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  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    ydoethur said:

    Mr. Eagles, people sat down and hammered out a constitution is what I mean.

    It didn't slowly accrue over centuries of precedent.

    Actually it did, for example the Due Process clause was based on Magna Carta.

    And let us not even discuss the 33 amendments to the constitution that have slowly accrue over centuries of precedent.
    Actually it’s 27. 33 were proposed, but six were never ratified.

    The 27th Amendment is priceless - 202 years and a piqued college student required to ratify it!
    I heard that story on the radio the other day. Actually really inspiring that ordinary people can really make a difference in the US
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,218

    eek said:

    Well Germany has nothing more to be gained from the destruction the Euro has done to less productive countries so why not.
    Watching the remaining EU members fight over budget contributions must be great fun if you're a brexiteer.
    Maybe but it does show that the EU is not all harmony and that they are unified

    Dark clouds gathering for the EU but to be positive let's hope common senses prevails, and as the EU commissioner, Paul Hogan, has confirmed, the Canada deal contains all the safeguards needed and should be the basis of agreement with the UK
    I wonder if a few are wondering why they didn't back the UK more often in disputes when we were in.
    They backed the UK in a fair number of disputes. But those aren't newsworthy. Us being ganged up on by two dozen angry dwarves is.
  • mattmatt Posts: 3,789
    edited February 2020
    rcs1000 said:

    eristdoof said:


    ... on your way to the zen like calm of the men's urinal?

    What???!!!!!
    I can relate to that. At a busy show etc the womens queue is massive while the mens queue is quickly moving and complete stoic silence. Get to the urinal and its eyes up, nobody says a word, job done, go.
    It makes a difference. Some restaurants I have been to in Manhattan recently had unisex loos and being forced to wait is quite a culture shock.

    I also did a double take once at the wash basin afterwards when realising the person next to me was a woman.

    Oh sh8t I'm in the ladies!!!

    oh no of course its unisex...
    That's incredibly common in the US, and has been for some time.
    I vaguely recall Belgo having unisex lavatories in the Seven Dials branch in the mid 90s. Perhaps nobody made a fuss either way?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    ydoethur said:

    Nigelb said:

    Foxy said:

    ydoethur said:

    matt said:

    ydoethur said:

    Mr. Mango, you're comparing two nations that are entirely different. Germany was a fusion of various states into a larger whole which is why it has such a peppering of large cities all over the place. The USA was created from the ground up rather than evolving historically.

    What you're talking about is cutting England into pieces, something that was never done to Scotland. And do you propose to give these assemblies powers equal to Holyrood? Will you have Lancastrians taxed differently to Yorkshiremen? And, if not, what's the point? You're creating bureaucracy without authority and relegating English devolution to a lower level than Scotland.

    Mr. Eagles, that's a different path to assemblies or an English Parliament. I do have a problem with the mayoral position being large cities only and delinquent London politicians preventing the desired Yorkshire-wide mayoral post. A Parliament, however, must be for England, to have powers equal to those of Holyrood. Anything else is carving England to pieces or playing with glorified councils.

    I'm sorry the USA was created from the ground up rather than evolving historically?

    I mean the USA didn't start off as a handful of colonies then evolved into a 50 state federation did it?
    It was an idea that had purchase.
    Too subtle for many.
    It Gadsden conversation going.
    Sewell be next?
    It would be a Folly to make any such prediction.
    I Alaska not think of further puns about land purchase.

    Louisiana is distinctly unsympathetic to punning.
    But did Cally phone ya? To tell you what Della wore? And what did Tenny see? What it what Arkan saw?
  • rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    Well Germany has nothing more to be gained from the destruction the Euro has done to less productive countries so why not.
    Watching the remaining EU members fight over budget contributions must be great fun if you're a brexiteer.
    Maybe but it does show that the EU is not all harmony and that they are unified

    Dark clouds gathering for the EU but to be positive let's hope common senses prevails, and as the EU commissioner, Paul Hogan, has confirmed, the Canada deal contains all the safeguards needed and should be the basis of agreement with the UK
    I wonder if a few are wondering why they didn't back the UK more often in disputes when we were in.
    They backed the UK in a fair number of disputes. But those aren't newsworthy. Us being ganged up on by two dozen angry dwarves is.
    Bercow has 23 twins?
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,230
    TOPPING said:

    No missed that one but for goodness sake don't be intimidated by the people on here. Please keep posting.

