The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
Project Truth: leaving or remaining will be the equivalent of about one good or bad year of economic growth over a period of about 5-10 years. You are not going to frighten many people with stuff like that. So both sides are spouting crap instead.
Economically we will face much bigger issues in the years ahead than whether or not we remain in the EU.
Yes
My view is that we can be a success in or out of the EU, and we can also be a failure in or out.
Even if we were to join the Euro and become fully integrated members of the EU (which I stress I do not want), a thoroughly incompetent government could cause far more harm to the UK than our embracing of the EU. Likewise if we were out.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
BSE was due to be killing hundreds if thousands by now too.
yes BSE was poorly presented in terms of risk. but don't you think nuclear war (or some kind of major nuclear terrorist activity) is now more likely than it was in the 80s when we used to worry about it?
I would agree that the risk of the odd nuke going off now is greater than the 80's due to proliferation etc. The risk of a global thermonuclear war is now lower imo.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
But look at it in elections.
Project Fear won the Indyref,
Project fear of Ed in Nicola's pocket won GE 2015 (coupled with Ozzy's awesome stewardship of the economy)
Fear has to be credible though to work. The Ed in the pocket meme worked as he was seen as weak and it was quite credible that the Scots would demand more goodies to be paid for by the English. On the other hand, in 1997 the Tories tried their "demon eyes" campaign against Blair and it was a miserable failure. Other examples of failure include "Save the Pound" from the Cons and "Save the NHS" from Lab
Indeed but I would also argue that fear needs a credible messenger. Remain has that in Cameron.
Coupled with Remain being the status quo, helps.
A credible messenger is a fair point. The question with Cameron is whether the 64% of the electorate who didn't vote for him last year find him credible on this (bearing in mind that a fair chunk of the 36% who did vote Con are plumping for leave)
Of the other 64% the UKIP voters are almost certainly written off from Remain while the Lib Dems and Labour will see both their own party leader and the PM saying the same thing. The PM will lend further credibility to their own side backing Remain. Though given the way the other parties votes are split the DaveTories are almost certainly enough to win it anyway.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
so whenever we identify a risk, take action and avert it, you believe there is a conspiracy.
for example, flu is very real. probably a number of your relatives dies of it in 1918, and we are not much further on in preventing similar
Well of those examples listed I would suggest that only in one case did we actually take effective action. The rest all turned out to be very effective scare stories and the fact they didn't come to pass had little or nothing to do with what we did or did not do.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
BSE was due to be killing hundreds if thousands by now too.
yes BSE was poorly presented in terms of risk. but don't you think nuclear war (or some kind of major nuclear terrorist activity) is now more likely than it was in the 80s when we used to worry about it?
Far more likely in the 80's, in fact we came extraordinarily close to conflict. Ignoring strategic submarine forces, Central Europe was littered with battlefield nuclear weapons, Cruise in the UK and elsewhere, and whatever canned sunshine the US had here, and in Belgium, Holland, Italy etc There were armed aircraft, pilots in cockpits, waiting at the end of runways with engines running ready for the 'Go' order. Most of that is stood down now.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
BSE was due to be killing hundreds if thousands by now too.
yes BSE was poorly presented in terms of risk. but don't you think nuclear war (or some kind of major nuclear terrorist activity) is now more likely than it was in the 80s when we used to worry about it?
I would agree that the risk of the odd nuke going off now is greater than the 80's due to proliferation etc. The risk of a global thermonuclear war is now lower imo.
Stephen Crabb is interesting. He has a beard which fits nicely with the new anti-politics and his background should have Tories eating out of his hand. I don't really buy what some said about lacking charisma. Compared to whom? Osborne? May? Javid?
Let's face it though he hasn't really been tested yet and if Cameron is forced out quickly it may be too soon for him. 2018-19 perhaps?
I grew up in Pembrokeshire and can assure you that compared with earlier MPs for the area -such as Desmond Donnelly and Nicholas Edwards - Stephen Crabb is seen as a political pigmy. He also came very close to being ruined during the Expenses Scandal. Moreover, since Devolution the post of Secretary of State for Wales is pretty much a non-job which many would favour being abolished. Crabb wasn't even Cameron's first choice, being appointed only after David Jones was found lacking. He is not disliked as such , but is certainly not on the radar of even his own constituents in the way that his predecessors were.
