I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
I presume you are referring to the sex between consenting adults. Did not even think of incest in that context. But how often would incest actually meet both the consenting and adult qualifications in the question?
There is one live case going though the courts in New Mexico at the moment. and some more historic one in New Zeeland. (half brothers/sisters who married without knowing they where Brother/sister become they had been adopted at birth and maries in the 1970/80s that now the records have been crosschecked have technically had there mirages invalidated nobody is trying to arrest them, but have your marage invalidated is still a bit off in my books.
While I share the yuck feeling with most on hear, my feeling are not sufficient reason to make adult Lovers in to criminals, or split up a family.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
I presume you are referring to the sex between consenting adults. Did not even think of incest in that context. But how often would incest actually meet both the consenting and adult qualifications in the question?
There is one live case going though the courts in New Mexico at the moment. and some more historic one in New Zeeland. (half brothers/sisters who married without knowing they where Brother/sister become they had been adopted at birth and maries in the 1970/80s that now the records have been crosschecked have technically had there mirages invalidated nobody is trying to arrest them, but have your marage invalidated is still a bit off in my books.
While I share the yuck feeling with most on hear, my feeling are not sufficient reason to make adult Lovers in to criminals, or split up a family.
Agreed. "It's icky" is not a sound basis for law, IMHO.
What MORI should have measured is the graph of satisfaction with Corbyn taken from those who (say they) voted Labour in 2015, rather than taking it from those who say they intend to vote Labour when each poll is taken. Since support for the party has fallen since Corbyn was elected in September 2015, and especially since Brexit in May 2016, none of the opinions of the (net) number abandoning Labour are being measured. And given that they've abandoned Labour, you can probably count the number of those satisfied with Corbyn in single % figures.
So I think the move towards net dissatisfaction with Corbyn is much more stark than even that rather damning graph indicates.
Apologies if the point has already been made far downthread - it is a rather obvious one so I suspect that someone already has.
Immediately before the last GE Mori forecast the UK Left triumvirate of Lib/Lab/Green would poll 48. They polled 43. An overstatement of five.
They forecast a Remain vote of 55. Remain polled 48. An overstatement of seven.
Even in today's poll they think that Con/UKIP are on 49 - which means the right have theoretically lost votes since 2015, Corbyn's appointment and the referendum. That defies logic.
By contrast:
Com Res 52 ICM 54 Yougov 54 Opinium 51
In what way is UKIP right wing?
In the way that they are commonly described as right wing.
I find left-right to be quite a lazy way of thinking, I prefer authoritarian-libertarian, and I think they come out on the authoritarian (i.e. left wing) end of the scale.
Is this trolling? Traditionally authoritarianism is seen as orthogonal to the left-right axis, so there are left and right wing authoritarians.
You need the second axis for this to make sense. So Authoritarian-egalitarian on one axis, and collectivist-libertarian on the other. Unless that is what you were meaning, Robert.
Here - have some fun with the world's smallest political quiz .....
It would be interesting to have a poll or something on PB to see what the actual political makeup of the posters on this site is - seeing as there is so much debate BTL about whether it is broadly left/right/far right etc
Well, keep in mind the party you currently vote for doesn't necessarily mean much in terms of whether your are right or left wing.
I mean, despite being branded a "PB Tory" for ten years on here, I've just come out as left-liberal on the political compass.
A lot of people would have voted Tory in 2010 and 2015 and will be doing so again in 2020 because they alternative is so terrible. I know speaking for myself (and I suspect there's a lot like me) if the Opposition got it's act together there's no reason I couldn't be persuaded to vote Labour (or indeed Lib-Dem) depending on the circumstances at the time - After all I have voted both Lab and Lib in general elections in the past.
It would be interesting to have a poll or something on PB to see what the actual political makeup of the posters on this site is - seeing as there is so much debate BTL about whether it is broadly left/right/far right etc
Well, keep in mind the party you currently vote for doesn't necessarily mean much in terms of whether your are right or left wing.
