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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Tonight’s polling and GE2017 betting round-up

SystemSystem Posts: 12,261
edited May 2017 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Tonight’s polling and GE2017 betting round-up

Other GE2017 findings from the poll

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Comments

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,348
    edited May 2017
    Seems about running right.

    Mrs May's lacklustre campaign, especially about fox hunting is responsible for the Tory lead being slashed.

    Last ComRes poll seemed like an outlier.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Sleazy Tories on the slide !
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830
    It's up up up for Labour. Tories reached their ceiling (48-50), Labour reached their floor (26-30)
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    FPT

    re: Wales - Yougov were close to accurate at the last election.

    re: Lib Dems - where will they go? On Opinium's best leader choice they break 2:1 for May over Corbyn, so if they move.....

    re: Labour's 32 - they are miles behind among 35+ and Opinium have substantially upweighted young blue collar workers because they presumably don't have many signed up to respond to political polls. It's a very dubious number because these voters are hard to reach. The Tories and Labour are close to level among young professionals.

    The idea that young white van man is voting Corbyn is hysterical.

  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    edited May 2017
    Tory lead still basically the same it has been for 2 weeks now across the various polls and this is after Corbyn's super popular manifesto.

    Still not buying Labour on > 30%, and Tories on nearly 50%.
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    ComRes produce yet another Labour figure in the 30s.

    Definitely a trend in the polls. Still not convinced regardless.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    The answer to the last question says it all: by 53% - 47%, the people think she is a liar.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    edited May 2017
    The Comres poll looks a little more likely than Opinium with 2% more for the LDs and 2% less for Labour, on Comres the Tories would gain 49 Labour seats, 1 SNP, 3 LDs and 1 UKIP seat giving May a majority of 108 (even if they are doing a little worse than the last poll)
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,045
    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,348
    Don't forget ORB, the third poll of the day that has seen the Tory lead cut.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    edited May 2017
    surbiton said:

    The answer to the last question says it all: by 53% - 47%, the people think she is a liar.

    The 3rd question is just plain bonkers....who did they interview a room full of students?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,727
    FPT Wales, actual vote shares were Lab 35%, Con 21%, Independent 21%, Plaid 15%, Lib Dem 7%.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,045
    surbiton said:

    The answer to the last question says it all: by 53% - 47%, the people think she is a liar.

    ..just a liar with an 18 point lead.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,727
    kle4 said:

    It's up up up for Labour. Tories reached their ceiling (48-50), Labour reached their floor (26-30)

    Being behind by 14-18% is not something to celebrate.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Betting Post

    Conservative leads continue to slide from the ridiculously enormous ones a couple of weeks ago.

    Anyway, I posted this a few minutes ago on the old thread. The pre-race ramble includes literally two bets:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2017/05/spain-pre-race-2017.html
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,144
    How long has this been here? :o
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    edited May 2017

    Betting Post

    Conservative leads continue to slide from the ridiculously enormous ones a couple of weeks ago.

    Anyway, I posted this a few minutes ago on the old thread. The pre-race ramble includes literally two bets:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2017/05/spain-pre-race-2017.html

    If we look at the polls, before that crazy spike of 25% leads (which most people queried), the leads were in the range we continue to see them now i.e 15-18%.

    What appears to have changed is Labour and Tories at levels that don't seem to tally with the responses to best leader (i.e. Corbyn is panned) or realistic (Tory getting nearly 50% of the vote).
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
  • ab195ab195 Posts: 477
    You'd expect a manifesto boost wouldn't you? The Labour launch this week will fall flat since its been spoiled, the Tory one will contain some sweeties, and the last three weeks will focus on personality. Not ideal for Mr Corbyn.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,144
    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    You've read the Tory manifesto?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,348
    RobD said:

    How long has this been here? :o

    Since 6pm BST.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,180
    kle4 said:

    It's up up up for Labour. Tories reached their ceiling (48-50), Labour reached their floor (26-30)

    I fear those words may come back to bite you.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,144

    RobD said:

    How long has this been here? :o

    Since 6pm BST.
    You're supposed to tell me these things, TSE :p
  • AndrewAndrew Posts: 2,900
    Anyone got nicer graphical summaries than wiki?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_United_Kingdom_general_election,_2017#Graphical_summary

    Leader favourability ratings do point towards approx 17/18% gap, so the 47-30 there would fit.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    For once I agree with TSE, in that the Tory campaign has up to now been dire, complacent and unfocused.

