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Rishi still favourite to be next PM though not as strong a one as he was – politicalbetting.com

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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    MaxPB said:

    Interesting combination of policy choices in Germany at the moment. Apparently, their healthcare authorities are getting panicky about exponential case growth, tidal waves of patients swamping hospitals, etc. etc. At the same time, sunshine holidays to the Balearics are starting up again. Go figure.

    I repeat what I said this morning, I don't understand where the German reputation for competence comes from. The above seems completely stupid.
    I don't understand what they're playing at either. That said, Germany's per capita death rate from Covid-19 is approximately half as great as ours, and the gap seems unlikely to narrow substantially. Whilst I've previously suggested that we really need to go and learn from some of the East Asian countries rather than the neighbours at the end of all of this, the Germans are nonetheless clearly getting some things more right than we are.
    But they seem to be repeating our mistakes from September which is what lined up our horrible winter with the worst second wave in Europe.
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    Time_to_LeaveTime_to_Leave Posts: 2,547
    Leon said:

    Jesus. That's not a great look, tho, is it? Taken alongside the odd interviews.

    Can America cope with ANOTHER president crumbling in front of their eyes? Will they learn to elect younger men and women, instead?


    I feel terribly sorry for Biden, of course, if he is in steep decline: and it does look like he might be

    The other angle is even worse. Sad. I hope I'm wrong

    https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1372938131339628544?s=20
    I think Biden is displaying worrying signs elsewhere, but what I see there is leather soled shoes vs carpet on steep wobbly stairs.
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    StockyStocky Posts: 9,718
    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
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    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Interesting combination of policy choices in Germany at the moment. Apparently, their healthcare authorities are getting panicky about exponential case growth, tidal waves of patients swamping hospitals, etc. etc. At the same time, sunshine holidays to the Balearics are starting up again. Go figure.

    I repeat what I said this morning, I don't understand where the German reputation for competence comes from. The above seems completely stupid.
    I don't understand what they're playing at either. That said, Germany's per capita death rate from Covid-19 is approximately half as great as ours, and the gap seems unlikely to narrow substantially. Whilst I've previously suggested that we really need to go and learn from some of the East Asian countries rather than the neighbours at the end of all of this, the Germans are nonetheless clearly getting some things more right than we are.
    But they seem to be repeating our mistakes from September which is what lined up our horrible winter with the worst second wave in Europe.
    That's also a fair point. I think we're all going to be keeping our fingers crossed that warm, sunny weather comes charging over the hill shortly to help stamp on this bastard virus - but some will be needing the help more than others.
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    MattWMattW Posts: 18,525
    edited March 2021

    MaxPB said:

    Interesting combination of policy choices in Germany at the moment. Apparently, their healthcare authorities are getting panicky about exponential case growth, tidal waves of patients swamping hospitals, etc. etc. At the same time, sunshine holidays to the Balearics are starting up again. Go figure.

    I repeat what I said this morning, I don't understand where the German reputation for competence comes from. The above seems completely stupid.
    I don't understand what they're playing at either. That said, Germany's per capita death rate from Covid-19 is approximately half as great as ours, and the gap seems unlikely to narrow substantially. Whilst I've previously suggested that we really need to go and learn from some of the East Asian countries rather than the neighbours at the end of all of this, the Germans are nonetheless clearly getting some things more right than we are.
    I'd disagree there I think.

    To avoid substantially catching up they will need to be firmly locked down until perhaps 30% of the population are vaccinated. That is perhaps going to mean two months or even more.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Interesting combination of policy choices in Germany at the moment. Apparently, their healthcare authorities are getting panicky about exponential case growth, tidal waves of patients swamping hospitals, etc. etc. At the same time, sunshine holidays to the Balearics are starting up again. Go figure.

    I repeat what I said this morning, I don't understand where the German reputation for competence comes from. The above seems completely stupid.
    I don't understand what they're playing at either. That said, Germany's per capita death rate from Covid-19 is approximately half as great as ours, and the gap seems unlikely to narrow substantially. Whilst I've previously suggested that we really need to go and learn from some of the East Asian countries rather than the neighbours at the end of all of this, the Germans are nonetheless clearly getting some things more right than we are.
    But they seem to be repeating our mistakes from September which is what lined up our horrible winter with the worst second wave in Europe.
    It was Germany that really put momentum behind the "suspend AZ" disaster, as well. The Paul Ehrlich Institute for Fucking Up Vaccine Drives Around The World.

    It has given me a very new perspective on our German friends. I still admire much they do, but, hmmm
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,610
    The big question is whether, if we'd voted to Remain, the EU would be listening to our advice on vaccines at the moment.
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,377
    Leon said:

    UK vaccinations

    image
    image
    image
    image

    Lovely to see. Shame it can't last til we get everyone done, but let us celebrate what we have here. 1% of the country in a day. Phenomenal


    I wonder if it can go higher til we hit the shortage at the end of the month?
    We have, apparently, 12 million second jabs to do in April.

    Which, by itself is an *average* of 400K per day. 2.8 million per week.

    Which means, with even a trickle of first vaccinations, a very high rate. Better than the last couple of "low" weeks.

    I think that people are misunderstanding what the "shortage" is about. The hope was to get a sufficient supply (India etc) so that first jabs could continue at high level in parallel to the second jab "wave" that is coming. This has now been delayed.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,610
    MaxPB said:

    Interesting combination of policy choices in Germany at the moment. Apparently, their healthcare authorities are getting panicky about exponential case growth, tidal waves of patients swamping hospitals, etc. etc. At the same time, sunshine holidays to the Balearics are starting up again. Go figure.

    I repeat what I said this morning, I don't understand where the German reputation for competence comes from. The above seems completely stupid.
    There's been a problem with several large construction projects in Germany recently, such as the new Berlin airport and the Hamburg opera house. A problem meaning more than 10 years overdue in the case of the airport.
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,150
    It's too cold to be called a banana republic, but ...
     
     
    We can now disclose that the Crown Office is doing a clear-up job, seeking to expunge remnants of Salmond’s evidence from the internet. It has ordered The Spectator to make further redactions to the Salmond submission. If we fail to comply, we have been advised that we could face penalties in excess of £50,000 (there is no cap), plus huge legal costs we would not recoup even if we win in court. It’s quite a risk, so we must consider removing Salmond’s evidence from our website.

    We take solace in the fact it has been available for all to read for many weeks now, and especially over the crucial period when Salmond and Sturgeon gave evidence to the Holyrood inquiry. This underlines the absurdity of the Crown Office’s jackboot approach to a free press, in pursuit of an agenda which suits its political masters.

    Happily, the original text remains published by an internet archive service in California, which permanently stores internet pages. This service is valued by researchers who seek originals of documents censored by authoritarian regimes. The Crown Office, as part of its clean-up operation, told us to delete this version too. Luckily this is not in our gift.
     
     
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crown-office-the-spectator-and-a-fight-for-a-free-press
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    Tricky one, though. Many people may think as you do, but then think some more and, well, do they want to diss the Queen?
    I guarantee you that most people - a very clear majority - would not appreciate their neighbour sticking a great big "patriotic" flag on the roof. They'd probably not make a fuss, for fear of kicking off a feud, but the feeling would be disapproval not approval. C'mon. We all know this. So that survey is a piece of nonsense.
    A bit of context. During a Jubilee or a sporting event, I often fly a Union Jack or England flag, but all year round I wouldn't.
    Yep. That's, I think, where Middle England is on this. I push the envelope a little (at my age) with my England shirt but I'm comfortable with that during a World Cup or the Euros. I would NOT wear it outside those times. I doubt many on here would either, regardless of how they vote.
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    MaxPB said:

    MaxPB said:

    Interesting combination of policy choices in Germany at the moment. Apparently, their healthcare authorities are getting panicky about exponential case growth, tidal waves of patients swamping hospitals, etc. etc. At the same time, sunshine holidays to the Balearics are starting up again. Go figure.

    I repeat what I said this morning, I don't understand where the German reputation for competence comes from. The above seems completely stupid.
    I don't understand what they're playing at either. That said, Germany's per capita death rate from Covid-19 is approximately half as great as ours, and the gap seems unlikely to narrow substantially. Whilst I've previously suggested that we really need to go and learn from some of the East Asian countries rather than the neighbours at the end of all of this, the Germans are nonetheless clearly getting some things more right than we are.
    But they seem to be repeating our mistakes from September which is what lined up our horrible winter with the worst second wave in Europe.
    Tragically our second wave isn't even close to worst in Europe.

