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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Another contender enters the LAB race which could be drawn

SystemSystem Posts: 12,265
edited July 2016 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Another contender enters the LAB race which could be drawn out for months

Owen Smith enters the LAB race https://t.co/Szhsj2CA19

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,768
    edited July 2016
    1st like Jezza

    BTW Owen Smith is waiting till after tomorrows NEC now before he decides to run or not
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,450
    Second like The Eagles.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    Completely irrelevant like Labour.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,768
    GIN1138 said:

    Second like The Eagles.

    I think Eagles will finish 3rd
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    Stupid move to split the unity vote and allow a second round and possible transfers from either of the unity candidates to Corbyn. Now it just looks like unprofessional infighting and squabbling between two people who just want to be leader rather than regicide.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,840
    Labour - committed to providing political pundits with work since 2015.

    Seriously, what would summer threads have been without a bizarre leadership contest last year? Apparently they decided it was so good it had to be an annual thing. I see Mike's hand in this.
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    Sorry to go off-topic so soon, but what are people's thoughts on the Republican convention? Is there any way that Trump doesn't get a bounce?
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    https://twitter.com/danbloom1/status/752561410450817024
  • WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    Is Theresa May the last Prime Minister who will face a Labour Opposition?
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,755
    Who's Owen Smith?
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,768
    RodCrosby said:

    https://twitter.com/danbloom1/status/752561410450817024

    I think compulsory reselection for all MPs has to be part of Corbyns bid for leader this time round.

    Lets face it these MPs are off to form SDP2 after a Jezza win anyway
  • OmniumOmnium Posts: 11,039
    Wanderer said:

    Is Theresa May the last Prime Minister who will face a Labour Opposition?

    That was David Cameron
  • TwistedFireStopperTwistedFireStopper Posts: 2,538
    edited July 2016
    As I commented at the weekend, what a time to be alive in Britain at the moment. We're either on the edge of the Abyss or just starting out on a trek to the Sunny Uplands.
    I think Labour are at the Abyss, though, and feeling a bit dizzy looking down.
  • Paul_BedfordshirePaul_Bedfordshire Posts: 3,632
    edited July 2016
    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,768
    Sean_F said:

    Who's Owen Smith?

    No idea is it the name you use when you book into a hotel with a lady who is not your Mrs ??
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,768
    I would say Owen Smith has a 5% chance of beating Jezza. Angela Eagle has LT a 1% chance IMO
  • eekeek Posts: 28,797
    edited July 2016
    bigjohnowls said:

    GIN1138 said:

    Second like The Eagles.

    I think Eagles will finish 3rd
    out of 2 candidates....

    I just commented on the previous thread, why on earth did she declare when things were clearly still up in the air? - based on Tom Watson's comments this afternoon
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    Owen Smith enters the LAB race

    Where do Labour keep finding these political titans ?
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,930
    Wanderer said:

    Is Theresa May the last Prime Minister who will face a Labour Opposition?

    You think it's only Labour PMs from now on? Brave.
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    TwistedFireStopper said:

    As I commented at the weekend, what a time to be alive in Britain at the moment. We're either on the edge of the Abyss or just starting out on a trek to the Sunny Uplands.
    I think Labour are at the Abyss, though, and feeling a bit dizzy looking down.

    The opening lines of 'A Tale of Two Cities' really come to mind
  • EdgwareJoelEdgwareJoel Posts: 26
    I just saw Angela Eagle give a speech for the first time on the BBC. Jesus Christ, if this is the best they can do they are in major trouble. At least Leadsome could deliver the rhythm of a sentence right.
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 57,930
    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    Actually, Paul, EFTA is quite good at doing trade deals. They have perfectly serviceable ones with Canada, the GCC, etc.

    Even if we did decide to leave the EEA later, there's no reason to leave EFTA.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    MaxPB said:

    Stupid move to split the unity vote and allow a second round and possible transfers from either of the unity candidates to Corbyn. Now it just looks like unprofessional infighting and squabbling between two people who just want to be leader rather than regicide.

    The fact that Eagle and Smith couldn't come to an agreement says it all.
  • YBarddCwscYBarddCwsc Posts: 7,172
    Sean_F said:

    Who's Owen Smith?

    Son of Professor Dai Smith, the Raymond Williams Professor of Cultural History at Swansea University, Chair of Welsh Arts Council, etc.