Crabbe is my MP, unfortunately. Big in the church, he has built up a decent powerbase down here which will be difficult to shift. He is known as a pleasant affable character, but as Justin says he really is a non entity compared to Desmond Donnelly and Nicholas Edwards. (Glad he didnt mention Nick Bennett. ) Crabbe just happened to be in the right place at the right time.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
so whenever we identify a risk, take action and avert it, you believe there is a conspiracy.
for example, flu is very real. probably a number of your relatives dies of it in 1918, and we are not much further on in preventing similar
Well of those examples listed I would suggest that only in one case did we actually take effective action. The rest all turned out to be very effective scare stories and the fact they didn't come to pass had little or nothing to do with what we did or did not do.
I'm assuming the one we took action on is AIDS? That proved to be very serious where action was not taken.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
so whenever we identify a risk, take action and avert it, you believe there is a conspiracy.
for example, flu is very real. probably a number of your relatives dies of it in 1918, and we are not much further on in preventing similar
Well of those examples listed I would suggest that only in one case did we actually take effective action. The rest all turned out to be very effective scare stories and the fact they didn't come to pass had little or nothing to do with what we did or did not do.
I think we took action for aids bse flu(continuing) and the millenium bug (I'm the most sceptical about that one) not to mention cfcs
@Morris_Dancer <:: class="Quote" rel="Morris_Dancer">Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle. ------- It seems genuine. I went and googled her up before I posted this to make sure and it appears that she became a supporter of Jihad and Islam. See this from Feb 2 2015: http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5161/mona-sahlin
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
a) 63% of the voting population ignored Dave's 'credibility' and voted for someone else; b) Half of the 37% that did vote for him intend to vote against him this time.
These numbers imply that Dave does not have the clout that is imagined.
TrustDaveTories are about 18%-19% of last year's electorate.
18-19% is a massive portion of the electorate if the referendum is close. Lets say it ends 42-58 (quite plausible) then it will the TrustDaveTories that win it for Remain.
Had Dave recommended Leave then I'd think 80% at least of Tories would have backed Leave. That 30% differences is an extra 11% for Leave and would have meant that instead of 42 Leave/58 Remain it would instead be 53 Leave/47 Remain and Leave would win. That's assuming that none of the other 63% are influenced.
Ignore Dave Tories are as numerous as TDTs if the opinion polls are to believed.
It's worth noting that Labour Leavers are higher online than by telephone as well. That seems strange, given that the stereotypical Milifandom Labour activist base online wouldn't be more anti-EU than the average Labour supporter, surely?
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
I believe it's actually a quote form the Swedish Democratic Workers Party, or so a quick Google suggests. This may not be the same as the Social Democrats.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
so whenever we identify a risk, take action and avert it, you believe there is a conspiracy.
for example, flu is very real. probably a number of your relatives dies of it in 1918, and we are not much further on in preventing similar
Well of those examples listed I would suggest that only in one case did we actually take effective action. The rest all turned out to be very effective scare stories and the fact they didn't come to pass had little or nothing to do with what we did or did not do.
I'm assuming the one we took action on is AIDS? That proved to be very serious where action was not taken.
Indeed: look at the infection rate figures for Swaziland, Lesotho and South Africa. The latter of which can be thoroughly put at the door of the ruling party, and their denier madness.
And the Millennium Bug was not a major problem because people soent a great deal of time, money and effort fixing things. The next one'll be Unix and the 2038 problem.
Of course, the OBR are being careful not to take sides. What else would you expect?
The OBR are under no obligation to be neutral over Brexit. This is just something you have made up. Indeed, Osborne was busy yesterday in the HoC pretending they supported remain.
That doesn't mean that it's not a certainty that there will be a short-term hit as I described. Surely no-one is seriously going to pretend otherwise, are they?
Well, that's precisely what the OBR have just done.
I mean, really? We don't even know, in even the vaguest terms, what Brexit settlement we'd be attempting to negotiate, let alone how long it would take or what the result would be.
Clearly, it won't have as big an impact as you desperately want it to, judging by the OBR's lack of reaction.
Of course, the OBR are being careful not to take sides. What else would you expect?