    Portugese healthcare collapsed in January and the Czech's now. Italy and more ... The issue in some countries is it's so bad they don't know how bad it is. Very, very tragic situation that we were fortunate to avoid.
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,329

    I just went for a cone-beam scan at a private clinic.

    I was asked (new thing, they said, come in this month) whether there was any possibility I was pregnant - they told me they now have to ask - and whether I had any preferred pronouns.

    I said absolutely not and I couldn't care less what people call me. I didn't want to grace the question with a response so left it blank on the consent form and ignored it.

    She was clearly embarrassed to ask, and said it was a sign of the times. I said hopefully the madness will end one day, and then we both laughed.

    If I'm ever asked for my preferred pronouns, I'm going find myself in quite the pickle. Should I go with iste, ista, istud, the idiomatic form for directing a prosecuting orator's scorn at a defendant, or ὅδε, ἥδε, τόδε, the proximal deictic announcing the arrival of a new character on the tragic stage? It's going to be tough to decide.
    When you write such linguistically rich posts like that I come away thinking you're a right-wing version of @Dura_Ace !
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    eek said:
    Yes they will, but winning it isn't the point as the unionist parties don't actually want rid of her just yet.

    Having the vote reinforces the 'Sturgeon fighting to survive' narrative in the media and also forces the Greens to publicly save her bacon, tying them to an obviously corrupt administration.

    Damaging the SNP enough to prevent them gaining a majority is the goal here, Sturgeon clinging on amid a crisis is a damn good way of acheiving that.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,612

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    On my road I have three houses flying flags. One Union Jack, one Liver Bird and one Unite.

    For obvious reasons I feel closer to two of those than the other, but I respect and don't judge any of them.

    The one with the Liver Bird went flag crazy when we won the Premier League, flying the flag of every single country of every player in the squad. A lot of flags!
    I used to live next to a guy who had a big flagpole in his back garden and change the flag every week. Mrs U and I always used to look out for what it was and see if we could guess what the flag represented.
    You did well to be able to find a buyer for the house!
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    Philip_ThompsonPhilip_Thompson Posts: 65,826
    edited March 2021
    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    Tricky one, though. Many people may think as you do, but then think some more and, well, do they want to diss the Queen?
    I guarantee you that most people - a very clear majority - would not appreciate their neighbour sticking a great big "patriotic" flag on the roof. They'd probably not make a fuss, for fear of kicking off a feud, but the feeling would be disapproval not approval. C'mon. We all know this. So that survey is a piece of nonsense.
    A bit of context. During a Jubilee or a sporting event, I often fly a Union Jack or England flag, but all year round I wouldn't.
    Yep. That's, I think, where Middle England is on this. I push the envelope a little (at my age) with my England shirt but I'm comfortable with that during a World Cup or the Euros. I would NOT wear it outside those times. I doubt many on here would either, regardless of how they vote.
    Why not?

    I'll happily go out in my England shirt or Liverpool or Tranmere Rovers shirt. Why wouldn't I?

    Honestly you sound like a conceited judgementalitist Mary Whitehouse throwback with a stick up your arse.

    Are we supposed to go to the shops or the pub in a shirt, jacket and tie in your eyes?
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115

    Leon said:

    Jesus. That's not a great look, tho, is it? Taken alongside the odd interviews.

    Can America cope with ANOTHER president crumbling in front of their eyes? Will they learn to elect younger men and women, instead?


    I feel terribly sorry for Biden, of course, if he is in steep decline: and it does look like he might be

    The other angle is even worse. Sad. I hope I'm wrong

    https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1372938131339628544?s=20
    I think Biden is displaying worrying signs elsewhere, but what I see there is leather soled shoes vs carpet on steep wobbly stairs.
    I still think he let the cat out the bag when he "misspoke" the other day about "President Harris".

    The 25th by the end of the year looks a rather likely outcome. And Trump will go ape-shit that Biden's condition was known about - and kept from the voters. Harris is in the White House even though people might not have wanted her over him, he will rage. Polling on that will be interesting.
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    NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,334
    edited March 2021
    Partick East/Kelvindale (4-member ward, 20000 voters) reportedly won last night by Labour on a 10% first preference swing on a decent 30% turnout, both SNP and Tory vote down. The seat is mostly Glasgow North, held by the SNP in 2019 with a 15% margin over Labour. Sarwar factor?

    Had been predicted as an SNP gain from an ex-Tory. http://ballotbox.scot/partick-kelvindale-by-election-2021

    Full result is here

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partick_East/Kelvindale_(ward)

    Interesting to look at the 2nd preferences. Con and LibDem swung heavily to Labour Greens more marginally to SNP.
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,860
    Hartlepool By Election

    Con 2.02

    Lab 1.96
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    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Andy_JS said:

    The big question is whether, if we'd voted to Remain, the EU would be listening to our advice on vaccines at the moment.

    If we had gone it alone in the alternate timeline like we did in reality, then no. But most probably we would've been cajoled into joining the centralized procurement scheme like everyone else did, in which case we'd have no advice to give.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115

    Partick East/Kelvindale (4-member ward, 20000 voters) reportedly won last night by Labour on a 10% first preference swing on a decent 30% turnout, both SNP and Tory vote down. The seat is mostly Glasgow North, held by the SNP in 2019 with a 15% margin over Labour. Sarwar factor?

    Had been predicted as an SNP gain from an ex-Tory. http://ballotbox.scot/partick-kelvindale-by-election-2021

    The Unionist vote getting its shit together....
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,612
    rcs1000 said:

    I just went for a cone-beam scan at a private clinic.

    I was asked (new thing, they said, come in this month) whether there was any possibility I was pregnant - they told me they now have to ask - and whether I had any preferred pronouns.

    I said absolutely not and I couldn't care less what people call me. I didn't want to grace the question with a response so left it blank on the consent form and ignored it.

    She was clearly embarrassed to ask, and said it was a sign of the times. I said hopefully the madness will end one day, and then we both laughed.

    You should do what I do, and be an equal opportunities idiot. I refer to everyone as "it".
    "Comrade"
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,329
    @Foxy Nice pic.

    I've also got a pair of trunks like that. I just wish my torso was that ripped.

    You're doing superbly for your age.
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    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,534
    dixiedean said:

    dixiedean said:

    Interesting story in Guardian regarding the recipients of furlough money. Wonder if there is more to come and whether anyone will care?

    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/mar/19/uk-furlough-scheme-pays-out-millions-to-foreign-states-and-tax-exiles

    I struggle to get very annoyed by story of rich person, who owns a business, legally claimed money from a scheme designed to support workers in order for their workers to be paid. Its quite different if they were trousering the money, which some unscrupulous people have done.

    No matter how personally wealth the business owner has, I don't expect them to be self funding their workforce for a year, while the government imposes sanctions which mean their business can't operate.
    Must admit that was my initial reaction. Hence my "will anybody care?"
    However, it has the potential, and currently no more than potential, for questions to be asked when the bills need to be paid by Joe and Joanne Public.
    The system, inevitably, took no account of the morals of applicants or beneficiaries. How on earth could Rishi's legislation have distinguished between worthy and unworthy applicants and beneficiaries? Excluding pole dancers and bookies' runners? The staff of Duke of Devonshire? Importers of coking coal? A Grauniad non story.

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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    TimT said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimT said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    A devastating report from Compass exposes the near-impossibility of Labour winning alone at the next election. We divide, they conquer, by Grace Barnett and Neal Lawson, shows Labour now needs at least a 10.52% swing, greater than in 1945 and 1997.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/18/labour-electoral-system-priti-patel-mayoral-elections

    I see that report is repeating tired old canards about progressive alliances and changing the voting system.

    When is Labour going to actually engage with the electorate as it is to, you know, win votes?
    I will get round to finishing the header I'm working on, but Hartlepool will likely add to Labour's woes on just how and where to fight the next election. Essentially, if you say the Tories and Labour are each going to put resources into 100 seats, the Tories can put that into 80 on defence and 20 on offence. Labour has to put it into 100 on attack - and even then, they have to leapfrog some of their low-hanging fruit and go for medium-difficult targets. And unless fortunes change dramatically for the SNP, it won't be in Scotland.

    Labour has to hope that the political tide goes so far in their favour that it swamps the Tory defences.

