I love this Tory idea that "economic pain" is "inevitable".
Some lucky people, of course, aren't feeling any "pain" at all under Osborne. They're booming. And they squeal to high heaven at the merest hint of "economic pain" for themselves, whilst prescribing "pain" for everyone else.
People like, ooh, energy companies, banks, super rich Tories...
Per Avery, it would be an interesting line for the Tories to insist to a disbelieving electorate that actually their living standards are improving. That should go a long way to countering the widely-held belief the Tories do not understand or particularly care about the lives of ordinary voters.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
The Tories obviously believe there is still more mileage in portraying the unemployed as bone idle shirkers. At some stage, though, they are going to push it too far.
Are you worried the shirkers might fall off the sofa, SO?
The real risk is that they'll then ring ambulance chasing 'real' lawyers and sue the government on legal aid for whiplash damage to their wrist.
But they won't be successful. Any court worth its salt will soon establish that the damaged wrist was a pre-existing condition.
#theUnionDivvie: If you want, I can think of a long list of Ex-Communists who are now totally respected members of the community and very successful politicians of all parties, business persons (yeah I know, too PC) and other leading lights, who having seen the light have changed from their so called wicked ways.
But like the Jesuits (Give me a child at 5), they were been trained to do a job. It would be interesting to think what would happen if present day school children were trained in similar methods
The Tories obviously believe there is still more mileage in portraying the unemployed as bone idle shirkers. At some stage, though, they are going to push it too far.
Or maybe it is a good habit to have deadlines to meet, good for confidence that you can get up every morning. maybe it helps in the long term to cope with the pressure of having to be somewhere every day.
'So what is he looking for, he wants Cameron to show why teh union should remain, he is happy to debate his position , unionists as ever are scared rigid.'
You must be delighted that the unionists are scared rigid,all going your way,independence nailed on,why do you keep on whining?
Who is whining , you show your true colours there, don't anybody dare have an opposing opinion to you. Insecure Tory fanny.
The Tories obviously believe there is still more mileage in portraying the unemployed as bone idle shirkers. At some stage, though, they are going to push it too far.
Or maybe it is a good habit to have deadlines to meet, good for confidence that you can get up every morning. maybe it helps in the long term to cope with the pressure of having to be somewhere every day.
Having made many disabled people poorer via the bedroom tax , the Conservatives now expect them to find the money to get to a job centre every day in their wheelchairs . I take it the Tories have given up any hope of getting a disabled person to vote for them in perpetuity .
First: St Andrews Graduate Eck would have a field day against a Etonian Fop and probably win any TV debate, Secondly: Salmond and Darling know each other and Salmond knows he would lose a TV debate. A second rate ex-RBS economist against an ex-Trotskyist, communist party trained debater, Chancellor of Exchequer, Edinburgh Councillor, Lawyer, Advocate, etc (wanna bet on who knows where the deepest bodies are buried and it ain't Eck).
As for Gorgeous George. if he had the balls to actually debate with Salmond in Scotland before some one permanently removed them (he has some very "not" friends in Scotland), he actually supports Independence and gives his adoration to Our Sublime Leader in waiting. Also another ex-communist.
Now this would be one hell of a battle of the egos. Twitter Murdo Fraser @murdo_fraser 10m Alex Salmond v. @georgegalloway? Now that's a debate I'd pay good money to see.
Per Avery, it would be an interesting line for the Tories to insist to a disbelieving electorate that actually their living standards are improving. That should go a long way to countering the widely-held belief the Tories do not understand or particularly care about the lives of ordinary voters.
SO
If you won the lottery jackpot you would still wander the world complaining of living in an involuntary penury imposed upon you by an uncaring Tory government.
But facts is facts.
From now on lefties on PB will only be able to claim that they "feel as though" their living standards have fallen.
The Tories obviously believe there is still more mileage in portraying the unemployed as bone idle shirkers. At some stage, though, they are going to push it too far.
Or maybe it is a good habit to have deadlines to meet, good for confidence that you can get up every morning. maybe it helps in the long term to cope with the pressure of having to be somewhere every day.
