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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The great polling divide: CON wins on big broad themes but

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    JohnLilburneJohnLilburne Posts: 6,011
    edited September 2013
    Can't believe that the Daily Mail is leading on the McBride serialisation with the apparently shocking revelation... that two consenting adults had sex. Epic fail, but then what do you expect of the Mail?
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 41,983

    malcolmg said:


    So going by your bluster I can assume you have ZERO examples of Cameron or his chums doing anything about it.

    Yawn.

    When did pointing out an important distinction become 'bluster'?

    As for this government taking steps to address the matter, have you tried reading a newspaper or using Google? I really can't be bothered to go through the list.
    Confirms my tally of ZERO
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Floater said:

    anyone believe Labour on immigration?

    To be fair to Ed, he has moved on from "British Jobs for British Workers"

    The latest announcement is "British Jobs for Foreign Workers"

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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    A big thank you to Plato for cutting and pasting the whole McBride memoirs. Royalties to Catholic charity of your choice.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
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    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,756
    Roger said:

    A big thank you to Plato for cutting and pasting the whole McBride memoirs. Royalties to Catholic charity of your choice.

    Now, now Roger, you'll never make the Ludlow Posse if you spend your days twerking on behalf of Ed Miliband.
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    Quincel said:

    The reflex Israeli answer, of course. In many ways it would be a remarkable sign of the times if the Kenyan government had requested Israeli help.

    Well, there's no point asking for help from us, we apparently now need to have a debate in Parliament before troops are deployed.

    This story is pretty horrific as well http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-24193734

    We really do need to find a way of taking the war to these bastards.
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,047
    Labour has to work out its stance on the economy. To my mind it beggars belief that Osborne is getting away with what he is, but the opposition simply hasn't been good enough. Why aren't Labour pointing out that despite Osborne's fatuous claims that deficit reduction would be the rock on which recovery would be based, growth is only now returning since deficit reduction has effectively stalled? That Osborne is nowhere near meeting his plan A and the extent to which things are improving is down to him abandoning his initial borrowing targets and embracing stimulus measures in the housing market? Trouble is Ed Balls thinks the voters are stupid and can only understand the most basic economic message. There is simply no subtlety or nuance in Labour's approach. So it now looks like the argument that the government's deficit stragegy has been won by Osborne. This is in spite of him completely failing to do what he said he would do and giving us the weakest recovery from recession in over 100 years.

    I suppose the Chancellor does at least deserve some credit for his political skill even if he's economically incompetent.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    Roger said:

    A big thank you to Plato for cutting and pasting the whole McBride memoirs. Royalties to Catholic charity of your choice.

    Oh Roger! If only I had - still your absurd post alleging this just shows you're rattled by facts from the horse's own mouth about the Nasty Labour Party you clearly carry a blazing torch for.

    Snuggle up with Mr McBride - you were made for each other!

    MWAH! :^)
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Labour has to work out its stance on the economy.

    That's easy. Borrow more money.

    Did you see Rachel Reeves earlier state that their policy of providing childcare for schoolchildren between 8am and 6pm is not funded?
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    RogerRoger Posts: 18,891
    edited September 2013
    @Alanbrooke

    "Now, now Roger, you'll never make the Ludlow Posse if you spend your days twerking on behalf of Ed Miliband."

    Good heavens a bespoke post! As rare on here these days as a non Etonian Cabinet Minister
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    MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    Can't believe that the Daily Mail is leading on the McBride serialisation with the apparently shocking revelation... that two consenting adults had sex. Epic fail, but then what do you expect of the Mail?

    It's a wonder they do so well.
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    AveryLPAveryLP Posts: 7,815
    edited September 2013
    Live on Sky News:

    Pre-teen sluts in Labour at Brighton conference.

    Interviewer: "What is Ed doing to help you?"

    Response: "He is reaching out and engaging with young people up and down the country."

    Interviewer: "And what are you telling him you need?"

