I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
Interesting. A Boris-Jezza pact looks to be on the cards. Boris's having no qualms about humiliating the ERG certainly fits in with that.
Jezza will not make a pact with the Tories under any circumstances whatsoever.
Maybe. But both Corbyn and Boris have an interest in seeing Brexit completed - in the expecation that both the LibDems and the Brexit Party will decline in the polls as Brexit loses its salience. Lab & Con need a return to conventional politics and this may be the easiest and quickest way to achieve it.
So some appointments of Conservative BAME MPs to high office are tokenism and others aren't. Thank goodness you are able so acutely to distinguish which is which.
Javid is a former high flying banker who has previously held a great office of state. Patel is a former tobacco/alcohol lobbyist who recently was fired/resigned from cabinet in disgrace for conducting her own foreign policy and lying to the PM.
And is also a bonkers Brexiter which I believe was perhaps the more pertinent aspect to her CV.
Not being snarky but people have been saying that on HERE for days now. So what's the significance of someone on Twitter saying what's been said here repeatedly?
1) Mrs Thatcher cut the navy. 2) Argentina (as had been predicted and as the government had been warned) invaded. 3) War. 4) Mrs Thatcher made yet more cuts to the navy so the armada could not be re-assembled. 5) John Nott walked out when challenged on this by Robin Day.
For all your sophistry, you do not seem to be challenging the facts of the cuts. It is Conservative governments that have decimated the armed forces. Putin would vote Tory.
Your point is that by cutting policemen it is all of a sudden the victims' fault that they are mugged/shot/burgled. And by cutting the Royal Navy, it was Thatcher's fault that Argentina invaded the Falkland Islands.
That would be quite funny if it wasn't so worrying.
No, my point is that it has been Conservative governments that cut the armed forces and the police. This is counterintuitive because the Tories are generally held to be strong on defence and law & order. The cuts later came home to roost.
So some appointments of Conservative BAME MPs to high office are tokenism and others aren't. Thank goodness you are able so acutely to distinguish which is which.
Javid is a former high flying banker who has previously held a great office of state. Patel is a former tobacco/alcohol lobbyist who recently was fired/resigned from cabinet in disgrace for conducting her own foreign policy and lying to the PM.
But.. still a step forward from appointing a *60 year old, white, male* tobacco lobbyist who got fired in disgrace
Not being snarky but people have been saying that on HERE for days now. So what's the significance of someone on Twitter saying what's been said here repeatedly?
She's a constitutional expert at the Institute of Government.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Define "Older" ...
Being on the wrong side of 50 my detailed assessment is that I believe he lacks a spine (reportedly run away from too many awkward situations), his pronouncements on race and colour convince me that he is anything but tolerant and if he has a plan we are yet to hear it rather than the vague objectives that he blusters about.
Executive summary: I cannot think of a role he is fit for, but PM is not it. If he worked me I would fire him.
1) Mrs Thatcher cut the navy. 2) Argentina (as had been predicted and as the government had been warned) invaded. 3) War. 4) Mrs Thatcher made yet more cuts to the navy so the armada could not be re-assembled. 5) John Nott walked out when challenged on this by Robin Day.
For all your sophistry, you do not seem to be challenging the facts of the cuts. It is Conservative governments that have decimated the armed forces. Putin would vote Tory.
Your point is that by cutting policemen it is all of a sudden the victims' fault that they are mugged/shot/burgled. And by cutting the Royal Navy, it was Thatcher's fault that Argentina invaded the Falkland Islands.
That would be quite funny if it wasn't so worrying.
No, my point is that it has been Conservative governments that cut the armed forces and the police. This is counterintuitive because the Tories are generally held to be strong on defence and law & order. The cuts later came home to roost.
Indeed. The army is now almost 1/3 smaller than it was in 2010.
Not being snarky but people have been saying that on HERE for days now. So what's the significance of someone on Twitter saying what's been said here repeatedly?
She's a constitutional expert at the Institute of Government.
