David Winnick argues it would be hypocrital not to speak against her record today (EdM warned MPs to be respectful today).
I see no contradiction in while acknowledging Thatcher's service and electoral success also criticising her record. She loved a good argument and would be sorely disappointed if Skinner did not take a pop at her today.
It's the Opposition Front Bench, scared of their own shadow, and the "I'd rather be tortured" stay away MPs who look foolish.
I agree overall. However, I understand it can be difficult to make criticisms of someone else's record while others are mourning. Especially as said criticism it has already made in the past and it will be made again in the future anyway. So it can be tempting not to say anything at all.
I guess that's probably why some argues that today's sitting is pointless.
More of a recognition poll that. I wonder if it affected the voting intention this morning.
Also, the idea football should hold a minute silence this weekend for someone who eyed it with suspicion is laughable.
It would not be respected at any ground, so let's not subject ourselves to such unedifying spectacles to please the whims of egotistical rich men. Whelan and Madejski need to wind their necks in.
The football ID card scheme she was going to introduce until Hillsbrough stopped her in her tracks would have killed football. She was not a fan, to say the least.
Morris, you forget we own 10% of the UK instituition known as the Bank of England. Just because they did not change the name does not mean it belongs to England only.
B ut shouldn't you be taking your share and setting up your own bank ? Really there's no benefit in staying in the BoE, better to do a clean split.
Mr. G, you can't leave a club and retain a say in how the rules are made. You don't get to divorce and then keep dipping into a joint account.
If you want separation, that's your choice, but you can't then plead for any rescue from financial disaster from the UK. [I suspect a deal on MPC representation could occur in exchange for a time to relocate Trident].
David Winnick argues it would be hypocrital not to speak against her record today (EdM warned MPs to be respectful today).
I see no contradiction in while acknowledging Thatcher's service and electoral success also criticising her record. She loved a good argument and would be sorely disappointed if Skinner did not take a pop at her today.
It's the Opposition Front Bench, scared of their own shadow, and the "I'd rather be tortured" stay away MPs who look foolish.
The club have now said they were proposing to have a minute's silence for the 24th Hillsborough anniversary anyway (though there was no mention of this previously). Which raises the possibility of it being combined.
.
That is emotional blackmail. Madejski is fantastically out of touch.
The thing is, Madejski isn't the owner any more, more a harmless and powerless figurehead. I can't see Thatcher's name being mentioned at the game, but in the cacophane that is the Madejski Stadium prior to kickoff, I can forsee some not hearing what the minutes silence is for and booing right through it. Thing it would be best to just drop it all together
Mr. G, you can't leave a club and retain a say in how the rules are made. You don't get to divorce and then keep dipping into a joint account.
If you want separation, that's your choice, but you can't then plead for any rescue from financial disaster from the UK. [I suspect a deal on MPC representation could occur in exchange for a time to relocate Trident].
No need to do a deal on Trident. If Salmond wants to stay in Nato and set up US bases, you can reasonably expect your ally to cut you some slack, it's what alliances do. So relocation to a reasonable timetable.
I see R5 is having a phone-in about Mrs T's funeral costs. Tasteless. Just tasteless.
On the day of her death, the BBC was quite balanced but, regrettably, they have subsequently reverted to type with almost 100% negative coverage. One of the main stories on the website today is that an australian who I've never heard of thinks she's a racist.
Their first contributor is Ken Livingstone... It's just so predictable. I'm switching it off again.
Look on the bright side - this is probably the last time he'll be wheeled out as a commentator....let the old fool enjoy his last hurrah - reminding us each time who won the argument.....
I agree with Harry Mount's logic here. But I'd say its more about self-reliance and self-respect which is why Old Labour and Tory have certain shared Methodist/Protestant views.
"Part of the reason is that conservatives accept the unfairnesses and shortcomings of the world as an inevitable reflection of the human condition. In their understanding that public spending cannot be infinite, that there must be some realistic restraint on altruistic impulses, they are often thought to be ruthless and heartless.
That supposed heartlessness is, more often than not, pragmatism. Margaret Thatcher didn't actively want to put lots of miners out of work, as those who celebrated her death might think. What she saw, in an utterly pragmatic way, was that there was no economic sense in propping up a failing industry – she didn't close down the mines; she refused to go on subsidising them. If they had been making money, they would still be open today.
The knowledge that their pragmatic, economic good sense is often perceived as being heartless often makes conservatives rather diffident, self-effacing and apologetic – all nice characteristics (although, it must be said, Margaret Thatcher, for all her personal kindness and decency, didn't have these particular qualities in abundance).
It's the other way round on the Left. Because you are always advocating milk and honey for the oppressed – even if that milk and honey is economically unaffordable or impossible to get hold of – you are protected by a forcefield of advertised niceness. With your public goodness established, you can then allow yourself all the personal bile in the world – by, say, opening a bottle of champagne on the death of a frail, 87-year-old woman.
David Winnick argues it would be hypocrital not to speak against her record today (EdM warned MPs to be respectful today).
I see no contradiction in while acknowledging Thatcher's service and electoral success also criticising her record. She loved a good argument and would be sorely disappointed if Skinner did not take a pop at her today.
It's the Opposition Front Bench, scared of their own shadow, and the "I'd rather be tortured" stay away MPs who look foolish.
I agree overall. However, I understand it can be difficult to make criticisms of someone else's record while others are mourning. Especially as said criticism it has already made in the past and it will be made again in the future anyway. So it can be tempting not to say anything at all.
I guess that's probably why some argues that today's sitting is pointless.
There are perfectly respectful ways of disagreeing with someone's record. What I suspect is that some on the left may be struggling with is an inability to see any redeeming features in Thatcher's record (in the same way that some on the right are blind to her failings) - and they would probably be wiser to keep their own council today.
tonight South Shields Labour select their candidate. All CLP grandees are backing Mark Walsh who must start as favourite.
There's a by-election in Luton too....on a Wednesday instead of the usual Thursday. It should be a LD hold as they comfortably won that ward in 2011 (which was one of their poorest years overall).
I see R5 is having a phone-in about Mrs T's funeral costs. Tasteless. Just tasteless.
On the day of her death, the BBC was quite balanced but, regrettably, they have subsequently reverted to type with almost 100% negative coverage. One of the main stories on the website today is that an australian who I've never heard of thinks she's a racist.
