

    Can't go any worse than the Jezza one, where the guy following him started off as a self confessed fan and they ended up banning him because he asked one toughish question and Jezza had a meltdown.
    Keir ‘Interesting’ Starmer
    Anyway he is already done a fly on the wall documentary series when he managed Whitbury-Newtown Leisure Centre.
    Fly on the wall documentary re: Keir Starmer COULD be quite riveting. IF they can find the right fly.
    And assuming it does not drop dead of boredom
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Floater said:

    TOPPING said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Not that I know but is there any implication/relevance for film speed?
    These objects also do not trigger sonic booms and have no visible propulsion units or heat plumes - whatever they are they seem to have a new propulsion system
    It looked fake or a drone to me outside chance a cruise missile however that flies - it's 100% not something extra terrestrial but it's great to be talking about UFOs on this mid May evening.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015

    Selebian said:

    From previous thread, on pollution from driving versus walking, I've looked it up and it is a nonsense comparison - doing a full life cycle analysis (and taking pessimistic assumptions*) on greenhouse gas from food calorie production against only the CO2 emissions from burning fuel in a car for the equivalent distance.

    I recall the PhD student being fairly convincing on this, but I probably should have pushed harder (still, it was only a mock more or less a throwaway line/reference in the introduction).

    So, keep walking, folks :smile:

    *damn scientists, tweaking the assumptions to get the answer they want!

    FYI, returned about half a hour ago from WALKING to the store for some groceries. Like I've done every few days for a LONG time, before & during the pandemic.

    SO how many other PBers do the same, on a regular basis?

    BTW number of times I've ordered a food delivery from Amazon, Whole Foods, local grocery or anywhere else this millennium = zero.
    I do.
    It's a 3 mile round trip to the nearest shop for me. Every other day at least.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    HYUFD said:

    Personally I think Batley will be a narrow Labour hold and Chesham and Amersham a narrow Tory hold, of course the more the Labour vote falls in the latter, the better for the LDs.

    Incidentally a university contemporary of mine will be the ReformUK candidate in Chesham and Amersham

    Jeez there you go bringing us all back to earth with your by election chat have you no romance in you, man?
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015
    HYUFD said:

    Personally I think Batley will be a narrow Labour hold and Chesham and Amersham a narrow Tory hold, of course the more the Labour vote falls in the latter, the better for the LDs.

    Incidentally a university contemporary of mine will be the ReformUK candidate in Chesham and Amersham

    Everyone needs a right wing mate.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,048

    Selebian said:

    From previous thread, on pollution from driving versus walking, I've looked it up and it is a nonsense comparison - doing a full life cycle analysis (and taking pessimistic assumptions*) on greenhouse gas from food calorie production against only the CO2 emissions from burning fuel in a car for the equivalent distance.

    I recall the PhD student being fairly convincing on this, but I probably should have pushed harder (still, it was only a mock more or less a throwaway line/reference in the introduction).

    So, keep walking, folks :smile:

    *damn scientists, tweaking the assumptions to get the answer they want!

    FYI, returned about half a hour ago from WALKING to the store for some groceries. Like I've done every few days for a LONG time, before & during the pandemic.

    SO how many other PBers do the same, on a regular basis?

    Rarely - even a small amount in the rucksack has me sweating like a pig. Home delivery's been a godsend.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002

    Helen Miller
    @MsHelicat
    ·
    4m
    Wednesday's i: PM faces backlash over local lockdowns #TomorrowsPapersToday



    Here we go again. Tiers and local lockdowns. Be interesting to see the scale of Tory rebellion.

    I don't see it happening - there's too many people who have been vaccinated.
    Maybe they'll just lock down the areas with shitty take-up.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015
    edited May 2021
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,146
    Alistair said:

    I'm old enough to remeber the mid-nineties and the surge of UFO reporting that happened then.

    If the UFOs are real, they'll send us a sign by making crop circles.
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,631
    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    Could have some kind of energy based shield which reduces the mass of objects inside the bubble. The Alcubierre warp drive would need something like that to work.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403

    Alistair said:

    I'm old enough to remeber the mid-nineties and the surge of UFO reporting that happened then.

    If the UFOs are real, they'll send us a sign by making crop circles.
    Has Steven Spielberg been cancelled yet because we might be needing him soon.
  • Options
    another_richardanother_richard Posts: 25,139
    Pulpstar said:

    Helen Miller
    @MsHelicat
    ·
    4m
    Wednesday's i: PM faces backlash over local lockdowns #TomorrowsPapersToday



    Here we go again. Tiers and local lockdowns. Be interesting to see the scale of Tory rebellion.

    I don't see it happening - there's too many people who have been vaccinated.
    Maybe they'll just lock down the areas with shitty take-up.
    Given the demographics of those areas ?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    edited May 2021
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
    Five years. Filmed in 2016, released in 2019
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
    Five years. They only released it in 2019
    WHY NOW?

    They* have you at their mercy.

    *Aliens/pranksters/USAF
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
    Five years. They only released it in 2019
    WHY NOW?

