+1. I grew up in Denmark where women largely agreed with what you say, and found the whole rigmarole that they observed in France and Britain completely perplexing. The more political ones also found it repellent in terms of accepting a sexist role - "Why should women make a special effort to dress to please men when men don't do the same?".
I've come to feel relaxed about it - if people want to make an effort to look good and feel happy in the results, why not? But I also think it's largely done for personal and peer satisfaction, in the same way as some men like to cultivate a finely-trimmed beard. The exception is hairstyle, which I think does make a major difference to how people look for both sexes and is worth taking time to consider what you want.
Ah yes, hair.
How many women dye their hair? And why?
Well, ask yourself this: if you were dating, would you choose a woman who had silver hair - however gorgeous and well kept and well cut - and however lovely her face, however engaging her personality, blah blah?
And be honest in your answers.
Men may not look at make up or what women wear or even their shoes (though I am sceptical - or perhaps it is just the men I know) but they do look at women's hair. And silver hair - even if you went silver in your 30's - means "old" and no man (or very few of them) want old or older women.
I will put my cards on the table. I have silver hair - gorgeous it is. But I am unique among my peers. And it - to some extent - helped in my job. Looking older and experienced and wise and like someone's mother and, if necessary, like a witch was very useful when interrogating some over-entitled overpaid toerag.
But pretty much every senior woman I have ever encountered, plenty of them older than me, did the opposite to me. If women care about their appearance, it's because they are often judged on their appearance - even in contexts where this should not matter and even when working with men who claim to be above such superficial issues.
I will put my cards on the table - I am 43 and still single
I am 36 shortly and still a merry bachelor.
It used to be a 'gay bachelor' but that led to one or two embarrassing misunderstandings...
I'm 45, have a four-year old son, and sometimes wish I was still a merry bachelor ...
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
I rarely use trains or any other public transport, if it cannot support itself then I say tough.
Off the top of my head, I spend approx 8-10% of my waking life on them. I f*****g hate trains...
I f***ing love trains, man!
Apart from oddities running at weekends only (like Brigg, Reddish South, Okehampton etc.) I just need 12 journeys, all in Scotland, to complete the UK National Network!
Ayr to Stranraer Falkirk to Perth to Inverness Croy to Alloa Cardenden Loop Leuchars to Dundee Ladybank to Perth Perth to Aberdeen Aberdeen to Inverness Craigendoran to Oban Crianlarich to Mallaig Inverness to Kyle Dingwall to Thurso and Wick
Interesting to reflect I've done all of those, except the line from Aberdeen to Elgin.
Aberdeen to Inverness goes through Elgin
I know. I've done Inverness to Elgin, but not on from there to Aberdeen.
I rarely use trains or any other public transport, if it cannot support itself then I say tough.
Off the top of my head, I spend approx 8-10% of my waking life on them. I f*****g hate trains...
I f***ing love trains, man!
Apart from oddities running at weekends only (like Brigg, Reddish South, Okehampton etc.) I just need 12 journeys, all in Scotland, to complete the UK National Network!
Ayr to Stranraer Falkirk to Perth to Inverness Croy to Alloa Cardenden Loop Leuchars to Dundee Ladybank to Perth Perth to Aberdeen Aberdeen to Inverness Craigendoran to Oban Crianlarich to Mallaig Inverness to Kyle Dingwall to Thurso and Wick
Keep us posted Sunil! Happy New Year to everyone on PB.
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Jesus: that sounds horrible. Best wishes to you all and hope matters improve.
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Bloody hell, Jonathan, you really are going through it. Kind of puts other troubles in perspective.
People focus on the economic effect of Brexit and underestimate its debilitating effect on politics and diplomacy. Brexit is the exact opposite of taking control. It means abdicating any effective opinion on what we want. If in practice you always go along with what others have already decided, you stop discussing the issues because there is no point arguing about things you can't influence.
Oh please, talk about women's shoes, its much more interesting.
I rarely use trains or any other public transport, if it cannot support itself then I say tough.
Off the top of my head, I spend approx 8-10% of my waking life on them. I f*****g hate trains...
I f***ing love trains, man!
Apart from oddities running at weekends only (like Brigg, Reddish South, Okehampton etc.) I just need 12 journeys, all in Scotland, to complete the UK National Network!
Ayr to Stranraer Falkirk to Perth to Inverness Croy to Alloa Cardenden Loop Leuchars to Dundee Ladybank to Perth Perth to Aberdeen Aberdeen to Inverness Craigendoran to Oban Crianlarich to Mallaig Inverness to Kyle Dingwall to Thurso and Wick
Interesting to reflect I've done all of those, except the line from Aberdeen to Elgin.
