Trump will no longer receive special Twitter treatment if he loses election.
Policy that protects ‘newsworthy individuals’ from having accounts banned for breaking rules wouldn’t apply to Trump.
Donald Trump could lose more than just the presidency this January. Twitter has confirmed that, if Trump leaves office, he will no longer receive special treatment as a “newsworthy individual”.
Twitter’s policy around newsworthiness protects certain people – such as elected officials with more than 250,000 followers – from having their accounts suspended or banned for rule infractions that would otherwise lead to severe penalties.
That policy is what has led to the company muting, but not removing, at least 12 tweets from the US president over the past week that cast doubt on the democratic process.
But, Twitter has confirmed, the policy does not apply to former elected officials. They have to follow the same rules as everyone else, and if a tweet breaks those rules, it gets removed. Were Trump to continue breaking Twitter’s rules regularly post-presidency, his account could be suspended.
“Twitter’s approach to world leaders, candidates and public officials is based on the principle that people should be able to choose to see what their leaders are saying with clear context,” a spokesman told the Guardian. “This means that we may apply warnings and labels, and limit engagement to certain Tweets. This policy framework applies to current world leaders and candidates for office, and not private citizens when they no longer hold these positions.”
That will present Trump with a choice once he leaves office: either tone down the rhetoric or face the prospect of his hugely influential following being taken away from him.
I think it would be very unwise to un-person trump. Just let him scream like a child and do the moderate thing on anything really crazy.
There's a real danger his tweets lead to actual violence.
So could unpersoning him. If he calls for violent revolution sure he has to go, but if it more of the same its all the fake news media are horrid nonsense, just ignore him.
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
That's just everyday sexism from you.
Have you forgotten HYUFD's posts in 2017 about Marine Le Pen winning the first round?
Fox says RNC still hopes for NC and AZ but has given up on NV and PA, in terms of the count. Hoping for the recount in GA to deliver. After that it’s in the courts.
I have an awful feeling that by the middle of next week we're going to be hearing that Fox says RNC still hopes for NC and AK but hopes for a second recount in GA and maybe the courts can help and otherwise maybe an asteroid will collide with earth or the aliens will come or something.
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
That's just everyday sexism from you.
Have you forgotten HYUFD's posts in 2017 about Marine Le Pen winning the first round?
I will have you know if France had used a completely different electoral system then Le Pen won the whole thing.
Trump will no longer receive special Twitter treatment if he loses election.
Policy that protects ‘newsworthy individuals’ from having accounts banned for breaking rules wouldn’t apply to Trump.
Donald Trump could lose more than just the presidency this January. Twitter has confirmed that, if Trump leaves office, he will no longer receive special treatment as a “newsworthy individual”.
Twitter’s policy around newsworthiness protects certain people – such as elected officials with more than 250,000 followers – from having their accounts suspended or banned for rule infractions that would otherwise lead to severe penalties.
That policy is what has led to the company muting, but not removing, at least 12 tweets from the US president over the past week that cast doubt on the democratic process.
But, Twitter has confirmed, the policy does not apply to former elected officials. They have to follow the same rules as everyone else, and if a tweet breaks those rules, it gets removed. Were Trump to continue breaking Twitter’s rules regularly post-presidency, his account could be suspended.
“Twitter’s approach to world leaders, candidates and public officials is based on the principle that people should be able to choose to see what their leaders are saying with clear context,” a spokesman told the Guardian. “This means that we may apply warnings and labels, and limit engagement to certain Tweets. This policy framework applies to current world leaders and candidates for office, and not private citizens when they no longer hold these positions.”
That will present Trump with a choice once he leaves office: either tone down the rhetoric or face the prospect of his hugely influential following being taken away from him.
I think it would be very unwise to un-person trump. Just let him scream like a child and do the moderate thing on anything really crazy. Unpersoning him just makes him a martyr and feds into thr narrative twitter are bias / happy to censor certain people and not others.
Of course they "censor" (let use their platform) only certain people. They kick off the ones who repeatedly dont comply with their hateful conduct policy, unless they are a key elected official. Others are fine.