    I have no choice. It's a calling. Wish it wasn't sometimes, but there you go.

    So where IS your Remainer badge? It's OK to keep it, I suppose, but what would be a bit rich would be still wearing it.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,602
    Interesting article IMO:

    "Long-read
    The use and abuse of ethnic minorities
    Why Western elites love some minorities more than others.

    SALVATORE BABONES"

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/02/21/the-use-and-abuse-of-ethnic-minorities/
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,230
    edited February 2020

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
  • EndillionEndillion Posts: 4,976

    Gabs3 said:

    Gabs3 said:

    Hardcore Trump hacks are already in charge of the Justice Department and the State Department. Now one is in charge of the Intelligence Community.

    https://twitter.com/MaxBoot/status/1230590980501516288

    This is why a second term would be far more damaging than the first.

    Funny how you fail to mention he's the most senior gay man in American politics. Homophobe.
    Firstly you're ridiculous, and secondly you're wrong, as Vice President is a more senior position than Director of National Intelligence.
    What's ridiculous about pointing out how two-faced lefties are?

    And no there have been no openly gay vice presidents.
    Where have I been two-faced? I have never called someone a homophobe for criticizing a left wing gay politician, unless the criticism specifically referred to their homosexuality.
    You called someone a racist for criticising a left wing politician.
    No, (s)he didn't. Speaking as the target of said accusation.
  • kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    We aren't Leavers anymore, we've left. There's no such thing as Leave or Remain anymore, that's history now that Brexit is done.
  • nichomarnichomar Posts: 7,483
    kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given that I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a GE that was a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    I have at last found a benefit to brexit! Last October I was on the verge of cancelling my health insurance because I had my Spanish health cards but didn’t because I didn’t trust the UK to not screw things up. I now find that it’s giving me multiple options over the next few months that I wouldn’t have had if I’d cancelled it!
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 63,105
    edited February 2020
    kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    Of course you are and campaigning to rejoin is going to appeal to many

    PS and keep posting by the way
  • eekeek Posts: 28,405

    rcs1000 said:

    eek said:

    Well Germany has nothing more to be gained from the destruction the Euro has done to less productive countries so why not.
    Watching the remaining EU members fight over budget contributions must be great fun if you're a brexiteer.
    Maybe but it does show that the EU is not all harmony and that they are unified

    Dark clouds gathering for the EU but to be positive let's hope common senses prevails, and as the EU commissioner, Paul Hogan, has confirmed, the Canada deal contains all the safeguards needed and should be the basis of agreement with the UK
    I wonder if a few are wondering why they didn't back the UK more often in disputes when we were in.
    They backed the UK in a fair number of disputes. But those aren't newsworthy. Us being ganged up on by two dozen angry dwarves is.
    Bercow has 23 twins?
    23 clones surely?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,230
    kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    There is a tendency to suggest that because we have left, we should accept the Leave arguments.
    That is pretty silly.

    Of course, for many people, unless they go on to experience personally any negative effects which they might attribute to leaving, the debate is no longer of any interest.
  • Gabs3Gabs3 Posts: 836

    kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    Of course you are and campaigning to rejoin is going to appeal to many

    PS and keep posting by the way
    Of course Rejoin doesn't have to be defined by the messy half measures of the UK's membership. We should lead in Europe and be fully in, so we can benefit like Germany.
  • NEW THREAD

  • brokenwheelbrokenwheel Posts: 3,352
    Nigelb said:

    Nigelb said:

    And no there have been no openly gay vice presidents.

    You didn't specify openly.
    No one can ever specify enough to stop a lefty trying to wriggle out of their own contradictions.

    So why aren't you celebrating the first openly gay man getting this position?
    Presumably because of his miserable character and utter unsuitability for the post ?
    Yeah but you could say the same about Hillary...
    With considerably less justification, of course you could.
    The point is if only gays/women with the "right" opinions count then it's an attitude which is homophobic/sexist itself.
  • Gabs3 said:

    kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    Of course you are and campaigning to rejoin is going to appeal to many

    PS and keep posting by the way
    Of course Rejoin doesn't have to be defined by the messy half measures of the UK's membership. We should lead in Europe and be fully in, so we can benefit like Germany.
    There's about as much chance of Alberta leading America as there is of us leading Europe.
  • Gabs3 said:

    kinabalu said:

