politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Theresa’s Tories still being hit by the GE2017 branding gamble

System

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Theresa’s Tories still being hit by the GE2017 branding gamble

It was noticing the photograph above of the Conservative battle bus at the general election that reminded me what a huge gamble the blue team made at the last election by putting everything on Theresa May.

Read the full story here

tpfkar

Surely if you have to tell everyone that you're a good leader, it's a surefire sign you're not? Was a bizarre slogan from the get-go.

TheScreamingEagles

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Nigelb

"Can she pull it round?..."

As always in politics, never say never - but realistically, no.

GIN1138

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

ThreeQuidder

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Ishmael_Z

You wait all year for a bus-themed thread and then two come along at once.

Is it the same bus?

isam

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Are the Koresh hoodies still for sale?

RoyalBlue

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

TGOHF

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

TheScreamingEagles

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

She lost the Tory majority, for that she deserves to be ousted.

Worst of all she lost the Tory majority against an IRA condoning Trot.

She should be forced to do the walk of shame in Manchester next month.

AlastairMeeks

Ishmael_Z said:

You wait all year for a bus-themed thread and then two come along at once.

Is it the same bus?

No, it's the Remain bus:

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/theresa-mays-recycled-battle-bus/

ydoethur

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

I didn't know the Rump Parliament was a Tory PM.

Although I suppose a rump is an arse, and that could be a point of similarity.

(And yes, I know you were referring to Amery and Chamberlain.)

dixiedean

Stable always was a nonsense. There were many ways to describe the period of Conservative majority 2015-17, but stable was certainly not one of them. When the u-turn/non u- turn on the dementia tax took place, it kicked away the strong and leadership bit too.
Slogans are all well and good (long term economic plan), but they have to bear some relation to reality.

Richard_Nabavi

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

TheScreamingEagles

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

ThreeQuidder

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

She lost the Tory majority, for that she deserves to be ousted.

You want another general election so soon?

ThreeQuidder

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

So what? She has more important things to worry about right now.

Ishmael_Z

AlastairMeeks said:

Ishmael_Z said:

You wait all year for a bus-themed thread and then two come along at once.

Is it the same bus?

No, it's the Remain bus:

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/theresa-mays-recycled-battle-bus/

LOL. Vertiginous depths of irony.

TheScreamingEagles

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

She lost the Tory majority, for that she deserves to be ousted.

You want another general election so soon?

Being ousted doesn't mean a new general election

OldKingCole

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

One very, very disturbed individual. Gone far beyond mockery now!

Hope he gets back to UK asap.

ThreeQuidder

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

She lost the Tory majority, for that she deserves to be ousted.

You want another general election so soon?

Being ousted doesn't mean a new general election

Legally, no, but politically it probably does in the present circumstances.

IanB2

For the government the only way is down.

Alice_Aforethought

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

ydoethur

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

There you may be being pessimistic. There are many pitfalls for Labour too, not least their leadership which remains weak and incompetent, also with an average age above 60.

Regarding Grenfell, first of all let's hope there isn't another one. Numerous blocks have failed and are undergoing hurried repairs but the only ones to have been forcibly evacuated (and evacuated in a bungled fashion that would have disgraced a fairly competent six year old, at that) were by a Labour council.

Incidentally, am I the only person wondering why Emma Dent Coad appears so desperate for the Grenfell enquiry not to go ahead?

Morris_Dancer

Ms. Aforethought, sounds like Mr. Eagles' take on classical history

Alice_Aforethought

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

There you may be being pessimistic. There are many pitfalls for Labour too, not least their leadership which remains weak and incompetent, also with an average age above 60.

Regarding Grenfell, first of all let's hope there isn't another one. Numerous blocks have failed and are undergoing hurried repairs but the only ones to have been forcibly evacuated (and evacuated in a bungled fashion that would have disgraced a fairly competent six year old, at that) were by a Labour council.

Incidentally, am I the only person wondering why Emma Dent Coad appears so desperate for the Grenfell enquiry not to go ahead?

