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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The Euro elections – what we know about turnout local authority by local authority
Final table for a few hours. 132 councils with their 2016 remain %. Sorted by the increase in turnout yesterday compared to last euros. pic.twitter.com/kXxO1jhawa
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> BXP has won!!!!!!!
Better than Watford!
Slovakia
Malta
Latvia
Czech Republic (second day of voting)
Martinique
Guadaloupe
Guayana
St Martin
St Barthelemy
St Pierre et Miquelon
Polynesie Fracanise
Spain +5
France +5
Italy +3
Netherlands +3
Ireland +2
Poland +1
Sweden +1
Austria +1
Denmark +1
Slovakia +1
Croatia +1
Estonia +1
Other countries unchanged
> After Brexit the redistribution of seats will be as follow
>
> Spain +5
> France +5
> Italy +3
> Netherlands +3
> Ireland +2
> Poland +1
> Sweden +1
> Austria +1
> Denmark +1
> Slovakia +1
> Croatia +1
> Estonia +1
>
> Other countries unchanged
Why doesn't Germany get any extra seats?
> > @Ave_it said:
> > BXP has won!!!!!!!
>
> Better than Watford!
Watford exited Europe very successfully!
> @dixiedean said:
> Anyone know what #15 "Tyne" is? South Tyneside is elsewhere on the list. Would that be Newcastle or N Tyneside?
I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
She deserves our respect.
Substitite Tory for Labour and Boris for Corbyn for a follow up question to be applied to many a 'moderate' Tory.
> @AndyJS said:
> > @AndreaParma_82 said:
> > After Brexit the redistribution of seats will be as follow
> >
> > Spain +5
> > France +5
> > Italy +3
> > Netherlands +3
> > Ireland +2
> > Poland +1
> > Sweden +1
> > Austria +1
> > Denmark +1
> > Slovakia +1
> > Croatia +1
> > Estonia +1
> >
> > Other countries unchanged
>
> Why doesn't Germany get any extra seats?
You are already the only one waiting for Italy. Waiting for Guyane and co would have been too much for all British anoraks
> @kle4 said:
> tomorrow it's time for
>
> The French islands not voting at the same time as mainland France? Logistical issue?
Burnley down next season with the Brighton!
> @MikeSmithson said:
> > @Ave_it said:
> > BXP has won!!!!!!!
>
> Better than Watford!
> I've just seen her speech for the first time. She filled up, turned and marched at speed into Downing Street where I expect she cried. When you feel emotional it's hard not to crack - I did a couple of weeks back during my best man speech for an old friend.
>
> I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
>
> She deserves our respect.
Absolutely
There has been a lot of very nasty, personal comments made about her tears. No-one is demanding that anyone has sympathy for her as a politician. But on a basic human level, it is absolutely right to acknowledge her sense of duty and determination to do her very best.
It wasn't enough and she made many mistakes along the way. But I hope she has the company of good friends and family over the coming weeks - she will need their support, love and kindness.
We are all very capable of being less than civil towards people with whom we disagree politically. But there are times to put the political to one side for a moment. When someone breaks down like that, it is one of those times.
> I've just seen her speech for the first time. She filled up, turned and marched at speed into Downing Street where I expect she cried. When you feel emotional it's hard not to crack - I did a couple of weeks back during my best man speech for an old friend.
>
> I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
>
> She deserves our respect.
If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
No respect from me.
> Newsnight now taking the p**s out of Francois and he doesn’t even realise.
>
> [Francois] is a deeply stupid man.
>
> Presumably, therefore, he is just the man who needs to put his name forward for the leadership?
He’s found someone even more stupid to vote for.
>
> If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
>
> She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
>
> No respect from me.
If she'd handed over to a no-dealer 5 months ago we could have currently been dealing with the mess of no deal.
> > @Foxy said:
> >
> > If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
> >
> > She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
> >
> > No respect from me.
>
> If she'd handed over to a no-dealer 5 months ago we could have currently been dealing with the mess of no deal.