Their first contributor is Ken Livingstone... It's just so predictable. I'm switching it off again.
Look on the bright side - this is probably the last time he'll be wheeled out as a commentator....let the old fool enjoy his last hurrah - reminding us each time who won the argument.....
I recall being at college in London whilst the GLC was on its last legs and banners were hung from its HQ - along with CND posters and Nuclear Free Zone signs declaring places like Lambeth to be immune from a Soviet strike.
It was laughable loony left stuff that unfortunately many today never saw with their own eyes.
David Winnick argues it would be hypocrital not to speak against her record today (EdM warned MPs to be respectful today).
I see no contradiction in while acknowledging Thatcher's service and electoral success also criticising her record. She loved a good argument and would be sorely disappointed if Skinner did not take a pop at her today.
It's the Opposition Front Bench, scared of their own shadow, and the "I'd rather be tortured" stay away MPs who look foolish.
I agree overall. However, I understand it can be difficult to make criticisms of someone else's record while others are mourning. Especially as said criticism it has already made in the past and it will be made again in the future anyway. So it can be tempting not to say anything at all.
I guess that's probably why some argues that today's sitting is pointless.
There are perfectly respectful ways of disagreeing with someone's record. What I suspect is that some on the left may be struggling with is an inability to see any redeeming features in Thatcher's record
Nah, Kinnock said she's important because she was the first female PM :-)
As far as football and Thatcher goes, one account I saw in the papers years ago said that after Hillsborough, the football bosses told Thatcher she ought to largely ignore the Taylor report recommendations - 'You might not realise, being a woman, but all-seater grounds would ruin the game', etc. Thatcher, unsurprisingly, ignored the football bosses, and implemented all-seater grounds.
If this account is true, she did a lot for football fans.
Thanks to JohnLoony and surbiton for their advice yesterday on the local candidates' squabble over nomination by an ex-local resident. I came to the same conclusion - the ERO doesn't need to investigate whether everyone who signs a nomination paper is still local, so long as they've not yet dropped off the electoral roll. It's of course a political point that the rival can make if he wants, though I doubt if voters will care.
Wonder if Bercow will call for George Galloway to speak in the HOC today ? If the opposition benches are not attended by many who wish to speak, then I can't see how Bercow can ignore MP's who might not be so kind in their assessment of Mrs T's period as PM.
Anyone claiming that Baroness Thatcher should not get a cermonial-funeral would better spend their time studying some history: The Iron Duke had a state-funeral despite the turmoil he brought to many "workers" and "Oirish". Still, it's the usual ill-informed that are posting their vaste lack-of-knowledge; and they are beyond help....
I think that Wellington got his state funeral for his military prowress against the French, rather than for his political position. Douglas Haig had a state funeral in the 1920's for similar reasons.
Winston Churchill had a state funeral in 1965, but he was a genuine exception. Politicians are by their very nature representative of one part of society, not its entirety. I would prefer that State funerals are reserved for the Royal Family, and exceptional military leaders, not politicians.
Hmmm - ceremonial funerals based on subjective political judgements do not sound like a good idea to me. There is either an accepted criteria or there is not.
A ceremonial funeral for one of the most indisputably divisive PMs of modern times could almost be a master strategy devised by Osbrowne. It certainly bodes well for the scottish tory surge predicted by the more amusing PB tories.
You mean the UK bank that Scotland owns 10% of at present. From the way the unionists go on you would think it belonged to England only , I know it requires a few brain cells to go beyond the name but give it a try.
Assets maybe Unckie Malc' but not much more. Does England own 84% of Holyrood Parish Assembly-Hall...?
RT @DPJHodges: If you want to gauge how insane the left's hatred of Mrs T is, pop over to @owenjones84 timeline. He's tweeting nice things about Blair.
Mr. Palmer, it's possible that welfare is a shy issue, by which I mean there's a 'nice' and a 'nasty' response, and that people are more likely to fib if they believe it should be slashed.
Overseas aid probably isn't directly comparable, because that's about the UK and Everywhere Else, whereas welfare here is about British benefits for British temporarily unemployed/ill and disabled/scrounger/slackers.
You may well be right. But what I meant was that we have sufficient polling data from last week when the welfare debate was raging to suggest that it hadn't helped the Conservaitve voting intention level - if anything, slightly the reverse. It's too soon to tell whether the Thatcher coverage will do so, though it's reasonable to assume a short-term boost.
David Winnick argues it would be hypocrital not to speak against her record today (EdM warned MPs to be respectful today).
I see no contradiction in while acknowledging Thatcher's service and electoral success also criticising her record. She loved a good argument and would be sorely disappointed if Skinner did not take a pop at her today.
It's the Opposition Front Bench, scared of their own shadow, and the "I'd rather be tortured" stay away MPs who look foolish.
I agree overall. However, I understand it can be difficult to make criticisms of someone else's record while others are mourning. Especially as said criticism it has already made in the past and it will be made again in the future anyway. So it can be tempting not to say anything at all.
I guess that's probably why some argues that today's sitting is pointless.
There are perfectly respectful ways of disagreeing with someone's record. What I suspect is that some on the left may be struggling with is an inability to see any redeeming features in Thatcher's record
Nah, Kinnock said she's important because she was the first female PM :-)
Yes - he's been determined to harm his own reputation in his recent comments!
Many people hated Thatcher. Some for understandable reasons, some not.
You need to get over it and move on.
Isn't it the left that needs to get over it ? She's been out of office for 23 years and you still harp on about her. Now she's permanently left the scene will it be move on or can you still not let go ? That must have been one traumatic defeat.
Many people hated Thatcher. Some for understandable reasons, some not.
You need to get over it and move on.
I think you need to go first ;^ ) Labour are still blaming her over 2 decades after she stood down. When you catch Non-Labour voters bitching about Brown and Blair in 20yrs time, feel free to call me out...
Many people hated Thatcher. Some for understandable reasons, some not.
You need to get over it and move on.
I think you need to go first ;^ ) Labour are still blaming her over 2 decades after she stood down. When you catch Non-Labour voters bitching about Brown and Blair in 20yrs time, feel free to call me out...
