On wines, I fear the world has caught up and overtaken France except at the very high end (for me, that mean Burgundies red and white, rather than Bordeaux).
I think you're out of date there. French winemakers have really upped their game in the last few years. In my opinion, the most dynamic wine-producing region in the world today is southern France, especially Languedoc-Roussillon - and the prices are very keen, in sharp contrast to the good wines of Italy, Spain or elsewhere.
Bordeaux is a huge wine growing area. The best middle market wines are seriously good value. You have to work through a lot of dull wines to get to them.
@Sunil - You'll have to go back to Manchester in December to do the Ordsall Chord
Yes I saw it under construction!
Actually there are five stations in Greater Manchester that I haven't visited or passed through: Westhoughton on the Bolton to Wigan link, Hall i'th' Wood and Bromley Cross on the Blackburn line, and Reddish South and Denton on the Friday morning only "ghost train" from Stockport to Stalybridge.
Hall i'th' Wood has a decent little museum at the hall should you visit. It is maintained as a Tudor mansion would have been, and is well worth a look if you are at all interested in such things.
@SeanT - I suggest you do the Loire valley. Purely for selfish reasons as the resulting travel tips would be more useful for me.
I toured the Loire valley in the summer of 1962 on an ES2 Norton motorbike, staying at youth hostels (!). "sol et luminaire" was, I think, just coming in. Do they still do that? It's kinda cheesy, but the food, French, culture, and countryside was great for a youngster.
France is not what it was, though, in terms of food (or indeed wine, or many other things)
I have been to France a dozen times in the last few years, I cannot remember a single meal that stands out. I can, by contrast, remember special meals in London, Cornwall, Devon, Calabria, Venice, Bhutan, India, Zambia.
The food in Lyon and the surrounding area was actively YUK. Tho not as bad as Bolivia. Or Germany.
In terms of landscapes France remains wonderful. That presumably will not change. The Dordogne is sensationally lovely to look at, even in deep Autumn.
You probably went to the wrong restaurants in Germany. There are loads of interesting fine dining restaurants , where most of the chefs are women unusually.
On wines, I fear the world has caught up and overtaken France except at the very high end (for me, that mean Burgundies red and white, rather than Bordeaux).
I think you're out of date there. French winemakers have really upped their game in the last few years. In my opinion, the most dynamic wine-producing region in the world today is southern France, especially Languedoc-Roussillon - and the prices are very keen, in sharp contrast to the good wines of Italy, Spain or elsewhere.
Thanks, Richard. You're probably right about me being out of date for that region of France.
@SeanT - I suggest you do the Loire valley. Purely for selfish reasons as the resulting travel tips would be more useful for me.
I toured the Loire valley in the summer of 1962 on an ES2 Norton motorbike, staying at youth hostels (!). "sol et luminaire" was, I think, just coming in. Do they still do that? It's kinda cheesy, but the food, French, culture, and countryside was great for a youngster.
France is not what it was, though, in terms of food (or indeed wine, or many other things)
I have been to France a dozen times in the last few years, I cannot remember a single meal that stands out. I can, by contrast, remember special meals in London, Cornwall, Devon, Calabria, Venice, Bhutan, India, Zambia.
The food in Lyon and the surrounding area was actively YUK. Tho not as bad as Bolivia. Or Germany.
In terms of landscapes France remains wonderful. That presumably will not change. The Dordogne is sensationally lovely to look at, even in deep Autumn.
Yes, I know you've said that before about French food.
But when I toured there I had very little money. Then, British student refectory food involved things like greasy chips and cauliflower cooked to a pasty consistency. Oh my god. Cafe food in France then had an inviolable basement considerably above that.
English fare has now truly risen, thanks no doubt in part to immigration.
Yep. I can remember when getting the ferry from Dover to Calais was like travelling between two different food universes, one - France - infinitely superior to the other
I'd now, I think, rather eat in the average Kentish gastropub than a Picardy brasserie, or at least they are about equal. I would definitely prefer to eat in London than Paris.
Hmm. London is perhaps better now at the high end, more creative restaurants with more variety. But in Paris you are much more likely to get a good meal for a better price than in London, if you're just looking for somewhere on a saturday evening etc.
