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On a day when a poll had 59% saying Johnson’s “untrustworthy” the betting money edges to an earlier

SystemSystem Posts: 12,128
edited April 2021 in General
imageOn a day when a poll had 59% saying Johnson’s “untrustworthy” the betting money edges to an earlier departure – politicalbetting.com

There has been quite a lot of activity on the Boris Johnson exit date betting markets and we’ve seen over the past couple of days 2021 being the year of his going move from an 8% chance to tonight a 21% one.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,928
    edited April 2021
    First. (After all the earlier runners were somehow disqualified and deleted.)
  • DumbosaurusDumbosaurus Posts: 777
    Second
  • Spot on article
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,800
    Boris Johnson will only leave if either:

    a) the electorate vote him out
    b) the Party turns on him when will only happen when he looks like a loser AND someone else looks like a winner.
    c) he goes on his own terms and watches helplessly as his reputation is destroyed by his ungrateful successors.
  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,800
    rcs1000 said:

    First. (After all the earlier runners were somehow disqualified and deleted.)

    Outrageous.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662
    edited April 2021
    stodge said:

    rcs1000 said:

    First. (After all the earlier runners were somehow disqualified and deleted.)

    Outrageous.
    Its been done to.me more than once.
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    kle4 said:

    gealbhan said:

    Downing St approached ex-Labour chancellor for help setting up trust to oversee PM's flat refurbishment

    And he told Starmer ages ago. LOTI (leader of the inquisition) has known all about this all along.

    Labour are up to their neck in this now!

    I posted the whole Sky article, not Scott's edit and paste, and not only was Starmer's office aware of it last summer, but the intention was for any costs for the Downing Street Estate to be managed by a trust similar to the White Houses
    Don't be silly BigG. this is not the USA. Johnson will come up smelling of roses, but he really shouldn't.
    Preserving no 10 for the nation and successive prime ministers seems sensible to me
    If it were that innocent why has the party acted so evasive and weird about it? Questions from opponents will always arise, but their behaviour has fed that.
    Yeah that’s a point.

    “If who funded it isn’t a problem, why don’t you just say who funded it then?” Is what is feeding the media, neither Dom or Labour prolonging this now, just the conservative Party itself.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    FPT:
    franklyn said:

    There have been a few photos of the decoration of Boris's flat in Downing Street. It looks unspeakably awful. No doubt when he goes it will cost a fortune for it all to be stripped out, because I don't think any normal person could now live in it. Apparently the dog regularly craps on the carpet, so the whole place will need a deep clean. Who pays for all that...us poor taxpayers I suppose

    Could you point us in the direction of these photos please @franklyn? I'd be interested to see them, and the only ones I've seen so far were of a completely different property that had nothing to do with No. 10-11 or its current makeover.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,154
    That’s a truly staggering statistic. 35% of people think Johnson is trustworthy?

    I shall go to bed before we have any more shocks.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    rcs1000 said:

    First. (After all the earlier runners were somehow disqualified and deleted.)

    I trust this statement, since it didn't say 'somehow' disqualified.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    BBC News Press Team
    @BBCNewsPR
    ·
    5h
    On Wednesday 28th April the BBC will be airing a special day of coverage on the deepening coronavirus crisis in India.

    We’ll have reports, interviews, and analysis across BBC TV, radio, and online throughout the day.

  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    Its a tad ironic the lefties on here smearing and exaggerating(lying,) with half truths( more lies) whilst accusing their opponents of half truths and lying.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    ydoethur said:

    That’s a truly staggering statistic. 35% of people think Johnson is trustworthy?

    I shall go to bed before we have any more shocks.

    More to the point that's the limit on how many people will claim they think he's trustworthy, even though more will still vote for him, ie not even party loyalty or support makes everyone willing to lie on a survey.
    ydoethur said:

    gealbhan said:

    Downing St approached ex-Labour chancellor for help setting up trust to oversee PM's flat refurbishment

    And he told Starmer ages ago. LOTI (leader of the inquisition) has known all about this all along.

    Labour are up to their neck in this now!

    I posted the whole Sky article, not Scott's edit and paste, and not only was Starmer's office aware of it last summer, but the intention was for any costs for the Downing Street Estate to be managed by a trust similar to the White Houses
    Don't be silly BigG. this is not the USA. Johnson will come up smelling of roses, but he really shouldn't.
    Preserving no 10 for the nation and successive prime ministers seems sensible to me
    But he's not preserving it for the nation, he is decorating it for his girlfriend. Theresa May's John Lewis January Sale offering was only a year or two old anyway. How often do you redecorate? Mind you Mrs May's decor was very....beige.
    Most everyone redecorated when they move into a home
    And most of us either did it ourselves or paid for it ourselves ab initio.
    Steady on, Doethur, any more latin sprinkled about and we'll think you are Boris - it would explain the Dom and Gove hatred.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,994
    FPT - Interesting story of how a husband and wife set up a justice-oriented non-profit mental health care organisation, until the Woke mob came for them.. but they stood-up to them, and defeated them:

    https://twitter.com/graceisforyou/status/1386739669866455043?s=20
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    stodge said:

    Boris Johnson will only leave if either:

    a) the electorate vote him out
    b) the Party turns on him when will only happen when he looks like a loser AND someone else looks like a winner.
    c) he goes on his own terms and watches helplessly as his reputation is destroyed by his ungrateful successors.