Does she? What has she said?

isam

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

TGOHF

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

Why would you want a new leader who would surely see approval ratings drop over the 4 year period until the next election ?

ydoethur

Alice_Aforethought said:

ydoethur said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

There you may be being pessimistic. There are many pitfalls for Labour too, not least their leadership which remains weak and incompetent, also with an average age above 60.

Regarding Grenfell, first of all let's hope there isn't another one. Numerous blocks have failed and are undergoing hurried repairs but the only ones to have been forcibly evacuated (and evacuated in a bungled fashion that would have disgraced a fairly competent six year old, at that) were by a Labour council.

Incidentally, am I the only person wondering why Emma Dent Coad appears so desperate for the Grenfell enquiry not to go ahead?

Does she? What has she said?

She keeps trying to get the judge sacked.

TOPPING

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

She would need to grasp the nettle and announce that we were staying in the single market and customs union and that for this the ECJ would be the final arbiter. She could then go strongly into bat for some kind of restriction on freedom of movement analagous to the emergency brake available a la EEA rules.

ydoethur

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

In fairness, if Isobel 'Dead Pig' Oakeshott said anything, I would in default of other evidence assume the opposite was true.

However, in this case there is fairly ample evidence that he does indeed have a serious problem.

TheScreamingEagles

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

Why would you want a new leader who would surely see approval ratings drop over the 4 year period until the next election ?

A good leader will have decent ratings.

Blair, Cameron, Thatcher et al managed it.

TOPPING

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

Sandpit

AlastairMeeks said:

Ishmael_Z said:

You wait all year for a bus-themed thread and then two come along at once.

Is it the same bus?

No, it's the Remain bus:

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/theresa-mays-recycled-battle-bus/

Obviously there’s not too many buses around with the office-style fitout and comms package.

Who else uses them apart from politicians?

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Topping, if May said that she'd be toppled before she finished speaking.

Alice_Aforethought

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

Right, but if he wants to keep his job or get another, he may find it helpful to point to some tinfoil hattery as evidence that he was off his trolley whatever his fans want.

A propos I read this chap's book a while ago and it was very interesting.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hiroo_Onoda

He is the Japanese soldier in the Philippines who did not surrender in 1972. How he persuaded himself that the war was not over, despite ample evidence to the contrary, is really quite illuminating. And he's not unique. There was another who didn't surrender till 1974 and others may well have held out longer and died later.

Casino_Royale

I haven't heard a peep from her for months.

What on earth is she doing?

TGOHF

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

Why would you want a new leader who would surely see approval ratings drop over the 4 year period until the next election ?

A good leader will have decent ratings.

Blair, Cameron, Thatcher et al managed it.

Yes - but a clean skin nearer the election will have less risk of "events" scuppering those ratings.

You lack patience for a 5 year game.

TheScreamingEagles

Sandpit said:

AlastairMeeks said:

Ishmael_Z said:

You wait all year for a bus-themed thread and then two come along at once.

Is it the same bus?

No, it's the Remain bus:

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/theresa-mays-recycled-battle-bus/

Obviously there’s not too many buses around with the office-style fitout and comms package.

Who else uses them apart from politicians?

Cricket teams.

Pakistan's team coach is the same vehicle as infamous Brexit bus pledging to fund NHS

Mickey Arthur's side face the Proteas in Birmingham today looking for their first win of the competition after their opening defeat against arch-rivals India.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/cricket/pakistans-team-coach-same-vehicle-10578711

ydoethur

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

Why would you want a new leader who would surely see approval ratings drop over the 4 year period until the next election ?

A good leader will have decent ratings.

Blair, Cameron, Thatcher et al managed it.

One of those at least was not a good leader.

Although interestingly he is also the only one who won every non-constituency vote he was responsible for.

isam

TOPPING said:

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

He slagged her off in public, so she mentioned that she had been told not to respond harshly as he wasn't well. Fair enough comeback I'd say

Now he is relying on Boris "lock him up" Johnson to get him out of Greece.. karma

williamglenn

Casino_Royale said:

I haven't heard a peep from her for months.