Well I bolloxed that up by catching the first train that ran to York - if I had waited for the Leeds train I would have got to Leeds half an hour earlier. At least I'm now on the last train home, and should be turning the key in the lock by around 00:20 - only 2 hours and 50 minutes late.
On topic(!). I hope that Le Pen can be squeezed out of the top two, so that it becomes a proper election, based on proper issues, rather than just 'Stop Le Pen'.
Totally off topic, three drunk lesbians sat opposite me...
@SeanT - I suggest you do the Loire valley. Purely for selfish reasons as the resulting travel tips would be more useful for me.
I toured the Loire valley in the summer of 1962 on an ES2 Norton motorbike, staying at youth hostels (!). "sol et luminaire" was, I think, just coming in. Do they still do that? It's kinda cheesy, but the food, French, culture, and countryside was great for a youngster.
France is not what it was, though, in terms of food (or indeed wine, or many other things)
I have been to France a dozen times in the last few years, I cannot remember a single meal that stands out. I can, by contrast, remember special meals in London, Cornwall, Devon, Calabria, Venice, Bhutan, India, Zambia.
The food in Lyon and the surrounding area was actively YUK. Tho not as bad as Bolivia. Or Germany.
In terms of landscapes France remains wonderful. That presumably will not change. The Dordogne is sensationally lovely to look at, even in deep Autumn.
This has been my experience too. I used to love going to France for many reasons, including its bread. Now, even the bread is meh... Still some great cheeses, thankfully.
On wines, I fear the world has caught up and overtaken France except at the very high end (for me, that mean Burgundies red and white, rather than Bordeaux).
Good white Burgundy remains one of the seven wonders of the world. There is still no white chardonnay that compares to a good Puligny Montrachet.
Red Burgundy? Pffft. Overpriced crap. If I have to drink a Pinot, then there are much better US ones.
High end red Bordeaux can be very good, but is simply not cost competitive.
Which region in the US for Pinots? I far prefer Oregon and Washington state over California. But I am surprised that you find them better (to me more complex, within the limits of still tasting good) than the top Burgundies.
@SeanT - I suggest you do the Loire valley. Purely for selfish reasons as the resulting travel tips would be more useful for me.
I toured the Loire valley in the summer of 1962 on an ES2 Norton motorbike, staying at youth hostels (!). "sol et luminaire" was, I think, just coming in. Do they still do that? It's kinda cheesy, but the food, French, culture, and countryside was great for a youngster.
France is not what it was, though, in terms of food (or indeed wine, or many other things)
I have been to France a dozen times in the last few years, I cannot remember a single meal that stands out. I can, by contrast, remember special meals in London, Cornwall, Devon, Calabria, Venice, Bhutan, India, Zambia.
The food in Lyon and the surrounding area was actively YUK. Tho not as bad as Bolivia. Or Germany.
In terms of landscapes France remains wonderful. That presumably will not change. The Dordogne is sensationally lovely to look at, even in deep Autumn.
This has been my experience too. I used to love going to France for many reasons, including its bread. Now, even the bread is meh... Still some great cheeses, thankfully.
On wines, I fear the world has caught up and overtaken France except at the very high end (for me, that mean Burgundies red and white, rather than Bordeaux).
Good white Burgundy remains one of the seven wonders of the world. There is still no white chardonnay that compares to a good Puligny Montrachet.
Red Burgundy? Pffft. Overpriced crap. If I have to drink a Pinot, then there are much better US ones.
High end red Bordeaux can be very good, but is simply not cost competitive.
Thing is claret has such a simple classification system it makes it cost and effort effective vs trying to find a great new discovery or gem from anywhere else.
Have you considered doing research on the Internet?
Life is both too short to stuff a mushroom and also to work out an alternative to a solid fourth or fifth growth or a decent cru bourgeois.
Apparently some people have actually given NUMERICAL scores to wines.
On the rights of EU citizens, I think we should have made an initial offer unilaterally, which would have shown good faith. The idea that the Spaniards would actually frogmarch Brits out of Spain after that is ridiculous. The EU would throw away any potential moral high ground it may have been able to claim post-brexit. It would have allowed the issue to be settled much earlier on both sides and avoid uncertainty. Now, if we are forced to do it unilaterally, there is no goodwill involved so no advantage to the UK (it's still the right thing to do morally though).
@SeanT - I suggest you do the Loire valley. Purely for selfish reasons as the resulting travel tips would be more useful for me.