The OBR are under no obligation to be neutral over Brexit. This is just something you have made up. Indeed, Osborne was busy yesterday in the HoC pretending they supported remain.
That doesn't mean that it's not a certainty that there will be a short-term hit as I described. Surely no-one is seriously going to pretend otherwise, are they?
Well, that's precisely what the OBR have just done.
I mean, really? We don't even know, in even the vaguest terms, what Brexit settlement we'd be attempting to negotiate, let alone how long it would take or what the result would be.
Clearly, it won't have as big an impact as you desperately want it to, judging by the OBR's lack of reaction.
@TSE Put it this way, were Cameron to recommend Leave, Leave would win a landslide. He's a nexus for floating voters. ------- Well, well, TSE sweating that Leave may win in June after all; and in actuality Cameron is fast losing credibility with the fear monger he has become.
The result is irrelevant, I'm not looking forward to the EU ref, as I will be editing PB from the 1st of June through to the 20th of June.
So for most of the last stage of the referendum campaign (and probable run up to a Tooting by election), as you all know, nothing major happens when Mike goes on holiday.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
Very good point and well made, Mr. Brooke. On the economic front we have also seen some predictions that were even more grossly wrong e.g. leaving the ERM would cripple us; if we didn't join the Euro we would not only be crippled but sidelined as well and the Uk would see not a penny more of internal investment as our financial services and vehicle manufacturers would decamp to the Eurozone.
Many of the people that gave us those nonsense predictions are still about and are still making the same arguments about what would happen if we leave the EU. Why any sentient being would listen to a word they say is quite beyond me.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
so whenever we identify a risk, take action and avert it, you believe there is a conspiracy.
for example, flu is very real. probably a number of your relatives dies of it in 1918, and we are not much further on in preventing similar
Well of those examples listed I would suggest that only in one case did we actually take effective action. The rest all turned out to be very effective scare stories and the fact they didn't come to pass had little or nothing to do with what we did or did not do.
I'm assuming the one we took action on is AIDS? That proved to be very serious where action was not taken.
We took action - constant action really - to try to mitigate the risk of nuclear war.
Stephen Crabb is interesting. He has a beard which fits nicely with the new anti-politics and his background should have Tories eating out of his hand. I don't really buy what some said about lacking charisma. Compared to whom? Osborne? May? Javid?
Let's face it though he hasn't really been tested yet and if Cameron is forced out quickly it may be too soon for him. 2018-19 perhaps?
I grew up in Pembrokeshire and can assure you that compared with earlier MPs for the area -such as Desmond Donnelly and Nicholas Edwards - Stephen Crabb is seen as a political pigmy. He also came very close to being ruined during the Expenses Scandal. Moreover, since Devolution the post of Secretary of State for Wales is pretty much a non-job which many would favour being abolished. Crabb wasn't even Cameron's first choice, being appointed only after David Jones was found lacking. He is not disliked as such , but is certainly not on the radar of even his own constituents in the way that his predecessors were.
Crabbe is my MP, unfortunately. Big in the church, he has built up a decent powerbase down here which will be difficult to shift. He is known as a pleasant affable character, but as Justin says he really is a non entity compared to Desmond Donnelly and Nicholas Edwards. (Glad he didnt mention Nick Bennett. ) Crabbe just happened to be in the right place at the right time.
There are several people on the Vote2012 website trying to get 29 new constituencies for the next proposed boundary review . Whether they start in the SE and work West and North or in the North and work Southwards because of the tight plus/minus 5% electorate limit they all seem to end up with a couple of constituencies Y Gweddillion In English - and left over bits - usually in the Pembrokeshire part of Wales .
@TSE Put it this way, were Cameron to recommend Leave, Leave would win a landslide. He's a nexus for floating voters. ------- Well, well, TSE sweating that Leave may win in June after all; and in actuality Cameron is fast losing credibility with the fear monger he has become.
The result is irrelevant, I'm not looking forward to the EU ref, as I will be editing PB from the 1st of June through to the 20th of June.
So for most of the last stage of the referendum campaign (and probable run up to a Tooting by election), as you all know, nothing major happens when Mike goes on holiday.
Will you be impartial? Innocent face.
