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  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,694
    edited January 2019
    Oh dear, how sad, never mind.

    William Hill will close hundreds of betting shops, many in a matter of weeks, as it shifts its focus to online gambling in the latest blow to the high street.

    The bookmaker revealed the financial fall-out from a tough 2018 on Monday, with operating profits falling 15pc.

    Like many other in the sector, William Hill has been hit hard by a government crackdown on fixed odds betting terminals (FOBTs), the so-called “crack cocaine” of gambling. Maximum stakes will be slashed to just £2 from April, pushing many shops into loss-making territory overnight.

    William Hill has earmarked about 900 shops for closure. Insiders said that while the company will shut some within days of the FOBT restrictions being implemented, it will take up to two years before the programme of closures is completed.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/01/21/william-hill-close-hundreds-betting-shops/
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    I think Ireland has to leave the EU though, to be able to negotiate that bi-lateral deal.

    Hmmm........
    No it doesn't. France has a bilateral customs union with Monaco. We could sign a bilateral treaty to make Northern Ireland part of Irish customs territory.

    The people in Northern Ireland want a backstop. A backstop has no material affect on the vast majority of people in Britain. It should be the easiest deal in history to do.

    No they don't want a backstop - nobody wants a backstop.

    What they want is an open border. But the EU is threatening to erect one.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,737
    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    DavidL said:

    Scott_P said:
    Maybe we could have a sensible FTA with the EU instead so that we don't need a hard border. Just a thought.
    A thought that's been debunked a million times since 2016. FTAs do not deliver frictionless trade.
    Depends what's in them. The SM is just a high powered FTA.
    Ok, so we stay in the single market and call it an FTA.
    If we stay in the CU, agree not to vary our standards and regulations out of step with the EU and accept mutual recognition of regulations by equivalent bodies the argument about whether we are in our out of the SM may become somewhat Jesuitical. And not very interesting either.
    You said yourself that it "depends what's in them". If frictionless trade is an essential requirement then what's in the agreement will necessarily include all of that. It's pointless.
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    It's not been a particularly good day for businessmen boosters of Brexit, all things considered.
  • TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    I think Ireland has to leave the EU though, to be able to negotiate that bi-lateral deal.

    Hmmm........
    No it doesn't. France has a bilateral customs union with Monaco. We could sign a bilateral treaty to make Northern Ireland part of Irish customs territory.

    The people in Northern Ireland want a backstop. A backstop has no material affect on the vast majority of people in Britain. It should be the easiest deal in history to do.

    No they don't want a backstop - nobody wants a backstop.

    What they want is an open border. But the EU is threatening to erect one.

    Actually, they want to stay in the EU. They can’t do that so support the backstop. And if they do end up with a hard border they may well end up leaving the UK.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220
    'Cause since I've come on home,
    Well my business's been a mess
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    :lol:

    Great icon as well.

    Molesworth?
  • Oh dear, how sad, never mind.

    William Hill will close hundreds of betting shops, many in a matter of weeks, as it shifts its focus to online gambling in the latest blow to the high street.

    The bookmaker revealed the financial fall-out from a tough 2018 on Monday, with operating profits falling 15pc.

    Like many other in the sector, William Hill has been hit hard by a government crackdown on fixed odds betting terminals (FOBTs), the so-called “crack cocaine” of gambling. Maximum stakes will be slashed to just £2 from April, pushing many shops into loss-making territory overnight.

    William Hill has earmarked about 900 shops for closure. Insiders said that while the company will shut some within days of the FOBT restrictions being implemented, it will take up to two years before the programme of closures is completed.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/01/21/william-hill-close-hundreds-betting-shops/

    And a crack down on online betting, especially in football and sport generally, is long overdue
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 22,042
    Mike Ashley - a chap who looks like enjoys cake - in you step...
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626
    IanB2 said:

    Stand by for resignations:

    Theresa May is set to reject Tory calls for her to give her ministers and MPs a free vote on an amendment to the Brexit motion being debated next week intended to stop the UK leaving the EU without a deal, government sources have indicated

    I'm sure Nadine Dorries will be happy to fill the Chancellor slot, as her reward for coming round to May's Deal....
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,257

    Well lots of Leavers thought getting trade deals would be quick and easy.

    Trade deals are long and hard.