    Basically, Welsh Labour aristocracy.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited July 2016
    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    FPT. Apologies if this has already been posted, but now looking significantly more grim for the PLP and wider Labour party?

    Twitter
    George Eaton ‏@georgeeaton 36m36 minutes ago
    Tom Watson to PLP meeting: "For years I've been told that I'm a fixer. Well, I've tried to fix this and I've failed."

    George Eaton ‏@georgeeaton 32m32 minutes ago
    Watson also told PLP: "I've got my own mandate but if I lost your confidence I would resign, and Jeremy should have done."
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,840
    rcs1000 said:

    Wanderer said:

    Is Theresa May the last Prime Minister who will face a Labour Opposition?

    You think it's only Labour PMs from now on? Brave.
    One thing Corbynistas have taught me is that you only ever get Tory PMs - sometimes they just happen to be called Labour at the time.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    Twitter
    Sophy Ridge ‏@SophyRidgeSky 43m43 minutes ago
    Owen Smith's team tell me "not true" he will launch rival leadership bid tomorrow. Presumably he's waiting to see if Corbyn on ballot paper
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    https://twitter.com/SkyData/status/752564163210280960
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,191
    Do labour not know that if you split the anti-x vote you make it easier for x? Good grief they are useless.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    https://twitter.com/SkyData/status/752564608175570944
  • HaroldOHaroldO Posts: 1,185
    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Did the same this morning IIRC, cheap shot from a tacky politician.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    Now May is PM in waiting and with Labour in turmoil she could well be PM for at least as long as Cameron if she calls and wins a snap election and if she waits until 2020 and wins she could be PM for almost a decade, surpassing Cameron and Major and Brown and almost as long as Blair and Thatcher. She will be the UK's Merkel, could dominate the centre and leave the right to UKIP and the left to whatever remains of Labour
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    Son of Professor Dai Smith, the Raymond Williams Professor of Cultural History at Swansea University, Chair of Welsh Arts Council, etc.

    Basically, Welsh Labour aristocracy.

    'The Crachach...'
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable
  • murali_smurali_s Posts: 3,067
    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    Will Larry the cat remain in No10, or leave with the Camerons?

    Twitter
    Larry the Cat ‏@Number10cat 2h2 hours ago
    Does anyone know a good cat groomer available tomorrow? I need to make a good impression on someone on Wednesday...
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,840
    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    Jeremy Corbyn and by extension his hundreds of thousands of supporters and millions of those who will vote labour do.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    Owen Smith is just waiting to see if Corbyn is on the ballot. If he is then I expect he might not run. Corbyn will do a demolition job on Eagle if he is indeed on.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Quite amazing that the Sky Data poll found 18% thought Jezza would be the better PM. Although he didn't quite beat the "Don't Knows".

    Bless ....
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,713
    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    she's also shadow health secretary. Is the NHS now a joke in Labour circles ?
  • TwistedFireStopperTwistedFireStopper Posts: 2,538
    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    The fact that she is probably one of Labour's "big beasts" should make you worried.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 52,920
    JackW said:

    Quite amazing that the Sky Data poll found 18% thought Jezza would be the better PM. Although he didn't quite beat the "Don't Knows".

    Bless ....

    Presumably they were the "Don't know who Corbyn is" group?
  • BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,492
    Does anybody know, will those people who paid £3 to vote in the last labour leadership election, automatically get a vote in this one? or will they have to pay again?

    I would have thought it was a one-off, but because it is within a year I don't want to assume anything!
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    edited July 2016
    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable
    And she can conduct negotiations on the basis of "I didn't want this any more than you do, but we are where we are".

    I'm optimistic of a soft landing for the first time since the vote. As I put it this morning I voted remain, but now I'm a belEEAver, and I suspect that position is quite widespread.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    11% of Londoners want it to be independent post Brexit, 23% want the London Assembly replaced with a London Parliament like Holyrood
    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/eleven-per-cent-of-people-want-london-to-become-a-separate-country-after-brexit-vote-a3292701.html
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    mu-rarrrrrrrrrrrrrrr-li
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Ishmael_X said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable
    And she can conduct negotiations on the basis of "I didn't want this any more than you do, but we are where we are".