I mean, despite being branded a "PB Tory" for ten years on here, I've just come out as left-liberal on the political compass.
A lot of people would have voted Tory in 2015 and will be doing so again in 2015 because they opposition is so terrible. I know speaking for myself (and I suspect there's a lot like me) if the Opposition got it's act together there's no reason I couldn't be persuaded to vote Labour (or indeed Lib-Dem) depending on the circumstances at the time - After all I have voted both Lab and Lib in general elections in the past.
I think what these charts show us is that you can be fairly right wing in the UK and still be a lily livered liberal lefty in the States.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
I presume you are referring to the sex between consenting adults. Did not even think of incest in that context. But how often would incest actually meet both the consenting and adult qualifications in the question?
There is one live case going though the courts in New Mexico at the moment. and some more historic one in New Zeeland. (half brothers/sisters who married without knowing they where Brother/sister become they had been adopted at birth and maries in the 1970/80s that now the records have been crosschecked have technically had there mirages invalidated nobody is trying to arrest them, but have your marage invalidated is still a bit off in my books.
While I share the yuck feeling with most on hear, my feeling are not sufficient reason to make adult Lovers in to criminals, or split up a family.
Agreed. "It's icky" is not a sound basis for law, IMHO.
Looking at the detailed MORI tables, the most damning statistic against Corbyn is this:
Amongst those who voted Labour in 2015 ONLY: "Are you satisfied or dissatisfied with the way Theresa May/Jeremy Corbyn is doing their job as PM/Leader of the Labour Party" May: Satisfied 33% Dissatisfied 56% Corbyn: Satisfied 32% Dissatisfied 57%
Personally I do think its perfectly possible for someone to be more liberal/left/conservative/right than they think, because as labels they are often widely interpreted, not even taking into account the different standards within different countries as to what are liberal or conservative positions. We know this to be true because it is very easy to find people supporting a policy until they find out which party is proposing it, then they change their mind, or condemning something their opponent does supposedly on ideological grounds when its discovered their side once did the same thing. People often seem to vote or belong to the tribe they think they are supposed to, based on an image of that tribe that might be out of date or just plain false.
That's not to say most of these tests are much good of course. My favourite was one put up around a GE, which rated against parties and had me within 5% on four of them. Either they really are very similar, or I am very confused politically.
Others sometimes suggest my closest party march is Plaid Cymru, which is no bloody good as I cannot vote for them even if I wanted.
OK, well I see all these fancy graphs. But given the audience on PB, I think one's outlook politically can actually best be summarised by the achieved ending to The Witcher 3.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
If you are going to outlaw M-F incest on the basis that it poses a risk to potential children - does the logic not follow that those with inheritable disabilities should also be banned from sex?
So Trump is saying it is all fake news, meanwhile his Defence Sec confirms Russians has interfered, or attempted to interfere, in a number of elections in democracies.
OK, well I see all these fancy graphs. But given the audience on PB, I think one's outlook politically can actually best be summarised by the achieved ending to The Witcher 3.
Requires a lot more time to complete that as far as analyses go, admittedly.
This is bizarre. Basically Labour are reliant on public sector middle managers worried about their pensions and "retirement packages". There really is no one else left.
No, it's feeble-minded prejudice-addled analysis from you.
Where's this nonsense about "public sector middle managers" come from ? Do you know one, are you one, would you like to be one ?
I just wonder how many public sector middle managers make up Stephen Timms' 35,000 majority here in East Ham ? In my experience, there are plenty of Conservative supporters among the public sector.
Clearly, Corbyn has a bedrock of support which may be disproportionately in some areas, age groups and social groups. My only observation is that a poll among the supposedly-educated (those with a Degree) shows less support for the Conservatives. I don't draw any conclusions from that but I do observe it.
By the way, Baxter Lab 35, Con 32, LD 21 and the only winner is Nicola S.