    That we will have to do our own - even with somebody as diligent and expert in the field as Liam Fox on the case- rather than have the EU doing them for us has never been my idea of what constitutes a brexit dividend. It's a brexit drawback IMO.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,621
    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    ... and bog paper.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,237
    Sean_F said:

    These maps still worry me, especially the ebony stuff in a lot of the Southern states.

    image

    and

    image

    https://www.iflscience.com/technology/these-maps-show-the-most-popular-porn-searches-in-each-us-state/

    I'd have thought the most popular category in the South would be "Sister."
    I think people view porn so as to imagine copulation with people they wouldn't normally be with.
  • kinabalu said:

    Well lots of Leavers thought getting trade deals would be quick and easy.

    Trade deals are long and hard.

    That we will have to do our own - even with somebody as diligent and expert in the field as Liam Fox on the case- rather than have the EU doing them for us has never been my idea of what constitutes a brexit dividend. It's a brexit drawback IMO.
    Prior to the referendum Mr Meeks did an analysis pointing out it takes several years to sort out trade deals.

    PB Leavers denounced him as a heretic, those Leavers look thick as mince now.
  • Dreadful day for business news, some Brexit related, and P & O announcing it is re-flagging to Cyprus is very depressing

    To mps - this mess needs sorting now and not delayed to the end of the year as proposed by Yvette Cooper
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992

    Scott_P said:
    He is talking rubbish. There is not a single word in the GFA that refers to the border and its status. There may be good reasons for not having a hard border (actually there are good reasons) but they have nothing at all to do with the GFA. He is just clutching at straws.
    Doesn't (have to) spell it out. Not like you to miss the wood, when looking at the trees, Richard.

    A hard border would arguably contravene any and all of Article 3 plus Strand Three Rights Safeguards and Equality of Opportunity Para 2(i) plus of course the Security section in toto and elements of Policing and Justice also.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 49,871
    rcs1000 said:

    Sean_F said:

    These maps still worry me, especially the ebony stuff in a lot of the Southern states.

    image

    and

    image

    https://www.iflscience.com/technology/these-maps-show-the-most-popular-porn-searches-in-each-us-state/

    I'd have thought the most popular category in the South would be "Sister."
    I think people view porn so as to imagine copulation with people they wouldn't normally be with.
    Women?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    TOPPING said:

    Scott_P said:
    He is talking rubbish. There is not a single word in the GFA that refers to the border and its status. There may be good reasons for not having a hard border (actually there are good reasons) but they have nothing at all to do with the GFA. He is just clutching at straws.
    Doesn't (have to) spell it out. Not like you to miss the wood, when looking at the trees, Richard.

    A hard border would arguably contravene any and all of Article 3 plus Strand Three Rights Safeguards and Equality of Opportunity Para 2(i) plus of course the Security section in toto and elements of Policing and Justice also.
    Makes you wonder why Dublin will allow the EU to build a hard border then doesn't it ?

  • IanB2 said:
    Who is head of the centre for European studies and a strong advocate of Norway joining the EU. Hmm. Not exactly an unbiased source on Norwegian attitudes to the EU.

    Erik O. Eriksen is research director of the Norwegian Research Council-funded project EuroDiv

    Eriksen was research director of the Norwegian Research Council-funded five-year project EuroTrans

    Erik Oddvar Eriksen was the scientific coordinator of the EU funded Integrated Project RECON - Reconstituting Democracy in Europe
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626
    Going into administration seems an overdue outcome. They need to sort out what the hell has gone on as between fraud and just bad managment - resolve what the true value of the business might be and whether there is enough there to be salvaged.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992
    TGOHF said:

    TOPPING said:

    Scott_P said:
    He is talking rubbish. There is not a single word in the GFA that refers to the border and its status. There may be good reasons for not having a hard border (actually there are good reasons) but they have nothing at all to do with the GFA. He is just clutching at straws.
    Doesn't (have to) spell it out. Not like you to miss the wood, when looking at the trees, Richard.

    A hard border would arguably contravene any and all of Article 3 plus Strand Three Rights Safeguards and Equality of Opportunity Para 2(i) plus of course the Security section in toto and elements of Policing and Justice also.
    Makes you wonder why Dublin will allow the EU to build a hard border then doesn't it ?

    They won't. The UK will cave.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992

    Going into administration seems an overdue outcome. They need to sort out what the hell has gone on as between fraud and just bad managment - resolve what the true value of the business might be and whether there is enough there to be salvaged.
    Old Compton Street won't be the same again.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,257

    I'm sure Nadine Dorries will be happy to fill the Chancellor slot, as her reward for coming round to May's Deal....

    I think she's doing the right thing.