Entirely appropriate for a private business, the expectation businesses should pander to aggressive nutters and let them damage their reputation and therefore shareholder value is very anti capitalist.
Okay, a question for our US experts - perhaps even a suggestion for someone with the knowledge to write a thread header.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
Fox says RNC still hopes for NC and AZ but has given up on NV and PA, in terms of the count. Hoping for the recount in GA to deliver. After that it’s in the courts.
I have an awful feeling that by the middle of next week we're going to be hearing that Fox says RNC still hopes for NC and AK but hopes for a second recount in GA and maybe the courts can help and otherwise maybe an asteroid will collide with earth or the aliens will come or something.
Feels like one of those 80s slasher movies. The monster needs to be killed a couple of times, because it finds miraculous ways of coming back.
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
I think we can all put the idea of vote rigging to bed. The BBC did an article on it and none of the signs of vote rigging happened in this election:
Delay in announcing results Too many voters A high turnout in specific areas Large numbers of invalid votes More votes than ballot papers issued Results that don't match
Read this thread, I noticed you posted a lot of this fake news vote rigging stuff, then buggered off when it was pointed out you were peddling fake news.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, Braveheart loving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
Perhaps Trump can claim that a million of his votes have been wrongly redirected to California and counted there, when they should have been counted in Nevada, Pennsylvania, Michigan and Georgia.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Fox says RNC still hopes for NC and AZ but has given up on NV and PA, in terms of the count. Hoping for the recount in GA to deliver. After that it’s in the courts.
I have an awful feeling that by the middle of next week we're going to be hearing that Fox says RNC still hopes for NC and AK but hopes for a second recount in GA and maybe the courts can help and otherwise maybe an asteroid will collide with earth or the aliens will come or something.
Feels like one of those 80s slasher movies. The monster needs to be killed a couple of times, because it finds miraculous ways of coming back.
I seem to remember making exactly that comment last night. Or was it the night before? Or the night before that?
Am I right in thinking that AP and Fox have called Arizona for Biden but none of the other news outlets?
Confusingly, DecisionDesk have not called AZ but have called PA (which takes Biden over the line).
Yes, that is correct. The impression is that none of the networks is keen to be first to call the election for Biden, resulting in excessive caution about calling the next state that would tip them over the 270 ECV mark.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Okay, a question for our US experts - perhaps even a suggestion for someone with the knowledge to write a thread header.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
The advantage of dragging this out is it gives him less time to do that. And I don't think he will. He will revert to learned behaviour. Multiple law suits, whinging and grifting. Probably the worst damage will be the amount he and his acolytes trouser. Political damage? Nah. He doesn't care.
Okay, a question for our US experts - perhaps even a suggestion for someone with the knowledge to write a thread header.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
The advantage of dragging this out is it gives him less time to do that. And I don't think he will. He will revert to learned behaviour. Multiple law suits, whinging and grifting. Probably the worst damage will be the amount he and his acolytes trouser. Political damage? Nah. He doesn't care.
I wish that were the case but then I see what he has already done with the civil service in recent weeks.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
I seem to remember David Cameron saying after than vote that the voices of England must be heard. What did they have to say about it?
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, Braveheart loving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
You ok, hun?
You know the weather's changed when HYUFD's no longer getting excited by powerful, strong men.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
I seem to remember David Cameron saying after than vote that the voices of England must be heard. What did they have to say about it?
England does not have its own Parliament unlike Scotland, so EVEL was perfectly acceptable
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
There is a post on 538 which is a bit difficult to make sense of, but seems to imply that the results of nearly 7000 ballots from Allegheny County, Pennsylvania, are about to be published.
There is a post on 538 which is a bit difficult to make sense of, but seems to imply that the results of nearly 7000 ballots from Allegheny County, Pennsylvania, are about to be published.
CNN just interviewed someone from Allegheny and he did not seem optimistic that they would be. There will be some soon but more likely about 2-3k.