I toured the Loire valley in the summer of 1962 on an ES2 Norton motorbike, staying at youth hostels (!). "sol et luminaire" was, I think, just coming in. Do they still do that? It's kinda cheesy, but the food, French, culture, and countryside was great for a youngster.
France is not what it was, though, in terms of food (or indeed wine, or many other things)
I have been to France a dozen times in the last few years, I cannot remember a single meal that stands out. I can, by contrast, remember special meals in London, Cornwall, Devon, Calabria, Venice, Bhutan, India, Zambia.
The food in Lyon and the surrounding area was actively YUK. Tho not as bad as Bolivia. Or Germany.
In terms of landscapes France remains wonderful. That presumably will not change. The Dordogne is sensationally lovely to look at, even in deep Autumn.
This has been my experience too. I used to love going to France for many reasons, including its bread. Now, even the bread is meh... Still some great cheeses, thankfully.
On wines, I fear the world has caught up and overtaken France except at the very high end (for me, that mean Burgundies red and white, rather than Bordeaux).
Good white Burgundy remains one of the seven wonders of the world. There is still no white chardonnay that compares to a good Puligny Montrachet.
Red Burgundy? Pffft. Overpriced crap. If I have to drink a Pinot, then there are much better US ones.
High end red Bordeaux can be very good, but is simply not cost competitive.
Which region in the US for Pinots? I far prefer Oregon and Washington state over California. But I am surprised that you find them better (to me more complex, within the limits of still tasting good) than the top Burgundies.
I second this question. I know the Russian River/Sonoma region well and while I do think their Pinots are excellent quality, they can be a bit predictable and lack the character and infinite variety of Burgundy, dollar for dollar.
I haven't had a chance to check but I guess it's been pointed out that Osborne seems to think that if we're not in the single market then we won't have any trade with Europe.
I am increasingly concerned about a Le Pen victory however. Even the biggest Le Pen sceptics have to see that everything has been moving in her favour for months. I read her manifesto and I think it will go down very well with a number of people. She is not shying away from the idea of putting French people first and at the open expense of all others (while also making it harder to actually get French citizenship). Yet the manifesto is professional and 'sensible' enough in other areas to be taken seriously as a true presidential manifesto.
In my opinion, the most dynamic wine-producing region in the world today is southern France, especially Languedoc-Roussillon
I don't drink alcohol, but I do attune my antennae to anthroposophist wackos.
They bury manure in cow horns, dig the horns up a lot later, mix the manure with water, stir it in a figure of eight, and use it as fertiliser. They are completely bonkers. Biodynamic wines have become a big thing in Languedoc-Roussillon, although I've no idea whether that's in the section of the market people are discussing here.
I am increasingly concerned about a Le Pen victory however. Even the biggest Le Pen sceptics have to see that everything has been moving in her favour for months. I read her manifesto and I think it will go down very well with a number of people. She is not shying away from the idea of putting French people first and at the open expense of all others (while also making it harder to actually get French citizenship). Yet the manifesto is professional and 'sensible' enough in other areas to be taken seriously as a true presidential manifesto.
Her point no.2, on referendums, is especially scary. Hello death penalty. Hello goodness knows what indignities thrown at Muslims. Her pal Wilders promises to close mosques and ban the Koran. After 1945 plebiscites were banned in Germany for decades with good reason.
The biggest concern is that if he did, he might try and bring back his mate TPD Reckless with him too.... now that would need a lot of nose-clips
Interesting - we assumed this, but good to have it confirmed:
“Douglas has been voting with the Tories anyway and will continue to do so, he's the only Ukip MP in the House but he's basically counted as another Tory already.”
May's position in the House gets a little bit easier....
Well I bolloxed that up by catching the first train that ran to York - if I had waited for the Leeds train I would have got to Leeds half an hour earlier. At least I'm now on the last train home, and should be turning the key in the lock by around 00:20 - only 2 hours and 50 minutes late.
On topic(!). I hope that Le Pen can be squeezed out of the top two, so that it becomes a proper election, based on proper issues, rather than just 'Stop Le Pen'.
Totally off topic, three drunk lesbians sat opposite me...
Best wishes Sandy. Have a good night's rest, whatever's left of it!
@Sunil - You'll have to go back to Manchester in December to do the Ordsall Chord
Yes I saw it under construction!