What on earth is she doing?

She's been invisible since around the time she sought Cameron's advice.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/07/17/theresa-may-seeks-david-camerons-advice-prime-minister-prepares/

TheScreamingEagles

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

TGOHF said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Given that she will go before another GE, is it good tactics to change sooner or later ?

She's buying the Tories two days in opposition with every day she remains in power.

If she has another Grenfell then you might as well give Corbyn the keys to Number 10 now.

Why would you want a new leader who would surely see approval ratings drop over the 4 year period until the next election ?

A good leader will have decent ratings.

Blair, Cameron, Thatcher et al managed it.

Yes - but a clean skin nearer the election will have less risk of "events" scuppering those ratings.

You lack patience for a 5 year game.

Nah. You need to deal with the infection first before it kills the patient.

619

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

Maybe, but she needs to crack on really. Her not condemning Trump was a mis-step: that's a free hit on an unpopular president saying stupid things.

isam

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Scott_P

619 said:

Maybe, but she needs to crack on really. Her not condemning Trump was a mis-step: that's a free hit on an unpopular president saying stupid things.

No, it really isn't...

https://twitter.com/helenlewis/status/897562893440372736

Essexit

isam said:

TOPPING said:

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

He slagged her off in public, so she mentioned that she had been told not to respond harshly as he wasn't well. Fair enough comeback I'd say

Now he is relying on Boris "lock him up" Johnson to get him out of Greece.. karma

Correction: he claims to be relying on BoJo, we have no idea how much of what he's tweeting is true.

TOPPING

Morris_Dancer said:

Mr. Topping, if May said that she'd be toppled before she finished speaking.

La reine est mort, vive le roi (ie Jacob).

Yes I'm afraid you are probably right. But as any Leaver will tell you, there was no manifesto for Leave, it is up to the government, so there is no reason she couldn't.

Plus, thinking about it - she is funnily enough safer than she has ever been. What are they going to do? Throw her out? There would have to be a GE and even bonkers Brexiters don't want one of those.

Sandpit

TheScreamingEagles said:

Sandpit said:

AlastairMeeks said:

Ishmael_Z said:

You wait all year for a bus-themed thread and then two come along at once.

Is it the same bus?

No, it's the Remain bus:

https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2017/05/theresa-mays-recycled-battle-bus/

Obviously there’s not too many buses around with the office-style fitout and comms package.

Who else uses them apart from politicians?

Cricket teams.

Pakistan's team coach is the same vehicle as infamous Brexit bus pledging to fund NHS

Mickey Arthur's side face the Proteas in Birmingham today looking for their first win of the competition after their opening defeat against arch-rivals India.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/cricket/pakistans-team-coach-same-vehicle-10578711

Ha, indeed it is! Maybe they’re flexible enough to change them around inside depending on the customer, a sports team bus interior is usually like a first class train carriage.

Scott_P

@FrankRGardner: Spanish media report that #BarcelonaAttack van attack suspect has been caught just west of Barcelona.

TOPPING

isam said:

TOPPING said:

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

He slagged her off in public, so she mentioned that she had been told not to respond harshly as he wasn't well. Fair enough comeback I'd say

Now he is relying on Boris "lock him up" Johnson to get him out of Greece.. karma

I suppose that's the nature of tweeting, but in my book, saying publicly I have been told not to be nasty to him because he is mad...is not cricket.

Dura_Ace

619 said:

Maybe, but she needs to crack on really. Her not condemning Trump was a mis-step: that's a free hit on an unpopular president saying stupid things.

It's wouldn't be "free" as she needs a trade deal from the greasy fucker and can't afford to infuriate him.