    I'm optimistic of a soft landing for the first time since the vote. As I put it this morning I voted remain, but now I'm a belEEaver, and I suspect that position is quite widespread.
    Many thanks for your pointers on previous thread.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,191
    So in my lifetime the Conservatives are on their second female leader and Labour on their second existential crisis.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    williamglenn said:

    JackW said:

    Quite amazing that the Sky Data poll found 18% thought Jezza would be the better PM. Although he didn't quite beat the "Don't Knows".

    Bless ....

    Presumably they were the "Don't know who Corbyn is" group?
    Think we may have found Labour's floor under Corbyn. Bit less than Hodges' 25 or even 20%.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Alanbrooke said:

    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    she's also shadow health secretary. Is the NHS now a joke in Labour circles ?
    Its all a bit like Hitler's Birthday party in the bunker, as the bombs and shells fall. The level of disconnect from reality is extraordinary.

    My respect for Eagle increases. She is the only one with the guts to put herself on the line.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    After Nick Boles landed in hot water when he got caught out trying to get some May supporters in Conservative Parliamentary party to tactically vote for Gove to stop Leadsom getting on ballot paper. I have been left wondering if the May campaign team wisely realised that Gove would have in the end proved a tougher opponent than Leadsom if he had been on that final ballot to be put to the wider membership....
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    Angela Eagle once 'ruthlessly removed' the British Women's Chess Association President in a coup. A sign of things to come?
    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/londoners-diary/londoners-diary-chilcot-rouses-the-biographers-of-tony-blair-a3292856.html
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 120,407
    https://twitter.com/DMcCaffreySKY/status/752556850319679488
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    Moses_ said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable
    And she can conduct negotiations on the basis of "I didn't want this any more than you do, but we are where we are".

    I'm optimistic of a soft landing for the first time since the vote. As I put it this morning I voted remain, but now I'm a belEEaver, and I suspect that position is quite widespread.
    Many thanks for your pointers on previous thread.
    No problem, good luck, final tip: check your household insurance, you may have general legal expenses cover for contractual disputes.
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    TwistedFireStopper said:

    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    The fact that she is probably one of Labour's "big beasts" should make you worried.
    Pretty accurate description, in the land of the blind the one eyed man is king.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    Ishmael_X said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable
    And she can conduct negotiations on the basis of "I didn't want this any more than you do, but we are where we are".

    I'm optimistic of a soft landing for the first time since the vote. As I put it this morning I voted remain, but now I'm a belEEAver, and I suspect that position is quite widespread.
    Agreed, I voted Remain too but as long as May can do some form of EEA deal we will be fine
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    Interesting to read that Eagle is a very good chess player.

    She must full well know she is Tom Watson's gambit pawn.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,112
    Ishmael_X said:

    HYUFD said:

    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable
    And she can conduct negotiations on the basis of "I didn't want this any more than you do, but we are where we are".

    I'm optimistic of a soft landing for the first time since the vote. As I put it this morning I voted remain, but now I'm a belEEAver, and I suspect that position is quite widespread.
    We shall see. Interesting to hear one of La Leadsom's dimwitted MP supporters trying to structure the debate in terms similar to : "May has said Brexit means Brexit, hence no Norwegian model...."

    Of course a) May has said no such thing (about Norway); and b) a lot of people, not perhaps BelEEAvers, perhaps Anti-Foreignevers, will remain unhappy.

    Such is life, I suppose.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    TwistedFireStopper said:

    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    The fact that she is probably one of Labour's "big beasts" should make you worried.
    Doesn't Luke lose his arm in a fight with Vader in Empire?
  • MaxPBMaxPB Posts: 39,334
    HYUFD said:

    11% of Londoners want it to be independent post Brexit, 23% want the London Assembly replaced with a London Parliament like Holyrood
    http://www.standard.co.uk/news/politics/eleven-per-cent-of-people-want-london-to-become-a-separate-country-after-brexit-vote-a3292701.html

    Not really a massive "movement" is it.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    foxinsoxuk said:

    Its all a bit like Hitler's Birthday party in the bunker, as the bombs and shells fall. The level of disconnect from reality is extraordinary.

    My respect for Eagle increases. She is the only one with the guts to put herself on the line.

    More like Stauffenberg's coup in 1944 ....

  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    fitalass said:

    Will Larry the cat remain in No10, or leave with the Camerons?

    Twitter
    Larry the Cat ‏@Number10cat 2h2 hours ago
    Does anyone know a good cat groomer available tomorrow? I need to make a good impression on someone on Wednesday...