Okay, a question for our US experts - perhaps even a suggestion for someone with the knowledge to write a thread header.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
The advantage of dragging this out is it gives him less time to do that. And I don't think he will. He will revert to learned behaviour. Multiple law suits, whinging and grifting. Probably the worst damage will be the amount he and his acolytes trouser. Political damage? Nah. He doesn't care.
I wish that were the case but then I see what he has already done with the civil service in recent weeks.
Yes but that was with the expectation he would win. It is no longer of any benefit to Donald J Trump. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see him as political at all. Outwith it being to his advantage.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
I'm against splitting up - the world is quite divided enough without further splits in countries that function reasonably well together. But I think that if the Scottish government really wants a new referendum then we shouldn't try to make it illegal (how?). A possible compromise would be to offer an earlier decisive referendum but with a higher threshold than 50%+1 - say 55% for something of that magnitude? (And yes, if we'd had that for Brexit it would have been a good idea.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective unions of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
Poor RCP has been in meltdown for the last week even before polling closed, and today their conservative lead article is openly calling for Republican state houses to nullify Democrat wins by appointing Republican electors!
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Poor RCP has been in meltdown for the last week even before polling closed, and today their conservative lead article is openly calling for Republican state houses to nullify Democrat wins by appointing Republican electors!
RCP's final forecast of Biden 319 and Trump 219 could well however end up being almost spot on, they just wrongly called Florida for Biden and Georgia for Trump
It took me awhile, making changes incrementally, but I managed in Democracy 3 the other day to take my USA state and create my religiously run state with zero crime (thanks to universal cctv, machine gun cops, police drones, face recognition technology, removal of jury trial, curfew and arbitrary detention), and eventually the removal of all state pensions and state run healthcare and education. It was also a green utopia.
I should think the developers will fix that exploit that video used though.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Indeed, nationalism is a good thing to be proud of like patriotism.
Xenophobia is a bad thing, but that is not nationalism.
Okay, a question for our US experts - perhaps even a suggestion for someone with the knowledge to write a thread header.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
The advantage of dragging this out is it gives him less time to do that. And I don't think he will. He will revert to learned behaviour. Multiple law suits, whinging and grifting. Probably the worst damage will be the amount he and his acolytes trouser. Political damage? Nah. He doesn't care.
I wish that were the case but then I see what he has already done with the civil service in recent weeks.
Yes but that was with the expectation he would win. It is no longer of any benefit to Donald J Trump. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see him as political at all. Outwith it being to his advantage.
No I hope you are right, and as I said I asked the question because I simply don't know anything much about the US system in any detail so I do appreciate your informed reply.
It took me awhile, making changes incrementally, but I managed in Democracy 3 the other day to take my USA state and create my religiously run state with zero crime (thanks to universal cctv, machine gun cops, police drones, face recognition technology, removal of jury trial, curfew and arbitrary detention), and eventually the removal of all state pensions and state run healthcare and education. It was also a green utopia.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
And the UK can also be built on nationalism behind our great Queen and royal family and Union Jack but a nationalism of unionism not division within these isles
It took me awhile, making changes incrementally, but I managed in Democracy 3 the other day to take my USA state and create my religiously run state with zero crime (thanks to universal cctv, machine gun cops, police drones, face recognition technology, removal of jury trial, curfew and arbitrary detention), and eventually the removal of all state pensions and state run healthcare and education. It was also a green utopia.
A utopia without pensions?
They all had private pensions by that point. Though the poor were not happy with me.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Indeed, nationalism is a good thing to be proud of like patriotism.
Xenophobia is a bad thing, but that is not nationalism.
It's not good or bad, it's just a thing. It causes territories to join together, it causes them to split apart. It helps them stay together, it stops them joining together. It's a pretty uncontroversial idea when considered in whole. The fight against nationalism died with Metternich.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
Personally although I can see the advantages of that it would feel a bit too much like the EU trying to keep us in various control mechanisms after Brexit. I suspect it would generate resentment and more strife. So I think it would be better to say that there will be a clean break but then at the same time negotiate joint ventures and cross border cooperation as equal independent partners.
