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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The case for making “personality” ratings a good electoral ind

SystemSystem Posts: 12,169
edited June 2020 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The case for making “personality” ratings a good electoral indicator

Last month, Keir Starmer appeared on the television in my front room to give his response to the Prime Minister’s Covid-19 statement. A few seconds later my eyes glazed over,  a few more passed and I switched the tv off saying “Jesus, he is dull”. It set me thinking that in a world of Reality tv, tiktok, snapchat, (none of which I am a fan of), and general instant gratification, (which I kind of am) Starmer was too boring to be Prime Minister. Those with a keen interest in politics scrutinise policies, but it could be that a significant minority, perhaps even a small majority, of the public prefer someone they can imagine mucking in on I’m a Celebrity Get Me Out of Here. The polls are tightening, and this weeks IPSOS-MORI political monitor has Starmer ahead of Boris Johnson in favourability by 14 points, albeit with over a third not yet knowing enough about him to express an opinion. So does charisma matter?

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    First.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118

    The Met are pretty good really. They’ve learnt a lot since the tuition fees protests.

    To be fair they had have quit a bit of experience. For quite a few years we had May Day riots, which were more hardcore and violent, then the toss pot students tried to have a go. And more recently the eco-fascists.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468

    The Met are pretty good really. They’ve learnt a lot since the tuition fees protests.

    To be fair they had have quit a bit of experience. For quite a few years we had May Day riots, which were more hardcore and violent, then the toss pot students tried to have a go. And more recently the eco-fascists.
    Hey I was one of those toss pot students!
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556
    edited June 2020
    4th like Starmer after Boris, the Lib Dem leader, and Don't Know :smile:
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118

    The Met are pretty good really. They’ve learnt a lot since the tuition fees protests.

    To be fair they had have quit a bit of experience. For quite a few years we had May Day riots, which were more hardcore and violent, then the toss pot students tried to have a go. And more recently the eco-fascists.
    Hey I was one of those toss pot students!
    Point proven ;-)
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411
    Good article Isam. Makes a change from the usual Remoaner written articles 😄.

    Yes I agree Starmer won't beat Boris. Starmer will stabilise Labour but won't win a GE. Maybe Jess, it would liven things up a bit!
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118
    edited June 2020
    FFS....

    Medical experts in the US fear the use of tear gas and pepper spray by the country's police at Black Lives Matter protests will increase the risk for Covid-19.

    The concern was raised in an open letter which explained why the demonstrations are necessary despite those attending having been advised to stay at home to help prevent the spread of coronavirus. The letter was signed by 1,288 professionals in the field.

    One bullet point reads: "Oppose any use of tear gas, smoke, or other respiratory irritants, which could increase risk for Covid-19 by making the respiratory tract more susceptible to infection, exacerbating existing inflammation, and inducing coughing."
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411
    Can't the police just hit the protesters with 2m long truncheons?

    Seriously they need to clear the streets of these people, nationwide
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    Thanks @isam, I kind of know what you mean, but I think it's marginal. The 2017 election is instructive. Even when Jezza utterly trounced May in the personality stakes, he still lost.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    https://twitter.com/willchamberlain/status/1266980021450805251?s=20
  • BluestBlueBluestBlue Posts: 4,556

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    They're putting Emily Maitlis right on it...
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118
    Hopefully the Great British summer weather will mean only the most hardcore of people truly looking for trouble will stay out.
  • humbuggerhumbugger Posts: 377
    Will be very interesting to see if Starmer condemns the protesters who are behaving thuggishly in London tonight.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    Starmer doesn't need to win, just to prevent the Tories from winning.

    I think the charisma factor is largely retrospective. If Ed Miliband had beaten Dave Cameron, wouldn't he have been seen as charismatic?
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,354
    Thank you and congratulations on your first Header, Sam! May it be the first of many.