Absolutely. Because the unemployed lie in bed all day and shirk. That's all I did when I was out of work. It did not cross my mind to look for another job. I just idled and sponged.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
First: St Andrews Graduate Eck would have a field day against a Etonian Fop and probably win any TV debate, Secondly: Salmond and Darling know each other and Salmond knows he would lose a TV debate. A second rate ex-RBS economist against an ex-Trotskyist, communist party trained debater, Chancellor of Exchequer, Edinburgh Councillor, Lawyer, Advocate, etc (wanna bet on who knows where the deepest bodies are buried and it ain't Eck).
As for Gorgeous George. if he had the balls to actually debate with Salmond in Scotland before some one permanently removed them (he has some very "not" friends in Scotland), he actually supports Independence and gives his adoration to Our Sublime Leader in waiting. Also another ex-communist.
Now this would be one hell of a battle of the egos. Twitter Murdo Fraser @murdo_fraser 10m Alex Salmond v. @georgegalloway? Now that's a debate I'd pay good money to see.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Absolutely. Because the unemployed lie in bed all day and shirk. That's all I did when I was out of work. It did not cross my mind to look for another job. I just idled and sponged.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
Hmm, you and I are in complete agreement for a change.
The colonel dominated the news today ! The Tories drowning in their own creation. The conference mood is very surreal. The housing bubble stoker has been deem ed controversial. 50000 march for NHS.
Why are they in Manchester ? Shouldn't they be in a seaside town in the South , like Brighton ?
Per Avery, it would be an interesting line for the Tories to insist to a disbelieving electorate that actually their living standards are improving. That should go a long way to countering the widely-held belief the Tories do not understand or particularly care about the lives of ordinary voters.
SO
If you won the lottery jackpot you would still wander the world complaining of living in an involuntary penury imposed upon you by an uncaring Tory government.
But facts is facts.
From now on lefties on PB will only be able to claim that they "feel as though" their living standards have fallen.
My living standards are absolutely fine, but I'm a property-owning top rate taxpayer. The last few years have been very good for people like me. If the Tories want to tell voters as a whole that they are better off than ever before who am I to stop them? They may find, though, that they do not get a sympathetic hearing.
Absolutely. Because the unemployed lie in bed all day and shirk. That's all I did when I was out of work. It did not cross my mind to look for another job. I just idled and sponged.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
It may have missed your attention, but you are not typical, you are in the top few percent, you overcame and succeeded. You can not equate your personal experience to that of 80% of the unemployed.
I would much rather people had a purpose and reason to interact with society and the chance to get into habits that generate benefits for them. It is your unfounded assumption that you stereotype my view as an orange jump suit image. I suggested nothing of that nature.
However, I think it is better for people to have to do something rather than doing nothing every day.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Per Avery, it would be an interesting line for the Tories to insist to a disbelieving electorate that actually their living standards are improving. That should go a long way to countering the widely-held belief the Tories do not understand or particularly care about the lives of ordinary voters.
SO
If you won the lottery jackpot you would still wander the world complaining of living in an involuntary penury imposed upon you by an uncaring Tory government.
But facts is facts.
From now on lefties on PB will only be able to claim that they "feel as though" their living standards have fallen.
... I'm a property-owning top rate taxpayer ...
Bet you are not as rich as malcolm, SO.
To recover excessive benefit spend without having to reveal the truth on living standards, all Tories need to do is raise VAT to 50% on Sky Sports HD subscriptions; quarter sized snooker tables purchased to fill subsidised spare rooms; Nike flashing light trainers and shell suits; and Costa del Sol package holidays routed via regional airports.
GG has left so many problems from his original Dundee and supposedly missing funds from a local labour party to then annoying too many "important" people in Glasgow. Then again, he has actually annoyed people so much in Bethnal Green and Bow that he lost his seat with local councillors defecting. So he won again in Bradford West with the cycle continuing.
I am not saying he isn't a brilliant campaigner, he is fantastic - he just gets bored with the mundane work actually of representing his constituents.
Yeah, I'm not disagreeing with much of that, but Galloway is not and never has been a supporter of Independence or Eck. He positively WANTS to fight for the Union, but no one in the Better No campaign fancies touching him with someone else's bargepole.
'But he wants the independence referendum to be called as soon as possible and insists he will share a platform with anyone to help persuade Scots to stay in the UK. He said: “They ought to get this fight on and I will do anything I can to stop what I believe would be bad for Scotland and worse for the working people in England. “If that means sharing platforms with people who hate me, then fine. The future of the country is more important than that.”'
I love this Tory idea that "economic pain" is "inevitable".