You do seem to be verging on trolling today. Perfectly reasonable to talk about Thatcher at the moment. And the last time I checked it's still legal to be critical of her.
Wonder if Bercow will call for George Galloway to speak in the HOC today ? If the opposition benches are not attended by many who wish to speak, then I can't see how Bercow can ignore MP's who might not be so kind in their assessment of Mrs T's period as PM.
I think Galloway has said he will not go to the HoC today (no change there then...) - his thoughts on Thatcher on the radio:
NIESR predicts 0.1pc growth in Q1. That's a knife edge between triple dip and not triple dip. NIESR have a pretty good record at predicting growth in quarters that the ONS report on. And its notable that the initial ONS number has sometimes undershot the NIESR forecast in previous quarters. So we could still see that unwanted record confirmed by the ONS in two weeks time.
The triple dip in and of itself won't change much economically. Overall we'd be pretty much where we have been these last two wasted years.
The political impact will be more devastating. And rightly so.
Thanks for that. The dramatisation of Lauda's crash at the Nurgburging gave me goose pimples. I hope Edwards, Merzario, Erlt and Lunger get all the credit they deserve for risking themselves in the flames to get him out.
I think I'll take the rest of the morning off and rewatch Senna, and say goodbye once more to the Prof.
"The problem is Thatcher encouraged the police to behave that way."
Presumably Wilson, Heath, Wilson again and Callaghan did likewise.
Football hooliganism started in the 1960s.
Perhaps Thatcher also encouraged the French police to behave that way against Leeds fans in 1975 etc, etc, etc?
As a Chelsea fan who went to a lot of games around in that era, from 1963 but virtually every game home and away from 1978-1986, I agree totally with the above post.
Some of the biggest riots I witnessed were in the late 60's and early 70's, particularly the Battle of Park Lane in 1967 and West Ham v Man Utd in 1968. It wasn't until the early 80's that the police started to really get their act together, and Luton was when the government finally said enough was enough.
As for the police I don't know where any supposed brutality comes from, bearing mind I was at a lot of games where full scale riots broke out, in most cases they just behaved as appropriate in the circumstances. In many cases the police came under sustained attack, Millwall fans are renowned for taking on the police.
Don't think football hooliganism has gone away either, it's much more organised, much smaller scale but is still there. Chelsea v Cardiff in 2010 is one example, only last weekend there was major trouble at a Luton match.
OGH 7th April "If stepping up the rhetoric on welfare was supposed to boost CON poll ratings it has yet to work" "Today's YouGov for Sunday Times. CON 30, LAB 40, LD 11, UKIP 13. So Tories 1% above low point with firm"
OGH 10th April "Labour’s YouGov lead down to 8pc – but it is too early to say that it’s Philpott, welfare, Mrs Thatcher or just normal margin of error" CON 33%: LAB 41%: LD 10%: Ukip 10%.
Crikey - Jeremy Kyle is a parody of itself FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT!
Then most of the guests have walked out or been escorted off the set by bouncers and there's so much beeping out of swearing that its like a Norman Collier sketch.
Not what, after 23 years, you'd call 'the long view...'
Compare & contrast with what Thatcher said when Foot died:
Baroness Thatcher, who clashed with Mr Foot many times in the 1980s, said she was very sorry to hear of his death, calling him 'a great parliamentarian and a man of high principles'.
"Margaret Thatcher, who defeated Callaghan in 1979, said: "Jim Callaghan was a formidable opponent, one who could best me across the dispatch box. In other circumstances he would have been a successful prime minster.
"He was a superb party manager. Despite our disagreements, I always respected him because I knew he was moved by deep patriotism."
"I believe that history will remember him for the sharpness and shrewdness of his mind; for his two periods of service as Prime Minister in difficult circumstances; and for his energy and enthusiasm, as well as for his many achievements. And also, perhaps here of all places, he will be remembered for his wit and his humour--often shown to such devastating effect on the Floor of the House. But that is the public man. His friends who knew him well speak also of the private man--of his great personal kindnesses and generosity. He expected loyalty from those around him and he offered it in full measure in return."
I can't recall who punned it on Twitter but it made me laugh.
Annoy the Argies by renaming the Falklands La Margaritas.
Classic ! :-)
The Falklands already have a public holiday on January 10th known as Margaret Thatcher day. It commemorates her visit to the Islands after the war was concluded.
It is worth noting that Mrs Thatcher not only liberated the Falklands, she liberated Argentina by causing the collapse of the military junta that had killed several thousand by extrajudicial execution. I dont expect that the democrats in Argentina are grateful, no one likes their liberators, witness the French and UK and USA.
Mr. Jessop, before my time but isn't Prost the Prof?
There was only one Prof in F1, called such by the drivers, mechanics and team owners. Sid Watkins. The media may have called Prost 'the professor', but from everything I've heard, 'Prof' in the paddock meant Sid.
There's a quote somewhere where Prost himself says so.
He is missed. A true great amongst men, and someone who changed motorsport safety forever.
Talking of Italy - any chance of a government yet?
Nah. Besani and Berlusconi met yesterday. But it was just to discuss new President of Republic choice. Now they seem to be focused on that . Voting starts on April 18th...after the new President is installed, I think we will have the last words: a government or new elections.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
We have a Morrisons in our village. Although the staff are generally polite and helpful, the standards of service are somewhat poor, especially when it comes to opening checkouts to relieve queues. I used to like shopping in other Morrisons occasionally ten or do years ago; but the character of the place has declined.
I dislike the automated checkout machines, as it advantages no-one but supermarket's bottom line. But if they are to have them, and to reduce the number of checkouts open, they should be reliable and not break down frequently.
And it does not seem particularly cheap, either.
We are getting a small convenience Co-Op store just down the road from us this year. I expect it to do very well - Morrisons have annoyed many of the locals over the years whilst they had a monopoly (the next convenient large store being in St Neots, seven miles away).
You mean the UK bank that Scotland owns 10% of at present. From the way the unionists go on you would think it belonged to England only , I know it requires a few brain cells to go beyond the name but give it a try.
Assets maybe Unckie Malc' but not much more. Does England own 84% of Holyrood Parish Assembly-Hall...?
Fluffy everything is shared, it will be interesting to see what our 10% of London comes to , get back some of our stole baubles as well. Which 10% of the embassies will we choose and hopefully we can get the Tories to keep all the rubbish bits we do not want.
