If a Deliveroo person is prepared to cycle down from Teesside to bring me a Parmo, then I might be interested. However, it might need reheating by then.
As might the Deliveroo person. You had best put the kettle on for him before ordering.
Obviously when Jezza comes in and closes all the free press he doesn't like this will be immaterial, but this particular rule was bonkers. If the press prints lies they should pay, but if they don't, they shouldn't be liable for the other sides costs.
Deliveroo is one business I don't get. It seems a very expensive way to get a takeaway from a crap chain restaurant, but then I wasn't effected by the KFC closures nor care if Nando runs out of chicken / Jamie Italian chain goes bust (other than obviously people losing work).
In principle you get a better meal from Deliveroo than Just Eat because they deal with fine dining (in relative terms) restaurants who see takeaway as another sales channel and don't want to do the delivery themselves. I believe Deliveroo charge those restaurants a 30% commission.
Having looked at the price differences on Deliveroo compared to the actual restaurant menu, I think it is the customers who pay the 30%.
I wouldn't be surprised that both parties are paying Deliveroo. Providing the delivery was their USP, but Just Eat and Uber so so as well now. Thinking about it, I haven't seen a Just Eat delivery rider recently.
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
The EU conveniently took away the A50 leverage by refusing to have any talks until A50 was enacted.
Then the EU insisted on 3 issues first (including the Ireland one) before discussing trade.
So that's why we're here and there appears to not be a plan, because the EU response to any UK plan is simply "do what you're told". And that attitude is why we voted for Brexit in the first place.
Mrs May could still have held off triggering A50 and got the policy brief sorted out in a more realistic fashion. To start the process with a fantasy that David Davis would hop over to Berlin and it would be sorted out in a week or two was not exactly brilliant politics.
I wonder if this is the week Boris finally flounces.
I think if he went this week, it would be seen as a resignation in disgrace after a problem filled week - the stuff about the Camden - Islington border, the letter to TMay speculating about a hard border, and criticism of the garden bridge fiasco.
I suspect his message would be drowned out if he goes this week - he's smart enough to choose a better time surely?
Sure. His reaction to the Imola tragedies in 1994 have undoubtedly save more lives in F1, as did he and Bernie getting Prof Watkins is as F1 medical officer. (Though I also slightly blame Moseley for the Imola deaths, given the sudden rule changes probably contributed to the crashes).
But over the current story? Nah.
I reckon Ron Dennis is chuckling at Mosely's demise.
Somewhat, and he isn’t the only one.
Murdoch is going to do everything in his considerable power to get Mosley in front of a judge on a perjury charge.
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
The EU conveniently took away the A50 leverage by refusing to have any talks until A50 was enacted.
Then the EU insisted on 3 issues first (including the Ireland one) before discussing trade.
So that's why we're here and there appears to not be a plan, because the EU response to any UK plan is simply "do what you're told". And that attitude is why we voted for Brexit in the first place.
"The more we realise how good the EU is at negotiations, the less we want the EU to negotiate on our behalf."
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
Well quite. I suppose since Belgium (and therefore Brussels) still legally sets it's time relative to GMT (rather than UTC), I suppose the government could keep adding leap seconds to GMT until a strategy develops. They said we leave the EU in 2019, but no one technically agreed when 2019 actually starts.
This is clearly mad, but still an improvement on what the government is actually doing.
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
The EU conveniently took away the A50 leverage by refusing to have any talks until A50 was enacted.
Then the EU insisted on 3 issues first (including the Ireland one) before discussing trade.
So that's why we're here and there appears to not be a plan, because the EU response to any UK plan is simply "do what you're told". And that attitude is why we voted for Brexit in the first place.
Re the first point, I can see your point. But regardless the government should have done all the detailed work on all the issues arising to come up with a plan of its own - for a transition, for all the different sectors, for an FTA, for or not EFTA/EEA, for Ireland, for the talks etc etc.
And then it should have taken the initiative by setting out what it wanted, what it would offer and how - in detail - it would get to wherever it wanted to be. Of course the EU might still have reacted in the way you describe but there might also have been a chance of them seeing that there was a serious grown up thoughtful interlocutor on the other side of the table. Not arrogant, incompetent amateurs like Johnson, Davis and Fox who, whatever your view on Brexit, shame this country.
And it could also have had the conversation with the country it needed to, to explain the destination, the trade offs, the complexities etc and it could have got some of those on the losing side on board or at least not so hostile. And it should have leveraged the skills and advice of people from across the political spectrum including those opposed to Brexit, because frankly it needed all the help it could got.
It did none of those things and now the government and the country are boxed into a corner.
Even if Brexit was not your choice there was a much more intelligent and thoughtful way of going about it than what we have seen.