    It May changed once the manifestoes are printed and published; then again it May not.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071

    Betting Post

    Conservative leads continue to slide from the ridiculously enormous ones a couple of weeks ago.

    Anyway, I posted this a few minutes ago on the old thread. The pre-race ramble includes literally two bets:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2017/05/spain-pre-race-2017.html

    I can see 3 bets suggested?
    Or am I reading your ramble incorrectly?
    Bottas, Verstappen and Ricciardo?
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Mr. Urquhart, it'll certainly be interesting to see how the results end up going.

    As an aside, there's only tomorrow's race and Monaco (in a fortnight) before polling day.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    edited May 2017

    Don't forget ORB, the third poll of the day that has seen the Tory lead cut.

    It is more a move from Blair landslide 1997 to Thatcher landslide 1987 for May than anything really significant
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    Mr. M, I count Verstappen and Ricciardo as one bet because I put half a stake on each.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    MikeK said:

    For once I agree with TSE, in that the Tory campaign has up to now been dire, complacent and unfocused.

    It May changed once the manifestoes are printed and published; then again it May not.

    Strangely the public think otherwise when asked. But then look at the answers they give on other stuff...
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,180

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    I think with Surbiton we have the IOS of this year's campaign.
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    Am assuming that we'll get another ICM for the Sun on Sunday at some point tonight? They've not given Labour a share in the 30s since Theresa May became Prime Minister.

    *IF* that occurs then it could be more evidence that Labour is doing better, or that herding is underway, or possibly both. Take your pick...
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,348
    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    How long has this been here? :o

    Since 6pm BST.
    You're supposed to tell me these things, TSE :p
    The morning thread should be going up at 5am BST

    The afternoon thread at 2pm

    The evening thread at 8pm

    Of course these timings could change due to someone doing a guest thread, or events dear boy.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    If Labour thinks whacking the top 5% of earners will pay for all Corbyn's goodies this week they obviously have not read the small print, the Tories aim is to keep taxes down for everyone as far as the public finances allow which is a bit more realistic than Cameron and Osborne's pledge not to raise any tax regardless
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,045
    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    I've no idea whats in the Tory manifesto. The tories have basically announced nothing and are still approx 15 points ahead.

    I cant see what labour have got left in the tank. The tories haven't even started their campaign
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    I've no idea whats in the Tory manifesto. The tories have basically announced nothing and are still approx 15 points ahead.

    I cant see what labour have got left in the tank. The tories haven't even started their campaign
    Well Labour have emptied the sweet shop like an obese teenager...
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,180
    MikeK said:

    For once I agree with TSE, in that the Tory campaign has up to now been dire, complacent and unfocused.

    It May changed once the manifestoes are printed and published; then again it May not.

    Right - are you predicting 100 or 200 for UKIP this time?
  • Fysics_TeacherFysics_Teacher Posts: 6,303
    Re polls: what GB percentage (as quoted in the polls) corresponds to a UK percentage of 30?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,107

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    The smallish uptick on labour seems to be a triump for some but it still points to a large conservative majority

    The conservative manifesto next week will see the party ramp up its campaign with serious onslaughts on labour's tax and spend policies and no doubt a widening of the atttack on Corbyn's lack of Brexit and defence policies.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    edited May 2017
    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39907481
  • Based on the coloured bar chart at the top of this thread, the Baxterised numbers are as follows:

    Con .......... 381

    Labour ..... 188

    LibDem ....... 5

    UKIP ........... 0

    Green ......... 0

    Is now the time to SELL the Tories with Spreadex at 397 seats, or to BUY Labour with Sporting or Spreadex at 162 seats? As the chap on Big Brother is apt to say ..... You decide!
    (I placed my spread bets yesterday)
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    edited May 2017
    HYUFD said:

    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work
    christine.baker24@btinternet.com

    Probably be an improvement if his son took over...I would guess already more intellectually capable than his father.
  • madasafishmadasafish Posts: 659
    Let's see:

    Labour have had virtually two weeks of hogging the news headlines. The Tories have said virtually nothing..
    And Labour have gained three percentage points...