The problem is this relies upon having a Government in Westminster adult enough to see that once Scotland has chosen independence it is in everyone's interests to make it work as well as possible including making concessions and compromises on the English side. I fear we have neither the politicians (of any party) or the public who are intelligent enough to realise that that is in our best interests.
Some light reading from Paul Krugman in the New York Times:-
Is America Becoming a Failed State? Mitch McConnell may make the nation ungovernable.
As I write this, it seems extremely likely that Joe Biden has won the presidency. And he clearly received millions more votes than his opponent. He can and should claim that he has been given a strong mandate to govern the nation.
But there are real questions about whether he will, in fact, be able to govern. At the moment, it seems likely that the Senate — which is wildly unrepresentative of the American people — will remain in the hands of an extremist party that will sabotage Biden in every way it can. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/05/opinion/joe-biden-senate-mitch-mcconnell.html
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
I'm against splitting up - the world is quite divided enough without further splits in countries that function reasonably well together. But I think that if the Scottish government really wants a new referendum then we shouldn't try to make it illegal (how?). A possible compromise would be to offer an earlier decisive referendum but with a higher threshold than 50%+1 - say 55% for something of that magnitude? (And yes, if we'd had that for Brexit it would have been a good idea.
Should have made it contingent that all 4 UK nations had to vote for Brexit to occur (although it would have caused other problems).
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
Personally although I can see the advantages of that it would feel a bit too much like the EU trying to keep us in various control mechanisms after Brexit. I suspect it would generate resentment and more strife. So I think it would be better to say that there will be a clean break but then at the same time negotiate joint ventures and cross border cooperation as equal independent partners.
The problem is this relies upon having a Government in Westminster adult enough to see that once Scotland has chosen independence it is in everyone's interests to make it work as well as possible including making concessions and compromises on the English side. I fear we have neither the politicians (of any party) or the public who are intelligent enough to realise that that is in our best interests.
If Scotland ever chose independence we would of course treat them exactly as the EU treated us and rightly so, if you choose to leave a union you should not expect any concessions from the larger state you are leaving, if you wish to become a foreign power you will be treated as one
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
I'm against splitting up - the world is quite divided enough without further splits in countries that function reasonably well together. But I think that if the Scottish government really wants a new referendum then we shouldn't try to make it illegal (how?). A possible compromise would be to offer an earlier decisive referendum but with a higher threshold than 50%+1 - say 55% for something of that magnitude? (And yes, if we'd had that for Brexit it would have been a good idea.
Should have made it contingent that all 4 UK nations had to vote for Brexit to occur (although it would have caused other problems).
Wouldn't work when 85% of the population of the UK live in England.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
Personally although I can see the advantages of that it would feel a bit too much like the EU trying to keep us in various control mechanisms after Brexit. I suspect it would generate resentment and more strife. So I think it would be better to say that there will be a clean break but then at the same time negotiate joint ventures and cross border cooperation as equal independent partners.
The problem is this relies upon having a Government in Westminster adult enough to see that once Scotland has chosen independence it is in everyone's interests to make it work as well as possible including making concessions and compromises on the English side. I fear we have neither the politicians (of any party) or the public who are intelligent enough to realise that that is in our best interests.
If Scotland ever chose independence we would of course treat them exactly as the EU treated us and rightly so, if you choose to leave a union you should not expect any concessions from the larger state you are leaving, if you wish to become a foreign power you will be treated as one
In the real world if Scotland ever chose to leave if you want to know how we'd treat them, look at how we treat the Republic of Ireland.
I hope Bidens speech is long enough to last two days, if it is he will finish about the same time PA will be called and he can end his speech 'oh and by the way I accept the Presidency'
A little known fact. The reason Chicago is called 'The Windy City' has nothing to do with wind from the lake but because one of their politicians spoke for days in order to fillibuster something or other. Sorry! But last time I was working there I ended up with a free day so took one of their open top bus tours round the city. Apart from The Al Capone stuff that was the most interesting thing.
Okay, a question for our US experts - perhaps even a suggestion for someone with the knowledge to write a thread header.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
The advantage of dragging this out is it gives him less time to do that. And I don't think he will. He will revert to learned behaviour. Multiple law suits, whinging and grifting. Probably the worst damage will be the amount he and his acolytes trouser. Political damage? Nah. He doesn't care.