    They* have you at their mercy.

    *Aliens/pranksters/USAF
    Ah, you have taken to wine
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,002
    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
    Five years. They only released it in 2019
    WHY NOW?

    They* have you at their mercy.

    *Aliens/pranksters/USAF
    Ah, you have taken to wine
    Sober all weekdays for months now. Although tomorrow I have what will be a boozy lunch. Cos I can.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
    Five years. They only released it in 2019
    WHY NOW?

    They* have you at their mercy.

    *Aliens/pranksters/USAF
    Ah, you have taken to wine
    Sober all weekdays for months now. Although tomorrow I have what will be a boozy lunch. Cos I can.
    Just to clarify, Friday is obviously not a weekday.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,403
    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    But it was indeed ununwatchable in the 80s.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658
    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    Could have some kind of energy based shield which reduces the mass of objects inside the bubble. The Alcubierre warp drive would need something like that to work.
    "Objects in the rear-view mirror may be larger, closer AND faster than they appear."
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015
    edited May 2021
    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    Jimmy White still going professionally. Him and Tony Meo used to get their hair cut at the barbers at the end of my street. Was crazy. Paparazzi worthy in 1988.
    And cheers for the reminder about that show. Will catch up
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658
    Strange things are seen in the desert gleam
    By the men who cruise the sky
    And the Utah contrails can tell queer tales
    As the US Air Force jets roar by . . .

    (Apologies to the spirit of Robert W. Service)
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015
    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    Yep. Almost all the best players under 25 are Chinese. Given that they peak at around 35, in 10 years time it will be all China.
    And there seem to be 3 or 4 new 16 year olds every single year, who are pretty damn decent.
  • Options
    Time_to_LeaveTime_to_Leave Posts: 2,547

    Alistair said:

    I'm old enough to remeber the mid-nineties and the surge of UFO reporting that happened then.

    If the UFOs are real, they'll send us a sign by making crop circles.
    You free tomorrow night? I have some spare planks of wood and some rope.
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,139
    TOPPING said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    All highly logical, and yet, Obama

    Former Pres Obama comes on TV, yesterday (the timing!), and contradicts his earlier testimony and says Yes, we cannot explain these, they are genuinely mysterious and exhibiting confounding technology

    (he obvs wasn't talking directly about Beaver, Utah, but the UAP behaviour in that video exactly matches eye witness reports from the US navy etc)

    Why on earth would ultra-rationalist Obama do this, unless he has very good reason?

    Whatever the answer, something Truly Weird is happening
    The Utah footage is 2yrs old. People were just a bit more rational and clear headed then.
    Five years. They only released it in 2019
    WHY NOW?

    They* have you at their mercy.

    *Aliens/pranksters/USAF
    Ah, you have taken to wine
    Sober all weekdays for months now. Although tomorrow I have what will be a boozy lunch. Cos I can.
    Just to clarify, Friday is obviously not a weekday.
    I would sincerely hope that no-one would suggest it was. Especially on a genteel site like PB.

    I mean, Thursday is borderline.
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,139
    dixiedean said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    Jimmy White still going professionally. Him and Tony Meo used to get their hair cut at the barbers at the end of my street. Was crazy. Paparazzi worthy in 1988.
    And cheers for the reminder about that show. Will catch up
    Yeah, good shout. I fancy watching it now, but will save for later in the week.
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658
    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    Yep. Almost all the best players under 25 are Chinese. Given that they peak at around 35, in 10 years time it will be all China.
    And there seem to be 3 or 4 new 16 year olds every single year, who are pretty damn decent.
    Shouldn't this be a Golden Age for British snooker coaches? And retailers of snooker-wear, snooker-shoes, snooker-cues?

    OR are the great-grandsons & daughters of the Bulldog Breed asleep at the wheel?
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    Could have some kind of energy based shield which reduces the mass of objects inside the bubble. The Alcubierre warp drive would need something like that to work.
    Well: either you are letting the mass of air pass through the flying vehicle (which is possible, I suppose) or you are diverting the air around you.

    I guess my point is that a space craft that somehow flies like a normal aerial vehicle, banking to turn, is clearly interacting with the atmosphere around it... in which case, the air around it needs to move.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,002
    dixiedean said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    Jimmy White still going professionally. Him and Tony Meo used to get their hair cut at the barbers at the end of my street. Was crazy. Paparazzi worthy in 1988.
    And cheers for the reminder about that show. Will catch up
    Old Meo, as we all know...

    Jimmy’s hair now is a bit rough!

    Great show. Higgins was a train wreck, quite sad to see. Reminds me of one of my mates when he was drinking
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    Yep. Almost all the best players under 25 are Chinese. Given that they peak at around 35, in 10 years time it will be all China.
    And there seem to be 3 or 4 new 16 year olds every single year, who are pretty damn decent.
    Shouldn't this be a Golden Age for British snooker coaches? And retailers of snooker-wear, snooker-shoes, snooker-cues?