This is the sort of thing why I argue the licence fee is totally broken. The BBC while wed to the telly tax can't compete with the shifts happening in the modern world of content creation.
Murdoch has seen the tectonic plates shifting, and the Sky under new ownership are in an even better position to adapt with the times.
Netflix and Amazon are providing some great content.
Much of it created or originally developed by the BBC. :-)
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
As I recall, the only justification for the A50 timing was the Euro elections in March 2019. When combined with the 2 year A50 deadline it meant that if triggered in March 2017 then we could avoid having MEPs who would only serve a part term.
Not a brilliant justification, but ...
A bloody silly justification IMO. So what if there were some UK MEPs. It might have annoyed the EU but big deal. Far more important was working out what we wanted which, some 21 months after the referendum, we still have not done.......
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
In any rational world, it's not the Government who should have done this before March 2017 - it was the Leave campaign who should have done it before June 2016. The Irish border was given no serious analysis during the referendum campaign (other than Remainer X: I think we have a problem here, Leaver Y: Nah, it'll be fine)
But as I and many others are having to come to terms with, we lost because we played a rational game when the battleground was elsewhere.
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
In any rational world, it's not the Government who should have done this before March 2017 - it was the Leave campaign who should have done it before June 2016. The Irish border was given no serious analysis during the referendum campaign (other than Remainer X: I think we have a problem here, Leaver Y: Nah, it'll be fine)
But as I and many others are having to come to terms with, we lost because we played a rational game when the battleground was elsewhere.
You didn't play a rational game. You just lied about different things.
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
They defenestrated IDS to keep the Tory brand going.
Not delivering Brexit would kill the Tory brand stone dead. So no chance.
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
Do you remember "No Deal is better than a bad deal"? The idea was that we threaten to walk away and the Germans, Italians etc would run after us because they would be desperate to sell us their cars and prosecco. Brexiteers egged May on and organised drinks parties to celebrate the event.
I pointed out on this forum that refusing to budge was a better BATNA (best alternative to negotiated agreement) but was told, just as well I wasn't doing the negotiations. (they may be right about that).
Remember that time when we woke up to find that the Conservatives had quietly dumped Ian Duncan Smith? What are the chances they will do the same with Brexit?
Nil. They need to dump the swivel-eyed Brexit loons first. After that they can ask the EU to stop the process whilst they take a realistic look at things and come up with a coherent plan for either IN or OUT.
A press on the PAUSE button would be ideal. Some very hard thinking to get a coherent plan is urgently needed.
Of course they should have done this before pressing the Article 50 button. God only knows why they didn't. The timing of Article 50 was about the only leverage the UK had.
As I recall, the only justification for the A50 timing was the Euro elections in March 2019. When combined with the 2 year A50 deadline it meant that if triggered in March 2017 then we could avoid having MEPs who would only serve a part term.
Not a brilliant justification, but ...
A bloody silly justification IMO. So what if there were some UK MEPs. It might have annoyed the EU but big deal. Far more important was working out what we wanted which, some 21 months after the referendum, we still have not done.......
I am not going to argue your point. I am, after all, an arch-Remoaner
It would be nice to have a national rational policy instead of watching the loons rub themselves against the furniture as they get excited by the thought of post-Brexit aka 1957 mk2.
The only consolation left to me is watching JRM et al's increasing desperation as it all falls apart as reality refuses to negotiate with fantasy.
... there might also have been a chance of them seeing that there was a serious grown up thoughtful interlocutor on the other side of the table. Not arrogant, incompetent amateurs like Johnson, Davis and Fox who, whatever your view on Brexit, shame this country.
That report was publicised at the time, and does not describe a frictionless border so it is not a viable solution.
As a die-hard remainer I'm not desperate to show one-thing or another in this case. But it seemed a lot better than the apocalyptic situation some people would have one believe.
Deliveroo is one business I don't get. It seems a very expensive way to get a takeaway from a crap chain restaurant, but then I wasn't effected by the KFC closures nor care if Nando runs out of chicken / Jamie Italian chain goes bust (other than obviously people losing work).
In principle you get a better meal from Deliveroo than Just Eat because they deal with fine dining (in relative terms) restaurants who see takeaway as another sales channel and don't want to do the delivery themselves. I believe Deliveroo charge those restaurants a 30% commission.
Having looked at the price differences on Deliveroo compared to the actual restaurant menu, I think it is the customers who pay the 30%.
I wouldn't be surprised that both parties are paying Deliveroo. Providing the delivery was their USP, but Just Eat and Uber so so as well now. Thinking about it, I haven't seen a Just Eat delivery rider recently.
Deliveroo strikes me as emblematic of what is wrong with Britain. Youngsters on the gig economy riding in dark and snow to deliver junk food to couch potatoes who would be better off walking to the grocery store then to the kitchen.