Aberdeen to Inverness goes through Elgin
I know. I've done Inverness to Elgin, but not on from there to Aberdeen.
Hope you popped down to my wifes home town of Lossiemouth while in Elgin. Beautiful beaches, championship golf course, harbour with fishing museum featuring lots of my wifes family, RAF Lossiemoth defending us from the Russians and fabulous views over the Firth
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Bloody hell, Jonathan, you really are going through it. Kind of puts other troubles in perspective.
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
I know we are spared a few more days of Parliament and its inability to decide on what to do but this is a useful primer on the options there from the EU side of things
I rarely use trains or any other public transport, if it cannot support itself then I say tough.
Off the top of my head, I spend approx 8-10% of my waking life on them. I f*****g hate trains...
I f***ing love trains, man!
Apart from oddities running at weekends only (like Brigg, Reddish South, Okehampton etc.) I just need 12 journeys, all in Scotland, to complete the UK National Network!
Ayr to Stranraer Falkirk to Perth to Inverness Croy to Alloa Cardenden Loop Leuchars to Dundee Ladybank to Perth Perth to Aberdeen Aberdeen to Inverness Craigendoran to Oban Crianlarich to Mallaig Inverness to Kyle Dingwall to Thurso and Wick
Interesting to reflect I've done all of those, except the line from Aberdeen to Elgin.
Aberdeen to Inverness goes through Elgin
I know. I've done Inverness to Elgin, but not on from there to Aberdeen.
Hope you popped down to my wifes home town of Lossiemouth while in Elgin. Beautiful beaches, championship golf course, harbour with fishing museum featuring lots of my wifes family, RAF Lossiemoth defending us from the Russians and fabulous views over the Firth
I'm afraid not, sadly. It's a place I wanted to visit, but didn't have time to on that occasion. All the area east of Inverness was very lovely though, I hope to spend more time exploring it this summer.
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Hell, I'll rein in any 2019 moaning in which I may have felt the need to indulge. Having experienced some small parts of that cocktail, I hope it stays manageable.
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
I rarely use trains or any other public transport, if it cannot support itself then I say tough.
Off the top of my head, I spend approx 8-10% of my waking life on them. I f*****g hate trains...
I f***ing love trains, man!
Apart from oddities running at weekends only (like Brigg, Reddish South, Okehampton etc.) I just need 12 journeys, all in Scotland, to complete the UK National Network!
Ayr to Stranraer Falkirk to Perth to Inverness Croy to Alloa Cardenden Loop Leuchars to Dundee Ladybank to Perth Perth to Aberdeen Aberdeen to Inverness Craigendoran to Oban Crianlarich to Mallaig Inverness to Kyle Dingwall to Thurso and Wick
Interesting to reflect I've done all of those, except the line from Aberdeen to Elgin.
Aberdeen to Inverness goes through Elgin
I know. I've done Inverness to Elgin, but not on from there to Aberdeen.
Hope you popped down to my wifes home town of Lossiemouth while in Elgin. Beautiful beaches, championship golf course, harbour with fishing museum featuring lots of my wifes family, RAF Lossiemoth defending us from the Russians and fabulous views over the Firth
I'm afraid not, sadly. It's a place I wanted to visit, but didn't have time to on that occasion. All the area east of Inverness was very lovely though, I hope to spend more time exploring it this summer.
It is worth a visit if you are going to do Elgin to Aberdeen
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Glad to hear it was a false alarm - what a start to the New Year
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
He is not as popular as 2015 but then Scheer is not that great an alternative either.
I expect a repeat of the 2012 US election when Obama's ratings were down but he still beat Obama, Trudeau will be re elected but with a lower majority and less enthusiasm than the last election
Fascinating Sam Harris podcast this week with a lady who is an expert in social media interference by GRU. Lots of info I have never heard as they get way past simply TRUUUUUMMP boooo that the likes of CNN never get beyond.
The only shoes my fiancée cares about are the metal ones for her horses xD. Conveniently we fit each others, and she owns zero heels. @Sunil become a farrier. @Jonathan blimey, hope things get better soon
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Blimmin' heck. Hope that some preferably all of that works its way through. At what time are you planning on letting your boys back into the rugby club?
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
I'm very sorry to hear that. I hope you pull through.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Thanks for kind words. Just real life biting hard all at once. If I’ve been a bit grumpy recently that’s why. PB is a nice place to escape. But Brexit politics isn’t hugely relaxing. Grrrr.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Thanks for kind words. Just real life biting hard all at once. If I’ve been a bit grumpy recently that’s why. PB is a nice place to escape. But Brexit politics isn’t hugely relaxing. Grrrr.
I wouldn't have said you have been, personally. But then, the temperature has been somewhat higher than normal recently all around.
