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  • Pulpstar said:

    TGOHF said:

    The next election - as backed up by Jack's Arse will see relatively few seats changing hands in England and Wales IMHO.

    Labour % may be up - but I'm struggling to see where the huge splashes of red will appear in the south.

    There won't be - And it doesn't need to - Labour will clean up in the Midlands and the North.
    Pulpstar said:

    TGOHF said:

    The next election - as backed up by Jack's Arse will see relatively few seats changing hands in England and Wales IMHO.

    Labour % may be up - but I'm struggling to see where the huge splashes of red will appear in the south.

    There won't be - And it doesn't need to - Labour will clean up in the Midlands and the North.
    Pulpstar said:

    TGOHF said:

    The next election - as backed up by Jack's Arse will see relatively few seats changing hands in England and Wales IMHO.

    Labour % may be up - but I'm struggling to see where the huge splashes of red will appear in the south.

    There won't be - And it doesn't need to - Labour will clean up in the Midlands and the North.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Requoting me three times - interesting...
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 42,162
    edited November 2013
    JonathanD said:


    Did you read your India article?

    "While design responsibility would be shared between consortium members, each country would build its own frigates. This would protect jobs in the politically sensitive warship-building industry in the West."

    Yep.
    What's clear is that there's no absolute principle of technological security, and that HMG/BAE have given up on having an export industry based on warships.

    Another article suggests 'the Turks would help build Britain's Type 26 Frigate, a type of naval ship due to enter service in the early 2020s. '

    http://archive.is/H3WI4

    I can see a scenario where a rUK in the huff with an independent Scotland and Portsmouth not having the capacity/cost effectiveness to fulfill all frigate orders, then ships could be built abroad.
  • @Pulpstar

    " I use the pb.com vanilla system..."

    Carrier pigeon might be quicker.
  • Mick_PorkMick_Pork Posts: 6,530
    Another "near perfect" IT project no doubt.
    IDS's benefit system severely criticised by MPs - expected to waste > £140m http://bit.ly/17cPU5I


    Welfare Reform ‏@Welfare__Reform 15 Sep

    Over ambitious and unreasonable targets. Incisive blog from @ComputerWeekly on the #UniversalCredit IT failure. http://www.computerweekly.com/blogs/public-sector/2013/09/universal-credit-failures-put-4.html
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,591

    The administrative principle of Universal Credit is that employers will report the earnings of all employees to HMRC on a monthly basis and this data will be fed into a DWP system that will calculate benefit entitlement. This sounds great in theory but no one seems to have thought of the practicalities. HMRC (a creaking and under-resourced organisation at the best of times) now has to process 12 times the volume of data it previously handled (earnings used to be reported annually).

    A big IT project which, despite the prophecies of doom and gloom from the usual suspects, has been working fine since it went live in April. It's a notable success for the government.
    But it is live for only a very small number of claimants. And I wonder if staff are relying on the system to calculate benefits or are actually doing some or all of the work manually.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited November 2013
    From today's Times, page 4:
    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
  • But it is live for only a very small number of claimants. And I wonder if staff are relying on the system to calculate benefits or are actually doing some or all of the work manually.

    No, the Real Time Information system - which was the bit I was referring to in my quote from your post - is basically fully up and running. Of course before it was implemented the press was full of horror stories about how it would be a disaster. Here's a typical one, from just before it went live:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/9975559/Chaos-over-biggest-employment-tax-shake-up-in-70-years.html

  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400

    The administrative principle of Universal Credit is that employers will report the earnings of all employees to HMRC on a monthly basis and this data will be fed into a DWP system that will calculate benefit entitlement. This sounds great in theory but no one seems to have thought of the practicalities. HMRC (a creaking and under-resourced organisation at the best of times) now has to process 12 times the volume of data it previously handled (earnings used to be reported annually).

    A big IT project which, despite the prophecies of doom and gloom from the usual suspects, has been working fine since it went live in April. It's a notable success for the government.
    But it is live for only a very small number of claimants. And I wonder if staff are relying on the system to calculate benefits or are actually doing some or all of the work manually.

    I think you are confusing HMRC's RTI PAYE system - which is up and running - with the DWP's Universal Credit.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    It'll be interesting to see whether MPs stand firm on the issue of votes for prisoners. Outside the LDs, hardly any supported the idea last time IIRC.
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,591
    JonathanD said:

    The administrative principle of Universal Credit is that employers will report the earnings of all employees to HMRC on a monthly basis and this data will be fed into a DWP system that will calculate benefit entitlement. This sounds great in theory but no one seems to have thought of the practicalities. HMRC (a creaking and under-resourced organisation at the best of times) now has to process 12 times the volume of data it previously handled (earnings used to be reported annually).

    A big IT project which, despite the prophecies of doom and gloom from the usual suspects, has been working fine since it went live in April. It's a notable success for the government.
    But it is live for only a very small number of claimants. And I wonder if staff are relying on the system to calculate benefits or are actually doing some or all of the work manually.

    I think you are confusing HMRC's RTI PAYE system - which is up and running - with the DWP's Universal Credit.

    I'm talking about the Universal Credit project as a whole. And the fact that it has been delayed several times, has been rolled out only to a tiny proportion of claimants and most of the people responsible for it seem to be continually briefing against each other does not suggest that it is going as swimmingly as you would have us believe.
  • JonathanDJonathanD Posts: 2,400
    edited November 2013




    I'm talking about the Universal Credit project as a whole. And the fact that it has been delayed several times, has been rolled out only to a tiny proportion of claimants and most of the people responsible for it seem to be continually briefing against each other does not suggest that it is going as swimmingly as you would have us believe.