    I thought he was Osborne's cat?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Pulpstar said:

    Interesting to read that Eagle is a very good chess player.

    She must full well know she is Tom Watson's gambit pawn.

    The pawn that makes its move may well become Queen...
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    @peter from Putney FPT ...thanks for the advice.

  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Sky news interview on now,

    Christine Shawcroft members rep on the NEC does not understand why a challenge to Corbyn is taking place given he got biggest mandate of any leader only 10 months ago. She states she will also vote tomorrow to ensure Corbyn is on the ballot.

    Krypes make it stop...I just cannot eat anymore popcorn.
  • EPGEPG Posts: 6,673
    TOPPING said:

    Paul_Bedfordshire said:

    @RobD said in previous thread: A deal in under five months? Interesting!

    The deal is already there. We leave the EU and join EFTA/EEA. Not exactly difficult to draft that.

    All that has to be decided is what concessions on free movement they will agree and how much Danegeld (in membership fees higher per capita than Norway) that - they will demand/we are prepared to pay - in return.

    Dosen't really take that long to agree principles behind closed doors then, after December or whenever, hold a few summits to thrash out the last details and play brinkmanship over the fees/free movement and everyone emerges triumphant into the sunlight.

    We get some bells and whistles on free movement stopping people coming over here to take un/low skilled work that isn't viable without housing benefit/tax credits/free NHS (unless their own country offers similar levels which exempts France Germany etc.) they still get much of our contribution which they can ill afford to lose and six months later then France and Germany see to it that EU will implement same free movement restrictions throughout the EU (without any reduction in payments by us of course which become our EFTA "Barnet Formula").

    We leave, set up our own trade deals outside the EU, carry on in EFTA and see what happens for a few years. If, in a decade or so EU is a much smaller portion of our trade, we have healthy agriculture, our seas are full of fish because we have replaced CAP/CFP with our own rules, we start handbagging for contribution reductions in the same way as Thatcher got our rebate. The won't want to lose all our contributions if they say no and we leave so will cave in.

    Job done.

    So easy to negotiate with the EU; looks like we're going to get all we want. Phewee.

    Just the teensy weensy slightest doubt, however, that it will be such plain sailing. I mean this is the organisation that the Leavers say gave us such a shocking deal a matter of a few months ago.
    The evil genius jailers have become the happy-clappy supplicants overnight.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 124,716
    edited July 2016
    JackW said:

    Quite amazing that the Sky Data poll found 18% thought Jezza would be the better PM. Although he didn't quite beat the "Don't Knows".

    Bless ....

    Yes, he managed to get over half the percentage Ed Miliband won last May, onwards and upwards Jezza!
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    JackW said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    Its all a bit like Hitler's Birthday party in the bunker, as the bombs and shells fall. The level of disconnect from reality is extraordinary.

    My respect for Eagle increases. She is the only one with the guts to put herself on the line.

    More like Stauffenberg's coup in 1944 ....

    Possibly.

    The choice for sensible Labour is to fight or to become extinct. Only one option has a chance of political survival.
  • TwistedFireStopperTwistedFireStopper Posts: 2,538
    AndyJS said:

    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/

    Because Labour can't.
  • AramintaMoonbeamQCAramintaMoonbeamQC Posts: 3,866
    Just when it looked like we might be entering a period of calm and stability, along come the Labour Party. Their commitment to giving us something to LOL about is much appreciated.

    Young Corbynite on Twitter asking what Labour need to do to win Scotland back from the SNP. Will you tell him, or shall I?
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    HYUFD said:

    JackW said:

    Quite amazing that the Sky Data poll found 18% thought Jezza would be the better PM. Although he didn't quite beat the "Don't Knows".

    Bless ....

    Yes, he managed to get over half the percentage Ed Miliband won last May, onwards and upwards Jezza!
    I think the comparable figure would be the percentage who thought Ed would make the best PM. Cameron always led his party.
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    TheScreamingEagles said:

    https://twitter.com/DMcCaffreySKY/status/752556850319679488

    The Labour party Leadership rules have been tested to the limit, and have proved to be totally unfit for purpose over the last couple of weeks. It seems incredible that Corbyn will even attempt to get on a Leadership ballot without the PLP nominations required?! You simple cannot run the main Opposition party, never mind a Government without the support of your Parliamentary colleagues however popular you are among the grassroots? Will Corbyn really lead the Labour party down a disastrous blind alley to obscurity over a battle for the Labour party brand?
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    TwistedFireStopper said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/

    Because Labour can't.
    Priceless! :)
  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 10,001
    I think I'm right in saying that Owen Smith was the Labour candidate in the Blaenau Gwent by election in 2006. He lost to Independent Dai Davies, Peter Law's agent.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    rottenborough said:

    fitalass said:

    Will Larry the cat remain in No10, or leave with the Camerons?