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
Has the luster worn off him? It can be hard to tell as, in ways similar to Macron, because Trudeau is a bit of a liberal darling if you only casually pay attention you'd only ever hear positive things (though with the recent protests that might not be true of Macron's image any longer)
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
He is not as popular as 2015 but then Scheer is not that great an alternative either.
I expect a repeat of the 2012 US election when Obama's ratings were down but he still beat Obama, Trudeau will be re elected but with a lower majority and less enthusiasm than the last election
The result could of course mean a Lib-led government under someone else.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinte amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
He is not as popular as 2015 but then Scheer is not that great an alternative either.
I expect a repeat of the 2012 US election when Obama's ratings were down but he still beat Obama, Trudeau will be re elected but with a lower majority and less enthusiasm than the last election
The result could of course mean a Lib-led government under someone else.
I doubt it, the main reason they are in government is Trudeau, the most charismatic leader the Liberals have had since Chretien or indeed probably his father. Trudeau took the Liberals from third to first last time remember
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Bloody hell. As a former colleague used to say, "You must have shot God's dog....."
If it's any consolation, others here seem grumpier!
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
Has the luster worn off him? It can be hard to tell as, in ways similar to Macron, because Trudeau is a bit of a liberal darling if you only casually pay attention you'd only ever hear positive things (though with the recent protests that might not be true of Macron's image any longer)
Macron like Trudeau is helped by the fact there is little appeal in any of the alternatives, Macron's rating is even lower than Trudeau's
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Thanks for kind words. Just real life biting hard all at once. If I’ve been a bit grumpy recently that’s why. PB is a nice place to escape. But Brexit politics isn’t hugely relaxing. Grrrr.
Heh, I agree, which is why I've taken to posting about trains, shoes and watches! I think sometimes in these hours of darkness, we need a little light relief.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
It's a recent thing though. Well-trimmed pubic hair used to be de rigeur for stars of adult films
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
My ex-CO once had to perform emergency topiary on a Manila bar girl while she stood over the bin in his hotel room. Such was the thicket that faced the intrepid explorer.
Taming the Growler.....
Although, to be fair, getting pubic hair in your teeth is not a great look.
However, nothing beats the horror of confronting The Hairy Nipple......
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
I think you're overthinking something that shouldn't be overthought.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Real men should be hairy! And real women should like hairy men!
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Facial hair, no, as it would be too much like being attracted to another man.
Leg hair is okay, so long as it's not too vigorous.
Thanks for kind words. Just real life biting hard all at once. If I’ve been a bit grumpy recently that’s why. PB is a nice place to escape. But Brexit politics isn’t hugely relaxing. Grrrr.
Sorry to hear of your troubles, and hope you pull through.
All I can manage to counter with is that I've been on "trainspotting leave" since the end of August.
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
True enough, I remember how horrified some friends of mine were in the eighties when Nena (of 99 Red baloons fame) showed off her hairy armpits on TOTP.
As a bit of a hippy, I have always been happy with the hirsute though.
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
True enough, I remember how horrified some friends of mine were in the eighties when Nena (of 99 Red baloons fame) showed off her hairy armpits on TOTP.
As a bit of a hippy, I have always been happy with the hirsute though.
Miley Cyrus' pink armpit hair is a bit revolting, however.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Real men should be hairy! And real women should like hairy men!
Chewbacca ain't got shit on me!
Unfortunately the Burt Reynolds/Magnum PI look has faded into history.
Mrs Foxy has a particular issue with nasal hair...
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Pubic hair performs a useful function beyond the erotic.
It provides a cushion against friction that can cause skin abrasion and injury, protection from bacteria and other unwanted pathogens. Shaving it can cause injury and may make the skin more vulnerable to herpes infections and genital warts. Hair helps regulate heat and sweating in the area. The hair follicles also have a nerve ending so that when the hair is lightly touched it gives a pleasant sensation.
I suppose the question for me would be this: why would I want to have sex with a man who wants to have sex with a woman whose genitals look like those of a child?
Hairy armpits and legs huge no's for me. Doesn't have to be shaved that day, being able to feel some small hairs there is okay but something that develops into patches of dark hairs is a real turn off...
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Facial hair, no, as it would be too much like being attracted to another man.
Leg hair is okay, so long as it's not too vigorous.