    You're right in principle, but of course personality is only one factor amongst many. I guess you are right with your Starmer bet though. At those odds, he's a lay....especially if the Tories get to replace Boris before the next GE.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,222
    St. John’s Would’ve Been Open to a Trump Photo-Op. All He Had to Do Was Ask.

    https://slate.com/human-interest/2020/06/st-johns-church-rector-rob-fisher-trump-photo-op.html
    He managed to alienate church leaders who see it as part of their mission to get along with the president.
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    Typical BBC. Always slow to react, slow to inform. That's why I watch Sky News even though it's as balanced as a Momentum meeting
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Sky presenter trying to have a go at the police and her own expert is having none of it saying the police have been excellent

    What is wrong with Sky
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    incidentally have the PB Tories seen this reverse ferret yet? Or is it just evidence of cabinet members not speaking to each other?

    https://twitter.com/SpaJw/status/1269293571527659520?s=09
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    Ave_it said:

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    Typical BBC. Always slow to react, slow to inform. That's why I watch Sky News even though it's as balanced as a Momentum meeting
    Maybe the live streams actually encourage violence and that not covering it Live is the sensible Option. There is nothing happening at the moment are the sky cameras hoping something kicks off to give them some footage?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Another Sky reporter now saying the protesters are antagonising the police
  • humbuggerhumbugger Posts: 377
    Foxy said:

    Starmer doesn't need to win, just to prevent the Tories from winning.

    I think the charisma factor is largely retrospective. If Ed Miliband had beaten Dave Cameron, wouldn't he have been seen as charismatic?

    Hell yes.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999
    Foxy said:

    incidentally have the PB Tories seen this reverse ferret yet? Or is it just evidence of cabinet members not speaking to each other?

    https://twitter.com/SpaJw/status/1269293571527659520?s=09

    'We have always been at war with poor food standards'
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411
    nichomar said:

    Ave_it said:

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    Typical BBC. Always slow to react, slow to inform. That's why I watch Sky News even though it's as balanced as a Momentum meeting
    Maybe the live streams actually encourage violence and that not covering it Live is the sensible Option. There is nothing happening at the moment are the sky cameras hoping something kicks off to give them some footage?
    Possibly. However BBC don't appear to be acknowledging that it's happening at all! (I haven't checked in the last few minutes)
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    edited June 2020
    nichomar said:

    Ave_it said:

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    Typical BBC. Always slow to react, slow to inform. That's why I watch Sky News even though it's as balanced as a Momentum meeting
    Maybe the live streams actually encourage violence and that not covering it Live is the sensible Option. There is nothing happening at the moment are the sky cameras hoping something kicks off to give them some footage?
    I have no idea what you are watching but this is a live and as Sky says a very dangerous situation.

    And of course it should be covered by the BBC

  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,608
    After 12 weeks, the wife had had enough. She's just attacked me with the scissors.

    My mullet lies on the kitchen floor....
  • eristdooferistdoof Posts: 5,065
    Glastonbury festival was a few weeks after the GE17 result.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    nichomar said:

    Ave_it said:

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    Typical BBC. Always slow to react, slow to inform. That's why I watch Sky News even though it's as balanced as a Momentum meeting
    Maybe the live streams actually encourage violence and that not covering it Live is the sensible Option. There is nothing happening at the moment are the sky cameras hoping something kicks off to give them some footage?
    I have no idea what you are watching but this is a live and as Sky says a very dangerous situation.

    And of course it should be covered by the BBC

    Turned Sky over because it was just lines of police getting wet and talking to the demonstrators.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118
    Perhaps we should run all the summer festivals after all, but make them BLM protests. All the yuff can go, have a good shout, scream, sing-along and dance give COVID to one another. Only proviso is they have to stay there for 3 weeks.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    It isn't ok, it is illegal.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    I agree with this. It's astute.

    But I think it's going to change because of coronavirus and recession and climate change. Things are going to get serious and frivolous Boris types will lose appeal. So will Boris.

    Trump in November will be a litmus. If he wins again I'm wrong.

  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    Perhaps we should run all the summer festivals after all, but make them BLM protests. All the yuff can go, have a good shout, scream, sing-along and dance give COVID to one another. Only proviso is they have to stay there for 3 weeks.

    The Notting Hill Carnival will almost certainly happen in some form anyway.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Foxy said:

    Starmer doesn't need to win, just to prevent the Tories from winning.

    I think the charisma factor is largely retrospective. If Ed Miliband had beaten Dave Cameron, wouldn't he have been seen as charismatic?

    The contemporary polls say he wasn't
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    It isn't ok, it is illegal.
    Selective enforcement is the antithesis of the rule of law.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    This will finish lockdown
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,413
    Regardless of the header, Starmer is what Labour had to have right now after Corbyn.
    Sensible, dull even. And a contrast to the PM. You can't out Boris Mr Johnson, so why try?
    What it has done is put Labour back in the game. There are plenty of Tories none too impressed with the government. Their votes are up for grabs. As are those who went blue for the first time. Along with the LDs .
    It may not be enough. There is a massive electoral hill to climb, but the first steps have been taken.
    Does anyone now question they will be one of the big two next time? Does anyone think they will go backwards?