    There are other types of successor?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 59,994
    On topic, I've been laying a Boris exit in 2021 today.
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    FPT:

    franklyn said:

    There have been a few photos of the decoration of Boris's flat in Downing Street. It looks unspeakably awful. No doubt when he goes it will cost a fortune for it all to be stripped out, because I don't think any normal person could now live in it. Apparently the dog regularly craps on the carpet, so the whole place will need a deep clean. Who pays for all that...us poor taxpayers I suppose

    Could you point us in the direction of these photos please @franklyn? I'd be interested to see them, and the only ones I've seen so far were of a completely different property that had nothing to do with No. 10-11 or its current makeover.
    Aren’t the ones in the sun competition actual then? I thought it looked brilliant.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,278
    edited April 2021
    Boris is still the Tories best vote winner and he still keeps the Brexit coalition behind him. That will be reinforced when the Tories likely win Hartlepool in the by election by squeezing the large Brexit party vote from the general election.

    Elsewhere I expect the results on May 6th to be a mixed bag, some Tory losses in the county elections after the high point of 2017 but balanced by some Tory gains in the district elections where there is still a sizeable UKIP vote to squeeze from 2016.

    In Remain heavy London and Scotland the Tories are likely to do less well but in Brexit voting Wales they should also make gains
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,477
    @Stocky
    Sorry been out

    TV - News at 6pm. George Alagiah.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    Foxy said:

    kle4 said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    Lol

    Go Woke, Go Broke

    The Oscars rating have plunged to their lowest ever. 9.8m

    Last year’s was the previous worst ever, 23m

    For context they used to hit 40m

    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/26/business/media/oscars-ratings.html

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/oscars-ratings-fall-58-as-event-draws-lowest-ever-tv-viewership-11619464398

    I'd imagine its dying for the same reason broadcast TV is dying. Who wants to sit and watch something on a broadcasters schedule nowadays?

    I've never been interested in the Oscars or any other awards ceremony, but if you are you can read all about it online, see clips on YouTube/Twitter/Facebook or whatever. Why bother sitting through a live broadcast?

    Live broadcasts of anything non-sporting are dying.
    Indeed. But I am also sure Hollywood’s ever-growing obsession with inclusivity and diversity, plus the hypocritical lecturing and pomposity that goes with it - multimillionaire celebs sneering at the poor racist hicks who watch the movies - is not helping

    Eg The big Oscar winning movie was all about homeless people. This year the Oscars were held in LA’s main train station, where 100s of homeless people usually kip.

    To do the ceremony, that turfed out the homeless

    The American movie industry is destroying itself. It was maybe doomed anyway, by TV, games and streaming but it is still a shame to watch
    Yes, it's the utter narcissism of it that gets me the most.
    The opening monologue referenced Chauvin and Floyd OF COURSE and it went on from there

    They seem to have forgotten their job is to entertain not lecture, show don’t tell, or they are just so scared of being seen as UNwoke they feel obliged to virtue-signal at EVERY opportunity

    It will end up with 0 viewers of “the most diverse list of nominations ever” when they manage to get a roster that has nobody white or male or Jewish or American and all the movies come from Kosovo and Somalia
    It's cover. They're doing it so they don't personally get criticised, but others do.

    However, if it starts to directly affect their own career, you can be sure they'll start to grumble.
    Yes, there will be a pinch point when the movies earn so little they finally think Well maybe one of the problems is that we’ve pushed the Woke stuff a bit too much?

    The American movie biz has another, maybe bigger problem, The world’s biggest movie market is now China. If you want a movie to max out its box office, it has to work there as well - or even mostly. Until a few years ago US movies did well in China

    Not any more. China now makes excellent movies for its own audience and they are tuning out of Hollywood. I doubt Chinese audiences will be won back by politically correct diatribes masquerading as cinema

    It may seem a trivial point, but so much of American soft power is - or was - bound up with the supremacy of Hollywood. The American century and the hegemony of Hollywood coincided perfectly.

    They began, and now they end, at the same time


    https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/its-official-china-overtakes-north-america-as-worlds-biggest-box-office-in-2020

    https://www.boxofficepro.com/eight-hundred-china-2020-box-office/
    What I found funny was the tastes of Chinese audiences - I think things like Fast and the Furious made big bucks, but Star Wars they turn their noses up at.

    I look forward to when they start releasing English language films. Noodle Westerns?
    I recently watched "A Touch of Sin" which could pass as a noodle Western. Very good indeed, and not uncritical of modern China.

    https://player.bfi.org.uk/rentals/film/watch-a-touch-of-sin-2013-online
    2013 I see, the early days of Emperor Xi. Hopefully they are still able to be so today.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    gealbhan said:

    FPT:

    franklyn said:

    There have been a few photos of the decoration of Boris's flat in Downing Street. It looks unspeakably awful. No doubt when he goes it will cost a fortune for it all to be stripped out, because I don't think any normal person could now live in it. Apparently the dog regularly craps on the carpet, so the whole place will need a deep clean. Who pays for all that...us poor taxpayers I suppose

    Could you point us in the direction of these photos please @franklyn? I'd be interested to see them, and the only ones I've seen so far were of a completely different property that had nothing to do with No. 10-11 or its current makeover.
    Aren’t the ones in the sun competition actual then? I thought it looked brilliant.
    No idea, haven't seen them.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873

    MaxPB said:

    Where dependency on Beijing takes you - servitude:

    Clive Hamilton, professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt University in Canberra, who has written widely on China’s growing influence in the region, told The Times: “There are now real questions about New Zealand’s sovereignty, which is spilling into the Five Eyes alliance.

    “Five Eyes can’t work without complete trust between the partners. New Zealand has become the weakest link.”