Fair enough, but it's not news to anyone here how things may play out. The EU's position and the parliamentary artihmetic have made a general election fought for a no-deal Brexit mandate a likely outcome for many months now, and nothing Boris has said or done has changed that.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
I obviously move in more decorous circles. His arrival has been noted on my facebook feed (which is studiously unpolitical most of the time). Almost all the comment has come from older women. None of it has been complimentary.
Sample:
"Oh God BORIS,! It's true what they say then, America sneezes and we get flu. Or the fool in this case, who'd vote for a man that can't find himself a decent barber. Oh that's right the USA."
This from a woman who has used the phrase "suck it up buttercup" about the referendum result.
If, say, Estonia is invaded by Russia at a time when Britain's Prime Minister is Jeremy Corbyn, do you think Britain would send troops
The Baltic membership of NATO is for deterrence purposes only. If that deterrent fails no NATO member is going to fight the Russian army through the streets of Tallinn no matter who the PM is.
Eh? How does that work as a deterrence then?
Probably not that well in the long term. Do you think the British public and government have the stomach to take hundreds of KIAs every day fighting for fucking Estonia? Because I don't. I was in Basra and the mission there just became don't do anything that might risk casualties and uncomfortable headlines.
I always thought the way it worked was that by risking hundred of casualties in Talinn, we avoid tens of thousands of casualties in Berlin.
Try getting on a soapbox and selling that concept during an election, as the coffins arrive every hour on non-stop news channels.
I guess that's the real problem with politics right now.
I'm going to use an analogy. In the 1980s, the Mexican government got into really serious financial trouble, and the then US Treasury Secretary put in place a system where the US guaranteed Mexican debt. (These were named in his honour, Brady Bonds.)
This led to a huge amount of criticism: why were US taxpayers being put on the hook for the profligacy of Mexican politicians? But it was, of course, the right call. It would have been far more expensive for the US if the Mexican government had gone to the wall. The US recognised that taking on a small amount of risk now, was far cheaper in the long run.
And that's the principle of NATO. We accept that we need to defend places far from home, because stopping an aggressive and expansionary country gets more expensive each time around. Stopping Hitler in the Saarland would have resulted in far fewer deaths, wouldn't it?
Have our horizons become so shrunk, that we risk terrible outcomes to avoid local pain? It's the psychology of the heroin addict, shutting out the real world for now, irrespective of the long term consequences of our actions.
It's already past that point. Russian seizure of Crimea and eastern Ukraine contradict the guarantees of Ukrainian territorial integrity that we signed up to in the Memorandum when they handed their nukes over to Russia.
At least in the 1930s we had begun to rearm, while we've continued to cut and pour immense resources into a pair of aircraft carriers that will be sod all use in a conflict with Russia.
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
For what it's worth, Boris' early moves have made me less likely to vote for him, not more.
That said, my constituency is still a blue-red marginal. In a forced choice between those options, it'd take a lot for me to do anything other than vote Conservative (so long as Corbyn or his ilk is Labour leader).
So some appointments of Conservative BAME MPs to high office are tokenism and others aren't. Thank goodness you are able so acutely to distinguish which is which.
Javid is a former high flying banker who has previously held a great office of state. Patel is a former tobacco/alcohol lobbyist who recently was fired/resigned from cabinet in disgrace for conducting her own foreign policy and lying to the PM.
And is also a bonkers Brexiter which I believe was perhaps the more pertinent aspect to her CV.
I'm staggered she was welcomed back to Cabinet, let alone given one of the Offices of State. Forget the death penalty appearance on Question Time, as embarassing as it was, and remember why she was fired.
No, not for running a parallel foreign policy. (For that, she merely got ticked off.)
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
It's already past that point. Russian seizure of Crimea and eastern Ukraine contradict the guarantees of Ukrainian territorial integrity that we signed up to in the Memorandum when they handed their nukes over to Russia.
At least in the 1930s we had begun to rearm, while we've continued to cut and pour immense resources into a pair of aircraft carriers that will be sod all use in a conflict with Russia.
Yes, but Ukraine is not a member of NATO. Furthermore, we are signatories to various treaties which guarantee the right of peoples to self determination. And, it's fair to say, that the people of Crimea would probably choose Russia over Ukraine.