No wonder diabetes has doubled in 20 years. It is national suicide by junk food.
That report was publicised at the time, and does not describe a frictionless border so it is not a viable solution.
As a die-hard remainer I'm not desperate to show one-thing or another in this case. But it seemed a lot better than the apocalyptic situation some people would have one believe.
Apologies if my first comment was misdirected. This document is suddenly being circulated by Leavers who think it offers an alternative solution to full alignment, but it doesn't.
This is the sort of thing why I argue the licence fee is totally broken. The BBC while wed to the telly tax can't compete with the shifts happening in the modern world of content creation.
Murdoch has seen the tectonic plates shifting, and the Sky under new ownership are in an even better position to adapt with the times.
Netflix and Amazon are providing some great content.
Much of it created or originally developed by the BBC. :-)
Mhh - why do I never watch anything on the Beeb then?
Oh of course - they get paid no matter what shite appears on our screens
That report was publicised at the time, and does not describe a frictionless border so it is not a viable solution.
As a die-hard remainer I'm not desperate to show one-thing or another in this case. But it seemed a lot better than the apocalyptic situation some people would have one believe.
Apologies if my first comment was misdirected. This document is suddenly being circulated by Leavers who think it offers an alternative solution to full alignment, but it doesn't.
No, it shows the EU and UK positions are quite similar. Looking for a FTA and technological solutions.
That report was publicised at the time, and does not describe a frictionless border so it is not a viable solution.
As a die-hard remainer I'm not desperate to show one-thing or another in this case. But it seemed a lot better than the apocalyptic situation some people would have one believe.
Apologies if my first comment was misdirected. This document is suddenly being circulated by Leavers who think it offers an alternative solution to full alignment, but it doesn't.
Fair enough. I find the whole customs, tariff, rules of origin marlarky rather esoteric. Recondite, even.
It seems sadly inevitable that the Northern Irish will be worse off as a result of whatever's put in place, hi-tech or otherwise.
The problem with the solution in the Good Friday Agreement context, I suspect, is the answer to the first question. You still need the physical border. The answer to the second question is that it is possible to design processes compliant with EU regulation that get you through the physical border faster.
Just had a flutter on George Osborne to be next London Mayor at 40/1.
In 2024 maybe not 2020 on the basis Livingstone and Boris both only served two terms.
If Corbyn wins in 2022 that would boost his chances as he could benefit from a mid term protest vote and he clearly has broader appeal in London at least than the average Tory
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
Just had a flutter on George Osborne to be next London Mayor at 40/1.
In 2024 maybe not 2020 on the basis Livingstone and Boris both only served two terms.
If Corbyn wins in 2022 that would boost his chances as he could benefit from a mid term protest vote and he clearly has broader appeal in London at least than the average Tory
He might even have the support of the local free rag.
The problem with the solution in the Good Friday Agreement context, I suspect, is the answer to the first question. You still need the physical border. The answer to the second question is that it is possible to design processes compliant with EU regulation that get you through the physical border faster.
Just had a flutter on George Osborne to be next London Mayor at 40/1.
In 2024 maybe not 2020 on the basis Livingstone and Boris both only served two terms.
If Corbyn wins in 2022 that would boost his chances as he could benefit from a mid term protest vote and he clearly has broader appeal in London at least than the average Tory
He might even have the support of the local free rag.
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
I find that very difficult to believe. That a Cabinet Minister would speak to The Independent.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Just had a flutter on George Osborne to be next London Mayor at 40/1.
I don't think they are good odds at all.
Since Brexit London has become such a solid Labour city that I don't see anyone under an official Conservative label winning a mayoral election again for decades to come, even for "out of the box" Tory candidates like Boris or Osborne.
For the foreseeable future IMO, Labour would only be beatable from the right by an independent.
At the moment Khan's approval ratings are excellent and given the Labour dominance of London right now he's a total shoo-in for re-election in 2020.
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
And people are betting real money on George Osborne becoming London mayor. Clearly not as a Conservative these days.
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
Oh, so technological solutions are possible? No need for plan C then.
Deliveroo is one business I don't get. It seems a very expensive way to get a takeaway from a crap chain restaurant, but then I wasn't effected by the KFC closures nor care if Nando runs out of chicken / Jamie Italian chain goes bust (other than obviously people losing work).
In principle you get a better meal from Deliveroo than Just Eat because they deal with fine dining (in relative terms) restaurants who see takeaway as another sales channel and don't want to do the delivery themselves. I believe Deliveroo charge those restaurants a 30% commission.
Having looked at the price differences on Deliveroo compared to the actual restaurant menu, I think it is the customers who pay the 30%.