I wish that were the case but then I see what he has already done with the civil service in recent weeks.
Yes but that was with the expectation he would win. It is no longer of any benefit to Donald J Trump. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see him as political at all. Outwith it being to his advantage.
No I hope you are right, and as I said I asked the question because I simply don't know anything much about the US system in any detail so I do appreciate your informed reply.
Not really informed. Just my gut. He could do a lot of damage with Executive Orders. For example he could pardon a bunch of serial killers and set them loose to roam the streets. How does this benefit him? No profit in it. He could sack everyone at the WH and refuse to sign anything I suppose.
It took me awhile, making changes incrementally, but I managed in Democracy 3 the other day to take my USA state and create my religiously run state with zero crime (thanks to universal cctv, machine gun cops, police drones, face recognition technology, removal of jury trial, curfew and arbitrary detention), and eventually the removal of all state pensions and state run healthcare and education. It was also a green utopia.
A utopia without pensions?
They all had private pensions by that point. Though the poor were not happy with me.
We need the Vulcans to turn up, then we can create the Federation and have a one world government.
This election is like one of those races in the Olympics, where someone would have broken the world record except another runner crossed the line a tenth of a second earlier. Trump is now on nearly 70,000,000 votes, which beats Obama08's 69,498,516. A record! Except, no, "Sleepy" Joe broke the tape before you.
Have the night off, Mr Trump. You did really well but save your energy now, because you're going to be on trial for the rest of your natural life.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Have a look at the UKIP stats in Scotland and at SNP policy on who gets Scottish passports - not to mention who gets to live in Sciotland at all.
The SNP{ aren't the ones who scream and shout at other Europeans sitting in Holyrood. Or in Westminster. Hell, the Tories scream and shout at Scots sitting in Westminster.
Gotta say TSE, with the exception of some of the older school nutters, the SNP are much much less nativist than the Tory part.
You obviously have not encountered the cybernats
Now Trump's toast, who's going to be your populist nationalist poster boy?
I always said I would have voted for Biden but GOP for Congress and I voted Remain, the only nationalist amongst the 2 of us is you and your fellow English hating, ranting, Bannockburn obsessing, saltire waving, whinging, bitter Scottish nationalists!!!
That told them 😁
But in the interests of balance though, If Ireland can exist okay out the U.K. in EU, what is the argument an independent Scotland can’t as well?
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
Great post. That is why I am an English supporter of Scottish Independence. For entirely positive and well meant reasons.
Thank you. 🙂
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
No as Scots voted against independence in 2014 in a once in a generation referendum
And Brexit doesn’t change that? the desire of majority of English and Welsh, those original Roman Britons, to brexit, can’t have the same powerful Brexit arguments to escape from vassalage, to take back sovereignty and control, turned back upon them in ScotRef2 now because of brexit?
No, Cameron had said he would hold an EUref even before the indyref in 2014, it was a once in a generation referendum and that will stand.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
I’m sure you agree with Richard and myself, just don’t realise it. It hinges upon understanding what a nation actually is. 🙂
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
The UK is older as a nation than Germany, Italy, India, the USA, Canada and Australia, all of them manage to be effective union of states and so can we, otherwise on your absurd argument they should all dissolve too
What made Italy? Nationalism. What made India? Nationalism. What made Germany? Nationalism.
Comments
It'll stop you embarrassing yourself further.
https://twitter.com/Ike_Saul/status/1324435797374808066
Have you forgotten HYUFD's posts in 2017 about Marine Le Pen winning the first round?
Still not sure why Disney Star Wars resurrected Palpatine in 2019!
https://twitter.com/lauren_llee/status/1324845113525284869
Entirely appropriate for a private business, the expectation businesses should pander to aggressive nutters and let them damage their reputation and therefore shareholder value is very anti capitalist.
If he turns his mind to it and lives down to his reputation, how much damage to the Presidency, to Government and to the country (short of starting a war) can Trump legally do between now and January?