A Corbyn-led Labour Party may well take push up its vote in London, university cities, and some centres of government, while falling back everywhere else.
Unlikely, the Tories won graduates at the last election and I expect Corbyn to do worse than Miliband with the university educated through losses to the LDs
OK, well I see all these fancy graphs. But given the audience on PB, I think one's outlook politically can actually best be summarised by the achieved ending to The Witcher 3.
There are times I feel very ignorant. This is one of them. I'm dimly aware that The Witcher 3 is a video game...
This is bizarre. Basically Labour are reliant on public sector middle managers worried about their pensions and "retirement packages". There really is no one else left.
No, it's feeble-minded prejudice-addled analysis from you.
Where's this nonsense about "public sector middle managers" come from ? Do you know one, are you one, would you like to be one ?
I just wonder how many public sector middle managers make up Stephen Timms' 35,000 majority here in East Ham ? In my experience, there are plenty of Conservative supporters among the public sector.
Clearly, Corbyn has a bedrock of support which may be disproportionately in some areas, age groups and social groups. My only observation is that a poll among the supposedly-educated (those with a Degree) shows less support for the Conservatives. I don't draw any conclusions from that but I do observe it.
By the way, Baxter Lab 35, Con 32, LD 21 and the only winner is Nicola S.
A Corbyn-led Labour Party may well take push up its vote in London, university cities, and some centres of government, while falling back everywhere else.
Unlikely, the Tories won graduates at the last election and I expect Corbyn to do worse than Miliband with the university educated through losses to the LDs
The Tories may have won graduates but not necessarily university cities. The two are not the same thing at all.
I find there's a major political divide between graduates who go and get a job in the "real world" who will be spread across the country and those who remain in academia (concentrated in the uni cities).
So, this draining the swamp thing actually meant destroying a free press.
Hey, if people no longer hear about the swamp, that's like its drained, right? Just like how stopping people complaining about it is the same as making the trains run on time.
Eventually, unless he truly does shake things up and sees an improvement in effective and reasonable government, Trump's ramblings will cease working even on his supporters, right? Might not be for awhile, but if he doesn't deliver his schtick will stop working, surely?
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
In the most cases where there has been M-F incest, it is between Half brothers/sisters, this may still feel, icky, but in terms of DNA cross over for any offspring it is the same amount 25% duplication as first cousins. which I would think nobody on hear wants to make illegal.
I realise this still does not fully address your issue, but anyway I don't feel I have the right to tell any consenting adult who they can or can not have sex with.
Amongst those who voted Labour in 2015 ONLY: "Are you satisfied or dissatisfied with the way Jeremy Corbyn is doing his job as Leader of the Labour Party" Feb 2017: Satisfied 32% Dissatisfied 57% Oct 2015: Satisfied 54% Dissatisfied 25%
A much bigger turnaround then than the graph at the top of this thread suggests.
This is bizarre. Basically Labour are reliant on public sector middle managers worried about their pensions and "retirement packages". There really is no one else left.
LMAO. Some PBTories really seem to think everyone who works in the private sector are working for Pricewaterhouse Coopers or something similar.
I work in "the private sector" (a small shop), and most of the people we work with have about as Labourish opinions on the NHS, taxing the rich, banks, etc. as you can get. (Admittedly they are not much enamoured of Corbyn himself.)
This is bizarre. Basically Labour are reliant on public sector middle managers worried about their pensions and "retirement packages". There really is no one else left.
LMAO. Some PBTories really seem to think everyone who works in the private sector are working for Pricewaterhouse Coopers or something similar.
I work in "the private sector" (a small shop), and most of the people we work with have about as Labourish opinions on the NHS, taxing the rich, banks, etc. as you can get. (Admittedly they are not much enamoured of Corbyn himself.)
Further to this: that same IPSOS-MORI poll says Labour trails the Tories by "only" 8% among private sector workers (not dramatically different to a 1% Labour lead with public-sector workers). Much of the Tories' lead seems to come from a walloping lead with the retired.