While I share your low opinion of most of the cabinet, particularly Williamson and Patel, Raab at the FCO is a different kettle of fish. He has years of experience working at the FCO in the New Labour era, indeed a CV which suits a SJW, including human rights activism, working for the ICC, Liberty and even Palestinian government. From Wikipedia:
"After leaving Cambridge, Raab worked at Linklaters in London, completing his two-year training contract at the firm and then leaving shortly after qualifying as a solicitor in 2000. Whilst at Linklaters he worked on project finance, international litigation and competition law. This included time on secondments at Liberty (the human rights NGO) and in Brussels advising on EU and WTO law.[15][third-party source needed] He spent the summer of 1998 at Birzeit University near Ramallah, Palestine's de facto capital on the West Bank, where he worked for one of the principal Palestinian negotiators of the Oslo peace accords, assessing World Bank projects on the West Bank.
Raab joined the Foreign Office in 2000, covering a range of briefs including leading a team at the British Embassy in The Hague, dedicated to bringing war criminals to justice. After returning to London, he advised on the Arab–Israeli conflict, the European Union, and Gibraltar. "
He’s only just found out Britain is an island off the coast of France.
I have had applicants for jobs with similar sorts of CVs: on paper they appear to have all the right qualifications and experience but look carefully. They are “parts of teams”, they “worked for” someone who did something. There is a carefully scripted vagueness about what they actually did. And when interviewed, it tends to fall apart. In practice Raab has been useless in office and has got himself a reputation for untrustworthiness in the EU, which is not a great start for a Foreign Secretary.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
Of course, those women have pre-selected themselves. If they loathed Boris they would not be there to throw their knickers granny-pants at him.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Define "Older" ...
Being on the wrong side of 50 my detailed assessment is that I believe he lacks a spine (reportedly run away from too many awkward situations), his pronouncements on race and colour convince me that he is anything but tolerant and if he has a plan we are yet to hear it rather than the vague objectives that he blusters about.
Executive summary: I cannot think of a role he is fit for, but PM is not it. If he worked me I would fire him.
Surrounded by over-60 women who routinely vote Tory in national elections, my experience tallies with Alastair's. Even the most committed Leavers loathe Johnson.
They don't vote Tory from ideology, commitment to free enterprise or even a favourable view of their Tory MP: they simply believed - till Johnson emerged as a likely leader - that Tories can be relied on to manage the economy, defend the country, keep law & order, and treat the lower orders with some dignity.
All that dissolves with Johnson. They smell a spiv. A few more will definitely vote Green, but most will vote LibDem. Would they revert if the Tories had a grownup leader? Possibly not till the following election cycle: in a few cases never
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
That's a fair point.
We have at least two members of the four great offices of state who have been fired for lying. The President of the United States wouldn't know what truth was if it hit him with a stick.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
According to Iain Dale there is a convention that a minister fired for an impropriety should not be bought back until they have faced the electorate i.e. after the following GE.
... There is a carefully scripted vagueness about what they actually did. And when interviewed, it tends to fall apart. In practice Raab has been useless in office and has got himself a reputation for untrustworthiness in the EU, which is not a great start for a Foreign Secretary.
So some appointments of Conservative BAME MPs to high office are tokenism and others aren't. Thank goodness you are able so acutely to distinguish which is which.
Javid is a former high flying banker who has previously held a great office of state. Patel is a former tobacco/alcohol lobbyist who recently was fired/resigned from cabinet in disgrace for conducting her own foreign policy and lying to the PM.
And is also a bonkers Brexiter which I believe was perhaps the more pertinent aspect to her CV.
I'm staggered she was welcomed back to Cabinet, let alone given one of the Offices of State. Forget the death penalty appearance on Question Time, as embarassing as it was, and remember why she was fired.
No, not for running a parallel foreign policy. (For that, she merely got ticked off.)
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Well Gavin Williamson has (allegedly**) lied to the PM, police and also leaked national security secrets. That seems to equate to 'slightly less of a promotion than might otherwise have been expected'.
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
They increased their number of seats by 50%. What was the percentage increase for Labour?
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
So some appointments of Conservative BAME MPs to high office are tokenism and others aren't. Thank goodness you are able so acutely to distinguish which is which.