There are fundamental itchiness/chafing (Informed of this one by good friends) considerations that simply don't apply with leg hair. Will leave it at that. Public hair removal is way more drastic than leg or facial hair removal.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinte amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
I don't agree. These sentiments remind me of the Mary Whitehouse and Lord Longford campaigns of the 1960s and 1970s which set themselves up as Canute-like opponents of the sexual freedoms brought about by the pill and the changing social climate of the time. These changes are now mainstream and the societal doom and disaster predicted have not materialised. Attempts to turn back the clock, widely supported in the rightwing press, the Churches and the Tory Party, were probably the least successful public campaign in modern times. The same applies to internet porn, it is out there, the genie cannot be put back in the bottle and we have to teach people how to approach and interpret it, not try to ban it. I don't think most people feel disappointed if they can't imitate everything they can see on the internet, some do perhaps but no doubt they would have felt disappointed if they did not imitate everything they saw in the top shelf magazines of our youth or heard about in whispered conversations behind the bikesheds.
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinite amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
Has absolutely destroyed the young? That does not ring true to me.
Do you see much evidence for that?
Or have you deduced that it must be true because (i) porn is all over and (ii) young people are impressionable?
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Real men should be hairy! And real women should like hairy men!
Chewbacca ain't got shit on me!
Unfortunately the Burt Reynolds/Magnum PI look has faded into history.
Mrs Foxy has a particular issue with nasal hair...
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Pubic hair performs a useful function beyond the erotic.
It provides a cushion against friction that can cause skin abrasion and injury, protection from bacteria and other unwanted pathogens. Shaving it can cause injury and may make the skin more vulnerable to herpes infections and genital warts. Hair helps regulate heat and sweating in the area. The hair follicles also have a nerve ending so that when the hair is lightly touched it gives a pleasant sensation.
I suppose the question for me would be this: why would I want to have sex with a man who wants to have sex with a woman whose genitals look like those of a child?
More pertinently, why would I want to have sex with a man who does not love me as I am. If he wants me to look like someone else,then he should go and find that someone else.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinte amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
I don't agree. These sentiments remind me of the Mary Whitehouse and Lord Longford campaigns of the 1960s and 1970s which set themselves up as Canute-like opponents of the sexual freedoms brought about by the pill and the changing social climate of the time. These changes are now mainstream and the societal doom and disaster predicted have not materialised. Attempts to turn back the clock, widely supported in the rightwing press, the Churches and the Tory Party, were probably the least successful public campaign in modern times. The same applies to internet porn, it is out there, the genie cannot be put back in the bottle and we have to teach people how to approach and interpret it, not try to ban it. I don't think most people feel disappointed if they can't imitate everything they can see on the internet, some do perhaps but no doubt they would have felt disappointed if they did not imitate everything they saw in the top shelf magazines of our youth or heard about in whispered conversations behind the bikesheds.
I disagree, I think the differences between the "porn" of yesteryear and today's stuff is the difference between the hash of the 60s and today's super skunk. Having said that, I believe the genie is firmly out of the bottle and there is no use trying to ban it. That doesn't mean I think it's remotely healthy or good for you.
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Pubic hair performs a useful function beyond the erotic.
It provides a cushion against friction that can cause skin abrasion and injury, protection from bacteria and other unwanted pathogens. Shaving it can cause injury and may make the skin more vulnerable to herpes infections and genital warts. Hair helps regulate heat and sweating in the area. The hair follicles also have a nerve ending so that when the hair is lightly touched it gives a pleasant sensation.
I suppose the question for me would be this: why would I want to have sex with a man who wants to have sex with a woman whose genitals look like those of a child?
More pertinently, why would I want to have sex with a man who does not love me as I am. If he wants me to look like someone else,then he should go and find that someone else.
I am me, not a work in progress.
True.
But I am suspicious of men who aren't at ease with what a grown up woman's body looks like.
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
He is not as popular as 2015 but then Scheer is not that great an alternative either.
I expect a repeat of the 2012 US election when Obama's ratings were down but he still beat Obama, Trudeau will be re elected but with a lower majority and less enthusiasm than the last election
Note that the new PPC is not modelled and the modelling of the BQ is not great.
Either way looks like Trudeau could lose his majority but is still likely to have the numbers for a Liberal minority government if needed, no other parties will do a deal with the Conservatives
My eldest who lives in Vancouver thinks Trudeau is over
Has the luster worn off him? It can be hard to tell as, in ways similar to Macron, because Trudeau is a bit of a liberal darling if you only casually pay attention you'd only ever hear positive things (though with the recent protests that might not be true of Macron's image any longer)
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinite amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
Has absolutely destroyed the young? That does not ring true to me.
Do you see much evidence for that?
Or have you deduced that it must be true because (i) porn is all over and (ii) young people are impressionable?