    Response: "More childcare".
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    Diversions are not working boys.. McBrides crap is pouring all over his former office mates.. remember they shared an office with him..and more to come..what about Drapers E-mails, ooeerr
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    DoubleCarpetDoubleCarpet Posts: 706
    edited September 2013
    Germany game average predictions: CDU/CSU 38.9 FDP 5.9 Greens 9.8 Die Linke 9.0 SPD 26.8 - almost even split between govt predictions, many thanks and good luck to everyone who took part.

    Full details at http://www.electiongame.co.uk/

    Exit polls are at 5pm.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited September 2013
    EdM is thinking BIG

    An Ipswich Tory @StokeParkCllr
    EdM promises 120k apprentices in the next Parliament. Tories have delivered 1.2million in last three years
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    Plato said:
    BBC –“Mr Campbell said a main flaw of Mr Brown was his need for "truly horrible people to be around him, doing truly horrible things in politics" which gave Labour a bad name.”

    Antony Shedon – “Brown developed a morbid hatred of Blair and became obsessed by his belief that Blair had stolen the leadership from him.- He surrounded himself with a coterie that included Balls, Ed Miliband, Douglas Alexander, Charlie Whelan, McBride and Tom Watson, who reinforced his sense of injustice.”

    A coincidence ? - Hmm, I rather think Ali has given the game away…!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-24194588

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2428513/The-unstable-ill-suited-PM-Robert-Walpole-1735-says-Anthony-Seldon.html
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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,047

    Germany game average predictions: CDU/CSU 38.9 FDP 5.9 Greens 9.8 Die Linke 9.0 SPD 26.8 - almost even split between govt predictions, many thanks and good luck to everyone who took part.

    Full details at http://www.electiongame.co.uk/

    Exit polls are at 5pm.

    Very early time to close the polling stations. I'd like to see us move to weekend voting in the UK. I wonder whether Saturday + Sunday would be possible, although it would cost more of course. Given how valuable democracy is though, elections are hardly expensive.
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    GasmanGasman Posts: 132

    Trouble is Ed Balls thinks the voters are stupid and can only understand the most basic economic message.

    But if the voters aren't stupid then Labour have no chance - their appeal is based entirely on spending lots of someone else's money.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    LOL http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10326409/Labour-accepted-payments-from-tobacco-giant-as-cigarette-packaging-row-rumbles-on.html

    Philip Morris has hired a stall in a prominent location in the exhibition hall at Labour’s annual conference in Brighton, at a cost likely to run to several thousand pounds.

    The disclosure will leave Ed Miliband open to allegations of double standards after he demanded an inquiry into the Conservative Party’s links to Philip Morris.

    The tobacco giant hired the services of the public affairs company run by Lynton Crosby, the Conservative Party’s election strategist.

    When the Coalition announced that it was dropping plans for all cigarettes to be sold in plain packages i July, Labour seized on the link as evidence that Mr Crosby had influenced government policy to suit his private clients, claims which both he and the Conservatives have denied.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited September 2013
    Cameron has the audacity to say (BBC news) the terroriost attack was NOT in the name of religion. The man is either a flaming fool or so frightened of mentioning the the word muslim in case it affects his vote. Cammo, a discrace to common sense and decency and to Britain's name in the world.
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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    O/T I do not know the story behind this but 7 of the 15 Conservative councillors on Dumfries/Galloway council have left the Conservative group and set up a rival grouping . This is the only Conservative held Westminster parliamentary seat .
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    The last graph from comres is the most revealing.

    The tories have so far failed to spell out that austerity will lead to lower taxes for ordinary people. I still think their best bet is to give voters a little bit of jam before 2015.
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    taffys said:

    The last graph from comres is the most revealing.

    The tories have so far failed to spell out that austerity will lead to lower taxes for ordinary people. I still think their best bet is to give voters a little bit of jam before 2015.

    In the UK 'austerity', has been increased taxation.

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    anotherDaveanotherDave Posts: 6,746
    edited September 2013
    MikeK said:

    Cameron has the audacity to say (BBC news) the terroriost attack was NOT in the name of religion. The man is either a flaming fool or so frightened of mentioning the the word muslim in case it affects his vote. Cammo, a discrace to common sense and decency and to Britain's name in the world.

    The politicos always seem to do this. It's bizarre.