    OR are the great-grandsons & daughters of the Bulldog Breed asleep at the wheel?
    The best cue makers? Airdrie and Shotts.
    Shoes? You need a pair of Batley and Spens.
    And for a natty waistcoat you can't go wrong with a Chesham and Amersham.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    rcs1000 said:

    MaxPB said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    Could have some kind of energy based shield which reduces the mass of objects inside the bubble. The Alcubierre warp drive would need something like that to work.
    Well: either you are letting the mass of air pass through the flying vehicle (which is possible, I suppose) or you are diverting the air around you.

    I guess my point is that a space craft that somehow flies like a normal aerial vehicle, banking to turn, is clearly interacting with the atmosphere around it... in which case, the air around it needs to move.
    A fair point. However we really might be the Stone Age Amazon jungle tribe staring up at a helicopter. How do they even begin to compute what they are seeing? Is it a bird, a demon, a floating tree, or a dream? Why would it come here?

    As a tribe they are brilliantly adapted to surviving in the rainforest, they have forensic skill at identifying poisonous fungi. Their ability to understand a helicopter, let alone explain what it’s doing, is zero

    We might be them: the anemones in the rock pool, with some vague uneasy sense of being watched
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 41,002
    I so wanted Jimmy White to win the 1990 World Championship. I’m watching him lose to Hendry now still hoping he might pull it off!
  • Options
    TheValiantTheValiant Posts: 1,718
    Question for the PB Brains Trusts this late night.

    Every week I keep seeing the discussion drift off into aliens. By some reasonably respected posters too.

    Why can I only find this stuff here? Is there any news items anywhere else? I haven't looked hard but I just can't obviously see what is going on.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015
    isam said:

    I so wanted Jimmy White to win the 1990 World Championship. I’m watching him lose to Hendry now still hoping he might pull it off!

    He even managed to lose to him in the first qualifying round this very year.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015
    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    Because magic.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    I note that you have gone from confidently (and ludicrously) proclaiming that ‘this is just USAF drone 3X-FD5 flying at supersonic speed’ to wondering if this IS aliens, ‘but how have they broken all the laws of physics’?

    In about 2 hours.

    By Friday you will be entreating us to use pyramids to sharpen our razors
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    I note that you have gone from confidently (and ludicrously) proclaiming that ‘this is just USAF drone 3X-FD5 flying at supersonic speed’ to wondering if this IS aliens, ‘but how have they broken all the laws of physics’?

    In about 2 hours.

    By Friday you will be entreating us to use pyramids to sharpen our razors
    This video is almost certainly a fake.

    There may well be other videos that have unexplainable stuff on them. But the simplest explanation for this video is that it's a fake.

    Also, all the shit about them not wanting to release it, etc., that smacks of how mediums operate, and get's my suspicion meter right up.
  • Options
    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 3,902
    WRT the Utah 'footage' it definitely feels well within the realms of a semi-competent VFX artist to make in a day or two.
  • Options
    dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 28,015

    By some reasonably respected posters too.

    Don't forget @Leon ;).
    It is making news in the States. Not here. One of the curiosities that makes it intriguing.

  • Options
    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 3,902
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    I note that you have gone from confidently (and ludicrously) proclaiming that ‘this is just USAF drone 3X-FD5 flying at supersonic speed’ to wondering if this IS aliens, ‘but how have they broken all the laws of physics’?

    In about 2 hours.

    By Friday you will be entreating us to use pyramids to sharpen our razors
    This video is almost certainly a fake.

    There may well be other videos that have unexplainable stuff on them. But the simplest explanation for this video is that it's a fake.

    Also, all the shit about them not wanting to release it, etc., that smacks of how mediums operate, and get's my suspicion meter right up.
    Yep, in terms of 'evidence' the Utah video can be filed with 99.9% certainty in the hoax file.
  • Options
    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    Maybe Starmer could do a photoshoot in his undies.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    I note that you have gone from confidently (and ludicrously) proclaiming that ‘this is just USAF drone 3X-FD5 flying at supersonic speed’ to wondering if this IS aliens, ‘but how have they broken all the laws of physics’?

    In about 2 hours.

    By Friday you will be entreating us to use pyramids to sharpen our razors
    This video is almost certainly a fake.

    There may well be other videos that have unexplainable stuff on them. But the simplest explanation for this video is that it's a fake.

    Also, all the shit about them not wanting to release it, etc., that smacks of how mediums operate, and get's my suspicion meter right up.
    Yes, that’s fair.

    Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, etc etc

    What makes me hesitate is this:

    1. The plausibility of their reportage. They genuinely feel real. Are they just great actors? Really? How have they benefited, financially?

    2. The multiple (and worldwide) videos of similar phenomena. How and why? Is this a global conspiracy or a universal glitch in drone cameras? Hmm

    3. The fact this is all entirely consonant with the US AF and navy reports (extreme speed and manoeuvres)

    4. Obama. Wtf. Why would he choose last night, of all nights, to reverse his earlier statements and say Yes, UAP are real

    How do you explain all that?
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,266

    Alistair said:

    I'm old enough to remeber the mid-nineties and the surge of UFO reporting that happened then.