This is spot on. If Dan Hodges stood for Parliament, I'd be tempted to vote for him.
"This morning the Today Programme reported that today’s special parliamentary session in honour of Margaret Thatcher will be a "difficult one" for Ed Miliband. The gist of its correspondent’s comments were that Labour’s leader had a tricky job in striking a respectful tone, but remembering the antipathy with which Mrs Thatcher was viewed by many on the Left.
It isn’t “difficult” at all. He stands up, he says nice things about Margaret Thatcher, he sits down again. And for once – just for once – he tells the Left to shove its antipathy where the sun doesn’t shine.
This week we are seeing the Labour Party at its worst. Childish. Petty. Self-indulgent. All the attributes, in fact, that handed Margaret Thatcher three successive general election victories on a plate. Since Mrs Thatcher’s death was announced, many in the Labour movement – me included – have been imploring others on the Left to mark her passing with the respect and dignity it deserves. Fat chance.
In Brixton, a “party” to celebrate her death ended with the looting of a charity shop. When the Daily Mail splashed on this on its front page last night, the reaction of most Labour supporters on Twitter who commented was to condemn the Daily Mail, rather than the vandals.
Yesterday Ed Miliband apparently had to issue a statement, urging his MPs to act with decorum in today’s parliamentary session. While he was doing that, the Durham Miners association – whose gala Miliband attended with much fanfare last year – announced they would be booking bands, comedians and holding a party to “rejoice” on the day of her funeral.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
LOL, neither of you have a clue and obviously did not really grow up in the 70's. It was a great time , plenty of jobs , cheap housing, cheap petrol and best of all cheap beer. Only way it could have been improved is for Scotland to have won the world cup in Argentina. The 70's were superb.
When Morrisons bought Safeway (mainly southern UK), it changed the Safeway product mix to more of the northern Morrisons product mix - pies and more pies, cakes, biscuits, chocolate and sweets etc. It is still struggling to recognise that the requirements of the southern UK shopper are often different to those of its northern stronghold.
The redundancies mentioned in the Guardian are due to technology and cheaper employment costs outside the UK. Not much can be done about those until we reduce employment costs in the UK to be more competitive globally.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
The three day week was under the Heath govt, due to a miners strike. That strike was about pay. By the early eighties miners were some of the best paid manual workers. It was tough work but in part the reason that pits were not financially viable, labour being a major cost.
I agree though that Britain was a divided country in the Seventies, there was little social harmony before her premiership. Mrs T was the product of those times. The Unions sowed the wind and reaped the whirlwind. She fought all her life and was a strong opoonent. I did not like her humourlessness and ruthlessness, but can see the need for what she did. The Left hate her because she was so effective that Socialism in its sixties and seventies form will never rise again. Like Cromwell she was mean enough to complete the job.
You mean the UK bank that Scotland owns 10% of at present. From the way the unionists go on you would think it belonged to England only , I know it requires a few brain cells to go beyond the name but give it a try.
Assets maybe Unckie Malc' but not much more. Does England own 84% of Holyrood Parish Assembly-Hall...?
Fluffy everything is shared, it will be interesting to see what our 10% of London comes to , get back some of our stole baubles as well. Which 10% of the embassies will we choose and hopefully we can get the Tories to keep all the rubbish bits we do not want.
It's a very minor point, but if Scotland becomes independent, I'm wondering what happens to Cape Wrath and its associated military ranges. There's a great deal of controversy at the moment because the MOD is trying to buy the remaining land around the lighthouse.
Cape Wrath is NATO's only combined operations practice area in the northern hemisphere. They won't want to see it go, but there are environmental and access concerns as well. It'd be interesting to see the way an independent government takes it.
Fluffy everything is shared, it will be interesting to see what our 10% of London comes to , get back some of our stole baubles as well. Which 10% of the embassies will we choose and hopefully we can get the Tories to keep all the rubbish bits we do not want.
[Fixed block...!]
Unckie Malc', The BoE is a company. It's major shareholder is a Mr Englandshire and he has nominated the Board of Directors. Together they agree to de-merge their Scottish operations.
Whatcha' gonna' do?
You may choose to keep Sterling but that means nothing regarding governance of England's currency. Does Serbia have a seat on the ECB? Does the British Virgin Isles have a seat on the Federal Reserve? Why should Scotland - a sovereign nation to-be - expect to be treated any differently...?
Oh, another thing: Not all things are to be shared (as they ain't paid for). Scotland will probably not want any PFI-ed RBS Voyager MRTTs and will find itself having to finance more than 8.4% of the [post-2016] PFI-ed Search-and-Rescue services. Sovereignty comes with costs attached....
Whether it was Wilson or Heath or then Callaghan - they were as bad and weak as each other when it came to grasping the nettle.
They all had their good points and talents - but dealing with what became the Sick Man of Europe wasn't one of them. Mrs T took off the gloves and faced it down. There was fall-out, but it needed to be done.
My FiL was made redundant and out of work for 3yrs around the Miner's Strike - and the local branch sec of TASS. He also went to the local Conservative Club and played snooker with his mates - he knew and they knew that the thuggery/closed shop/show of hands was fundamentally wrong. They'd never ever indulge in the Thatcher bashing on display today even if they'd never vote Tory.
Assets maybe Unckie Malc' but not much more. Does England own 84% of Holyrood Parish Assembly-Hall...?
Fluffy everything is shared, it will be interesting to see what our 10% of London comes to , get back some of our stole baubles as well. Which 10% of the embassies will we choose and hopefully we can get the Tories to keep all the rubbish bits we do not want.
Unckie Malc', The BoE is a company. It's major shareholder is a Mr Englandshire and he has nominated the Board of Directors. Together they agree to de-merge their Scottish operations.
Whatcha' gonna' do?
You may choose to keep Sterling but that means nothing regarding governance of England's currency. Does Serbia have a seat on the ECB? Does the British Virgin Isles have a seat on the Federal Reserve? Why should Scotland - a sovereign nation to-be - expect to be treated any differently...?
Fluffy , now you have moved on to a different topic. There will indeed need to be lots of discussions on how the changes to the UK treasury is split , rules changed , whether it continues for all owners or if new institutions need to be formed. The discussions will be interesting , but unlike the views on here it will not just be a case of England deciding what they will do with the shared UK assets.