    I expect the Tories to start ads/headlines etc 2-3 weeks before 8th June - so 18th May roughly..

    Labour may gain some more by then - say another percentage point...

    The question is: how good will the Tory response be? Is Mr Crosby worth the £ millions he is paid? Or will Labour reduce the lead to "only" 11%..?



  • HaroldOHaroldO Posts: 1,185

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    The ransomware attack affected more than just hospitals which ameliorated the impact of any attack on the government.
    But the Tories need a solid manifesto, they need more funding for schools and hospitals at least.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,348

    Based on the coloured bar chart at the top of this thread, the Baxterised numbers are as follows:

    Con .......... 381

    Labour ..... 188

    LibDem ....... 5

    UKIP ........... 0

    Green ......... 0

    Is now the time to SELL the Tories with Spreadex at 397 seats, or to BUY Labour with Sporting or Spreadex at 162 seats? As the chap on Big Brother is apt to say ..... You decide!
    (I placed my spread bets yesterday)

    Why didn't you listen to me when I advised buying the the Tories at 378?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    edited May 2017
    HaroldO said:

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    The ransomware attack affected more than just hospitals which ameliorated the impact of any attack on the government.
    But the Tories need a solid manifesto, they need more funding for schools and hospitals at least.
    Sure...but lets say 40+ NHS trusts were still down now the media would be absolutely monstering them, regardless that German trains or Nissan also got hit.

    Instead they have had a bit of a battering, but the media coverage will now pass / move on, and actually gives the Tories a chance to say look response was ok, could have been better, here is a plan and just imagine what Captain Calamity and Team Twat would have done.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    I've no idea whats in the Tory manifesto. The tories have basically announced nothing and are still approx 15 points ahead.

    I cant see what labour have got left in the tank. The tories haven't even started their campaign
    Just wait until we get the social conservative manifesto,then the fun starts on here.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,107

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    Bit difficult to confine it to the NHS when it was a worldwide attack hitting lots of different countries and industries
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,727
    HYUFD said:

    Don't forget ORB, the third poll of the day that has seen the Tory lead cut.

    It is more a move from Blair landslide 1997 to Thatcher landslide 1987 for May than anything really significant
    The Tories are doing better than Blair, in terms of vote share.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    I've no idea whats in the Tory manifesto. The tories have basically announced nothing and are still approx 15 points ahead.

    I cant see what labour have got left in the tank. The tories haven't even started their campaign
    And therein is the problem. What's May doing in N. Ireland today? Nothing but farting around old problems that are in no ones interest except a group of N. Irish politico's that people would rather forget. In other words, wasting time.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,107
    felix said:

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    I think with Surbiton we have the IOS of this year's campaign.
    IOS ?
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546
    edited May 2017

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    Bit difficult to confine it to the NHS when it was a worldwide attack hitting lots of different countries and industries
    Sure, but we know how the media have a problem with minor facts like that. Given they are already pre-programmed to go NHS, never enough money, Tory cuts, yadda yadda yadda...if the response had been a disaster Mrs Solid and Stable May would have got a right old battering for days on end, despite it not really being down to her.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,727

    Based on the coloured bar chart at the top of this thread, the Baxterised numbers are as follows:

    Con .......... 381

    Labour ..... 188

    LibDem ....... 5

    UKIP ........... 0

    Green ......... 0

    Is now the time to SELL the Tories with Spreadex at 397 seats, or to BUY Labour with Sporting or Spreadex at 162 seats? As the chap on Big Brother is apt to say ..... You decide!
    (I placed my spread bets yesterday)

    I expect the Tories to win c.400, Labour c. 170.
  • RazedabodeRazedabode Posts: 3,045
    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830
    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    It's up up up for Labour. Tories reached their ceiling (48-50), Labour reached their floor (26-30)

    Being behind by 14-18% is not something to celebrate.
    No, but it encourages all their support to firm up, and save seats that might otherwise be lost, and so prevents the worst possible scenarios.