Actually there are five stations in Greater Manchester that I haven't visited or passed through: Westhoughton on the Bolton to Wigan link, Hall i'th' Wood and Bromley Cross on the Blackburn line, and Reddish South and Denton on the Friday morning only "ghost train" from Stockport to Stalybridge.
Hall i'th' Wood has a decent little museum at the hall should you visit. It is maintained as a Tudor mansion would have been, and is well worth a look if you are at all interested in such things.
Some PBers will be familiar with the unusual triangular arrangement.
I of course refer to the platforms at Shipley station - whatever might you have been thinking?!?
I completed the triangle last Tuesday. Did Ilkley to Bradford and Bradford to Saltaire. The third side was done a couple of weeks earlier, Leeds to Skipton.
Well I bolloxed that up by catching the first train that ran to York - if I had waited for the Leeds train I would have got to Leeds half an hour earlier. At least I'm now on the last train home, and should be turning the key in the lock by around 00:20 - only 2 hours and 50 minutes late.
On topic(!). I hope that Le Pen can be squeezed out of the top two, so that it becomes a proper election, based on proper issues, rather than just 'Stop Le Pen'.
Totally off topic, three drunk lesbians sat opposite me...
Marine Le Pen in the final two would be a contest on issues, immigration, globalisation, the Euro and protectionism paramount amongst them
Well I bolloxed that up by catching the first train that ran to York - if I had waited for the Leeds train I would have got to Leeds half an hour earlier. At least I'm now on the last train home, and should be turning the key in the lock by around 00:20 - only 2 hours and 50 minutes late.
On topic(!). I hope that Le Pen can be squeezed out of the top two, so that it becomes a proper election, based on proper issues, rather than just 'Stop Le Pen'.
Totally off topic, three drunk lesbians sat opposite me...
Hope you got home safely! I was actually in Leeds all of last week
Some PBers will be familiar with the unusual triangular arrangement.
I of course refer to the platforms at Shipley station - whatever might you have been thinking?!?
I completed the triangle last Tuesday. Did Ilkley to Bradford and Bradford to Saltaire. The third side was done a couple of weeks earlier, Leeds to Skipton.
Did you visit the David Hockney exhibition centre at Saltaire? One of my favourite galleries.
2. do a tour of the Loire chateaux, vineyards and famous gardens.
My instinct is to go for Rome: better weather, better art, and better food. But I've never been to the Loire valley.
Is the Loire any good? Or is it just a bunch of big houses and mediocre bistros?
My recent trips to Dordogne, and Lyon, have slightly put me off France. The food is in serious relative decline. BUT I have been to Rome many times. And basically seen it all.
"But I've never been to the Loire valley" I think you've just answered your own question.
Yes, I think that is the answer. Rome would probably be, intrinsically, the greater experience, the food will be spectac, I'd get special views of incredible art, they'll probably get me to sign a gold-hinged Latin translation of THE GENESIS SECRET for an embarrassingly grovelling Pope but... I've never been to the Loire.
My motto in life hitherto has always been: go to the new place, see the new girl, make the new friend, try writing the new genre in fiction, and it has served me well.
The Loire it is. Those chateaux better put out.
Thankyou PB for all the advice.
Chenonceaux is the glamour shot of course, but Azay le Rideau is a little gem.
Seconded - and add Loches for its history and dramatic setting, Valencay for its gardens and Cheverney if you're a Tintin fan.
Some PBers will be familiar with the unusual triangular arrangement.
I of course refer to the platforms at Shipley station - whatever might you have been thinking?!?
I completed the triangle last Tuesday. Did Ilkley to Bradford and Bradford to Saltaire. The third side was done a couple of weeks earlier, Leeds to Skipton.
Did you visit the David Hockney exhibition centre at Saltaire? One of my favourite galleries.
No, I didn't. I did walk down to the bridges across the canal and the River Aire.
In my opinion, the most dynamic wine-producing region in the world today is southern France, especially Languedoc-Roussillon
I don't drink alcohol, but I do attune my antennae to anthroposophist wackos.
They bury manure in cow horns, dig the horns up a lot later, mix the manure with water, stir it in a figure of eight, and use it as fertiliser. They are completely bonkers. Biodynamic wines have become a big thing in Languedoc-Roussillon, although I've no idea whether that's in the section of the market people are discussing here.