    Both were genuinely possibilities under RLB.
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    Closer, and closer.

    https://twitter.com/Survation/status/1269326346930569222

    Waits for Survation etc..
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    This will finish lockdown
    It was finished anyway
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    This will finish lockdown
    It already has finished (if it even started), but if you think this will influence other people and how they behave, it won't.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    nichomar said:

    nichomar said:

    Ave_it said:

    The BBC news channel completely ignoring the situation in Whitehall

    Typical BBC. Always slow to react, slow to inform. That's why I watch Sky News even though it's as balanced as a Momentum meeting
    Maybe the live streams actually encourage violence and that not covering it Live is the sensible Option. There is nothing happening at the moment are the sky cameras hoping something kicks off to give them some footage?
    I have no idea what you are watching but this is a live and as Sky says a very dangerous situation.

    And of course it should be covered by the BBC

    Turned Sky over because it was just lines of police getting wet and talking to the demonstrators.
    You are not watching the same channel or are in denial
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468
    That Survation poll - oof.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    Sky presenter trying to have a go at the police and her own expert is having none of it saying the police have been excellent

    What is wrong with Sky

    Why do you watch so much Sky?

    It seems to irritate the hell out of you.
  • LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 18,434
    tlg86 said:

    Thanks @isam, I kind of know what you mean, but I think it's marginal. The 2017 election is instructive. Even when Jezza utterly trounced May in the personality stakes, he still lost.

    It's not the only determinant, but if you'd looked at it when May had a poll lead of 20+ points it might have helped you to decide to bet against a landslide.
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    This will finish lockdown
    Lockdown is basically over anyway.

    All we have got left is the government suppressing significant industry sectors which are desperate to reopen on the grounds of "science" which has no credibility or consistency
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 41,999

    After 12 weeks, the wife had had enough. She's just attacked me with the scissors.

    My mullet lies on the kitchen floor....

    What had your pet mullet ever done to her?
  • dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,300
    @isam Interesting piece, thanks for having a go.
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,060
    England currently 200/4 against West Indies

    I may be slightly late with that news...
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226

    After 12 weeks, the wife had had enough. She's just attacked me with the scissors.

    My mullet lies on the kitchen floor....

    Has she stamped on it to make absolutely sure?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    kinabalu said:

    Sky presenter trying to have a go at the police and her own expert is having none of it saying the police have been excellent

    What is wrong with Sky

    Why do you watch so much Sky?

    It seems to irritate the hell out of you.
    The contrast between their presenter and her reporters on the spot was stark
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Scott_xP said:
    This does not surprise me

    However, not sure it changes anything
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,482

    After 12 weeks, the wife had had enough. She's just attacked me with the scissors.

    My mullet lies on the kitchen floor....

    What had your pet mullet ever done to her?
    Carping about nothing if you ask me.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,413
    A frisson of joy when I put up a post saying Starmer will improve Labour's position.
    And then have the new Survation poll as the very next post.
    :smiley:
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,468

    Scott_xP said:
    This does not surprise me

    However, not sure it changes anything
    It doesn’t, but I don’t think there’s anything immediate on the horizon that is going to give the Government much popularity. If anything, everything on the horizon will be negative - job losses, austerity, tax rises, more death...
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102

    Scott_xP said:
    This does not surprise me

    However, not sure it changes anything
    It doesn’t, but I don’t think there’s anything immediate on the horizon that is going to give the Government much popularity. If anything, everything on the horizon will be negative - job losses, austerity, tax rises, more death...
    That is fair comment
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,482
    Foxy said:

    incidentally have the PB Tories seen this reverse ferret yet? Or is it just evidence of cabinet members not speaking to each other?

    https://twitter.com/SpaJw/status/1269293571527659520?s=09

    All I've seen is everyone on PB declaring that we'll be awash with unlabelled horror food from the US, with nothing to subtantiate the story. Now a Minister has said different it is some kind of U-turn!
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,060
    286 all out. I'm sure England will sort out their habit of batting collapses after this...
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    In theory you're right, in practice there's next-to-no chance of police interfering if private individuals make discreet visits to each others' homes. They have neither the numbers nor the inclination to deal with widespread, low-level rule-breaking of this kind.