@plato "This is spot on. If Dan Hodges stood for Parliament, I'd be tempted to vote for him."
....This morning the Today Programme reported that today’s special parliamentary session in honour of Margaret Thatcher will be a "difficult one" for Ed Miliband.... .....This week we are seeing the Labour Party at its worst.... ...In Brixton, a “party” to celebrate her death ended with the looting of a charity shop...
From Ed Miliband to the looting of a charity shop in three graceful leaps.
Never mind that the latter has Sweet. F. A. To do with Miliband or Labour.
Hodges is an idiot, spoon feeding garbage to the gullible and stupid.
You mean the UK bank that Scotland owns 10% of at present. From the way the unionists go on you would think it belonged to England only , I know it requires a few brain cells to go beyond the name but give it a try.
Assets maybe Unckie Malc' but not much more. Does England own 84% of Holyrood Parish Assembly-Hall...?
Fluffy everything is shared, it will be interesting to see what our 10% of London comes to , get back some of our stole baubles as well. Which 10% of the embassies will we choose and hopefully we can get the Tories to keep all the rubbish bits we do not want.
It's a very minor point, but if Scotland becomes independent, I'm wondering what happens to Cape Wrath and its associated military ranges. There's a great deal of controversy at the moment because the MOD is trying to buy the remaining land around the lighthouse.
Cape Wrath is NATO's only combined operations practice area in the northern hemisphere. They won't want to see it go, but there are environmental and access concerns as well. It'd be interesting to see the way an independent government takes it.
While the eurozone retrenches severely and crashes its own economy, Osborne allows the stabilizers to work and Britain only flatlines (which although poor is better than what Spain, Ireland, Portugal, Italy and of course Greece are experiencing).
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
Whether it was Wilson or Heath or then Callaghan - they were as bad and weak as each other when it came to grasping the nettle.
They all had their good points and talents - but dealing with what became the Sick Man of Europe wasn't one of them. Mrs T took off the gloves and faced it down. There was fall-out, but it needed to be done.
The 74-79 govt gets an underserved bad press. They inherited a nightmare situation from Heath, had no majority, got inflation down and obviously confronted over-mighty union power in a way that ultimately cost them the election.
While the eurozone retrenches severely and crashes its own economy, Osborne allows the stabilizers to work and Britain only flatlines (which although poor is better than what Spain, Ireland, Portugal, Italy and of course Greece are experiencing).
Cutting corporation tax and empowering the private sector doesn't hurt either.
When Morrisons bought Safeway (mainly southern UK), it changed the Safeway product mix to more of the northern Morrisons product mix - pies and more pies, cakes, biscuits, chocolate and sweets etc. It is still struggling to recognise that the requirements of the southern UK shopper are often different to those of its northern stronghold.
The redundancies mentioned in the Guardian are due to technology and cheaper employment costs outside the UK. Not much can be done about those until we reduce employment costs in the UK to be more competitive globally.
I did not believe you could be any more condescending or write even more horse manure than normal, but that takes the biscuit. Having lived in the south you are obviously either having a laugh or are a sandwich short of a picnic ( no pun intended you can substitute a slice short of a pie if needed ).
"LOL, neither of you have a clue and obviously did not really grow up in the 70's. It was a great time , plenty of jobs , cheap housing, cheap petrol and best of all cheap beer. Only way it could have been improved is for Scotland to have won the world cup in Argentina. The 70's were superb."
The 70s for my personal economics were excellent. but disastrous for the country.
I drove a coal lorry during the 3-day week (as did many of our graduates) in order to keep our paper mills running that were full of export orders.
Inflation was terrible - even though we got monthly increases and we rapidly lost our competitiveness.
You must have imbibed too much cheap beer and your memory suffered as a consequence.
RT @AngryExile: “@HappySlayerUK: Anti capitalists and socialists are buying a song from Apple, Amazon, Google etc to celebrate Thatcher's death."<Hahahaha
It's been claimed that MPs can claim up to £3700 to break their holidays and attend the HoC today. Why didnt Dave just have the tribute on Monday?
One would hope they'd have the self awareness and humility to claim only what is neccessary. I am sure the papers or Guido will point us to any that don't.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
Some on the Left ought to reflect on why Margaret Thatcher was able to win in 1978. In part it was due to her determination to bring about changes, but it was also due to the intellectual and politcal vaccuum of The Left which allowed closed shops, flying pickets, unsecret strike votes - Show of Hands and all that. The power cuts, the unburied dead, the high rates of income tax and a bloated public sector didn't act as great adverts for socialism Labour style.
I grew up under 3 day weeks, the BBC on strike and off air, unburied dead, rubbish 6ft high in the street, power cuts, flying pickets, the IMF, union thuggery and closed shops. It was appalling and totally out of control.
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
best of all cheap beer.
Watney's Red Barrel?
Perhaps you were enjoying it in quantity?
Carlotta , geography is not your best subject , that was an English beer and luckily we were not subjected to it in God's country, naff advertising excepted. We did have our share of dodgy beers but there was good enough stuff around as well. Carling is its equivalent today.
Carlotta , have to add I was a bit less selective in those days mind you so all beer was good.
When Morrisons bought Safeway (mainly southern UK), it changed the Safeway product mix to more of the northern Morrisons product mix - pies and more pies, cakes, biscuits, chocolate and sweets etc. It is still struggling to recognise that the requirements of the southern UK shopper are often different to those of its northern stronghold.
The redundancies mentioned in the Guardian are due to technology and cheaper employment costs outside the UK. Not much can be done about those until we reduce employment costs in the UK to be more competitive globally.
I did not believe you could be any more condescending or write even more horse manure than normal, but that takes the biscuit. Having lived in the south you are obviously either having a laugh or are a sandwich short of a picnic ( no pun intended you can substitute a slice short of a pie if needed ).
Financier is right though. The Leicester Safeway had a good range of products, now it is Morrisons it is definitly more down market. In Leicester it is quite busy, but not doing so well in more prosperous places. Margins are lower on low value products. I rarely shop there now.
The 74-79 govt gets an underserved bad press. They inherited a nightmare situation from Heath, had no majority, got inflation down and obviously confronted over-mighty union power in a way that ultimately cost them the election.