Sandpit

Essexit said:

isam said:

TOPPING said:

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

He slagged her off in public, so she mentioned that she had been told not to respond harshly as he wasn't well. Fair enough comeback I'd say

Now he is relying on Boris "lock him up" Johnson to get him out of Greece.. karma

Correction: he claims to be relying on BoJo, we have no idea how much of what he's tweeting is true.

At the same time as calling him names.
https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899596617422168064
The guy is losing it, I suggest we all leave him to it. The British Embassy in Athens will know about him and deal with whatever needs doing.

isam

TOPPING said:

isam said:

TOPPING said:

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

He slagged her off in public, so she mentioned that she had been told not to respond harshly as he wasn't well. Fair enough comeback I'd say

Now he is relying on Boris "lock him up" Johnson to get him out of Greece.. karma

I suppose that's the nature of tweeting, but in my book, saying publicly I have been told not to be nasty to him because he is mad...is not cricket.

I see your point. I guess she just wanted to shut him up.

MikeSmithson

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

SandyRentool

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Catalan Separatist?

isam

MikeSmithson said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

Well she did win the Election, but it was also a failure. @ThreeQuidder didn't call it a success.

ThreeQuidder

MikeSmithson said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

She won the election, Mike, get over it.

It's a bit much you calling me stupid when you were the one touting James Chapman as the new great hope for the continuity Remainers!

Morris_Dancer

Mr. Smithson, reminds me a little of the old Third Crusade debate (although Richard's task was far harder than May's, and he was far more competent). Retook Acre but didn't get Jerusalem. Success, or failure?

foxinsoxuk

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

TheScreamingEagles

ThreeQuidder said:

MikeSmithson said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

She won the election, Mike, get over it.

It's a bit much you calling me stupid when you were the one touting James Chapman as the new great hope for the continuity Remainers!

By her own metric she lost the election.

She said if she lost six seats she'd lose the election. She lost more than six.

TOPPING

re Theresa's success or otherwise, I think the point is that she ended up in a worse position than she started, and she didn't need to do it.

That is the key issue.

If there was a statutory election, she fought and won, then well done her. But this was entirely to increase her existing majority, was not needed, and she failed in the only thing she held the election for. Hence I think it fair to say she failed, although of course "won" the election (in quote marks because she didn't win the election as in win an overall majority allowing her party to make decisions unilaterally win the election).

logical_song

TOPPING said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

She would need to grasp the nettle and announce that we were staying in the single market and customs union and that for this the ECJ would be the final arbiter. She could then go strongly into bat for some kind of restriction on freedom of movement analagous to the emergency brake available a la EEA rules.

She couldn't do that - how about Boris ;-)

TGOHF

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Did you miss the Borough Market incident ?

TOPPING

logical_song said:

TOPPING said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

She would need to grasp the nettle and announce that we were staying in the single market and customs union and that for this the ECJ would be the final arbiter. She could then go strongly into bat for some kind of restriction on freedom of movement analagous to the emergency brake available a la EEA rules.

She couldn't do that - how about Boris ;-)

If they topple her there is a GE (imagine the Evening Standard leaders). No one wants that.

Alice_Aforethought

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Meeting plod quite often in the line of duty, I'd have to disagree.

A lot of people would certainly get liquidated, but rather too many would be Brazilian electricians.

SandyRentool

'Media reports quoting police sources said the man targeted in Subirats shouted "Allahu Akbar" ("God is Greatest") when confronted.'

Looks like the police didn't have time to enter into this theological discussion.

Alice_Aforethought

SandyRentool said:

'Media reports quoting police sources said the man targeted in Subirats shouted "Allahu Akbar"

So he was "Asian"?

logical_song

TOPPING said:

logical_song said:

TOPPING said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

She would need to grasp the nettle and announce that we were staying in the single market and customs union and that for this the ECJ would be the final arbiter. She could then go strongly into bat for some kind of restriction on freedom of movement analagous to the emergency brake available a la EEA rules.

She couldn't do that - how about Boris ;-)

If they topple her there is a GE (imagine the Evening Standard leaders). No one wants that.