    If the UFOs are real, they'll send us a sign by making crop circles.
    You free tomorrow night? I have some spare planks of wood and some rope.
    Build those gallows high
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    I note that you have gone from confidently (and ludicrously) proclaiming that ‘this is just USAF drone 3X-FD5 flying at supersonic speed’ to wondering if this IS aliens, ‘but how have they broken all the laws of physics’?

    In about 2 hours.

    By Friday you will be entreating us to use pyramids to sharpen our razors
    This video is almost certainly a fake.

    There may well be other videos that have unexplainable stuff on them. But the simplest explanation for this video is that it's a fake.

    Also, all the shit about them not wanting to release it, etc., that smacks of how mediums operate, and get's my suspicion meter right up.
    Yes, that’s fair.

    Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, etc etc

    What makes me hesitate is this:

    1. The plausibility of their reportage. They genuinely feel real. Are they just great actors? Really? How have they benefited, financially?

    2. The multiple (and worldwide) videos of similar phenomena. How and why? Is this a global conspiracy or a universal glitch in drone cameras? Hmm

    3. The fact this is all entirely consonant with the US AF and navy reports (extreme speed and manoeuvres)

    4. Obama. Wtf. Why would he choose last night, of all nights, to reverse his earlier statements and say Yes, UAP are real

    How do you explain all that?
    I'm not denying the possibility (or even the probability) of UAP.

    But things that happen near to the ground need to be treated more sceptically, because one has to make many more assumptions. One isn't just assuming interstellar travel, and incredible propulsion systems, and the like, one also has to accept that it doesn't interact with the matter around it. (And if so, one has to ask why it bothers flying above the mountain, or having the light bounce off it...)

    And that's a much harder ask. It's a massive difference in what you have to assume.
  • Options
    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,369
    kle4 said:

    Selebian said:

    From previous thread, on pollution from driving versus walking, I've looked it up and it is a nonsense comparison - doing a full life cycle analysis (and taking pessimistic assumptions*) on greenhouse gas from food calorie production against only the CO2 emissions from burning fuel in a car for the equivalent distance.

    I recall the PhD student being fairly convincing on this, but I probably should have pushed harder (still, it was only a mock more or less a throwaway line/reference in the introduction).

    So, keep walking, folks :smile:

    *damn scientists, tweaking the assumptions to get the answer they want!

    FYI, returned about half a hour ago from WALKING to the store for some groceries. Like I've done every few days for a LONG time, before & during the pandemic.

    SO how many other PBers do the same, on a regular basis?

    Rarely - even a small amount in the rucksack has me sweating like a pig. Home delivery's been a godsend.
    Not me. The former council's ridiculously strict planning policy means that all the homes are in areas unpolluted by, um, shops, and all the shops are nearly half an hour's walk away, partly up a steep hill. Life is too short. Home delivery yay!

    When I lived in Nottingham, the housing was a few minutes from a huge supermarket, and of course I'd walk to it. I genuinely don't understand why any council wouldn't plan for that - healthier, cheaper, fewer carbon emissions - what's not to like?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    I note that you have gone from confidently (and ludicrously) proclaiming that ‘this is just USAF drone 3X-FD5 flying at supersonic speed’ to wondering if this IS aliens, ‘but how have they broken all the laws of physics’?

    In about 2 hours.

    By Friday you will be entreating us to use pyramids to sharpen our razors
    This video is almost certainly a fake.

    There may well be other videos that have unexplainable stuff on them. But the simplest explanation for this video is that it's a fake.

    Also, all the shit about them not wanting to release it, etc., that smacks of how mediums operate, and get's my suspicion meter right up.
    Yes, that’s fair.

    Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, etc etc

    What makes me hesitate is this:

    1. The plausibility of their reportage. They genuinely feel real. Are they just great actors? Really? How have they benefited, financially?

    2. The multiple (and worldwide) videos of similar phenomena. How and why? Is this a global conspiracy or a universal glitch in drone cameras? Hmm

    3. The fact this is all entirely consonant with the US AF and navy reports (extreme speed and manoeuvres)

    4. Obama. Wtf. Why would he choose last night, of all nights, to reverse his earlier statements and say Yes, UAP are real

    How do you explain all that?
    I'm not denying the possibility (or even the probability) of UAP.

    But things that happen near to the ground need to be treated more sceptically, because one has to make many more assumptions. One isn't just assuming interstellar travel, and incredible propulsion systems, and the like, one also has to accept that it doesn't interact with the matter around it. (And if so, one has to ask why it bothers flying above the mountain, or having the light bounce off it...)

    And that's a much harder ask. It's a massive difference in what you have to assume.
    I’m going to go with the obvious and easiest answer. Despite much incredulity, US military and intelligence have now encountered enough UAP, with enough baffling technology, that they feel it’s best to be honest (rather than feed a population already high on Q-Anon etc)

    So much drone footage is emerging that constant debunking does not work, and is possibly counter-productive

    However they genuinely have no idea what it is. China? Aliens? God? They haven’t a clue and they’re being honest (and what held back many before, in reporting this, was fear of mockery)

    That’s the best I can do
  • Options
    AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 20,139
    Ufobetting.com

    Aliens in our midst by 2022?