    Getting a bad result rather than a disastrous one is not a win for Labour, but it is better. At the moment the Tories are lazy, assuming that because Corbyn has poor ratings they need say nothing (we keep hearing they are holding back - until when? And why?), and while his allies have messed up Corbyn so far has not, meaning the 'let him tie his own rope' strategy has been ineffective, even if it has not led to a shift that would change the outcome from anything other than a Tory win.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    felix said:

    MikeK said:

    For once I agree with TSE, in that the Tory campaign has up to now been dire, complacent and unfocused.

    It May changed once the manifestoes are printed and published; then again it May not.

    Right - are you predicting 100 or 200 for UKIP this time?
    I forgive you for living in the past. ;)
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,546

    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.

    The uptick has to be students...has to be. Labour aren't even ahead with public sector workers or the working class.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830

    felix said:

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    I think with Surbiton we have the IOS of this year's campaign.
    IOS ?
    Like me, he repeatedly predicted Ed M would win the 2015 election. Unlike me, he was a Labour partisan who mocked anyone who predicted otherwise, reporting that Labour's magnificent ground game was seeing them challenge in places they used to struggle in.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,107

    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.

    The uptick has to be students...has to be. Labour aren't even ahead with public sector workers or the working class.
    Is that not pilling up votes in areas they are already well ahead
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,180

    felix said:

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    I think with Surbiton we have the IOS of this year's campaign.
    IOS ?
    One of several enormo-idiots. He and Justin are fighting hard for this year's slot.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,107
    felix said:

    felix said:

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    I think with Surbiton we have the IOS of this year's campaign.
    IOS ?
    One of several enormo-idiots. He and Justin are fighting hard for this year's slot.
    Well hard not to agree with that
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,144

    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    How long has this been here? :o

    Since 6pm BST.
    You're supposed to tell me these things, TSE :p
    The morning thread should be going up at 5am BST

    The afternoon thread at 2pm

    The evening thread at 8pm

    Of course these timings could change due to someone doing a guest thread, or events dear boy.
    Now you've gone and told everyone :(
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,107
    kle4 said:

    felix said:

    surbiton said:

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Yes, they have. Under £80000, no tax increase. Under the Tories, everyone will pay more tax.

    That is why it was leaked!
    Except IEA and IFS called total horseshit on that claim. Somewhere between £3-4k per household more required in tax.
    I think with Surbiton we have the IOS of this year's campaign.
    IOS ?
    Like me, he repeatedly predicted Ed M would win the 2015 election. Unlike me, he was a Labour partisan who mocked anyone who predicted otherwise, reporting that Labour's magnificent ground game was seeing them challenge in places they used to struggle in.
    Thanks for that - so you are sensibly rational which I agree with but Surbiton is irrational which I agree with
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,727
    kle4 said:

    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    It's up up up for Labour. Tories reached their ceiling (48-50), Labour reached their floor (26-30)

    Being behind by 14-18% is not something to celebrate.
    No, but it encourages all their support to firm up, and save seats that might otherwise be lost, and so prevents the worst possible scenarios.

    Getting a bad result rather than a disastrous one is not a win for Labour, but it is better. At the moment the Tories are lazy, assuming that because Corbyn has poor ratings they need say nothing (we keep hearing they are holding back - until when? And why?), and while his allies have messed up Corbyn so far has not, meaning the 'let him tie his own rope' strategy has been ineffective, even if it has not led to a shift that would change the outcome from anything other than a Tory win.
    It depends what you mean by disastrous. I expect this year to be 1997 in reverse.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    Sean_F said:

    HYUFD said:

    Don't forget ORB, the third poll of the day that has seen the Tory lead cut.

    It is more a move from Blair landslide 1997 to Thatcher landslide 1987 for May than anything really significant
    The Tories are doing better than Blair, in terms of vote share.
    Yes but I think while May can match Thatcher's 1987 majority it will be difficult for her to match Blair's 1997 majority because of the size of the Labour majorities in its safest seats
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830

    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.