I shall edit PB in my usual style, offering sagacious betting advice as my primary goal
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
Trump has likely already won Arizona due to the large number of early voters. On the other hand Utah is above 50% WTA, suspect that Cruz will manage that thanks to the Mormons.
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
That's already the case though. Don't like EU membership - vote for a UKIP government. Parliamentary sovereignty in action.
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
Maybe, but last time labour were in for 13 years and opened the flood gates as we all know
There seems to be a worrying and very odd understanding of 'risk' here. Mind you, that's not surprising - plenty of academic studies show that people are extremely bad at evaluating risk.
Just because something doesn't happen, doesn't mean there wasn't a risk of it happening, or that concerns abut the risk weren't entirely appropriate. For example, of Alanbrooke's list, several were either very real risks indeed (nuclear war, AIDS), or were unquantifiable risks where we simply couldn't tell how serious the risk was (BSE, Bird flu), or were real risks mitigated by sensible action (millennium bug, which was definitely real for commercial and banking systems even though people got over-excited about its possible effects on 'embedded' systems).
In addition, some rather relevant items were missed off the list - such as warnings about the 2008 crash.
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
That's already the case though. Don't like EU membership - vote for a UKIP government. Parliamentary sovereignty in action.
No need for that though is there. The Conservative PM has given us a referendum - people's democracy in action.
Add in the top people who worked for CCHQ at the last election are now working for Remain who are united, whilst Leave are still farting around trying to get lead campaign status.
Mr Eagles I'm 55 this year. Here's a selection of the scare stories I've grown up with.
1970s. Oil will run out by 2000 - it didn't and we're awash with the stuff 1970s - an Ice age is on its way early in the C21- I'm still mowing my lawn 1980s - we'll all die in a nuclear war - well Jezzas still saying it 1980s - we'll all die of AIDS - doesn't look that way 1990s - Global warming France will turn to desert - hugely disappointed by that one 1990s - the millenium bug will stop civilisation - nope TV still worked ar 00.01 on 1 Jan 2000 2000 - Saddam has WMDs - best let that one go 2000s - Foot and Mouth - probably one of our mors shameful episodes 2010s - we'll all die of Bird Flu - mostly chickens did, people not so much
The problem with establishment scare mongering for us oldies is we've seen it all before. And the more shrilly you do it the more convinced we become you're just trying it on.
so whenever we identify a risk, take action and avert it, you believe there is a conspiracy.
for example, flu is very real. probably a number of your relatives dies of it in 1918, and we are not much further on in preventing similar
Well of those examples listed I would suggest that only in one case did we actually take effective action. The rest all turned out to be very effective scare stories and the fact they didn't come to pass had little or nothing to do with what we did or did not do.
I'm assuming the one we took action on is AIDS? That proved to be very serious where action was not taken.
Yes. I was regarding AIDS as being the one where we took effective action and really made a difference.
There seems to be a worrying and very odd understanding of 'risk' here. Mind you, that's not surprising - plenty of academic studies show that people are extremely bad at evaluating risk.
Just because something doesn't happen, doesn't mean there wasn't a risk of it happening, or that concerns abut the risk weren't entirely appropriate. For example, of Alanbrooke's list, several were either very real risks indeed (nuclear war, AIDS), or were unquantifiable risks where we simply couldn't tell how serious the risk was (BSE, Bird flu), or were real risks mitigated by sensible action (millennium bug, which was definitely real for commercial and banking systems even though people got over-excited about its possible effects on 'embedded' systems).
In addition, some rather relevant items were missed off the list - such as warnings about the 2008 crash.
You are right but who was talking about risk? Mr. Brooke was talking about public predictions made by so called experts and/or senior politicians of what would happen, not what might happen unless we did x,y or z. For example in the early seventies there were people in positions of authority, or at least influence, running around telling us that oil was going to run out.
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
Maybe, but last time labour were in for 13 years and opened the flood gates as we all know
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
That's already the case though. Don't like EU membership - vote for a UKIP government. Parliamentary sovereignty in action.
Or vote for a party that has a referendum in its manifesto.
He's promised them lots of free stuff, and it sounds good if youve never paid income tax.
What is interesting is Sanders support is all middle and upper middle class white college kids. The people mostly likely to be directly affected by his central policies, minimum wage of $15/hr and US firms made to make stuff in the US, i.e overwhelmingly African American and Latinos still go for Hillary.