    The specific difficulty you mentioned was HMRC having to process every months PAYE data rather than the once a year it was previously. As Richard mentioned this part of the system is working fine, its the Universal Credit benefit calculation part by the DWP that isn't.



    "This sounds great in theory but no one seems to have thought of the practicalities. HMRC (a creaking and under-resourced organisation at the best of times) now has to process 12 times the volume of data it previously handled (earnings used to be reported annually)."
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    1997 puzzle. Since the Tories received 31% , if I recall correctly, are you suggesting they were below 14% , 18 months prior to May 1997 ?

    Shurely shome mishtake !
  • LennonLennon Posts: 1,782
    surbiton said:

    1997 puzzle. Since the Tories received 31% , if I recall correctly, are you suggesting they were below 14% , 18 months prior to May 1997 ?

    Shurely shome mishtake !

    I'm pretty certain that Mike has used the 'lead' change rather than absolute opposition % change. So the change is as much from the Lab vote going to the LD's and so reducing the stated lead as it is from the Tory position improving.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,543
    Lennon said:

    surbiton said:

    1997 puzzle. Since the Tories received 31% , if I recall correctly, are you suggesting they were below 14% , 18 months prior to May 1997 ?

    Shurely shome mishtake !

    I'm pretty certain that Mike has used the 'lead' change rather than absolute opposition % change. So the change is as much from the Lab vote going to the LD's and so reducing the stated lead as it is from the Tory position improving.
    I think that's correct. There were polls at the start of 1996 showing Labour 30%+ ahead.

    I think they were, even then, overstating the Labour lead.

  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,489

    Mick_Pork said:

    JackW said:

    Why would a British government wish to build their Royal Navy ships in the dockyards of a foreign power ?

    For the same reasons that caused them to do it previously - necessity, expediency, cost, convenience?
    You mean the reasons they and BAE set out yesterday?

    *titters*
    I must admit I am finding it difficult to understand why people (outside of those directly affected) are so concerned about one British Dockyard getting work instead of another British dockyard. Almost every one of these politicians and commentators - including those on here - who are moaning about the decision are also those who support a No vote in the referendum next year. As such they are supposedly in favour of the continuation of one United Kingdom. This by implication means that they would want decisions made on a basis that is best for the whole of the UK not just one southern portion of it.

    So to now claim that jobs should not go to Scotland because of the threat of independence - particularly when they all seem to gloat about how it will never happen anyway - seems rather daft.
    Urrm, I'm generally pro-union, and was arguing on here that the move was sad, but sensible.

    Off-topic: just came back from a meeting to find a Spitfire (I think) doing loop-the-loops over our house. It's been doping it for five minutes now. Magic!
  • Pulpstar said:

    Requoting me three times - interesting...

    Something went wrong, if you think the Tories will be wiped out in the Midlands I expect you to be wrong. The feeling is pretty positive, overall Tory gains are on the cards if the recovery gathers pace. Derby North is one that is very much on for taking.

  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Bobajob said:

    I see Chris Christie supports both gun control and believes in global warming.

    He's a politician. He will say whatever he thinks is necessary to get himself elected no matter how stupid it is.
    Why is gun control stupid? Why do people need to carry things around that are designed to kill people? And they do, regularly. Ban all citizen guns in the US now - it's the only sensible approach.
    You're looking at it purely on a rational basis and not factoring in the totemic status of the right to bear arms in the American psyche. For them it is about freedom - for much the same reason why a lot of people in the UK get upset about the concept of the police being armed.

    (Ironic isn't it: the US response is 'give us weapons to defend against the state' the UK position is 'don't arm the state).

    Additionally, a better long-term solution would be to fix the mental health system in the US - th massacres that you read about will likely happen anyway, albeit with less damage - until that is done.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,503

    Messers Pork, Dickson & Malcolm - how many ships will the Scottish Defence Force order from the Clyde shipyards?

    Carlotta, how many will the UK government order from the Clyde shipyards. I am not in government , independence has not happened and my crystal ball is very cloudy.
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,489

    JonathanD said:


    Did you read your India article?

    "While design responsibility would be shared between consortium members, each country would build its own frigates. This would protect jobs in the politically sensitive warship-building industry in the West."

    Yep.
    What's clear is that there's no absolute principle of technological security, and that HMG/BAE have given up on having an export industry based on warships.

    Another article suggests 'the Turks would help build Britain's Type 26 Frigate, a type of naval ship due to enter service in the early 2020s. '

    http://archive.is/H3WI4

    I can see a scenario where a rUK in the huff with an independent Scotland and Portsmouth not having the capacity/cost effectiveness to fulfill all frigate orders, then ships could be built abroad.
    It also depends on what BAE as a company wish to do if Scotland becomes independent. As you say, there's plenty of other places in the world where they can build ships. The only reason why BAE has continued with shipbuilding in the UK is due to orders from the RN.

    As I've said passim, I think the problem is that BAE have been designing ships solely for the UK market, which are not a good fit for the export market. That is a great shame.

    The saga of the Scotstoun-built Brunei corvettes has hardly helped. I've read a fair bit into that, and can make no headway into who was to blame ...
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakhoda_Ragam_class_OPV
  • AndreaParma_82AndreaParma_82 Posts: 4,714
    edited November 2013
    Applicants for Labour Coventry North East selection

    Colleen Fletcher (Coventry Cllr)
    Maya Ali (Coventy Cllr)
    Faye Abbott (Coventy Cllr)
    Pat Seaman (former union rep for youth workers in Coventry)
    Randhir Auluck (works at Coventry University)
    Christine Thomas (local party member)
    Catherine Tite (from Wolverhampton)
    Doreen McCalla (from North East Derbyshire)
    Puneet Grewal (from Brentford and Isleworth, tried selection there too)
    Roseanna Kirk (from Lincoln)
    Deborah Sangster (Leicester Cllr)
    Savita Sehdev (from Wolverhampton, previously shortlisted for High Peak and Grevesham and also tried in Stourbridge)


  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    It's been doping it for five minutes now. Magic!