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/beijing-is-driving-a-wedge-between-australia-and-new-zealand-pkcsnmc2j

    Yup, I don't understand what St Jacinda is playing at, the five eyes becomes four which seems like a bigger loss for NZ than it does for the other four. The differing stance of Australia and NZ is what's most worrying here. China has split a very strong alliance in the Pacific and seemingly completely captured the NZ premier. She seems completely incapable of recognising the China/NZ relationship for what it is - abuser and victim.
    I don't want NZ to become part of China's sphere of influence, but let's not forget that essentially in five eyes, the other four eyes are very much in America's sphere of influence.
    Maybe so, but that's a pretty easy choice for most.
  • One particular user will try to argue away 59% with don’t knows or some other such bollocks
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,774
    edited April 2021
    stodge said:

    Boris Johnson will only leave if either:

    a) the electorate vote him out
    b) the Party turns on him when will only happen when he looks like a loser AND someone else looks like a winner.
    c) he goes on his own terms and watches helplessly as his reputation is destroyed by his ungrateful successors.

    d) proof emerges that he actually gave the football SuperLeague the nod, when first asked
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 35,895
    Tomorrow's @independent front page #tomorrowspaperstoday To subscribe to the Daily Edition http://www.independentsubscriptions.co.uk/ https://twitter.com/ThairShaikh/status/1387141247429718018/photo/1
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,928
    edited April 2021

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxygen. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    I asked one my employees - a lady in her early 30s - if she had been vaccinated:

    No.

    Will she be getting vaccinated?

    It's not for me.

    She then told me her father in law had been hospitalized for three months with Covid.
  • FossFoss Posts: 992
    I would guess that the important dates for Johnson’s internal measures of success would be staying past a) late Sept 2025 (and so beat Cameron), b) late Sept 2029 (Blair), and c) late Feb 2031 (Thatcher) AND choosing to go on his terms rather than due to loosing party or country.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    Foss said:

    I would guess that the important dates for Johnson’s internal measures of success would be staying past a) late Sept 2025 (and so beat Cameron), b) late Sept 2029 (Blair), and c) late Feb 2031 (Thatcher) AND choosing to go on his terms rather than due to loosing party or country.

    I can believe the first, given his dislike of Cameron seems to have extended into office with that girly swot stuff, but if Boris Johnson has ever looked 10 years ahead I will eat my least favourite hat. Whatever his strengths are, and he has them, long term planning I am not sure is one of them.
  • squareroot2squareroot2 Posts: 6,662

    One particular user will try to argue away 59% with don’t knows or some other such bollocks

    How many of you are there? Your opinion seems to be vacillating daily?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    kle4 said:

    MaxPB said:

    Where dependency on Beijing takes you - servitude:

    Clive Hamilton, professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt University in Canberra, who has written widely on China’s growing influence in the region, told The Times: “There are now real questions about New Zealand’s sovereignty, which is spilling into the Five Eyes alliance.

    “Five Eyes can’t work without complete trust between the partners. New Zealand has become the weakest link.”

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/beijing-is-driving-a-wedge-between-australia-and-new-zealand-pkcsnmc2j

    Yup, I don't understand what St Jacinda is playing at, the five eyes becomes four which seems like a bigger loss for NZ than it does for the other four. The differing stance of Australia and NZ is what's most worrying here. China has split a very strong alliance in the Pacific and seemingly completely captured the NZ premier. She seems completely incapable of recognising the China/NZ relationship for what it is - abuser and victim.
    I don't want NZ to become part of China's sphere of influence, but let's not forget that essentially in five eyes, the other four eyes are very much in America's sphere of influence.
    Maybe so, but that's a pretty easy choice for most.
    But we didn't vote for America any more than we voted for China. So it doesn't strike me as markedly more legitimate democratically to take orders from the first than it would be to take orders from the second.

    To give you an example of this influence, I think Sunak has pushed Corporation Tax up because the US wanted us to. Obviously I can't prove that because obviously it didn't happen in public. I also can't see any justification for us increasing our Trident warhead count other than as a bung to Uncle Sam. I don't like it, and I'm looking forward to that influence waning, though I understand that process alarms some people.
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,470
    rcs1000 said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxygen. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    I asked one my employees - a lady in her early 30s - if she had been vaccinated:

    No.

    Will she be getting vaccinated?

    It's not for me.

    She then told me her father in law had been hospitalized for three months with Covid.
    Has she had any other vaccinations ?

    And what will you do if she gets covid and is off sick for three months herself ?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxygen. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    After yesterday's radio silence, you have come out swinging today. Well done!
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    Its not a fallacy. The media, the questioning for ministers, the headlines, the front pages tend to be dominated by one story. Looking at the BBC News front page right now the headline 'big story' has a giant picture of Carrie and Boris from clap for carers and a headline about flat renovations. Underneath is a tiny picture of funeral pyres from India. Do you really think that priotisation is right? It seems pretty sick to me.

    Thousands of people a day are dying in the EU, thousands of people a day in India and its getting worse fast - this looks like being one of the worst humanitarian crises in all time and we could be helping - I know the country has sent oxygen to India but we should be grilling as to what more can be done if anything.

    People pretend to care about humanitarian crises when they stroke their own ego banging on about 0.7% but unfolding before our eyes is one of the worst crises I ever recall seeing, some of the most heartbreaking images we've seen, and all anyone wants to talk about is wallpaper and words said in a meeting eight months ago.