Can he salt the earth and make enough mess that it will take Biden his whole presidency to sort it out? Or is he specifically constrained in his actions by being an outgoing president as opposed to a sitting president? (if you see what I mean).
https://twitter.com/ZcohenCNN/status/1324849481381257218
https://twitter.com/ZcohenCNN/status/1324849482647916544
But nations need to keep their identity, their culture, their democracy, and where these are smothered by any union with other nations, with so much surrender of your sovereignty into the pool, so some far away government, speaking a language other than your own, now rules over you, you vote and everything stays the same, building up your desire to take back control - something has got to change hasn’t it?
Are you saying that feeling just made up? Got up by scoundrels? It’s not really real? That there is no excuse to feel that?
https://twitter.com/lauren_llee/status/1324850342681522177
And I don't think he will. He will revert to learned behaviour. Multiple law suits, whinging and grifting.
Probably the worst damage will be the amount he and his acolytes trouser.
Political damage? Nah. He doesn't care.
Would it be best then to have a conscious decoupling, like via a Royal Commission. So as not to throw out with the change cooperation that really is helpful win win?
https://twitter.com/meganmesserly/status/1324854269472694272
Ridiculous that this hasn't been called yet.
You know the weather's changed when HYUFD's no longer getting excited by powerful, strong men.
I was of course worried that in that time someone would call this game over. But clearly I had no need for such concern.
Plus the prospect of a hard border with England still keeps Scots behind the Union post Brexit
https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/poll-most-scots-would-reject-independence-after-considering-issues-2976093
Can you be part of a nation and not share the same language?
Can you have members of a Nation outside its borders?
Does the nation have a border or are you a member through culture?
if ScotRef2 goes ahead, who is entitled to vote, the Scottish Nation which straddles borders and is anywhere in the world?
To what degree minorities have to assimilate to culture to have membership and rights?
What about people without a common territory or economic life, who do not have material prerequisites to form a separate nationstate?
https://youtu.be/AYvxBx4D9Jo
It is no longer of any benefit to Donald J Trump. Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see him as political at all. Outwith it being to his advantage.
https://twitter.com/mattdpearce/status/1324833485060599809
What made India? Nationalism.
What made Germany? Nationalism.
Spanish-speaking Latino voters are being bombarded with disinformation ahead of the election
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2020/10/20/nation/spanish-speaking-latino-voters-are-being-bombarded-with-disinformation-ahead-election/
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/2020_elections_electoral_college_map_no_toss_ups.html
I should think the developers will fix that exploit that video used though.
Xenophobia is a bad thing, but that is not nationalism.
96% of the vote in now.
Call it already.
It's a pretty uncontroversial idea when considered in whole. The fight against nationalism died with Metternich.
The problem is this relies upon having a Government in Westminster adult enough to see that once Scotland has chosen independence it is in everyone's interests to make it work as well as possible including making concessions and compromises on the English side. I fear we have neither the politicians (of any party) or the public who are intelligent enough to realise that that is in our best interests.
Is America Becoming a Failed State?
Mitch McConnell may make the nation ungovernable.
As I write this, it seems extremely likely that Joe Biden has won the presidency. And he clearly received millions more votes than his opponent. He can and should claim that he has been given a strong mandate to govern the nation.
But there are real questions about whether he will, in fact, be able to govern. At the moment, it seems likely that the Senate — which is wildly unrepresentative of the American people — will remain in the hands of an extremist party that will sabotage Biden in every way it can.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/05/opinion/joe-biden-senate-mitch-mcconnell.html
We just received 2,172 additional votes from Arizona. Biden is currently up by 38,455 votes.
What shall unmake the UK? Nationalism.
We are not the EU.
How does this benefit him? No profit in it.
He could sack everyone at the WH and refuse to sign anything I suppose.
Trump is now on nearly 70,000,000 votes, which beats Obama08's 69,498,516. A record! Except, no, "Sleepy" Joe broke the tape before you.
Have the night off, Mr Trump. You did really well but save your energy now, because you're going to be on trial for the rest of your natural life.
Lack of pragmatism.