Javid is a former high flying banker who has previously held a great office of state. Patel is a former tobacco/alcohol lobbyist who recently was fired/resigned from cabinet in disgrace for conducting her own foreign policy and lying to the PM.
And is also a bonkers Brexiter which I believe was perhaps the more pertinent aspect to her CV.
I'm staggered she was welcomed back to Cabinet, let alone given one of the Offices of State. Forget the death penalty appearance on Question Time, as embarassing as it was, and remember why she was fired.
No, not for running a parallel foreign policy. (For that, she merely got ticked off.)
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Boris sacked for lying to his boss. Patel sacked for lying to her boss. Williamson sacked as boss thought him to be lying. Leadsom accused of misleading over her CV. Jenrick accused of misleading over his CV. Then we come the master, Grant Shapps....
Clearly honesty is not a priority in this government.
Surrounded by over-60 women who routinely vote Tory in national elections, my experience tallies with Alastair's. Even the most committed Leavers loathe Johnson.
They don't vote Tory from ideology, commitment to free enterprise or even a favourable view of their Tory MP: they simply believed - till Johnson emerged as a likely leader - that Tories can be relied on to manage the economy, defend the country, keep law & order, and treat the lower orders with some dignity.
All that dissolves with Johnson. They smell a spiv. A few more will definitely vote Green, but most will vote LibDem. Would they revert if the Tories had a grownup leader? Possibly not till the following election cycle: in a few cases never
That all sounds about right. My Tory votes in the past were focused on being "relied on to manage the economy, defend the country, keep law & order"
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Boris Johnson was fired from The Times for lying, wasn't he?
1) Mrs Thatcher cut the navy. 2) Argentina (as had been predicted and as the government had been warned) invaded. 3) War. 4) Mrs Thatcher made yet more cuts to the navy so the armada could not be re-assembled. 5) John Nott walked out when challenged on this by Robin Day.
For all your sophistry, you do not seem to be challenging the facts of the cuts. It is Conservative governments that have decimated the armed forces. Putin would vote Tory.
Your point is that by cutting policemen it is all of a sudden the victims' fault that they are mugged/shot/burgled. And by cutting the Royal Navy, it was Thatcher's fault that Argentina invaded the Falkland Islands.
That would be quite funny if it wasn't so worrying.
No, my point is that it has been Conservative governments that cut the armed forces and the police. This is counterintuitive because the Tories are generally held to be strong on defence and law & order. The cuts later came home to roost.
Indeed. The army is now almost 1/3 smaller than it was in 2010.
Because Labour's profligate spending meant tough choices were necessary.
In 2010 for every £4 of spending, £1 was borrowed.
Now for every £34 of spending, £1 was borrowed.
How do you suppose we as a nation could have fixed Labour's mess without some cuts from 2010?
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Boris Johnson was fired from The Times for lying, wasn't he?
Boris Johnson worked for The Times when he was PM?
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
Of course, those women have pre-selected themselves. If they loathed Boris they would not be there to throw their knickers granny-pants at him.
Please, Beverley, it's many hours till the watershed!
Mr. P, interesting tweet, if accurate (loss of Grayling, very pro-leave and pro-Boris, indicates it might be). If Boris can't even get the hardliners behind him, he's got half a faction.
Difficult to oust a PM. Not so hard to undermine one.
We know he doesn’t have the votes to get the (or his) WA through the HoC. So it looks like he’ll either play Russian roulette with Parliament, or go for a GE if forced.
There’s talk of these magical 40 Labour MPs who might somehow vote it through. They won’t materialise.
Any Labour MPs voting with Johnson would almost certainly be voting to end their political careers. A few are standing down at the next GE, though, so he could get those. Hoey is a given.
Is everyone left in the PLP so browbeaten, resigned or unambitious that they can't muster another challenge to Corbyn?
Johnson has banked on an immediate bounce and that any significant electoral surge for the LDs will damage Labour MP numbers. Under FPTP this will enhance seat numbers for the Tories. The LDs excitement at knocking Labour into third in terms of vote share still leaves us with Johnson.