    Give me a break. Lets never hear from any of these imposters how much they care about humanitarianism ever again.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    rcs1000 said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxygen. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    I asked one my employees - a lady in her early 30s - if she had been vaccinated:

    No.

    Will she be getting vaccinated?

    It's not for me.

    She then told me her father in law had been hospitalized for three months with Covid.
    There are no words. 😡🤦‍♂️
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    edited April 2021

    kle4 said:

    MaxPB said:

    Where dependency on Beijing takes you - servitude:

    Clive Hamilton, professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt University in Canberra, who has written widely on China’s growing influence in the region, told The Times: “There are now real questions about New Zealand’s sovereignty, which is spilling into the Five Eyes alliance.

    “Five Eyes can’t work without complete trust between the partners. New Zealand has become the weakest link.”

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/beijing-is-driving-a-wedge-between-australia-and-new-zealand-pkcsnmc2j

    Yup, I don't understand what St Jacinda is playing at, the five eyes becomes four which seems like a bigger loss for NZ than it does for the other four. The differing stance of Australia and NZ is what's most worrying here. China has split a very strong alliance in the Pacific and seemingly completely captured the NZ premier. She seems completely incapable of recognising the China/NZ relationship for what it is - abuser and victim.
    I don't want NZ to become part of China's sphere of influence, but let's not forget that essentially in five eyes, the other four eyes are very much in America's sphere of influence.
    Maybe so, but that's a pretty easy choice for most.
    But we didn't vote for America any more than we voted for China. So it doesn't strike me as markedly more legitimate democratically to take orders from the first than it would be to take orders from the second.

    To give you an example of this influence, I think Sunak has pushed Corporation Tax up because the US wanted us to. Obviously I can't prove that because obviously it didn't happen in public. I also can't see any justification for us increasing our Trident warhead count other than as a bung to Uncle Sam. I don't like it, and I'm looking forward to that influence waning, though I understand that process alarms some people.
    I don't think many people would disagree with the view that it would be nice not to be so beholden to the influence of other countries (unless wholly voluntary), and to assert independent views and decisions whenever we can.

    But that doesn't mean that the places exerting those influences are morally equatable. And therefore, if one must be within one and not the other, the less morally dubious one, even if hardly ideal, is a far better option even if the other might well offer better practical arrangements.
  • FossFoss Posts: 992
    kle4 said:

    Foss said:

    I would guess that the important dates for Johnson’s internal measures of success would be staying past a) late Sept 2025 (and so beat Cameron), b) late Sept 2029 (Blair), and c) late Feb 2031 (Thatcher) AND choosing to go on his terms rather than due to loosing party or country.

    I can believe the first, given his dislike of Cameron seems to have extended into office with that girly swot stuff, but if Boris Johnson has ever looked 10 years ahead I will eat my least favourite hat. Whatever his strengths are, and he has them, long term planning I am not sure is one of them.
    He doesn't need a 10 year plan to want to 'beat' Blair, he just needs to have that deep gut desire to out compete another peer and slip one further step up the rankings.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231

    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    Its not a fallacy. The media, the questioning for ministers, the headlines, the front pages tend to be dominated by one story. Looking at the BBC News front page right now the headline 'big story' has a giant picture of Carrie and Boris from clap for carers and a headline about flat renovations. Underneath is a tiny picture of funeral pyres from India. Do you really think that priotisation is right? It seems pretty sick to me.

    Thousands of people a day are dying in the EU, thousands of people a day in India and its getting worse fast - this looks like being one of the worst humanitarian crises in all time and we could be helping - I know the country has sent oxygen to India but we should be grilling as to what more can be done if anything.

    People pretend to care about humanitarian crises when they stroke their own ego banging on about 0.7% but unfolding before our eyes is one of the worst crises I ever recall seeing, some of the most heartbreaking images we've seen, and all anyone wants to talk about is wallpaper and words said in a meeting eight months ago.

    Give me a break. Lets never hear from any of these imposters how much they care about humanitarianism ever again.
    What do you think we should do regarding India that has not yet happened?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480

    rcs1000 said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxygen. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    I asked one my employees - a lady in her early 30s - if she had been vaccinated:

    No.

    Will she be getting vaccinated?

    It's not for me.

    She then told me her father in law had been hospitalized for three months with Covid.
    Has she had any other vaccinations ?

    And what will you do if she gets covid and is off sick for three months herself ?
    It's America. Sack her.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,586
    Foxy said:
    And are you one of his 2,858 followers? I think we should be told.
  • Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    Absolutely right. They’ve played this well and for well over a year. Patience.
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    Its not a fallacy. The media, the questioning for ministers, the headlines, the front pages tend to be dominated by one story. Looking at the BBC News front page right now the headline 'big story' has a giant picture of Carrie and Boris from clap for carers and a headline about flat renovations. Underneath is a tiny picture of funeral pyres from India. Do you really think that priotisation is right? It seems pretty sick to me.

    Thousands of people a day are dying in the EU, thousands of people a day in India and its getting worse fast - this looks like being one of the worst humanitarian crises in all time and we could be helping - I know the country has sent oxygen to India but we should be grilling as to what more can be done if anything.

    People pretend to care about humanitarian crises when they stroke their own ego banging on about 0.7% but unfolding before our eyes is one of the worst crises I ever recall seeing, some of the most heartbreaking images we've seen, and all anyone wants to talk about is wallpaper and words said in a meeting eight months ago.

    Give me a break. Lets never hear from any of these imposters how much they care about humanitarianism ever again.
    I always had impression “world news” channels are much more watchable because the main national news is always so focussed just on the national angle and without the balance you speak of.