    Twitter
    Larry the Cat ‏@Number10cat 2h2 hours ago
    Does anyone know a good cat groomer available tomorrow? I need to make a good impression on someone on Wednesday...

    I thought he was Osborne's cat?
    Officially, Larry belongs to the Cabinet Office.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    williamglenn said:

    JackW said:

    Quite amazing that the Sky Data poll found 18% thought Jezza would be the better PM. Although he didn't quite beat the "Don't Knows".

    Bless ....

    Presumably they were the "Don't know who Corbyn is" group?
    Possibly .... or Status Quo - "we're too polite to kick a man when he's down, down, deeper and down."
  • RobDRobD Posts: 60,158
    AndyJS said:

    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/

    No. She must deliver for all.
  • ParistondaParistonda Posts: 1,843
    Ishmael_X said:

    HYUFD said:



    Yes but we now have a Remainer leading the country, so the EU may be a bit more amenable

    And she can conduct negotiations on the basis of "I didn't want this any more than you do, but we are where we are".

    I'm optimistic of a soft landing for the first time since the vote. As I put it this morning I voted remain, but now I'm a belEEAver, and I suspect that position is quite widespread.
    I am one of the rare true europhile/support the idea of ever closer union types - but as it's clear the UK is on a ever diverging path from the rest of the EU, I think an EEA type solution is the best option we have left, and we should go for it - no second votes or parliament blockages of brexit. The EEA option is not perfect, but it is a good compromise all round. If May can deliver a successful brexit-lite then she may put the europe question to bed. I'm no tory but am mildly optimistic for the first time since June 23rd.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    surbiton said:

    rottenborough said:

    fitalass said:

    Will Larry the cat remain in No10, or leave with the Camerons?

    Twitter
    Larry the Cat ‏@Number10cat 2h2 hours ago
    Does anyone know a good cat groomer available tomorrow? I need to make a good impression on someone on Wednesday...

    I thought he was Osborne's cat?
    Officially, Larry belongs to the Cabinet Office.
    I think you are mistaken concerning the power structures of felines.

    The Cabinet Office belongs to Larry.
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296
    So who isn't watching Trainspotting Live on BBC 4? :)
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    FrankBooth said:

    I think I'm right in saying that Owen Smith was the Labour candidate in the Blaenau Gwent by election in 2006. He lost to Independent Dai Davies, Peter Law's agent.

    He also turned Pontypridd from a rock-solid Labour seat into a marginal in 2010.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    AndyJS said:

    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/

    Keep polishing your pink bus, love.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    tlg86 said:

    So who isn't watching Trainspotting Live on BBC 4? :)

    A new series of University Challenge has just started on BBC2.
  • felixfelix Posts: 15,180
    AndyJS said:

    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/

    Labour really don't get this uniting the country malarkey do they?
  • fitalassfitalass Posts: 4,320
    rottenborough said:

    fitalass said:

    Will Larry the cat remain in No10, or leave with the Camerons?

    Twitter
    Larry the Cat ‏@Number10cat 2h2 hours ago
    Does anyone know a good cat groomer available tomorrow? I need to make a good impression on someone on Wednesday...

    I thought he was Osborne's cat?
    No, Larry is the No10 cat, the Osborne's cat Freya is the tabby that lives with them next door. I believe that Freya elected herself boss cat in Downing Street without much of a fight from Larry. :)
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    John_M said:

    AndyJS said:

    "Harman: Theresa May must ‘deliver for women’"

    http://leftfootforward.org/2016/07/harman-theresa-may-must-deliver-for-women/

    Keep polishing your pink bus, love.
    at least that's more positive than cleaning behind the fridge.
  • John_MJohn_M Posts: 7,503
    fitalass said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    https://twitter.com/DMcCaffreySKY/status/752556850319679488