Some lucky people, of course, aren't feeling any "pain" at all under Osborne. They're booming. And they squeal to high heaven at the merest hint of "economic pain" for themselves, whilst prescribing "pain" for everyone else.
People like, ooh, energy companies, banks, super rich Tories...
Many thousands of people in "banks" have lost their jobs through no fault of their own. I blame Labour.
Absolutely. Because the unemployed lie in bed all day and shirk. That's all I did when I was out of work. It did not cross my mind to look for another job. I just idled and sponged.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
It may have missed your attention, but you are not typical, you are in the top few percent, you overcame and succeeded. You can not equate your personal experience to that of 80% of the unemployed.
I would much rather people had a purpose and reason to interact with society and the chance to get into habits that generate benefits for them. It is your unfounded assumption that you stereotype my view as an orange jump suit image. I suggested nothing of that nature.
However, I think it is better for people to have to do something rather than doing nothing every day.
Where I ended up is not typical, but I am pretty sure that the attitude I had when I was unemployed is: go out and find a job. Having a very low income is not fun, especially when you are supporting a family. An acknowledgement or two from the Tories that most people on JSA are not idling scroungers, but are in fact actively looking for work and usually manage to find it pretty quickly would be nice - but the politics of welfare and benefits don't seem to suit that.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
No offence, but having the start of the Tory conference dominated by a couple of old colonels with bristling moustaches probably wasn't the image David Cameron wanted people to have in mind of the Conservatives in 2013.
It's either interesting, or utterly unsurprising that this issue's been discussed, using very similar language for the last 500 years or so. The 'idle poor' is a phrase with such a long history.
Absolutely. Because the unemployed lie in bed all day and shirk. That's all I did when I was out of work. It did not cross my mind to look for another job. I just idled and sponged.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
It may have missed your attention, but you are not typical, you are in the top few percent, you overcame and succeeded. You can not equate your personal experience to that of 80% of the unemployed.
I would much rather people had a purpose and reason to interact with society and the chance to get into habits that generate benefits for them. It is your unfounded assumption that you stereotype my view as an orange jump suit image. I suggested nothing of that nature.
However, I think it is better for people to have to do something rather than doing nothing every day.
Where I ended up is not typical, but I am pretty sure that the attitude I had when I was unemployed is: go out and find a job. Having a very low income is not fun, especially when you are supporting a family. An acknowledgement or two from the Tories that most people on JSA are not idling scroungers, but are in fact actively looking for work and usually manage to find it pretty quickly would be nice - but the politics of welfare and benefits don't seem to suit that.
Labour's record on unemployment is atrocious. Cut the crap and stop voting for Labour's poverty pimps.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
It's either interesting, or utterly unsurprising that this issue's been discussed, using very similar language for the last 500 years or so. The 'idle poor' is a phrase with such a long history.
The rich have always blamed the poor or God for poverty. Either it's the will of some deity, or it's because the poor are too feckless, thick or lazy to rise above their station.
GG has left so many problems from his original Dundee and supposedly missing funds from a local labour party to then annoying too many "important" people in Glasgow. Then again, he has actually annoyed people so much in Bethnal Green and Bow that he lost his seat with local councillors defecting. So he won again in Bradford West with the cycle continuing.
I am not saying he isn't a brilliant campaigner, he is fantastic - he just gets bored with the mundane work actually of representing his constituents.
Yeah, I'm not disagreeing with much of that, but Galloway is not and never has been a supporter of Independence or Eck. He positively WANTS to fight for the Union, but no one in the Better No campaign fancies touching him with someone else's bargepole.
'But he wants the independence referendum to be called as soon as possible and insists he will share a platform with anyone to help persuade Scots to stay in the UK. He said: “They ought to get this fight on and I will do anything I can to stop what I believe would be bad for Scotland and worse for the working people in England. “If that means sharing platforms with people who hate me, then fine. The future of the country is more important than that.”'
I'm a bit worried about the Independent's story (not the others) about going to the job centre 'every day' - there's a risk there that you become institutionalised and stuck on that particular routine. However, I haven't seen the detail.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
Hmmm. Not sure about the Tory conference/related thus far. First day though I guess. Union bashing (including Tory voting union members I assume), Labour bashing (no swingery voters wooed there then), benefit bashing (all are deemed scroungers I guess). Only 'hard working families' need apply. And I don't think the latter will be convinced.
