The Tories plan to plumb the depths of Browns worst points that much is clear.
I never held out for anything better. It's just that I dont remember you posting in a furious rage when Labour were proposing these things but when the Tories do it's fop that and twit school this.
Mr. F, could it be that the public are being, er, frothy?
Public opinion changed dramatically in 2007 (huzzah!), and the Yougov daily poll, when first unveiled, showed us just how much statistical noise there was.
Oddly other SNPers joining in which is odd as this must be good news for the Yes campaign.
Which Yes campaign is this good news for? The old "Yes, we can't" campaign, or Eck's new "Yes, we want to remain in the UK" campaign launched last week?
Oddly other SNPers joining in which is odd as this must be good news for the Yes campaign.
Which Yes campaign is this good news for? The old "Yes, we can't" campaign, or Eck's new "Yes, we want to remain in the UK" campaign launched last week?
lol - fair point but a yes vote has to be more likely if Labour's chances in Westminster fade so you'd think Dickson et al would be pleased by this poll.
So how can you compare this to the 3 polls yesterday that had UKIP on 18%, 19% and 20% respectively? Its clear that the UKIP surge causes problems for old methodology hence the increasing gaps between the likes of Survation at one end and ICM at the other. A 13% gap is massive, massive enough to start raising eyebrows.
Lol - just read through the whole thread - most "PB tories" with calm and measured responses -Tim, Pork and others posting like crazy.! Oddly other SNPers joining in which is odd as this must be good news for the Yes campaign. Oh and for once OGH hasn't got much to say.
The "sensational ICM poll" would be good news for the Yes campaign if we see the current 4/1 price on CON MAJ dropping like a stone. I am not holding my breath.
Oddly other SNPers joining in which is odd as this must be good news for the Yes campaign.
Which Yes campaign is this good news for? The old "Yes, we can't" campaign, or Eck's new "Yes, we want to remain in the UK" campaign launched last week?
lol - fair point but a yes vote has to be more likely if Labour's chances in Westminster fade so you'd think Dickson et al would be pleased by this poll.
It is JackW's preposterous ARSE projection from this morning which is keeping me amused, not a rogue "gold standard" poll.
Whoops. Helps if you copy n paste the correct election result.
Liberal Democrats (Mike Crockart) 16,684 36% Labour 12,881 28% Conservative 10,767 23% SNP 6,115 13%
But the point still stands. It is a vast long shot for the SNP.
I agree with you there, Stuart. On the Aberdeen Donside swing, the LDs would regain the Edinburgh Western Holyrood seat, and they usually do better at Westminster elections. The LDs no longer run the council, which works in their favour too.
Which once again begs the question: which 13 seats is JackW predicting that the SNP are going to win? If not Edinburgh West or Caithness et al, then where?
I'm sure Andrea will correct me but I dont think your list of 7 seats contained the 7 top SNP target (Dundee West is surely an easier ask than some of those you listed and would fall on a swing similar to that achieved in the Dundee City West Holyrood constituency).
Anyway, have you not seen this poll? It's a popular one here:
"The other seven seats would be won by the SNP - Aberdeenshire West & Kincardine; Argyll & Bute; Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross; North East Fife; Gordon; Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey; and Ross, Skye & Lochaber."
JackW's ARSE is a fine resource for this site. Thankfully JackW wont pay any attention to tim's rantings about it.
The Left are tearing themselves apart over at CiF over this poll, blaming the Guardian and Andrew Rawnsley for orchestrating Ed's disastrous lurch to the Right.
Lol - just read through the whole thread - most "PB tories" with calm and measured responses -Tim, Pork and others posting like crazy.! Oddly other SNPers joining in which is odd as this must be good news for the Yes campaign. Oh and for once OGH hasn't got much to say.
The "sensational ICM poll" would be good news for the Yes campaign if we see the current 4/1 price on CON MAJ dropping like a stone. I am not holding my breath.
Clearly saying that this is a good poll for the tories - while still being calm enough to remind people that it's only one poll and might obviously be an outlier - is what passes for 'crazy' among the far right swivel-eyed loons.
Posting inflammatory comment like "we'll have to wait and see" drives these swivel-eyed loons to impotent ranting fury. It's why nobody takes them seriously.
Mr. Dickson, I suspect that the SNP could do well indeed in 2015.
If Scotland votes for separation who else would you want to back?
If Scotland votes No then unionists can vote the SNP, safe in the knowledge that won't lead to separation. E. Miliband loses the Brown bonus in Scotland, the Lib Dems have been in coalition with the Conservatives and the blues are unlikely to take many seats. It's a good place for the SNP to be.
I couldn't give two figs for the plight of the SNP. I want my country and my nation to be in a good place. We have ahead of us the opportunity to take ourselves there. Our fate is in our own hands come September next year.
The SNP was merely the tool we used to lever ourselves to independence. We are nearly there. After that we can fling the tool to the back of the shed. Or, more likely, place it in a display case in the museum.
Whoops. Helps if you copy n paste the correct election result.
Liberal Democrats (Mike Crockart) 16,684 36% Labour 12,881 28% Conservative 10,767 23% SNP 6,115 13%
But the point still stands. It is a vast long shot for the SNP.
I agree with you there, Stuart. On the Aberdeen Donside swing, the LDs would regain the Edinburgh Western Holyrood seat, and they usually do better at Westminster elections. The LDs no longer run the council, which works in their favour too.
