I don't remember Trump being any good last time against Clinton. And for a supposed tv pro, he has shown time and time again how useless he is a public speaking.
Biden does have more experience of debating in recent times, although is debate even really the right word for these events? Being immune to self doubt and dogged in making talking point sees you through ignoring the other chap quite a bit I'd assume. If the moderator tries to get you to actually debate, just screech about bias on twitter, the supporters will lap it up.
Biden does have more experience of debating in recent times, although is debate even really the right word for these events? Being immune to self doubt and dogged in making talking point sees you through ignoring the other chap quite a bit I'd assume. If the moderator tries to get you to actually debate, just screech about bias on twitter, the supporters will lap it up.
I think both are crap at debates. Its Boris vs Corbyn at PMQs level.
Through reducing the IQ of those watching? Almost certainly.
But I think a general rule of thumb is very few things seem to have a large impact, including campaigns - the ones that stick in our minds are rare, and the crucial moments we remember are probably reflective of the situation rather than impacting them. Though we don't want to go full historical revisionism on it and accidentally explain away every, er, explanation for something happening.
Tory MPs show they have no greater responsibility than the Tory Party. They don't deserve to govern.
Deserve has little to do with it, fact is they are very good at convincing people they should govern. At least now there is an opposition that seems to realise it doesn't matter how much they want power or deserve it, they need to be as good as the Tories at convincing people they should get it.
I cant imagine the debates will change any minds. It isn't as if both candidates are relatively unknown like Obama and anybody is going to be shocked if Biden accuses Trump of racism, sexism, Islmaphobia, etc.
I don't remember Trump being any good last time against Clinton. And for a supposed tv pro, he has shown time and time again how useless he is a public speaking.
Trump's best debate performance was his destruction of Jeb Bush in South Carolina.
I bet that will go down a whole lot better with some who objected to factcheckUK last time.
In both cases they should make it clear it comes from the Democratic/Tory party
The Tories did on the page and even through the Twitter @ handle but still people complained, people who now will be laughing and smiling about the Democrats doing it.
I bet that will go down a whole lot better with some who objected to factcheckUK last time.
In both cases they should make it clear it comes from the Democratic/Tory party
The Tories did on the page and even through the Twitter @ handle but still people complained, people who now will be laughing and smiling about the Democrats doing it.
The Tories did not make it clear. The Democrats have also not made it clear.
It might well have been the purpose, Boris and his cohorts are more comfortable on that territory, but it seems an awfully high stakes gamble for what it achieves.
People seem to like inexperienced politicians thesedays, demogogic outsiders who will shake up the system. It's not even purely a right wing thing. But while a bland technocratic professional politician style can go too far, it'd be nice if a political animal like Biden, steepled in decades of skill in the political arts, could show one reason that is useful and manage to puncture Trump's energetic, deceptively effective flailings.
I don't remember Trump being any good last time against Clinton. And for a supposed tv pro, he has shown time and time again how useless he is a public speaking.
The biggest debate win ever was 2012 when Romney beat Obama in the first debate and went from behind to a poll lead until Obama clawed it back in subsequent debates, Romney won the post debate poll by 52%, Clinton's 34% win in the 2016 post debate poll was sizeable but not as big as that https://news.gallup.com/poll/195923/clinton-debate-victory-larger-side-modern-debates.aspx
I don't remember Trump being any good last time against Clinton. And for a supposed tv pro, he has shown time and time again how useless he is a public speaking.
There been a rash of "Well Actually Trump was very effective in 2016 debates" article appearing on my timeline today.
Written by people with false memory syndrome as far as I can tell.
The post debate polls showed Trump lost all 3 but he still won the election .
Trump was crap and at times very weird and creepy.
What was the big thing for him were the rallies. He gets to speak unchecked and does so that i think speaks to a lot of normal Americans and not like a regular politician. And they got yuuuuuuge coverage with the media and online.
Although he is trying to do the same again this time, I don't think there is the same cut through.
Given the 8 DUP MPs backed the bill and there are 365 Tory MPs and the bill passed with 340 votes, that means at least 33 Tory MPs did not vote for it.
In any case the Lords will vote it down and delay it until well into 2021
I don't remember Trump being any good last time against Clinton. And for a supposed tv pro, he has shown time and time again how useless he is a public speaking.
There been a rash of "Well Actually Trump was very effective in 2016 debates" article appearing on my timeline today.
Written by people with false memory syndrome as far as I can tell.
It was the rallies that were a big boost for him last time. They had real momentum and got constant coverage, normally because the media had a gotcha, he lied, he said something outrageous etc, but the voters that mattered for him saw them differently.
I watched their special yesterday. They tried ever so hard to turn it into a mega scandal, but even the democrat representative they had on admitted they have all the same kind of voter targetting data, just they would never ever use it for negative targetting....which I don't buy given the climate of politicial ads in the US, they are overwhelming attack / negative ones.