    Shadsy?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    What if advanced intelligent life is very rare in our galaxy?

    Maybe most life is just microbes. We are an exception - but not unique

    At that point we would be exceptionally interesting to another extra-terrestrial civilisation, with advanced technology, seeking to understand its own evolution
  • Options
    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,809
    Leon said:

    What if advanced intelligent life is very rare in our galaxy?

    Maybe most life is just microbes. We are an exception - but not unique

    At that point we would be exceptionally interesting to another extra-terrestrial civilisation, with advanced technology, seeking to understand its own evolution

    “Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.”
  • Options
    ChameleonChameleon Posts: 3,902

    Ufobetting.com

    Aliens in our midst by 2022?

    Shadsy?

    I hope so, worst case they kill me, best case there's a universe out there waiting to be explored. The negatives of the former are vastly outweighed by the possibilities of the latter.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    Leon said:

    What if advanced intelligent life is very rare in our galaxy?

    Maybe most life is just microbes. We are an exception - but not unique

    At that point we would be exceptionally interesting to another extra-terrestrial civilisation, with advanced technology, seeking to understand its own evolution

    And maybe they seeded Covid, just to see how we'd react to it...
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    CatMan said:

    Leon said:

    What if advanced intelligent life is very rare in our galaxy?

    Maybe most life is just microbes. We are an exception - but not unique

    At that point we would be exceptionally interesting to another extra-terrestrial civilisation, with advanced technology, seeking to understand its own evolution

    “Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.”
    Perhaps we are the Lolita of species, and of planets. On the cusp of self awareness. Poised between innocence and knowing. We are therefore superbly attractive, as Obama said on tv, to ‘Pedophile Humbert Humbert planets’, grooming the galaxy for suitable prey

    Ok I’m going to bed. Night
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,447
    Leon said:

    CatMan said:

    Leon said:

    What if advanced intelligent life is very rare in our galaxy?

    Maybe most life is just microbes. We are an exception - but not unique

    At that point we would be exceptionally interesting to another extra-terrestrial civilisation, with advanced technology, seeking to understand its own evolution

    “Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.”
    Perhaps we are the Lolita of species, and of planets. On the cusp of self awareness. Poised between innocence and knowing. We are therefore superbly attractive, as Obama said on tv, to ‘Pedophile Humbert Humbert planets’, grooming the galaxy for suitable prey

    Ok I’m going to bed. Night
    "When they took @Leon up in the spaceship, the aliens abused him. Sexually."
  • Options
    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    What if advanced intelligent life is very rare in our galaxy?

    Maybe most life is just microbes. We are an exception - but not unique

    At that point we would be exceptionally interesting to another extra-terrestrial civilisation, with advanced technology, seeking to understand its own evolution

    And maybe they seeded Covid, just to see how we'd react to it...
    Nah, they fixed the 2016 election, just to see how the world would react.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,032
    TOPPING said:


    Edit: just seen one of them. It's going 100mph at best. @Dura_Ace goes faster than that on his way to buy milk and fags from Tesco.

    Don't smoke or consume bovine mucus but I do hit 100mph every single time I drive a car.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,535
    edited May 2021
    The Washington Post. We are, likely, not alone



    ‘The socialization of the UAP reality begins.....

    Alien life looks more and more likely. Catholics are ready.’

    https://twitter.com/disclosure89/status/1394818284931801090?s=21
  • Options
    FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 76,292
    edited May 2021
    The mob wins...

    Headteacher of Pimlico Academy who sparked race row revolt QUITS after school was rocked by mass pupil protests over 'racist' uniform policy, changing of curriculum, and the Union flag was torched

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9592523/Headteacher-Pimlico-Academy-sparked-race-row-revolt-QUITS.html
  • Options
    gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    How does anything with a mass travel vast distances in space, and still be alive at the end of it?
  • Options
    swing_voterswing_voter Posts: 1,435

    The mob wins...

    Headteacher of Pimlico Academy who sparked race row revolt QUITS after school was rocked by mass pupil protests over 'racist' uniform policy, changing of curriculum, and the Union flag was torched

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9592523/Headteacher-Pimlico-Academy-sparked-race-row-revolt-QUITS.html

    Not sure the mob won... if he lost the support of staff/students/parents then his extremely well paid position is probably untenable.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,549

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    Yep. Almost all the best players under 25 are Chinese. Given that they peak at around 35, in 10 years time it will be all China.
    And there seem to be 3 or 4 new 16 year olds every single year, who are pretty damn decent.
    Shouldn't this be a Golden Age for British snooker coaches? And retailers of snooker-wear, snooker-shoes, snooker-cues?