Which once again begs the question: which 13 seats is JackW predicting that the SNP are going to win? If not Edinburgh West or Caithness et al, then where?
I'm sure Andrea will correct me but I dont think your list of 7 seats contained the 7 top SNP target (Dundee West is surely an easier ask than some of those you listed and would fall on a swing similar to that achieved in the Dundee City West Holyrood constituency).
Anyway, have you not seen this poll? It's a popular one here:
"The other seven seats would be won by the SNP - Aberdeenshire West & Kincardine; Argyll & Bute; Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross; North East Fife; Gordon; Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey; and Ross, Skye & Lochaber."
JackW's ARSE is a fine resource for this site. Thankfully JackW wont pay any attention to tim's rantings about it.
I realise you are always busy on PB highlighting green issues Neil, but that poll was posted with the caveat that it was optimistic and several of the lib dem MPs like Kennedy were quite likely to be able to hold off a challenge. The point was that Danny Alexander was very unlikely to be one of them.
Mr McLeish said there was “too much venom and hatred aimed at the SNP” in Better Together, which is an alliance of Labour, Tories and the Lib Dems.
He called on the Labour leadership in Scotland to leave the group and “forge a new campaign” with Lib Dem supporters of greater devolution.
The Better Together campaign is led by former Labour chancellor Alistair Darling, but the leadership of the group includes senior Scottish Tories such as David McLetchie, who is a director of the campaign.
Mr McLeish said that the anti-independence campaign was “tied to the utterings of David Cameron and the Scottish Tories” as he called for a new Unionist Labour-Lib Dem campaign.
He also said that Better Together was involved in a “constant haranguing of Scots” in a campaign he claimed is dominated by Westminster and London-based politicians.
Mr McLeish said: “There are fear and scare stories such as that we’ll have passport controls at the Border and won’t have access to blood transfusion supplies. Next they’ll be saying there will be seven years of famine in an independent Scotland and that aliens will land here.
“By leaving Better Together, Labour can start to reinforce its identity.”
The former first minister’s attack on his party’s decision to support Better Together came as it emerged that senior figures within Scottish Labour had refused to join the cross-party campaign because of Tory involvement.
Mr McLeish warned: “Scots don’t like to be talked to like idiots and there has been a constant haranguing of Scots by Westminster in terms of the type of campaign being run.
“This could creates a backlash as Scots want to know what vision of Scotland within the Union the Unionists are campaigning for. If there’s another year of this people will start to rebel.”
He said: “The Tories bring nothing to the table, so Labour and progressive Lib Dems have to put forward their own campaign.
“It’s not just the referendum, we have a general election in 2015 and then a Holyrood election in 2016.”
Whoops. Helps if you copy n paste the correct election result.
Liberal Democrats (Mike Crockart) 16,684 36% Labour 12,881 28% Conservative 10,767 23% SNP 6,115 13%
But the point still stands. It is a vast long shot for the SNP.
I agree with you there, Stuart. On the Aberdeen Donside swing, the LDs would regain the Edinburgh Western Holyrood seat, and they usually do better at Westminster elections. The LDs no longer run the council, which works in their favour too.
Which once again begs the question: which 13 seats is JackW predicting that the SNP are going to win? If not Edinburgh West or Caithness et al, then where?
Anyway, have you not seen this poll? It's a popular one here:
You just need to use a little bit of common sense to see that JackW's "SNP 13" this morning was complete pants. If it wasn't then why does Jack not name the 13 seats he is projecting as SNP wins, rather than inviting us to guess?
Well, pop-pickers, I did postulate the thought only a week ago about whether the Tories might sneak a lead in the weeks ahead, and blimey ICM have near as done it already!
(I had been thinking that a surpasso in one poll might just be possible after the 2Q GDP figures and narrative about sustained recovery).
Anyway, best guess is that Labour's lead is now down to the 6-8% with18 months still to go. Things can only get better....
You just need to use a little bit of common sense to see that JackW's "SNP 13" this morning was complete pants.
Stuart, JackW gives us the benefit of his ARSE from time to time. You can pay attention to it or you can ignore it. People who paid attention to it in the past could have done so very profitably.
You think 7 gains is ridiculous. And yet here is a poll saying 7 gains from one party alone is possible. Clearly one or two from Labour wouldnt be totally impossible either. 13 may be at the optimistic end of the spectrum but it's hardly so far out as to render the entire projection completely implausible.
JackW has a very good track record. Only fools dismiss his predictions out of hand.
I do, however, struggle to understand his Scottish predictions at present.
So, "JackW has a very good track record" does he? Then why is he refusing to inform us of what his ARSE projection was saying in the summer of 2008, in other words at the same point in the electoral cycle?
It wouldn't be because it was hilariously inaccurate, would it?
Whoops. Helps if you copy n paste the correct election result.
Liberal Democrats (Mike Crockart) 16,684 36% Labour 12,881 28% Conservative 10,767 23% SNP 6,115 13%
But the point still stands. It is a vast long shot for the SNP.
I agree with you there, Stuart. On the Aberdeen Donside swing, the LDs would regain the Edinburgh Western Holyrood seat, and they usually do better at Westminster elections. The LDs no longer run the council, which works in their favour too.
Which once again begs the question: which 13 seats is JackW predicting that the SNP are going to win? If not Edinburgh West or Caithness et al, then where?
I'm sure Andrea will correct me but I dont think your list of 7 seats contained the 7 top SNP target (Dundee West is surely an easier ask than some of those you listed and would fall on a swing similar to that achieved in the Dundee City West Holyrood constituency).