Nice rewrite of history there, Jonathan.
You forgot the bit about the the IMF leaving them no choice in the matter.
@Jonathan - inflation was at 24% during Wilson's Premiership in 1974.
Wilson inherited 16% from Heath in '74', Callaghan left it at 10% and falling in '79. Of course as I've pointed out before, the pound lost more value due to inflation during Thatcher's premiership than under any other PM.
When Morrisons bought Safeway (mainly southern UK), it changed the Safeway product mix to more of the northern Morrisons product mix - pies and more pies, cakes, biscuits, chocolate and sweets etc. It is still struggling to recognise that the requirements of the southern UK shopper are often different to those of its northern stronghold.
The redundancies mentioned in the Guardian are due to technology and cheaper employment costs outside the UK. Not much can be done about those until we reduce employment costs in the UK to be more competitive globally.
I did not believe you could be any more condescending or write even more horse manure than normal, but that takes the biscuit. Having lived in the south you are obviously either having a laugh or are a sandwich short of a picnic ( no pun intended you can substitute a slice short of a pie if needed ).
Financier is right though. The Leicester Safeway had a good range of products, now it is Morrisons it is definitly more down market. In Leicester it is quite busy, but not doing so well in more prosperous places. Margins are lower on low value products. I rarely shop there now.
Fox, He may be correct in his facts around choice of products, but his pathetic sweeping dig that people in the south are superior to the people in the north who only eat pies and crap was way over the top. The man is an imbecile or not all there.
The 74-79 govt gets an underserved bad press. They inherited a nightmare situation from Heath, had no majority, got inflation down and obviously confronted over-mighty union power in a way that ultimately cost them the election.
Nice rewrite of history there, Jonathan.
You forgot the bit about the the IMF leaving them no choice in the matter.
Labour got the blame for clearing up Heath's mess. Or are you changing your tune about the current Coalition and have decided that the situation Cameron inherited has no bearing on current conditions?
Just caught this thoughtful piece by, of all people, Russell Brand in the Guardian.
The blunt, pathetic reality today is that a little old lady has died, who in the winter of her life had to water roses alone under police supervision.
I do not yet know what effect Margaret Thatcher has had on me as an individual or on the character of our country as we continue to evolve. As a child she unnerved me but we are not children now and we are free to choose our own ethical codes and leaders that reflect them.
It's been claimed that MPs can claim up to £3700 to break their holidays and attend the HoC today. Why didnt Dave just have the tribute on Monday?
One would hope they'd have the self awareness and humility to claim only what is neccessary. I am sure the papers or Guido will point us to any that don't.
LOL, you have to be kidding it will be maximum claims all round and as much free drink as they can swill down to celebrate another windfall.
If even Tony Benn can find something nice to say.....
The childish and petty comments made by those who know a great deal better have been instructive.
As an average member of Joe Public, I'd find something nice to say or STFU if I couldn't until at least the deceased was in the ground. She's been dead less than 48hrs - yet some supposed adults can't restrain themselves.
"LOL, neither of you have a clue and obviously did not really grow up in the 70's. It was a great time , plenty of jobs , cheap housing, cheap petrol and best of all cheap beer. Only way it could have been improved is for Scotland to have won the world cup in Argentina. The 70's were superb."
The 70s for my personal economics were excellent. but disastrous for the country.
I drove a coal lorry during the 3-day week (as did many of our graduates) in order to keep our paper mills running that were full of export orders.
Inflation was terrible - even though we got monthly increases and we rapidly lost our competitiveness.
You must have imbibed too much cheap beer and your memory suffered as a consequence.
More like someone dropped a bag of that coal on your napper.
Comments
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=05rzPnZ6lxw
I guess that's probably why some argues that today's sitting is pointless.
Presumably Wilson, Heath, Wilson again and Callaghan did likewise.
Football hooliganism started in the 1960s.
Perhaps Thatcher also encouraged the French police to behave that way against Leeds fans in 1975 etc, etc, etc?
If you want separation, that's your choice, but you can't then plead for any rescue from financial disaster from the UK. [I suspect a deal on MPC representation could occur in exchange for a time to relocate Trident].
"Part of the reason is that conservatives accept the unfairnesses and shortcomings of the world as an inevitable reflection of the human condition. In their understanding that public spending cannot be infinite, that there must be some realistic restraint on altruistic impulses, they are often thought to be ruthless and heartless.
That supposed heartlessness is, more often than not, pragmatism. Margaret Thatcher didn't actively want to put lots of miners out of work, as those who celebrated her death might think. What she saw, in an utterly pragmatic way, was that there was no economic sense in propping up a failing industry – she didn't close down the mines; she refused to go on subsidising them. If they had been making money, they would still be open today.
The knowledge that their pragmatic, economic good sense is often perceived as being heartless often makes conservatives rather diffident, self-effacing and apologetic – all nice characteristics (although, it must be said, Margaret Thatcher, for all her personal kindness and decency, didn't have these particular qualities in abundance).
It's the other way round on the Left. Because you are always advocating milk and honey for the oppressed – even if that milk and honey is economically unaffordable or impossible to get hold of – you are protected by a forcefield of advertised niceness. With your public goodness established, you can then allow yourself all the personal bile in the world – by, say, opening a bottle of champagne on the death of a frail, 87-year-old woman.
Which is better? Public niceness and personal nastiness, or public pragmatism and personal niceness? http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/culture/harrymount/100068819/are-right-wingers-nicer-than-left-wingers/
There's a by-election in Luton too....on a Wednesday instead of the usual Thursday. It should be a LD hold as they comfortably won that ward in 2011 (which was one of their poorest years overall).
It was laughable loony left stuff that unfortunately many today never saw with their own eyes.
Nah, Kinnock said she's important because she was the first female PM :-)
If this account is true, she did a lot for football fans.
Annoy the Argies by renaming the Falklands La Margaritas.
Winston Churchill had a state funeral in 1965, but he was a genuine exception. Politicians are by their very nature representative of one part of society, not its entirety. I would prefer that State funerals are reserved for the Royal Family, and exceptional military leaders, not politicians.
Many people hated Thatcher. Some for understandable reasons, some not.