Plus all the coverage I've seen on tv about help to buy has been tagged 'controversial'.
Surely a shorefront white stucco Regency villa has tickled your fancy just once during the discussion of HTB, Carola.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Oh, a stucco Regency villa is way beyond my means Avery.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
Avery has a heart, but he hides it, sometimes, behind statistics and irony.
When Carola knows that the family of one of my best school, university and flat-share friends gave their name to a street in Burslem, she'll forgive me.
Okay. Go on then.
Old Butt Lane?
Nope.
Think bricks.
Walley Street?
Sneyd not snide, Carola.
[Not the streetname]
Not Sneyd Street? The brickworks?
The family owned the Colliery and Brickworks Company (and had done since its mid 19th century founding). I guess you will know when it shut down better than I but I guess late 1970s early 1980s.
They made glazed engineering bricks including those, for example, used to build St Pancras Station.
The family owned the Colliery and Brickworks Company (and had done since its mid 19th century founding). I guess you will know when it shut down better than I but I guess late 1970s early 1980s.
They made glazed engineering bricks including those, for example, used to build St Pancras Station.
Tbh I don't recall when it closed. I do remember local stories of the bricks being used in some royal connection. My memories are more of pot banks... most gone now, as has pretty much everything in Stoke. Coal, steel, pottery. A wasteland now. Sad.
The family owned the Colliery and Brickworks Company (and had done since its mid 19th century founding). I guess you will know when it shut down better than I but I guess late 1970s early 1980s.
They made glazed engineering bricks including those, for example, used to build St Pancras Station.
Tbh I don't recall when it closed. I do remember local stories of the bricks being used in some royal connection. My memories are more of pot banks... most gone now, as has pretty much everything in Stoke. Coal, steel, pottery. A wasteland now. Sad.
There is a literary route to the name via Arnold Bennett's "Anna of the Five Towns" (1902).
I don't know much more about the history except that there was a major pit accident at the Colliery in the 1940s which killed tens of miners. The mine got nationalised with almost all others but the brickmaking company continued at least until the 1970s.
"Labour will not promise to renationalise Royal Mail after it is privatised, shadow business secretary Chuka Umunna has confirmed.
But he spelled out a series of new obligations that the party would place on the company.
The announcement came shortly before Royal Mail shares are to be sold.
Labour's conference voted to commit the party to renationalisation, but sources made it clear at the time the policy would not be adopted by the leadership."
"Labour will not promise to renationalise Royal Mail after it is privatised, shadow business secretary Chuka Umunna has confirmed.
But he spelled out a series of new obligations that the party would place on the company.
The announcement came shortly before Royal Mail shares are to be sold.
Labour's conference voted to commit the party to renationalisation, but sources made it clear at the time the policy would not be adopted by the leadership."
fitalass
Your link goes to the wrong BBC article but you can navigate from an on-page link to the Royal Mail Umunna article on which you are commenting.
Typical Labour policy. They don't want the responsibility or cost of ownership but believe they have the right to interfere in the company's operations as if they still owned it and the company's business was still a "public service".
If Miliband or Umunna have concerns about lack of competition in an industry - whether railways, household energy supplies or mail and parcel distribution services - then the proper course of action is to refer to the Competition Commission.
Otherwise we will end up with continued interference in operation management by polticians deciding business strategy on the back of an envelope. Angela Eagle's grudge list of ticketing reforms she wants to impose on the rail franchisees is a typical and absurd example. Miliband's price fixing of energy supplies a more dangerous continuation of the same theme.
Once an industry has been privatised it has to leave its former owners hands for good and ministers should stop pretending to be "responsible" for its services and operations..
These figures are rather up and down, but are average figures, and probably the median RHDI would be more relevant than the mean.
If as mooted the rich are getting richer, the median may well be stagnant or declining. The upper and lower quartile points would alo be interesting. At least for those of us who like stats.
"Labour will not promise to renationalise Royal Mail after it is privatised, shadow business secretary Chuka Umunna has confirmed.
But he spelled out a series of new obligations that the party would place on the company.
The announcement came shortly before Royal Mail shares are to be sold.
Labour's conference voted to commit the party to renationalisation, but sources made it clear at the time the policy would not be adopted by the leadership."
fitalass
Your link goes to the wrong BBC article but you can navigate from an on-page link to the Royal Mail Umunna article on which you are commenting.