    The kind of thing they're going to break up is big house and street parties. If somebody's single neighbour was having her boyfriend round her flat and they decided to ring the local constabulary to grass her up, then I imagine they'd be politely told to get lost.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    It isn't OK, though is it?
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411

    Scott_xP said:
    This does not surprise me

    However, not sure it changes anything
    Layla will sort it out!
  • humbuggerhumbugger Posts: 377

    Scott_xP said:
    This does not surprise me

    However, not sure it changes anything
    It doesn’t, but I don’t think there’s anything immediate on the horizon that is going to give the Government much popularity. If anything, everything on the horizon will be negative - job losses, austerity, tax rises, more death...
    Re-opening the pubs and restaurants may well give the government a quick win in popularity. But you are right that management of the economy will test it.

    Having said that, sooner or later Starmer will have to tell voters what he believes in and what policies will flow from that. His Brexit policy was disastrous, and he'll have to do better. He'll need an attractive and distinctive policy programme and be able to keep his party together behind it. Not easy.

    He also needs to sound interesting. When a nation needs inspiring worthy but dull will probably not be enough.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,482
    Foxy said:

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    It isn't OK, though is it?
    No it isn't. It needs to be banned, explicitly.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    edited June 2020
    Mark Wright of Sky saying this is exactly what BLM did not want to happen

    He reports that some are trying to take his cameras away

    Mark just talking to a very angry BLM demonstrator who is furious and says we have not come here for this but came here for unity, and that has gone now
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,118

    Mark Wright of Sky saying this is exactly what BLM did not want to happen

    He reports that some are trying to take his cameras away

    Mark just talking to a very angry BLM demonstrator who is furious and says we have not come here for this but came here for unity, and that has gone now

    Lets not forget a journalist was bottled in the week, because the mob thought he was from the Daily Mail. He wasn't, but that is immaterial.
  • nico67nico67 Posts: 4,502
    edited June 2020
    Starmer might be seen as dull but after 5 years of the Bozo clown show voters might be happy to have a serious , non-grandstanding politician in no 10.

  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,226
    edited June 2020
    Whilst I do think Starmer will win the next election I confess to sharing the @isam experience of watching that particular broadcast by him. He did not grab me. Indeed he lost the battle for my attention to his desk and surroundings. So he does need to work on this.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    I do find it ridiculous that this is okay, and yet people cant go to their girlfriend or boyfriend’s homes to “watch Netflix” without risking criminal penalty.

    It isn't ok, it is illegal.
    Selective enforcement is the antithesis of the rule of law.
    Policing requires either consent of the people or overwhelming force. In Britain it is impossible to enforce a law in the presence of mass disobedience.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,780
    dr_spyn said:
    The two most recent polls have the two narrowest Con leads since the GE.

    In the thread, the words "Sir Keir will not be the next PM" seem a tad overly confident.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,599
    Nice catch by Gatting.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    nico67 said:

    Starmer might be seen as dull but after 5 years of the Bozo clown show voters might be happy to have a serious , non-grandstanding politician in no 10.

    He's submerged his submarine as well
  • StuartDicksonStuartDickson Posts: 12,146
    Excellent first header. Thanks sam.

    However, you’re conclusion, if correct, is just further proof that Scottish voters have significantly different preferences in terms of style and the (perceived) personality of candidates. Which I think we all knew anyway.

    Boris is a disaster for the Scottish Tories. The jury is out on Starmer via a vis his influence on the Scottish Labour vote. Can’t see Moran being much help to the struggling SLDs.
  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,413
    Andy_JS said:

    Nice catch by Gatting.

    Have the marchers started chucking pies now?
    Or am I conflating two stories?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102

    dr_spyn said:
    The two most recent polls have the two narrowest Con leads since the GE.

    In the thread, the words "Sir Keir will not be the next PM" seem a tad overly confident.
    I have said for a long time it is impossible to know how GE 24 will play out
  • humbuggerhumbugger Posts: 377
    kinabalu said:

    Whilst I do think Starmer will win the next election I confess to sharing the @isam experience of watching that particular broadcast by him. He did not grab me. Indeed he lost the battle for my attention to his desk and surroundings. So he does need to work on this.