    But to expect a national news Chanel to have that sort of balance, is that how it should work?

    Every single UK daily led with this non story yesterday regardless of their bias, are you saying they were wrong as well?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480

    Foxy said:
    And are you one of his 2,858 followers? I think we should be told.
    I am not. Makes you proud to be British though.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 95,873
    edited April 2021
    Foss said:

    kle4 said:

    Foss said:

    I would guess that the important dates for Johnson’s internal measures of success would be staying past a) late Sept 2025 (and so beat Cameron), b) late Sept 2029 (Blair), and c) late Feb 2031 (Thatcher) AND choosing to go on his terms rather than due to loosing party or country.

    I can believe the first, given his dislike of Cameron seems to have extended into office with that girly swot stuff, but if Boris Johnson has ever looked 10 years ahead I will eat my least favourite hat. Whatever his strengths are, and he has them, long term planning I am not sure is one of them.
    He doesn't need a 10 year plan to want to 'beat' Blair, he just needs to have that deep gut desire to out compete another peer and slip one further step up the rankings.
    I'll reframe - I don't think he has the constancy to have such a long term desire, rather than merely, say, 'I wanted to become PM'.

    Blair is rebuilding his reputation but was wildly disliked for quite some time, if Boris has a gut level desire to 'beat' him, I'd bet it would be around leaving office better liked and remaining so, rather than beat his tenure in office. Thatcher is better remembered than Salisbury after all (Ok, granted, time is a factor there too).

    Edit: Incidentally, Boris goes past Eden on Friday.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,586
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:
    And are you one of his 2,858 followers? I think we should be told.
    I am not. Makes you proud to be British though.
    It does indeed!
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826



    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    Its not a fallacy. The media, the questioning for ministers, the headlines, the front pages tend to be dominated by one story. Looking at the BBC News front page right now the headline 'big story' has a giant picture of Carrie and Boris from clap for carers and a headline about flat renovations. Underneath is a tiny picture of funeral pyres from India. Do you really think that priotisation is right? It seems pretty sick to me.

    Thousands of people a day are dying in the EU, thousands of people a day in India and its getting worse fast - this looks like being one of the worst humanitarian crises in all time and we could be helping - I know the country has sent oxygen to India but we should be grilling as to what more can be done if anything.

    People pretend to care about humanitarian crises when they stroke their own ego banging on about 0.7% but unfolding before our eyes is one of the worst crises I ever recall seeing, some of the most heartbreaking images we've seen, and all anyone wants to talk about is wallpaper and words said in a meeting eight months ago.

    Give me a break. Lets never hear from any of these imposters how much they care about humanitarianism ever again.
    What do you think we should do regarding India that has not yet happened?
    Its hard to know, because there's so little being asked about what's going on or what can be done to know if more can be done. For starters though.
    1. The CPAP machines etc bought early in the pandemic, rather than arguing about the fact that the tax situation was sorted for those making ventilators how about we recognise that we don't need them anymore and loan them to India to help out? We can then loan them from nation to nation that is going through spikes until this over.
    2. Oxygen: Can we do more to help?
    3. Dexamethasone or anything else: Do they need help? Can we help supply it?
    4. Others like Foxy etc may have more suggestions. If these big questions were being asked then maybe we might go somewhere rather than turning a blind eye to funeral pyres.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    kle4 said:

    kle4 said:

    MaxPB said:

    Where dependency on Beijing takes you - servitude:

    Clive Hamilton, professor of public ethics at Charles Sturt University in Canberra, who has written widely on China’s growing influence in the region, told The Times: “There are now real questions about New Zealand’s sovereignty, which is spilling into the Five Eyes alliance.

    “Five Eyes can’t work without complete trust between the partners. New Zealand has become the weakest link.”

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/beijing-is-driving-a-wedge-between-australia-and-new-zealand-pkcsnmc2j

    Yup, I don't understand what St Jacinda is playing at, the five eyes becomes four which seems like a bigger loss for NZ than it does for the other four. The differing stance of Australia and NZ is what's most worrying here. China has split a very strong alliance in the Pacific and seemingly completely captured the NZ premier. She seems completely incapable of recognising the China/NZ relationship for what it is - abuser and victim.
    I don't want NZ to become part of China's sphere of influence, but let's not forget that essentially in five eyes, the other four eyes are very much in America's sphere of influence.
    Maybe so, but that's a pretty easy choice for most.
    But we didn't vote for America any more than we voted for China. So it doesn't strike me as markedly more legitimate democratically to take orders from the first than it would be to take orders from the second.

    To give you an example of this influence, I think Sunak has pushed Corporation Tax up because the US wanted us to. Obviously I can't prove that because obviously it didn't happen in public. I also can't see any justification for us increasing our Trident warhead count other than as a bung to Uncle Sam. I don't like it, and I'm looking forward to that influence waning, though I understand that process alarms some people.
    I don't think many people would disagree with the view that it would be nice not to be so beholden to the influence of other countries (unless wholly voluntary), and to assert independent views and decisions whenever we can.

    But that doesn't mean that the places exerting those influences are morally equatable. And therefore, if one must be within one and not the other, the less morally dubious one, even if hardly ideal, is a far better option even if the other might well offer better practical arrangements.
    I don't think we should become China's lackey, good grief no. But I don't really think we should be anyone's.
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,255
    Foxy said:
    BTL that's a genuinely uplifting discussion.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965
    kle4 said:

    Foss said:

    kle4 said:

    Foss said:

    I would guess that the important dates for Johnson’s internal measures of success would be staying past a) late Sept 2025 (and so beat Cameron), b) late Sept 2029 (Blair), and c) late Feb 2031 (Thatcher) AND choosing to go on his terms rather than due to loosing party or country.