So, this draining the swamp thing actually meant destroying a free press.
Hey, if people no longer hear about the swamp, that's like its drained, right? Just like how stopping people complaining about it is the same as making the trains run on time.
He's mad. Downright mad. Just rambling on to himself.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
In the most cases where there has been M-F incest, it is between Half brothers/sisters, this may still feel, icky, but in terms of DNA cross over for any offspring it is the same amount 25% duplication as first cousins. which I would think nobody on hear wants to make illegal.
I realise this still does not fully address your issue, but anyway I don't feel I have the right to tell any consenting adult who they can or can not have sex with.
I thought first cousin incest was illegal and I'm OK with it being so.
@KateEMcCann: Trump is literally pissed off because people are "finding out what took place" via THE PRESS reporting when he speaks to foreign leaders.
@jessicaelgot: Donald Trump is accusing newspapers of committing journalism
(((Dan Hodges))) @DPJHodges 6m6 minutes ago More I genuinely don't see how Congress allows this man to remain President of the United States for the next 4 years.
A problem with that is the commonplace marriage of first cousins among Pakistani Muslims, which is leading to an increase in children (particularly boys) born with learning difficulties.
A problem with that is the commonplace marriage of first cousins among Pakistani Muslims, which is leading to an increase in children (particularly boys) born with learning difficulties.
Seems like evidence enough to change the law and make it illegal then.
(((Dan Hodges))) @DPJHodges 6m6 minutes ago More I genuinely don't see how Congress allows this man to remain President of the United States for the next 4 years.
This is bizarre. Basically Labour are reliant on public sector middle managers worried about their pensions and "retirement packages". There really is no one else left.
LMAO. Some PBTories really seem to think everyone who works in the private sector are working for Pricewaterhouse Coopers or something similar.
I work in "the private sector" (a small shop), and most of the people we work with have about as Labourish opinions on the NHS, taxing the rich, banks, etc. as you can get. (Admittedly they are not much enamoured of Corbyn himself.)
Further to this: that same IPSOS-MORI poll says Labour trails the Tories by "only" 8% among private sector workers (not dramatically different to a 1% Labour lead with public-sector workers). Much of the Tories' lead seems to come from a walloping lead with the retired.
This is bizarre. Basically Labour are reliant on public sector middle managers worried about their pensions and "retirement packages". There really is no one else left.
LMAO. Some PBTories really seem to think everyone who works in the private sector are working for Pricewaterhouse Coopers or something similar.
I work in "the private sector" (a small shop), and most of the people we work with have about as Labourish opinions on the NHS, taxing the rich, banks, etc. as you can get. (Admittedly they are not much enamoured of Corbyn himself.)
Further to this: that same IPSOS-MORI poll says Labour trails the Tories by "only" 8% among private sector workers (not dramatically different to a 1% Labour lead with public-sector workers). Much of the Tories' lead seems to come from a walloping lead with the retired.
Yeah, but they vote.
Sure, but it still goes against the idea that no-one except "public sector middle-managers" has any sympathy with Labour, since IPSOS says their support with private-sector workers is about the same as its national average.
@KateEMcCann: Trump is literally pissed off because people are "finding out what took place" via THE PRESS reporting when he speaks to foreign leaders.
@jessicaelgot: Donald Trump is accusing newspapers of committing journalism
Well, a British government had an MP arrested for aiding & abetting the commission of journalism embarrassing to The State...
This press conference is off the charts brilliant.
@mehdirhasan: "The leaks are real but the news is fake," Trump just claimed. Come back George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan and Richard Nixon. All is forgiven.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
In the most cases where there has been M-F incest, it is between Half brothers/sisters, this may still feel, icky, but in terms of DNA cross over for any offspring it is the same amount 25% duplication as first cousins. which I would think nobody on hear wants to make illegal.
I realise this still does not fully address your issue, but anyway I don't feel I have the right to tell any consenting adult who they can or can not have sex with.