You need to get over it and move on.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ek5zaZz5OWs&feature=youtu.be
"Yes - he's been determined to harm his own reputation in his recent comments"
I was really disappointed by Kinnock. I've frequently praised him on PB - his comments have changed my view of him.
NIESR predicts 0.1pc growth in Q1. That's a knife edge between triple dip and not triple dip. NIESR have a pretty good record at predicting growth in quarters that the ONS report on. And its notable that the initial ONS number has sometimes undershot the NIESR forecast in previous quarters. So we could still see that unwanted record confirmed by the ONS in two weeks time.
The triple dip in and of itself won't change much economically. Overall we'd be pretty much where we have been these last two wasted years.
The political impact will be more devastating. And rightly so.
http://notthetreasuryview.blogspot.co.uk/2012/04/recessions-and-recoveries-historical.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ft_CLGXGp_8
I think I'll take the rest of the morning off and rewatch Senna, and say goodbye once more to the Prof.
Some of the biggest riots I witnessed were in the late 60's and early 70's, particularly the Battle of Park Lane in 1967 and West Ham v Man Utd in 1968. It wasn't until the early 80's that the police started to really get their act together, and Luton was when the government finally said enough was enough.
As for the police I don't know where any supposed brutality comes from, bearing mind I was at a lot of games where full scale riots broke out, in most cases they just behaved as appropriate in the circumstances. In many cases the police came under sustained attack, Millwall fans are renowned for taking on the police.
Don't think football hooliganism has gone away either, it's much more organised, much smaller scale but is still there. Chelsea v Cardiff in 2010 is one example, only last weekend there was major trouble at a Luton match.
OGH 7th April "If stepping up the rhetoric on welfare was supposed to boost CON poll ratings it has yet to work" "Today's YouGov for Sunday Times. CON 30, LAB 40, LD 11, UKIP 13. So Tories 1% above low point with firm"
OGH 10th April "Labour’s YouGov lead down to 8pc – but it is too early to say that it’s Philpott, welfare, Mrs Thatcher or just normal margin of error" CON 33%: LAB 41%: LD 10%: Ukip 10%.
Then most of the guests have walked out or been escorted off the set by bouncers and there's so much beeping out of swearing that its like a Norman Collier sketch.
"an unmitigated disaster for Britain"
Not what, after 23 years, you'd call 'the long view...'
Compare & contrast with what Thatcher said when Foot died:
Baroness Thatcher, who clashed with Mr Foot many times in the 1980s, said she was very sorry to hear of his death, calling him 'a great parliamentarian and a man of high principles'.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1255300/Michael-Foot-hero-Left-dies-96-Tributes-man-led-Labour-catastrophe.html#ixzz2Q35Mg2n5
Thatcher on Callaghan:
"Margaret Thatcher, who defeated Callaghan in 1979, said: "Jim Callaghan was a formidable opponent, one who could best me across the dispatch box. In other circumstances he would have been a successful prime minster.
"He was a superb party manager. Despite our disagreements, I always respected him because I knew he was moved by deep patriotism."
http://www.smh.com.au/news/World/Blair-leads-tributes-to-Labour-giant/2005/03/27/1111862248607.html
Major on Wilson:
"I believe that history will remember him for the sharpness and shrewdness of his mind; for his two periods of service as Prime Minister in difficult circumstances; and for his energy and enthusiasm, as well as for his many achievements. And also, perhaps here of all places, he will be remembered for his wit and his humour--often shown to such devastating effect on the Floor of the House. But that is the public man. His friends who knew him well speak also of the private man--of his great personal kindnesses and generosity. He expected loyalty from those around him and he offered it in full measure in return."
http://www.johnmajor.co.uk/page903.html
Here, Prodi said she's responsible for the current economic crisis.
I think he can send his CV to be South Shields campaign agent now.
It is worth noting that Mrs Thatcher not only liberated the Falklands, she liberated Argentina by causing the collapse of the military junta that had killed several thousand by extrajudicial execution. I dont expect that the democrats in Argentina are grateful, no one likes their liberators, witness the French and UK and USA.
Talking of Italy - any chance of a government yet?
There's a quote somewhere where Prost himself says so.
He is missed. A true great amongst men, and someone who changed motorsport safety forever.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2013/apr/10/morrisons-axes-700-more-jobs
Does misfortune follow Osborne around ?
Thatcher was precisely what was needed. I only voted for her once in 1987 but the Left ruined us - I bitterly regret ever voting for them again given what we learnt about how they destroyed our economy again.
Spanish Industrial Output WDA (Feb) Y/Y -6.5% vs. Exp. -4.9% (Prev. -5.0%, Rev. to -4.9%) (RANsquawk)
Italian Industrial Production SA (Feb) M/M -0.8% vs. Exp. -0.5% (Prev. 0.8%, Rev. to 1.0%) (RANsquawk)
I dislike the automated checkout machines, as it advantages no-one but supermarket's bottom line. But if they are to have them, and to reduce the number of checkouts open, they should be reliable and not break down frequently.
And it does not seem particularly cheap, either.
We are getting a small convenience Co-Op store just down the road from us this year. I expect it to do very well - Morrisons have annoyed many of the locals over the years whilst they had a monopoly (the next convenient large store being in St Neots, seven miles away).
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/retailandconsumer/9844802/Morrisons-buys-clutch-of-Jessops-shops.html
Perhaps George Osborne should visit Farringdon Road Offices of The Guardian.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2013/feb/05/guardian-observer-journalists-strike
"This morning the Today Programme reported that today’s special parliamentary session in honour of Margaret Thatcher will be a "difficult one" for Ed Miliband. The gist of its correspondent’s comments were that Labour’s leader had a tricky job in striking a respectful tone, but remembering the antipathy with which Mrs Thatcher was viewed by many on the Left.
It isn’t “difficult” at all. He stands up, he says nice things about Margaret Thatcher, he sits down again. And for once – just for once – he tells the Left to shove its antipathy where the sun doesn’t shine.
This week we are seeing the Labour Party at its worst. Childish. Petty. Self-indulgent. All the attributes, in fact, that handed Margaret Thatcher three successive general election victories on a plate. Since Mrs Thatcher’s death was announced, many in the Labour movement – me included – have been imploring others on the Left to mark her passing with the respect and dignity it deserves. Fat chance.