    I can believe the first, given his dislike of Cameron seems to have extended into office with that girly swot stuff, but if Boris Johnson has ever looked 10 years ahead I will eat my least favourite hat. Whatever his strengths are, and he has them, long term planning I am not sure is one of them.
    He doesn't need a 10 year plan to want to 'beat' Blair, he just needs to have that deep gut desire to out compete another peer and slip one further step up the rankings.
    I'll reframe - I don't think he has the constancy to have such a long term desire, rather than merely, say, 'I wanted to become PM'.

    Blair is rebuilding his reputation but was wildly disliked for quite some time, if Boris has a gut level desire to 'beat' him, I'd bet it would be around leaving office better liked and remaining so, rather than beat his tenure in office. Thatcher is better remembered than Salisbury after all (Ok, granted, time is a factor there too).

    Edit: Incidentally, Boris goes past Eden on Friday.
    'Boris goes past Eden on Friday.'

    He'll probably try to shag Eve while he's there.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    Well, given their inability to come up with a attractive policy platform or a leader more interesting than watching paint that's already dried, I suppose it will have to do...
  • I think I will die laughing if Johnson is brought down thanks to his latest squeeze's love of expensive wallpaper and it was all exposed by the Sage of Barnard Castle who the PM spent massive personal political capital saving only a year ago.

    He’s done a superb job of looking dodgy by refusing to explain where the donation came from. Which means when it inevitably leaks he’s going to look stupid
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,549
    rcs1000 said:

    First. (After all the earlier runners were somehow disqualified and deleted.)

    You guys DO like to keep it in the family!
  • Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    Well, given their inability to come up with a attractive policy platform or a leader more interesting than watching paint that's already dried, I suppose it will have to do...
    The Tories just knick Labour’s policies anyway, why do the work for them?
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    Well, given their inability to come up with a attractive policy platform or a leader more interesting than watching paint that's already dried, I suppose it will have to do...
    The Tories just knick Labour’s policies anyway, why do the work for them?
    Well, it's the only way Labour will see their policies implemented in government, so why not?
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 26,470

    I think I will die laughing if Johnson is brought down thanks to his latest squeeze's love of expensive wallpaper and it was all exposed by the Sage of Barnard Castle who the PM spent massive personal political capital saving only a year ago.

    The odd thing is that Boris does show loyalty to people who cause him trouble - not just Dom but Stanley and Jo as well.

    There's probably some needy insecurity underlying it.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    gealbhan said:

    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    IshmaelZ said:

    Well said Mike, this is all trivial bullshit by people too desperate to scrape the barrel with ridiculous nonsense because they don't want to admit that the UK is going well. I have trust in the British public to see through all this mud slinging and vote based on principles and policies.

    From India we are seeing truly tragic images, over three thousand a day known deaths and rising fast. Images on our screens of funeral pyres because the crematoriums are overloaded and hospitals are turning the sick away because they have no oxyden. 😢

    In the European Union we see leaders one month on still arguing over who gets to sit in the big chair for a photo opportunity. Meanwhile two and a half thousand people a day are dying from Covid.

    In the USA Biden is taking this seriously, but still over 600 daily deaths and running into major resistance by antivaxxers.

    In the UK the pandemic is over, deaths have effectively stopped. So lets squabble over wallpaper the taxpayer hasn't been charged for and what someone may or may not have said in temper eight months ago.

    Some people have really lost their moral compass! We should be asking big questions like how can we help the likes of India out now that we've helped ourselves, not this myopic nonsense.

    The drunk driver's fallacy, that it is not possible to think about more than one thing at a time. And how do you justify wibbling about ufos an hour or so ago?
    Its not a fallacy. The media, the questioning for ministers, the headlines, the front pages tend to be dominated by one story. Looking at the BBC News front page right now the headline 'big story' has a giant picture of Carrie and Boris from clap for carers and a headline about flat renovations. Underneath is a tiny picture of funeral pyres from India. Do you really think that priotisation is right? It seems pretty sick to me.

    Thousands of people a day are dying in the EU, thousands of people a day in India and its getting worse fast - this looks like being one of the worst humanitarian crises in all time and we could be helping - I know the country has sent oxygen to India but we should be grilling as to what more can be done if anything.

    People pretend to care about humanitarian crises when they stroke their own ego banging on about 0.7% but unfolding before our eyes is one of the worst crises I ever recall seeing, some of the most heartbreaking images we've seen, and all anyone wants to talk about is wallpaper and words said in a meeting eight months ago.

    Give me a break. Lets never hear from any of these imposters how much they care about humanitarianism ever again.
    I always had impression “world news” channels are much more watchable because the main national news is always so focussed just on the national angle and without the balance you speak of.

    But to expect a national news Chanel to have that sort of balance, is that how it should work?

    Every single UK daily led with this non story yesterday regardless of their bias, are you saying they were wrong as well?
    Yes the media are in a parallel universe Twitter bubble and feed off each other.

    When the world is in the midst of one of the worst humanitarian crises ever, we shouldn't just become innoculated to it. Especially when we're in the fortunate position to be getting out of crisis mode, the responsible thing to do is to try and help the less fortunate. How much CPAP machinery etc did we buy for the pandemic that we no longer need but others desperately do? These sort of questions should be getting asked.