I take your point. Her complete ineptness at the Brexit process is a rare positive, but clearly despite rather than because of her best efforts
If I had one positive about her it is that she made the libra tissue glucose monitor available on the NHS. I cannot think of another.
> > @RochdalePioneers said:
> > I've just seen her speech for the first time. She filled up, turned and marched at speed into Downing Street where I expect she cried. When you feel emotional it's hard not to crack - I did a couple of weeks back during my best man speech for an old friend.
> >
> > I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
> >
> > She deserves our respect.
>
> If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
>
> She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
>
> No respect from me.
They are her failings as a politician. Which are many. And yes, her failings as a person when it comes to things like emotional intelligence. I get that. I've been on the receiving end of bosses with no EI. But they remain people, and part of being a socialist is that I care for people. May is a Tory, and a somewhat cold and calculating Tory at that.
But set party politics aside and what do we find. A person. In agony. Having forced herself to stay despite sanity demanding she quit, having long since privately understood it's over. I personally would hate to be an MP. It's an awful job. Then we have ministers. Under the spotlight for all they say and do. Or worse all they don't say or do.
Think how bad it is to be Prime Minister. It's not like they get remunerated sufficiently for the pressure and hours
Sums us up really.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2019/05/24/amber-rudd-hints-would-work-boris-johnson-rules-tory-leadership/
> I've just seen her speech for the first time. She filled up, turned and marched at speed into Downing Street where I expect she cried. When you feel emotional it's hard not to crack - I did a couple of weeks back during my best man speech for an old friend.
>
> I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
>
> She deserves our respect.
She may deserve a quiver of human sympathy, but respect has some higher preconditions as far as I'm concerned. It was only May's obfuscations, striving and submerged ambition that got her to the point she reached today.
> > @Foxy said:
> >
> > If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
> >
> > She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
> >
> > No respect from me.
>
> If she'd handed over to a no-dealer 5 months ago we could have currently been dealing with the mess of no deal.
Exactly .
I think May has made countless mistakes and failed to try and unite the country . But at least her legacy won’t be crashing the UK out of the EU .
When push came to shove she saw the damage that would do especially to the peace process in NI and said no.
> > @RochdalePioneers said:
> > I've just seen her speech for the first time. She filled up, turned and marched at speed into Downing Street where I expect she cried. When you feel emotional it's hard not to crack - I did a couple of weeks back during my best man speech for an old friend.
> >
> > I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
> >
> > She deserves our respect.
>
> If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
>
> She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
>
> No respect from me.
Me neither I am afraid. And not because of anything to do with Brexit per se. The amount of harm she has done to innocent people whose only 'crime' was to come from another country and then settle here in the UK is atrocious. I think it goes beyond a 'tin ear' or lack of emotional intelligence. I genuinely believe she saw immigrants, whatever their status, as an easy target and so used her ability to harass and drive them out of the country as a means to gain political kudos.
I know earlier I said she was xenophobic and perhaps that was unfair. But she has used harming a particular set of people who are as British as I am as a means to further her political career. For that reason if no other she deserves no sympathy.
Given the growth in vote in most cities, and similar expectations of Labour leakage to LD, I'm expecting the Libs to notch up a good performance too as the obvious voice of Remain amongst none Tories.
I'm sticking to my previous predictions - Tories and Lab down on 7ish% each, both behind Greens, BXP on 40ish, Libs on mid 20s.
> I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
> So nice to see that people are unwilling to find any compassion, not even a smidge, even for their worst enemy, indeed, wear that as a mark of pride. Heartwarming.
Pretty grim isn't it.
I shed a tear when Brown resigned. It was the most human of all his speeches, and I was genuinely sad to see him go - despite working for years to help get a Tory victory.
Mrs May has done her duty, in difficult times, I suspect to huge personal cost - but the way that events conspired meant her way wasn't to be, and I'm pleased that she has finally done the right thing and resigned. We should be grateful that people are willing to devote their lives in the hope of improving the lives of others - if we lose that sense of gratitude I suspect society would be much poorer for it.