    Or accept that they will not win power in less than 2 attempts.
    Hartlepool coming into play is absolutely fascinating but it's unlikely to damage Labour. The balance of risk is the other way. It's Brexit Central, stuffed full of white working class patriots, each and every one of them imbued with love of country and good old-fashioned commonsense, and the timing could not be better for the government. Brexit is done and looking inspired due to the EU vaccine shambles. By contrast our own vaccine efforts are paying off in spades, motoring us out of lockdown before other countries, liberties taken about to be restored. If the Tories, the party of hard leave, can't win in Hartlepool, the capital of hard leave, at this time, in these circumstances, it will be telling us the tide is turning and opposition beckons before too long. They need to win it (and convincingly) to retain control of the narrative. By this analysis, which imo is the right one, the pressure is all on them. It's something of a free hit for Labour.
    Nice try. But an opposition party losing a seat to the governing party is still rarer than rocking-horse shit.

    But if another dozen Red Wall Labour MPs would like to resign to give Labour some "free hits" - they know where the Chiltern Hundreds are....
    Sure, but this is a very particular scenario and the result has potentially huge ramifications for where our domestic politics is heading.

    If Labour win here, the most Brexity of seats, so soon after Brexit and with it looking to the untrained eye to be a great decision, it will mean Europe is losing its salience as an issue driving votes and that by the time of the next GE it will barely feature. Plus Corbyn has gone, remember, and will be a distant memory by then. Labour now has a leader that, dull or not, most people can envisage as PM. This hasn't happened since 2010.

    It will leave just one of the 3 key factors from the "BBC" election of Dec 19 still in play. "Boris". Can he carry that load? Can this political magician do it again, even after 5 years in power and with the economy in the toilet? I yield to no-one in my recognition of his powers, the guy's a vote magnet in the places that count, but I'm not so sure he can.

    So that's the big story. A Labour win. If the Cons take it, it's a shrug and business as usual.
    Total bollocks. If Starmer can’t win back a northern, traditionally Labour seat like Hartlepool, after seven zillion years of Tory government, then his leadership is in trouble. Simply the case. People won’t just ‘shrug’.

    Yes there are complicating factors that make it somewhat harder. But, he should still win it

    FWIW I think Labour will succeed
    This is the traditional analysis but it's no longer applicable in the new politics forged by the 2016 EU Referendum and its aftermath. If the Tories can't win here, a triumphant Brexit just pocketed, they are losing their grip on what won them their GE majority - their consolidation and ownership of the Leave political identity, transcending class. Which means big trouble for them, since they offer little else except the "Boris" act. If Labour win this seat in May, Starmer will not quite be measuring up the curtains for number 10, but he will be immensely heartened, trust me.
    Lol. Holding one of their own seats 11 years into Opposition that even Corbyn managed not to lose would be 'immensely heartening'? How Labour's ambitions have been etiolated by defeat - I remember when they used to be a national party. Now they're barely a regional one...
    I've explained why I'm viewing it the way I am. We have a new politics now. The Cons have merged with Leave and they need to retain ownership of it. If they don't it's hard to see where they go. What are the Cons without Leave? That's a rhetorical question because I know you can't answer it. Nobody can. They'll still be "Boris", yes, but that's no basis for the future. Imagine having your fortunes dependent on him. Talk about precarious. No, tough times ahead for the party, methinks, if they lose their Leave USP. Like the GOP without MAGA, they'll be faced with a long and arduous rebuilding process from the bottom up.
    Actually, I'd say atm that the Cons are the only UK party of genuine optimism. SNP, maybe, but in a very dour way. Optimism and hope are good for political parties, at least until self-belief in the vision is lost.
    That comes from the 2 Bs in the BBC election. "Boris" has a 'sunny side up' persona but that's all that is - a persona. And then Brexit. For Remainers, it's damage limitation. Only true beLeavers see a great future coming from it. By the next GE, both of these Bs could be losing lustre. I think they will be. There's a fine line between optimism and simple-minded delusion.
    I think it is truly sad for you if you believe your last sentence without any form of qualification. Human life is only bearable with hope and optimism. They can be sustaining in truly dark times, when all others believe the optimists to be delusional. Who best survived Auschwitz - the optimists or the pessimists?
    But it needs to be based on something credible. I find 'ra ra' sentiment, in the absence of that, rather shallow and exploitative. For example, these celebs who say to their followers, "Never give up on your dream. You can do anything if you put your mind to it." A bit of that goes a long long way with me. But I AM an optimist. For example, I just knew that Trump was heading for a fall. I knew this world was not so grim as to be one where America gave him another term. I have faith in human nature.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298

    Belatedly catching up with the enjoyable vibrancy debate downthread. I broadly agree with Casino that the ideal is variety without any one community dominating everyone else. Replacing one monoculture by another isn't much fun.

    It's difficult, though. The tendency in all cities around Europe that I've seen is for foreigners to cluster. I used to get impatient with Brits in Basel who ignored Fasnacht (the quite unique variety of carnival) but would never miss a football transmission at the English-Speaking Club. But it was a comfort blanket for them - even some who'd lived there a long time. In the same way, U imagine that a Bangladeshi coming to Britain would think it a lot more natural to live in Tower Hamlets than Godalming - contacts, birth language and familiar culture.

    It does break down in large parts of London - in Holloway I enjoyed the really bewildering mix, so you stopped thinking "Oh, there's a Sikh" and just looked at everyone as individual humans. So maybe with time...

    And no, I've never thought of Godalming Pizza Express as cultural diversity :)

    Not even the American Hot?

    Have to say, Nick, what surprised (not to say triggered) me was your use of the word "ethnic" which wouldn't have been out of place on the lips of Warren Mitchell's famous character (no, not Willy Loman in Death of a Salesman).
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    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995
    Leon said:

    Jesus. That's not a great look, tho, is it? Taken alongside the odd interviews.

    Can America cope with ANOTHER president crumbling in front of their eyes? Will they learn to elect younger men and women, instead?


    I feel terribly sorry for Biden, of course, if he is in steep decline: and it does look like he might be

    The other angle is even worse. Sad. I hope I'm wrong

    https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1372938131339628544?s=20
    We seem to have gone from a President who was always all over the news and a dominant personality, despite being divisive to a President who is near invisible, does not provoke major feelings either way and when he does come out seems to be a doddery grandpa.

    In some respects a good thing in terms of healing America but not good for US power projection abroad.

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    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,847
    The last time I checked a Biden video which was held up as an example of advanced senility...I found him considerably more lucid than Boris.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150

    Leon said:

    Jesus. That's not a great look, tho, is it? Taken alongside the odd interviews.

    Can America cope with ANOTHER president crumbling in front of their eyes? Will they learn to elect younger men and women, instead?


    I feel terribly sorry for Biden, of course, if he is in steep decline: and it does look like he might be

    The other angle is even worse. Sad. I hope I'm wrong

    https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1372938131339628544?s=20
    I think Biden is displaying worrying signs elsewhere, but what I see there is leather soled shoes vs carpet on steep wobbly stairs.
    I still think he let the cat out the bag when he "misspoke" the other day about "President Harris".

    The 25th by the end of the year looks a rather likely outcome. And Trump will go ape-shit that Biden's condition was known about - and kept from the voters. Harris is in the White House even though people might not have wanted her over him, he will rage. Polling on that will be interesting.
    There are lots of Dems on Twitter saying it is distasteful and absurd to speculate on Biden's mental/physical health, when he just "stumbled". That would be fine if they hadn't spent months speculating on Donald Trump in the exact same way, including the notorious time he walked slowly down a ramp

    Including, I am sad to say, Joe Biden himself. A moment that has NOT aged well

    https://twitter.com/SaraGonzalesTX/status/1372950597171838982?s=20
  • Options
    BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    I just went for a cone-beam scan at a private clinic.

    I was asked (new thing, they said, come in this month) whether there was any possibility I was pregnant - they told me they now have to ask - and whether I had any preferred pronouns.

    I said absolutely not and I couldn't care less what people call me. I didn't want to grace the question with a response so left it blank on the consent form and ignored it.

    She was clearly embarrassed to ask, and said it was a sign of the times. I said hopefully the madness will end one day, and then we both laughed.

    If I'm ever asked for my preferred pronouns, I'm going find myself in quite the pickle. Should I go with iste, ista, istud, the idiomatic form for directing a prosecuting orator's scorn at a defendant, or ὅδε, ἥδε, τόδε, the proximal deictic announcing the arrival of a new character on the tragic stage? It's going to be tough to decide.
    When you write such linguistically rich posts like that I come away thinking you're a right-wing version of @Dura_Ace !
    Nice of you to say, but Dura swallows Jane's, I swallow lexica ... there's not really all that much difference in the procedure!
  • Options
    FloaterFloater Posts: 14,195
    Germany ramps up efforts to vaccinate population

    https://twitter.com/TheLocalGermany/status/1372959563314384896

  • Options
    algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 10,534

    Hartlepool By Election

    Con 2.02

    Lab 1.96

    About right I think. Labour to scape home.