    Putting my ERG cap on - which I can do if I make this quick - and addressing one of their meetings, I would say something like the following:

    "Look, the traitor Grieve plans to tie this whole thing up in knots. It will be a world of pain and at the end of it, no Brexit. So we need to get real. The withdrawal agreement is not the end of the world. Yes, I know, I know, Ireland and the Backstop, we would all prefer that neither were there, but they are, and that is not changing. So let us pass the wretched thing, and at least leave, then we can call in the dues later and, you know, really make our presence felt going forward. The dream lives on!"
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    Scott_P said:
    He is talking rubbish. There is not a single word in the GFA that refers to the border and its status. There may be good reasons for not having a hard border (actually there are good reasons) but they have nothing at all to do with the GFA. He is just clutching at straws.
    The core of the Good Friday Agreement is the recognition that a United Ireland is a legitimate aspiration for people living in Northern Ireland to the extent, for example, that they are allowed to reject British citizenship and hold Irish citizenship in preference with no detriment to them.

    It simply is not credible to say that putting a hard border between the six counties and the rest of the country is at all consistent with that recognition. How would you react to a hard border between Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire?
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    Because the content would be the same as the NI-only backstop, so the ERG and DUP would still hate it.
    It couldn’t be because we would be out of the EU at that point.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited January 2019
    All I ever see from this campaign is threats and blackmail towards Labour about what would supposedly happen if we don't do as they say, rather than any positive arguments for their idea. Seemingly they learnt nothing from the original referendum campaign about what does and doesn't persuade people.
  • VerulamiusVerulamius Posts: 1,543
    Dyson is moving some of his significant people functions (SPFs) to Singapore.

    I am sure that the tax benefit gained from this move is purely incidental to the overall commercial rationale.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Dyson is moving some of his significant people functions (SPFs) to Singapore.

    I am sure that the tax benefit gained from this move is purely incidental to the overall commercial rationale.

    https://twitter.com/PickardJE/status/1087760786808807425
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626
    kinabalu said:

    I'm sure Nadine Dorries will be happy to fill the Chancellor slot, as her reward for coming round to May's Deal....

    I think she's doing the right thing.

    Putting my ERG cap on - which I can do if I make this quick - and addressing one of their meetings, I would say something like the following:

    "Look, the traitor Grieve plans to tie this whole thing up in knots. It will be a world of pain and at the end of it, no Brexit. So we need to get real. The withdrawal agreement is not the end of the world. Yes, I know, I know, Ireland and the Backstop, we would all prefer that neither were there, but they are, and that is not changing. So let us pass the wretched thing, and at least leave, then we can call in the dues later and, you know, really make our presence felt going forward. The dream lives on!"
    As some of us have been saying for weeks!

    The price for their support needs to be May stepping down as soon as her successor is appointed, with that process kicking off in early April. Then ERG can get behind a candidate who is prepared to walk away from the May Deal at the first sign of bad faith by EU negotiators in the trade deal negotiations....
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220
    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?
  • Scott_P said:
    He is talking rubbish. There is not a single word in the GFA that refers to the border and its status. There may be good reasons for not having a hard border (actually there are good reasons) but they have nothing at all to do with the GFA. He is just clutching at straws.
    The core of the Good Friday Agreement is the recognition that a United Ireland is a legitimate aspiration for people living in Northern Ireland to the extent, for example, that they are allowed to reject British citizenship and hold Irish citizenship in preference with no detriment to them.

    It simply is not credible to say that putting a hard border between the six counties and the rest of the country is at all consistent with that recognition. How would you react to a hard border between Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire?
    They are indeed able to hold those aspirations. But the hard border does not change the CTA nor does it change the status of Northern Ireland. I am not advocating one which is why I support the Deal but the idea there is any legal impediment in the GFA to it is just rubbish
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,737
    Charles said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    Because the content would be the same as the NI-only backstop, so the ERG and DUP would still hate it.
    It couldn’t be because we would be out of the EU at that point.
    We could still do a bilateral customs deal with Ireland (like the France/Monaco deal, where Ireland is France and Northern Ireland is Monaco).
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    Because the content would be the same as the NI-only backstop, so the ERG and DUP would still hate it.
    In that case it wouldn't pass parliament. Just like the NI-only backstop..

    bingo
    Would it require a parliamentary vote? Meaningful or otherwise. Parly doesn't vote on every trade deal...
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,737

    Scott_P said:
    He is talking rubbish. There is not a single word in the GFA that refers to the border and its status. There may be good reasons for not having a hard border (actually there are good reasons) but they have nothing at all to do with the GFA. He is just clutching at straws.
    The core of the Good Friday Agreement is the recognition that a United Ireland is a legitimate aspiration for people living in Northern Ireland to the extent, for example, that they are allowed to reject British citizenship and hold Irish citizenship in preference with no detriment to them.