Johnson can only be pegged back from his 35% voteshare landslide in two ways. A stronger-Corbyn-free Labour leading the charge or mass defections to the LDs by Corbyn-fearng Labour MPs. They need to get off their sorry rumps and do one or tge other.
It speaks volumes too that good people on the Tory side like Grieve are so tribal they too feel they have to stay with the Party and hold their noses. I suspect many, many Tory voters opposed to Johnson will do the same.
At present Johnson looks invincible, all the stars have aligned for a small window at least.
But there can be no election now until 10th October - even if Johnson tries to call it himself. After two and a half months in office he will not be that new. To capitalize on any bounce , he needed to call the election yesterday for early September.
So some appointments of Conservative BAME MPs to high office are tokenism and others aren't. Thank goodness you are able so acutely to distinguish which is which.
Javid is a former high flying banker who has previously held a great office of state. Patel is a former tobacco/alcohol lobbyist who recently was fired/resigned from cabinet in disgrace for conducting her own foreign policy and lying to the PM.
And is also a bonkers Brexiter which I believe was perhaps the more pertinent aspect to her CV.
I'm staggered she was welcomed back to Cabinet, let alone given one of the Offices of State. Forget the death penalty appearance on Question Time, as embarassing as it was, and remember why she was fired.
No, not for running a parallel foreign policy. (For that, she merely got ticked off.)
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Boris sacked for lying to his boss. Patel sacked for lying to her boss. Williamson sacked as boss thought him to be lying. Leadsom accused of misleading over her CV. Jenrick accused of misleading over his CV. Then we come the master, Grant Shapps....
Clearly honesty is not a priority in this government.
"It is complete balderdash. It is an inverted pyramid of piffle. It is all completely untrue and ludicrous conjecture. I am amazed people can write this drivel." - Boris, 2004.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Define "Older" ...
Being on the wrong side of 50 my detailed assessment is that I believe he lacks a spine (reportedly run away from too many awkward situations), his pronouncements on race and colour convince me that he is anything but tolerant and if he has a plan we are yet to hear it rather than the vague objectives that he blusters about.
Executive summary: I cannot think of a role he is fit for, but PM is not it. If he worked me I would fire him.
You’re far too soft. I’d never have hired him. He’d make a good subject for one of my investigations.
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
I'm not sure anyone is extrapolating are they (other than in fun)? We all know about the LDs in by elections. But really what do you expect them to do when these results come in? Stuff is happening nationally with all the parties. The LDs were dead and buried and now they are revived. Whether it leads to anything is another matter. You are being a sourpuss if you can't let them have some joy with it.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
Of course, those women have pre-selected themselves. If they loathed Boris they would not be there to throw their knickers granny-pants at him.
Oi!! Granny pants are very useful things. We cannot have everything going south when we garden.
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
They increased their number of seats by 50%. What was the percentage increase for Labour?
But...the LibDems got some good local election results just prior to the 2015 election too. Before they were marmalised.....
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
On his first outing in the Commons as pm BJ stated that Nicola Sturgeon became FM without a vote. That was a lie.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
Of course, those women have pre-selected themselves. If they loathed Boris they would not be there to throw their knickers granny-pants at him.
Oi!! Granny pants are very useful things. We cannot have everything going south when we garden.
I don't think I understand that and I have a feeling I don't want to.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Boris Johnson was fired from The Times for lying, wasn't he?
Boris Johnson worked for The Times when he was PM?
Boris Johnson, who is Prime Minister, was previously fired from a job for lying.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
On his first outing in the Commons as pm BJ stated that Nicola Sturgeon became FM without a vote. That was a lie.
When did the Scottish public vote to make Sturgeon PM?
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Boris Johnson was fired from The Times for lying, wasn't he?
Boris Johnson worked for The Times when he was PM?
Boris Johnson, who is Prime Minister, was previously fired from a job for lying.
Better?
Better.
Everyone has a past. Big difference between past mistakes [in this case wasn't it nearly 3 decades ago?] and malfeasance in office.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Well, I suppose saying she wouldn't call a GE and then doing so would meet the usual criterion.
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
They increased their number of seats by 50%. What was the percentage increase for Labour?