    These terrorists are shouting religious slogans during the act, but the politicos then babble on about how it was nothing to do with them being muslims, Islam is a religion of peace blah, blah, blah.
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    I'd like to see us move to weekend voting in the UK. I wonder whether Saturday + Sunday would be possible, although it would cost more of course. Given how valuable democracy is though, elections are hardly expensive.

    I'd like to see advance voting, as in many US states, it could largely replace postal voting.

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    tim said:

    MaxPB said:

    Labour leading on personal themes is hardly a surprise. They are the party of bribes and vote buying.

    Tory electoral strategy is entirely based on bribing pensioners isn't it?

    You truly are a laughable one-eyed individual sometimes.....may I remind you of this ever so 'subtle' pre-election bribe by your former moral-compass led Chancellor?

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4834278.stm
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    MikeK said:

    Cameron has the audacity to say (BBC news) the terroriost attack was NOT in the name of religion. The man is either a flaming fool or so frightened of mentioning the the word muslim in case it affects his vote. Cammo, a discrace to common sense and decency and to Britain's name in the world.

    We may disagree on other things Mike but in this case you are quite right.
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    Has any group claimed responsibility for the Kenyan attack..
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    Germany game average predictions: CDU/CSU 38.9 FDP 5.9 Greens 9.8 Die Linke 9.0 SPD 26.8 - almost even split between govt predictions, many thanks and good luck to everyone who took part.

    Full details at http://www.electiongame.co.uk/

    Exit polls are at 5pm.

    Very early time to close the polling stations. I'd like to see us move to weekend voting in the UK. I wonder whether Saturday + Sunday would be possible, although it would cost more of course. Given how valuable democracy is though, elections are hardly expensive.
    I suspect you might see a big drop in turnout unless you were going to link it to compulsory voting. How many people go away for the weekend? Are that many people really going to change their weekend plans 'just because we have to vote'.
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    I'd like to see us move to weekend voting in the UK. I wonder whether Saturday + Sunday would be possible, although it would cost more of course. Given how valuable democracy is though, elections are hardly expensive.

    I'd like to see advance voting, as in many US states, it could largely replace postal voting.

    What is "advance voting"?

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    Has any group claimed responsibility for the Kenyan attack..

    Harakat al-Shabaab al-Mujahideen. A Somali group. You can probably guess from their name what their religious and political views are.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    Has any group claimed responsibility for the Kenyan attack..

    Where you been living for the last 24 hours? Somalis of al-Shabab have openly proclaimed their good deeds for the day. Maybe you thought that they were ice cream sellers?
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Odinga, speaking now on Kenyan TV (via BBC) went to school with my son. Funny how life works out.
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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited September 2013
    It seems we have Islamist terrorists killing about 60 'infidels' in Kenya and separately up to 200 Christian infidels in Pakistan.

    I confidently expect our political classes to fall over themselves in reassuring us all that this is the religion of peace.

    I feel a SeanT blog coming along....
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    How?

    AndrewSparrow @AndrewSparrow
    Rachel Reeves says Labour's school childcare from 8am to 6pm idea "won't cost any [extra] money" - #lab13 - theguardian.com/politics/2013/…
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    Er, what it says on the tin. In many US states you can vote in person in advance of election day. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Advance_voting#United_States
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    Mike K i have been mostly doing what seems to be a difficult task for most people i tthe UK..making lotsa dosh..
    I haven't been watching the news so had no idea if there had been a claim made..but many thanks for the info.. so kind
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    TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    edited September 2013
    Plato said:

    How?
    AndrewSparrow @AndrewSparrow
    Rachel Reeves says Labour's school childcare from 8am to 6pm idea "won't cost any [extra] money" - #lab13 - theguardian.com/politics/2013/…

    Plato, you forget that Labour believe in the magic moneytree.
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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    "For publishers newspaper serialisations are a double edge sword. If a newspaper is allowed to serialise too much of the book, it can seriously impact on book sales. So there is always a word limit agreed in the contract. In the Mcbride book, if my memory serves me correctly, the Mail is allowed to serialise 15,000 words out of the total word count of 140,000 (it could be 20,000, but I haven’t got the document to hand). Even so, I am sure there will be many people who think they don’t need to read the book because of the massive coverage, not just in the Mail but elsewhere. To compensate for this, the publisher takes a cut from the serialisation fee. Depending on the book and the context the cut is anything from 10% to 50%, although the norm is 10-20%. The rest goes to the author.