    No point anyway. We are out

    We are all Leavers now, you mean? I have some sympathy for this view. But there are those who wish to continue to argue passionately that Brexit was a grave mistake. Like me, for example. I am still very much arguing that. And given I voted Remain on Dec 12th in a quasi EU Ref2 I am (IMO) perfectly entitled to do so.
    Of course you are and campaigning to rejoin is going to appeal to many

    PS and keep posting by the way
    Of course Rejoin doesn't have to be defined by the messy half measures of the UK's membership. We should lead in Europe and be fully in, so we can benefit like Germany.
    Germany is currently wanting to do a 'Maggie' and are demanding rebates

    The present budget discussion are in chaos as the EU argue amongst themselves

    It is not a happy place just now
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,230
    nichomar said:

    I have at last found a benefit to brexit! Last October I was on the verge of cancelling my health insurance because I had my Spanish health cards but didn’t because I didn’t trust the UK to not screw things up. I now find that it’s giving me multiple options over the next few months that I wouldn’t have had if I’d cancelled it!

    That sounds like a very good decision with hindsight. All the best with it.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,230
    Nigelb said:

    There is a tendency to suggest that because we have left, we should accept the Leave arguments.
    That is pretty silly.

    Of course, for many people, unless they go on to experience personally any negative effects which they might attribute to leaving, the debate is no longer of any interest.

    Well, yes, that would be silly. My sense, though, is that the argument is going to largely fade away. I think for an awful lot of Leavers, just the act of doing it is sufficient. And for most Remainers, we will adjust to the new reality.
  • MangoMango Posts: 1,019
    Endillion said:


    Well, she's demonstrably not Native American, and I had no idea there was such a stereotype. Without that knowledge, I think it's pretty clear that I am mocking Warren, and only Warren. But I am happy to be educated otherwise, and withdraw the comment, with apologies.

    I think you just increased the average dignity of the internet by a point or two. Well played.
  • MangoMango Posts: 1,019



    We aren't Leavers anymore, we've left. There's no such thing as Leave or Remain anymore, that's history now that Brexit is done.

    Ok Leaver.
  • I'm only really here for the us elections at this point. There's not much which I care about to predict in uk politics for a while except the Labour leadership which looks like a foregone conclusion.

    It is I think instructive to compare how the parallel contest to choose the person who leads in taking on the incumbent government are panning out in the US and UK. In the US, the various candidates have resorted to knocking spots off each other in very public debates even though doing so is to the significant benefit of the incumbent Trump. In the UK, by contrast, and to the Labour Party's credit I think, the public debates have been conducted in a way which avoids overt attacks on other candidates (although RLB has made some indirect attacks). Starmer I am sure also realises that he is going to win so is mindful of the next step of ensuring that the party stays together in the wake of his victory.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,623
    Andy_JS said:

    Interesting article IMO:

    "Long-read
    The use and abuse of ethnic minorities
    Why Western elites love some minorities more than others.

    SALVATORE BABONES"

    https://www.spiked-online.com/2020/02/21/the-use-and-abuse-of-ethnic-minorities/

    That’s a really interesting and worthwhile commentary on modern identity politics.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,609
    Mango said:



    We aren't Leavers anymore, we've left. There's no such thing as Leave or Remain anymore, that's history now that Brexit is done.

    Ok Leaver.
    Ok Loser.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,484
    DavidL said:

    The problem that Labour has in Scotland is that they have never worked out how to take on the SNP. In Scotland they kept their base docile for decades on the simple mantra of keep the Tories out, even in seats where the Tories were touch and go about losing their deposit.

    Focusing on another leftish party as the enemy has proved intellectually just too difficult. Why should someone who is centre left vote Labour instead of SNP. If its centralist, statist bureaucratic, higher tax and economically doomed policies with various freebies thrown in that you want the SNP give you everything you need, probably more. The other difficulty of moving away from KTTO is that you actually need to have some ideas, another intellectual Everest that SLAB have found insuperable.

    Through most of my adult life Labour were the party of the Scottish establishment. Their placemen were everywhere, if you wanted to get on in public life you towed the line and signed up to every piece of nonsense that was in vogue. The SNP are now acquiring similar dominance and without these placemen who at least knew something about how society actually works Labour looks totally bereft.

    I am not sure that I see a way back. Recent equivocation has even lost them the title of the defenders of the Union. They have absolutely nothing to offer.

    Perhaps they will be the repository of some disappointed SNP returners when the upper echelons of that party seem determined to outdo each other in the sleaze scandal stakes.
This discussion has been closed.