But...the LibDems got some good local election results just prior to the 2015 election too. Before they were marmalised.....
The trend for the LibDems in the 2010-2015 local elections was appalling, though. They stopped even standing in wards they used to win. Indeed, on this board, the disaster of their position in local government, and their collapse in councillor numbers was used as evidence that they were never coming back.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Boris Johnson was fired from The Times for lying, wasn't he?
Boris Johnson worked for The Times when he was PM?
Boris Johnson, who is Prime Minister, was previously fired from a job for lying.
Better?
Better.
Everyone has a past. Big difference between past mistakes [in this case wasn't it nearly 3 decades ago?] and malfeasance in office.
15 years ago:
"I have not had an affair with Petronella. It is complete balderdash. It is an inverted pyramid of piffle. It is all completely untrue and ludicrous conjecture. I am amazed people can write this drivel." - Boris, 2004.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
Boris Johnson was fired from The Times for lying, wasn't he?
Boris Johnson worked for The Times when he was PM?
Boris Johnson, who is Prime Minister, was previously fired from a job for lying.
Better?
Better.
Everyone has a past. Big difference between past mistakes [in this case wasn't it nearly 3 decades ago?] and malfeasance in office.
15 years ago:
"I have not had an affair with Petronella. It is complete balderdash. It is an inverted pyramid of piffle. It is all completely untrue and ludicrous conjecture. I am amazed people can write this drivel." - Boris, 2004.
21 years ago:
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky."
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
They increased their number of seats by 50%. What was the percentage increase for Labour?
But...the LibDems got some good local election results just prior to the 2015 election too. Before they were marmalised.....
The trend for the LibDems in the 2010-2015 local elections was appalling, though. They stopped even standing in wards they used to win. Indeed, on this board, the disaster of their position in local government, and their collapse in councillor numbers was used as evidence that they were never coming back.
Back then, nobody reckoned on the power of The Re-animator - Theresa May!
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
On his first outing in the Commons as pm BJ stated that Nicola Sturgeon became FM without a vote. That was a lie.
When did the Scottish public vote to make Sturgeon PM?
PM? They never have had a vote to make her PM and never will.
The Scottish Parliament votes on who becomes FM, in 2014 NS won with 66 votes, Ruth lost comprehensively with 15 votes. Perhaps the mother of parliaments might care to look into such exercises of democratic accountability.
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
Not if the PM was also fired for telling lies...
What lie did the PM tell...
On his first outing in the Commons as pm BJ stated that Nicola Sturgeon became FM without a vote. That was a lie.
When did the Scottish public vote to make Sturgeon PM?
PM? They never have had a vote to make her PM and never will.
The Scottish Parliament votes on who becomes FM, in 2015 NS won with 66 votes, Ruth lost comprehensively with 15 votes. Perhaps the mother of parliaments might care to look into such exercises of democratic accountability.
Typo, FM.
So the public never voted? If Parliament wants to hold a vote on Boris, Parliament is entitled to do so. LOTO Corbyn chose to waive holding a vote.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
I obviously move in more decorous circles. His arrival has been noted on my facebook feed (which is studiously unpolitical most of the time). Almost all the comment has come from older women. None of it has been complimentary.
Sample:
"Oh God BORIS,! It's true what they say then, America sneezes and we get flu. Or the fool in this case, who'd vote for a man that can't find himself a decent barber. Oh that's right the USA."
This from a woman who has used the phrase "suck it up buttercup" about the referendum result.
My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was making the best of a bad situation, commented on our family whatsapp group that Boris was completely unsuitable as PM, not because of his political record but because of his attitude to women.
1) Mrs Thatcher cut the navy. 2) Argentina (as had been predicted and as the government had been warned) invaded. 3) War. 4) Mrs Thatcher made yet more cuts to the navy so the armada could not be re-assembled. 5) John Nott walked out when challenged on this by Robin Day.
For all your sophistry, you do not seem to be challenging the facts of the cuts. It is Conservative governments that have decimated the armed forces. Putin would vote Tory.
Your point is that by cutting policemen it is all of a sudden the victims' fault that they are mugged/shot/burgled. And by cutting the Royal Navy, it was Thatcher's fault that Argentina invaded the Falkland Islands.