    So how does a newspaper come to serialise a book? What’s the process? For a normal political book, up until recently there were only really three players – the Mail, Mail on Sunday and the Sunday Times. Most of the others had pulled out of the serial market altogether or would only do one or two books a year. Recently though, The Times, Telegraphm Sunday Telegraph and The Guardian have reentered the serial market. When I first started publishing books in 1998 it was commonplace to secure high five figure serial deals. Even 8 years ago quite a few books got six figure sums. Nowadays only ex Prime Ministers or the likes of Peter Mandelson command such sums. Most book serialisations go for a fraction of what they would have done some years ago. Indeed, I wonder whether we are heading towards a situation where newspapers stop paying for book deals and take the view that newspapers in other countries do: “Why should I pay for something which is PR for the book?” I don’t see that happening here while we have seven or eight national newspapers which compete with each other for attention... > http://www.iaindale.com/posts/2013/09/22/how-newspaper-book-serialisations-work?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
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    Patrick said:

    I confidently expect our political classes to fall over themselves in reassuring us all that this is the religion of peace.I feel a SeanT blog coming along....

    Generally speaking, it is. For these people who are clearly killing in the name of Islam, it clearly isn't. Why politicians seem incapable of making this simple distinction is beyond me.

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    FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,047

    Germany game average predictions: CDU/CSU 38.9 FDP 5.9 Greens 9.8 Die Linke 9.0 SPD 26.8 - almost even split between govt predictions, many thanks and good luck to everyone who took part.

    Full details at http://www.electiongame.co.uk/

    Exit polls are at 5pm.

    Very early time to close the polling stations. I'd like to see us move to weekend voting in the UK. I wonder whether Saturday + Sunday would be possible, although it would cost more of course. Given how valuable democracy is though, elections are hardly expensive.
    I suspect you might see a big drop in turnout unless you were going to link it to compulsory voting. How many people go away for the weekend? Are that many people really going to change their weekend plans 'just because we have to vote'.
    There must be a reason why European countries vote at the weekend. I would have thought higher turnout could be part of the explanation.
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    MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    MikeK said:

    Cameron has the audacity to say (BBC news) the terroriost attack was NOT in the name of religion. The man is either a flaming fool or so frightened of mentioning the the word muslim in case it affects his vote. Cammo, a discrace to common sense and decency and to Britain's name in the world.

    The politicos always seem to do this. It's bizarre.

    These terrorists are shouting religious slogans during the act, but the politicos then babble on about how it was nothing to do with them being muslims, Islam is a religion of peace blah, blah, blah.
    PC is a fundamentalist religion.
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    Plato said:

    [snipped]

    It's a bit of a service if you post stuff from behind the Times paywall, but we can all follow a link to Iain Dale if we are so minded.

    In the case of political memoirs, I guess that hardly anyone would buy them anyway so the serialisation is not so much a "two edged sword" but the only way to make money out of it.

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    There must be a reason why European countries vote at the weekend. I would have thought higher turnout could be part of the explanation.

    Maybe they have always done it, just we have always voted on Thursday. Slightly surprised at the Germans voting on Sunday as until recently they have always taken Sunday (and Saturday afternoon) closing quite seriously.

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    PlatoPlato Posts: 15,724
    edited September 2013

    Plato said:

    [snipped]

    It's a bit of a service if you post stuff from behind the Times paywall, but we can all follow a link to Iain Dale if we are so minded.

    In the case of political memoirs, I guess that hardly anyone would buy them anyway so the serialisation is not so much a "two edged sword" but the only way to make money out of it.

    Well don't read two paragraphs is you don't want to - it's very easy. I must remember your reading matter tastes when I'm paying for the content - good grief.
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    There must be a reason why European countries vote at the weekend. I would have thought higher turnout could be part of the explanation.