    With all due respect, I find it hard to believe anybody can predict the result of a GE 4 years away. If a week is a long time in politics 4 years is an eternity.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    edited June 2020
    dr_spyn said:

    Closer, and closer.

    https://twitter.com/Survation/status/1269326346930569222

    Waits for Survation etc..

    Con 314 seats, Lab 253

    NOM beckons, Starmer on a Corbyn 2017 result, but that is before tactical voting...
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,240
    Interesting header @isam, but a few questions follow.

    First, does Boris have a personality, or an act? Who was it who did the piece about being at a couple of awards dos and seeing BoJo do the same routine, word for word and tic for tic? The act might wear pretty thin- like old time music hall acts on the telly.

    Next, will Boris make it to 2024? Right now, he looks pretty unwell and pretty unhappy.

    Finally, you make a good point about first name recognition. Maggie had it, though Blair didn't need it really. SKS does by definition; he's Sir Keir. The Sir-ness puts a bit of distance, I'm sure. But I was struck by a report on this week's PMQs which described them as Sir Keir and Mr Johnson. Which one sounds bigger, more Prime Ministerial?
  • YokesYokes Posts: 1,335
    edited June 2020
    What is happening in London as of 7.15 is minor in scale. The police are just trying to section it off and the hope is those who don't fancy it will go home and those who are keen get a bit bored. Once you do section it off, then you can move in a more decisive manner if you wish or just wait.

    If you start throwing stuff, whether London or New York, Beijing or Moscow, you cannot expect the state's police not to react. Violence is violence, whatever the cause.

  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Foxy said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Closer, and closer.

    https://twitter.com/Survation/status/1269326346930569222

    Waits for Survation etc..

    Con 314 seats, Lab 253

    NOM beckons, Starmer on a Corbyn 2017 result, but that is before tactical voting...
    You are getting as bad as HYUFD
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,381
    Foxy said:

    Starmer doesn't need to win, just to prevent the Tories from winning.

    I think the charisma factor is largely retrospective. If Ed Miliband had beaten Dave Cameron, wouldn't he have been seen as charismatic?

    I think that is largely true. Blair was often referred to as Bambi in the early days. Blair's confidence grew as Major's government imploded, and as you indicate charisma came on the back of success in 1997.

    Starmer's personal ratings are currently ascending on the back of his clinical and withering victories overJohnson at PMQs. The fact that he can think before he speaks will demonstrate he is serious rather than casual and flippant. Starmer's confidence will rise should the government start to fail over the longer term. The time may also be right by 2024 for a grown up rather than a man-child-stand-up comedian. Starmer looks the part and will grow into the role.

    As for Tories claiming Jess Phillips or Lisa Nandy would be running away with the polls had they won the leadership race. I don't believe them. Much as I rate Phillips and Mandy, Tory supporters would be calling them out for their regional accents, which would demonstrate a lack of intelligence, a lack of social standing or just a demonstration of their general ignorance, irrespective of personal or educational achievement. I can say this as someone with a thick West Midlands accent, which however hard I have tried to shake it off it remains and has been a millstone throughout my career. Conversely any success would categorise them as champagne socialists.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,176
    humbugger said:

    kinabalu said:

    Whilst I do think Starmer will win the next election I confess to sharing the @isam experience of watching that particular broadcast by him. He did not grab me. Indeed he lost the battle for my attention to his desk and surroundings. So he does need to work on this.

    With all due respect, I find it hard to believe anybody can predict the result of a GE 4 years away. If a week is a long time in politics 4 years is an eternity.
    I stumbled upon this site in 2013. I remember the sense of incredulity I had when first saw Jack's ARSE, which was confidently predicting that Ed Miliband would never be PM. I was fairly sure that the Tories would be out of power after 2015. Come 21:30 on the night of the election, I was certain that Jack was right and had always been right.

    Having said that, now is a very different moment in politics. I still think the big thing for Starmer is how does he react when economic impact starts to bite. Cameron and Osborne backed the bank bailout. How will Labour react to the difficult decisions taken by the government?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720
    dr_spyn said:
    Con 317, Lab 249...
  • Ave_itAve_it Posts: 2,411

    Foxy said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Closer, and closer.

    https://twitter.com/Survation/status/1269326346930569222

    Waits for Survation etc..

    Con 314 seats, Lab 253

    NOM beckons, Starmer on a Corbyn 2017 result, but that is before tactical voting...
    You are getting as bad as HYUFD
    LAB will be ahead soon.