> > @CatMan said:
> > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
>
> As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
Out of interest what was it about that post that was *patronising*? Or is identifying as a citizen of nowhere inherently patronising???
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/9151519/conservative-leadership-race-boris-johnson-theresa-may/
> > @CatMan said:
> > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
>
> As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
A minority of snowflakes will continue to feel betrayed and furious about stuff they can’t quite put their fingers on. The rest of us - the majority - won’t.
Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
> > @Foxy said:
> > > @RochdalePioneers said:
> > > I've just seen her speech for the first time. She filled up, turned and marched at speed into Downing Street where I expect she cried. When you feel emotional it's hard not to crack - I did a couple of weeks back during my best man speech for an old friend.
> > >
> > > I've heard lots of negative comments today about her emotion, and seen the photos taken. She may be an utterly shit politician. But she remains a living feeling human who has continued on with her sense of duty long after most people would have quit.
> > >
> > > She deserves our respect.
> >
> > If she had gone 5 months ago, possibly.
> >
> > She has a tin ear, and demonstrated it by not knowing when it was time to go. She has failed at everything that she has attempted in her short premiership, before handing over to a fuckwit.
> >
> > No respect from me.
>
> They are her failings as a politician. Which are many. And yes, her failings as a person when it comes to things like emotional intelligence. I get that. I've been on the receiving end of bosses with no EI. But they remain people, and part of being a socialist is that I care for people. May is a Tory, and a somewhat cold and calculating Tory at that.
>
> But set party politics aside and what do we find. A person. In agony. Having forced herself to stay despite sanity demanding she quit, having long since privately understood it's over. I personally would hate to be an MP. It's an awful job. Then we have ministers. Under the spotlight for all they say and do. Or worse all they don't say or do.
>
> Think how bad it is to be Prime Minister. It's not like they get remunerated sufficiently for the pressure and hours
Think of how many innocent people she squashed getting there, and whilst there.
The pain of a bruised ego will heal. She will be ok. All that's happened is someone has gone from being stupendously privileged to merely very privileged. It's a demotion she richly deserved.
> Otherwise UK would have imposed to wait to publish results until the last bureau of Guayane close!
>
> You are already the only one waiting for Italy. Waiting for Guyane and co would have been too much for all British anoraks
>
> > @kle4 said:
> > tomorrow it's time for
>
> >
> > The French islands not voting at the same time as mainland France? Logistical issue?
>
>
So Andrea, all other countries start counting and releasing results as soon as they finish on Sunday? eg Germany 6pm local, France/Spain 8pm - is that right? UK only country to wait for Italy closing at 11pm local time??!!
> https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
>
>
>
> My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
>
> Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
Brown was the worst PM in half a century
> > @HYUFD said:
> > > @CatMan said:
> > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> >
> > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
>
> A minority of snowflakes will continue to feel betrayed and furious about stuff they can’t quite put their fingers on. The rest of us - the majority - won’t.
The fact you still think the metropolitan liberal elite constitutes the majority of the country shows you have still learnt nothing from the Leave vote and explains why the Brexit Party will top the poll on Sunday
> > @HYUFD said:
> > > @CatMan said:
> > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> >
> > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
>
> Out of interest what was it about that post that was *patronising*? Or is identifying as a citizen of nowhere inherently patronising???
It wasn’t. It’s just that HYUFD is learning conversational ERG as that’s what his unwavering, unconditional support for his team requires.
What a difference a few weeks makes.
> > @HYUFD said:
> > > @CatMan said:
> > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> >
> > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
>
> Out of interest what was it about that post that was *patronising*? Or is identifying as a citizen of nowhere inherently patronising???
By its very definition it was meant to express the inherent superiority of a pro globalisation liberal elite
> By its very definition it was meant to express the inherent superiority of a pro globalisation liberal elite
You are hallucinating victimhood.