    Maybe they have always done it, just we have always voted on Thursday. Slightly surprised at the Germans voting on Sunday as until recently they have always taken Sunday (and Saturday afternoon) closing quite seriously.

    Apparently the UK voting on Thursdays only started in the 1930s, so it's not even a particularly old tradition.
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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    German turnout at 14.00 41.4% compared to 36.1% in 2009 , 41.9% in 2005 and 42.8% in 2002
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Tory Treasury @ToryTreasury

    BREAKING: Gov't legal advice says Ed Miliband's new apprenticeship policy is illegal under EU law. It's unravelled within 24 hrs #shambles

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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699

    German turnout at 14.00 41.4% compared to 36.1% in 2009 , 41.9% in 2005 and 42.8% in 2002

    And final turnouts 2009 70.8% , 2005 77.7% , 2002 79.1%
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    Tory Treasury @ToryTreasury

    BREAKING: Gov't legal advice says Ed Miliband's new apprenticeship policy is illegal under EU law. It's unravelled within 24 hrs #shambles

    Sounds odd, what's the law it's illegal under? It would be good if the EU had a general prohibition against pandering populist political twattery, but it doesn't.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    norman smith @BBCNormanS

    Tories claim Labour "hire an apprentice" policy wd be illegal under EU law - cos post have to be open to EU aswell as UK apprentice #lab13

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    [Deleted User][Deleted User] Posts: 0
    edited September 2013
    @JonhLilburne

    Yeah right.

    Any idea what percentage of all the world's suicide bombings and religious massacres are NOT perpetrated by the rageboys?

    Here's my take on it: I'm an atheist. All the sky fairies seem equally as preposterous to me as the next. God, Allah, Flying Spaghetti Monster. The lot.

    But... the central message of Christianity is love. Forgive. Turn the other cheek. Love your enemy. Be kind. Show compassion. Show restraint. You will be rewarded in heaven for kindness. Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar's and render unto God that which is God's - a space for the secular and human liberty is baked in. The central core of our Judeo-Christian heritage and culture is based on something benevolent and kind - and free. I am delighted to live in a world driven by these values even though I cannot accept the existence of a deity.

    The central message of Islam is obedience. The very word Islam means submission. Do WTF you're told. Try to leave and we'll kill you. Obey the Koran and kill the infidel. Women - do WTF you're told. Women and infidels - your word only counts half that of a Muslim in court. If you ain't Muslim you don't count. You will be rewarded in heaven with 72 virgins for committing massacres. Sharia trumps all and there can be no space for freedom or human rights. All must submit to Allah's will (to wipe out the infidels). That's what it says in the Koran. That's what the Imams and Mullahs say. I believe they mean it. I am horrified by the prospect of Muslim values spreading further into the world. Into my world.

    So you can tell me that the vast majrity of Muslims abhor this stuff. Bullshit. What % of even Britain's Muslims want to see Sharia? (Yes it's a scary high number). The problem isn't Islamic fundamentalism. It isn't Islamic terrorism. It's Islam itself. And in a world of modern communications where freedom, participation of women, tolerance and all the rest are needed to succeed economically it is no wonder whatever that the Muslim world falls ever further behind. As Mohammed El Baradei said of Egypt: You can't eat Sharia law. Their religion is fu<king up their own lives - and everyone else's who takes a different view. Islam is desperately, desperately in need of a Reformation.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    James Kirkup @jameskirkup

    Labour sources on Tory claim their apprenticeship plan breaks EU law: 'This is bogus. Of course apprenticeships are open to all EU citizens'

    So labours *BRITISH* apprenticeships is a load of bollocks.
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    Good afternoon, everyone.

    Currently writing the post-race piece. I won't 'spoil' the race, but if you're planning on watching highlights you might prefer not to. Wasn't a classic.
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    norman smith @BBCNormanS

    Tories claim Labour "hire an apprentice" policy wd be illegal under EU law - cos post have to be open to EU aswell as UK apprentice #lab13

    Does the Labour plan ban other EU nationals from getting the apprentice spot?
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    norman smith @BBCNormanS

    Tories claim Labour "hire an apprentice" policy wd be illegal under EU law - cos post have to be open to EU aswell as UK apprentice #lab13

    That's probably not a fatal flaw, any EU citizen applying for a position would probably be resident anyway. Can't imagine many people coming here for an apprenticeship.