    OR are the great-grandsons & daughters of the Bulldog Breed asleep at the wheel?
    Lots of snooker clubs closed. Not sure why: declining booze sales, perhaps, or the smoking ban.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,549
    All this UFO nonsense is a Number 10 dead cat to stop discussion of Dominic Cummings' revelations about government... well, whatever he was tweeting about.
  • Options
    Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,720

    kle4 said:

    Selebian said:

    From previous thread, on pollution from driving versus walking, I've looked it up and it is a nonsense comparison - doing a full life cycle analysis (and taking pessimistic assumptions*) on greenhouse gas from food calorie production against only the CO2 emissions from burning fuel in a car for the equivalent distance.

    I recall the PhD student being fairly convincing on this, but I probably should have pushed harder (still, it was only a mock more or less a throwaway line/reference in the introduction).

    So, keep walking, folks :smile:

    *damn scientists, tweaking the assumptions to get the answer they want!

    FYI, returned about half a hour ago from WALKING to the store for some groceries. Like I've done every few days for a LONG time, before & during the pandemic.

    SO how many other PBers do the same, on a regular basis?

    Rarely - even a small amount in the rucksack has me sweating like a pig. Home delivery's been a godsend.
    Not me. The former council's ridiculously strict planning policy means that all the homes are in areas unpolluted by, um, shops, and all the shops are nearly half an hour's walk away, partly up a steep hill. Life is too short. Home delivery yay!

    When I lived in Nottingham, the housing was a few minutes from a huge supermarket, and of course I'd walk to it. I genuinely don't understand why any council wouldn't plan for that - healthier, cheaper, fewer carbon emissions - what's not to like?
    That's interesting.

    I thought shop were a key resource for sustainable sites, along with Drs and Schools etc.

    Though I confess I don't know how much leeway they have if they push it.
  • Options
    Cocky_cockneyCocky_cockney Posts: 760
    Meanwhile on topic, I don't think the Conservatives are unpopular enough for the Lib Dems to pull off what would be standard fayre midterm by-election win. The circumstances are different at the moment and the 45% Leave - 55% Remain vote from 5 years ago doesn't fill me with confidence that this is other than a Conservative win.

    If the alleged Indian variant rips through the country (it won't) then it might be different but obviously no opposition politician would be hoping for such a thing.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,305

    The mob wins...

    Headteacher of Pimlico Academy who sparked race row revolt QUITS after school was rocked by mass pupil protests over 'racist' uniform policy, changing of curriculum, and the Union flag was torched

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9592523/Headteacher-Pimlico-Academy-sparked-race-row-revolt-QUITS.html

    Everyone and everything is racist.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,549
    It is one of my perennial rants that the BBC's news team slavishly follows American news overnight and at weekends.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,401

    The mob wins...

    Headteacher of Pimlico Academy who sparked race row revolt QUITS after school was rocked by mass pupil protests over 'racist' uniform policy, changing of curriculum, and the Union flag was torched

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9592523/Headteacher-Pimlico-Academy-sparked-race-row-revolt-QUITS.html

    Not sure the mob won... if he lost the support of staff/students/parents then his extremely well paid position is probably untenable.
    I don’t think it was anything to do with the racist nutters at BLM. Admittedly their influence is creepy and unhelpful and it provides a convenient peg for the DM to hang their usual spiel on, but if that was all the school wouldn’t have got rid of him.

    The problem seems to be that a large number of staff were about to strike and/or bring lawsuits over bullying allegations. Now *that* is a a serious matter with unfortunate financial implications.
  • Options
    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,401
    edited May 2021
    Have just seen the news about John Swinney and Humza Yousaf.

    Boy, Nicola Sturgeon is really determined to utterly destroy education in Scotland, isn’t she?
  • Options
    SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 15,658

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    Yep. Almost all the best players under 25 are Chinese. Given that they peak at around 35, in 10 years time it will be all China.
    And there seem to be 3 or 4 new 16 year olds every single year, who are pretty damn decent.
    Shouldn't this be a Golden Age for British snooker coaches? And retailers of snooker-wear, snooker-shoes, snooker-cues?

    OR are the great-grandsons & daughters of the Bulldog Breed asleep at the wheel?
    Lots of snooker clubs closed. Not sure why: declining booze sales, perhaps, or the smoking ban.
    My point is, snooker may be dying on it's feet in the UK (or at least less than robust) but it's clearly booming in China.

    So MIGHT behoove a formerly great trading nation to get it's collective finger out, and start trading on its snooker cred with eager (and credulous) Chinese. Especially since you've gone and screwed up your commercial relationship with (rest of) Europe for a mess of Brexit.
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068
    I'm torn on this one:

    I don't think it's a very good idea for prosecutions to get political. Hunting people in the courts because they are your political opponents is a Very Bad Thing.

    On the other hand, it does look like the Trump Organization has played fast and loose, and may well have broken a great number of laws. (Declaring different values for buildings between the tax authority and your mortgage lender is a dangerous game: you're either committing tax fraud or mail fraud.)
  • Options
    rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 54,068

    Meanwhile on topic, I don't think the Conservatives are unpopular enough for the Lib Dems to pull off what would be standard fayre midterm by-election win. The circumstances are different at the moment and the 45% Leave - 55% Remain vote from 5 years ago doesn't fill me with confidence that this is other than a Conservative win.