Anyway, have you not seen this poll? It's a popular one here:
"The other seven seats would be won by the SNP - Aberdeenshire West & Kincardine; Argyll & Bute; Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross; North East Fife; Gordon; Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey; and Ross, Skye & Lochaber."
JackW's ARSE is a fine resource for this site. Thankfully JackW wont pay any attention to tim's rantings about it.
I realise you are always busy on PB highlighting green issues Neil, but that poll was posted with the caveat that it was optimistic and several of the lib dem MPs like Kennedy were quite likely to be able to hold off a challenge. The point was that Danny Alexander was very unlikely to be one of them.
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
@Stuart_Dickson My recollection is that JackW made no predictions for the UK in 2008. I'm prepared to be disproved on this, but I thought JackW only made UK predictions in 2010. I'm quite surprised to see him making predictions now.
Whoops. Helps if you copy n paste the correct election result.
Liberal Democrats (Mike Crockart) 16,684 36% Labour 12,881 28% Conservative 10,767 23% SNP 6,115 13%
But the point still stands. It is a vast long shot for the SNP.
I agree with you there, Stuart. On the Aberdeen Donside swing, the LDs would regain the Edinburgh Western Holyrood seat, and they usually do better at Westminster elections. The LDs no longer run the council, which works in their favour too.
Which once again begs the question: which 13 seats is JackW predicting that the SNP are going to win? If not Edinburgh West or Caithness et al, then where?
I'm sure Andrea will correct me but I dont think your list of 7 seats contained the 7 top SNP target (Dundee West is surely an easier ask than some of those you listed and would fall on a swing similar to that achieved in the Dundee City West Holyrood constituency).
Anyway, have you not seen this poll? It's a popular one here:
"The other seven seats would be won by the SNP - Aberdeenshire West & Kincardine; Argyll & Bute; Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross; North East Fife; Gordon; Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey; and Ross, Skye & Lochaber."
JackW's ARSE is a fine resource for this site. Thankfully JackW wont pay any attention to tim's rantings about it.
I realise you are always busy on PB highlighting green issues Neil, but that poll was posted with the caveat that it was optimistic and several of the lib dem MPs like Kennedy were quite likely to be able to hold off a challenge. The point was that Danny Alexander was very unlikely to be one of them.
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
More than likely. Which isn't to say they can take it for granted because they definitely can't. Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
New NY Mayoral Poll out showing Weiner leading in the Democratic Primary by 3 points. Both of the regular pollsters there now have him ahead, albeit narrowly. Assuming the democrat candidate wins the whole thing in October (highly likely) the 3/1 available on Weiner at Ladbrokes still looks value, albeit not mega-value. A hell of a race there, by the way.
@Stuart_Dickson My recollection is that JackW made no predictions for the UK in 2008. I'm prepared to be disproved on this, but I thought JackW only made UK predictions in 2010. I'm quite surprised to see him making predictions now.
Of course, we could resort to Google, but I'm enjoying making Jack squirm.
C'mon Jack, out with it: what was your 2008 ARSE projection?
Jack is a bit of a bumbling gentleman Stuart. The sort of jovial old man you see spluttering around at a country pub.
Nice enough, but no one takes his insights seriously.
Jack does.
Jack is presumably applying a UNS to some "poll". Falkirk (especially now) and Dundee are conceivable gains for the SNP from Labour, taking them to 8. Argyll and Gordon are the easier gains from the LDs, so we are now at 10. The LDs are between 22-23% ahead of the SNP in each of Caithness etc., Inverness, Aberdeenshire West and Edinburgh West. So it must be 3 of those 4, unless the SNP are virtually level with SLAB and can pick up Ayrshire North.
Fair play to Jack on his predictions for the POTUS election 2012 though, but of course 2 variables are easier to predict than 4.
Have we reached this tipping point? I don't think so, yet. But we're getting a lot closer.
We're also reaching the point where health and the NHS become politically toxic for Labour. As someone who recalls the decades during which this was Labour's banker policy, it's an extraordinary state of affairs. The perceived saviour of the nation's health in the 21st Century could be a Tory and could be Jeremy Hunt.
Re the NHS, I remember an American pundit saying (about a decade ago, so I cannot link, sorry) that Brits would love the NHS until, suddenly, they realised its drawbacks, at which point support wouldn't just decline, it would collapse.
The American said that, at this moment, we would stop sneering at America's health service, and also start to question, very profoundly, our pious faith in socialised medicine.
Have we reached this tipping point? I don't think so, yet. But we're getting a lot closer.
I'd rather we didn't spend 17.9% ! of our GDP on health, like insuring the car its not really a disgressionary payment whether it is private or public.
What happens in Singapore, the health spend is low (4% of gpd) (1/4 of USA, 1/2 of UK) it is 67% private (Would appeal to centre-right types) and the life expectancy is almost 82 years there ! Whatever it is they do perhaps it is the way to go, I think its some sort of compulsory insurance with the Gov't picking up the tab for UB40s etc
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
More than likely. Which isn't to say they can take it for granted because they definitely can't. Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
I'd love to see the Lib Dem membership figures in Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey. Hope Danny has a dug to keep him company knocking doors.
But this is precisely the problem. For years the Left has justified the NHS by comparing it with America. Fact is there are dozens of health services far superior to both ours and America's, in terms of outcome and spending.
I only did so because you quoted an American predicting the end of the NHS. I imagine that many of the alternative systems you describe would also qualify as "socialised medicine" in his book.