    Mushrooms, or just magic?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    edited November 2013

    Applicants for Labour Coventry North East selection

    Colleen Fletcher (Coventry Cllr)
    Maya Ali (Coventy Cllr)
    Faye Abbott (Coventy Cllr)
    Pat Seaman (former union rep for youth workers in Coventry)
    Randhir Auluck (works at Coventry University)
    Christine Thomas (local party member)
    Catherine Tite (from Wolverhampton)
    Doreen McCalla (North East Derbyshire)
    Puneet Grewal (Brentford and Isleworth, tried selection there too)
    Roseanna Kirk (Lincoln)
    Deborah Sangster (Leicester Cllr)
    Savita Sehdev (Wolverhampton, previously shortlisted for High Peak and Grevesham and also tried in Stourbridge)


    Wonder who will go for it for the CONs - Noonan again, maybe Allan Andrews or could even be my Dad lol. Suspect Cov South could well be Gary Riddley.
  • malcolmg said:

    Messers Pork, Dickson & Malcolm - how many ships will the Scottish Defence Force order from the Clyde shipyards?

    Carlotta, how many will the UK government order from the Clyde shipyards. I am not in government , independence has not happened and my crystal ball is very cloudy.
    The UK government have ordered three patrol craft to keep the Scottish yards busy as the QE carrier program winds down, and then there is the type 26 destroyer, of which there will be 13. The order for the first of the latter will be placed late in 2014. I expect that order will be placed in the country that pays for it - and why not?

    As you pointed out earlier the Scots will benefit from jobs repatriated from England upon independence. Why should the process not work in the opposite direction?
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,591
    macisback said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Requoting me three times - interesting...

    Something went wrong, if you think the Tories will be wiped out in the Midlands I expect you to be wrong. The feeling is pretty positive, overall Tory gains are on the cards if the recovery gathers pace. Derby North is one that is very much on for taking.

    Even though the Tories did not win a single ward in that constituency at the last Council election?

  • @Pulpstar/GeoffM

    *Betting Post*

    Had a look at Towcester and have had a big ew bet on Sapphire Rouge in the 1.10. I got 16/1but it's in to 12s now. Still think it's value at that.

    The 2.10 is also interesting. The McCoy factor has kicked in big time. His mount, Church Field is in to 7/2. It could win, but it wouldn't be value at double that price. So what else is? The answer I think is most of them. I will put up four at big prices. None of them are likely, but they are all hugely overpriced:

    Scales 18/1
    Moscow Presents 20/1
    Thoresby 25/1
    Crystal Swing 33/1

    If I had to pick one it would be Crystal Swing, but you may like to mix and match.

    Good luck
  • AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece

    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    @Peter_the_Punter Many thanks for the tips again today. Appreciated!
    @ Pulpstar Good luck with just Raceclear today. They have done me nicely over the last few months.
  • LennonLennon Posts: 1,782
    @PtP - You're backing a Horse called Crystal Swing... where's TSE! :-)
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Lennon said:

    @PtP - You're backing a Horse called Crystal Swing... where's TSE! :-)

    Crystal Swing 50/1 on betfair.

  • Lennon said:

    @PtP - You're backing a Horse called Crystal Swing... where's TSE! :-)

    Backed one called Gay Marriage yesterday. It was a poor second.

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    ECB cuts rates by 25bps !?
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    HOLY COW

    RT @EdConwaySky: ECB lowers main interest rate (refinancing rate) from 0.5% to 0.25%
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,489

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.


    Planning public services will be a nightmare.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,928

    JackW said:

    TGOHF said:

    The next election - as backed up by Jack's Arse will see relatively few seats changing hands in England and Wales IMHO.

    Labour % may be up - but I'm struggling to see where the huge splashes of red will appear in the south.

    Please note my ARSE is fully capitalized.

    Apart from Labour swingdown, differential turnout will IMO be a very important part of the picture, something I've been banging on about for yonks.

    Certainly turnout will be very low in LAB heartlands - but it will be much higher in the battlegrounds.

    You have started to sound like Stuart Truth

    That's a surprise in a way since Miliband is supposed to be a core vote figure who can't appeal to the centre. What's going on? YouGov polling suggests the public see Cameron and Miliband as roughly equidistant from the centre ground, Cam obviously to the right and Mili to the left. However Cameron has much higher satisfaction ratings amongst his own supporters. The danger is that although current polling suggests the parties are only 5-6 points apart, Cameron could well be building up big majorities in areas he doesn't need them, whereas (the less popular with his own supporters) Miliband won't be. That seemed to be reflected in the Ashcroft polling. However we don't truly know (there don't seem to be many marginal polls around) and there's 18 months left or 78 weeks as Harold Wilson would prefer.
  • FinancierFinancier Posts: 3,916
    edited November 2013
    Plato said:

    HOLY COW

    RT @EdConwaySky: ECB lowers main interest rate (refinancing rate) from 0.5% to 0.25%

    GBP jumps 7c to 1.197Euro - get your holiday cash now?

  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Sterling just shot up 100 basis points !
  • AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.


    Where are they all flocking from, as one bigoted granny might say.
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Financier said:

    Plato said:

    HOLY COW

    RT @EdConwaySky: ECB lowers main interest rate (refinancing rate) from 0.5% to 0.25%

    GBP jumps 7c to 1.197Euro - get your holiday cash now?