It seems underhand and ungentlemanly to target people with ads giving them reasons not to vote for the side they usually vote for, but I have already seen ones this time around targetting white Trump voters to get them to not vote for the down ballot GOP candidates even if they vote for Trump for president.
I'm not really sure why "seamless trade within the UK" is so important, if it is so unimportant with the rest of the World...
We are the UK not the whole world.
There was a time when the main argument of the Brexit supporters was that being in the EU restricted our ability to trade freely and seamlessly with the wider World.
I'm not really sure why "seamless trade within the UK" is so important, if it is so unimportant with the rest of the World...
We are the UK not the whole world.
There was a time when the main argument of the Brexit supporters was that being in the EU restricted our ability to trade freely and seamlessly with the wider World.
Which is still true. Brexit deals with that issue.
We won't have seamless trade with the whole world though, that was never pledged.
The only thing I remember now from the 2016 debates was the "You'd be in Jail" comment in the second one and Trump stalking Hillary around the stage.
Given Biden's past comments wanting to "beat the hell" out of Trump I wouldn't be surprised if (in the second especially) Trump tries to goad Biden into losing his temper.
Went for a very plez oyster lunch with a friend in Soho today.
Oxford St, Regent St, and Soho now feel almost normal, with the added tedium of masks and queues, for sure - but normal. A lot of shoppers, plenty of traffic. Shops actually busy.
It was an agreeably warm sunny Autumn day but certainly not high summer, and yet the crowds were out. Restaurants pretty full. Bars mildly buzzing.
If we can avoid another calamitous national lockdown, we may also avoid economic Apocalypse. And the predictions of the End of London might prove premature.
Lawyers in the UK Government surely must be removed from the bar
Yes - by voting against the Labour amendment which “requires ministers to respect the rule of law and uphold the independence of the courts”, both the Lord Chancellor, Robert Buckland, and the A-G, Suella Braverman, are in breach of their oaths of office. They should be disciplined by the Bar Council frankly.
Wasn't @Cyclefree making a similar suggestion using the Falklands a week or two back?
A few weeks back and not seriously. Is Priti reading PB? If she is, can she and her stupid colleagues just bog off and stop dragging Britain’s name through the mud.
The post debate polls showed Trump lost all 3 but he still won the election .
Trump was crap and at times very weird and creepy.
What was the big thing for him were the rallies. He gets to speak unchecked and does so that i think speaks to a lot of normal Americans and not like a regular politician. And they got yuuuuuuge coverage with the media and online.
Although he is trying to do the same again this time, I don't think there is the same cut through.
"Not like a politician" is, of course, slightly less easy to pull off when you have been the number one politician in the country for 4 years.
Went for a very plez oyster lunch with a friend in Soho today.
Oxford St, Regent St, and Soho now feel almost normal, with the added tedium of masks and queues, for sure - but normal. A lot of shoppers, plenty of traffic. Shops actually busy.
It was an agreeably warm sunny Autumn day but certainly not high summer, and yet the crowds were out. Restaurants pretty full. Bars mildly buzzing.
If we can avoid another calamitous national lockdown, we may also avoid economic Apocalypse. And the predictions of the End of London might prove premature.
Lockdown descends on us tomorrow - banned from leaving our home county of Conwy and banned from leaving the county to go on holiday while those here at our hotels told to go home
Went for a very plez oyster lunch with a friend in Soho today.
Oxford St, Regent St, and Soho now feel almost normal, with the added tedium of masks and queues, for sure - but normal. A lot of shoppers, plenty of traffic. Shops actually busy.
It was an agreeably warm sunny Autumn day but certainly not high summer, and yet the crowds were out. Restaurants pretty full. Bars mildly buzzing.
If we can avoid another calamitous national lockdown, we may also avoid economic Apocalypse. And the predictions of the End of London might prove premature.
Er... I think you're the only one on here who has been predicting the End of London.
Lawyers in the UK Government surely must be removed from the bar
Yes - by voting against the Labour amendment which “requires ministers to respect the rule of law and uphold the independence of the courts”, both the Lord Chancellor, Robert Buckland, and the A-G, Suella Braverman, are in breach of their oaths of office. They should be disciplined by the Bar Council frankly.
Wasn't @Cyclefree making a similar suggestion using the Falklands a week or two back?
A few weeks back and not seriously. Is Priti reading PB? If she is, can she and her stupid colleagues just bog off and stop dragging Britain’s name through the mud.
Sending them to Ascension or St Helena is an entirely sensible idea. Both are British possessions. Both need economic development. Ascension in particular is large enough to allow major improvement. And it's nice and sunny.
IF all these people want is "asylum" and "safety" rather than, say, a job in a corner shop already owned by their uncle and/or an arranged marriage with a girl they've got lined up in Khartoum then can then import, what is the problem?