I thought first cousin incest was illegal and I'm OK with it being so.
Mr Thompson,
I normally agree with most of your comments on hear, so hope you don't feel rebuffed by this, but I think you are incorrect on what this the Legal status of Cousin Marge in the UK is at the moment, and disagree about what it should be.
(((Dan Hodges))) @DPJHodges 6m6 minutes ago More I genuinely don't see how Congress allows this man to remain President of the United States for the next 4 years.
Tbh, strange and paranoid rants at the media feels quite tolerable in comparison to him stoking up hate against minorities, declaring war on countries because someone insulted his tan, striking awful trade deals that screw over other countries like the UK, etc.
A problem with that is the commonplace marriage of first cousins among Pakistani Muslims, which is leading to an increase in children (particularly boys) born with learning difficulties.
The problem is amplified by people being related in multiple ways. First cousins share 25%, but if their parents were also related, the numbers snowball.
It's also the same with Jews. When doing DNA testing with commercial companies people often get shared dna figures that indicate 2nd cousin when the truth is they are 4th or 5th cousins, but many times overs in various ways.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
If you are going to outlaw M-F incest on the basis that it poses a risk to potential children - does the logic not follow that those with inheritable disabilities should also be banned from sex?
It would depend on who they plan to have sex with.
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
If you are going to outlaw M-F incest on the basis that it poses a risk to potential children - does the logic not follow that those with inheritable disabilities should also be banned from sex?
Only with people with the same inheritable disability! No reason to bar a Cystic Fibrosis sufferer having children with a Sickle cell sufferer.
Incest is not just about genetics (and I agree cousanguity should be barred) but also about abusive power relationships in families, and I would consider cousanguinous arranged marriages as part of abusive power relations witbin patriarchal families.
OK, well I see all these fancy graphs. But given the audience on PB, I think one's outlook politically can actually best be summarised by the achieved ending to The Witcher 3.
There are times I feel very ignorant. This is one of them. I'm dimly aware that The Witcher 3 is a video game...
Based on books that are seriously good. Another plug for them! Everyone who is even slightly inclined to read fantasy or enjoys Game of Thrones should read them.
OK, well I see all these fancy graphs. But given the audience on PB, I think one's outlook politically can actually best be summarised by the achieved ending to The Witcher 3.
There are times I feel very ignorant. This is one of them. I'm dimly aware that The Witcher 3 is a video game...
Based on books that are seriously good. Another plug for them! Everyone who is even slightly inclined to read fantasy or enjoys Game of Thrones should read them.
Once I've read A Kingdom Asunder, I'll start on Blood of Elves (is that the best book to start with, or should I start with short stories?)
I'm agog at all these pbers who are apparently comfortable with incest being legalised.
As long as it's between consenting adults, is it necessarily worse than (for instance) extreme sadomasochism?
For any offspring it produces absolutely!
What about if there is no possibility of any offspring though ?
How frequently is that the case?
Birth control fails and even the infertile can have "miracle babies". Virtually only non-heterosexual [or equivalent] incest would pass that test.
I think M-F incest simply has to be illegal because as you say birth control can indeed fail.
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
In the most cases where there has been M-F incest, it is between Half brothers/sisters, this may still feel, icky, but in terms of DNA cross over for any offspring it is the same amount 25% duplication as first cousins. which I would think nobody on hear wants to make illegal.
I realise this still does not fully address your issue, but anyway I don't feel I have the right to tell any consenting adult who they can or can not have sex with.
I thought first cousin incest was illegal and I'm OK with it being so.
For England and Wales, I don't see first cousins listed:
"Sex with an adult who is related as parent (including adoptive parent), grandparent, child (including adopted child), grandchild, brother, sister, half-brother, half-sister, uncle, aunt, nephew or niece, is illegal"
Mr. Johnstone, sounds a bit like the royal problem from a few centuries ago.