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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    norman smith @BBCNormanS

    Tories claim Labour "hire an apprentice" policy wd be illegal under EU law - cos post have to be open to EU aswell as UK apprentice #lab13

    Does the Labour plan ban other EU nationals from getting the apprentice spot?
    No.

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    British jobs for French workers!

    Well, it's only slightly more ridiculous than "The French president speaks for Britain."
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    Patrick.. well said..
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    British jobs for French workers!

    Well, it's only slightly more ridiculous than "The French president speaks for Britain."

    Even worse,british apprentices for all the EU.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @ToryTreasury: .@jameskirkup so Ed Miliband is now admitting that, actually, his scheme won't require firms to hire local workers as apprentices?
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Remember when Ed said his wife was not going to introduce him?

    @zoesqwilliams: just got told 'this is a brilliant story for you: Justine has been speaking in public for the first time. She might introduce Ed.' #lab13
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    British jobs for French workers!

    Well, it's only slightly more ridiculous than "The French president speaks for Britain."

    Even worse,british apprentices for all the EU.
    The original plan is meddlesome bollocks, but it being open to other EU nationals resident in Britain isn't ridiculous, it's blindingly obvious. The Tory tweeters must know that, they're just blowing smoke.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453


    Even worse,british apprentices for all the EU.

    British jobs for Bulgarian/Romanian workers.

    Genius.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    norman smith @BBCNormanS

    Tories claim Labour "hire an apprentice" policy wd be illegal under EU law - cos post have to be open to EU aswell as UK apprentice #lab13

    That's probably not a fatal flaw, any EU citizen applying for a position would probably be resident anyway. Can't imagine many people coming here for an apprenticeship.

    I can,they is loads of young EU citizens round where I live,moving with they families.
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    I was listening to Pienaar interviewing Cooper on this very issue on R5 this morning, she was definitely not saying the apprenticeships were for EU nationals.....
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    Patrick said:

    The central core of our Judeo-Christian heritage and culture is based on something benevolent and kind - and free.

    If it took 2,000 years for the benevolence and kindness of Christianity to become the basis of 'our' culture, what sort of timescale do you think Islam should be allowed?
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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    edited September 2013
    Young EU applicants for apprenticeships will probably have a better command of English.. at least able to read and write it
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    edited September 2013

    British jobs for French workers!

    Well, it's only slightly more ridiculous than "The French president speaks for Britain."

    Even worse,british apprentices for all the EU.
    The original plan is meddlesome bollocks, but it being open to other EU nationals resident in Britain isn't ridiculous, it's blindingly obvious. The Tory tweeters must know that, they're just blowing smoke.
    It's labour who is blowing smoke,pulling the wool over the british peoples eyes,they tried to make out it was British people apprenticeships only.
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    Plato said:

    How?

    AndrewSparrow @AndrewSparrow
    Rachel Reeves says Labour's school childcare from 8am to 6pm idea "won't cost any [extra] money" - #lab13 - theguardian.com/politics/2013/…

    A (very) left-wing teacher friend of mine spat blood at this idea, when I had the temerity to mention it to her a couple of months ago. She said teachers were there for education and teaching, not to be used as day-care assistants.

    An anecdote, certainly, but I wonder how many teachers agree with it?

    Personally I think it *may* be a good idea, depending on the costs and details. For one thing, I would not want it to be compulsory - if parents can look after their children after school, let them. The time should also be productively used - sports, clubs, activities etc.

    But I can't see how it would not cost any extra money ...
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453


    But I can't see how it would not cost any extra money ...

    She did say the schools could charge for it, which would mean no additional tax-payer money in that case
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    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,288
    edited September 2013
    The thread says "Lab wins on areas that directly affect people"

    Housing - 95%+ of people live where they live and don't particularly need to move.

    Unemployment is 8%. 92% of people are employed. Those figures don't include retired people - none of whom are unemployed.

    Education affects more people but still it's only a fairly small minority of people who have children of school age.