They will be safe and protected by British law. They will not be raped or starved. They will have the opportunity to learn skills and prove themselves. If all goes well at the very least they are spared further suffering, at best they can then become full UK citizens. Why are we so effete we find this unacceptably mean?
I was thinking that looks like a fairly flattering photo they've used.
Is there a Labour plant in CCHQ?
It's not smug enough is it? There's surely one of him with a greasy smile - perhaps whilst shaking hands with Jean Paul Juncker or that awful Dutch one with the teeth. This feels underdeveloped.
The problem (well, a problem) with Ascension Island is that it only has a population of 805. I'm not sure it has the facilities (sewage, electricity, water, people, etc.) to add even 500 asylum seekers to that number.
Went for a very plez oyster lunch with a friend in Soho today.
Oxford St, Regent St, and Soho now feel almost normal, with the added tedium of masks and queues, for sure - but normal. A lot of shoppers, plenty of traffic. Shops actually busy.
It was an agreeably warm sunny Autumn day but certainly not high summer, and yet the crowds were out. Restaurants pretty full. Bars mildly buzzing.
If we can avoid another calamitous national lockdown, we may also avoid economic Apocalypse. And the predictions of the End of London might prove premature.
The problem (well, a problem) with Ascension Island is that it only has a population of 805. I'm not sure it has the facilities (sewage, electricity, water, people, etc.) to add even 500 asylum seekers to that number.
I actually know someone who has been there. It's basically an airbase on a rock if I remember rightly what he told me.
Comments
Shame I'm in the US, and can't play.
Biden is a low key savage
https://twitter.com/JohnRentoul/status/1311027419894161410?s=19
But I think a general rule of thumb is very few things seem to have a large impact, including campaigns - the ones that stick in our minds are rare, and the crucial moments we remember are probably reflective of the situation rather than impacting them. Though we don't want to go full historical revisionism on it and accidentally explain away every, er, explanation for something happening.
I doubt we are going to hear high quality policy based debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpuaPfOuxB0
Labour voted for the thing you won an 80 seat majority on! The thing you said was oven ready and a great deal!
I am astonished at the brazen lying of these scam artists and how so many - including some here - just eat it up
https://twitter.com/Conservatives/status/1311027739911229440
Life comes at you fast.
But no score draw seems more likely.
So nice of him to be honest about himself for once
https://news.gallup.com/poll/195923/clinton-debate-victory-larger-side-modern-debates.aspx
Written by people with false memory syndrome as far as I can tell.
What was the big thing for him were the rallies. He gets to speak unchecked and does so that i think speaks to a lot of normal Americans and not like a regular politician. And they got yuuuuuuge coverage with the media and online.
Although he is trying to do the same again this time, I don't think there is the same cut through.
https://twitter.com/ftukpolitics/status/1311033773190975489
In any case the Lords will vote it down and delay it until well into 2021
It seems underhand and ungentlemanly to target people with ads giving them reasons not to vote for the side they usually vote for, but I have already seen ones this time around targetting white Trump voters to get them to not vote for the down ballot GOP candidates even if they vote for Trump for president.
I'm tempted to just say, 'Madagascar'.
We won't have seamless trade with the whole world though, that was never pledged.
https://twitter.com/TSEofPB/status/1311038427668910083
What if there's Nothing Left?
Given Biden's past comments wanting to "beat the hell" out of Trump I wouldn't be surprised if (in the second especially) Trump tries to goad Biden into losing his temper.
Here's some of Professor Sikora's previous bullshit.
https://twitter.com/jamesrbuk/status/1308163851712638976
Physician heal thy self.
Hard to think of anyone who's made fewer correct calls than Prof Sikora.
He looks like James Bond lol
Went for a very plez oyster lunch with a friend in Soho today.
Oxford St, Regent St, and Soho now feel almost normal, with the added tedium of masks and queues, for sure - but normal. A lot of shoppers, plenty of traffic. Shops actually busy.
It was an agreeably warm sunny Autumn day but certainly not high summer, and yet the crowds were out. Restaurants pretty full. Bars mildly buzzing.
If we can avoid another calamitous national lockdown, we may also avoid economic Apocalypse. And the predictions of the End of London might prove premature.
Agree - "Brexit is done" in the voters' mind - and if its not "done" whose fault is that then?
This is Mark Drakeford, Wales FM
Is there a Labour plant in CCHQ?
IF all these people want is "asylum" and "safety" rather than, say, a job in a corner shop already owned by their uncle and/or an arranged marriage with a girl they've got lined up in Khartoum then can then import, what is the problem?
They will be safe and protected by British law. They will not be raped or starved. They will have the opportunity to learn skills and prove themselves. If all goes well at the very least they are spared further suffering, at best they can then become full UK citizens. Why are we so effete we find this unacceptably mean?
Like the use of wilting rose emoticon though.
Before Christmas?