I remember reading somewhere (maybe when I was at university) that a certain proportion of people find the 'exotic' much more attractive than the average, the reasoning (or evolutionary basis, to be more precise) being that it helped introduce new genes and reduce the risk of in-breeding.
This Donald Trump news conference is unlike anything I've ever seen. Obsessed with ratings, rambling away against the press.
Sounds like the Chavez and Correa types in South America, who have their own weekly tv shows where they ramble on for hours and whinge about criticism of even the most petty nature.
Just back from Stoke - so a brief update. The Lib Dem HQ is in a pub - just like old times! You couldn't move for the media - BBC and Sky doing filming while I was there. But a different picture out on the streets. Lots of Labour posters around the union office in Shelton but very little elsewhere. Quite a few Ali posters in the small shops on the A53 - probably the Kashmiri community. No sign of any Conservative or UKIP activity.
Mr. F, by chance, Blood of Elves is one of the first books on the "Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought" for Kingdom Asunder.
As is Best Served Cold, by Joe Abercrombie, and The Dragonbone Chair, by Tad Williams.
Not read any of The Witcher books. May give them a look, wallet/time permitting, when my to-read pile has diminished. Almost finished The Darkness That Comes Before, by R. Scott Bakker.
Trump is just amazing - I have never seen the MSM so comprehensively put in their box. Trump to Sopel of the BBC. Trump - Where are you from - Sopel - the BBC - Trump - here's another beauty - Sopel impartial free and fair -Trump just like CNN.
This press conference is off the charts brilliant.
He's total box office gold
For better and worse. It's hard to take your eyes of this guy when he gets going, and he is capable of being genuinely and intentionally funny. But the rest of it...
Trump is just amazing - I have never seen the MSM so comprehensively put in their box. Trump to Sopel of the BBC. Trump - Where are you from - Sopel - the BBC - Trump - here's another beauty - Sopel impartial free and fair -Trump just like CNN.
This press conference is off the charts brilliant.
He's total box office gold
For better and worse. It's hard to take your eyes of this guy when he gets going, and he is capable of being genuinely and intentionally funny. But the rest of it...
Comments
But should that mean M-M or F-F incest ought to be illegal too ?
While I share the yuck feeling with most on hear, my feeling are not sufficient reason to make adult Lovers in to criminals, or split up a family.
RELEASE: CIA espionage orders for the last French presidential election
https://t.co/ARd8alUjMS #CIAFrance https://t.co/Al9bK4OHZE
What MORI should have measured is the graph of satisfaction with Corbyn taken from those who (say they) voted Labour in 2015, rather than taking it from those who say they intend to vote Labour when each poll is taken. Since support for the party has fallen since Corbyn was elected in September 2015, and especially since Brexit in May 2016, none of the opinions of the (net) number abandoning Labour are being measured. And given that they've abandoned Labour, you can probably count the number of those satisfied with Corbyn in single % figures.
So I think the move towards net dissatisfaction with Corbyn is much more stark than even that rather damning graph indicates.
Apologies if the point has already been made far downthread - it is a rather obvious one so I suspect that someone already has.
I mean, despite being branded a "PB Tory" for ten years on here, I've just come out as left-liberal on the political compass.
A lot of people would have voted Tory in 2010 and 2015 and will be doing so again in 2020 because they alternative is so terrible. I know speaking for myself (and I suspect there's a lot like me) if the Opposition got it's act together there's no reason I couldn't be persuaded to vote Labour (or indeed Lib-Dem) depending on the circumstances at the time - After all I have voted both Lab and Lib in general elections in the past.
I'm Liberal/Left.
Seriously?
Who believes these charts anyway.
Amongst those who voted Labour in 2015 ONLY:
"Are you satisfied or dissatisfied with the way Theresa May/Jeremy Corbyn is doing their job as PM/Leader of the Labour Party"
May: Satisfied 33% Dissatisfied 56%
Corbyn: Satisfied 32% Dissatisfied 57%
And on that note I have to go and wup up a chinese mini-banquet. Goodnight all ...