I wouldn't be surprised that both parties are paying Deliveroo. Providing the delivery was their USP, but Just Eat and Uber so so as well now. Thinking about it, I haven't seen a Just Eat delivery rider recently.
Deliveroo strikes me as emblematic of what is wrong with Britain. Youngsters on the gig economy riding in dark and snow to deliver junk food to couch potatoes who would be better off walking to the grocery store then to the kitchen.
No wonder diabetes has doubled in 20 years. It is national suicide by junk food.
Is it any worse than bacon ? Which according to some reports what you read is killing us. Anyways I have for a long time eaten less red meat and become more flexitarianism.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Lansman wants to transform Labour into a member led organisation.
UNITE do not want this they want Unions to hold sway.
Whose side are PB Tories on given Jennie Formby or JL are the only 2 games in town.
Who are these nobodies you keep pasting Scott - like a yellow pages of self important metropolitan misanthropes who are legends in their own Latte breaks.
Whose side are PB Tories on given Jennie Formby or JL are the only 2 games in town.
Not on any side. The Labour Party's affairs are its problem, although it must be deeply distressing for traditional Labour figures to see the parasite continuing to eat away at the party from the inside.
Who are these nobodies you keep pasting Scott - like a yellow pages of self important metropolitan misanthropes who are legends in their own Latte breaks.
Looks like he's an EU correspondent of a former newspaper... titters.
Who are these nobodies you keep pasting Scott - like a yellow pages of self important metropolitan misanthropes who are legends in their own Latte breaks.
Looks like he's an EU correspondent of a former newspaper... titters.
Not sure the Pulitzer committee will spend much time considering that tweet.
No wonder the Indy is down he tubes if their journos spend more time tweeting their virtue than reporting the news.
Just had a flutter on George Osborne to be next London Mayor at 40/1.
In 2024 maybe not 2020 on the basis Livingstone and Boris both only served two terms.
If Corbyn wins in 2022 that would boost his chances as he could benefit from a mid term protest vote and he clearly has broader appeal in London at least than the average Tory
Only Livingstone actually stood and lost a 3rd (and 4th) time. Boris stood down. I wonder if he might have won re-election in 2016 had he stood. My gut says probably not, especially as Boris had come out for Leave by that point, but it would have been far closer than Khan vs Goldsmith.
I wonder if Labour might want to stand a new candidate in 2024 to prevent Khan falling into the Livingstone trap of turning stale and losing.
I've no idea what Jon Stone is trying to say there, but the Cabinet Minister quoted is just stating the obvious truth, that the UK has no interest in putting up any physical controls at the Irish border. Why on earth would we want to? What would we be trying to prevent?
Leonard's biggest challenge is keeping on-side the circa 30% of SLAB's support base which favours independence - he's still relatively unknown outside political circles:
Just had a flutter on George Osborne to be next London Mayor at 40/1.
In 2024 maybe not 2020 on the basis Livingstone and Boris both only served two terms.
If Corbyn wins in 2022 that would boost his chances as he could benefit from a mid term protest vote and he clearly has broader appeal in London at least than the average Tory
Only Livingstone actually stood and lost a 3rd (and 4th) time. Boris stood down. I wonder if he might have won re-election in 2016 had he stood. My gut says probably not, especially as Boris had come out for Leave by that point, but it would have been far closer than Khan vs Goldsmith.
I wonder if Labour might want to stand a new candidate in 2024 to prevent Khan falling into the Livingstone trap of turning stale and losing.
Livingstone the Labour candidate lost after two terms as Mayor, Goldsmith the Tory candidate lost after two terms of a Tory Mayor. In 2024 therefore Osborne would likely have a good chance whoever Labour put up and especially if Corbyn is PM in midterm and West London and suburban Tories are motivated to come out and give Labour a kicking
Tezza at PMQs yesterday was insistent on controlling our borders.*
*terms and exclusions apply, apparently...
For immigration, yes. But since we have the Common Travel Area, and have done for many decades. that is completely irrelevant to Ireland. I can't think of a single person who has suggested that we shouldn't recognise EU standards on goods, so there's nothing to check (except whether people are smuggling guns'n'booze'n'fags of course, but that's no different to now).
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
Oh, so technological solutions are possible? No need for plan C then.
If the UK says the Irish border is unenforceable, as this cabinet minister foolishly asserts*, the EU will prioritise Ireland over all other considerations of trade with the UK. Just because the UK government is grossly irresponsible doesn't mean the other party will be.
* Because presumably he thinks that an argument for option B - technical solutions. It is possible that the Irish/EU have already come to the same conclusion about the impossibility of a managed border.
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
Oh, so technological solutions are possible? No need for plan C then.