Nitwit Bernie supporters full of self righteousness zeal.
seems like USA political assasinations are more often right wing in origin
Yeah. The brother of Ronald Reagan's would be assassin had dinner with Vice President George Bush's son on the day before the assassination, and was a donor too.
I learn something new every day on PB
Reagan's attempted assassination conspiracy is bigger than JFK's assassination.
For virtually the whole period of Obama's term in office I've been secretly worried I'm about to witness a live headshot.
Just because he's black doesn't guarantee that he's definitely going to shoot someone.
Although I noticed that they surround him with bullet proof glass in case he tries it.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
He's promised them lots of free stuff, and it sounds good if youve never paid income tax.
What is interesting is Sanders support is all middle and upper middle class white college kids. The people mostly likely to be directly affected by his central policies, minimum wage of $15/hr and US firms made to make stuff in the US, i.e overwhelmingly African American and Latinos still go for Hillary.
Hillary's biggest problem in November is that alot of those kids are going to turn out for Bernie, and Bernie only.
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
Maybe, but last time labour were in for 13 years and opened the flood gates as we all know
I guess voters liked it.
I am not sure, indeed I am certain, voters had no idea of the consequences of uncontrolled immigration but they certainly do now
He's promised them lots of free stuff, and it sounds good if youve never paid income tax.
What is interesting is Sanders support is all middle and upper middle class white college kids. The people mostly likely to be directly affected by his central policies, minimum wage of $15/hr and US firms made to make stuff in the US, i.e overwhelmingly African American and Latinos still go for Hillary.
Hillary's biggest problem in November is that alot of those kids are going to turn out for Bernie, and Bernie only.
Perhaps....the anti-Donald is strong though, as OGH stated last night on the polling matters show, that his contacts say Trump is great for getting the vote out for Hillary.
Mr. Pulpstar, probably your own fault. Did you win some bets?
Was following Raceclear back when it was free - beating the start price is a big issue for bookies, alot of them are clueless how to price anything up and just follow Betfair !
Maybe we should threaten to leave the EU more often? Imagine what Cameron could have got if he seriously said, right I am going to tell the British people to leave unless I get what I want.
Mr. Pulpstar, probably your own fault. Did you win some bets?
Was following Raceclear back when it was free - beating the start price is a big issue for bookies, alot of them are clueless how to price anything up and just follow Betfair !
It got very expensive very quickly - at least compared with the amounts I was betting.
Edit: they seem to have had a good Cheltenham so far though. 6 winners on day two.
Mr. Pulpstar, probably your own fault. Did you win some bets?
Was following Raceclear back when it was free - beating the start price is a big issue for bookies, alot of them are clueless how to price anything up and just follow Betfair !
It got very expensive very quickly - at least compared with the amounts I was betting.
Edit: they seem to have had a good Cheltenham so far though. 6 winners on day two.
Their system worked, providing you could get on everything at best price !
That just became too much effort in the end for my liking + the psychological difficulty in not betting on a tip that shortens and seeing it win.
Mr. Urquhart, tremble at the unfettered might of sovereign Britannia!
[It is a good step. In the same way as an ounce of peas is welcomed by a starving person].
It is also another "Dead Cat" to keep the chatting classes busy over the next few days, rather than focusing too hard on the Alice in Wonderland 2019 turn around in the public finances...
I just had a thought that I do not think has been discussed. The EU and leaving is largely viewed through the prism of a Conservative Government but if (and it is a big if) labour got their act in order and became the Government, and they took over control of our borders, they would just open them again and we would have gone through all the hastle of leaving for no gain
I think you miss the big difference, Mr. G. If a future government introduced a policy that the voters didn't like then could be voted out.
Maybe, but last time labour were in for 13 years and opened the flood gates as we all know
I guess voters liked it.
I am not sure, indeed I am certain, voters had no idea of the consequences of uncontrolled immigration but they certainly do now
I guess when you have two parties with the same broad attitude to immigration (the only observable difference being the Tories pretending they could reduce it) then it's hard to vote on that basis however important it is to you.