> > @rottenborough said:
> > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> >
> >
> >
> > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> >
> > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
>
> Brown was the worst PM in half a century
After the debacle of the last five years it takes gall and/or blindness to keep saying that.
> > @edmundintokyo said:
> > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > @CatMan said:
> > > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> > >
> > > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
> >
> > Out of interest what was it about that post that was *patronising*? Or is identifying as a citizen of nowhere inherently patronising???
>
> By its very definition it was meant to express the inherent superiority of a pro globalisation liberal elite
Wonderful stuff!!
> > @SouthamObserver said:
> > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > @CatMan said:
> > > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> > >
> > > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
> >
> > A minority of snowflakes will continue to feel betrayed and furious about stuff they can’t quite put their fingers on. The rest of us - the majority - won’t.
>
> The fact you still think the metropolitan liberal elite constitutes the majority of the country shows you have still learnt nothing from the Leave vote and explains why the Brexit Party will top the poll on Sunday
They will not get close to 50% and so do not represent the majority. The fact you don’t understand that demonstrates that your sole interest is in appeasing a minority because it might help your team to win.
> > @rottenborough said:
> > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> >
> >
> >
> > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> >
> > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
>
> Brown was the worst PM in half a century
Since Churchill, huh?
>
> The fact you still think the metropolitan liberal elite constitutes the majority of the country shows you have still learnt nothing from the Leave vote and explains why the Brexit Party will top the poll on Sunday
This grotesque mischaracterisation of Leave and Remain voters explains why the Conservative Party is doomed to oblivion.
EU expect the following timetable:
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/resources/library/media/20190521RES52073/20190521RES52073.pdf
> @DoubleCarpet said:
> > @AndreaParma_82 said:
> > Otherwise UK would have imposed to wait to publish results until the last bureau of Guayane close!
> >
> > You are already the only one waiting for Italy. Waiting for Guyane and co would have been too much for all British anoraks
> >
> > > @kle4 said:
> > > tomorrow it's time for
> >
> > >
> > > The French islands not voting at the same time as mainland France? Logistical issue?
> >
> >
>
> So Andrea, all other countries start counting and releasing results as soon as they finish on Sunday? eg Germany 6pm local, France/Spain 8pm - is that right? UK only country to wait for Italy closing at 11pm local time??!!
We have enough problems getting people of talent to enter public service without further compounding the issue by refusing to see that politicians of every shade are also human beings with emotions, feelings and frailties.
Yes, argue about priorities, policies and positions. Question motives.
But we have to acknowledge the public service in high political office takes a human toll.
For all her failings, Theresa May showed the emotional impact that the job has taken on her. It was a very natural and human reaction - she is not a good enough actor to fake that.
For all his failings, Jeremy Corbyn must find the pressures of being LOTO challenging to deal with at times. Can I despise what he stands for and at the same time acknowledge that some of the things he has endured will have come at no little personal, human cost? Of course.
Corbyn has failed to live up to his claim to wanting to deliver a kinder, gentler politics. But that doesn't mean the rest of us should stop trying.
If we want a functional political class - and I think that is something we all should be able to agree on - we have to allow for some level of human frailty and allow some compassion. We don't have to forgive everything, we don't have to forget it either.
But our politicians will never be perfect. We do have to hold them to a higher standard because they seek to govern us. But we also have to acknowledge their humanity from time to time.
Not everything is political. Nor should it ever be.
> > @edmundintokyo said:
> > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > @CatMan said:
> > > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> > >
> > > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
> >
> > Out of interest what was it about that post that was *patronising*? Or is identifying as a citizen of nowhere inherently patronising???
>
> By its very definition it was meant to express the inherent superiority of a pro globalisation liberal elite
Alright Viktor Orbán, calm down
> > @HYUFD said:
> > By its very definition it was meant to express the inherent superiority of a pro globalisation liberal elite
>
> You are hallucinating victimhood.