    It simply is not credible to say that putting a hard border between the six counties and the rest of the country is at all consistent with that recognition. How would you react to a hard border between Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire?
    They are indeed able to hold those aspirations. But the hard border does not change the CTA nor does it change the status of Northern Ireland. I am not advocating one which is why I support the Deal but the idea there is any legal impediment in the GFA to it is just rubbish
    To say that a hard border does not change the status of Northern Ireland is equivalent to saying that Brexit does not change the status of the UK.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,752
    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626
    TOPPING said:

    Going into administration seems an overdue outcome. They need to sort out what the hell has gone on as between fraud and just bad managment - resolve what the true value of the business might be and whether there is enough there to be salvaged.
    Old Compton Street won't be the same again.
    You go there for the cake? 🍩
  • kinabalu said:

    Well lots of Leavers thought getting trade deals would be quick and easy.

    Trade deals are long and hard.

    That we will have to do our own - even with somebody as diligent and expert in the field as Liam Fox on the case- rather than have the EU doing them for us has never been my idea of what constitutes a brexit dividend. It's a brexit drawback IMO.
    Was your reference to Dr "No Deals" Fox tongue in cheek?

    "Hello Doctor, I think I have haemorrhoids, could you examine me please? Tell me, do you know anything about haemorrhoids?"

    "Well I have looked them up in a book. I am actually a professionally trained trade negotiator with an MBA in business and 20 years working for the EU trade commission, so I am quite a clever chap, and should be excellent at this GP stuff. Now bend over for me will you...."
  • Pulpstar said:

    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?

    Roberts cannot propose/pass a budget like Pelosi.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220
    edited January 2019

    Pulpstar said:

    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?

    Roberts cannot propose/pass a budget like Pelosi.
    He has tremendous legal (& by implication cultural) power though.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,604
    Anorak said:

    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    Because the content would be the same as the NI-only backstop, so the ERG and DUP would still hate it.
    In that case it wouldn't pass parliament. Just like the NI-only backstop..

    bingo
    Would it require a parliamentary vote? Meaningful or otherwise. Parly doesn't vote on every trade deal...
    'Necessity hath no law'. I have a feeling we may be reaching for Cromwell's great thought quite soon

  • kinabalu said:

    I'm sure Nadine Dorries will be happy to fill the Chancellor slot, as her reward for coming round to May's Deal....

    I think she's doing the right thing.

    Putting my ERG cap on - which I can do if I make this quick - and addressing one of their meetings, I would say something like the following:

    "Look, the traitor Grieve plans to tie this whole thing up in knots. It will be a world of pain and at the end of it, no Brexit. So we need to get real. The withdrawal agreement is not the end of the world. Yes, I know, I know, Ireland and the Backstop, we would all prefer that neither were there, but they are, and that is not changing. So let us pass the wretched thing, and at least leave, then we can call in the dues later and, you know, really make our presence felt going forward. The dream lives on!"
    If Nadine is given a shot at being Chancellor perhaps we should give her a shot at the Nobel prize for mathematics as well while we are at it.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,737
    kinabalu said:

    I'm sure Nadine Dorries will be happy to fill the Chancellor slot, as her reward for coming round to May's Deal....

    I think she's doing the right thing.

    Putting my ERG cap on - which I can do if I make this quick - and addressing one of their meetings, I would say something like the following:

    "Look, the traitor Grieve plans to tie this whole thing up in knots. It will be a world of pain and at the end of it, no Brexit. So we need to get real. The withdrawal agreement is not the end of the world. Yes, I know, I know, Ireland and the Backstop, we would all prefer that neither were there, but they are, and that is not changing. So let us pass the wretched thing, and at least leave, then we can call in the dues later and, you know, really make our presence felt going forward. The dream lives on!"
    Is the phrase "going forward" allowed in ERG meetings?
  • Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?

    Roberts cannot propose/pass a budget like Pelosi.
    He has tremendous legal (& by implication cultural) power though.
    He does.

    I think he's the key vote on effectively overturning Roe v Wade, that will something that will outlast anything Pelosi will do as Speaker.
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,257

    Was your reference to Dr "No Deals" Fox tongue in cheek?