    If this was an earthquake or other and thousands a day were dying from its aftermath we'd be getting more of a response than we're seeing. Yet people claim they care about this stuff when it comes to Budget Day, when it comes to the real world news they don't.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,360

    Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    From a guy who sat in a Shadow Cabinet for three years whilst anti-semitism ran riot all around him. So he could get the top job and, er, clean it up.

    Yeah, he knows all about the slow burn does Starmer....
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,549

    FPT:

    franklyn said:

    There have been a few photos of the decoration of Boris's flat in Downing Street. It looks unspeakably awful. No doubt when he goes it will cost a fortune for it all to be stripped out, because I don't think any normal person could now live in it. Apparently the dog regularly craps on the carpet, so the whole place will need a deep clean. Who pays for all that...us poor taxpayers I suppose

    Could you point us in the direction of these photos please @franklyn? I'd be interested to see them, and the only ones I've seen so far were of a completely different property that had nothing to do with No. 10-11 or its current makeover.
    Hands of the doggie - the only appealing, attractive member of the whole No 10 entourage!

    And willing to bet he craps a damn sight less than Boris. And if he does occasionally do it on the rug (don't they take the critter outside regularly?) well, reckon its only after Boris & Carrie have been chewing on it.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,214



    The CPAP machines etc bought early in the pandemic, rather than arguing about the fact that the tax situation was sorted for those making ventilators how about we recognise that we don't need them anymore and loan them to India to help out? We can then loan them from nation to nation that is going through spikes until this over.
    Oxygen: Can we do more to help?
    Dexamethasone or anything else: Do they need help? Can we help supply it?
    Others like Foxy etc may have more suggestions. If these big questions were being asked then maybe we might go somewhere rather than turning a blind eye to funeral pyres.
    Pause our vaccination campaign and give them our vaccines. Could easily save tens of thousands of lives.
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited April 2021
    Not convinced by driverless cars tbh

    More and more, my views are aligning with the daily mail. Help!
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,549
    Charles, can you please tell us, what terrible things HAVE you been called? Besides Chuck that is!

    Just inferred you preferred "Charles" cause that's your PB moniker.

    For all we know, your REAL name is Raoul . . .
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    Wot a swimsuit?

    Won’t be hiding any nuts in there.

    Plenty more questions, not just how much did the paper leading the pack pay Cummings?
    And why is The Mail trying to destroy Boris and the careers of hundreds of Conservative councillors, who will represent the values and Brexit the Mail campaigns for?
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,549
    Is anyone else wondering, why Leon's new avatar is Lenin and NOT Trotsky?

    Though personally always pegged him as a left-wing Bukharinite with serious Menshevik tendencies . . .
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited April 2021
    Deleted

    I need to keep up!
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,928
    Pulpstar said:
    Hmmm... that's rather an inflated sense of self worth, no?
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 38,528
    rcs1000 said:

    Pulpstar said:
    Hmmm... that's rather an inflated sense of self worth, no?
    It's just sad.
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362

    Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    Well, given their inability to come up with a attractive policy platform or a leader more interesting than watching paint that's already dried, I suppose it will have to do...
    “ paint that's already dried “

    No No no. Paint already dried. That’s over the top. That’s silly exaggeration.

    This is starmer

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLOPygVcaVE&t=1s



  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,477

    Is anyone else wondering, why Leon's new avatar is Lenin and NOT Trotsky?

    Though personally always pegged him as a left-wing Bukharinite with serious Menshevik tendencies . . .

    Leon recently converted to communism over the European Super League debacle.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    "Corruption"

    He was given an award by Theresa May's government in 2017 and 2018
    He made a donation to Theresa May's constituency office.
    He gave £100,000 to the anti-Brexit Stronger In campaign.

    Nothing awarded to him by the pro-Brexit Johnson government on that list.

    Is that what you've got?
  • solarflaresolarflare Posts: 3,705
    Pulpstar said:
    For the love of god why haven't they called it Shake and Vax?
  • CorrectHorseBatteryCorrectHorseBattery Posts: 21,436
    edited April 2021

    "Corruption"

    He was given an award by Theresa May's government in 2017 and 2018
    He made a donation to Theresa May's constituency office.
    He gave £100,000 to the anti-Brexit Stronger In campaign.

    Nothing awarded to him by the pro-Brexit Johnson government on that list.

    Is that what you've got?
    Rattled.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401

    Bad news if you have a pet camel.

    "@PoliticsForAlI
    NEW: Devi Sridhar says coronavirus can infect camels - and they could then infect humans"

    No doubt the vast camel population of Scotland will now be used as further justification for her zero covid policy ideas.
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    gealbhan said:

    Sleaze is a slow burn. Labour have successfully embedded a narrative, upon which every subsequent dodgy deal can be hung. In the long run it’s their best prospect for getting back in the game.

    Well, given their inability to come up with a attractive policy platform or a leader more interesting than watching paint that's already dried, I suppose it will have to do...
    “ paint that's already dried “

    No No no. Paint already dried. That’s over the top. That’s silly exaggeration.

    This is starmer

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLOPygVcaVE&t=1s

    Excellent - one of his more dripping gripping parliamentary performances there...
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,477
    Weird front page splash on tomorrow’s Mail.

    My car already does that at any speed. It beeps at me if I take my hands off the wheel for more than a few seconds, but it otherwise effectively drives itself on that motorway.

    I assume it’s legal??
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    Mmm, that feels like it's a bit on the wane. It's not a deepening or gathering in momentum of a story or theme, it's now just the DM reaching into their basket of shit about Boris and chucking whatever they can find in there. Think he'll probably muddle through this.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    That seems odd to me.