Typical Labour policy. They don't want the responsibility or cost of ownership but believe they have the right to interfere in the company's operations as if they still owned it and the company's business was still a "public service".
If Miliband or Umunna have concerns about lack of competition in an industry - whether railways, household energy supplies or mail and parcel distribution services - then the proper course of action is to refer to the Competition Commission.
Otherwise we will end up with continued interference in operation management by polticians deciding business strategy on the back of an envelope. Angela Eagle's grudge list of ticketing reforms she wants to impose on the rail franchisees is a typical and absurd example. Miliband's price fixing of energy supplies a more dangerous continuation of the same theme.
Once an industry has been privatised it has to leave its former owners hands for good and ministers should stop pretending to be "responsible" for its services and operations..
Otherwise we will end up with continued interference in operation management by polticians deciding business strategy on the back of an envelope.
Rather like Dave telling energy companies to move customers to their cheapest tariff, Avery?
I dont think I've ever seen you lay into the Tories this savagely before!
Not keen on that interference, Neil.
The proper way to have handled this issue was to have notified OfGen and the industry's competent representative body of the government's concerns relating to pricing. Specifically that the government was concerned that suppliers were using complex pricing schemes to obscure and prevent assessment of consumer value.
Then leave it to the regulator and the industry to work out whether the government's concerns were valid and, if so, how a voluntary or mandatory change in practice could be implemented to address the concern.
Cameron's proposal that suppliers default to lowest price supply when consumers didn't specifically opt for a promoted package may have been the right solution but the regulator and industry should have had the opportunity to review it and consider alternatives as possibly better means of resolving the underlying problem.
There really is no need for governments to legislate on such issues or even to prescibe specific solutions. Maybe as a very last resort, but prior consideration should be given to changing regulatory powers and management before even considering legislation.
@politicshome: Tomorrow's Independent front page: Osborne's welfare war: go to job centre every day - or lose benefits http://t.co/bP2pNWsnFa
I would love, love to see the government attempt this ridiculous policy. The press will have a field day with photos of queues halfway up the street at overwhelmed jobcentres. Unless, of course, the government is going to open thousands of new jobcentres to cope, in which case the unemployment problem is solved!
These figures are rather up and down, but are average figures, and probably the median RHDI would be more relevant than the mean.
If as mooted the rich are getting richer, the median may well be stagnant or declining. The upper and lower quartile points would alo be interesting. At least for those of us who like stats.
Table source: Office for National Statistics Quarterly National Accounts Q2 2013: Table 1
They derive from the "Quarterly National Accounts - 2013 Q2" bulletin so will be high level figures with little backup detail.
I will look to see whether the ONS publish separate data and commentary on the RHDI. It is possible there are regular detailed reports which answer your questions.
@politicshome: Tomorrow's Independent front page: Osborne's welfare war: go to job centre every day - or lose benefits http://t.co/bP2pNWsnFa
I would love, love to see the government attempt this ridiculous policy. The press will have a field day with photos of queues halfway up the street at overwhelmed jobcentres. Unless, of course, the government is going to open thousands of new jobcentres to cope, in which case the unemployment problem is solved!
Well we aren't paying them to do nothing, if this were enacted we'd be paying them to queue up.
I agree with you it might be stressful for the people working in the job centre though! Perhaps it could be a system where you have to log on to the job centre website at look at at least 5 job ads or something.
A quick lookup on the ONS site reveals that HRDI figures are only produced for Quarterly National Accounts releases and do not have a oublication series of their own. There is a one off report on the impact the recession had on RHDI which I will read.
I will also dig further into the data series released with the QNA to see if there is any greater detail which can be worked up to provide answers to you questions on distribution across the population. I am not hopeful here though.
In the meantime I found this short video released by the ONS in 2011 which explains the concept and construction of Real Households' Disposable Income. It is a good primer so worth embedding the youtube version in thread:
Comments
Some lucky people, of course, aren't feeling any "pain" at all under Osborne. They're booming. And they squeal to high heaven at the merest hint of "economic pain" for themselves, whilst prescribing "pain" for everyone else.
People like, ooh, energy companies, banks, super rich Tories...
The real risk is that they'll then ring ambulance chasing 'real' lawyers and sue the government on legal aid for whiplash damage to their wrist.
But they won't be successful. Any court worth its salt will soon establish that the damaged wrist was a pre-existing condition.