It sounds like a fun hobby. Wacko spotting, I mean.
Some PBers will be familiar with the unusual triangular arrangement.
I of course refer to the platforms at Shipley station - whatever might you have been thinking?!?
I completed the triangle last Tuesday. Did Ilkley to Bradford and Bradford to Saltaire. The third side was done a couple of weeks earlier, Leeds to Skipton.
Did you visit the David Hockney exhibition centre at Saltaire? One of my favourite galleries.
No, I didn't. I did walk down to the bridges across the canal and the River Aire.
Some PBers will be familiar with the unusual triangular arrangement.
I of course refer to the platforms at Shipley station - whatever might you have been thinking?!?
I completed the triangle last Tuesday. Did Ilkley to Bradford and Bradford to Saltaire. The third side was done a couple of weeks earlier, Leeds to Skipton.
Did you visit the David Hockney exhibition centre at Saltaire? One of my favourite galleries.
No, I didn't. I did walk down to the bridges across the canal and the River Aire.
That's a shame, if you're interested in Hockney.
I saw Salts Mill from the bridge over the railway, but didn't realise was an exhibition centre.
He gets cheered for everything, it's like Nuremberg
It's a long-standing US tradition that States of the Union addresses and the like received ridiculous amounts of applause that make Brits cringe.
This surprised my for the fact that Trump kept so well on message. A few bits of absolute red meat that made the Dems gasp (task force for illegal immigrant crime). But then some really good stuff (repeal and replace, smooth transition for those in exchanges, keeping existing condition insurance, cross state line insurance).
If this turns out to be the real President Trump, rather than the campaign stump speech or the Twitterstorm, then I for one will be much relieved.
Interesting that, apart for the homage to the fallen Special Ops guy, the support for NATO line got the most applause.
If only Theresa-the-appeaser hadn't gone to Washington and bolstered Trump's support for NATO....much smarter to stay at home like Angela waiting for Trump to return her call....
If only Theresa-the-appeaser hadn't gone to Washington and bolstered Trump's support for NATO....much smarter to stay at home like Angela waiting for Trump to return her call....
Did the Munich Security Conference pass you by? When is anyone from the Trump administration coming to London again? What a pickle...
Comments
At the very least, you need to try some of the better Italian, Argentinian and US Bordeaux-blends. (I.e. Cab Sauvignion - Merlot.)
I maintain Ridge Monte Bello is the best Bordeaux in the world.
On topic(!). I hope that Le Pen can be squeezed out of the top two, so that it becomes a proper election, based on proper issues, rather than just 'Stop Le Pen'.
Totally off topic, three drunk lesbians sat opposite me...
Macron 36% (-6)
Hamon 34% (-1)
Fillon 28% (-2)
Dupont-Aignan 23% (+6) <----------- !!
Marine Le Pen 25% (+4)
Mélenchon 30% (+2)
Polarisation!
Hollande 26% (+3)
Cazeneuve 40% (-2)
Does anyone believe that here?
Some PBers will be familiar with the unusual triangular arrangement.
I of course refer to the platforms at Shipley station - whatever might you have been thinking?!?
"We have passed" said Franco.
“Douglas has been voting with the Tories anyway and will continue to do so, he's the only Ukip MP in the House but he's basically counted as another Tory already.”
May's position in the House gets a little bit easier....
He gets cheered for everything, it's like Nuremberg
This surprised my for the fact that Trump kept so well on message. A few bits of absolute red meat that made the Dems gasp (task force for illegal immigrant crime). But then some really good stuff (repeal and replace, smooth transition for those in exchanges, keeping existing condition insurance, cross state line insurance).
If this turns out to be the real President Trump, rather than the campaign stump speech or the Twitterstorm, then I for one will be much relieved.
Interesting that, apart for the homage to the fallen Special Ops guy, the support for NATO line got the most applause.
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/opinion/donald-trump-looked-presidential-in-his-first-speech-to-congress/news-story/
If only Theresa-the-appeaser hadn't gone to Washington and bolstered Trump's support for NATO....much smarter to stay at home like Angela waiting for Trump to return her call....
http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/02/donald-trump-congressional-speech?mbid=social_twitter
They seem to have gone to the next NEW THREAD.Are we talking on two thread at once atm ?