    The uptick has to be students...has to be. Labour aren't even ahead with public sector workers or the working class.
    Is that not pilling up votes in areas they are already well ahead
    It's one possible scenario.

    a - Polls are just wrong - there is some reason for believing this might be the case, given anecdata and Labour struggles in many areas in locals and mayoralties

    b - Piling up votes in safe seats, losing elsewhere - Similar to a), but would mean polls could be right even as Labour's struggles are genuine and would be repeated at a GE

    c - There is a surge for Labour and Corbyn for some reason (fear of a big Tory majority, nonvoters saying they will vote Labour, popular policies overcoming doubts over Corbyn, sclerotic LD vote).
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683

    HYUFD said:

    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39907481

    Probably be an improvement if his son took over...I would guess already more intellectually capable than his father.
    Trudeau Snr still has a big lead in Canadian polls
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_43rd_Canadian_federal_election
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,144
    malcolmg said:

    How desperate can the Tories get.
    twitter.com/andysearson/status/863073898048479234/photo/1

    And yet she's still in the high 40s.
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,144
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39907481

    Probably be an improvement if his son took over...I would guess already more intellectually capable than his father.
    Trudeau Snr still has a big lead in Canadian polls
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_43rd_Canadian_federal_election
    He went up in my opinion when he saw the light and ditched PR in favour of glorious FPTP.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830
    edited May 2017
    malcolmg said:

    How desperate can the Tories get.
    hts://twitter.com/andysearson/status/863073898048479234/photo/1

    So what? If it ain't an Obama sized mass rally of thousands, it isn't newsworthy anyway, who cares if parties make an effort to get hundreds of party supporters to show up or a few dozen? It's a hassle for them, and it doesn't sway anybody any which way. "What's that Bob, 150 showed up for the Corbyn rally but only 100 for the May rally? Well, that changes everything".

    I don't know why they bother, can they just not all have the leader pose in front of a green screen at the start of the campaign. Saves on show leather too.
  • MTimTMTimT Posts: 7,034
    Clearly time for the Tories to panic - their polling is so consistently in the 46-48% range none is even commenting about it anymore.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    At the moment I'm reading Harari's great book, Sapiens. It takes my mind from this election campaign.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    Probably expecting HMRC to become less efficient.
  • CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    edited May 2017

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    Bit difficult to confine it to the NHS when it was a worldwide attack hitting lots of different countries and industries
    Sure, but we know how the media have a problem with minor facts like that. Given they are already pre-programmed to go NHS, never enough money, Tory cuts, yadda yadda yadda...if the response had been a disaster Mrs Solid and Stable May would have got a right old battering for days on end, despite it not really being down to her.
    National security including cyberdefence is down to her.

    Ross Anderson asks, "If large numbers of NHS organisations failed to act on a critical notice from Microsoft two months ago, then whose fault is that?"

    Has any journalist had the intelligence to wonder whether private-sector health organisations, such as private hospitals, run the same software, and if so, whether they acted on the notice from Microsoft or not?

    Or maybe the very existence of private healthcare and the difference between it and state healthcare isn't something the Tories (or Labour, it seems) wish to point up?
  • Black_RookBlack_Rook Posts: 8,905
    MTimT said:

    Clearly time for the Tories to panic - their polling is so consistently in the 46-48% range none is even commenting about it anymore.

    Indeed - and has been remarked earlier (was it by yourself? I can't recall, sorry,) the shares of both the Lib Dems and Ukip are wearing back down to bedrock in these polls.

    That will be a comfort to the Tories. If the polling does turn out to be accurate - and I have my reservations about all these Labour numbers on 30%+, given the data coming out of the key supplementary questions - then there's not much further for Labour to climb without taking votes directly from the Conservatives, which itself seems exceedingly implausible given the huge political gulf between the positions of the two major parties.

    A final result of something like Con 46%, Lab 32% would imply a thrashing rather than an annihilation of Labour - something not entirely unlike the 1987 result, albeit with the added complication of the SNP vote (i.e. the Tories may not get quite so many seats, but Labour should do worse than the Tories.) It also implies that a significant Liberal Democrat resurgence won't happen.