    The odds that are far too close is most seats in GE. Tories are narrow odds on favourite, I think they should be shorter.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Fun with flags time, kids.

    What is this one behind Mr Grimes?

    https://twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1372854107585839110

    It's the 'Canzuk' shield but the red stars of the NZ Southern Cross appear to have been slightly bleached by DG's tears.
    A sneaky nod to White Power? Or less viscerally, the "chaps we can trust"?
    You're a strange one.

    Do you think the European Union is a nod to White Power?

    Do you think CANZUK has more, less or similar level of "whiteness" to the European Union?
    You're being too reductive and literal. These mindsets don't work like that. You have to ask why somebody like Grimes is flying the CANZUK shield. I'm sure you don't (do you?) so WTF is he and ilk doing it? I suggest it's for similar reasons that people in the States fly the Dixie flag. This is not to advertise a desire to refight the Civil War. It's to show support for a set of values. A set of values that encompass a high degree of nostalgia for a bygone age and the old ways. A set of values that in many cases are at the very least tinged with racism. It could be, I'm musing here but at the same time it's a little more than musing, that the CANZUK shield is becoming our version of the Confederate flag for our version of those Americans who choose to fly it. In which case, good, because it is a "tell". It's better to know than to not know.
    Kinabalu, the Sinfinder General. Pricking the victims, to see if they bleed. Drooling as they strip
    It's simply that I lack the peculiar mindset required to assume that anything short of KKK white sheets and hanging trees is not racist. And I note no substantive counter-argument yet offered by anybody as to why somebody like Darren Grimes would be flying this flag. He's from Durham.
    Why would half the members of the Labour Party be flying the Palestinian flag when they're from Islington?
    Great question and the answer supports my insight. For many (although not all) it is a general values statement rather than being specific to Palestine. It says to the world, "I am an anti-imperialist. I hate the west." Ditto with many symbols. The Dixie flag. The CANZUK shield. Which is where we came in. If you think everyone who flies that flag is simply and only campaigning for free movement in the White Commonwealth with no hinterland of nostalgia tinged with racism, I have a bridge to sell you.
    What on earth is the "White Commonwealth"?
    https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/White_Commonwealth
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 116,995

    Leon said:

    Jesus. That's not a great look, tho, is it? Taken alongside the odd interviews.

    Can America cope with ANOTHER president crumbling in front of their eyes? Will they learn to elect younger men and women, instead?


    I feel terribly sorry for Biden, of course, if he is in steep decline: and it does look like he might be

    The other angle is even worse. Sad. I hope I'm wrong

    https://twitter.com/DailyCaller/status/1372938131339628544?s=20
    I think Biden is displaying worrying signs elsewhere, but what I see there is leather soled shoes vs carpet on steep wobbly stairs.
    I still think he let the cat out the bag when he "misspoke" the other day about "President Harris".

    The 25th by the end of the year looks a rather likely outcome. And Trump will go ape-shit that Biden's condition was known about - and kept from the voters. Harris is in the White House even though people might not have wanted her over him, he will rage. Polling on that will be interesting.
    Trump v Harris 2024 would be the culture wars in full, no middle ground there.

    A younger candidate like Joe Kennedy III or Beto O'Rourke would be better for the Democrats if they win the Massachusetts and Texas governors races in 2022
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,525
    geoffw said:

    It's too cold to be called a banana republic, but ...
     
     

    We can now disclose that the Crown Office is doing a clear-up job, seeking to expunge remnants of Salmond’s evidence from the internet. It has ordered The Spectator to make further redactions to the Salmond submission. If we fail to comply, we have been advised that we could face penalties in excess of £50,000 (there is no cap), plus huge legal costs we would not recoup even if we win in court. It’s quite a risk, so we must consider removing Salmond’s evidence from our website.

    We take solace in the fact it has been available for all to read for many weeks now, and especially over the crucial period when Salmond and Sturgeon gave evidence to the Holyrood inquiry. This underlines the absurdity of the Crown Office’s jackboot approach to a free press, in pursuit of an agenda which suits its political masters.

    Happily, the original text remains published by an internet archive service in California, which permanently stores internet pages. This service is valued by researchers who seek originals of documents censored by authoritarian regimes. The Crown Office, as part of its clean-up operation, told us to delete this version too. Luckily this is not in our gift.
     
     
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crown-office-the-spectator-and-a-fight-for-a-free-press

    Where are jurisdictions on this?

    Does the Crown Office have any over an English publication?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150
    edited March 2021
    MattW said:

    geoffw said:

    It's too cold to be called a banana republic, but ...
     
     

    We can now disclose that the Crown Office is doing a clear-up job, seeking to expunge remnants of Salmond’s evidence from the internet. It has ordered The Spectator to make further redactions to the Salmond submission. If we fail to comply, we have been advised that we could face penalties in excess of £50,000 (there is no cap), plus huge legal costs we would not recoup even if we win in court. It’s quite a risk, so we must consider removing Salmond’s evidence from our website.

    We take solace in the fact it has been available for all to read for many weeks now, and especially over the crucial period when Salmond and Sturgeon gave evidence to the Holyrood inquiry. This underlines the absurdity of the Crown Office’s jackboot approach to a free press, in pursuit of an agenda which suits its political masters.

    Happily, the original text remains published by an internet archive service in California, which permanently stores internet pages. This service is valued by researchers who seek originals of documents censored by authoritarian regimes. The Crown Office, as part of its clean-up operation, told us to delete this version too. Luckily this is not in our gift.
     
     
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crown-office-the-spectator-and-a-fight-for-a-free-press
    Where are jurisdictions on this?

    Does the Crown Office have any over an English publication?

    ******

    Yes, I don't understand how a Scottish "office" can enforce censorship on a magazine in England
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Floater said:

    Germany ramps up efforts to vaccinate population

    https://twitter.com/TheLocalGermany/status/1372959563314384896

    My understanding was that a big part of the problem with the German authorities' wobbly attitudes towards AZ is that it was the vaccine intended to permit the GP phase of the rollout, because of ease of storage.

    It's quite possible that they won't get through an (already pathetic) 20 appointments per week, but about 2 - because the rest of the lucky recipients will be no-shows.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    tbf many people said it wasn't and that transmissibility amongst that age group was low.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Been suffering from dial up speeds to the internet for the past two days.

    SKY looked into it. BT had done some work on the system - and not reset it properly. Thanks BT. Thanks a bunch...
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 24,979

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    I would be waiting until Wednesday of next week before saying that outloud but it doesn't seem to have resulted in the spreading event that was feared.

    And I'm not surprised infections have fallen slower than the other figures - we are doing double the number of tests we were doing 2 weeks ago and that is going to pick up any children who wouldn't otherwise have shown any symptons.
  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    TOPPING said:

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    tbf many people said it wasn't and that transmissibility amongst that age group was low.
    Well, they weren't saying that when the kids went back for a day!
  • Options
    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    This week will be the week we see an uptick in testing.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    Chameleon said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    The fact that you're struggling so much to comprehend that not everyone hates the national flag, despite having polling data proving you to be very wrong is an apt summation of Labour's current issues: for the party to win, the activists need to lose.
    I'm merely casting doubt on a survey that says a clear majority of the country actually APPROVE of people flying the Union Jack on their house. I just think that's a nonsense. I'm surprised anybody on here bar the real fruities disagrees with me on this tbh.
  • Options
    Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    TOPPING said:

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    tbf many people said it wasn't and that transmissibility amongst that age group was low.
    Perhaps its simply the case that most or all of the super-spreader events were happening in hospitals and care homes, and getting the staff vaccinated has largely wiped those incidents out? But we're all still guessing, aren't we?
  • Options
    sarissasarissa Posts: 1,776
    algarkirk said:

    Hartlepool By Election

    Con 2.02

    Lab 1.96

    About right I think. Labour to scape home.