Betrayal and victimhood are addictive, but you can’t build a country at ease with itself on the back of them.
https://twitter.com/FrankLuntz/status/1132027463297523712
> Newcastle. Norty Tyneside is at 34.9%
>
> > @dixiedean said:
> > Anyone know what #15 "Tyne" is? South Tyneside is elsewhere on the list. Would that be Newcastle or N Tyneside?
>
>
Cheers.
> > @HYUFD said:
> >
> > The fact you still think the metropolitan liberal elite constitutes the majority of the country shows you have still learnt nothing from the Leave vote and explains why the Brexit Party will top the poll on Sunday
>
> This grotesque mischaracterisation of Leave and Remain voters explains why the Conservative Party is doomed to oblivion.
No, it shows why your vision of eternal Tory Heathism does not connect with the mood of the times as Mattthew Godwin has amply demonstrated
> Away from the May-hem, new betting opps folks:
>
> https://twitter.com/FrankLuntz/status/1132027463297523712
It'd be funny if one of the debates was Sanders, Biden, Warren and Buttigieg
> > @HYUFD said:
> > > @rottenborough said:
> > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> > >
> > > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
> >
> > Brown was the worst PM in half a century
>
> After the debacle of the last five years it takes gall and/or blindness to keep saying that.
It was Brown who overspent and failed to control immigration and let the banks run riot and created the conditions for the populist unrest which produced Corbyn and Brexit in the first plave
> > @Jonathan said:
> > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > @rottenborough said:
> > > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> > > >
> > > > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
> > >
> > > Brown was the worst PM in half a century
> >
> > After the debacle of the last five years it takes gall and/or blindness to keep saying that.
>
> It was Brown who overspend and failed to control immigration and let the banks run riot and created the conditions for the populist unrest which produced Corbyn and Brexit in the first plave
Total crap.
> > @HYUFD said:
> > > @SouthamObserver said:
> > > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > > @CatMan said:
> > > > > I'm a citizen of nowhere, so I have sod all compassion for May
> > > >
> > > > As Sunday will prove citizens of somewhere are still fed up with being patronised by the likes of you
> > >
> > > A minority of snowflakes will continue to feel betrayed and furious about stuff they can’t quite put their fingers on. The rest of us - the majority - won’t.
> >
> > The fact you still think the metropolitan liberal elite constitutes the majority of the country shows you have still learnt nothing from the Leave vote and explains why the Brexit Party will top the poll on Sunday
>
> They will not get close to 50% and so do not represent the majority. The fact you don’t understand that demonstrates that your sole interest is in appeasing a minority because it might help your team to win.
It is 50% Leave 50 % Remain with Survation today and Survation had Remain ahead in its final pre EU referendum poll
> > @rottenborough said:
>
> > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
>
>
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
> > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
>
> >
>
> > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
>
>
>
> Brown was the worst PM in half a century
>
> It depends whether we are talking strictly about time as PM. Brown was a tower during the 1990s in the run up to 1997 win. I think everyone forgets him demolishing the Major government, day after day, in Commons, whilst also preparing policy and manifesto etc.
Brown has the intellect that Blair could only assume he has. Blair is a second rate politician who was lucky to have a first rate team to back him. Unfortunately, Brown ended up with a second rate team who could not keep up with him.
> The unwillingness of a number of people (on here and elsewhere) to refuse to look beyond the political to the human is dispiriting.
>
> We have enough problems getting people of talent to enter public service without further compounding the issue by refusing to see that politicians of every shade are also human beings with emotions, feelings and frailties.
>
> Yes, argue about priorities, policies and positions. Question motives.
>
> But we have to acknowledge the public service in high political office takes a human toll.
>
> For all her failings, Theresa May showed the emotional impact that the job has taken on her. It was a very natural and human reaction - she is not a good enough actor to fake that.
>
> For all his failings, Jeremy Corbyn must find the pressures of being LOTO challenging to deal with at times. Can I despise what he stands for and at the same time acknowledge that some of the things he has endured will have come at no little personal, human cost? Of course.
>
> Corbyn has failed to live up to his claim to wanting to deliver a kinder, gentler politics. But that doesn't mean the rest of us should stop trying.