What people don't get about plan C is that it is the minimalist option, not the maximalist one. Any plan A or B must be *better* in terms of the NI/Ireland situation, not merely adequate.
Sad to hear the Bolsheviks and Trotskyites are at war. Worthy reminder that the Conservatives do not have a monopoly on disunity.
Yes indeed, and it seems that Corbyn is on the side of the Unions rather than the members. No doubt this is what he meant by the new politics. Goodness only knows what Labour moderates think of the choice before them?
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Lansman wants to transform Labour into a member led organisation.
UNITE do not want this they want Unions to hold sway.
Whose side are PB Tories on given Jennie Formby or JL are the only 2 games in town.
This is the sort of thing why I argue the licence fee is totally broken. The BBC while wed to the telly tax can't compete with the shifts happening in the modern world of content creation.
Murdoch has seen the tectonic plates shifting, and the Sky under new ownership are in an even better position to adapt with the times.
Murdoch is losing the race for Sky, Comcast and Disney have both put more bucks on the table. .
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Tyson gives a wonderful timely example of hypocrisy of the left.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Lansman wants to transform Labour into a member led organisation.
UNITE do not want this they want Unions to hold sway.
Whose side are PB Tories on given Jennie Formby or JL are the only 2 games in town.
Who cares. We're too busy enjoying the sight of the Deputy Leader explaining why he should keep the £1/2 million quid he's trousered from a man whose parents had Hitler at their wedding.
Deliveroo is one business I don't get. It seems a very expensive way to get a takeaway from a crap chain restaurant, but then I wasn't effected by the KFC closures nor care if Nando runs out of chicken / Jamie Italian chain goes bust (other than obviously people losing work).
In principle you get a better meal from Deliveroo than Just Eat because they deal with fine dining (in relative terms) restaurants who see takeaway as another sales channel and don't want to do the delivery themselves. I believe Deliveroo charge those restaurants a 30% commission.
Having looked at the price differences on Deliveroo compared to the actual restaurant menu, I think it is the customers who pay the 30%.
I wouldn't be surprised that both parties are paying Deliveroo. Providing the delivery was their USP, but Just Eat and Uber so so as well now. Thinking about it, I haven't seen a Just Eat delivery rider recently.
Deliveroo strikes me as emblematic of what is wrong with Britain. Youngsters on the gig economy riding in dark and snow to deliver junk food to couch potatoes who would be better off walking to the grocery store then to the kitchen.
No wonder diabetes has doubled in 20 years. It is national suicide by junk food.
Is it any worse than bacon ? Which according to some reports what you read is killing us. Anyways I have for a long time eaten less red meat and become more flexitarianism.
Cured meats such as ham and bacon are more linked to bowel cancer than directly to obesity. Obesity also contributes, but the nitrites in bacon seem to have a specific effect.
Tezza at PMQs yesterday was insistent on controlling our borders.*
*terms and exclusions apply, apparently...
For immigration, yes. But since we have the Common Travel Area, and have done for many decades. that is completely irrelevant to Ireland. I can't think of a single person who has suggested that we shouldn't recognise EU standards on goods, so there's nothing to check (except whether people are smuggling guns'n'booze'n'fags of course, but that's no different to now).
This is the sort of thing why I argue the licence fee is totally broken. The BBC while wed to the telly tax can't compete with the shifts happening in the modern world of content creation.
Murdoch has seen the tectonic plates shifting, and the Sky under new ownership are in an even better position to adapt with the times.
Murdoch is losing the race for Sky, Comcast and Disney have both put more bucks on the table. .
That is what I said....Disney is in the prime position to leverage their existing position to move to the future, hence why he has already sold off $66bn of assets to them.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Personally, I have always found the machine politicians and fixers on the so-called 'moderate'/trade union wing of the Labour Party its least appealing
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
Oh, so technological solutions are possible? No need for plan C then.
What people don't get about plan C is that it is the minimalist option, not the maximalist one. Any plan A or B must be *better* in terms of the NI/Ireland situation, not merely adequate.
Plan C involves the economic annexation of part of the country.
I suppose we could dispense with tiresome things like Westminster and just have the Commission run the country. Much more “minimalist” than present arrangements with layers of elections and MPs and wotnot.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Tyson gives a wonderful timely example of hypocrisy of the left.
Oh come on. The poor man. He was complaining earlier that he was trapped in Florence. Because of Brexit, apparently.
I mean: being trapped in Florence. Have some pity.
Lansman wants to transform Labour into a member led organisation.
Is this an admission that Jeremy Corbyn's election was a cock-up?
And I am not going to get my coat, it's too fecking cold and snowy out there. Even the inside of my woodstore has got snow all over it, it's blowing about harder than a whore Clinton is paying by the orgasm.
Tezza at PMQs yesterday was insistent on controlling our borders.*
*terms and exclusions apply, apparently...