That's not to say most of these tests are much good of course. My favourite was one put up around a GE, which rated against parties and had me within 5% on four of them. Either they really are very similar, or I am very confused politically.
Others sometimes suggest my closest party march is Plaid Cymru, which is no bloody good as I cannot vote for them even if I wanted.
http://m.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/trump_administration/prez_track_feb16
Your UK Political Compass
Economic Left/Right: 8.0
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.54
Suppressed I come out as such a moderate!
I find there's a major political divide between graduates who go and get a job in the "real world" who will be spread across the country and those who remain in academia (concentrated in the uni cities).
https://youtu.be/uVVTb3nZssQ
I realise this still does not fully address your issue, but anyway I don't feel I have the right to tell any consenting adult who they can or can not have sex with.
"Are you satisfied or dissatisfied with the way Jeremy Corbyn is doing his job as Leader of the Labour Party"
Feb 2017: Satisfied 32% Dissatisfied 57%
Oct 2015: Satisfied 54% Dissatisfied 25%
A much bigger turnaround then than the graph at the top of this thread suggests.
I work in "the private sector" (a small shop), and most of the people we work with have about as Labourish opinions on the NHS, taxing the rich, banks, etc. as you can get. (Admittedly they are not much enamoured of Corbyn himself.)
Economic Left/Right: 0.0
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.0
Oh dear, I appear to be depressingly dripish...
@jessicaelgot: Donald Trump is accusing newspapers of committing journalism
More
I genuinely don't see how Congress allows this man to remain President of the United States for the next 4 years.
A problem with that is the commonplace marriage of first cousins among Pakistani Muslims, which is leading to an increase in children (particularly boys) born with learning difficulties.
https://twitter.com/CAPAction/status/832220746034380802
Interesting position, though.
Using evidence as grounds for changing the law?
... I thought you were British. Your cover is blown, Agent Thomski! No true Briton would make that mistake.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-38994965
Come back George W. Bush, Ronald Reagan and Richard Nixon. All is forgiven.
I normally agree with most of your comments on hear, so hope you don't feel rebuffed by this, but I think you are incorrect on what this the Legal status of Cousin Marge in the UK is at the moment, and disagree about what it should be.
It's also the same with Jews. When doing DNA testing with commercial companies people often get shared dna figures that indicate 2nd cousin when the truth is they are 4th or 5th cousins, but many times overs in various ways.
It's all about him.
Incest is not just about genetics (and I agree cousanguity should be barred) but also about abusive power relationships in families, and I would consider cousanguinous arranged marriages as part of abusive power relations witbin patriarchal families.
Admittedly, a great deal of incest is non-consensual.
He just got fact-checked, mid-presser, by
Fox News...EDIT: Fake News apparently
"Sex with an adult who is related as parent (including adoptive parent), grandparent, child (including adopted child), grandchild, brother, sister, half-brother, half-sister, uncle, aunt, nephew or niece, is illegal"
I remember reading somewhere (maybe when I was at university) that a certain proportion of people find the 'exotic' much more attractive than the average, the reasoning (or evolutionary basis, to be more precise) being that it helped introduce new genes and reduce the risk of in-breeding.
https://twitter.com/HolyroodDaily/status/832294446343544832
Theresa better start playing catch up doublequick.
Press man asks how reporting the real leaks can be fake.
Trump rambles.
As is Best Served Cold, by Joe Abercrombie, and The Dragonbone Chair, by Tad Williams.
Not read any of The Witcher books. May give them a look, wallet/time permitting, when my to-read pile has diminished. Almost finished The Darkness That Comes Before, by R. Scott Bakker.
Elon Musk is crazy. But sometimes he's my sort of crazy:
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-02-16/global-infrastructure-partners-gets-big-returns-in-sleepy-sector
He's a modern day Fred Dibnah (who, near the end of his life, started digging a coal mine in his back garden. Just for LOLs.)
Box office
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sudCmrAsF4