That would be quite funny if it wasn't so worrying.
No, my point is that it has been Conservative governments that cut the armed forces and the police. This is counterintuitive because the Tories are generally held to be strong on defence and law & order. The cuts later came home to roost.
Indeed. The army is now almost 1/3 smaller than it was in 2010.
Because Labour's profligate spending meant tough choices were necessary.
In 2010 for every £4 of spending, £1 was borrowed.
Now for every £34 of spending, £1 was borrowed.
How do you suppose we as a nation could have fixed Labour's mess without some cuts from 2010?
The global financial crisis was not Labour's mess and the answer to your question is through economic growth, which is the natural state of the economy, rather than flatlining the recovery inherited from Labour.
Leaving that to one side, it is idle to pretend you could cut tens of thousands of boats, tommies and coppers without reducing our capacity to protect Rolex-wearers and oil tankers. Of course, crime adds to GDP so there is that!
The No Deal diehards like Baker and Francois are basically Brexit Party anyway, even refusing to vote for the Withdrawal Agreement at MV3 thus resulting in us still being in the EU.
Much like the diehard Remainers like Greening and Grieve who voted against both the Withdrawal Agreement and No Deal and are basically LDs who want to stop Brexit
The attempts to extrapolate Parliamentary election outcomes from local election by elections is frankly daft and naive.We saw big LibDem successes at these 'pavement poltics' by elections for several months prior to the 2017 election - plus their win at the Richmond by election courtesy of Zac Goldsmith. How well did that work out for them?
I'm not sure anyone is extrapolating are they (other than in fun)? We all know about the LDs in by elections. But really what do you expect them to do when these results come in? Stuff is happening nationally with all the parties. The LDs were dead and buried and now they are revived. Whether it leads to anything is another matter. You are being a sourpuss if you can't let them have some joy with it.
The Brecon and Radnor parliamentary one next week will be interesting. I had it nailed-on as LD.. but if a Boris Bounce lets the (convicted) Tory hold on, that will be somewhat narrative-altering.
I'd like to see some detailed polling about how Boris Johnson is regarded by older women. My anecdotal experience is that even fervent Leavers in that group are not impressed.
Depends. You haven't been waiting in a hall or dinner at which there are plenty of older women, just before Boris was due to walk in. They just about restrained themselves from whipping off their undergarments.
I obviously move in more decorous circles. His arrival has been noted on my facebook feed (which is studiously unpolitical most of the time). Almost all the comment has come from older women. None of it has been complimentary.
Sample:
"Oh God BORIS,! It's true what they say then, America sneezes and we get flu. Or the fool in this case, who'd vote for a man that can't find himself a decent barber. Oh that's right the USA."
This from a woman who has used the phrase "suck it up buttercup" about the referendum result.
My wife, who is not very interested in politics and thought Theresa May was making the best of a bad situation, commented on our family whatsapp group that Boris was completely unsuitable as PM, not because of his political record but because of his attitude to women.
I am sure she is not alone in taking that view.
I think my mum would agree with that, judging from her recent comments
For what it's worth, Boris' early moves have made me less likely to vote for him, not more.
That said, my constituency is still a blue-red marginal. In a forced choice between those options, it'd take a lot for me to do anything other than vote Conservative (so long as Corbyn or his ilk is Labour leader).
Do you not have a Yorkshire First candidate, Morris, or something of that ilk? He/she won't get in, but you'll feel a lot better about it afterwards.
I wonder who he thinks Boris is going to negotiate with? AIUI, the EU Team is disbanded. Gone. Exit stage left pursued by a Johnson
People keep saying this "EU team is disbanded" stuff but actually Barnier is still there and he said even yesterday that he remains available for talks with the UK through the summer.
If the talks hit a breakthrough, whether it be with Barnier or Varadkar, it won't take long to fill the formalities to get an amendment made. Though it does look like the EU may decide to see what the next General Election brings instead.
Barnier has recently retweeted Junckers conversation with Boris. The WA is not open for negotiation, though they would consider changes to the PD that are compatible with the WA. The EU27 have been very consistent in not undermining each other.