For immigration, yes. But since we have the Common Travel Area, and have done for many decades. that is completely irrelevant to Ireland. I can't think of a single person who has suggested that we shouldn't recognise EU standards on goods, so there's nothing to check (except whether people are smuggling guns'n'booze'n'fags of course, but that's no different to now).
You’re sounding positively HYUFD-ish.
I'm just baffled by the extraordinary contortions which people are adopting to make the Irish border an issue, when it clearly isn't. To repeat my question, why on earth would the UK want to put up border checks? There will literally be nothing to check if we have a trade agreement, and even in a no-deal WTO scenario, it wouldn't be worth doing physical checks since tariffs could be collected by a self-declaratory system and we're not going to exclude EU-compliant goods in any conceivable scenario.
I appreciate that most people going on about the border are purely using it as a crude attempt to undermine Brexit or attack Theresa May, but even allowing for that, it's such a completely feeble argument that I'm astonished anyone can keep a straight face when deploying it. There are plenty of other, much more difficult issues to worry about.
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
Oh, so technological solutions are possible? No need for plan C then.
What people don't get about plan C is that it is the minimalist option, not the maximalist one. Any plan A or B must be *better* in terms of the NI/Ireland situation, not merely adequate.
Plan C involves the economic annexation of part of the country.
I suppose we could dispense with tiresome things like Westminster and just have the Commission run the country. Much more “minimalist” than present arrangements with layers of elections and MPs and wotnot.
Plan C involves a continuation of the status quo inasmuch as it affects Northern Ireland to the extent necessary to maintain the Good Friday Agreement and the all-island economy. It's the minimum necessary.
Alternatively there could be Plan A - an agreement that the UK as a whole maintain at least as close a relationship with the EU as covered by Plan C. Or Plan B - a specific solution for Northern Ireland, in other words the population of Northern Ireland could vote for unification.
Blair’s speech is fascinating. It’s a clear, logical argument for why Europe makes sense for Britain in the world today and the world to come.
Who knows what would have happened if Cameron had actually made a positive case for Europe? He certainly couldn’t have done it in the 4 months he gave himself.
Tezza at PMQs yesterday was insistent on controlling our borders.*
*terms and exclusions apply, apparently...
For immigration, yes. But since we have the Common Travel Area, and have done for many decades. that is completely irrelevant to Ireland. I can't think of a single person who has suggested that we shouldn't recognise EU standards on goods, so there's nothing to check (except whether people are smuggling guns'n'booze'n'fags of course, but that's no different to now).
You’re sounding positively HYUFD-ish.
I'm just baffled by the extraordinary contortions which people are adopting to make the Irish border an issue, when it clearly isn't. To repeat my question, why on earth would the UK want to put up border checks? There will literally be nothing to check if we have a trade agreement, and even in a no-deal WTO scenario, it wouldn't be worth doing physical checks since tariffs could be collected by a self-declaratory system and we're not going to exclude EU-compliant goods in any conceivable scenario.
I appreciate that most people going on about the border are purely using it as a crude attempt to undermine Brexit or attack Theresa May, but even allowing for that, it's such a completely feeble argument that I'm astonished anyone can keep a straight face when deploying it. There are plenty of other, much more difficult issues to worry about.
It's a national security issue for Ireland and they have every right to negotiate in the way that they are, especially when people on the UK side openly push for Irexit or treating Northern Ireland as an ungoverned space.
I see that satire truly is dead. @tyson claims he doesn't do personal attacks, and Jon Lansman says he is standing as General Sec of the Labour Party in order to help Jeremy Corbyn sweep away the old machine politics.
Lansman wants to transform Labour into a member led organisation.
UNITE do not want this they want Unions to hold sway.
Whose side are PB Tories on given Jennie Formby or JL are the only 2 games in town.
Who cares. We're too busy enjoying the sight of the Deputy Leader explaining why he should keep the £1/2 million quid he's trousered from a man whose parents had Hitler at their wedding.
Surely he can not be blamed for who his parents invited to their wedding ?
It's a national security issue for Ireland and they have every right to negotiate in the way that they are, especially when people on the UK side openly push for Irexit or treating Northern Ireland as an ungoverned space.
They can do what they like, of course, but that doesn't alter the fact the UK has no interest in putting up border controls. If the EU and Ireland want to, well, that would be a great pity, but they have no need to in any scenario. (Cue the usual nonsense about EU regulations requiring inspections. Who sets EU regulations?)
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
If the border is unenforceable as the UK cabinet minister asserts, the EU will double down on technical solutions to manage it. Common regulation across Ireland would be the only workable solution.
Oh, so technological solutions are possible? No need for plan C then.