@Stuart_Dickson Would you care to reprise your pre-2010 predictions?
Unlike Jack I did not publish an ARSE projection to great fanfare this morning.
It is perfectly legitimate for us to request a review of his track record, which we could do if he would provide us with his ARSE from 2008, at the same point in the electoral cycle.
We're also reaching the point where health and the NHS become politically toxic for Labour.
That's what you want to happen but it's not true. The polling shows Labour *leads* on the NHS.
And the Tories led on the NHS - for the first time ever - when Dave was in opposition. These days Labour only lead in virtue of not being in government. That's a shocking comedown. There was a time (now gone) when Labour was genuinely and permanently trusted on the issue.
I caught Andy Burnham's performance on Sky News yesterday, and tonight on the ITN news. This politician is really not helping himself or the Official Opposition with his behaviour. His total focus appears to be the angry rebuttal of any criticism of himself and the last Labour Government rather than the very serious issues raised and how they effected so many individuals. This is very similar to how Ed Balls behaves when it comes to any criticism of him or the last Government's economic policies or legacy.
We're also reaching the point where health and the NHS become politically toxic for Labour.
That's what you want to happen but it's not true. The polling shows Labour *leads* on the NHS.
And the Tories led on the NHS - for the first time ever - when Dave was in opposition. These days Labour only lead in virtue of not being in government. That's a shocking comedown. There was a time (now gone) when Labour was genuinely and permanently trusted on the issue.
That's quite a distance from the issue becomming "toxic" for them like you claimed.
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
More than likely. Which isn't to say they can take it for granted because they definitely can't. Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
I'd love to see the Lib Dem membership figures in Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey. Hope Danny has a dug to keep him company knocking doors.
His problem might well also be from those who used to be lib dem members joining in the campaigning against him. It's not as if there was any danger of there being a lack of willing folk keen to help defenestrate him from other parties.
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
I caught Andy Burnham's performance on Sky News yesterday, and tonight on the ITN news. This politician is really not helping himself or the Official Opposition with his behaviour. His total focus appears to be the angry rebuttal of any criticism of himself and the last Labour Government rather than the very serious issues raised and how they effected so many individuals. This is very similar to how Ed Balls behaves when it comes to any criticism of him or the last Government's economic policies or legacy.
I think he may have a guilty conscience - not saying deserved but there all the same. Probably worth trying to needle him over it and see if he goes mental.
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
More than likely. Which isn't to say they can take it for granted because they definitely can't. Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
I'd love to see the Lib Dem membership figures in Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey. Hope Danny has a dug to keep him company knocking doors.
His problem might well also be from those who used to be lib dem members joining in the campaigning against him. It's not as if there was any danger of there being a lack of willing folk keen to help defenestrate him from other parties.
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
I'm praying that we'll get another 3 leaders debates featuring Nick Clegg. That ought to finish off Danny Alexander's political "career".
Have we reached this tipping point? I don't think so, yet. But we're getting a lot closer.
I dont think we'll ever get to the point where we can afford to pay the amount Americans do to administer healthcare.
The American system is terrible. One of the worst in the world in terms of medical bangs for your buck.
But this is precisely the problem. For years the Left has justified the NHS by comparing it with America. Fact is there are dozens of health services far superior to both ours and America's, in terms of outcome and spending.
We need to get over this fatuous worship of the 1945 settlement, and copy the best health services around the world, amongst which we are not numbered. Whatever lefties say.
There are education systems better than ours, too - such as South Korea and Finland, but they involve paying teachers more, so are not discussed.
Jack is presumably applying a UNS to some "poll". Falkirk (especially now) and Dundee are conceivable gains for the SNP from Labour, taking them to 8. Argyll and Gordon are the easier gains from the LDs, so we are now at 10. The LDs are between 22-23% ahead of the SNP in each of Caithness etc., Inverness, Aberdeenshire West and Edinburgh West. So it must be 3 of those 4, unless the SNP are virtually level with SLAB and can pick up Ayrshire North.
You forgot Ochil & S Perthshire.
Overall, I think Jack is being a bit gung-ho for the SNP, but who cares if it's 8, 12, or 13? In the overall scheme of things, that isn't the interest.
At least Jack is putting his fundaments on display.
What's Australia's health care system like? Anyone have any experience of it?
The full article is worth a read
"Australia has a system whereby primary medical care (general practice doctors), much specialist health care (for example a cardiologist) and almost all important pharmaceuticals are covered by the government but with a copayment by patient. Most the copayments are large enough to be annoying (the service is not free) but do not cover anything like the costs. The copayments differ sometimes due to your income status. For instance most people have a copayment for pharmaceuticals of about $20 – but for (low income) pensioners the copayment is $5."
On the NHS: Andy Burnham deserves everything that's coming to him. Labour's cynical and vicious response to Cameron's generosity in not making political capital out of Mid Staffs has assured that.
On the NHS: Andy Burnham deserves everything that's coming to him. Labour's cynical and vicious response to Cameron's generosity in not making political capital out of Mid Staffs has assured that.
The spin doesn't match the reality sadly.
David Cameron: NHS deaths are Labour’s fault
DAVID Cameron piled pressure on Labour’s Andy Burnham to quit yesterday over the “targets culture” that led to the Mid Staffs Hospital tragedy.
The PM pointed the finger after Labour called for NHS chief executive Sir David Nicholson to be “sacked immediately”.