Well, it wasn't a serious suggestion, but would there need to be a GE? If Tory/DUP choose to stick together then it could be business as usual (SNAFU).

CarlottaVance

tpfkar said:

Surely if you have to tell everyone that you're a good leader, it's a surefire sign you're not? Was a bizarre slogan from the get-go.

Many moons ago I read a great comment by an American Union leader.

Being powerful is like being a lady.

If you have to tell people you are, you ain't.....

Sandpit

Only one news story for the next few hours...
https://twitter.com/itsRamel/status/899643533048635392

logical_song

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

MikeSmithson said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

She won the election, Mike, get over it.

It's a bit much you calling me stupid when you were the one touting James Chapman as the new great hope for the continuity Remainers!

By her own metric she lost the election.

She said if she lost six seats she'd lose the election. She lost more than six.

You have to admire Mr £3 tenaciousness in the face of the facts.

williamglenn

CarlottaVance said:

tpfkar said:

Surely if you have to tell everyone that you're a good leader, it's a surefire sign you're not? Was a bizarre slogan from the get-go.

Many moons ago I read a great comment by an American Union leader.

Being powerful is like being a lady.

If you have to tell people you are, you ain't.....

Isn't that usually attributed to Thatcher?

CarlottaVance

TGOHF said:

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Did you miss the Borough Market incident ?

Eight minutes from first 999 call to dead terrorists is not too shabby....

foxinsoxuk

Alice_Aforethought said:

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Meeting plod quite often in the line of duty, I'd have to disagree.

A lot of people would certainly get liquidated, but rather too many would be Brazilian electricians.

Perhaps you are right, we need EU migrant cops if we want crack shots. Our own bobbies are not up to the same standard.

Essexit

Alice_Aforethought said:

SandyRentool said:

'Media reports quoting police sources said the man targeted in Subirats shouted "Allahu Akbar"

So he was "Asian"?

Named locally as Juan?

CarlottaVance

williamglenn said:

CarlottaVance said:

tpfkar said:

Surely if you have to tell everyone that you're a good leader, it's a surefire sign you're not? Was a bizarre slogan from the get-go.

Many moons ago I read a great comment by an American Union leader.

Being powerful is like being a lady.

If you have to tell people you are, you ain't.....

Isn't that usually attributed to Thatcher?

It is - possibly we both read it in the Sunday Times!

freetochoose

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

You must be mad

TGOHF

CarlottaVance said:

TGOHF said:

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Did you miss the Borough Market incident ?

Eight minutes from first 999 call to dead terrorists is not too shabby....

That was thanks to our membership of the EU - will decline to 3rd world standards after Brexit.

foxinsoxuk

TGOHF said:

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Did you miss the Borough Market incident ?

The equivalent to Cambrils would perhaps be Cromer.

London is unusual in having armed cops minutes away. When the Whitehaven shootings happened it took an hour for armed cops to get there.

AlastairMeeks

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

TOPPING

logical_song said:

TOPPING said:

logical_song said:

TOPPING said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

She would need to grasp the nettle and announce that we were staying in the single market and customs union and that for this the ECJ would be the final arbiter. She could then go strongly into bat for some kind of restriction on freedom of movement analagous to the emergency brake available a la EEA rules.

She couldn't do that - how about Boris ;-)

If they topple her there is a GE (imagine the Evening Standard leaders). No one wants that.

Well, it wasn't a serious suggestion, but would there need to be a GE? If Tory/DUP choose to stick together then it could be business as usual (SNAFU).

No indeed I got the non-serious bit, but just thinking further about it, May is safe as houses - I really don't think they could get away with two coronations because people would say: unelected May just scraped through, unelected second guy would get a hiding and you need to give us the opportunity to give it to him.

TheScreamingEagles

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Has to be a Black Swan.

Though voters fell out of love with Cameron following Coulson and the pasty tax but he got them back for the next general election organically.