    Healthcare is the only area of the four which could be argued to affect almost everyone but only in the sense that you might get ill. The vast majority of people are not ill (or at least not seriously) over even a 5 year Parliament.


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    Patrick said:

    The central core of our Judeo-Christian heritage and culture is based on something benevolent and kind - and free.

    If it took 2,000 years for the benevolence and kindness of Christianity to become the basis of 'our' culture, what sort of timescale do you think Islam should be allowed?
    And much of those 2000 years was filled with violence and terror easily equal to anything being done in the name of Islam.

    I am an atheist and my attitude is a plague on all your houses. Right now the problem is indeed Islam (though the peace loving Buddhists appear to be catching the massacre bug as well) but to try and claim some moral superiority for a Christian religion much of whose history is steeped in blood and conquest seems somewhat hypocritical.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @jameskirkup: Miliband, Saturday: "Any firm who wants to bring in a foreign worker... they also have to train up someone who's a *local* worker."

    He has really done an "Ed" on this one.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    British jobs for French workers!

    Well, it's only slightly more ridiculous than "The French president speaks for Britain."

    Even worse,british apprentices for all the EU.
    The original plan is meddlesome bollocks, but it being open to other EU nationals resident in Britain isn't ridiculous, it's blindingly obvious. The Tory tweeters must know that, they're just blowing smoke.
    And by the way,I'm not a tory tweeter.

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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Strong. Decisive.
    Ed Miliband was embarrassed on the first day of the Labour Party conference today as he was forced to applaud a union attack on his flagship trade union reforms.

    Speaking at a debate intended to pave the way for historic changes to the Labour-union link, Paul Kenny, head of the GMB energy workers union, dismissed them as “dinner party babble”.

    He added that the “removal or sale” of their collective voice was “not on the agenda”.
    http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/politics/article3875895.ece
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    simples

    Local as in the EU local.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    James Willby @JamesWillby

    @ChrisBryantMP @matthancockmp Ah now Chris, but that is *not* how this being sold is it. This is "British jobs for British workers" 2.0.

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    MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,288

    Tory Treasury @ToryTreasury

    BREAKING: Gov't legal advice says Ed Miliband's new apprenticeship policy is illegal under EU law. It's unravelled within 24 hrs #shambles

    Surely it makes no sense anyway.

    Almost any company large enough to be recruiting from abroad will be employing at least the same number of new trainees somewhere within the company.

    So bingo - they just reclassify any new trainee (or other new joiner) as an apprentice.
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    Strong. Decisive.

    @tnewtondunn: Chaos for Ed if they win.. MT @JBeattieMirror Unions have contemporary motion tomorrow demanding cap on public sector pay is lifted #lab13
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,661
    edited September 2013
    Finally worked out how to stop PB threads flittering up and down every few seconds: switch JavaScript off in preferences. But you have to switch it back on to post comments.
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    MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699
    edited September 2013
    How much public money did the Conservatives spend to drag out government legal advisers at a weekend to give an opinion as to whether Labour's scheme is legal or not ?
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    RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    It will be interesting to see if the AfD or FDP exceed the 5% in any particular Land, while failing the hurdle nationally. If so, it will probably lead to calls for further reform of the German electoral system...
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    richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    edited September 2013
    MS It is so bleedin obvious they probably asked the offfice junior..it's a pity Labour didn't do the same
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,661
    "Open Europe ‏@OpenEurope 20m

    First German election exit poll expected at 6pm BST, projected seat allocation here http://event.faz.net/event/bundestagswahl/live/#/live
    Expand"


    "The turnout estimate for #btw13 at 2pm was 41.4% compared to 36.1% in 2009 & 41.9% in 2005 http://www.wahlrecht.de/news/2013/bundestagswahl-2013.html …"

    https://twitter.com/OpenEurope
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    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,116
    edited September 2013

    Patrick said:

    The central core of our Judeo-Christian heritage and culture is based on something benevolent and kind - and free.

    If it took 2,000 years for the benevolence and kindness of Christianity to become the basis of 'our' culture, what sort of timescale do you think Islam should be allowed?
    And much of those 2000 years was filled with violence and terror easily equal to anything being done in the name of Islam.