    The Euro isn't doing well ... there's a great snap shot of it falling off a cliff on Twitter.
  • Sean_F said:

    Lennon said:

    surbiton said:

    1997 puzzle. Since the Tories received 31% , if I recall correctly, are you suggesting they were below 14% , 18 months prior to May 1997 ?

    Shurely shome mishtake !

    I'm pretty certain that Mike has used the 'lead' change rather than absolute opposition % change. So the change is as much from the Lab vote going to the LD's and so reducing the stated lead as it is from the Tory position improving.
    I think that's correct. There were polls at the start of 1996 showing Labour 30%+ ahead.

    I think they were, even then, overstating the Labour lead.

    There's also the fact that the theme of the 1997 election was very much "Get rid of the Tories", so no doubt many of those who'd hypothetically say Lab in a polling question may have been swayed by a local Lib Dem armed with bar charts and equally anti-Tory rhetoric.

  • Financier said:

    Plato said:

    HOLY COW

    RT @EdConwaySky: ECB lowers main interest rate (refinancing rate) from 0.5% to 0.25%

    GBP jumps 7c to 1.197Euro - get your holiday cash now?

    7c in one go... oh my lordie...
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,489
    According to Guido, Simon Hughes has been ordered to apologise to parliament over failure to register six donations to his local party.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    edited November 2013
    Our interest rates go down and the value of our currency goes up ??!

    Edit It is ECB rate !
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,591


    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.


    Where are they all flocking from, as one bigoted granny might say.

    Is a 9.5m rise in population over the next 25 years a very much quicker rate of growth than we have had over the last 25? I rather doubt it.

    No need to panic yet then.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Financier said:

    Plato said:

    HOLY COW

    RT @EdConwaySky: ECB lowers main interest rate (refinancing rate) from 0.5% to 0.25%

    GBP jumps 7c to 1.197Euro - get your holiday cash now?

    7c in one go... oh my lordie...
    No. It is 0.7 cents. Well actually 1 cent now.
  • Yvette Roper ‏@YvetteRoper 45s
    67 of 70 economists predicted no #ECB rate cut http://bit.ly/1a9FMZk #euro $eurusd

    Show's you how much economists know about anything.. as dear old Mrs T proved..
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    No, the value of GBP hasn;t gone up a quick look at EUR.USD shows that EUR is down - very sharply.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    edited November 2013

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.


    It will be on the whole positive. The increase will be mostly in young people - taxpayers. Unlike many Eurpoean countries where they will have to look after an increasing aged population from a shrinking taxpayer base.

    Britain is becoming like the USA in the 20th century ! Dynamic and optimistic !!Good !!!
  • Quite misleading these stats IMO since it is often the opposition's polling that declines in the 18 months in the lead up to a GE....and not just the incumbent's. That's what happened in 2010 for instance, where the Tories who were on course for a landslide majority of more than 100 seats with 18 months to go ended up without a single seat majority.

    But I do agree that a clawback is not inevitable...but given Miliband's appalling personal ratings and the clear historical trend of the opposition's share of the vote generally to decline in the lead up to a GE, I doubt very much that Labour will win by as much as 5-6% on polling day. A hung parliament still looks by far the likeliest outcome at the moment IMO.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415

    Yvette Roper ‏@YvetteRoper 45s
    67 of 70 economists predicted no #ECB rate cut http://bit.ly/1a9FMZk #euro $eurusd

    Show's you how much economists know about anything.. as dear old Mrs T proved..

    Hacker: What about Sir Frank? He's head of the Treasury!
    Bernard: Well I'm afraid he's at an even greater disadvantage in understanding economics: he's an economist.

  • This is the problem the government is creating for itself.

    It gives the impression that its priorities are:

    1) London
    2) Scotland
    3) Rest of the world

    But elections aren't won in these places but in medium sized towns and its these places which feel ignored, indeed looked down upon, by the government.

    Further thoughts:

    The likes of Heath (at least in 1970), Thatcher and Major (at least in 1992) gave the impression of caring about and trying to help the people of the outer suburbs and medium sized town in middle England. Because they were 'people like us'.

    But Cameron and Osborne don't.

    Their backgrounds and interests are fundamentally different and they don't give the impression that they care or even that they pretend to care.

    On the contrary they give the impression that they relish the shifts of wealth and power that are happening from 'middle England' to 'world cities'.

    This is why Cameron does so dredfully on those 'in touch with people like you' questions and why EdM's cost of living campaign has borne fruit.

    And why emphasising an improving economy is unlikely to bring the government support - if an improving economy only benefits 'people like them' and not 'people like us' hasn't the government failed you, even 'betrayed' you ?
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,489


    This is the problem the government is creating for itself.

    It gives the impression that its priorities are:

    1) London
    2) Scotland
    3) Rest of the world

    But elections aren't won in these places but in medium sized towns and its these places which feel ignored, indeed looked down upon, by the government.

    Further thoughts:

    The likes of Heath (at least in 1970), Thatcher and Major (at least in 1992) gave the impression of caring about and trying to help the people of the outer suburbs and medium sized town in middle England. Because they were 'people like us'.

    But Cameron and Osborne don't.

    Their backgrounds and interests are fundamentally different and they don't give the impression that they care or even that they pretend to care.

    On the contrary they give the impression that they relish the shifts of wealth and power that are happening from 'middle England' to 'world cities'.

    This is why Cameron does so dredfully on those 'in touch with people like you' questions and why EdM's cost of living campaign has borne fruit.