    The Labour party Leadership rules have been tested to the limit, and have proved to be totally unfit for purpose over the last couple of weeks. It seems incredible that Corbyn will even attempt to get on a Leadership ballot without the PLP nominations required?! You simple cannot run the main Opposition party, never mind a Government without the support of your Parliamentary colleagues however popular you are among the grassroots? Will Corbyn really lead the Labour party down a disastrous blind alley to obscurity over a battle for the Labour party brand?
    File under "Questions to which the answer is: Yes".
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,654
    edited July 2016
    fitalass said:

    TheScreamingEagles said:

    https://twitter.com/DMcCaffreySKY/status/752556850319679488

    The Labour party Leadership rules have been tested to the limit, and have proved to be totally unfit for purpose over the last couple of weeks. It seems incredible that Corbyn will even attempt to get on a Leadership ballot without the PLP nominations required?! You simple cannot run the main Opposition party, never mind a Government without the support of your Parliamentary colleagues however popular you are among the grassroots? Will Corbyn really lead the Labour party down a disastrous blind alley to obscurity over a battle for the Labour party brand?
    No, the Labour rulebook is very very clear actually.
    Watto just doesn't like what it says and is trying to rig it the wrong way.
  • FensterFenster Posts: 2,115
    JackW said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    Its all a bit like Hitler's Birthday party in the bunker, as the bombs and shells fall. The level of disconnect from reality is extraordinary.

    My respect for Eagle increases. She is the only one with the guts to put herself on the line.

    More like Stauffenberg's coup in 1944 ....

    I hope she doesn't put the dynamite up against Watson's leg. The assassination will never work.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    AndyJS said:

    FrankBooth said:

    I think I'm right in saying that Owen Smith was the Labour candidate in the Blaenau Gwent by election in 2006. He lost to Independent Dai Davies, Peter Law's agent.

    He also turned Pontypridd from a rock-solid Labour seat into a marginal in 2010.
    Presumably one of these two rebels/moderators will redraw before the Corbyn showdown?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    It was funny hearing Krishnan Guru-Murthy asking Diane Abbott whether she thought Angela Eagle was Darth Vader.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    Fenster said:

    JackW said:

    foxinsoxuk said:

    Its all a bit like Hitler's Birthday party in the bunker, as the bombs and shells fall. The level of disconnect from reality is extraordinary.

    My respect for Eagle increases. She is the only one with the guts to put herself on the line.

    More like Stauffenberg's coup in 1944 ....

    I hope she doesn't put the dynamite up against Watson's leg. The assassination will never work.
    Downfall, what a fine film. And source of endless parody.

    Where are the Unite battalions to the North?
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 63,562
    fitalass said:

    rottenborough said:

    fitalass said:

    Will Larry the cat remain in No10, or leave with the Camerons?

    Twitter
    Larry the Cat ‏@Number10cat 2h2 hours ago
    Does anyone know a good cat groomer available tomorrow? I need to make a good impression on someone on Wednesday...

    I thought he was Osborne's cat?
    No, Larry is the No10 cat, the Osborne's cat Freya is the tabby that lives with them next door. I believe that Freya elected herself boss cat in Downing Street without much of a fight from Larry. :)
    So Larry could be back as Top Cat, when Osborne moves to FO?
  • tlg86tlg86 Posts: 26,296
    AndyJS said:

    tlg86 said:

    So who isn't watching Trainspotting Live on BBC 4? :)

    A new series of University Challenge has just started on BBC2.
    Damn it, I'll have to catch up with that on the iPlayer.
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    AndyJS said:

    It was funny hearing Krishnan Guru-Murthy asking Diane Abbott whether she thought Angela Eagle was Darth Vader.

    and whether she was princess leia, which I'd posted here this morning!
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    tlg86 said:

    So who isn't watching Trainspotting Live on BBC 4? :)

    Currently delayed arrival of 66789.

    Beyond satire and compulsive viewing...
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    foxinsoxuk said:

    Alanbrooke said:

    murali_s said:

    AndyJS said:

    Diane Abbott on C4 News dubs Angela Eagle "The Empire Strikes Back" candidate.

    Does anyone take Diane Abbott seriously? She's comedy gold...
    she's also shadow health secretary. Is the NHS now a joke in Labour circles ?
    Its all a bit like Hitler's Birthday party in the bunker, as the bombs and shells fall. The level of disconnect from reality is extraordinary.

    My respect for Eagle increases. She is the only one with the guts to put herself on the line.
    Corbyn has spent this evening addressing the Cuba Solidarity Campaign.
This discussion has been closed.