What people don't get about plan C is that it is the minimalist option, not the maximalist one. Any plan A or B must be *better* in terms of the NI/Ireland situation, not merely adequate.
Plan C involves the economic annexation of part of the country.
I suppose we could dispense with tiresome things like Westminster and just have the Commission run the country. Much more “minimalist” than present arrangements with layers of elections and MPs and wotnot.
Plan C involves a continuation of the status quo inasmuch as it affects Northern Ireland to the extent necessary to maintain the Good Friday Agreement and the all-island economy. It's the minimum necessary.
Alternatively there could be Plan A - an agreement that the UK as a whole maintain at least as close a relationship with the EU as covered by Plan C. Or Plan B - a specific solution for Northern Ireland, in other words the population of Northern Ireland could vote for unification.
Does not the GFA say NI will not transfer its sovereignty without NI saying so? If so the Commission’s crackpot, malign, and aggressive stance ( even if it’s an opening gambit for negotiations) has all the aerodynamics of half a house brick without that consent, as Ms Foster will doubtless tell them at full volume. I don’t blame her.
There again the EU isn’t big on consent of the governed is it?
Tezza at PMQs yesterday was insistent on controlling our borders.*
*terms and exclusions apply, apparently...
For immigration, yes. But since we have the Common Travel Area, and have done for many decades. that is completely irrelevant to Ireland. I can't think of a single person who has suggested that we shouldn't recognise EU standards on goods, so there's nothing to check (except whether people are smuggling guns'n'booze'n'fags of course, but that's no different to now).
You’re sounding positively HYUFD-ish.
I'm just baffled by the extraordinary contortions which people are adopting to make the Irish border an issue, when it clearly isn't. To repeat my question, why on earth would the UK want to put up border checks? There will literally be nothing to check if we have a trade agreement, and even in a no-deal WTO scenario, it wouldn't be worth doing physical checks since tariffs could be collected by a self-declaratory system and we're not going to exclude EU-compliant goods in any conceivable scenario.
I appreciate that most people going on about the border are purely using it as a crude attempt to undermine Brexit or attack Theresa May, but even allowing for that, it's such a completely feeble argument that I'm astonished anyone can keep a straight face when deploying it. There are plenty of other, much more difficult issues to worry about.
First, you are ignoring the history of the island of Ireland. Secondly, there is an inherent contradiction which makes people throw up their hands in frustration: we Brexited to take back control. But for the Irish border, we don't want to take back control so won't take back control even though in theory we could take back control.
There is your metaphor for the whole of Brexit.
We theoretically might or might not be able to do something, but the practicality and illogicality of doing it means that we won't do it. So we are in the status quo ante. And all for what? For absolutely nothing, because all the things we have grown to value, live with and accept, we are nominally throwing away only to try to recreate it exactly as it was before we started.
Comments
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5449399/Culture-Secretary-cancels-second-Leveson-Inquiry.html
Obviously when Jezza comes in and closes all the free press he doesn't like this will be immaterial, but this particular rule was bonkers. If the press prints lies they should pay, but if they don't, they shouldn't be liable for the other sides costs.
I suspect his message would be drowned out if he goes this week - he's smart enough to choose a better time surely?
Murdoch is going to do everything in his considerable power to get Mosley in front of a judge on a perjury charge.
This is clearly mad, but still an improvement on what the government is actually doing.
3/1?
And then it should have taken the initiative by setting out what it wanted, what it would offer and how - in detail - it would get to wherever it wanted to be. Of course the EU might still have reacted in the way you describe but there might also have been a chance of them seeing that there was a serious grown up thoughtful interlocutor on the other side of the table. Not arrogant, incompetent amateurs like Johnson, Davis and Fox who, whatever your view on Brexit, shame this country.
And it could also have had the conversation with the country it needed to, to explain the destination, the trade offs, the complexities etc and it could have got some of those on the losing side on board or at least not so hostile. And it should have leveraged the skills and advice of people from across the political spectrum including those opposed to Brexit, because frankly it needed all the help it could got.
It did none of those things and now the government and the country are boxed into a corner.
Even if Brexit was not your choice there was a much more intelligent and thoughtful way of going about it than what we have seen.
https://twitter.com/SirBasilBrush/status/969227448901623808
A bloody silly justification IMO. So what if there were some UK MEPs. It might have annoyed the EU but big deal. Far more important was working out what we wanted which, some 21 months after the referendum, we still have not done.......
But as I and many others are having to come to terms with, we lost because we played a rational game when the battleground was elsewhere.
That report was publicised at the time, and does not describe a frictionless border so it is not a viable solution.
If the Tories wanted to get <30% of the vote in London, Osborne would be a good choice.
Not delivering Brexit would kill the Tory brand stone dead. So no chance.