See the link I posted in reply to Anothernick, below.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinte amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
I don't agree. These sentiments remind me of the Mary Whitehouse and Lord Longford campaigns of the 1960s and 1970s which set themselves up as Canute-like opponents of the sexual freedoms brought about by the pill and the changing social climate of the time. These changes are now mainstream and the societal doom and disaster predicted have not materialised. Attempts to turn back the clock, widely supported in the rightwing press, the Churches and the Tory Party, were probably the least successful public campaign in modern times. The same applies to internet porn, it is out there, the genie cannot be put back in the bottle and we have to teach people how to approach and interpret it, not try to ban it. I don't think most people feel disappointed if they can't imitate everything they can see on the internet, some do perhaps but no doubt they would have felt disappointed if they did not imitate everything they saw in the top shelf magazines of our youth or heard about in whispered conversations behind the bikesheds.
The things that take place in hardcore porn seem painful, rather than enjoyable.
Sympathies, Jonathan - that sounds awful. I find the forum a relaxed place to escape from stresses at times: there is a lot to be said for being among peolple who are friendly but not immediately proximate - close friends and family want to talk about the problems, we just want to talk about...er..pubic hair today, apparently. Who knows what will take our fancy tomorrow and distract us further?
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Pubic hair performs a useful function beyond the erotic.
It provides a cushion against friction that can cause skin abrasion and injury, protection from bacteria and other unwanted pathogens. Shaving it can cause injury and may make the skin more vulnerable to herpes infections and genital warts. Hair helps regulate heat and sweating in the area. The hair follicles also have a nerve ending so that when the hair is lightly touched it gives a pleasant sensation.
I suppose the question for me would be this: why would I want to have sex with a man who wants to have sex with a woman whose genitals look like those of a child?
More pertinently, why would I want to have sex with a man who does not love me as I am. If he wants me to look like someone else,then he should go and find that someone else.
I am me, not a work in progress.
True.
But I am suspicious of men who aren't at ease with what a grown up woman's body looks like.
Isn't that true though of all politicians especially in democratic free societies?
The sense of novelty, of youth, of "something different" naturally wears off when you see them every day. and they face the same problems as their predecessors and the reality dawns they have the same lack of answers.
Those who come into office widely disliked have of course little to lose by comparison.
In the end, everyone finds their own level of incompetence (and that's true outside politics too).
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Yes - absolutely agree. Something rather creepy about it.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Yes - absolutely agree. Something rather creepy about it.
It's not modern though. There is a wonderful passage in Ousamah ibn-MUnqidh's Memoirs where a Frank gets his pubes shaved, Arab fashion, by a man at the baths. He's so pleased with the effect he drags this man to his house, orders his wife to strip and gets her pudendum shaved as well. Ousamah, not surprisingly, was rather bemused by this second action!
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinite amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
Has absolutely destroyed the young? That does not ring true to me.
Do you see much evidence for that?
Or have you deduced that it must be true because (i) porn is all over and (ii) young people are impressionable?
See the link I posted in reply to Anothernick, below.
I'm not qualified to challenge the science in all of that, Though the website is clearly plugging a line and is not objective; it has the slightly polemical air of the "just say no" campaigns in the US. And anyway it seems that the science is disputed
I'm not saying internet porn is harmless but nor do I think it will lead to the destruction of young minds and I frankly doubt that it is deeply damaging to most users.
Sympathies, Jonathan - that sounds awful. I find the forum a relaxed place to escape from stresses at times: there is a lot to be said for being among peolple who are friendly but not immediately proximate - close friends and family want to talk about the problems, we just want to talk about...er..pubic hair today, apparently. Who knows what will take our fancy tomorrow and distract us further?
Sympathies from me also @Jonathan - that sounds like a far larger group of troubles than anyone should be having to put up with. I hope you see a few resolve themselves quickly in positive ways.
Re PB tonight: Shoes, pubic hair and vegan sausage rolls ?! Any chance we can just go back to Brexit?
Sympathies, Jonathan - that sounds awful. I find the forum a relaxed place to escape from stresses at times: there is a lot to be said for being among peolple who are friendly but not immediately proximate - close friends and family want to talk about the problems, we just want to talk about...er..pubic hair today, apparently. Who knows what will take our fancy tomorrow and distract us further?
Sympathies from me also @Jonathan - that sounds like a far larger group of troubles than anyone should be having to put up with. I hope you see a few resolve themselves quickly in positive ways.
Re PB tonight: Shoes, pubic hair and vegan sausage rolls ?! Any chance we can just go back to Brexit?
It’s like the good old days of PB...all that is missing is top first class airport lounges, Michelin starred restaurants & bottles of plonk.
Isn't that true though of all politicians especially in democratic free societies?
The sense of novelty, of youth, of "something different" naturally wears off when you see them every day. and they face the same problems as their predecessors and the reality dawns they have the same lack of answers.