    "Hello Doctor, I think I have haemorrhoids, could you examine me please? Tell me, do you know anything about haemorrhoids?"

    "Well I have looked them up in a book. I am actually a professionally trained trade negotiator with an MBA in business and 20 years working for the EU trade commission, so I am quite a clever chap, and should be excellent at this GP stuff. Now bend over for me will you...."

    I would rather have him doing trade deals than probing up my bum, if I can perhaps leave it at that.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220
    algarkirk said:

    Anorak said:

    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    Because the content would be the same as the NI-only backstop, so the ERG and DUP would still hate it.
    In that case it wouldn't pass parliament. Just like the NI-only backstop..

    bingo
    Would it require a parliamentary vote? Meaningful or otherwise. Parly doesn't vote on every trade deal...
    'Necessity hath no law'. I have a feeling we may be reaching for Cromwell's great thought quite soon
    Olly Cromwell, about as pleasent as Jo Stalin or old Adolf.
  • Scott_P said:
    Sums up the duplicitous lying bastards. Brexiteer will eventually used as a pejorative term for pathological liars and charlatans. The whited sepulchres and hypocrites of the modern age.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776
    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?
  • mattmatt Posts: 3,789

    It's not been a particularly good day for businessmen boosters of Brexit, all things considered.

    Perhaps Johnson could write a ST column where he warns of hubris.
  • kinabalu said:

    Was your reference to Dr "No Deals" Fox tongue in cheek?

    "Hello Doctor, I think I have haemorrhoids, could you examine me please? Tell me, do you know anything about haemorrhoids?"

    "Well I have looked them up in a book. I am actually a professionally trained trade negotiator with an MBA in business and 20 years working for the EU trade commission, so I am quite a clever chap, and should be excellent at this GP stuff. Now bend over for me will you...."

    I would rather have him doing trade deals than probing up my bum, if I can perhaps leave it at that.
    10/10 !! One of the funniest posts I have seen in a while, albeit, if by inference, a little homophobic!
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?

    Roberts cannot propose/pass a budget like Pelosi.
    He has tremendous legal (& by implication cultural) power though.
    He does.

    I think he's the key vote on effectively overturning Roe v Wade, that will something that will outlast anything Pelosi will do as Speaker.
    Yes, I've got him down as a Bush conservative, not on the Pence or Trump wing; I don't think either 'side' can take his vote for granted in anything (particularly not Trump on anything tangentially Trump related)
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,257

    As some of us have been saying for weeks!

    The price for their support needs to be May stepping down as soon as her successor is appointed, with that process kicking off in early April. Then ERG can get behind a candidate who is prepared to walk away from the May Deal at the first sign of bad faith by EU negotiators in the trade deal negotiations....

    There you go then. Although I'm not sure she will agree to standing down. I sense she likes being Prime Minister, she likes it very much.

    But no matter - you will get Gove as Brexit Tsar, he's a pragmatic Leaver and will obtain a pragmatic but not BINO deal. You just see if he doesn't.
  • kinabalu said:

    I'm sure Nadine Dorries will be happy to fill the Chancellor slot, as her reward for coming round to May's Deal....

    I think she's doing the right thing.

    Putting my ERG cap on - which I can do if I make this quick - and addressing one of their meetings, I would say something like the following:

    "Look, the traitor Grieve plans to tie this whole thing up in knots. It will be a world of pain and at the end of it, no Brexit. So we need to get real. The withdrawal agreement is not the end of the world. Yes, I know, I know, Ireland and the Backstop, we would all prefer that neither were there, but they are, and that is not changing. So let us pass the wretched thing, and at least leave, then we can call in the dues later and, you know, really make our presence felt going forward. The dream lives on!"
    Is the phrase "going forward" allowed in ERG meetings?
    Nadine would use it. Though she would probably be unwittingly going backward.
  • Oh dear, how sad, never mind.

    William Hill will close hundreds of betting shops, many in a matter of weeks, as it shifts its focus to online gambling in the latest blow to the high street.

    The bookmaker revealed the financial fall-out from a tough 2018 on Monday, with operating profits falling 15pc.

    Like many other in the sector, William Hill has been hit hard by a government crackdown on fixed odds betting terminals (FOBTs), the so-called “crack cocaine” of gambling. Maximum stakes will be slashed to just £2 from April, pushing many shops into loss-making territory overnight.