I pointed out on this forum that refusing to budge was a better BATNA (best alternative to negotiated agreement) but was told, just as well I wasn't doing the negotiations. (they may be right about that).
It would be nice to have a national rational policy instead of watching the loons rub themselves against the furniture as they get excited by the thought of post-Brexit aka 1957 mk2.
The only consolation left to me is watching JRM et al's increasing desperation as it all falls apart as reality refuses to negotiate with fantasy.
No wonder diabetes has doubled in 20 years. It is national suicide by junk food.
Oh of course - they get paid no matter what shite appears on our screens
It seems sadly inevitable that the Northern Irish will be worse off as a result of whatever's put in place, hi-tech or otherwise.
If Corbyn wins in 2022 that would boost his chances as he could benefit from a mid term protest vote and he clearly has broader appeal in London at least than the average Tory
Reality bites for Barmy Barnier
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-northern-ireland-border-brexit-eu-hard-no-deal-cabinet-irish-a8235096.html?amp&__twitter_impression=true
Britain would refuse to enforce any new border in Ireland even if there is a ‘no deal’ Brexit, a Cabinet minister has told The Independent.
With the EU saying this week that a border is the only option if Britain refuses to stay aligned with European customs and regulation, the minister added: “If they want to put up a border, let them try.”
[sotto voce] except that one...
Since Brexit London has become such a solid Labour city that I don't see anyone under an official Conservative label winning a mayoral election again for decades to come, even for "out of the box" Tory candidates like Boris or Osborne.
For the foreseeable future IMO, Labour would only be beatable from the right by an independent.
At the moment Khan's approval ratings are excellent and given the Labour dominance of London right now he's a total shoo-in for re-election in 2020.
UNITE do not want this they want Unions to hold sway.
Whose side are PB Tories on given Jennie Formby or JL are the only 2 games in town.
No wonder the Indy is down he tubes if their journos spend more time tweeting their virtue than reporting the news.
I wonder if Labour might want to stand a new candidate in 2024 to prevent Khan falling into the Livingstone trap of turning stale and losing.
https://twitter.com/DanielJHannan/status/969229640400326656
https://twitter.com/DanielJHannan/status/969248291882926080
https://inews.co.uk/news/scotland/richard-leonard-scots-wont-vote-im-english/
No Al-Beeb "even-handedness"; no Lib-Dhimmy 'bar-chart'? Events occur and grown-ups handle them.
So what do you do? Markets are fun for short-term gains: Invest long.
Tezza at PMQs yesterday was insistent on controlling our borders.*
*terms and exclusions apply, apparently...
Question - who will be manning this hard border ? The Gardai or crack EU troops from the 1690th Molenbeek fusiliers ??
It would always be shut because control means closed.
Like the EU - it would be useless.
* Because presumably he thinks that an argument for option B - technical solutions. It is possible that the Irish/EU have already come to the same conclusion about the impossibility of a managed border.
Lansman wants to transform labour alright
I suppose we could dispense with tiresome things like Westminster and just have the Commission run the country. Much more “minimalist” than present arrangements with layers of elections and MPs and wotnot.
https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/969249928051642370
I mean: being trapped in Florence. Have some pity.
And I am not going to get my coat, it's too fecking cold and snowy out there. Even the inside of my woodstore has got snow all over it, it's blowing about harder than a whore Clinton is paying by the orgasm.
I appreciate that most people going on about the border are purely using it as a crude attempt to undermine Brexit or attack Theresa May, but even allowing for that, it's such a completely feeble argument that I'm astonished anyone can keep a straight face when deploying it. There are plenty of other, much more difficult issues to worry about.
What's the latest on the boundary review?
Edit - no, my apologies, it can't be the SNP figure is too high if it's 600. That said it's 26 short not 53.
Alternatively there could be Plan A - an agreement that the UK as a whole maintain at least as close a relationship with the EU as covered by Plan C. Or Plan B - a specific solution for Northern Ireland, in other words the population of Northern Ireland could vote for unification.
Blair’s speech is fascinating. It’s a clear, logical argument for why Europe makes sense for Britain in the world today and the world to come.
Who knows what would have happened if Cameron had actually made a positive case for Europe? He certainly couldn’t have done it in the 4 months he gave himself.
https://order-order.com/2018/03/01/karl-marx-clothing-range-launched-corbynista-kids/
There again the EU isn’t big on consent of the governed is it?
There is your metaphor for the whole of Brexit.
We theoretically might or might not be able to do something, but the practicality and illogicality of doing it means that we won't do it. So we are in the status quo ante. And all for what? For absolutely nothing, because all the things we have grown to value, live with and accept, we are nominally throwing away only to try to recreate it exactly as it was before we started.
It is the very definition of bonkers.