It's why I find the optimistic adoration of certain people, parties or ideologies to be simultaneously baffling, endearing and frustrating. I have never experienced such inspiration toward a person, party or idea but I can see the appeal, how those more passionate and idealistic can probably achieve things I never could with such a cynical take on things, but I just cannot understand, in our modern democratic societies, how people can come to seemingly love certain individuals on sometimes very limited evidence, not even the truth of who someone is but the myth. Granted, the same thing does work in reverse for hatred of certain people, parties and ideologies.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Yes - absolutely agree. Something rather creepy about it.
It's not modern though. There is a wonderful passage in Ousamah ibn-MUnqidh's Memoirs where a Frank gets his pubes shaved, Arab fashion, by a man at the baths. He's so pleased with the effect he drags this man to his house, orders his wife to strip and gets her pudendum shaved as well. Ousamah, not surprisingly, was rather bemused by this second action!
And that was in twelfth century Jerusalem!
I think observant Muslims are requires to shave their body hair, including armpits and pubes. Probably sensible in the context of the desert-living early Muslims.
Isn't that true though of all politicians especially in democratic free societies?
The sense of novelty, of youth, of "something different" naturally wears off when you see them every day. and they face the same problems as their predecessors and the reality dawns they have the same lack of answers.
It's why I find the optimistic adoration of certain people, parties or ideologies to be simultaneously baffling, endearing and frustrating. I have never experienced such inspiration toward a person, party or idea but I can see the appeal, how those more passionate and idealistic can probably achieve things I never could with such a cynical take on things, but I just cannot understand, in our modern democratic societies, how people can come to seemingly love certain individuals on sometimes very limited evidence, not even the truth of who someone is but the myth. Granted, the same thing does work in reverse for hatred of certain people, parties and ideologies.
How 1930s Germany fell for Hitler is a mystery to me.
And yet, much as each of us probably likes to think we'd have resisted the rise of Nazisim if we'd been there, we can never really know can we?
Sympathies, Jonathan - that sounds awful. I find the forum a relaxed place to escape from stresses at times: there is a lot to be said for being among peolple who are friendly but not immediately proximate - close friends and family want to talk about the problems, we just want to talk about...er..pubic hair today, apparently. Who knows what will take our fancy tomorrow and distract us further?
Sympathies from me also @Jonathan - that sounds like a far larger group of troubles than anyone should be having to put up with. I hope you see a few resolve themselves quickly in positive ways.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Yes - absolutely agree. Something rather creepy about it.
It's not modern though. There is a wonderful passage in Ousamah ibn-MUnqidh's Memoirs where a Frank gets his pubes shaved, Arab fashion, by a man at the baths. He's so pleased with the effect he drags this man to his house, orders his wife to strip and gets her pudendum shaved as well. Ousamah, not surprisingly, was rather bemused by this second action!
And that was in twelfth century Jerusalem!
I think observant Muslims are requires to shave their body hair, including armpits and pubes. Probably sensible in the context of the desert-living early Muslims.
Why so? And wouldn't access to sharp razors have been a luxury in the late first millennium?
Isn't that true though of all politicians especially in democratic free societies?
The sense of novelty, of youth, of "something different" naturally wears off when you see them every day. and they face the same problems as their predecessors and the reality dawns they have the same lack of answers.
It's why I find the optimistic adoration of certain people, parties or ideologies to be simultaneously baffling, endearing and frustrating. I have never experienced such inspiration toward a person, party or idea but I can see the appeal, how those more passionate and idealistic can probably achieve things I never could with such a cynical take on things, but I just cannot understand, in our modern democratic societies, how people can come to seemingly love certain individuals on sometimes very limited evidence, not even the truth of who someone is but the myth. Granted, the same thing does work in reverse for hatred of certain people, parties and ideologies.
How 1930s Germany fell for Hitler is a mystery to me.
And yet, much as each of us probably likes to think we'd have resisted the rise of Nazisim if we'd been there, we can never really know can we?
I suspect we'd all go with the flow more than we'd like to think. As credible as we think ourselves to be we're guaranteed to believe at least one really stupid thing, and of course if we were faced with actual repressive politics and brutal regimes well, a lot of the world shows most people just accept it and we'd probably be the same.
Indeed. Without wishing to go into detail on a family friendly forum, I think porn has absolutely destroyed the young. I am just about old enough that as a teenager for me porn was a furtive copy of Playboy or perhaps a well thumbed Razzle shared between friends. We knew it bore no relationship to real life. Today's teens have access to infinite amounts of hardcore in HD, any time, any where, on their phones.
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
Has absolutely destroyed the young? That does not ring true to me.
Do you see much evidence for that?
Or have you deduced that it must be true because (i) porn is all over and (ii) young people are impressionable?
See the link I posted in reply to Anothernick, below.