    The odds that are far too close is most seats in GE. Tories are narrow odds on favourite, I think they should be shorter.
    And in related news, NOM in Scottish election down to evens at Ladbrokes. Was 11/4 recently.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    Of course I'd be delighted. Alas, conservation area regulations and issues of listed building consent might sadly lead them to a more subdued display of their patriotic enthusiasm. You know how it is.
    :smile: - Quite. I get you. Say no more.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298

    TOPPING said:

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    tbf many people said it wasn't and that transmissibility amongst that age group was low.
    Perhaps its simply the case that most or all of the super-spreader events were happening in hospitals and care homes, and getting the staff vaccinated has largely wiped those incidents out? But we're all still guessing, aren't we?
    Yep but I remember many times the scientists opined on transmissibility in schools as being low. Albeit the one day back was presumably the result of fear of the variant.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,525
    edited March 2021
    Leon said:

    MattW said:

    geoffw said:

    It's too cold to be called a banana republic, but ...
     
     

    We can now disclose that the Crown Office is doing a clear-up job, seeking to expunge remnants of Salmond’s evidence from the internet. It has ordered The Spectator to make further redactions to the Salmond submission. If we fail to comply, we have been advised that we could face penalties in excess of £50,000 (there is no cap), plus huge legal costs we would not recoup even if we win in court. It’s quite a risk, so we must consider removing Salmond’s evidence from our website.

    We take solace in the fact it has been available for all to read for many weeks now, and especially over the crucial period when Salmond and Sturgeon gave evidence to the Holyrood inquiry. This underlines the absurdity of the Crown Office’s jackboot approach to a free press, in pursuit of an agenda which suits its political masters.

    Happily, the original text remains published by an internet archive service in California, which permanently stores internet pages. This service is valued by researchers who seek originals of documents censored by authoritarian regimes. The Crown Office, as part of its clean-up operation, told us to delete this version too. Luckily this is not in our gift.
     
     
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/the-crown-office-the-spectator-and-a-fight-for-a-free-press
    Where are jurisdictions on this?

    Does the Crown Office have any over an English publication?
    ******

    Yes, I don't understand how a Scottish "office" can enforce censorship on a magazine in England
    -----------------
    The only straw in the wind is that Joanne Cherry and Great Jumping Jolyon succeeded in suing then Govt, but the Spectator footprint in Scotland is limited to online readers for that particular content.

    Though "can read it via the internet" has long been an argument in defamation cases.
  • Options
    rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 58,216

    Floater said:

    Germany ramps up efforts to vaccinate population

    https://twitter.com/TheLocalGermany/status/1372959563314384896

    My understanding was that a big part of the problem with the German authorities' wobbly attitudes towards AZ is that it was the vaccine intended to permit the GP phase of the rollout, because of ease of storage.

    It's quite possible that they won't get through an (already pathetic) 20 appointments per week, but about 2 - because the rest of the lucky recipients will be no-shows.
    Take your time guys, you have all the time in the world...
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    MattW said:

    kinabalu said:

    MattW said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Fun with flags time, kids.

    What is this one behind Mr Grimes?

    https://twitter.com/talkRADIO/status/1372854107585839110

    It's the 'Canzuk' shield but the red stars of the NZ Southern Cross appear to have been slightly bleached by DG's tears.
    A sneaky nod to White Power? Or less viscerally, the "chaps we can trust"?
    You're a strange one.

    Do you think the European Union is a nod to White Power?

    Do you think CANZUK has more, less or similar level of "whiteness" to the European Union?
    You're being too reductive and literal. These mindsets don't work like that. You have to ask why somebody like Grimes is flying the CANZUK shield. I'm sure you don't (do you?) so WTF is he and ilk doing it? I suggest it's for similar reasons that people in the States fly the Dixie flag. This is not to advertise a desire to refight the Civil War. It's to show support for a set of values. A set of values that encompass a high degree of nostalgia for a bygone age and the old ways. A set of values that in many cases are at the very least tinged with racism. It could be, I'm musing here but at the same time it's a little more than musing, that the CANZUK shield is becoming our version of the Confederate flag for our version of those Americans who choose to fly it. In which case, good, because it is a "tell". It's better to know than to not know.
    Q: Why are you calling Darren Grimes a racist?
    A: Because he's flying the CANZUK flag.
    Q: Why is that racist?
    A: Because racists fly that flag.
    Q: Racists like who?
    A: Darren Grimes.

    See also: St George's cross, the Union Jack.
    Why not show just a little intellectual curiosity about why people do what they do? It won't bring you out in a rash, I promise.
    Remember that Darren Grimes' chair has 4 legs.

    And there are 4 arms on a Swastika.

    He must be a real Nazi.
    :smile: - Oh dear. Tell you what, Matt, if you ask me nicely I'll take notes and report back to you on what the world looks like beyond the end of your nose.
    Just adding a little to the self-satire on this one.

    I think you are nearly in conspiraloon territory today. It's endearing but a little peculiar.
    You just keep an eye out for "CANZUK" symbols and note who is using them. Then we'll see how conspiraloon I'm being.
  • Options
    FoxyFoxy Posts: 44,614

    @Foxy Nice pic.

    I've also got a pair of trunks like that. I just wish my torso was that ripped.

    You're doing superbly for your age.

    Thanks, I try to look after myself. Obviously not everyone gets to see how patriotic I am 😇
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,718
    Foxy said:

    @Foxy Nice pic.

    I've also got a pair of trunks like that. I just wish my torso was that ripped.

    You're doing superbly for your age.

    Thanks, I try to look after myself. Obviously not everyone gets to see how patriotic I am 😇
    Have you got any CANZUK trunks?
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    edited March 2021

    Partick East/Kelvindale (4-member ward, 20000 voters) reportedly won last night by Labour on a 10% first preference swing on a decent 30% turnout, both SNP and Tory vote down. The seat is mostly Glasgow North, held by the SNP in 2019 with a 15% margin over Labour. Sarwar factor?

    Had been predicted as an SNP gain from an ex-Tory. http://ballotbox.scot/partick-kelvindale-by-election-2021

    Full result is here

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Partick_East/Kelvindale_(ward)

    Interesting to look at the 2nd preferences. Con and LibDem swung heavily to Labour Greens more marginally to SNP.

    Other excitable extrapolations from other STV by-elections are available.

    https://twitter.com/BallotBoxScot/status/1372931271400296458?s=20

  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,329
    I think Peter Foster is Faisal Islam's understudy but (a) I wouldn't have a problem with a Swiss style SPS deal and (b) I'm not sure it'd necessarily rule out a US trade deal either, although it might limit it in scope.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150
    kinabalu said:

    Chameleon said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    The fact that you're struggling so much to comprehend that not everyone hates the national flag, despite having polling data proving you to be very wrong is an apt summation of Labour's current issues: for the party to win, the activists need to lose.
    I'm merely casting doubt on a survey that says a clear majority of the country actually APPROVE of people flying the Union Jack on their house. I just think that's a nonsense. I'm surprised anybody on here bar the real fruities disagrees with me on this tbh.
    Do you ever wonder if you're actually a total fucking idiot?

    I get the strange sense that you do. But not often. But you do. Like, once a month or something, you will wake up in a cold lick of sweat, thinking about yourself, and you cringe, deeply and profoundly - but it is so painful you bury it away and then you go back to your normal glibness, and shallowness, and you feel fine.

    I'm right, aren't I?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150
    Probably the most EU-hostile article I have ever seen in the Guardian. Quite savage

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/19/eu-astrazeneca-vaccine-stance-spain-europe-covid
  • Options
    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    Looking at the Speccie editorial on the Scottish situation, I came across this piece on Meghan Markle. Brutal, but funny:

    https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/a-handy-guide-to-marklism
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    EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,976
    It's so cool how some people can apparently dedicate most of their free time to figuring out tiny clues (via flag props etc) as to who is and is not racist, and yet completely miss the mountains of evidence that a leader of a political party they happen to support, might be a tiny bit intolerant towards certain groups.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,662
    edited March 2021
    https://twitter.com/jonathanjosephs/status/1372963968612962306?s=20

    Interesting, Qantas CEO reckons demand for non-stop Oz-UK flights has gone UP because of the pandemic - their number 1 selling international route is Perth-London. And the ME "super connectors" (Emirates/Qatar) aren't going to have much joy - the UK has just suspended flights from Qatar.
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,150
    edited March 2021
    blockquote Durcheinander
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    TimTTimT Posts: 6,328
    kinabalu said:

    TimT said:

    kinabalu said:

    TimT said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    Leon said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    A devastating report from Compass exposes the near-impossibility of Labour winning alone at the next election. We divide, they conquer, by Grace Barnett and Neal Lawson, shows Labour now needs at least a 10.52% swing, greater than in 1945 and 1997.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/mar/18/labour-electoral-system-priti-patel-mayoral-elections

    I see that report is repeating tired old canards about progressive alliances and changing the voting system.