Sir David was local health boss in 2005 and 2006 at the height of failings at Stafford Hospital where 1,200 patients needlessly died.
Mr Burnham was Health Secretary from 2009 to 2010.
In his first attack on Labour over the issue, the PM said: “Part of the problem was people following a very top down, target-led agenda which meant patient care being put on the back-burner. David Nicholson has made his apology and wants to get on with his job.
“Other people, frankly, should be thinking of their position.” Labour claimed Mr Cameron was trying to “politicise a huge tragedy”. But Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt accused Labour of “catastrophic policy mistakes”.
What is really frustrating is the fact that almost all the scrutiny on the NHS and its delivery focuses totally on its delivery in England. And that is letting our devolved health care in Scotland and Wales get away with far too little scrutiny.
I heard a patients relative tonight tell of the exact same experience I had when my dad was dying in a Scottish hospital. His mouth and lips were bone dry, and not a sign of an oral mouth pack anywhere in sight in his room when I came in. I had to go and ask the nursing staff for one and did it myself, my dad was sucking the sponge he was desperate for some fluid. He squeezed my hand and smiled at me. My late Aunt was rushed into hospital in a life threatening condition last year, when she was moved two weeks later they had to get a specialist bed for her as she had developed bedsores!! That in my day as a nurse would have been regarded as one of the ultimate failures of good basic nursing care.
This shouldn't be happening if the most basic care plans and charts for a patients needs were being were being followed and kept up to date by staff.
I caught Andy Burnham's performance on Sky News yesterday, and tonight on the ITN news. This politician is really not helping himself or the Official Opposition with his behaviour. His total focus appears to be the angry rebuttal of any criticism of himself and the last Labour Government rather than the very serious issues raised and how they effected so many individuals. This is very similar to how Ed Balls behaves when it comes to any criticism of him or the last Government's economic policies or legacy.
I think he may have a guilty conscience - not saying deserved but there all the same. Probably worth trying to needle him over it and see if he goes mental.
Go back to Google, look up the date of the the publication of the Francis report, and read Cameron's initial response. Also, in the Sun article you quote, there's no mention by Cameron of Andy Burnham.
On the NHS: Andy Burnham deserves everything that's coming to him. Labour's cynical and vicious response to Cameron's generosity in not making political capital out of Mid Staffs has assured that.
I'm not saying it's not deserved i just haven't followed the details. Either way if he does have a conscience over it then haunting him might lead to a s**** out.
edit: If true (the conscience thing) then i suppose if the NHS scandals did become a big deal there'd be the possibility of a shadow cabinet reshuffle as Cerise swapped Burnham for one of the sociopaths like *bleep*.
I caught Andy Burnham's performance on Sky News yesterday, and tonight on the ITN news. This politician is really not helping himself or the Official Opposition with his behaviour. His total focus appears to be the angry rebuttal of any criticism of himself and the last Labour Government rather than the very serious issues raised and how they effected so many individuals. This is very similar to how Ed Balls behaves when it comes to any criticism of him or the last Government's economic policies or legacy.
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
More than likely. Which isn't to say they can take it for granted because they definitely can't. Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
I'd love to see the Lib Dem membership figures in Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey. Hope Danny has a dug to keep him company knocking doors.
His problem might well also be from those who used to be lib dem members joining in the campaigning against him. It's not as if there was any danger of there being a lack of willing folk keen to help defenestrate him from other parties.
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
I'm praying that we'll get another 3 leaders debates featuring Nick Clegg. That ought to finish off Danny Alexander's political "career".
I still think it wold be remarkable if the lib dems were suicidal enough to have their election campaign with Clegg as leader, but he does seem to be firmly ensconced in his westminster bubble seemingly oblivious to his own toxicity and that the lib dem base is getting hammered year on year.
Dave's lies on the reorganisation have wrecked Tory polling on health, are you forecasting that it'll recover?
Yes, or at least be partially neutralised by confusion. I'm afraid Labour's naked and vicious politicisation leaves no choice. They really are absolutely shameless - Lord (Philip) Hunt on the News at 10 was a complete disgrace, a cynical combination of complacency about what happened under Labour, and scare-mongering with utter nonsense about the US, as though that was the only alternative.
Cameron quoted Francis as absolving Burnham in Parliament, then changed his mind a bit later and decided to use the deaths. Not quite sure where that strategy came from.
Where it came from was Labour blaming coalition ministers for everything. Well, two can play at that game.
Mind you, it does begin to look as though the Labour government deliberately covered up the scale of the problem. I don't think Andy Burnham was personally responsible for Mid Staffs, but he and/or his colleagues may have been responsible for the culture of cover-up.
Was there some part of this that confused you or are you seriously claiming this wasn't an opportunistic political attack aimed at labour?
In his first attack on Labour over the issue, the PM said: “Part of the problem was people following a very top down, target-led agenda which meant patient care being put on the back-burner. David Nicholson has made his apology and wants to get on with his job.
“Other people, frankly, should be thinking of their position.” Labour claimed Mr Cameron was trying to “politicise a huge tragedy”. But Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt accused Labour of “catastrophic policy mistakes”.
Stick to the tory spin. He clearly had a go at labour. It was merited so why you want to spin otherwise is baffling.
In your world Osbrowne might be near perfect and Cammie always "generous" and would never dream of politicising an issue, but outside of CCHQ I don't think you'll get many on here willing to believe that risible tosh. Apart from the PB tories of course.
Let's see the current lot promote a culture of openness then.