I'm not qualified to challenge the science in all of that, Though the website is clearly plugging a line and is not objective; it has the slightly polemical air of the "just say no" campaigns in the US. And anyway it seems that the science is disputed
I'm not saying internet porn is harmless but nor do I think it will lead to the destruction of young minds and I frankly doubt that it is deeply damaging to most users.
Yes, the site is polemical, but it is well researched and an interesting compilation of links.
But rather than read about it, my suggestion to anyone who thinks that porn is not addictive is to go without for 28 days and see how hard it is. Fnarr fnarr.
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Yes - absolutely agree. Something rather creepy about it.
It's not modern though. There is a wonderful passage in Ousamah ibn-MUnqidh's Memoirs where a Frank gets his pubes shaved, Arab fashion, by a man at the baths. He's so pleased with the effect he drags this man to his house, orders his wife to strip and gets her pudendum shaved as well. Ousamah, not surprisingly, was rather bemused by this second action!
And that was in twelfth century Jerusalem!
I think observant Muslims are requires to shave their body hair, including armpits and pubes. Probably sensible in the context of the desert-living early Muslims.
In other good news Mrs BJO is now home. The heart attack from yesterday is now problems with the muscles round the heart that prese ted as a heart attack and not a real heart attack at al.
Thank fook for that.
Holy shit, good news. Forgotten what that looks like. Well done. Hope for the rest of us.
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today) Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy) Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming. Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today ) Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Bloody hell, Jonathan, you really are going through it. Kind of puts other troubles in perspective.
Best wishes and best of luck.
Best wishes and I hope things sort themselves out v soon. I will pray for you and your family.
I can't imagine many of the pubic hair fans would prefer women with leg hair or facial hair.
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
Pubic hair performs a useful function beyond the erotic.
It provides a cushion against friction that can cause skin abrasion and injury, protection from bacteria and other unwanted pathogens. Shaving it can cause injury and may make the skin more vulnerable to herpes infections and genital warts. Hair helps regulate heat and sweating in the area. The hair follicles also have a nerve ending so that when the hair is lightly touched it gives a pleasant sensation.
I suppose the question for me would be this: why would I want to have sex with a man who wants to have sex with a woman whose genitals look like those of a child?
More pertinently, why would I want to have sex with a man who does not love me as I am. If he wants me to look like someone else,then he should go and find that someone else.
I am me, not a work in progress.
True.
But I am suspicious of men who aren't at ease with what a grown up woman's body looks like.
I totally agree.
Most grown-up women aren't quite at ease with what a grown-up woman's body looks like. Make-up, flattering cuts on dresses etc. They're not at ease with what a grown-up woman's body smells like either - perfume. Japanese women (at least) aren't so happy with what a grown-up woman's body sounds like.
There are some confusing signals here. I guess we need to be grown-up about it.
Sympathies, Jonathan - that sounds awful. I find the forum a relaxed place to escape from stresses at times: there is a lot to be said for being among peolple who are friendly but not immediately proximate - close friends and family want to talk about the problems, we just want to talk about...er..pubic hair today, apparently. Who knows what will take our fancy tomorrow and distract us further?
Re PB tonight: Shoes, pubic hair and vegan sausage rolls ?! Any chance we can just go back to Brexit?
Can I ask a strange question why we're talking about attraction. Having been married for 43 years to the same woman, I didn't realise the fashion is now to shave your pubes. I saw a TV show briefly and it came as a total surprise. I had to check with my son who knows these things, and he confirmed it.
Surely pubic hair is a turn on? I can only speak about women because men are ugly, smelly creatures at the best of times (but I'm sure gay men may have different views).
Yes, I do realise I'm an old git.
Any body hair is to be deplored below the neck. It is an aesthetic that has come from pornography.
Personally I have always felt it had more than a touch of pedophilia about. Really distasteful.
Yes - absolutely agree. Something rather creepy about it.
It's not modern though. There is a wonderful passage in Ousamah ibn-MUnqidh's Memoirs where a Frank gets his pubes shaved, Arab fashion, by a man at the baths. He's so pleased with the effect he drags this man to his house, orders his wife to strip and gets her pudendum shaved as well. Ousamah, not surprisingly, was rather bemused by this second action!
And that was in twelfth century Jerusalem!
I think observant Muslims are requires to shave their body hair, including armpits and pubes. Probably sensible in the context of the desert-living early Muslims.
Why so? And wouldn't access to sharp razors have been a luxury in the late first millennium?
Razors were widespread tech from the Stone Age on, but more importantly after the first big shave you can use rough stone, pumice stone for preference, to rub the area and stop hair growing. Monks used both ways for their tonsures.
