No, we should use the best Englishman or woman available, and should feel ashamed at hiring anyone without a British passport.
So, you would rather we lost test matches. Well, it's a view I guess.
I would rather lose than cheat yes
Let me fix that for you: "I would rather lose than abide by the same rules as all other teams in the competition."
"We'll it's a view I guess" and "let me fix that for you" within a couple of hours.... I don't think you need any coaching to win the annoying smugness medal
But I would rather lose than cheat, even if everyone else was cheating yes
Standards, morals and principles are not flexible for me
Usually, the word 'cheap' implies not playing by the same rules as everyone else. Having a foreign coach means playing by exactly the same rules as everyone else. If you want to change the rules, that's fine (although you will find scant support for that in the governing bodies of football or cricket). However, so long as we play according the rules, we cannot, by definition, be cheating.
But just to you remember, the bowling coach before Saker was Ottis Gibson (West Indian). The current overall coach is Andy Flower (South African). If you drift back a few years, Dene Hills (Australian) was the batting coach. In fact, if you read the Mike Brearley Ashes trilogy from the early 1980s, you will find a significant number of non-English (and Scottish, etc.) coaching and support staff. It simply has never been the case that coaching staff have been considered 'part of the team', so do you wish to accuse pretty much every English team in living memory of cheating?
No, we should use the best Englishman or woman available, and should feel ashamed at hiring anyone without a British passport.
So, you would rather we lost test matches. Well, it's a view I guess.
I would rather lose than cheat yes
Let me fix that for you: "I would rather lose than abide by the same rules as all other teams in the competition."
"We'll it's a view I guess" and "let me fix that for you" within a couple of hours.... I don't think you need any coaching to win the annoying smugness medal
But I would rather lose than cheat, even if everyone else was cheating yes
Standards, morals and principles are not flexible for me
Usually, the word 'cheap' implies not playing by the same rules as everyone else. Having a foreign coach means playing by exactly the same rules as everyone else. If you want to change the rules, that's fine (although you will find scant support for that in the governing bodies of football or cricket). However, so long as we play according the rules, we cannot, by definition, be cheating.
But just to you remember, the bowling coach before Saker was Ottis Gibson (West Indian). The current overall coach is Andy Flower (South African). If you drift back a few years, Dene Hills (Australian) was the batting coach. In fact, if you read the Mike Brearley Ashes trilogy from the early 1980s, you will find a significant number of non-English (and Scottish, etc.) coaching and support staff. It simply has never been the case that coaching staff have been considered 'part of the team', so do you wish to accuse pretty much every English team in living memory of cheating?
You mean "cheat" I suppose?
I surely have made myself clear? I would think using any person not qualified to compete for the Nation to coach the team, or a department of the team, to be cheating... there are levels, some cheating is more serious than other cheating, but it is all wrong.
If everyone else is cheating, it makes no difference
Whether it as been going on for years, or if it a new thing is irrelevant. In my eyes it is cheating.
I don't suppose it will ever change, but that doesn't alter what I think one bit. I would feel happier for any nation that succeeded in sporting competition using only their own resources, and I think they would feel prouder too,
Maybe we should ban Andy Murray in the olympics, after all he not only uses Lendl he also spent years being coached properly in Barcelona, traitor.
Never heard such nonsense.
You should read some of your own posts then!
Not saying anyone should be banned because of who coaches them
Fair enough for And Murray to be coached by whoever he likes when he is playing in individual events, but if there is such a thing as a Davis Cup coach, then that coach should have to qualify for the team the same as the players, in terms of nationality
Utter bollox. We would be world champions at cricket and football as no other countries would have learnt the sport from English coaches. Should English coaches not go to South Africa / USA and coach kids there?
on the subject of cheating in sport ,isn't it nice to recall those pure ,warming the heart moments when sportspersons not only do not cheat but also do not leave it to the umpire/ref to make a decision if they know they are in the wrong- There are not that many that come to mind in most sports but there is something uplifting watching Adam Gilchrist walking when he knew he nicked or Robbie Fowler trying to persuade the ref it wasn't a penalty for his side.
Modern sport seems a bit grubby (I wasn't proud of Stuart Broad at Trent Bridge for instance) when there is no honour amongst the competitors - Golf is becoming a little more ruthless in this regard as well
My view is that we should do everything we can within the rules of the competition to win.
I would be perfectly comfortable changing the rules in the way you suggest, however - as I made clear in a comment to state_go_away - I think that it would be basically unenforceable, as players could personally hire their own coaches (see tennis), and private individuals could donate 'advisors'.
My comments are not really about the rights and wrongs of foreign coaches. They are about the fact that we play within a set of rules that are determined by a sport's governing body. We cannot be cheating so long as we play within those rules. And we should do everything we can within those rules to win.
Maybe we should ban Andy Murray in the olympics, after all he not only uses Lendl he also spent years being coached properly in Barcelona, traitor.
Never heard such nonsense.
You should read some of your own posts then!
Not saying anyone should be banned because of who coaches them
Fair enough for And Murray to be coached by whoever he likes when he is playing in individual events, but if there is such a thing as a Davis Cup coach, then that coach should have to qualify for the team the same as the players, in terms of nationality
Utter bollox. We would be world champions at cricket and football as no other countries would have learnt the sport from English coaches. Should English coaches not go to South Africa / USA and coach kids there?