Also, the leave vs remain polling suggests that even now a majority of voters don't, on balance, care.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
The "supreme belief" of the Left is the same as it always has been - the abolition, or at least the minimization, of unmerited privilege. That might be religious - go back far enough and Catholics were denied the vote in Britain - or, more typically, economic (the privilege Labour was founded to counter) but nowadays it is also racial/cultural. A white skin is an unmerited privilege - and, yes, I look forward to the arguments here that it is either a right of some sort, or else in some way merited, whilst at the same time being an accident of birth. I shall deal with them :
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
The "supreme belief" of the Left is the same as it always has been - the abolition, or at least the minimization, of unmerited privilege. That might be religious - go back far enough and Catholics were denied the vote in Britain - or, more typically, economic (the privilege Labour was founded to counter) but nowadays it is also racial/cultural. A white skin is an unmerited privilege - and, yes, I look forward to the arguments here that it is either a right of some sort, or else in some way merited, whilst at the same time being an accident of birth. I shall deal with them :
You think being White is an unmerited privilege that needs to be corrected?
They missed out my personal favourite (joking) the liquid treacle drink that is SuperMalt...I believe it has to be up there with the most sugary of anything on the market.
There seems to be a worrying and very odd understanding of 'risk' here. Mind you, that's not surprising - plenty of academic studies show that people are extremely bad at evaluating risk.
Just because something doesn't happen, doesn't mean there wasn't a risk of it happening, or that concerns abut the risk weren't entirely appropriate. For example, of Alanbrooke's list, several were either very real risks indeed (nuclear war, AIDS), or were unquantifiable risks where we simply couldn't tell how serious the risk was (BSE, Bird flu), or were real risks mitigated by sensible action (millennium bug, which was definitely real for commercial and banking systems even though people got over-excited about its possible effects on 'embedded' systems).
In addition, some rather relevant items were missed off the list - such as warnings about the 2008 crash.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
The "supreme belief" of the Left is the same as it always has been - the abolition, or at least the minimization, of unmerited privilege. That might be religious - go back far enough and Catholics were denied the vote in Britain - or, more typically, economic (the privilege Labour was founded to counter) but nowadays it is also racial/cultural. A white skin is an unmerited privilege - and, yes, I look forward to the arguments here that it is either a right of some sort, or else in some way merited, whilst at the same time being an accident of birth. I shall deal with them :
You think being White is an unmerited privilege that needs to be corrected?
That elides some steps in the logic, which would be that our society continues to be structured in such a way that it confers privilege on those with white skin. It would be a bit difficult to argue that that privilege is merited, I'd have thought, but I'm sure it won't take long for someone to have a crack at it.
I'm reasonably confident that the intended next step is to try and restructure society so that it no longer confers that privilege, rather than restructure skin colour.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
The "supreme belief" of the Left is the same as it always has been - the abolition, or at least the minimization, of unmerited privilege. That might be religious - go back far enough and Catholics were denied the vote in Britain - or, more typically, economic (the privilege Labour was founded to counter) but nowadays it is also racial/cultural. A white skin is an unmerited privilege - and, yes, I look forward to the arguments here that it is either a right of some sort, or else in some way merited, whilst at the same time being an accident of birth. I shall deal with them :
You think being White is an unmerited privilege that needs to be corrected?
That is the core foundation of multiculturalism. The dominant/host culture is privileged and it is necessary for legal and state sponsored corrective actions to change this. Ultimately the only way to break the power of the host, is to reduce its influence and dominance by adding more diversity.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
The "supreme belief" of the Left is the same as it always has been - the abolition, or at least the minimization, of unmerited privilege. That might be religious - go back far enough and Catholics were denied the vote in Britain - or, more typically, economic (the privilege Labour was founded to counter) but nowadays it is also racial/cultural. A white skin is an unmerited privilege - and, yes, I look forward to the arguments here that it is either a right of some sort, or else in some way merited, whilst at the same time being an accident of birth. I shall deal with them :
You think being White is an unmerited privilege that needs to be corrected?
That elides some steps in the logic, which would be that our society continues to be structured in such a way that it confers privilege on those with white skin. It would be a bit difficult to argue that that privilege is merited, I'd have thought, but I'm sure it won't take long for someone to have a crack at it.
I'm reasonably confident that the intended next step is to try and restructure society so that it no longer confers that privilege, rather than restructure skin colour.