    That will get CHB excited!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    nico67 said:

    Starmer might be seen as dull but after 5 years of the Bozo clown show voters might be happy to have a serious , non-grandstanding politician in no 10.

    He's submerged his submarine as well
    Don't interrupt your enemy when they are making a mistake.

    Starmar is making plans, and popcorn, I expect...
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Ave_it said:

    Foxy said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Closer, and closer.

    https://twitter.com/Survation/status/1269326346930569222

    Waits for Survation etc..

    Con 314 seats, Lab 253

    NOM beckons, Starmer on a Corbyn 2017 result, but that is before tactical voting...
    You are getting as bad as HYUFD
    LAB will be ahead soon.

    That will get CHB excited!
    We are nearing the stage we will not need to vote as Sir Keir rides to the rescue !!!!!
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    edited June 2020
    Foxy said:

    nico67 said:

    Starmer might be seen as dull but after 5 years of the Bozo clown show voters might be happy to have a serious , non-grandstanding politician in no 10.

    He's submerged his submarine as well
    Don't interrupt your enemy when they are making a mistake.

    Starmar is making plans, and popcorn, I expect...

    Letter writing and avoiding making any decisions

    Lets see what he has to say about today
  • CatManCatMan Posts: 3,060
    Anyone know what the weather forecast is for London 36 years ago?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,720

    Foxy said:

    nico67 said:

    Starmer might be seen as dull but after 5 years of the Bozo clown show voters might be happy to have a serious , non-grandstanding politician in no 10.

    He's submerged his submarine as well
    Don't interrupt your enemy when they are making a mistake.

    Starmar is making plans, and popcorn, I expect...
    Letter writing and avoiding making any decisions

    Lets see what he has to say about today

    https://twitter.com/Keir_Starmer/status/1269197488554156032?s=19
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    apparently according to a young teacher my son knows the lack of social distancing at this protest is ok as its the moral thing to do.

    She accepts that going to a party would be wrong

    I never realised a virus selected its victims based on their morals.........


    Oh - she was fine to go on the protest, but not ok to go to school to work.........

    That it seems would be more dangerous......
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,149
    humbugger said:

    kinabalu said:

    Whilst I do think Starmer will win the next election I confess to sharing the @isam experience of watching that particular broadcast by him. He did not grab me. Indeed he lost the battle for my attention to his desk and surroundings. So he does need to work on this.

    With all due respect, I find it hard to believe anybody can predict the result of a GE 4 years away. If a week is a long time in politics 4 years is an eternity.
    Quite. Recent movement to Labour under Starmer has been good and encouraging for him, but there is getting a bit too confident that he's got it in the bag already.

    And 'will win' needs qualifying as there are different degrees of winning. Vote share? Most seats but not in government (not likely for Labour in fairness, with more agreement possibilities), majority? Second in seats but in power a la Jacinda Adern?
  • Northern_AlNorthern_Al Posts: 8,390
    Yokes said:

    What is happening in London as of 7.15 is minor in scale. The police are just trying to section it off and the hope is those who don't fancy it will go home and those who are keen get a bit bored. Once you do section it off, then you can move in a more decisive manner if you wish or just wait.

    If you start throwing stuff, whether London or New York, Beijing or Moscow, you cannot expect the state's police not to react. Violence is violence, whatever the cause.

    Quite so. There have been significant protests in most major UK cities today, and they have been pretty much uniformly peaceful. The police have had little to do other than normal protest march stuff. London protests usually attract a very small minority of idiots who start chucking stuff at the police, but this shouldn't detract from the overall good behaviour of thousands of protestors. My reports from the front line give accounts of good-natured protests and good relations with the police. I suspect the police will not be unhappy about how the day has turned out nationally.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,102
    Good to see labour in Scotland will campaign against indy 2 at Holyrood 21

    So SNP and Green only ones for second ref
  • logical_songlogical_song Posts: 9,914
    Foxy said:

    dr_spyn said:

    Closer, and closer.

    https://twitter.com/Survation/status/1269326346930569222

    Waits for Survation etc..

    Con 314 seats, Lab 253

    NOM beckons, Starmer on a Corbyn 2017 result, but that is before tactical voting...
    I can definitely see fewer people voting against Labour with Starmer in charge instead of Corbyn.
This discussion has been closed.