>
> If we want a functional political class - and I think that is something we all should be able to agree on - we have to allow for some level of human frailty and allow some compassion. We don't have to forgive everything, we don't have to forget it either.
>
> But our politicians will never be perfect. We do have to hold them to a higher standard because they seek to govern us. But we also have to acknowledge their humanity from time to time.
>
> Not everything is political. Nor should it ever be.
Nobody forces these people to take these jobs. And everyone should know the sorts of pressures they entail. Moreover no one forces these people to walk all over others to gain high office. They choose to do that themselves and so are not deserving of sympathy when they fall from power into a life of wealth and security that few people can even begin to dream of.
Her tears today were self pity when they should have been of shame.
>
> It is 50% Leave 50 % Remain with Survation today and Survation had Remain ahead in its final pre EU referendum poll
Survation's final poll for the European elections has the Lib Dems on 12% behind the Conservatives and Labour. We'll find out shortly how accurate their weightings are.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/24/opinion/theresa-may-resigns.html
> > @HYUFD said:
> > > @Jonathan said:
> > > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > > @rottenborough said:
> > > > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> > > > >
> > > > > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
> > > >
> > > > Brown was the worst PM in half a century
> > >
> > > After the debacle of the last five years it takes gall and/or blindness to keep saying that.
> >
> > It was Brown who overspend and failed to control immigration and let the banks run riot and created the conditions for the populist unrest which produced Corbyn and Brexit in the first plave
>
> Total crap.
Nope I would suggest that is pretty accurate. He and May vie for worst PM in the post war era.
> But they remain people, and part of being a socialist is that I care for people.
> Think how bad it is to be Prime Minister. It's not like they get remunerated sufficiently for the pressure and hours <
+++++
"part of being a socialist is that I care for people"
Really??!!! Only socialists "care for people"?
PUKE. VOM. UGH.
"Part of being me is that I am lovely and care a lot, it comes with being me"
Go screw yourself you stupid, narcissistic, embarrassing, wanky, idiotic, self congratulating pillock.
President Trump’s re-election campaign has spent far more than any single Democratic presidential candidate on Facebook advertising, reprising a strategy that was central to his 2016 victory.
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2019/05/21/us/politics/trump-2020-facebook-ads.html
>
> Nobody forces these people to take these jobs. And everyone should know the sorts of pressures they entail. Moreover no one forces these people to walk all over others to gain high office. They choose to do that themselves and so are not deserving of sympathy when they fall from power into a life of wealth and security that few people can even begin to dream of.
>
> Her tears today were self pity when they should have been of shame.
You have absolutely no evidence for that assertion. You are projecting your own prejudices on the situation. And that says more about you than anything else.
As regards the pressures, there is some truth in that - but until you have lived the life, you cannot really appreciate what it actually entails. You can think you are prepared, but I suspect nothing can adequately prepare you for it. And we need people prepared to step up to the plate.
> > @rottenborough said:
> > > @rottenborough said:
> >
> > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> >
> > > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> >
> > >
> >
> > > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
> >
> >
> >
> > Brown was the worst PM in half a century
> >
> > It depends whether we are talking strictly about time as PM. Brown was a tower during the 1990s in the run up to 1997 win. I think everyone forgets him demolishing the Major government, day after day, in Commons, whilst also preparing policy and manifesto etc.
>
> Brown has the intellect that Blair could only assume he has. Blair is a second rate politician who was lucky to have a first rate team to back him. Unfortunately, Brown ended up with a second rate team who could not keep up with him.
Blair was a first rank PM much as I disagreed with him, along with Thatcher the only first rank PM of my lifetime.
> https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123?s=20
Major was PM for 6.5 years!
> > @John_McLean said:
> > > @rottenborough said:
> > > > @rottenborough said:
> > >
> > > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > > My objection to this is that Brown was not a lesser figure. A good chunk, maybe the bulk, of New Labour policy and conception was driven by Brown, relentlessly. Even the 'tough on crime' etc etc was his.
> > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > > Blair would have never amounted to anything if they had not happened to share an office. Discuss.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Brown was the worst PM in half a century
> > >
> > > It depends whether we are talking strictly about time as PM. Brown was a tower during the 1990s in the run up to 1997 win. I think everyone forgets him demolishing the Major government, day after day, in Commons, whilst also preparing policy and manifesto etc.
> >
> > Brown has the intellect that Blair could only assume he has. Blair is a second rate politician who was lucky to have a first rate team to back him. Unfortunately, Brown ended up with a second rate team who could not keep up with him.
>
> Blair was a first rank PM much as I disagreed with him, along with Thatcher the only first rank PM of my lifetime.
>
>
Blair was a fine orator and a fast thinker. He had excellent self awareness that has utterly deserted him. He was lucky in his timing in that he never faced a strong Conservative party until very late on.
He made some important contributions to domestic policy which will go down as being successful, and some important contributions to foreign policy that definitely won't. Take Iraq out of the equation and all his failings are minor, subjective or manifested after his time (the continued financialisation of the economy and the crash).
I despised him for Iraq but didn't gloat when he left. He largely succeeded on his own terms, which is something no PM has really done since then.
> > @HYUFD said:
> > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123?s=20
>
> Major was PM for 6.5 years!
After Thatcher had served more then 11.5
So, Major was PM for roughly half as long.
https://twitter.com/AaronBastani/status/1132047373432184832
See the thread comments.
> The unwillingness of a number of people (on here and elsewhere) to refuse to look beyond the political to the human is dispiriting.
>
> We have enough problems getting people of talent to enter public service without further compounding the issue by refusing to see that politicians of every shade are also human beings with emotions, feelings and frailties.
>
> Yes, argue about priorities, policies and positions. Question motives.
>
> But we have to acknowledge the public service in high political office takes a human toll.
>
> For all her failings, Theresa May showed the emotional impact that the job has taken on her. It was a very natural and human reaction - she is not a good enough actor to fake that.
>
> For all his failings, Jeremy Corbyn must find the pressures of being LOTO challenging to deal with at times. Can I despise what he stands for and at the same time acknowledge that some of the things he has endured will have come at no little personal, human cost? Of course.
>
> Corbyn has failed to live up to his claim to wanting to deliver a kinder, gentler politics. But that doesn't mean the rest of us should stop trying.
>
> If we want a functional political class - and I think that is something we all should be able to agree on - we have to allow for some level of human frailty and allow some compassion. We don't have to forgive everything, we don't have to forget it either.
>
> But our politicians will never be perfect. We do have to hold them to a higher standard because they seek to govern us. But we also have to acknowledge their humanity from time to time.
>
> Not everything is political. Nor should it ever be.
+1
> > @justin124 said:
> > > @HYUFD said:
> > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123?s=20
> >
> > Major was PM for 6.5 years!
>
> After Thatcher had served more then 11.5
>
> So, Major was PM for roughly half as long.
Nearer 60% but my point is that he was PM for a long time. Not far off Macmillan.
Phillips vs Boris at GE 2022?
Wow. That would be something...
> > @Mortimer said:
> > > @justin124 said:
> > > > @HYUFD said:
> > > > https://twitter.com/MichaelLCrick/status/1132000001738117123?s=20
> > >
> > > Major was PM for 6.5 years!
> >
> > After Thatcher had served more then 11.5
> >
> > So, Major was PM for roughly half as long.
>
> Nearer 60% but my point is that he was PM for a long time. Not far off Macmillan.
60% is roughly half....
https://twitter.com/EuropeElects/status/1132043429809147909
> Distinct lack of big city / metro counts yet. I don't suppose there's any great reason to assume that the trend will be much different from the rest though in terms of the Remaininess - turnout relationship.
Whilst Tory remainer areas like Wandsworth and Putney are well up, Labour areas like Lambeth and Waltham Forest are less spectacular.
Wealthy London is whining to the faraway towns.