    And why emphasising an improving economy is unlikely to bring the government support - if an improving economy only benefits 'people like them' and not 'people like us' hasn't the government failed you, even 'betrayed' you ?
    So you admit your original post this morning was a load of rubbish. Good.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Yvette Roper ‏@YvetteRoper 45s
    67 of 70 economists predicted no #ECB rate cut http://bit.ly/1a9FMZk #euro $eurusd

    Show's you how much economists know about anything.. as dear old Mrs T proved..

    Shows how much the Euro hasn't taken action - unlike the Uk.

    Remember the days of coordinated action by central banks around the world ?

    Not today - the Uk's next interest rate move will be up not down.
  • surbiton said:

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.
    It will be on the whole positive. The increase will be mostly in young people - taxpayers. Unlike many Eurpoean countries where they will have to look after an increasing aged population from a shrinking taxpayer base.

    Britain is becoming like the USA in the 20th century ! Dynamic and optimistic !!Good !!!

    Umm in case you hadn't noticed, the USA is a little bigger, and a little sparser than the UK...
  • PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Pulpstar said:

    Yvette Roper ‏@YvetteRoper 45s
    67 of 70 economists predicted no #ECB rate cut http://bit.ly/1a9FMZk #euro $eurusd

    Show's you how much economists know about anything.. as dear old Mrs T proved..

    Hacker: What about Sir Frank? He's head of the Treasury!
    Bernard: Well I'm afraid he's at an even greater disadvantage in understanding economics: he's an economist.
    Chris Adams @chrisadamsmkts
    ECB rate cut shows it has nothing left to fight austerity-induced deflation. Bigger problem is the rate cut won't get through to borrowers
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Plato said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Yvette Roper ‏@YvetteRoper 45s
    67 of 70 economists predicted no #ECB rate cut http://bit.ly/1a9FMZk #euro $eurusd

    Show's you how much economists know about anything.. as dear old Mrs T proved..

    Hacker: What about Sir Frank? He's head of the Treasury!
    Bernard: Well I'm afraid he's at an even greater disadvantage in understanding economics: he's an economist.
    Chris Adams @chrisadamsmkts
    ECB rate cut shows it has nothing left to fight austerity-induced deflation. Bigger problem is the rate cut won't get through to borrowers
    Not much austerity in France - just Milibandesque policies.



  • This is the problem the government is creating for itself.

    It gives the impression that its priorities are:

    1) London
    2) Scotland
    3) Rest of the world

    But elections aren't won in these places but in medium sized towns and its these places which feel ignored, indeed looked down upon, by the government.

    Further thoughts:

    The likes of Heath (at least in 1970), Thatcher and Major (at least in 1992) gave the impression of caring about and trying to help the people of the outer suburbs and medium sized town in middle England. Because they were 'people like us'.

    But Cameron and Osborne don't.

    Their backgrounds and interests are fundamentally different and they don't give the impression that they care or even that they pretend to care.

    On the contrary they give the impression that they relish the shifts of wealth and power that are happening from 'middle England' to 'world cities'.

    This is why Cameron does so dredfully on those 'in touch with people like you' questions and why EdM's cost of living campaign has borne fruit.

    And why emphasising an improving economy is unlikely to bring the government support - if an improving economy only benefits 'people like them' and not 'people like us' hasn't the government failed you, even 'betrayed' you ?
    So you admit your original post this morning was a load of rubbish. Good.
    And where did I admit that ?

    You're behaviour is becoming increasingly bizarre Josias and you seem to have an increasingly unhealthy obsession with my comments.

    Now I'm going to do some more work.

    Might I suggest you do likewise instead of making yourself look silly.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited November 2013
    Perfect timing! Dear Danny "we should have joined the Euro, 5 million unemployed" Blancheflower is touring the studios claiming Ed Balls was right......no doubt we'll benefit from his sage advises of the ECB cut shortly....
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,503
    hucks67 said:

    TGOHF said:

    hucks67 said:

    Another example of why press regulation is needed in regard to how errors are corrected. The apology will be a small column hidden on page 27, when the original article may have been more prominent in the paper. People will remember the article on Brown claiming expenses when hardly attending parliament, but they probably won't see the apology.
    They will remember the legacy of his disastrous time in office for another 10 years as we dig our way out of his spending to achieve power machinations.

    Brown may not claim expenses - but he does a salary - perhaps you can defend his attendance record in the HoP ?

    Being in the chamber of parliament is not an indication of attendance. Personally I don't actually know how often Brown works from offices in Westminster. Perhaps because he is not sitting on the greenbenches for hours listening to the same old tired debates, he is able to spend more time dealing with issues affecting his constituents.

    Actually because Brown stood for election in 2010, he was right to honour his commitment to his constituents that he would serve for the 5 years. Previous PM's have not acted in such an honourable way. They have simply walked away to pursue other interests.

    Given he is permanently abroad talking bollocks on lecture tours I doubt very much if he is representing the donkeys that voted for him, but given Labour's record in Scotland that will be no worse than usual.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Perfect timing! Dear Danny "we should have joined the Euro, 5 million unemployed" Blancheflower is touring the studios claiming Ed Balls was right......no doubt we'll benefit from his sage advises of the ECB cut shortly....

    Who still gives this buffoon airspace ?
  • The ECB rate cut is really concerning.
  • perdixperdix Posts: 1,806


    This is the problem the government is creating for itself.

    It gives the impression that its priorities are:

    1) London
    2) Scotland
    3) Rest of the world

    But elections aren't won in these places but in medium sized towns and its these places which feel ignored, indeed looked down upon, by the government.

    Further thoughts:

    The likes of Heath (at least in 1970), Thatcher and Major (at least in 1992) gave the impression of caring about and trying to help the people of the outer suburbs and medium sized town in middle England. Because they were 'people like us'.

    But Cameron and Osborne don't.

    Their backgrounds and interests are fundamentally different and they don't give the impression that they care or even that they pretend to care.