    Is this is dummy swerve and a later edition has an absolute bombshell?
  • gealbhangealbhan Posts: 2,362
    ping said:

    Deleted

    I need to keep up!
    “ They aren't donations, they're high yield, low risk investments. “. 🥱
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826

    Bad news if you have a pet camel.

    "@PoliticsForAlI
    NEW: Devi Sridhar says coronavirus can infect camels - and they could then infect humans"

    No doubt the vast camel population of Scotland will now be used as further justification for her zero covid policy ideas.
    LOL was about to say something similar! 😀

    "Corruption"

    He was given an award by Theresa May's government in 2017 and 2018
    He made a donation to Theresa May's constituency office.
    He gave £100,000 to the anti-Brexit Stronger In campaign.

    Nothing awarded to him by the pro-Brexit Johnson government on that list.

    Is that what you've got?
    Rattled.
    No, bemused.

    If you wish to care to explain the relevance of stuff done by Theresa May and donations to Theresa May's office and the Remain campaign she backed then be my guest. I've made my opinion on her abundantly clear in the past.

    Not sure what relevance of any of that to today. "Look this man once donated to the campaign Boris was running against". Ooh big story.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,401
    Look 'self driving' squirrel!
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,477

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    That seems odd to me.

    Is this is dummy swerve and a later edition has an absolute bombshell?
    The cars story is senseless. As I say upthread, my car already does the things it describes, presumably legally?
  • FairlieredFairliered Posts: 4,874

    Bad news if you have a pet camel.

    "@PoliticsForAlI
    NEW: Devi Sridhar says coronavirus can infect camels - and they could then infect humans"

    No doubt the vast camel population of Scotland will now be used as further justification for her zero covid policy ideas.
    It’s enough to give anyone the hump.
  • IshmaelZIshmaelZ Posts: 21,830

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    Mmm, that feels like it's a bit on the wane. It's not a deepening or gathering in momentum of a story or theme, it's now just the DM reaching into their basket of shit about Boris and chucking whatever they can find in there. Think he'll probably muddle through this.
    Mustique is ancient history, flatgate is a fail because it is public property, not his, and "bodies piled high" shows him in exactly the right light: I want him locking down, but doing it with extreme reluctance, and that's what he is doing. I am not a fan or apologist but there really isn't very much to see here. On trustworthiness, what's the trend? I would not be amazed to find 59% thought him untrustworthy when they elected him in 2019.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231

    Pulpstar said:
    For the love of god why haven't they called it Shake and Vax?
    :D

    To put the T-lymphocytes and antibodies back?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 56,928

    "Corruption"

    He was given an award by Theresa May's government in 2017 and 2018
    He made a donation to Theresa May's constituency office.
    He gave £100,000 to the anti-Brexit Stronger In campaign.

    Nothing awarded to him by the pro-Brexit Johnson government on that list.

    Is that what you've got?
    So, what you're saying is that every thing this guy supports goes to shit...
  • SeaShantyIrish2SeaShantyIrish2 Posts: 17,549

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    That seems odd to me.

    Is this is dummy swerve and a later edition has an absolute bombshell?
    The cars story is senseless. As I say upthread, my car already does the things it describes, presumably legally?
    Did you miss the story about the self-driving car that crashed in Texas (think it was there)?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 54,677
    Amazon Prime’s LEONARDO is a pretty good renaissance art drama if you fancy some fresco-n-frolics


    Googling the background I’m amazed to find there are only eight - eight! - undisputed paintings by Leonardo da Vinci

    No wonder a slightly crab dubious “ninth” work sold for $450m
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    That seems odd to me.

    Is this is dummy swerve and a later edition has an absolute bombshell?
    The cars story is senseless. As I say upthread, my car already does the things it describes, presumably legally?
    It was 1986 in the pancake flat wastelands of Northern Alberta, when our driver pointed the car at the horizon and turned round to play a hand of cards with those in the back seats.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 51,578
    Foxy said:
    Foxy said:
    Stranger hobby?
  • pingping Posts: 3,805
    edited April 2021
    Why did Boris allow himself to be caught up in a pack of lies?

    He lies when he doesn’t even need to. It’s ridiculous. Silly man.
  • Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    I like Johnson, he's a good party leader and Prime Minister, he's been a good politician for decades. I think he'll go down in history as one of our three most important postwar PMs (along with Attlee and Thatcher, Churchill's importance was during the war).

    But I would not for one second call him trustworthy. He's a politician and do you know how to tell when a politician is lying? Their lips are moving.

    I wouldn't call any PM we have had in my life "trustworthy". Every single one of them obfuscates, spins and does whatever they can. It's what we expect from politicians.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,477

    Mail still plugging away....but it's not their lead:


    That seems odd to me.

    Is this is dummy swerve and a later edition has an absolute bombshell?
    The cars story is senseless. As I say upthread, my car already does the things it describes, presumably legally?
    Did you miss the story about the self-driving car that crashed in Texas (think it was there)?
    I did miss that, but this story isn’t really about fully self-driving cars in any case. If I turn Lane Assist and Adaptive Cruise Control on in my car, it keeps itself in lane and automatically slows down and speeds up to maintain a safe consistent distance with the car ahead. If it comes into a traffic jam, it will stop, then start itself up again when the traffic moves.

    It drives itself, on the motorway.

    The manufacturer includes a sensor to stop me removing my hands and reading the paper, but only because it would presumably be illegal technology otherwise?
This discussion has been closed.