    William Hill has earmarked about 900 shops for closure. Insiders said that while the company will shut some within days of the FOBT restrictions being implemented, it will take up to two years before the programme of closures is completed.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2019/01/21/william-hill-close-hundreds-betting-shops/

    And a crack down on online betting, especially in football and sport generally, is long overdue
    Anyone who has been in a Will Hill betting shop recently can only rejoice at this news.
  • FenmanFenman Posts: 1,047
    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776
    Fenman said:

    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    There will be electricity on the days the wind blows strongly in North Sea.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    I think Mr Varadkar is not enjoying first contact with hard reality.....
  • kinabalukinabalu Posts: 42,257

    10/10 !! One of the funniest posts I have seen in a while, albeit, if by inference, a little homophobic!

    :-)

    Most kind. Plead not guilty to the charge, but I will indeed leave it at that.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626
    kinabalu said:

    As some of us have been saying for weeks!

    The price for their support needs to be May stepping down as soon as her successor is appointed, with that process kicking off in early April. Then ERG can get behind a candidate who is prepared to walk away from the May Deal at the first sign of bad faith by EU negotiators in the trade deal negotiations....

    There you go then. Although I'm not sure she will agree to standing down. I sense she likes being Prime Minister, she likes it very much.

    But no matter - you will get Gove as Brexit Tsar, he's a pragmatic Leaver and will obtain a pragmatic but not BINO deal. You just see if he doesn't.
    Given her stellar performance as PM (ahem), May can't be allowed ANYWHERE NEAR the trade negotiations.

    (That sentiment probably deserved way more block caps!)
  • Pulpstar said:

    algarkirk said:

    Anorak said:

    TOPPING said:

    TGOHF said:

    Charles said:

    Scott_P said:
    You mean the bilateral U.K.-Ireland deal that was floated a few days ago? Not a bad idea. Why don’t we do that instead of the backstop?
    Because the content would be the same as the NI-only backstop, so the ERG and DUP would still hate it.
    In that case it wouldn't pass parliament. Just like the NI-only backstop..

    bingo
    Would it require a parliamentary vote? Meaningful or otherwise. Parly doesn't vote on every trade deal...
    'Necessity hath no law'. I have a feeling we may be reaching for Cromwell's great thought quite soon
    Olly Cromwell, about as pleasent as Jo Stalin or old Adolf.
    Do I detect an instance of Godwin's Law....?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220
    Won't the bookies just replace Fixed odds terminals with a bunch of cartoon horse racing ? (Yes it's a thing...)
  • kinabalu said:

    As some of us have been saying for weeks!

    The price for their support needs to be May stepping down as soon as her successor is appointed, with that process kicking off in early April. Then ERG can get behind a candidate who is prepared to walk away from the May Deal at the first sign of bad faith by EU negotiators in the trade deal negotiations....

    There you go then. Although I'm not sure she will agree to standing down. I sense she likes being Prime Minister, she likes it very much.

    But no matter - you will get Gove as Brexit Tsar, he's a pragmatic Leaver and will obtain a pragmatic but not BINO deal. You just see if he doesn't.
    Given her stellar performance as PM (ahem), May can't be allowed ANYWHERE NEAR the trade negotiations.

    (That sentiment probably deserved way more block caps!)
    She isn't going to be any worse than the disgraced GP though is she?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220
    edited January 2019
    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    I think Mr Varadkar is not enjoying first contact with hard reality.....
    ...and now the furious row back:

    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1087765579195473920
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Pulpstar said:

    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
    https://www.poemhunter.com/poem/rice-pudding/
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776
    https://twitter.com/NickCohen4/status/1087703792588595200

    I like "disaster socialism" as a term.

  • Pulpstar said:

    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
    Semolina is even worse
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Varadkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    Seems to me that Ireland and the EU have climbed up a political ledge and are entirely unwilling to climb down, so for now some of them at any rate have to pretend that there are not certain consequences to that position.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,914
    Pulpstar said:

    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
    It's got school dinners written all over it
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163
    Danny565 said:

    All I ever see from this campaign is threats and blackmail towards Labour about what would supposedly happen if we don't do as they say, rather than any positive arguments for their idea. Seemingly they learnt nothing from the original referendum campaign about what does and doesn't persuade people.
    You're surprised? They have been increasingly blatant.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163
    edited January 2019
    DavidL said:

    Scott_P said:
    Maybe we could have a sensible FTA with the EU instead so that we don't need a hard border. Just a thought.
    Not going to happen. Why would it when 'winning' is all that matters to the sides? Which will prevent them agreeing.
    Scott_P said:
    Cannot give it up for a promise, so will see nothing agreed, causing what he doesn't want to happen. Makes sense.
  • rkrkrkrkrkrk Posts: 8,301
    Danny565 said:

    All I ever see from this campaign is threats and blackmail towards Labour about what would supposedly happen if we don't do as they say, rather than any positive arguments for their idea. Seemingly they learnt nothing from the original referendum campaign about what does and doesn't persuade people.
    It's strange but the second referendumers are in some ways aligned with No Dealers. Their best chance of winning such a vote is for the vote to be between Remain and No Deal.