    When is Labour going to actually engage with the electorate as it is to, you know, win votes?
    I will get round to finishing the header I'm working on, but Hartlepool will likely add to Labour's woes on just how and where to fight the next election. Essentially, if you say the Tories and Labour are each going to put resources into 100 seats, the Tories can put that into 80 on defence and 20 on offence. Labour has to put it into 100 on attack - and even then, they have to leapfrog some of their low-hanging fruit and go for medium-difficult targets. And unless fortunes change dramatically for the SNP, it won't be in Scotland.

    Labour has to hope that the political tide goes so far in their favour that it swamps the Tory defences.

    Or accept that they will not win power in less than 2 attempts.
    Hartlepool coming into play is absolutely fascinating but it's unlikely to damage Labour. The balance of risk is the other way. It's Brexit Central, stuffed full of white working class patriots, each and every one of them imbued with love of country and good old-fashioned commonsense, and the timing could not be better for the government. Brexit is done and looking inspired due to the EU vaccine shambles. By contrast our own vaccine efforts are paying off in spades, motoring us out of lockdown before other countries, liberties taken about to be restored. If the Tories, the party of hard leave, can't win in Hartlepool, the capital of hard leave, at this time, in these circumstances, it will be telling us the tide is turning and opposition beckons before too long. They need to win it (and convincingly) to retain control of the narrative. By this analysis, which imo is the right one, the pressure is all on them. It's something of a free hit for Labour.
    Nice try. But an opposition party losing a seat to the governing party is still rarer than rocking-horse shit.

    But if another dozen Red Wall Labour MPs would like to resign to give Labour some "free hits" - they know where the Chiltern Hundreds are....
    Sure, but this is a very particular scenario and the result has potentially huge ramifications for where our domestic politics is heading.

    If Labour win here, the most Brexity of seats, so soon after Brexit and with it looking to the untrained eye to be a great decision, it will mean Europe is losing its salience as an issue driving votes and that by the time of the next GE it will barely feature. Plus Corbyn has gone, remember, and will be a distant memory by then. Labour now has a leader that, dull or not, most people can envisage as PM. This hasn't happened since 2010.

    It will leave just one of the 3 key factors from the "BBC" election of Dec 19 still in play. "Boris". Can he carry that load? Can this political magician do it again, even after 5 years in power and with the economy in the toilet? I yield to no-one in my recognition of his powers, the guy's a vote magnet in the places that count, but I'm not so sure he can.

    So that's the big story. A Labour win. If the Cons take it, it's a shrug and business as usual.
    Total bollocks. If Starmer can’t win back a northern, traditionally Labour seat like Hartlepool, after seven zillion years of Tory government, then his leadership is in trouble. Simply the case. People won’t just ‘shrug’.

    Yes there are complicating factors that make it somewhat harder. But, he should still win it

    FWIW I think Labour will succeed
    This is the traditional analysis but it's no longer applicable in the new politics forged by the 2016 EU Referendum and its aftermath. If the Tories can't win here, a triumphant Brexit just pocketed, they are losing their grip on what won them their GE majority - their consolidation and ownership of the Leave political identity, transcending class. Which means big trouble for them, since they offer little else except the "Boris" act. If Labour win this seat in May, Starmer will not quite be measuring up the curtains for number 10, but he will be immensely heartened, trust me.
    Lol. Holding one of their own seats 11 years into Opposition that even Corbyn managed not to lose would be 'immensely heartening'? How Labour's ambitions have been etiolated by defeat - I remember when they used to be a national party. Now they're barely a regional one...
    I've explained why I'm viewing it the way I am. We have a new politics now. The Cons have merged with Leave and they need to retain ownership of it. If they don't it's hard to see where they go. What are the Cons without Leave? That's a rhetorical question because I know you can't answer it. Nobody can. They'll still be "Boris", yes, but that's no basis for the future. Imagine having your fortunes dependent on him. Talk about precarious. No, tough times ahead for the party, methinks, if they lose their Leave USP. Like the GOP without MAGA, they'll be faced with a long and arduous rebuilding process from the bottom up.
    Actually, I'd say atm that the Cons are the only UK party of genuine optimism. SNP, maybe, but in a very dour way. Optimism and hope are good for political parties, at least until self-belief in the vision is lost.
    That comes from the 2 Bs in the BBC election. "Boris" has a 'sunny side up' persona but that's all that is - a persona. And then Brexit. For Remainers, it's damage limitation. Only true beLeavers see a great future coming from it. By the next GE, both of these Bs could be losing lustre. I think they will be. There's a fine line between optimism and simple-minded delusion.
    I think it is truly sad for you if you believe your last sentence without any form of qualification. Human life is only bearable with hope and optimism. They can be sustaining in truly dark times, when all others believe the optimists to be delusional. Who best survived Auschwitz - the optimists or the pessimists?
    But it needs to be based on something credible. I find 'ra ra' sentiment, in the absence of that, rather shallow and exploitative. For example, these celebs who say to their followers, "Never give up on your dream. You can do anything if you put your mind to it." A bit of that goes a long long way with me. But I AM an optimist. For example, I just knew that Trump was heading for a fall. I knew this world was not so grim as to be one where America gave him another term. I have faith in human nature.
    Perhaps our positions on this are not too far apart. I, too, have faith in human nature, and dislike 'ra ra' sentiment. But I cannot abide fatalistic pessimism and am constantly dismayed by how prevalent it is.
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    BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    edited March 2021
    Foxy said:

    @Foxy Nice pic.

    I've also got a pair of trunks like that. I just wish my torso was that ripped.

    You're doing superbly for your age.

    Thanks, I try to look after myself. Obviously not everyone gets to see how patriotic I am 😇
    Jesus. We've heard of flying the Union Jack, but watch out! Here comes @Foxy in the Union Jock...

    We're all thinking it, but please no flagpole jokes at the back.
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    The words 'first in a series' are enough to strike despair into the most optimistic of natures.

    https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/1372963807916658695?s=20
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,329
    Foxy said:

    @Foxy Nice pic.

    I've also got a pair of trunks like that. I just wish my torso was that ripped.

    You're doing superbly for your age.

    Thanks, I try to look after myself. Obviously not everyone gets to see how patriotic I am 😇
    You tease..
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150

    The words 'first in a series' are enough to strike despair into the most optimistic of natures.

    https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/1372963807916658695?s=20

    Galloway is often a dick, but he is nearly always an articulate dick.

    You never know. It might, to everyone's surprise, actually be OK
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Leon said:

    The words 'first in a series' are enough to strike despair into the most optimistic of natures.

    https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/1372963807916658695?s=20

    Galloway is often a dick, but he is nearly always an articulate dick.

    You never know. It might, to everyone's surprise, actually be OK
    Which one is Ken?
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    I think Peter Foster is Faisal Islam's understudy but (a) I wouldn't have a problem with a Swiss style SPS deal and (b) I'm not sure it'd necessarily rule out a US trade deal either, although it might limit it in scope.
    I think the government will only accept mutual recognition deals with the EU now. There won't be one way or unilateral alignment in any area, especially for something as tiny as fish and agricultural. Ultimately the EU wants border pedantry, that's the tool they use to export their regulatory disadvantages to the rest of the world and the government is wise to it.

    The next 5 years needs to be spent finding new markets, finding new clients and finding new suppliers outside of the EU. Look forwards not backwards.
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,150
    MattW said:


    .. snipped ..
    The only straw in the wind is that Joanne Cherry and Great Jumping Jolyon succeeded in suing then Govt, but the Spectator footprint in Scotland is limited to online readers for that particular content.

    Though "can read it via the internet" has long been an argument in defamation cases.

    I read the printed edition half an hour ago in Edinburgh.
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187
    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    Tricky one, though. Many people may think as you do, but then think some more and, well, do they want to diss the Queen?
    I guarantee you that most people - a very clear majority - would not appreciate their neighbour sticking a great big "patriotic" flag on the roof. They'd probably not make a fuss, for fear of kicking off a feud, but the feeling would be disapproval not approval. C'mon. We all know this. So that survey is a piece of nonsense.
    I think you misunderstood me: the Queen is wont to fly the flag on her house, yet most people do not disapprove of her, if they say they disapprove of flying the flag on your house then they're disapproving of the Queen!