But like the Jesuits (Give me a child at 5), they were been trained to do a job. It would be interesting to think what would happen if present day school children were trained in similar methods
If you won the lottery jackpot you would still wander the world complaining of living in an involuntary penury imposed upon you by an uncaring Tory government.
But facts is facts.
From now on lefties on PB will only be able to claim that they "feel as though" their living standards have fallen.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
Or do teachers offload all their energy and ambition onto their teenage pupils?
Why are they in Manchester ? Shouldn't they be in a seaside town in the South , like Brighton ?
The story in the guardian about Matthew D'ancona's book about David Cameron's evidence at Leveson is off limits.
This story relates to phone hacking, and already some posters on here have posted defamatory and legally problematic posts based on this story.
So please desist.
Absolutely. Because the unemployed lie in bed all day and shirk. That's all I did when I was out of work. It did not cross my mind to look for another job. I just idled and sponged.
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
It may have missed your attention, but you are not typical, you are in the top few percent, you overcame and succeeded. You can not equate your personal experience to that of 80% of the unemployed.
I would much rather people had a purpose and reason to interact with society and the chance to get into habits that generate benefits for them. It is your unfounded assumption that you stereotype my view as an orange jump suit image. I suggested nothing of that nature.
However, I think it is better for people to have to do something rather than doing nothing every day.
And the little two-bed terrace that I was lucky enough to buy when it was affordable will be way beyond most of the teenagers that I teach. Unless they all make it to top rate taxpayers.
My ambitions have never been about what I can buy.
Maybe I don't share your values. Although I'd hate to believe that you're the I'm all right jack-ish cold fish that you present on here.
To recover excessive benefit spend without having to reveal the truth on living standards, all Tories need to do is raise VAT to 50% on Sky Sports HD subscriptions; quarter sized snooker tables purchased to fill subsidised spare rooms; Nike flashing light trainers and shell suits; and Costa del Sol package holidays routed via regional airports.
'But he wants the independence referendum to be called as soon as possible and insists he will share a platform with anyone to help persuade Scots to stay in the UK.
He said: “They ought to get this fight on and I will do anything I can to stop what I believe would be bad for Scotland and worse for the working people in England.
“If that means sharing platforms with people who hate me, then fine. The future of the country is more important than that.”'
http://tinyurl.com/paj378g
I reckon the workless should be put in orange jump suits as well. We need to know who these lazy, scrounging sub-humans are.
It may have missed your attention, but you are not typical, you are in the top few percent, you overcame and succeeded. You can not equate your personal experience to that of 80% of the unemployed.
I would much rather people had a purpose and reason to interact with society and the chance to get into habits that generate benefits for them. It is your unfounded assumption that you stereotype my view as an orange jump suit image. I suggested nothing of that nature.
However, I think it is better for people to have to do something rather than doing nothing every day.
Where I ended up is not typical, but I am pretty sure that the attitude I had when I was unemployed is: go out and find a job. Having a very low income is not fun, especially when you are supporting a family. An acknowledgement or two from the Tories that most people on JSA are not idling scroungers, but are in fact actively looking for work and usually manage to find it pretty quickly would be nice - but the politics of welfare and benefits don't seem to suit that.
I would much rather people had a purpose and reason to interact with society and the chance to get into habits that generate benefits for them. It is your unfounded assumption that you stereotype my view as an orange jump suit image. I suggested nothing of that nature.
However, I think it is better for people to have to do something rather than doing nothing every day.
Where I ended up is not typical, but I am pretty sure that the attitude I had when I was unemployed is: go out and find a job. Having a very low income is not fun, especially when you are supporting a family. An acknowledgement or two from the Tories that most people on JSA are not idling scroungers, but are in fact actively looking for work and usually manage to find it pretty quickly would be nice - but the politics of welfare and benefits don't seem to suit that.
Labour's record on unemployment is atrocious. Cut the crap and stop voting for Labour's poverty pimps.
Remember.Galloway faced the US Congress and crushed them. Salmond chickened out when summoned to justify his Magari decisions before Congress.
Old Butt Lane?
Think bricks.
[Not the streetname]
Socialists easily held Lisbon.
The local Chamber of Commerce president running as Independent gain Porto from the offical centre-right candidate
Governing PPD/PSD is losing mayors all around the country. PS is making some gains but also lost some cities (for ex Evora) to the Communists.
They made glazed engineering bricks including those, for example, used to build St Pancras Station.