Being white isn't a privilege.
I'm very not white skinned, this country has given me some fantastic privileges and opportunities, for which I will be forever grateful for.
Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
The quote is widely reported on the internet, although I don't know if it's authentic, or misreported.
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
They are both embarrassed and ashamed by their native culture, ethnicity and privilege.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
The "supreme belief" of the Left is the same as it always has been - the abolition, or at least the minimization, of unmerited privilege. That might be religious - go back far enough and Catholics were denied the vote in Britain - or, more typically, economic (the privilege Labour was founded to counter) but nowadays it is also racial/cultural. A white skin is an unmerited privilege - and, yes, I look forward to the arguments here that it is either a right of some sort, or else in some way merited, whilst at the same time being an accident of birth. I shall deal with them :
You think being White is an unmerited privilege that needs to be corrected?
That elides some steps in the logic, which would be that our society continues to be structured in such a way that it confers privilege on those with white skin. It would be a bit difficult to argue that that privilege is merited, I'd have thought, but I'm sure it won't take long for someone to have a crack at it.
I'm reasonably confident that the intended next step is to try and restructure society so that it no longer confers that privilege, rather than restructure skin colour.
We have been taking that next step, under both Tory & Labour governments, for decades now. What we have achieved is a good deal of integration of people born here, and, as a corollary, a good deal of anger amongst first generation immigrants, irrespective of their ethnicity.
He's promised them lots of free stuff, and it sounds good if youve never paid income tax.
What is interesting is Sanders support is all middle and upper middle class white college kids. The people mostly likely to be directly affected by his central policies, minimum wage of $15/hr and US firms made to make stuff in the US, i.e overwhelmingly African American and Latinos still go for Hillary.
Hillary's biggest problem in November is that alot of those kids are going to turn out for Bernie, and Bernie only.
Not really. Those kids will want to stop Trump and a supreme justice that will overturn Citizens United.
Comments
https://twitter.com/LadyAodh/status/709536219709853696
Even if we were to join the Euro and become fully integrated members of the EU (which I stress I do not want), a thoroughly incompetent government could cause far more harm to the UK than our embracing of the EU. Likewise if we were out.
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
<:: class="Quote" rel="Morris_Dancer">Mr. K, is that a genuine quote? And, if so, how big is the Swedish Social Democrat Party?
There was a school here, I can't remember which, with an eastern European majority. The migrant kids demanded the British ones bowed to them, and there are conflicting reports over whether there was a major incident or a minor scuffle.
-------
It seems genuine. I went and googled her up before I posted this to make sure and it appears that she became a supporter of Jihad and Islam. See this from Feb 2 2015:
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5161/mona-sahlin
Also this from 2012
http://www.whyileftsweden.com/?p=139
But, I did hear the Swedish Education Minister say (in the context of declining school standards, in schools with large numbers of asylum-seekers' children) "the problem is not them, it's us."
One gets the impression that left-wing Swedish politicians actively hate their own voters.
Tory 2015 Leave
TNS 65%
ORB 64%
BMG 59%
YG ..59%
ICM 49%
CR...46%
Mori,41%
It's worth noting that Labour Leavers are higher online than by telephone as well. That seems strange, given that the stereotypical Milifandom Labour activist base online wouldn't be more anti-EU than the average Labour supporter, surely?
It's deeply concerning.
Mr. K, at this rate, the far right will rise over Europe in response to far left insanity. Lovely.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_HIV/AIDS_adult_prevalence_rate
http://www.avert.org/professionals/hiv-around-world/sub-saharan-africa/swaziland
And the Millennium Bug was not a major problem because people soent a great deal of time, money and effort fixing things. The next one'll be Unix and the 2038 problem.
Of course, the OBR are being careful not to take sides. What else would you expect?
The OBR are under no obligation to be neutral over Brexit. This is just something you have made up. Indeed, Osborne was busy yesterday in the HoC pretending they supported remain.
That doesn't mean that it's not a certainty that there will be a short-term hit as I described. Surely no-one is seriously going to pretend otherwise, are they?
Well, that's precisely what the OBR have just done.
I mean, really? We don't even know, in even the vaguest terms, what Brexit settlement we'd be attempting to negotiate, let alone how long it would take or what the result would be.