    On the contrary they give the impression that they relish the shifts of wealth and power that are happening from 'middle England' to 'world cities'.

    This is why Cameron does so dredfully on those 'in touch with people like you' questions and why EdM's cost of living campaign has borne fruit.

    And why emphasising an improving economy is unlikely to bring the government support - if an improving economy only benefits 'people like them' and not 'people like us' hasn't the government failed you, even 'betrayed' you ?
    Your argument is a false, opportunistic, kipper-like one. In order for the widest improvement in lives for all, the nation needs sustainable growth. If you don't create the wealth as a nation, there will be less to spread around. London has always been dominant, don't knock its success. We should stand behind those who can lead the way in economic growth and find ways to help those who have difficulties. There are no quick fixes except in the imaginations of Redland and kipperland.

  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    One for tim - GO admits failure.


    George Osborne ‏@George_Osborne 2m


    Been at the @BirdsEyeUK factory in Lowestoft: firm's most productive plant in Europe. Not sure my stint on the packing line contributed
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    One for tim - GO admits failure.


    George Osborne ‏@George_Osborne 2m


    Been at the @BirdsEyeUK factory in Lowestoft: firm's most productive plant in Europe. Not sure my stint on the packing line contributed
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,503

    malcolmg said:

    Messers Pork, Dickson & Malcolm - how many ships will the Scottish Defence Force order from the Clyde shipyards?

    Carlotta, how many will the UK government order from the Clyde shipyards. I am not in government , independence has not happened and my crystal ball is very cloudy.
    The UK government have ordered three patrol craft to keep the Scottish yards busy as the QE carrier program winds down, and then there is the type 26 destroyer, of which there will be 13. The order for the first of the latter will be placed late in 2014. I expect that order will be placed in the country that pays for it - and why not?

    As you pointed out earlier the Scots will benefit from jobs repatriated from England upon independence. Why should the process not work in the opposite direction?
    Till they cut the orders and the amount of government jobs in Scotland is pitifully low so it will be lucky to be a trickle south , whilst it will be major amounts the other way.
  • perdixperdix Posts: 1,806
    tim said:

    @RichardNabavi

    Explain to me why Cameron put the inadequate IDS in charge of this flagship

    Because IDS has a passion for social justice.

  • BobajobBobajob Posts: 1,536
    @Richard Tyndall

    UK gun-related deaths per 100k popn pa 0.25
    US gun-related deaths per 100k popn pa 10.5

    Ban em. Ban the lot. Ban the now.
  • BobajobBobajob Posts: 1,536
    @Richard Tyndall

    UK gun-related deaths per 100k popn pa 0.25
    US gun-related deaths per 100k popn pa 10.5

    Ban em. Ban the lot. Ban them now.
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,503

    JonathanD said:


    Did you read your India article?

    "While design responsibility would be shared between consortium members, each country would build its own frigates. This would protect jobs in the politically sensitive warship-building industry in the West."

    Yep.
    What's clear is that there's no absolute principle of technological security, and that HMG/BAE have given up on having an export industry based on warships.

    Another article suggests 'the Turks would help build Britain's Type 26 Frigate, a type of naval ship due to enter service in the early 2020s. '

    http://archive.is/H3WI4

    I can see a scenario where a rUK in the huff with an independent Scotland and Portsmouth not having the capacity/cost effectiveness to fulfill all frigate orders, then ships could be built abroad.
    TUD, it is only Scotland that will be excluded , they will get their pals in India or Turkey to build them. Given teh amount of jobs from UK concentration in south east and London that will come back to Scotland , it will be little matter , also Govan can revert to being a normal business and look to other interests rather than sitting begging for crumbs from Westminster.
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,928
    perdix said:


    This is the problem the government is creating for itself.

    It gives the impression that its priorities are:

    1) London
    2) Scotland
    3) Rest of the world

    But elections aren't won in these places but in medium sized towns and its these places which feel ignored, indeed looked down upon, by the government.


    And why emphasising an improving economy is unlikely to bring the government support - if an improving economy only benefits 'people like them' and not 'people like us' hasn't the government failed you, even 'betrayed' you ?
    Your argument is a false, opportunistic, kipper-like one. In order for the widest improvement in lives for all, the nation needs sustainable growth. If you don't create the wealth as a nation, there will be less to spread around. London has always been dominant, don't knock its success. We should stand behind those who can lead the way in economic growth and find ways to help those who have difficulties. There are no quick fixes except in the imaginations of Redland and kipperland.

    London hasn't always been dominant. I would argue that when this country was most economically successful, around 1770 to 1870 (when we led the world) the economic heart of the country was in the regions. Since then London and particularly its financial institutions have become more dominant and we have slipped behind the US and Germany.

  • TGOHF said:

    Perfect timing! Dear Danny "we should have joined the Euro, 5 million unemployed" Blancheflower is touring the studios claiming Ed Balls was right......no doubt we'll benefit from his sage advises of the ECB cut shortly....

    Who still gives this buffoon airspace ?
    Radio 4 this morning....

  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064
    Looks like the wheels are falling off the EU recovery wagon. German industrial production down by almost 1% MoM compared to expectations of stagnation. This is the latest in a series of weak EU figures.

    Bad times coming for us as well then if they manage to piss away their limited recovery, part of our recovery is based on a small rebound in exports to EMU nations.

    Hopefully the quarter point cut from the ECB helps but I don't see it making much of a difference.
  • TGOHF said:

    Perfect timing! Dear Danny "we should have joined the Euro, 5 million unemployed" Blancheflower is touring the studios claiming Ed Balls was right......no doubt we'll benefit from his sage advises of the ECB cut shortly....