    A soft Brexit both muddies the waters in terms of distinguishing between Remain and Brexit, but also makes it harder to get the votes needed for a referendum.

    I know others disagree, but the most likely way I see that we will end up with a really disastrous hard Brexit or No Deal, is if we have a second referendum and Remain loses.
  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,752

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    I think Mr Varadkar is not enjoying first contact with hard reality.....
    ...and now the furious row back:

    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1087765579195473920
    Is he in some kind of incompetence competition with Theresa May?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163
    She must be a deal supporter, the surest way to guarantee there is not a no deal. Being so afraid of the consequences of no deal, she surely would not promote a course of action which might risk no deal, right?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776
    https://twitter.com/Freedland/status/1087750265145643008

    I'm curious why Dyson, who must have already been considering such a move in summer 2016, chose to be so high profile about leaving?

    He must have know this would look bloody terrible.

  • ChrisChris Posts: 11,752
    Fenman said:

    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Splendid. Show Johnny Foreigner a thing or two, what?
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163

    https://twitter.com/NickCohen4/status/1087703792588595200

    I like "disaster socialism" as a term.

    I don't like Williamson, but he's a supporter of the leadership not the leadership, right? He's someone who was cut out from it in fact?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 71,285

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?

    Roberts cannot propose/pass a budget like Pelosi.
    He has tremendous legal (& by implication cultural) power though.
    He does.

    I think he's the key vote on effectively overturning Roe v Wade, that will something that will outlast anything Pelosi will do as Speaker.
    But as a conservative who doesn’t wish to destroy the court, would probably shy away from doing so. For now the court is comparatively balanced, albeit conservative - but of course another Trump appointment would change all that.

    Let’s hope RBG again shrugs off her latest brush with cancer.

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776
    kle4 said:

    https://twitter.com/NickCohen4/status/1087703792588595200

    I like "disaster socialism" as a term.

    I don't like Williamson, but he's a supporter of the leadership not the leadership, right? He's someone who was cut out from it in fact?
    I think he thinks the leadership team are a hotbed of semi-Blairites actually who are afraid of going the full Venezuela in one parliamentary term.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163

    https://twitter.com/Freedland/status/1087750265145643008

    I'm curious why Dyson, who must have already been considering such a move in summer 2016, chose to be so high profile about leaving?

    He must have know this would look bloody terrible.

    Maybe he really does not think it is a big deal how it looks? He has invested heavily into sites in the UK in recent years, that speaks for itself, and if it stops so will that.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220

    Pulpstar said:

    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
    Semolina is even worse
    Hah yes it is indeed. I was physically sick about 25 years ago when I tried it.
  • Nigelb said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Pulpstar said:

    I wonder where John Roberts ranks in terms of power that individuals possess given you know precisely how Gorsuch, Alito, Thomas, Kavanaugh (Very conservative) and Breyer, Ginsburg, Sotomayor, Kagan (Liberal) will vote on these matters:

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-46963426

    He's probably only got slightly less effective power than Trump in the US system. How does his power compare to Pelosi... ?

    Roberts cannot propose/pass a budget like Pelosi.
    He has tremendous legal (& by implication cultural) power though.
    He does.

    I think he's the key vote on effectively overturning Roe v Wade, that will something that will outlast anything Pelosi will do as Speaker.
    But as a conservative who doesn’t wish to destroy the court, would probably shy away from doing so. For now the court is comparatively balanced, albeit conservative - but of course another Trump appointment would change all that.

    Let’s hope RBG again shrugs off her latest brush with cancer.

    I suspect he could choose to chip away at Roe v Wade.

    Best options in that situation is to let the states decide or only allow abortions in the first 16 weeks.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 62,776
    Chris said:

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    I think Mr Varadkar is not enjoying first contact with hard reality.....
    ...and now the furious row back:

    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1087765579195473920
    Is he in some kind of incompetence competition with Theresa May?
    He has some serious ground to make up, if that is the case.
  • GallowgateGallowgate Posts: 19,469

    https://twitter.com/Freedland/status/1087750265145643008

    I'm curious why Dyson, who must have already been considering such a move in summer 2016, chose to be so high profile about leaving?