Clearly, it won't have as big an impact as you desperately want it to, judging by the OBR's lack of reaction.
The OBR are under no obligation to be neutral over Brexit. This is just something you have made up. Indeed, Osborne was busy yesterday in the HoC pretending they supported remain.
That doesn't mean that it's not a certainty that there will be a short-term hit as I described. Surely no-one is seriously going to pretend otherwise, are they?
Well, that's precisely what the OBR have just done.
I mean, really? We don't even know, in even the vaguest terms, what Brexit settlement we'd be attempting to negotiate, let alone how long it would take or what the result would be.
Clearly, it won't have as big an impact as you desperately want it to, judging by the OBR's lack of reaction.
Innocent face.
Many of the people that gave us those nonsense predictions are still about and are still making the same arguments about what would happen if we leave the EU. Why any sentient being would listen to a word they say is quite beyond me.
In praise of George Osborne.
This was a real problem for small traders, and he is taking action to stop it...
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/03/16/amazon_and_ebay_will_be_liable_for_traders_evading_vat/
Trump has likely already won Arizona due to the large number of early voters. On the other hand Utah is above 50% WTA, suspect that Cruz will manage that thanks to the Mormons.
Budget 2016 calculator
Just because something doesn't happen, doesn't mean there wasn't a risk of it happening, or that concerns abut the risk weren't entirely appropriate. For example, of Alanbrooke's list, several were either very real risks indeed (nuclear war, AIDS), or were unquantifiable risks where we simply couldn't tell how serious the risk was (BSE, Bird flu), or were real risks mitigated by sensible action (millennium bug, which was definitely real for commercial and banking systems even though people got over-excited about its possible effects on 'embedded' systems).
In addition, some rather relevant items were missed off the list - such as warnings about the 2008 crash.
Quite.
UPDATE: The Midland Goods Shed is also dead. 20% cuts across the board mean that crazy idea “new space for debate, culture and curiosity” is no more.
The what, the who, the where...
http://www.theguardian.com/membership/midland-goods-shed-progress/2014/sep/10/-sp-midland-goods-shed-guardian-events-membership-building-space
Although I noticed that they surround him with bullet proof glass in case he tries it.
The supreme belief of the modern Left is anti-racism.
And what better way to signal the strength of your anti-racism than to invite in as many people as possible from the most different cultures possible?
There are enough people who think the same and vote that way to give them a platform to power.
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-35834142
Maybe we should threaten to leave the EU more often? Imagine what Cameron could have got if he seriously said, right I am going to tell the British people to leave unless I get what I want.
Edit: they seem to have had a good Cheltenham so far though. 6 winners on day two.
It was a big issue an required a big effort to fix.
[It is a good step. In the same way as an ounce of peas is welcomed by a starving person].
Phwoar.
That just became too much effort in the end for my liking + the psychological difficulty in not betting on a tip that shortens and seeing it win.
Also, the leave vs remain polling suggests that even now a majority of voters don't, on balance, care.
https://twitter.com/mikejoslin/status/710227415012921344
Talking of which,
http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35831125
They missed out my personal favourite (joking) the liquid treacle drink that is SuperMalt...I believe it has to be up there with the most sugary of anything on the market.
I'm reasonably confident that the intended next step is to try and restructure society so that it no longer confers that privilege, rather than restructure skin colour.
Not officially banned from Betvictor, but I can't place any bet...
William Hill have given me a free bet for Zabana, and the 8/1 treble just landed.
Slightly better day than yesterday
I'm very not white skinned, this country has given me some fantastic privileges and opportunities, for which I will be forever grateful for.
Unless it's a general fizzy drink trick, where you invert the bottle and pump it up until it shoots into the air.
Mr. P, ah, I've only read three Discworld books, so my knowledge of it is somewhat feeble.
Cue Card landing the Gold cup (I'm sticking with Don Poli after Ruby Ricci Mullins robbed my Vautour bet) might come close.
Gingers have always brought great joy in my life, and also got me into trouble as well.
NEW THREAD NEW THREAD
I didn't back Sprinter Sacre, and 2 other winners were tipped (I even posted one here) that I managed to NOT back...
I was led astray by PtP, Cheltboy and "Chris" who tipped a couple of very handy fallers instead.
Happy days