No problem at all as long as they aren't coaching the national team
on the subject of cheating in sport ,isn't it nice to recall those pure ,warming the heart moments when sportspersons not only do not cheat but also do not leave it to the umpire/ref to make a decision if they know they are in the wrong- There are not that many that come to mind in most sports but there is something uplifting watching Adam Gilchrist walking when he knew he nicked or Robbie Fowler trying to persuade the ref it wasn't a penalty for his side.
Modern sport seems a bit grubby (I wasn't proud of Stuart Broad at Trent Bridge for instance) when there is no honour amongst the competitors - Golf is becoming a little more ruthless in this regard as well
Again I completely agree with you.
I have been a bad sport many time in my life, and I am quite ashamed, but I don't cheat.
Im sure everyone on here, apart from me of course, would agree it is racist.
I used the term "pikey food" to describe frozen lasagne on here and was roundly criticized
So come on tim, Roger and all the others who piled in when I said it, lets condemn the Labour MP
In Birmingham, pikey translates to either gypsy or tramp. So it's not racist, its just offensive. Dromey spends so little time in Birmingham he wouldn't know this.
''Yet they all expressed a total loathing of the ANC and particularly Zuma, who seems hated even by blacks.''
A significant minority of the audience at last night's QT clearly thought the ANC was in the rich white man's pocket. There was manifestly support for a much more 'radical' solution.
Definite signs that the improving economy is eating into the Labour lead.
I spoke to a well-known Tory MP at a Telegraph shindig t'other day, and asked him what he REALLY thought of their electoral chances. He said there was a 10-20% chance of an overall Tory majority, but he put the odds of a continuing Tory-led Coalition at more than 50%.
He's a smart guy - one of the smartest in the party - and he was being honest.
Intriguing.
Takes a while to seep through to the non political geeks that the economy is improving.
Another 18 months to go - looks like Hodges will prove crowd on here wrong.
Comments
@TelegraphNews: Labour MP Jack Dromey accused of being racist after using the word 'pikey' http://t.co/bPwNS33uPL
http://order-order.com/2013/12/13/52-dislike-ed-balls-policies/#comments
Time for the Twitter Police to arrest him and charge him with hate crimes against humanity, theft of oxygen and removal of common sense.
But just to you remember, the bowling coach before Saker was Ottis Gibson (West Indian). The current overall coach is Andy Flower (South African). If you drift back a few years, Dene Hills (Australian) was the batting coach. In fact, if you read the Mike Brearley Ashes trilogy from the early 1980s, you will find a significant number of non-English (and Scottish, etc.) coaching and support staff. It simply has never been the case that coaching staff have been considered 'part of the team', so do you wish to accuse pretty much every English team in living memory of cheating?
Apparently Labour HQ sent out a release claiming it was an auto-correct error. The JD himself sent out another claiming it was the guys nickname.
I can only imagine the tim-a-thon if a Conservative MP had used the p-y word...
(Central forecast)
Con vote lead 7.3%
Con seat lead 57 seats
(10000 Monte Carlo simulations)
Chance of Tory vote lead: 99.9%
Chance of a Tory seat lead: 97.4%
Chance of a Hung Parliament: 63.5%
Chance of a Tory majority: 36.5%
Chance of a Labour majority: 0.0%
A recovery in Tory fortunes, after a slight weakening last month, back to more or less where it's been since May 2013.
I surely have made myself clear?
I would think using any person not qualified to compete for the Nation to coach the team, or a department of the team, to be cheating... there are levels, some cheating is more serious than other cheating, but it is all wrong.
If everyone else is cheating, it makes no difference
Whether it as been going on for years, or if it a new thing is irrelevant. In my eyes it is cheating.
I don't suppose it will ever change, but that doesn't alter what I think one bit. I would feel happier for any nation that succeeded in sporting competition using only their own resources, and I think they would feel prouder too,
You see it differently, that's your choice.
I used the term "pikey food" to describe frozen lasagne on here and was roundly criticized
So come on tim, Roger and all the others who piled in when I said it, lets condemn the Labour MP
Modern sport seems a bit grubby (I wasn't proud of Stuart Broad at Trent Bridge for instance) when there is no honour amongst the competitors - Golf is becoming a little more ruthless in this regard as well
I would be perfectly comfortable changing the rules in the way you suggest, however - as I made clear in a comment to state_go_away - I think that it would be basically unenforceable, as players could personally hire their own coaches (see tennis), and private individuals could donate 'advisors'.
My comments are not really about the rights and wrongs of foreign coaches. They are about the fact that we play within a set of rules that are determined by a sport's governing body. We cannot be cheating so long as we play within those rules. And we should do everything we can within those rules to win.
No problem at all as long as they aren't coaching the national team
I have been a bad sport many time in my life, and I am quite ashamed, but I don't cheat.
Lab 1.78
Con 2.3
A significant minority of the audience at last night's QT clearly thought the ANC was in the rich white man's pocket. There was manifestly support for a much more 'radical' solution.
And we thought we had problems...
Another 18 months to go - looks like Hodges will prove crowd on here wrong.