In Brixton, a “party” to celebrate her death ended with the looting of a charity shop. When the Daily Mail splashed on this on its front page last night, the reaction of most Labour supporters on Twitter who commented was to condemn the Daily Mail, rather than the vandals.
Yesterday Ed Miliband apparently had to issue a statement, urging his MPs to act with decorum in today’s parliamentary session. While he was doing that, the Durham Miners association – whose gala Miliband attended with much fanfare last year – announced they would be booking bands, comedians and holding a party to “rejoice” on the day of her funeral.
This is the modern Left, is it? So full of bitterness and spite that we will not even allow the Right to bury their dead..." http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100211461/if-labour-cant-show-restraint-today-it-will-say-more-about-them-than-it-does-about-margaret-thatcher/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter
Austerity failing big time over there Harry.
Yet Tory loons want more of it here.
The redundancies mentioned in the Guardian are due to technology and cheaper employment costs outside the UK.
Not much can be done about those until we reduce employment costs in the UK to be more competitive globally.
I agree though that Britain was a divided country in the Seventies, there was little social harmony before her premiership. Mrs T was the product of those times. The Unions sowed the wind and reaped the whirlwind. She fought all her life and was a strong opoonent. I did not like her humourlessness and ruthlessness, but can see the need for what she did. The Left hate her because she was so effective that Socialism in its sixties and seventies form will never rise again. Like Cromwell she was mean enough to complete the job.
Cape Wrath is NATO's only combined operations practice area in the northern hemisphere. They won't want to see it go, but there are environmental and access concerns as well. It'd be interesting to see the way an independent government takes it.
http://www.jmt.org/news.asp?s=2&cat=News&nid=JMT-N10762
Unckie Malc', The BoE is a company. It's major shareholder is a Mr Englandshire and he has nominated the Board of Directors. Together they agree to de-merge their Scottish operations.
Whatcha' gonna' do?
You may choose to keep Sterling but that means nothing regarding governance of England's currency. Does Serbia have a seat on the ECB? Does the British Virgin Isles have a seat on the Federal Reserve? Why should Scotland - a sovereign nation to-be - expect to be treated any differently...?
Oh, another thing: Not all things are to be shared (as they ain't paid for). Scotland will probably not want any PFI-ed RBS Voyager MRTTs and will find itself having to finance more than 8.4% of the [post-2016] PFI-ed Search-and-Rescue services. Sovereignty comes with costs attached....
Whether it was Wilson or Heath or then Callaghan - they were as bad and weak as each other when it came to grasping the nettle.
They all had their good points and talents - but dealing with what became the Sick Man of Europe wasn't one of them. Mrs T took off the gloves and faced it down. There was fall-out, but it needed to be done.
My FiL was made redundant and out of work for 3yrs around the Miner's Strike - and the local branch sec of TASS. He also went to the local Conservative Club and played snooker with his mates - he knew and they knew that the thuggery/closed shop/show of hands was fundamentally wrong. They'd never ever indulge in the Thatcher bashing on display today even if they'd never vote Tory.
Whatcha' gonna' do?
You may choose to keep Sterling but that means nothing regarding governance of England's currency. Does Serbia have a seat on the ECB? Does the British Virgin Isles have a seat on the Federal Reserve? Why should Scotland - a sovereign nation to-be - expect to be treated any differently...?
Fluffy , now you have moved on to a different topic. There will indeed need to be lots of discussions on how the changes to the UK treasury is split , rules changed , whether it continues for all owners or if new institutions need to be formed.
The discussions will be interesting , but unlike the views on here it will not just be a case of England deciding what they will do with the shared UK assets.
http://www.greenbenchesuk.com/2013/04/mps-whove-tweeted-to-say-they-wont-be.html
....This morning the Today Programme reported that today’s special parliamentary session in honour of Margaret Thatcher will be a "difficult one" for Ed Miliband....
.....This week we are seeing the Labour Party at its worst....
...In Brixton, a “party” to celebrate her death ended with the looting of a charity shop...
From Ed Miliband to the looting of a charity shop in three graceful leaps.
Never mind that the latter has Sweet. F. A. To do with Miliband or Labour.
Hodges is an idiot, spoon feeding garbage to the gullible and stupid.
and Partick Thistle won a cup final...
While the eurozone retrenches severely and crashes its own economy, Osborne allows the stabilizers to work and Britain only flatlines (which although poor is better than what Spain, Ireland, Portugal, Italy and of course Greece are experiencing).
Perhaps you were enjoying it in quantity?
"Hodges is an idiot, spoon feeding garbage to the gullible and stupid"
You've a CSE Grade 5 in trolling. Must try harder.
- inflation was at 24% during Wilson's Premiership in 1974.
http://safalra.com/other/historical-uk-inflation-price-conversion/
And "empowering" private sector is a bit wishy-washy and a matter of subjectivity.
"LOL, neither of you have a clue and obviously did not really grow up in the 70's. It was a great time , plenty of jobs , cheap housing, cheap petrol and best of all cheap beer. Only way it could have been improved is for Scotland to have won the world cup in Argentina. The 70's were superb."
The 70s for my personal economics were excellent. but disastrous for the country.
I drove a coal lorry during the 3-day week (as did many of our graduates) in order to keep our paper mills running that were full of export orders.
Inflation was terrible - even though we got monthly increases and we rapidly lost our competitiveness.
You must have imbibed too much cheap beer and your memory suffered as a consequence.
Carlotta , have to add I was a bit less selective in those days mind you so all beer was good.
The Shocking 70s - B of E figures for inflation.
http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/education/Pages/inflation/timeline/chart.aspx
You forgot the bit about the the IMF leaving them no choice in the matter.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2013/apr/08/margaret-thatcher-dies-portraits
If even Tony Benn can find something nice to say.....
The blunt, pathetic reality today is that a little old lady has died, who in the winter of her life had to water roses alone under police supervision.
I do not yet know what effect Margaret Thatcher has had on me as an individual or on the character of our country as we continue to evolve. As a child she unnerved me but we are not children now and we are free to choose our own ethical codes and leaders that reflect them.
As an average member of Joe Public, I'd find something nice to say or STFU if I couldn't until at least the deceased was in the ground. She's been dead less than 48hrs - yet some supposed adults can't restrain themselves.
Pitiful stuff.