CopperSulphate

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Maybe Corbyn being actually scrutinised properly as now people expect him to win the next election. The last one was all about May and Tory cock-ups.

ThreeQuidder

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

MikeSmithson said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

She won the election, Mike, get over it.

It's a bit much you calling me stupid when you were the one touting James Chapman as the new great hope for the continuity Remainers!

By her own metric she lost the election.

She said if she lost six seats she'd lose the election. She lost more than six.

Didn't she say that if she lost six seats Corbyn would become PM? That was wrong too.

619

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

I imagine she will try to have a 'reboot' or 3, but none of them will land.

She was never 'popular' as a warm personality, but for being 'strong and stable' and ' A safe pair of hands'. She has lost that, and I can't see how she can ever get that back again.

Eventually, she will make a big mistake or circumstances will make it look like she has, her popularity will plummet even more and she will be given a chance to retire with grace and make way for someone else.

Scott_P

https://twitter.com/julieowenmoylan/status/899624486202429441

619

TOPPING said:

logical_song said:

TOPPING said:

logical_song said:

TOPPING said:

Richard_Nabavi said:

No, she can't turn it round, but she can salvage her reputation and depart with grace, if Brexit can be negotiated without total chaos. How big an 'if' that is remains to be seen.

Although many of her woes are self-inflicted, it's also the case that the media like to knock down those that they have built up. Before the election, she was getting an over-favourable press, and a correction was inevitable. What was surprising was the speed and ferocity of that correction.

Jeremy Corbyn has arguably followed the reverse trajectory, but Labour shouldn't kid themselves that the fundamentals have changed.

She would need to grasp the nettle and announce that we were staying in the single market and customs union and that for this the ECJ would be the final arbiter. She could then go strongly into bat for some kind of restriction on freedom of movement analagous to the emergency brake available a la EEA rules.

She couldn't do that - how about Boris ;-)

If they topple her there is a GE (imagine the Evening Standard leaders). No one wants that.

Well, it wasn't a serious suggestion, but would there need to be a GE? If Tory/DUP choose to stick together then it could be business as usual (SNAFU).

No indeed I got the non-serious bit, but just thinking further about it, May is safe as houses - I really don't think they could get away with two coronations because people would say: unelected May just scraped through, unelected second guy would get a hiding and you need to give us the opportunity to give it to him.

Any new Tory leader will have to go for an election. If before March 2019, they would have to say that there will be one in June 2019, as they may be able to get away with delaying for Brexit talks

freetochoose

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Something will happen before long that will give her the opportunity to re-assert herself. Whether or not she's up to it remains to be seen.

I doubt it personally.

619

CopperSulphate said:

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Maybe Corbyn being actually scrutinised properly as now people expect him to win the next election. The last one was all about May and Tory cock-ups.

The sun was basically calling him a terrorist in the lead up to the election and making him out to be a total idiot.

I don't buy this 'Corbyn was given an easy time' argument I keep seeing

GIN1138

Sandpit said:

Essexit said:

isam said:

TOPPING said:

isam said:

Alice_Aforethought said:

RoyalBlue said:

GIN1138 said:

https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899625161057595392

Poor man. He really doesn't sound well.

It could be smart. If you want later to disown your Twittery and get away with it by telling everyone you were mentally ill when you wrote all that then, a good start might be to appear to be a complete nutter now. You can then argue that all of it was of a piece.

It is the Blackadder Goes Forth strategy of wearing your underpants on your head, sticking pencils up your nose and going "wibble, wibble".

But when Isobel Oakeshott implied he was mentally ill, his fans slaughtered her

If she knew him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.
If she didn't know him to be mentally ill then it was inappropriate to tweet.

He slagged her off in public, so she mentioned that she had been told not to respond harshly as he wasn't well. Fair enough comeback I'd say

Now he is relying on Boris "lock him up" Johnson to get him out of Greece.. karma

Correction: he claims to be relying on BoJo, we have no idea how much of what he's tweeting is true.