    If the alleged Indian variant rips through the country (it won't) then it might be different but obviously no opposition politician would be hoping for such a thing.

    My gut is that it'll be Witney again, with the LibDems achieving a solid second place - something like 50-42.

    That being said, if I were to be wrong, I think it's not likely I'd be wrong because the LibDems outperform.
  • Options
    DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 24,549

    dixiedean said:

    Leon said:

    isam said:

    Watching Gods of Snooker... it was so big in the 80s. What a different world

    White & Higgins were absolute nutters!

    A misconception. Snooker is bigger now than ever.

    Why? Snooker is ENORMOUS in China. 150m fans


    https://www.ft.com/content/973ccf14-ad5a-4b0e-b6f6-9fad8634f3b0
    Yep. Almost all the best players under 25 are Chinese. Given that they peak at around 35, in 10 years time it will be all China.
    And there seem to be 3 or 4 new 16 year olds every single year, who are pretty damn decent.
    Shouldn't this be a Golden Age for British snooker coaches? And retailers of snooker-wear, snooker-shoes, snooker-cues?

    OR are the great-grandsons & daughters of the Bulldog Breed asleep at the wheel?
    Lots of snooker clubs closed. Not sure why: declining booze sales, perhaps, or the smoking ban.
    My point is, snooker may be dying on it's feet in the UK (or at least less than robust) but it's clearly booming in China.

    So MIGHT behoove a formerly great trading nation to get it's collective finger out, and start trading on its snooker cred with eager (and credulous) Chinese. Especially since you've gone and screwed up your commercial relationship with (rest of) Europe for a mess of Brexit.
    Already done. Which partly explains why snooker is popular there in the first place. The snooker tour includes Chinese events, and a quick glance at the recent World Championship results finds five Chinese players took part.
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/snooker/56762588
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,821
    rcs1000 said:

    I'm torn on this one:

    I don't think it's a very good idea for prosecutions to get political. Hunting people in the courts because they are your political opponents is a Very Bad Thing.

    On the other hand, it does look like the Trump Organization has played fast and loose, and may well have broken a great number of laws. (Declaring different values for buildings between the tax authority and your mortgage lender is a dangerous game: you're either committing tax fraud or mail fraud.)
    Not prosecuting crimes because the alleged perpetrator is a very important person is also a Very Bad Thing.
    The publicity seeking tendencies of the US prosecutorial system is perhaps more the problem ?
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,821
    ydoethur said:

    The mob wins...

    Headteacher of Pimlico Academy who sparked race row revolt QUITS after school was rocked by mass pupil protests over 'racist' uniform policy, changing of curriculum, and the Union flag was torched

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9592523/Headteacher-Pimlico-Academy-sparked-race-row-revolt-QUITS.html

    Not sure the mob won... if he lost the support of staff/students/parents then his extremely well paid position is probably untenable.
    I don’t think it was anything to do with the racist nutters at BLM. Admittedly their influence is creepy and unhelpful and it provides a convenient peg for the DM to hang their usual spiel on, but if that was all the school wouldn’t have got rid of him.

    The problem seems to be that a large number of staff were about to strike and/or bring lawsuits over bullying allegations. Now *that* is a a serious matter with unfortunate financial implications.
    Bullying and/or sociopathic heads are sadly not very rare phenomena.
    If they’re a little more subtle about it, they can get away with it for years.
  • Options
    swing_voterswing_voter Posts: 1,435
    ydoethur said:

    The mob wins...

    Headteacher of Pimlico Academy who sparked race row revolt QUITS after school was rocked by mass pupil protests over 'racist' uniform policy, changing of curriculum, and the Union flag was torched

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9592523/Headteacher-Pimlico-Academy-sparked-race-row-revolt-QUITS.html

    Not sure the mob won... if he lost the support of staff/students/parents then his extremely well paid position is probably untenable.
    I don’t think it was anything to do with the racist nutters at BLM. Admittedly their influence is creepy and unhelpful and it provides a convenient peg for the DM to hang their usual spiel on, but if that was all the school wouldn’t have got rid of him.

    The problem seems to be that a large number of staff were about to strike and/or bring lawsuits over bullying allegations. Now *that* is a a serious matter with unfortunate financial implications.
    Agree with the comments above, my experience of a number of Academies is that they suffer from top-down, hierarchical structures that too often lead to bullying and poor leadership - the loss of 30 plus members of staff in 6 months (even with lockdown) speaks volumes about the leadership/management issues and not about wokeism...
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 62,821
    Nigelb said:

    rcs1000 said:

    I'm torn on this one:

    I don't think it's a very good idea for prosecutions to get political. Hunting people in the courts because they are your political opponents is a Very Bad Thing.