The family owned the Colliery and Brickworks Company (and had done since its mid 19th century founding). I guess you will know when it shut down better than I but I guess late 1970s early 1980s.
They made glazed engineering bricks including those, for example, used to build St Pancras Station.
Tbh I don't recall when it closed. I do remember local stories of the bricks being used in some royal connection. My memories are more of pot banks... most gone now, as has pretty much everything in Stoke. Coal, steel, pottery. A wasteland now. Sad.
They made glazed engineering bricks including those, for example, used to build St Pancras Station.
Tbh I don't recall when it closed. I do remember local stories of the bricks being used in some royal connection. My memories are more of pot banks... most gone now, as has pretty much everything in Stoke. Coal, steel, pottery. A wasteland now. Sad.
There is a literary route to the name via Arnold Bennett's "Anna of the Five Towns" (1902).
I don't know much more about the history except that there was a major pit accident at the Colliery in the 1940s which killed tens of miners. The mine got nationalised with almost all others but the brickmaking company continued at least until the 1970s.
BBC - Labour rules out Royal Mail renationalisation pledge
"Labour will not promise to renationalise Royal Mail after it is privatised, shadow business secretary Chuka Umunna has confirmed.
But he spelled out a series of new obligations that the party would place on the company.
The announcement came shortly before Royal Mail shares are to be sold.
Labour's conference voted to commit the party to renationalisation, but sources made it clear at the time the policy would not be adopted by the leadership."
Your link goes to the wrong BBC article but you can navigate from an on-page link to the Royal Mail Umunna article on which you are commenting.
Typical Labour policy. They don't want the responsibility or cost of ownership but believe they have the right to interfere in the company's operations as if they still owned it and the company's business was still a "public service".
If Miliband or Umunna have concerns about lack of competition in an industry - whether railways, household energy supplies or mail and parcel distribution services - then the proper course of action is to refer to the Competition Commission.
Otherwise we will end up with continued interference in operation management by polticians deciding business strategy on the back of an envelope. Angela Eagle's grudge list of ticketing reforms she wants to impose on the rail franchisees is a typical and absurd example. Miliband's price fixing of energy supplies a more dangerous continuation of the same theme.
Once an industry has been privatised it has to leave its former owners hands for good and ministers should stop pretending to be "responsible" for its services and operations..
I dont think I've ever seen you lay into the Tories this savagely before!
These figures are rather up and down, but are average figures, and probably the median RHDI would be more relevant than the mean.
If as mooted the rich are getting richer, the median may well be stagnant or declining. The upper and lower quartile points would alo be interesting. At least for those of us who like stats.
BBC - The story of Ed Miliband's energy price freeze plan
Correct link to this BBC article - Labour rules out Royal Mail renationalisation pledge
The proper way to have handled this issue was to have notified OfGen and the industry's competent representative body of the government's concerns relating to pricing. Specifically that the government was concerned that suppliers were using complex pricing schemes to obscure and prevent assessment of consumer value.
Then leave it to the regulator and the industry to work out whether the government's concerns were valid and, if so, how a voluntary or mandatory change in practice could be implemented to address the concern.
Cameron's proposal that suppliers default to lowest price supply when consumers didn't specifically opt for a promoted package may have been the right solution but the regulator and industry should have had the opportunity to review it and consider alternatives as possibly better means of resolving the underlying problem.
There really is no need for governments to legislate on such issues or even to prescibe specific solutions. Maybe as a very last resort, but prior consideration should be given to changing regulatory powers and management before even considering legislation.
I will look to see whether the ONS publish separate data and commentary on the RHDI. It is possible there are regular detailed reports which answer your questions.
Give me a day or two.
I agree with you it might be stressful for the people working in the job centre though! Perhaps it could be a system where you have to log on to the job centre website at look at at least 5 job ads or something.
RHDI
A quick lookup on the ONS site reveals that HRDI figures are only produced for Quarterly National Accounts releases and do not have a oublication series of their own. There is a one off report on the impact the recession had on RHDI which I will read.
I will also dig further into the data series released with the QNA to see if there is any greater detail which can be worked up to provide answers to you questions on distribution across the population. I am not hopeful here though.
In the meantime I found this short video released by the ONS in 2011 which explains the concept and construction of Real Households' Disposable Income. It is a good primer so worth embedding the youtube version in thread:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2eQPzTyApY