    I am an atheist and my attitude is a plague on all your houses. Right now the problem is indeed Islam (though the peace loving Buddhists appear to be catching the massacre bug as well) but to try and claim some moral superiority for a Christian religion much of whose history is steeped in blood and conquest seems somewhat hypocritical.
    Yep, the list of religions that have managed not to murder heretics, blasphemers, infidels, schismatics and plain old non-believers must be tiny. Quakers maybe?

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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @tnewtondunn: Lab now conceding that '1-for-1' Brit apprenticeships for non-EU workers have to be open to all EU citizens - encouraging more immig. Oops.
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    TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    This apprentice scheme cock up is pure Miliband.

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    Y0kelY0kel Posts: 2,307
    Kenya

    Foreign Special forces have turned up, not advisors, guys with kit.

    Balance of probability is there are likely to be foreigners amongst the hostages.
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    TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    How much public money did the Conservatives spend to drag out government legal advisers at a weekend to give an opinion as to whether Labour's scheme is legal or not ?

    I bet you cringed when labour used the word 'local'.

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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    TGOHF said:

    This apprentice scheme cock up is pure Miliband.

    As in Community, where Brita is a synonym for cock-up, so on the first day of conference Labour have 'dropped a Miliband'
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    Patrick said:

    The central core of our Judeo-Christian heritage and culture is based on something benevolent and kind - and free.

    If it took 2,000 years for the benevolence and kindness of Christianity to become the basis of 'our' culture, what sort of timescale do you think Islam should be allowed?
    And much of those 2000 years was filled with violence and terror easily equal to anything being done in the name of Islam.

    I am an atheist and my attitude is a plague on all your houses. Right now the problem is indeed Islam (though the peace loving Buddhists appear to be catching the massacre bug as well) but to try and claim some moral superiority for a Christian religion much of whose history is steeped in blood and conquest seems somewhat hypocritical.
    Yep, the list of religions that have managed not to murder heretics, blasphemers, infidels, schismatics and plain old non-believers must be tiny. Quakers maybe?

    Much as I scorn religion generally I have to say I do admire those Quakers I have met. My next door neighbour is a senior Quaker (if such a thing can be said to exist) in her late 60s or early 70s. A little grey haired old lady she has spent much of her life helping with negotiations to end conflict in Northern Ireland, Lebanon and Yugoslavia. An amazing woman who still disappears off regularly to war zones to try and help with negotiations.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited September 2013

    Patrick said:

    The central core of our Judeo-Christian heritage and culture is based on something benevolent and kind - and free.

    If it took 2,000 years for the benevolence and kindness of Christianity to become the basis of 'our' culture, what sort of timescale do you think Islam should be allowed?
    Well it's had 14 centuries to develop and civilise. They are now regressing. How much longer would you give them, big man?
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    Scott_P said:


    But I can't see how it would not cost any extra money ...

    She did say the schools could charge for it, which would mean no additional tax-payer money in that case
    Fair enough. I wonder how much it will cost per hour compared to many parents who need it most, e.g. those on the NMW?

    And what would the children be doing whilst in school?

    As ever, the devil is in the details. But it could well be a good idea.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,661
    edited September 2013
    The higher turnout in Germany is probably good news for AfD because it was thought they might bring out people who haven't voted for a few years in the same way that UKIP is doing here.
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    GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071

    Good afternoon, everyone.
    Currently writing the post-race piece. I won't 'spoil' the race, but if you're planning on watching highlights you might prefer not to. Wasn't a classic.

    Thanks Mr Dancer, I'm going to watch the recorded version later. I only saw two glimpses of the race through a pub window of any significance - one which would have won me a small bet I had intended to place (safety car) and one which would have lost me a small bet (think of the car with nosecone buried in wall).

    Many thanks again for your F1 commentary here and your blog on the sport elsewhere.

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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    So the new spin line is that when Ed said local, he meant Romania.

    That is weak, weak, weak, even by the PB Kinnocks' low standards.
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    Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 26,661
    Anyone know if there'll be live streaming of a German election show online for foreign viewers?
This discussion has been closed.