Have the famous 50 NHS whistleblowers whose payoffs were criticised by Parliament, had their stories published yet? If not, why not?
The NHS should have no secrets from us, the taxpayers who fund and use it. But I see no sign of the current government adopting such a radical approach.
Every time you try to patronise and dismiss Danny Alexander by using the nick name the 'park ranger' to describe him, you remind me of his previous very local links to his constituency before politics.
Kennedy and Ming Campbell,if he stands, will keep their seats.
More than likely. Which isn't to say they can take it for granted because they definitely can't. Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
I'd love to see the Lib Dem membership figures in Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Strathspey. Hope Danny has a dug to keep him company knocking doors.
His problem might well also be from those who used to be lib dem members joining in the campaigning against him. It's not as if there was any danger of there being a lack of willing folk keen to help defenestrate him from other parties.
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
Cameron quoted Francis as absolving Burnham in Parliament, then changed his mind a bit later and decided to use the deaths. Not quite sure where that strategy came from.
I don't think Andy Burnham was personally responsible for Mid Staffs, but he and/or his colleagues may have been responsible for the culture of cover-up.
Andy Burnham seems to have gone wrong when he started listening to his friends advice
"Mr Burnham is said to have repeatedly rejected her calls to improve the much-criticised system, which gave Basildon a 'good' rating just weeks before an unannounced inspection uncovered filthy wards and a high death rate.
The furious rows are out of character for the normally mild-mannered Mr Burnham, who has recently been tipped as a contender to take over the Labour leadership from Gordon Brown. Some friends have advised him to 'toughen up' his image in preparation for a run at the job."
Pork likes the fruit, but tends to mistake the stones for acorns. This gives him indigestion.
You're clearly still smarting from your shattered dreams of Lansley becoming PM, Seth O Logue.
Poor old Seth. So much spin, so little common sense.
I know what would cheer you up, Pork.
A date night with tim!
Calm down Seth before you start getting overexcited at the thought of used condoms again. I'm afraid the heat is clearly doing very strange things to you. Time for a cold shower old chap.
The problem of the Tory position is that it's actually two quite different positions. There are plenty of Tories who would agree with SeanT that we need something different from the NHS. But this is the last thing that Cameron wants us to think - his position is that the NHS is jolly good... when defended by the Tories. The reason his party lags on the issue is that people generally like the NHS and sense the intentions of the first group.
Banging on about Burnham won't really change that and the whole strategy is probably misconceived, like Labour going on about welfare spongers - it raises the profile of an issue where the party is perceived as weaker.
Banging on about Burnham won't really change that and the whole strategy is probably misconceived, like Labour going on about welfare spongers - it raises the profile of an issue where the party is perceived as weaker.
Nothing to lose, given Labour's cynical party-political games on the NHS. At worst it will help engender the feeling that there isn't much difference between the two parties on the NHS, which in terms of day-to-day management is probably correct, since ministers can't actually micro-manage such a huge organisation, and anyway Labour doesn't disagree on the use of private providers:
We will support an active role for the independent sector working alongside the NHS in the provision of care, particularly where they bring innovation – such as in end-of-life care and cancer services, and increase capacity... Patients requiring elective care will have the right, in law, to choose from any provider who meets NHS standards of quality at NHS costs.
Labour manifesto, 2010. Health Secretary: Andy Burnham.
"Cameron's generosity in not making political capital out of Mid Staffs has assured that.
Absolutely no mention of any absurd caveats/excuses about the timing and the Francis report.
The truth is he used Mid Staffs to attack labour and for some reason that fact upsets you greatly.
"In his first attack on Labour over the issue, the PM said: “Part of the problem was people following a very top down, target-led agenda which meant patient care being put on the back-burner. David Nicholson has made his apology and wants to get on with his job.
“Other people, frankly, should be thinking of their position.”
Your inept spin is as amusing and incompetent as it always is. "Near Perfect" in fact.
'"Mr Burnham is said to have repeatedly rejected her calls to improve the much-criticised system, which gave Basildon a 'good' rating just weeks before an unannounced inspection uncovered filthy wards and a high death rate.'
Toxic Andy.
Makes you wonder what the real A&E waiting times would have been under New Labour if they had been measured during 'unannounced' inspections.
Comments
Public opinion changed dramatically in 2007 (huzzah!), and the Yougov daily poll, when first unveiled, showed us just how much statistical noise there was.
' Oddly other SNPers joining in which is odd as this must be good news for the Yes campaign'.
Think many have already thrown in the towel..
lol - fair point but a yes vote has to be more likely if Labour's chances in Westminster fade so you'd think Dickson et al would be pleased by this poll.
Anyway, have you not seen this poll? It's a popular one here:
http://newsnetscotland.com/index.php/scottish-politics/6902-new-poll-suggests-lib-dems-face-scottish-mainland-wipeout
"The other seven seats would be won by the SNP - Aberdeenshire West & Kincardine; Argyll & Bute; Caithness, Sutherland & Easter Ross; North East Fife; Gordon; Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey; and Ross, Skye & Lochaber."
JackW's ARSE is a fine resource for this site. Thankfully JackW wont pay any attention to tim's rantings about it.
Nick Clegg has announced a review of employment and training options for 16 to 24-year-olds.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23323277#
Good move.
Posting inflammatory comment like "we'll have to wait and see" drives these swivel-eyed loons to impotent ranting fury. It's why nobody takes them seriously.
Liam Byrne pathetic on benefit cap on BBC-"It misses too many families!" Save-my-seat Teather even worse:she voted cruel cuts,until fired.