    And I still think they're over-counting Labour and under-counting the Liberal Democrats.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    HaroldO said:

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    The ransomware attack affected more than just hospitals which ameliorated the impact of any attack on the government.
    But the Tories need a solid manifesto, they need more funding for schools and hospitals at least.
    If they commit an extra £350m to the NHS it'd be an act of political genius - especially as it'll happen over time anyway. Although it'd financial folly without root and branch restructuring at the same time.

    Also, I'd almost certainly choke to death on a glass of (decent) whisky if that happened, so win-win. You'll miss me when I'm gone.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,039
    malcolmg said:
    Rather good :)

  • maaarshmaaarsh Posts: 3,592

    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.

    Yes, because the missing numbers are DK or neither - most of whom will be left leaning voters who probably know the correct answer to those questions but don't want to accept they should be relevant to how they vote.
  • GeoffMGeoffM Posts: 6,071
    RobD said:

    malcolmg said:

    How desperate can the Tories get.
    twitter.com/andysearson/status/863073898048479234/photo/1

    And yet she's still in the high 40s.
    Are you surprised? A crowd of fans has gathered just to watch her get off a bus!
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,408

    Interesting that more think they would pay less tax under Labour. Have they seen their manifesto?

    No-one thinks Labour will win. The hypothetical tax increase versus the one that will happen.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,075
    edited May 2017
    Off-topic: sounds like Hitman's been cancelled and Mass Effect is on ice.

    Hitman looked like a very good game, but the weird way it was rolled out can't have helped sales.

    Edited extra bit: anyway, I'm off.
  • TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,454
    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39907481

    Probably be an improvement if his son took over...I would guess already more intellectually capable than his father.
    Trudeau Snr still has a big lead in Canadian polls
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_43rd_Canadian_federal_election
    He went up in my opinion when he saw the light and ditched PR in favour of glorious FPTP.
    His poll lead ranges from 14 points to 0. I think some pollsters might be wrong...!
  • CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    edited May 2017
    maaarsh said:

    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.

    Yes, because the missing numbers are DK or neither - most of whom will be left leaning voters who probably know the correct answer to those questions but don't want to accept they should be relevant to how they vote.
    You're mistaking your opinion for a fact. Corbyn wishes to negotiate with Daesh. Daesh have said they wish to negotiate with the west. Daesh are an obscenely barbaric murdering death cult, but the British government's first responsibility is supposed to be to this country.
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 7,021
    So far went look to be seeing a moderate manifesto bounce for Labour (for a not-so-moderate manifesto). Tories still stubbornly clinging to the mid-to-high 40s. Without any substantial downwards movement for the Tories, Labour are going to struggle to break 200 seats as things stand.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830
    Cyan said:

    maaarsh said:

    #ComRes
    Most likely to keep Britain safe from terrorism

    May 47%
    Corbyn 14%

    #Comres
    Best to lead Britain’s negotiations over Brexit

    May 50%
    Corbyn 15%

    And Labour are at 32%. Right.

    Yes, because the missing numbers are DK or neither - most of whom will be left leaning voters who probably know the correct answer to those questions but don't want to accept they should be relevant to how they vote.
    You're mistaking your opinion for a fact.
    Another contender should PB need a new strapline.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39907481

    Probably be an improvement if his son took over...I would guess already more intellectually capable than his father.
    Trudeau Snr still has a big lead in Canadian polls
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_43rd_Canadian_federal_election
    He went up in my opinion when he saw the light and ditched PR in favour of glorious FPTP.
    Well he has a majority and wants to keep it
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,770

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    Bit difficult to confine it to the NHS when it was a worldwide attack hitting lots of different countries and industries

    No attacks in Wales, apparently. The Welsh government did pay for the security upgrade.

  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    felix said:

    MikeK said:

    For once I agree with TSE, in that the Tory campaign has up to now been dire, complacent and unfocused.

    It May changed once the manifestoes are printed and published; then again it May not.