    More seriously, I feel much the same as you in that seeing a St George flag on a house does not make me want to dash to know the occupants. But I guess it's not so much about the flag as the connotations. Different example, I read a few years back that the clothing brand Lonsdale was favoured by neo-nazis as you could couple it with a jacket so the Lonsdale wording on the front was partially obscurred, leaving 'NSDA'. Now, I wasn't a Lonsdale buyer before, but I certainly wouldn't have been after that. Later they started sponsoring gay and multicultural events to put off the nazi crowd and that detoxified the brand for me (I still never bough any, but I would no longer have been put off by thinking that people would think I was a Nazi). Much the same with the flag. I've no inclination to stick any flag on my house, but say a family member wanted to do so then the thing that would bother me is not the flag, but everyone walking past assuming I'm a racist. So I wouldn't mind it during a football tournament as that connotation would not be there, or at least, not so much. Equally I'd be relaxed about someone sticking a Scotland flag or Isle of Mann or Yorkshire flag on my house. It's not the flag, it's the association between people who fly the England flag and racism (in England) which I don't think exists for the other home nation flags.

    Likewise for a neighbour. England flag, I'd think it lowered the tone. Union flag too, although not quite as bad. Other home nation flag or other country flag - eccentric maybe, but not really a problem. It's unfair, but there it is.

    Like you, I'm surprised by the poll.
    Clothing brands can get hijacked, yes. One I recall. Levi Stapress, Ben Sherman shirt, Doc Martens (with the cushioned sole) - great look but tarnished by association for a while. The survey, I suspect people answered in a false, virtue-signalling way. That's why it's given those bizarre results. Love of flags is part of the new PC. If you don't comply, the antiwokerati "patriot" mob descend on you and you risk being cancelled. Naga Munchetty is the latest to get into hot water, I've just seen. "Respect that flag and make a noise about it too, else you're a wokie worm who hates Britain!" "Reactionaries must speak to students!" "Ban protests that annoy gammons!" It will pass, I'm sure, but right now it's in the ascendancy.
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    Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 8,844
    When will the number of southern irish residents vaccinated by the uk surpass those that are vaccinated by the eu vaccines I wonder
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    Leon said:

    The words 'first in a series' are enough to strike despair into the most optimistic of natures.

    https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/1372963807916658695?s=20

    Galloway is often a dick, but he is nearly always an articulate dick.

    You never know. It might, to everyone's surprise, actually be OK
    He's articulate but I can't remember it transferring to the written word. 'Self-published' is a bit of death knell, isn't it?
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    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,329
    God, the Lib Dems have leafleted me for the locals.

    It's like someone speaking to me from beyond the grave.
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,288

    Stocky said:

    MaxPB said:

    To my pleasant surprise, cases trending down again after having been flatish:


    The drop offs in deaths is just massive. The vaccines are really having a huge effect now with all of groups 1-4 now having single jab protection of 85% against mortality. It's a game changer.
    Comparisons from Friday TWO weeks ago are:

    New infections 5947 - 4802 (19% fall)
    Deaths 236 - 101 (57% fall)
    Hospitalisations 811 - 494 (39% fall)
    We have now had two weeks of stats since schools opened up. Fingers crossed, but it may not have been the super-spreader event we feared.
    OTOH cases increased daily from Sunday to Thursday.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,115
    Foxy said:

    @Foxy Nice pic.

    I've also got a pair of trunks like that. I just wish my torso was that ripped.

    You're doing superbly for your age.

    Thanks, I try to look after myself. Obviously not everyone gets to see how patriotic I am 😇
    Do you have Action Man's hair too?
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150
    Delicious irony in the Sinn Fein Health Minister arguing for Irish citizens to benefit from British success and generosity
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607

    https://twitter.com/jonathanjosephs/status/1372963968612962306?s=20

    Interesting, Qantas CEO reckons demand for non-stop Oz-UK flights has gone UP because of the pandemic - their number 1 selling international route is Perth-London. And the ME "super connectors" (Emirates/Qatar) aren't going to have much joy - the UK has just suspended flights from Qatar.

    Yes absolutely, with the UK and Australia looking to be or stay virus free within the next few months a direct flight will be very popular as it can avoid any chance of quarantine in the ME or Asia.
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    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,150
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,081
    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    Tricky one, though. Many people may think as you do, but then think some more and, well, do they want to diss the Queen?
    I guarantee you that most people - a very clear majority - would not appreciate their neighbour sticking a great big "patriotic" flag on the roof. They'd probably not make a fuss, for fear of kicking off a feud, but the feeling would be disapproval not approval. C'mon. We all know this. So that survey is a piece of nonsense.
    I think you misunderstood me: the Queen is wont to fly the flag on her house, yet most people do not disapprove of her, if they say they disapprove of flying the flag on your house then they're disapproving of the Queen!

    More seriously, I feel much the same as you in that seeing a St George flag on a house does not make me want to dash to know the occupants. But I guess it's not so much about the flag as the connotations. Different example, I read a few years back that the clothing brand Lonsdale was favoured by neo-nazis as you could couple it with a jacket so the Lonsdale wording on the front was partially obscurred, leaving 'NSDA'. Now, I wasn't a Lonsdale buyer before, but I certainly wouldn't have been after that. Later they started sponsoring gay and multicultural events to put off the nazi crowd and that detoxified the brand for me (I still never bough any, but I would no longer have been put off by thinking that people would think I was a Nazi). Much the same with the flag. I've no inclination to stick any flag on my house, but say a family member wanted to do so then the thing that would bother me is not the flag, but everyone walking past assuming I'm a racist. So I wouldn't mind it during a football tournament as that connotation would not be there, or at least, not so much. Equally I'd be relaxed about someone sticking a Scotland flag or Isle of Mann or Yorkshire flag on my house. It's not the flag, it's the association between people who fly the England flag and racism (in England) which I don't think exists for the other home nation flags.

    Likewise for a neighbour. England flag, I'd think it lowered the tone. Union flag too, although not quite as bad. Other home nation flag or other country flag - eccentric maybe, but not really a problem. It's unfair, but there it is.

    Like you, I'm surprised by the poll.
    Clothing brands can get hijacked, yes. One I recall. Levi Stapress, Ben Sherman shirt, Doc Martens (with the cushioned sole) - great look but tarnished by association for a while. The survey, I suspect people answered in a false, virtue-signalling way. That's why it's given those bizarre results. Love of flags is part of the new PC. If you don't comply, the antiwokerati "patriot" mob descend on you and you risk being cancelled. Naga Munchetty is the latest to get into hot water, I've just seen. "Respect that flag and make a noise about it too, else you're a wokie worm who hates Britain!" "Reactionaries must speak to students!" "Ban protests that annoy gammons!" It will pass, I'm sure, but right now it's in the ascendancy.
    Didn't Fred Perry suspend sales in the US because their polo shirts were being appropriated by the Boogaloo Boys or Proud Boys or whatever the sexually frustrated fascists are calling themselves now?
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    On my road I have three houses flying flags. One Union Jack, one Liver Bird and one Unite.

    For obvious reasons I feel closer to two of those than the other, but I respect and don't judge any of them.

    The one with the Liver Bird went flag crazy when we won the Premier League, flying the flag of every single country of every player in the squad. A lot of flags!
    This post has a slightly odd performative air about it.
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    LeonLeon Posts: 47,150
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    On my road I have three houses flying flags. One Union Jack, one Liver Bird and one Unite.

    For obvious reasons I feel closer to two of those than the other, but I respect and don't judge any of them.

    The one with the Liver Bird went flag crazy when we won the Premier League, flying the flag of every single country of every player in the squad. A lot of flags!
    This post has a slightly odd performative air about it.
    You might have spotted another Nazi! A good day for you. Three in total?
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,060
    "Last super-spreader event before lockdown!" This is Paris today:
    https://twitter.com/Mediavenir/status/1372941782225465344
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    Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 8,844
    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    kinabalu: 'Lol @ bollocks poll! Everyone really hates the flag, like me!'

    Also kinabalu: 'If after a decade in Opposition Labour can barely hang on to a seat they've held for 50 years that'll be a huge win for them!'

    Maybe, just maybe, there's a connection between those two things?
    You're falling for cliched groupthink. Or possibly just straining too hard to believe what you want to be true. Either way, you'll make some bad calls if you're not careful. You need to stay alert to changes. And answer me honestly. Your brand new neighbour goes UJ crazy. You approve? You're pleased as punch? Or do you wish he hadn't and want the lovely old one back? Another rhetorical one.
    On my road I have three houses flying flags. One Union Jack, one Liver Bird and one Unite.

    For obvious reasons I feel closer to two of those than the other, but I respect and don't judge any of them.