Oh dear,the left getting upset ;-)
The SNP was merely the tool we used to lever ourselves to independence. We are nearly there. After that we can fling the tool to the back of the shed. Or, more likely, place it in a display case in the museum.
YouGov/Sun poll tonight: CON 31%, LAB 40%, LDEM 11%, UKIP 11%. Nine point Lab lead, no sign of union row collapse.
You just need to use a little bit of common sense to see that JackW's "SNP 13" this morning was complete pants. If it wasn't then why does Jack not name the 13 seats he is projecting as SNP wins, rather than inviting us to guess?
Nice enough, but no one takes his insights seriously.
(I had been thinking that a surpasso in one poll might just be possible after the 2Q GDP figures and narrative about sustained recovery).
Anyway, best guess is that Labour's lead is now down to the 6-8% with18 months still to go. Things can only get better....
https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/356885595680829440/photo/1
You think 7 gains is ridiculous. And yet here is a poll saying 7 gains from one party alone is possible. Clearly one or two from Labour wouldnt be totally impossible either. 13 may be at the optimistic end of the spectrum but it's hardly so far out as to render the entire projection completely implausible.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_2a5AA30RTY
The #500 benefits cap is going down very well though.
Amusingly enough Lab minority/Lib-Lab coalition is the only workable Gov't on these numbers.
I do, however, struggle to understand his Scottish predictions at present.
It wouldn't be because it was hilariously inaccurate, would it?
Chris Ship @chrisshipitv
So Guardian/ICM Con 36% Lab 36% <Election all to play for. But YouGov/Sun Con 31% Lab 40% <Miliband in No10
Yet I somehow doubt they will be struggling to get lib dem activists to help them in their seats while little little Danny could well find himself quite lonely, for some unfathomable reason.
C'mon Jack, out with it: what was your 2008 ARSE projection?
Fair play to Jack on his predictions for the POTUS election 2012 though, but of course 2 variables are easier to predict than 4.
http://www.politicshome.com/uk/article/82022/the_daily_mail_tuesday_16th_july_2013.html
https://twitter.com/pow_rebecca/status/356887449806438401
http://www.rebeccapow.com/?page_id=13
What happens in Singapore, the health spend is low (4% of gpd) (1/4 of USA, 1/2 of UK) it is 67% private (Would appeal to centre-right types) and the life expectancy is almost 82 years there ! Whatever it is they do perhaps it is the way to go, I think its some sort of compulsory insurance with the Gov't picking up the tab for UB40s etc
"MPs ask Charles: Why DO you pay lower tax rate than your servants?"
It is perfectly legitimate for us to request a review of his track record, which we could do if he would provide us with his ARSE from 2008, at the same point in the electoral cycle.
Telegraph - Andy Burnham: The Coalition failed to act on my concerns about the NHS
His problem might well also be from those who used to be lib dem members joining in the campaigning against him. It's not as if there was any danger of there being a lack of willing folk keen to help defenestrate him from other parties.
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
I'm praying that we'll get another 3 leaders debates featuring Nick Clegg. That ought to finish off Danny Alexander's political "career".
Overall, I think Jack is being a bit gung-ho for the SNP, but who cares if it's 8, 12, or 13? In the overall scheme of things, that isn't the interest.
At least Jack is putting his fundaments on display.
"Australia has a system whereby primary medical care (general practice doctors), much specialist health care (for example a cardiologist) and almost all important pharmaceuticals are covered by the government but with a copayment by patient. Most the copayments are large enough to be annoying (the service is not free) but do not cover anything like the costs. The copayments differ sometimes due to your income status. For instance most people have a copayment for pharmaceuticals of about $20 – but for (low income) pensioners the copayment is $5."
http://brontecapital.blogspot.co.uk/2009/08/health-care-reform-and-single-payer.html
Expect them to finish up with 6 (-5) ?
I heard a patients relative tonight tell of the exact same experience I had when my dad was dying in a Scottish hospital. His mouth and lips were bone dry, and not a sign of an oral mouth pack anywhere in sight in his room when I came in. I had to go and ask the nursing staff for one and did it myself, my dad was sucking the sponge he was desperate for some fluid. He squeezed my hand and smiled at me. My late Aunt was rushed into hospital in a life threatening condition last year, when she was moved two weeks later they had to get a specialist bed for her as she had developed bedsores!! That in my day as a nurse would have been regarded as one of the ultimate failures of good basic nursing care.
This shouldn't be happening if the most basic care plans and charts for a patients needs were being were being followed and kept up to date by staff.
Go back to Google, look up the date of the the publication of the Francis report, and read Cameron's initial response. Also, in the Sun article you quote, there's no mention by Cameron of Andy Burnham.
edit: If true (the conscience thing) then i suppose if the NHS scandals did become a big deal there'd be the possibility of a shadow cabinet reshuffle as Cerise swapped Burnham for one of the sociopaths like *bleep*.
The bizarre criminal conspiracy was Labour not Libor.
I still think it wold be remarkable if the lib dems were suicidal enough to have their election campaign with Clegg as leader, but he does seem to be firmly ensconced in his westminster bubble seemingly oblivious to his own toxicity and that the lib dem base is getting hammered year on year.
Are we undergoing a heatwave these days or is it just the prospect of Rowenna getting to Westminster?
Cecile Kyenge, Italy's first-ever black cabinet minister, declined to call directly for Senate Vice-President Roberto Calderoli to resign.