Big big mistake not to get Steve Baker on board. Fighting on one flank is near impossible, but having this on the Brexity flank makes life impossible. Maybe Steve Baker needs to believe in Britain more?
Comments
https://www.conservativehome.com/parliament/2019/07/johnsons-ministerial-appointments.html
Being on the wrong side of 50
Executive summary: I cannot think of a role he is fit for, but PM is not it. If he worked me I would fire him.
Sajid, meet Anthony Barber.
Sample:
"Oh God BORIS,! It's true what they say then, America sneezes and we get flu. Or the fool in this case, who'd vote for a man that can't find himself a decent barber. Oh that's right the USA."
This from a woman who has used the phrase "suck it up buttercup" about the referendum result.
At least in the 1930s we had begun to rearm, while we've continued to cut and pour immense resources into a pair of aircraft carriers that will be sod all use in a conflict with Russia.
Do we have to wait for Sunday?
That said, my constituency is still a blue-red marginal. In a forced choice between those options, it'd take a lot for me to do anything other than vote Conservative (so long as Corbyn or his ilk is Labour leader).
No, not for running a parallel foreign policy. (For that, she merely got ticked off.)
She was fired for lying to the Prime Minister. The Prime Minister asked her a direct question. Mrs Patel looked into her heart, and decided it would be easier to lie.
Maybe I'm an idiot, but shouldn't that disqualify you from any ministerial post?
https://link.springer.com/book/10.1057/9781137032249
So, it's not an analagous situation.
They don't vote Tory from ideology, commitment to free enterprise or even a favourable view of their Tory MP: they simply believed - till Johnson emerged as a likely leader - that Tories can be relied on to manage the economy, defend the country, keep law & order, and treat the lower orders with some dignity.
All that dissolves with Johnson. They smell a spiv. A few more will definitely vote Green, but most will vote LibDem. Would they revert if the Tories had a grownup leader? Possibly not till the following election cycle: in a few cases never
We have at least two members of the four great offices of state who have been fired for lying. The President of the United States wouldn't know what truth was if it hit him with a stick.
We're fucked, aren't we?
If I had voted for this I would be ashamed right now
Classy.
Patel sacked for lying to her boss.
Williamson sacked as boss thought him to be lying.
Leadsom accused of misleading over her CV.
Jenrick accused of misleading over his CV.
Then we come the master, Grant Shapps....
Clearly honesty is not a priority in this government.
In 2010 for every £4 of spending, £1 was borrowed.
Now for every £34 of spending, £1 was borrowed.
How do you suppose we as a nation could have fixed Labour's mess without some cuts from 2010?
Here is a list. Enjoy....
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/37-lies-gaffes-scandals-make-18558695
- Boris, 2004.
Oi!! Granny pants are very useful things. We cannot have everything going south when we garden.
That was a lie.
Wrong kind of BAMEs apparently. Trying to claim javid is some sort of far right extremist is quite bizarre.
Better?
Everyone has a past. Big difference between past mistakes [in this case wasn't it nearly 3 decades ago?] and malfeasance in office.
"I have not had an affair with Petronella. It is complete balderdash. It is an inverted pyramid of piffle. It is all completely untrue and ludicrous conjecture. I am amazed people can write this drivel."
- Boris, 2004.
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman, Miss Lewinsky."
- POTUS, 1998
The Scottish Parliament votes on who becomes FM, in 2014 NS won with 66 votes, Ruth lost comprehensively with 15 votes. Perhaps the mother of parliaments might care to look into such exercises of democratic accountability.
So the public never voted? If Parliament wants to hold a vote on Boris, Parliament is entitled to do so. LOTO Corbyn chose to waive holding a vote.
I am sure she is not alone in taking that view.
Leaving that to one side, it is idle to pretend you could cut tens of thousands of boats, tommies and coppers without reducing our capacity to protect Rolex-wearers and oil tankers. Of course, crime adds to GDP so there is that!
Much like the diehard Remainers like Greening and Grieve who voted against both the Withdrawal Agreement and No Deal and are basically LDs who want to stop Brexit
https://twitter.com/Mina_Andreeva/status/1154427956015632384?s=19