    The one with the Liver Bird went flag crazy when we won the Premier League, flying the flag of every single country of every player in the squad. A lot of flags!
    This post has a slightly odd performative air about it.
    Most people don't really care that much what there neighbours do with their land we mostly aren't a nation that goes banging on our neighbours doors to complain they have too many garden gnomes/flags/pebble dashing/painted their front door the wrong colour.

    I suspect if you did a poll asking would you rather live next to someone who flies a flag or a judgemental joyless jerk of a woke leftie that the figures would be even more in favour of the flag wavers
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298
    MaxPB said:

    https://twitter.com/jonathanjosephs/status/1372963968612962306?s=20

    Interesting, Qantas CEO reckons demand for non-stop Oz-UK flights has gone UP because of the pandemic - their number 1 selling international route is Perth-London. And the ME "super connectors" (Emirates/Qatar) aren't going to have much joy - the UK has just suspended flights from Qatar.

    Yes absolutely, with the UK and Australia looking to be or stay virus free within the next few months a direct flight will be very popular as it can avoid any chance of quarantine in the ME or Asia.
    Plus as it stands the flight will be blissfully sprog-free as there doesn't seem any prospect of them getting a vaccine in sight.

    Not sure what that will do to the holiday market tho.
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    God, the Lib Dems have leafleted me for the locals.

    It's like someone speaking to me from beyond the grave.

    It's Lib Dem spring conference this weekend.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,418
    Leon said:

    The words 'first in a series' are enough to strike despair into the most optimistic of natures.

    https://twitter.com/GerryHassan/status/1372963807916658695?s=20

    Galloway is often a dick, but he is nearly always an articulate dick.

    You never know. It might, to everyone's surprise, actually be OK
    Cover's not great is it? The concept of Hitler and hangers on walking around London as they did in Paris is a powerful one but the execution is poor. No excuse for really bad graphic design when the gig economy means you can get a pro to do that for you for a pittance.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    https://twitter.com/jonathanjosephs/status/1372963968612962306?s=20

    Interesting, Qantas CEO reckons demand for non-stop Oz-UK flights has gone UP because of the pandemic - their number 1 selling international route is Perth-London. And the ME "super connectors" (Emirates/Qatar) aren't going to have much joy - the UK has just suspended flights from Qatar.

    Yes absolutely, with the UK and Australia looking to be or stay virus free within the next few months a direct flight will be very popular as it can avoid any chance of quarantine in the ME or Asia.
    Plus as it stands the flight will be blissfully sprog-free as there doesn't seem any prospect of them getting a vaccine in sight.

    Not sure what that will do to the holiday market tho.
    One imagines under 18s will be exempt given no vaccines are approved for them yet.
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    MikeSmithsonMikeSmithson Posts: 7,382

    God, the Lib Dems have leafleted me for the locals.

    It's like someone speaking to me from beyond the grave.

    The party has been denied all its normal methods of communication by the pandemic.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    Tricky one, though. Many people may think as you do, but then think some more and, well, do they want to diss the Queen?
    I guarantee you that most people - a very clear majority - would not appreciate their neighbour sticking a great big "patriotic" flag on the roof. They'd probably not make a fuss, for fear of kicking off a feud, but the feeling would be disapproval not approval. C'mon. We all know this. So that survey is a piece of nonsense.
    I think you misunderstood me: the Queen is wont to fly the flag on her house, yet most people do not disapprove of her, if they say they disapprove of flying the flag on your house then they're disapproving of the Queen!

    More seriously, I feel much the same as you in that seeing a St George flag on a house does not make me want to dash to know the occupants. But I guess it's not so much about the flag as the connotations. Different example, I read a few years back that the clothing brand Lonsdale was favoured by neo-nazis as you could couple it with a jacket so the Lonsdale wording on the front was partially obscurred, leaving 'NSDA'. Now, I wasn't a Lonsdale buyer before, but I certainly wouldn't have been after that. Later they started sponsoring gay and multicultural events to put off the nazi crowd and that detoxified the brand for me (I still never bough any, but I would no longer have been put off by thinking that people would think I was a Nazi). Much the same with the flag. I've no inclination to stick any flag on my house, but say a family member wanted to do so then the thing that would bother me is not the flag, but everyone walking past assuming I'm a racist. So I wouldn't mind it during a football tournament as that connotation would not be there, or at least, not so much. Equally I'd be relaxed about someone sticking a Scotland flag or Isle of Mann or Yorkshire flag on my house. It's not the flag, it's the association between people who fly the England flag and racism (in England) which I don't think exists for the other home nation flags.

    Likewise for a neighbour. England flag, I'd think it lowered the tone. Union flag too, although not quite as bad. Other home nation flag or other country flag - eccentric maybe, but not really a problem. It's unfair, but there it is.

    Like you, I'm surprised by the poll.
    Clothing brands can get hijacked, yes. One I recall. Levi Stapress, Ben Sherman shirt, Doc Martens (with the cushioned sole) - great look but tarnished by association for a while. The survey, I suspect people answered in a false, virtue-signalling way. That's why it's given those bizarre results. Love of flags is part of the new PC. If you don't comply, the antiwokerati "patriot" mob descend on you and you risk being cancelled. Naga Munchetty is the latest to get into hot water, I've just seen. "Respect that flag and make a noise about it too, else you're a wokie worm who hates Britain!" "Reactionaries must speak to students!" "Ban protests that annoy gammons!" It will pass, I'm sure, but right now it's in the ascendancy.
    Didn't Fred Perry suspend sales in the US because their polo shirts were being appropriated by the Boogaloo Boys or Proud Boys or whatever the sexually frustrated fascists are calling themselves now?
    Time was when no self respecting British Movement type would be seen without a Stone Island top as the logos were pretty similar.
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    ydoethurydoethur Posts: 67,232

    God, the Lib Dems have leafleted me for the locals.

    It's like someone speaking to me from beyond the grave.

    It's Lib Dem spring conference this weekend.
    Social distancing not an issue.
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    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,187

    kinabalu said:

    Foxy said:

    kinabalu said:

    Selebian said:

    kinabalu said:

    LOL. That is a bollocks poll! So you go to some blokes's house and see he's got the flag of St George billowing from the roof - and OVER HALF of people say they APPROVE of that?

    Come off it. You get out of there pronto, wondering what's down in the cellar.

    No, that's people not answering honestly for fear of coming over as snobby and judgemental.
    Tricky one, though. Many people may think as you do, but then think some more and, well, do they want to diss the Queen?
    I guarantee you that most people - a very clear majority - would not appreciate their neighbour sticking a great big "patriotic" flag on the roof. They'd probably not make a fuss, for fear of kicking off a feud, but the feeling would be disapproval not approval. C'mon. We all know this. So that survey is a piece of nonsense.
    A bit of context. During a Jubilee or a sporting event, I often fly a Union Jack or England flag, but all year round I wouldn't.
    Yep. That's, I think, where Middle England is on this. I push the envelope a little (at my age) with my England shirt but I'm comfortable with that during a World Cup or the Euros. I would NOT wear it outside those times. I doubt many on here would either, regardless of how they vote.
    Why not?

    I'll happily go out in my England shirt or Liverpool or Tranmere Rovers shirt. Why wouldn't I?

    Honestly you sound like a conceited judgementalitist Mary Whitehouse throwback with a stick up your arse.

    Are we supposed to go to the shops or the pub in a shirt, jacket and tie in your eyes?
    Oh do stop it, Philip. Let's have some issue discipline. White Commonwealth. Flag of St George. Union Jacks. All have questions to answer. But nobody is casting aspersions about Tranmere Rovers. That's no part of this discussion.
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    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,298
    MaxPB said:

    TOPPING said:

    MaxPB said:

    https://twitter.com/jonathanjosephs/status/1372963968612962306?s=20

    Interesting, Qantas CEO reckons demand for non-stop Oz-UK flights has gone UP because of the pandemic - their number 1 selling international route is Perth-London. And the ME "super connectors" (Emirates/Qatar) aren't going to have much joy - the UK has just suspended flights from Qatar.

    Yes absolutely, with the UK and Australia looking to be or stay virus free within the next few months a direct flight will be very popular as it can avoid any chance of quarantine in the ME or Asia.
    Plus as it stands the flight will be blissfully sprog-free as there doesn't seem any prospect of them getting a vaccine in sight.

    Not sure what that will do to the holiday market tho.
    One imagines under 18s will be exempt given no vaccines are approved for them yet.
    Interesting though. If that cohort can spread it the exemption would make no sense. Although schools data these last two weeks are encouraging.
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    MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 37,607
    WhatsApp, Instagram and Facebook all down for the last hour. Something's wrong.
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