But she invited him to "reflect deeply" about the racial slur. She said politicians speak in the name of citizens and that "words have weight".
Mr Calderoli has phoned Ms Kyenge to apologise for his comments."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-23312479
Mind you, it does begin to look as though the Labour government deliberately covered up the scale of the problem. I don't think Andy Burnham was personally responsible for Mid Staffs, but he and/or his colleagues may have been responsible for the culture of cover-up.
Was there some part of this that confused you or are you seriously claiming this wasn't an opportunistic political attack aimed at labour?
In his first attack on Labour over the issue, the PM said: “Part of the problem was people following a very top down, target-led agenda which meant patient care being put on the back-burner. David Nicholson has made his apology and wants to get on with his job.
“Other people, frankly, should be thinking of their position.” Labour claimed Mr Cameron was trying to “politicise a huge tragedy”. But Health Secretary Jeremy Hunt accused Labour of “catastrophic policy mistakes”.
Stick to the tory spin. He clearly had a go at labour. It was merited so why you want to spin otherwise is baffling.
In your world Osbrowne might be near perfect and Cammie always "generous" and would never dream of politicising an issue, but outside of CCHQ I don't think you'll get many on here willing to believe that risible tosh. Apart from the PB tories of course.
http://www.rebeccapow.com/?page_id=13
Nice bouquet.
A third of Britain is effectively off-limits to lower-income working families because private rents are unaffordable, a new report claims.
The report comes from the Resolution Foundation, which campaigns on behalf of low to middle-income families.
It says most of southern England is now beyond the reach of less affluent households.
Mark Easton spoke to a group of young people in London and discovered many of them were spending more than half their salaries on rent."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-23312220
Poor old Seth. So much spin, so little common sense.
A date night with tim!
Let's see the current lot promote a culture of openness then.
Have the famous 50 NHS whistleblowers whose payoffs were criticised by Parliament, had their stories published yet? If not, why not?
The NHS should have no secrets from us, the taxpayers who fund and use it. But I see no sign of the current government adopting such a radical approach.
The wee park ranger is a very big target. Maybe Clegg will pop by to 'help' him?
READ THIS SPEECH:
https://www.gov.uk/government/speeches/francis-report-pm-statement-on-mid-staffs-public-inquiry
NOTE THE DATE:
6 February 2013
TRY TO GET YOUR HEAD ROUND THIS BIT:
But let us also be clear about what the Report does not say.
Francis does not blame any specific policy.
He does not blame the last Secretary of State for Health.
And he says we should not seek scapegoats.
AND THIS BIT:
The last government commissioned the first report from Robert Francis…
…and when he saw that report, the former Secretary of State – now the Shadow Health Secretary – was right to apologise for what went wrong.
AND THIS BIT:
Mr Speaker, since the problems at Mid Staffordshire hospital first came to light a number of important steps have been taken.
The last government set up the National Quality Board and the Quality Accounts System.
Andy Burnham seems to have gone wrong when he started listening to his friends advice
"Mr Burnham is said to have repeatedly rejected her calls to improve the much-criticised system, which gave Basildon a 'good' rating just weeks before an unannounced inspection uncovered filthy wards and a high death rate.
The furious rows are out of character for the normally mild-mannered Mr Burnham, who has recently been tipped as a contender to take over the Labour leadership from Gordon Brown. Some friends have advised him to 'toughen up' his image in preparation for a run at the job."
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1233532/NHS-feud-hothead-Labour-baroness-accused-sending-colleagues-abusive-emails.html
Calm down Seth before you start getting overexcited at the thought of used condoms again.
I'm afraid the heat is clearly doing very strange things to you. Time for a cold shower old chap.
The Labour MP there seems quite decent compared to Dundee West and Falkirk though
Banging on about Burnham won't really change that and the whole strategy is probably misconceived, like Labour going on about welfare spongers - it raises the profile of an issue where the party is perceived as weaker.
I see Broxtowe CLP shortlisted 5 people yesterday. I guess you, Greg Marshall, Nick McDonald, Atul Joshi ...who's the 5th?
We will support an active role for the independent sector working alongside the NHS in the provision of care, particularly where they bring innovation – such as in end-of-life care and cancer services, and increase capacity... Patients requiring elective care will have the right, in law, to choose from any provider who meets NHS standards of quality at NHS costs.
Labour manifesto, 2010. Health Secretary: Andy Burnham.
*tears of laughter etc*
Struck a sore spot did I Richard?
Save your pathetic attempts at deflection with the Francis Report and the timing.
You tried to claim Cammie was some ludicrous whiter than white "generous" figure that didn't use Mid Staffs to attack labour.
Absolutely no mention of any absurd caveats/excuses about the timing and the Francis report.
The truth is he used Mid Staffs to attack labour and for some reason that fact upsets you greatly.
"In his first attack on Labour over the issue, the PM said: “Part of the problem was people following a very top down, target-led agenda which meant patient care being put on the back-burner. David Nicholson has made his apology and wants to get on with his job.
“Other people, frankly, should be thinking of their position.”
Your inept spin is as amusing and incompetent as it always is. "Near Perfect" in fact.
'"Mr Burnham is said to have repeatedly rejected her calls to improve the much-criticised system, which gave Basildon a 'good' rating just weeks before an unannounced inspection uncovered filthy wards and a high death rate.'
Toxic Andy.
Makes you wonder what the real A&E waiting times would have been under New Labour if they had been measured during 'unannounced' inspections.