    Right - are you predicting 100 or 200 for UKIP this time?
    No UKIP vote over 15% is my punt with isam. I am still happy with that. Nuttall is pants.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,683
    edited May 2017

    RobD said:

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Justin Trudeau brings his 3 year old son to work http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-39907481

    Probably be an improvement if his son took over...I would guess already more intellectually capable than his father.
    Trudeau Snr still has a big lead in Canadian polls
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_in_the_43rd_Canadian_federal_election
    He went up in my opinion when he saw the light and ditched PR in favour of glorious FPTP.
    His poll lead ranges from 14 points to 0. I think some pollsters might be wrong...!
    Most polls give the Liberals over 40% and the Tories at 30% or under, 1 has them tied on 35%. The Tories supposed Donald Trump figure, businessman Kevin O'Leary, dropped out of their leadership race in April saying he lacked support in Quebec leaving Mitt Romney figure Maxime Bernier, former vice-president of the Standard Life of Canada Insurance company, MEI as the current Tory leadership poll leader
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,830

    Off-topic: sounds like Hitman's been cancelled and Mass Effect is on ice.

    Hitman looked like a very good game, but the weird way it was rolled out can't have helped sales.

    Shame on the Mass Effect front. Andromeda is not great but there's potential and they've shown before they can make big improvements been installments, as have other creators - The Witcher 2 is leagues beyond The Witcher for instance.
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,039

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    Bit difficult to confine it to the NHS when it was a worldwide attack hitting lots of different countries and industries

    No attacks in Wales, apparently. The Welsh government did pay for the security upgrade.

    I suspect the truth of your statement is akin to the truth of the viz article linked earlier. The security upgrade is of course free.
  • NeilVWNeilVW Posts: 733

    Re polls: what GB percentage (as quoted in the polls) corresponds to a UK percentage of 30?

    As an example, in 2015 Miliband scored 30.4% UK-wide and 31.2% GB-wide.
  • CyanCyan Posts: 1,262
    edited May 2017
    Omnium said:

    It looks like the Tories might have dodged two bullets this week. The expenses stuff and now the NHS ransom-ware. Given nearly all the NHS trusts are back online, there is limited scope for attacking the government handling (although in these situation the role of central government is always overstated both positively and negatively).

    Bit difficult to confine it to the NHS when it was a worldwide attack hitting lots of different countries and industries

    No attacks in Wales, apparently. The Welsh government did pay for the security upgrade.

    I suspect the truth of your statement is akin to the truth of the viz article linked earlier. The security upgrade is of course free.
    If it weren't free to obtain, it would be Microsoft who were holding organisations to ransom. But surely installation costs money in administration?
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    Sean_F said:

    kle4 said:

    It's up up up for Labour. Tories reached their ceiling (48-50), Labour reached their floor (26-30)

    Being behind by 14-18% is not something to celebrate.
    No, but it encourages all their support to firm up, and save seats that might otherwise be lost, and so prevents the worst possible scenarios.

    Getting a bad result rather than a disastrous one is not a win for Labour, but it is better. At the moment the Tories are lazy, assuming that because Corbyn has poor ratings they need say nothing (we keep hearing they are holding back - until when? And why?), and while his allies have messed up Corbyn so far has not, meaning the 'let him tie his own rope' strategy has been ineffective, even if it has not led to a shift that would change the outcome from anything other than a Tory win.
    It depends what you mean by disastrous. I expect this year to be 1997 in reverse.
    Isn't Corbyn surviving Labour's worst possible scenario according to many soft-leftists/'centrists'?
  • malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 43,718
    GeoffM said:

    RobD said:

    malcolmg said:

    How desperate can the Tories get.
    twitter.com/andysearson/status/863073898048479234/photo/1

    And yet she's still in the high 40s.
    Are you surprised? A crowd of fans has gathered just to watch her get off a bus!
    They were on the bus with her , you don't think she would actually meet a real human from the public surely.
  • steve_garnersteve_garner Posts: 1,019
    Squeaky bum time for the Tories. Labour's high visibility campaign on popular policies is remorselessly closing the polling gap.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,408
    MTimT said:

    Clearly time for the Tories to panic - their polling is so consistently in the 46-48% range none is even commenting about it anymore.

    This election is a choice between an enormous Conservative majority or merely a large one. I might have pointed out"strong and stable" sounds ever so slightly entitled in that environment and perhaps a little counterproductive, but the conclusion is so foregone that it doesn't make any difference.
This discussion has been closed.