Comments
Currently wrestling with
Mother in hospital with acute Leukaemia (doing well, but starting second chemo today)
Father in different hospital 100m away with broken collar bone and dementia (v grumpy)
Wife in wheelchair with MS and/or spinal fracture, back from hospital today. Diagnosis looming.
Slipped disc in neck (v. minor, but a pain in the neck today )
Two teenage boys (lovely, but pain in neck) currently in car park outside rugby club.
Fortunately politics offers some respite from real life.
Best wishes and best of luck.
https://twitter.com/akulith/status/1080460889839595522
Having experienced some small parts of that cocktail, I hope it stays manageable.
I expect a repeat of the 2012 US election when Obama's ratings were down but he still beat Obama, Trudeau will be re elected but with a lower majority and less enthusiasm than the last election
https://twitter.com/samharrisorg/status/1080547158577696768?s=21
@Sunil become a farrier.
@Jonathan blimey, hope things get better soon
It's a contradiction for me because I'm hugely against the porno ban / wanking license / drive to teach every teenager how to use a VPN that the government seem hell bent on pressing ahead with, because on principle I abhor censorship of any kind and think it sets a dangerous precedent.
On the other hand, porn is corrupting minds and - more importantly - hearts. People today expect their sex to look like porn and it is deeply damaging as most of us are not and do not want to be pornstars.
Despite being draconian and illiberal, the government has a point. But I'm not sure what, if anything, can be done.
If it's any consolation, others here seem grumpier!
Wishing you and your family all the best.
Although, to be fair, getting pubic hair in your teeth is not a great look.
However, nothing beats the horror of confronting The Hairy Nipple......
Obviously it is another difference again but if you prefer women not to have hair in several places where it does (or can) grow naturally then it really isn't that much of a jump to see why they some people might not want it in other places as well.
And real women should like hairy men!
Chewbacca ain't got shit on me!
Leg hair is okay, so long as it's not too vigorous.
All I can manage to counter with is that I've been on "trainspotting leave" since the end of August.
As a bit of a hippy, I have always been happy with the hirsute though.
Mrs Foxy has a particular issue with nasal hair...
It provides a cushion against friction that can cause skin abrasion and injury, protection from bacteria and other unwanted pathogens. Shaving it can cause injury and may make the skin more vulnerable to herpes infections and genital warts. Hair helps regulate heat and sweating in the area. The hair follicles also have a nerve ending so that when the hair is lightly touched it gives a pleasant sensation.
I suppose the question for me would be this: why would I want to have sex with a man who wants to have sex with a woman whose genitals look like those of a child?
I may need to acquire a merkin to get this post through the wire I guess.
https://twitter.com/GreggsOfficial/status/1080527865467322369
Do you see much evidence for that?
Or have you deduced that it must be true because (i) porn is all over and (ii) young people are impressionable?
I am me, not a work in progress.
Some research on the subject, NSFW, obviously.
https://www.yourbrainonporn.com/miscellaneous-resources/start-here-evolution-has-not-prepared-your-brain-for-todays-porn/
But I am suspicious of men who aren't at ease with what a grown up woman's body looks like.
"Piers Morgan seems to have deleted the twit they were replying to"
I'll get my coat.
(By the way, how do you know what takes place in hardcore porn?)
https://twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1080526060507283456
http://www.twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1080526060507283456 He also replied to their putdown with his usual inimitable style and class:
http://www.twitter.com/piersmorgan/status/1080532990940401664
The sense of novelty, of youth, of "something different" naturally wears off when you see them every day. and they face the same problems as their predecessors and the reality dawns they have the same lack of answers.
Those who come into office widely disliked have of course little to lose by comparison.
In the end, everyone finds their own level of incompetence (and that's true outside politics too).
Don't Worry, they'll fucking tell you...
And that was in twelfth century Jerusalem!
https://www.psychologytoday.com/gb/blog/women-who-stray/201307/your-brain-porn-its-not-addictive
I'm not saying internet porn is harmless but nor do I think it will lead to the destruction of young minds and I frankly doubt that it is deeply damaging to most users.
Re PB tonight: Shoes, pubic hair and vegan sausage rolls ?! Any chance we can just go back to Brexit?
NO!
Back on topic, am I right in thinking German women tend not to shave their armpits - or is that way out of date now?
And yet, much as each of us probably likes to think we'd have resisted the rise of Nazisim if we'd been there, we can never really know can we?
Edit - oh bollocks, I've changed the conversation back myself!!!!!
But rather than read about it, my suggestion to anyone who thinks that porn is not addictive is to go without for 28 days and see how hard it is. Fnarr fnarr.
Best wishes and I hope things sort themselves out v soon. I will pray for you and your family.
There are some confusing signals here. I guess we need to be grown-up about it.