    He must have know this would look bloody terrible.

    The Conservative Party, the party of business, overseeing the erosion of our tax base. Nice.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,163
    Chris said:

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    I think Mr Varadkar is not enjoying first contact with hard reality.....
    ...and now the furious row back:

    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1087765579195473920
    Is he in some kind of incompetence competition with Theresa May?
    She's still winning.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    It's not been a particularly good day for businessmen boosters of Brexit, all things considered.

    EU membership enable (alleged) fraud and larceny?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626

    Pulpstar said:

    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
    Semolina is even worse
    Tapioca!

    *school-dinner flash-back trauma. With rose-hip syrup.....*
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,355
    edited January 2019
    Pulpstar said:

    Won't the bookies just replace Fixed odds terminals with a bunch of cartoon horse racing ? (Yes it's a thing...)

    It's not nearly as profitable, although it too should be banned on the basis that it is not possible for the punter to win.

    My grandfather was a street bookie. This was an illegal activity of course. The introduction of betting shops was a wholly beneficial development as it largely removed the activity from the underworld and all its attendant criminal associations. For many years the shops prospered and were widely experienced as lively and safe havens in which to pursue a fairly harmless pastime. They went into decline with the arrival of the internet and the traditional skills of the bookmaker went into decline with them, as the big firms found they could only achieve satisfactory results by turning the shops into amusement arcades filled with the modern successors to the old fruit machines, or 'one-armed bandits' as they were widely and accurately known.

    It's difficult to make money from betting but not impossible. It is impossible to make money from the machines. They represent legalised robbery, and there is no need or place for them on the High Street. The sooner they disappear the better, and the shops that harbour them can go too - with absolutely zero downside to the general public.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,220

    Pulpstar said:

    Fenman said:


    Chris said:

    IanB2 said:

    IanB2 said:

    Only 4/1 that we could be heading for fuel rationing?

    Will we end up playing Monopoly by candlelight several nights a week, and it will indeed be the early 70s once again?

    I was a student in Liverpool during the power cuts in the early 70s. One day I met a fellow student, whom I knew to be fairly militant atheist, coming out of the Catholic Cathedral which was opposite the Students Union. When I asked him what he'd been up to, he said the Cathedral was a really good source of candles.

    So there you are. Top tip for the coming blackouts - move near a RC Church.
    By chance I found a load of candles at the bottom of a drawer just yesterday. So in one respect at least I am prepared for no deal. Just the food, bottled water and shotgun to go....
    Make sure you get food that can be cooked by a candle, of course.
    Camping stove, pasta and tinned tomatoes all in the garage, next to the tinned rice pudding.
    Rice pudding is probably my least favourite food in the whole world !
    Semolina is even worse
    Tapioca!

    *school-dinner flash-back trauma. With rose-hip syrup.....*
    Hah yes they are all in the same vile boat.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 42,992

    TOPPING said:

    Going into administration seems an overdue outcome. They need to sort out what the hell has gone on as between fraud and just bad managment - resolve what the true value of the business might be and whether there is enough there to be salvaged.
    Old Compton Street won't be the same again.
    You go there for the cake? 🍩
    What else is going on there?
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    kle4 said:

    Danny565 said:

    All I ever see from this campaign is threats and blackmail towards Labour about what would supposedly happen if we don't do as they say, rather than any positive arguments for their idea. Seemingly they learnt nothing from the original referendum campaign about what does and doesn't persuade people.
    You're surprised? They have been increasingly blatant.
    Well I'm not surprised, but the parallels between how they failed to convince the general public in 2016, and how they're failing to convince Labour now (in both cases trying to bully them into it with arguments about how they're doomed if they don't do as they say), only just struck me
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,626
    kle4 said:

    Chris said:

    I must admit I'm lost. What is Vardkar on about? The EU will want a hard border if we become a 3rd country and they have said so repeatedly.

    Is he saying he will refuse?

    I think Mr Varadkar is not enjoying first contact with hard reality.....
    ...and now the furious row back:

    https://twitter.com/bbclaurak/status/1087765579195473920
    Is he in some kind of incompetence competition with Theresa May?
    She's still winning.
    There's a certain pleasing symmetry to their positons - both claiming to be avowedly against the outcome made most likely by their respective actions....
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