    Who still gives this buffoon airspace ?
    The nighthawks editor.

    Last night. Item 3.

    Which is even more amusing in hindsight.

  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    surbiton said:

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.
    It will be on the whole positive. The increase will be mostly in young people - taxpayers. Unlike many Eurpoean countries where they will have to look after an increasing aged population from a shrinking taxpayer base.

    Britain is becoming like the USA in the 20th century ! Dynamic and optimistic !!Good !!!
    Umm in case you hadn't noticed, the USA is a little bigger, and a little sparser than the UK...

    The UK is barely populated. 120 million, then you are talking. More the merrier !
  • antifrank said:

    The ECB rate cut is really concerning.

    It's not exactly what you'd call a "resounding vote of confidence" is it?

  • MaxPB said:

    Looks like the wheels are falling off the EU recovery wagon. German industrial production down by almost 1% MoM compared to expectations of stagnation. This is the latest in a series of weak EU figures.

    Bad times coming for us as well then if they manage to piss away their limited recovery, part of our recovery is based on a small rebound in exports to EMU nations.

    Hopefully the quarter point cut from the ECB helps but I don't see it making much of a difference.

    Well the interest rate cut (and effect on euro) means that our exports just got more expensive, so that won't help..
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    surbiton said:

    surbiton said:

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.
    It will be on the whole positive. The increase will be mostly in young people - taxpayers. Unlike many Eurpoean countries where they will have to look after an increasing aged population from a shrinking taxpayer base.

    Britain is becoming like the USA in the 20th century ! Dynamic and optimistic !!Good !!!
    Umm in case you hadn't noticed, the USA is a little bigger, and a little sparser than the UK...
    The UK is barely populated. 120 million, then you are talking. More the merrier !

    How about 20 million white americans from the southern states ?
  • It must be awful to be living in Portsmouth this lunchtime.

    Pretty much like every day but the news that there are three Southampton players are in the England squad, that's got to hurt.
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,064

    MaxPB said:

    Looks like the wheels are falling off the EU recovery wagon. German industrial production down by almost 1% MoM compared to expectations of stagnation. This is the latest in a series of weak EU figures.

    Bad times coming for us as well then if they manage to piss away their limited recovery, part of our recovery is based on a small rebound in exports to EMU nations.

    Hopefully the quarter point cut from the ECB helps but I don't see it making much of a difference.

    Well the interest rate cut (and effect on euro) means that our exports just got more expensive, so that won't help..
    The Euro will recover I'm sure, that's not the biggest issue though, it is that the EMU has found a way to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. German intransigence on wage dumping across Europe still hasn't been fixed. The EU needs to step up and force Germany to introduce a minimum wage. No more wage dumping. Can't be a single market if one player refuses to stick to the rules.
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699

    MaxPB said:

    Looks like the wheels are falling off the EU recovery wagon. German industrial production down by almost 1% MoM compared to expectations of stagnation. This is the latest in a series of weak EU figures.

    Bad times coming for us as well then if they manage to piss away their limited recovery, part of our recovery is based on a small rebound in exports to EMU nations.

    Hopefully the quarter point cut from the ECB helps but I don't see it making much of a difference.

    Well the interest rate cut (and effect on euro) means that our exports just got more expensive, so that won't help..
    The Euro is still stronger today than it was 12 months ago against both the US $ and £ sterling .
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    MaxPB said:

    Looks like the wheels are falling off the EU recovery wagon. German industrial production down by almost 1% MoM compared to expectations of stagnation. This is the latest in a series of weak EU figures.

    Bad times coming for us as well then if they manage to piss away their limited recovery, part of our recovery is based on a small rebound in exports to EMU nations.

    Hopefully the quarter point cut from the ECB helps but I don't see it making much of a difference.

    Well the interest rate cut (and effect on euro) means that our exports just got more expensive, so that won't help..
    Went up a whole cent (!!!!) - already off it's peak.



  • surbiton said:

    surbiton said:

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.
    It will be on the whole positive. The increase will be mostly in young people - taxpayers. Unlike many Eurpoean countries where they will have to look after an increasing aged population from a shrinking taxpayer base.

    Britain is becoming like the USA in the 20th century ! Dynamic and optimistic !!Good !!!
    Umm in case you hadn't noticed, the USA is a little bigger, and a little sparser than the UK...
    The UK is barely populated. 120 million, then you are talking. More the merrier !

    Everyone knows the PB Kinnocks are Ponzi scheme fans, but that's taking stupidity to another level.
  • antifrank said:

    The ECB rate cut is really concerning.

    It's not exactly what you'd call a "resounding vote of confidence" is it?

    It looks like an attempt to blow up a balloon by an asthmatic who has had a tracheotomy.
  • On topic.

    I guess the caveat that prior to 1997 the polling methodology was a bit sub optimal must distort things?

    That said the advent of a coalition and the rise of UKIP must may distort the polling this time around.

    I guess we'll find out in 18 months time.
  • O/T - fascinating view of latest milestone of largest construction project in Europe:

    http://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2013/11/07/crossrail-breaks-into-huge-cavern-under-stepney/
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Draghi saying no inflation any time soon.

  • Good afternoon, everyone.

    The eurozone is inherently screwed. It's got to either unite or die (as IDS said shortly before the Conservatives decided to assassinate him). If it separates that'll be very disruptive and quite possibly bitter. If it begins to become a single nation state then it won't work because, as everyone who wasn't as mad as a Huhne pointed out pre-euro, the nations are too diverse in economic and cultural terms.

    Imagine a country that has the Greeks, Germans, Italians, Spaniards and French in it. Is it a picture of uniform behaviour and perfect integration, or is it a collection of wildly different regions that don't fit together?