    On the other hand, it does look like the Trump Organization has played fast and loose, and may well have broken a great number of laws. (Declaring different values for buildings between the tax authority and your mortgage lender is a dangerous game: you're either committing tax fraud or mail fraud.)
    Not prosecuting crimes because the alleged perpetrator is a very important person is also a Very Bad Thing.
    The publicity seeking tendencies of the US prosecutorial system is perhaps more the problem ?
    Apologies for that shocking statement. It ought to have been “are the problem”.
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    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,452
    rcs1000 said:

    dixiedean said:

    rcs1000 said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    rcs1000 said:

    Leon said:

    moonshine said:

    Leon said:

    Gadi Schwartz
    @GadiNBC
    ·
    24m
    With Obama weighing in today & Rubio’s statements this weekend, you’ve got to hope the issue of UAPs has finally transcended questions of political partisanship. Whatever they are, they seem to represent an inflection point for society as a whole.


    https://twitter.com/GadiNBC/status/1394740524343463936?s=20

    There’s been an assumption even from the likes of Lue Elizondo that the June report to Congress won’t reveal too much new but will be the start of a longer process that might reveal a lot in time. Could be Elizondo is wrong and that the Biden government has decided to rip the plaster off. Hard to think of a more obvious proxy to float something out there for Biden than Obama.
    Let’s say “something”, whatever the “something” is, has been kept secret for many years and you’re right that there’s moves afoot to reveal it. The way I see it there’s two reasons for that:

    1) It has been concluded it’s the right thing to do; or

    2) It has been assessed that it’s about to come out anyway in an uncontrolled fashion (e.g. increased use of better drones or increased volumes of private owned space assets).

    1 seems unlikely so I think you’re left with 2, especially if it actually is extraterrestrial objects. That would mean no mad rush to reveal EVERYTHING in one go, but a sense it does need to come out in a controlled fashion in the next year or two.
    I'd go with 2 (of the two options)

    See all the new drone footage, from around the world, apparently showing exactly the same thing: small weird aircraft, like silvery bullets the size of a smartcar, capable of incredible speeds - 9,000mph or even 14,000mph

    Drone cameras - a new technology - may be capturing so much footage of UAPs that is no longer credibly deniable or debunkable

    That would move the USG to control the narrative and get the info out first, so they look like they are "in command" of the situation

    Also plausible


    This is the footage from Utah. No one has successfully debunked it

    https://twitter.com/brianjhanley/status/1083171588802052096?s=20

    An analysis of what it shows

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cFN7KofHpcY
    Does that require debunking?

    It's a fast moving flying object that he thinks is travelling at 9,000 miles per hour.

    But which I'd reckon is actually travelling at about a quarter of that speed.

    Why? Because at 9,000 miles per hour it would be compressing a lot of the air it hits. The wave it would generate as it went by (and the air jumped back into place) would result in trees moving an awful lot.

    My guess is that it's a grey coloured XQ-58A (which is the US government's fighter drone) travelling at a supersonic speed.
    lol
    Lol?

    If an object passes through air at a high speed, it compresses the air that hits the leading edges.

    The faster it's travelling, the more compression there is.

    And the more the air spring back once the object has passed.

    Something travelling at 9,000 miles an hour (if it's the size they say it is) would be compressing an awful lot of air. So, either

    (a) it's not the size they say it is
    (b) it's not going at the speed they say it is
    or
    (c) it's able to avoid compressing the air it travels through

    My money is on (a) and/or (b).

    Edit to add: watch the footage again. The trees don't seem to even register its presence. Doesn't that strike you as strange?
    At 9000 mph isn't the speed great enough that the compression heats the air enough to burn the nitrogen?
    Quite possibly.

    Here are my questions:

    (1) Could an alien civilization achieve massively more efficient propulsion to enable objects to travel at previously unimaginable speeds, to accelerate and brake in ways that would appear to break the laws of physics?

    Yes. If they exist, one would expect them to have propulsion systems beyond the imagination of man.

    (2) Could said civilization create new kinds of surface that would potentially dramatically reduce friction as craft travel through the air or water?

    Yes. But that's harder.

    (3) Could they avoid the fact that they're ultimately a solid object travelling through air?

    No. Ultimately their craft will have mass. And that mass will push up against air. There's no avoiding compressing the air as you pass through it.

    And that's why I'm sceptical of the Beaver, UT footage. Simply, if the trees and things swayed, that would make the movement much more plausible.
    "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
    Clarke's Third Law.
    But there are levels of difficulty.

    We can conceive of power sources so vast you could accelerate to close to the speed of light in a short space. Even if we have no idea how that could be achieved, practically, we can conceive of methods.

    And while we don't know how to dramatically reduce the friction a solid object would have in passing through the air, it certainly doesn't strike me as impossible.

    What does strike me as unlikely, though, is that it has no interaction with the mass around it.

    Air is stuff. Just like the mountain is stuff. If you can travel through the air without interacting with it in any way, then you could travel through the mountain too. And you'd also ask why light bothers to bounce off it as well.
    We don’t yet understand what space and time really are. Which may be pertinent.
  • Options
    TazTaz Posts: 11,305
    ydoethur said:

    Have just seen the news about John Swinney and Humza Yousaf.

    Boy, Nicola Sturgeon is really determined to utterly destroy education in Scotland, isn’t she?

    It’s not in a great state at the moment anyway.
This discussion has been closed.