At the same time as calling him names.
https://twitter.com/James08209590/status/899596617422168064
The guy is losing it, I suggest we all leave him to it. The British Embassy in Athens will know about him and deal with whatever needs doing.

Given he is claiming to have been arrested, drugged and assaulted on the orders of HMG that sounds a bit ominous...

TOPPING

freetochoose said:

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Something will happen before long that will give her the opportunity to re-assert herself. Whether or not she's up to it remains to be seen.

I doubt it personally.

You've either got the want to go for a drink with factor or you haven't.

She transparently doesn't have it, which was fine when the perception was we need a harsh taskmistress to get us through Brexit. But this no longer applies now either - you can't be a harsh taskmistress if no one needs to listen to you and your threats.

She now just has to soldier on.

ThreeQuidder

logical_song said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

ThreeQuidder said:

MikeSmithson said:

ThreeQuidder said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

She's a loser, to quote a message aimed at another Tory PM..

You have sat too long here for any good you have been doing. Depart, I say, and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go.

Far too soon to depose a leader who just won a general election.

Even by your standards that is a very stupid comment. She went into the election with the express objective of winning a bigger majority. She ended up without a majority at all. I call that failure.

She won the election, Mike, get over it.

It's a bit much you calling me stupid when you were the one touting James Chapman as the new great hope for the continuity Remainers!

By her own metric she lost the election.

She said if she lost six seats she'd lose the election. She lost more than six.

You have to admire Mr £3 tenaciousness in the face of the facts.

The facts are that she got most votes, most seats and was the only possible PM.

She won.

Richard_Nabavi

619 said:

Maybe, but she needs to crack on really. Her not condemning Trump was a mis-step: that's a free hit on an unpopular president saying stupid things.

She did condemn him, in no uncertain terms.

That's she's perceived by some as not having done so is a fine example of the fact that she's now being treated unfairly unfavourably, in contrast to the period before the election when she was being over-praised.

SandyRentool

freetochoose said:

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Something will happen before long that will give her the opportunity to re-assert herself. Whether or not she's up to it remains to be seen.

I doubt it personally.

I'd be surprised if Argentina invades the Falklands this side of the next General Election.

Where else might she start a war?

GIN1138

SandyRentool said:

'Media reports quoting police sources said the man targeted in Subirats shouted "Allahu Akbar"

Admiral Akbar?

TheScreamingEagles

SandyRentool said:

freetochoose said:

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Something will happen before long that will give her the opportunity to re-assert herself. Whether or not she's up to it remains to be seen.

I doubt it personally.

I'd be surprised if Argentina invades the Falklands this side of the next General Election.

Where else might she start a war?

Gibraltar.

Though we might have to give up sovereignty of The Rock to get a good Brexit deal.

TGOHF

foxinsoxuk said:

TGOHF said:

foxinsoxuk said:

isam said:

https://twitter.com/eveningstandard/status/899646251863506944

Spanish police do seem very effective. Gunning down 5 terrorists in a resort like cambrils before they got anyone was particularly so, as not a high profile area.

Finnish plod not slouches either. About time our boys in blue got firearms as a routine.

Did you miss the Borough Market incident ?

The equivalent to Cambrils would perhaps be Cromer.

You think those drunken pikeys should have been shot dead on Saturday night ?

Not sure I'd go that far..

CopperSulphate

SandyRentool said:

freetochoose said:

AlastairMeeks said:

What is it that Theresa May is going to say or do that will change people's opinions of her again? It's hard to imagine in practice.

Something will happen before long that will give her the opportunity to re-assert herself. Whether or not she's up to it remains to be seen.

I doubt it personally.

I'd be surprised if Argentina invades the Falklands this side of the next General Election.

Where else might she start a war?

It could be related to the rising threat of Islam to the UK and Europe.

nigel4england

Not sure this fits the Remain narrative, however some of us have been saying the same for a while now:

http://commentcentral.co.uk/brexit-negotiations-the-davis-poker-face/