    Reminds me a bit of the consensus below about the stupidity of regional assemblies. The UK has very well-established regions/countries (Wales, Northern Ireland, Scotland, England). To give each their own assembly/parliament then try and carve one (England) into nonsensical little sections is just ridiculous.
  • Mr Dancer.

    IDS' unite or die of speech would have carried more weight if it wasn't delivered by a serial Maastricht rebel.

    It's the equivalent of Caligula criticising The UK for the way peers are appointed to the House of Lords.
  • It must be awful to be living in Portsmouth this lunchtime.

    Pretty much like every day but the news that there are three Southampton players are in the England squad, that's got to hurt.

    *Does Saints fan happy dance*
  • @TSE - thanks for the tip to wait for the extra clips through the credits at the end of Thor - the first one I did not understand at all (the archivist looked like the crazed designer in Zoolander), but the second one I got. Always nice to see Greenwich - first as Paris, now being trashed by aliens!
  • anothernickanothernick Posts: 3,591

    surbiton said:

    surbiton said:

    AndyJS said:

    From today's Times, page 4:

    "The UK's population will rise by 9.6 million in the next 25 years, equivalent to the city the size of London, with immigration fuelling much of the increase.

    New official projections estimate that the population will hit 73.3 million by 2037, compared with 63.7 million today. About 60 per cent of the increase will come from immigration, including the children of immigrants."
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/uk/article3915234.ece
    That is a quite astonishing projection which is going to have huge implications for the national health services, the education systems, transport, planning, you name it. Every single sphere of government, supra-national, national and local is going to be under extreme stress if this projection is anywhere close to reality.
    It will be on the whole positive. The increase will be mostly in young people - taxpayers. Unlike many Eurpoean countries where they will have to look after an increasing aged population from a shrinking taxpayer base.

    Britain is becoming like the USA in the 20th century ! Dynamic and optimistic !!Good !!!
    Umm in case you hadn't noticed, the USA is a little bigger, and a little sparser than the UK...
    The UK is barely populated. 120 million, then you are talking. More the merrier !
    Everyone knows the PB Kinnocks are Ponzi scheme fans, but that's taking stupidity to another level.

    In the 1960s, when the world population was 3bn (and the Uk about 50m) there were apocalyptic predictions of mass starvation and disaster if it reached 4bn. Now it's 7bn and food is more abundant than ever before (which is not to say that everyone has enough but few are starving and none need to starve).

    In the last 150 years or so the populations of countries such as the USA, Hong Kong, Singapore have grown exponentially and yet these countries have seen living standards rise to levels undreamed of by previous generations.

    And yet predicted increases in population are regarded with horror by so many people. Odd isn't it?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,964
    edited November 2013
    Mr. Eagles, some say having Incitatus in the Cabinet would improve it :p

    Edited extra bit: and Goldflake/Innocent would make far better chief whips!
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    Ed Miliband's current focus on energy prices, the cost of living, wages and even the NHS all ignore the elephant in the room for the Labour party at the next GE. Its the economy stupid, and its the Leadership to take on the tough decisions to deliver on sustained economic growth that will be the key to the next GE result. Gordon Brown promised a similar strategy, and he too claimed he could deliver on it because he could control a sustainable economy to deliver on those promises. Indeed, he told us that he had ended the cycle of boom and bust in the UK. Right now, all Ed Miliband is doing policy wise, is to attempt to put restraints on the future continued growth of the UK economy post the GE 2015 with gimmicks that have yet to be costed.

    The electorate know that the key to improving their wages, personal finances and public services is their own future job security first and foremost, and right now they have more confidence in Cameron and Osborne than they do Ed Miliband and Ed Balls when it comes to managing the economy. The last Labour Government is still regarded as the most to blame for our economic travails in recent years, and the current optimism in the future economic growth and employment forecasts are their worst nightmare scenario as we rapidly head towards the next GE.

    I can see many voters nodding in agreement with Ed Miliband when he bangs on about how tough the last few years have been, and especially how its effected their take home income, energy bills and the general cost of living etc. But will they agree enough with Ed Miliband and the Labour party to risk rewarding them with the stewardship of an improving UK economy by punishing this Government for successfully starting to clear up their last mess in its first term. I don't think so, and especially if the UK's recovery under this Government is increasingly regarded in a positive light in comparison to other Western economies. I would would ignore the comparisons of what happened in the 2007/2011 Holyrood elections at your peril. Despite current polling, Labour may need to hang onto those Libdem switchers to shore up rather than increase their current seat share.





  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Plato said:

    HOLY COW

    RT @EdConwaySky: ECB lowers main interest rate (refinancing rate) from 0.5% to 0.25%

    Not exactly unexpected I would say.
  • @TSE - thanks for the tip to wait for the extra clips through the credits at the end of Thor - the first one I did not understand at all (the archivist looked like the crazed designer in Zoolander), but the second one I got. Always nice to see Greenwich - first as Paris, now being trashed by aliens!

    With out wanting to give away spoilers.

    Benicio del Toro was playing The Collector.

    He is a character from The Guardians of the Galaxy comics.

    By coincidence there's a Guardians of The Galaxy film out next year.

    Also stars Karen Gillan.

  • O/T - fascinating view of latest milestone of largest construction project in Europe:

    http://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/2013/11/07/crossrail-breaks-into-huge-cavern-under-stepney/

    Cheers for the link – An awesome feat of engineering.

    For all those that marvelled as the ‘Shard’ went up, I wonder how many knew what was being constructed beneath their feet?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    antifrank said:

    The ECB rate cut is really concerning.

    In a way it is, but it had to come.

    Europe has been kicking the can down the road for quite a while now.

  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,044
This discussion has been closed.