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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The race for the Republican nomination could be clearer aft

SystemSystem Posts: 11,704
edited December 2015 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » The race for the Republican nomination could be clearer after tonight’s final debate of 2015

Judging by the size of the TV audiences for the debates this coming fight for the Republican nomination is attracting more public attention than any previous White House race at the stage.

Read the full story here


«13

Comments

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    Go ABC or ABT
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    Anyone But Corbyn, Mr. Eagles?
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    MP_SEMP_SE Posts: 3,642
    Second like Trump.
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    Anyone But Corbyn, Mr. Eagles?

    Anyone but Carson
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    MP_SE said:

    Second like Trump.

    Are you using AV ?
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    Is Cruz now the establishment candidate?!
  • Options
    philiphphiliph Posts: 4,704

    Go ABC or ABT

    Just to be annoying I will point out that this could ultimately be:

    Anyone but Trump
    Anyone but Clinton

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    Mr. Eagles, blasphemy! You shall be consigned to the Prison Pyramid!
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Wanderer said:

    Is Cruz now the establishment candidate?!

    Rubio is, but they would accept Cruz. Cruz is very unpopular in DC.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    edited December 2015
    Interesting take from Tim, a keen GOP watcher. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/donald-trump/12047232/Donald-Trump-is-a-monster-yes.-But-thats-what-many-Americans-actually-want.html
    These positions are not as cray-cray as they first appear. Most Republicans want a wall along the southern border and the Obama administration has deported more immigrants than any other president in US history. As for spying on American Muslims, the NSA scandal showed that all Americans are being spied on, and anyone who thinks the CIA and FBI aren’t monitoring mosques is a fool.

    Finally, Trump's proposed Muslim ban is awful – but Congress has already voted to restrict immigration from countries affected by the Islamic State conflict. On substance, Trump isn’t quite as out of the mainstream as he first appears.
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    Tim_B said:

    Wanderer said:

    Is Cruz now the establishment candidate?!

    Rubio is, but they would accept Cruz. Cruz is very unpopular in DC.
    I get that they'd prefer Cruz to Trump. Still, that is some desperate establishment.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    "He's not going to win the Republican nomination" let's remember this from Tim Stanley.

    If Trump wins in New Hampshire and Iowa goes Cruz, this becomes a two horse race with Trump the favourite.
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    What are people's views on Cruz vs Clinton? What would Cruz's chances be?
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    shadsyshadsy Posts: 289

    In advance of tonight's GOP debate, here's how the latest Ladbrokes' odds compare with the polls. pic.twitter.com/Jm9nHIWWUD

    — Ladbrokes Politics (@LadPolitics) December 15, 2015
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.
    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    edited December 2015
    I'm not writing Rubio off by the way, but he needs to

    1) Beat Trump in New Hampshire
    2) Overtake Cruz nationally and convincingly as the 'Stop Trump' candidate, continued good polling for Cruz will place Cruz in that position.
    3) Get some better advertising, I thought "My Dad's a bartender" was awful.

    He has a chance but methinks it is more of the ~ 7-2 variety rather than the 6-4 one.
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    Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 4,853
    Any opinions on whether the Trump as Clinton / Democrat plant murmurs are going to get any mileage whatsover, either in determination of fact or as a political tool?

    You would count such a thing ridiculous in most cases, but with Trump nothing seems too out there.
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    I was reading a piece the other day (can't find the link now) which argued that he was the only other candidate in Trump's "lane" - ie, strong man who gets stuff done - and that if Trump imploded he could pick up a lot of his support. I think the article suggested he had about a 10% chance.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    He has a great organization in NH, and his investment is starting to pay off. People following the news would know this.

    Folks need to stop focussing on polls and follow the news, trends and momentum. Polls are merely a snapshot and don't track trends etc.

    Why are folks on here obsessed with polls yet don't follow what's happening?
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    kle4kle4 Posts: 92,048
    Tim_B said:

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    He has a great organization in NH, and his investment is starting to pay off. People following the news would know this.

    Folks need to stop focussing on polls and follow the news, trends and momentum. Polls are merely a snapshot and don't track trends etc.

    Why are folks on here obsessed with polls yet don't follow what's happening?
    Because I'm interested, but only up to a point. It's easy to see poll numbers, but looking at news? Nah, I'll go with my gut instinct.
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    tpfkartpfkar Posts: 1,548
    Surely, if the republican race boils down to Trump vs Cruz, punters should go all in on Hillary? Can we really see the Republican establishment comfortable with Cruz? He might not be Donald Trump, but he's still Ted Cruz.
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.
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    WandererWanderer Posts: 3,838
    "After each round of balloting, the participants paused to pray collectively"

    This is talking about the 2001 Tory leadership contest, yes?
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    Wanderer said:

    "After each round of balloting, the participants paused to pray collectively"

    This is talking about the 2001 Tory leadership contest, yes?
    If so, their prayers weren't answered.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    kle4 said:

    Tim_B said:

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    He has a great organization in NH, and his investment is starting to pay off. People following the news would know this.

    Folks need to stop focussing on polls and follow the news, trends and momentum. Polls are merely a snapshot and don't track trends etc.

    Why are folks on here obsessed with polls yet don't follow what's happening?
    Because I'm interested, but only up to a point. It's easy to see poll numbers, but looking at news? Nah, I'll go with my gut instinct.
    As a betting person, surely you want all the information you can get. 'gut instinct' - not sure that's a winning strategy - particularly if you are following an election in one country when you live in a very different one.
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Wanderer said:

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    I was reading a piece the other day (can't find the link now) which argued that he was the only other candidate in Trump's "lane" - ie, strong man who gets stuff done - and that if Trump imploded he could pick up a lot of his support. I think the article suggested he had about a 10% chance.
    Yes, that article struck a chord with me too. Christie could have the winning combination of moderate enough policies to get the Establishment on side, with the "blunt-speaking" strong-man persona to win over some Trump voters.

    I went deep on Rubio a while ago, but I'm having doubts now: he couldn't have asked for better media attention in the past few months, yet he's still barely above 10% in the polls.
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    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,227
    @NickPalmer:

    Hello Nick:

    I saw your reply, for which many thanks. I didn't want to make you reply, though I do appreciate it. I just wanted to make clear that I had replied to your question, which was a fair one.

    I think that a different Labour party to the one we have now would have a reasonable chance of persuading me and people like me to vote for it.

    I think it a shame that you - or the current Labour party - don't seem to think so.

    Part of my heart - as my post on some of the work I have done and causes I have adopted - beats left, in the best sense of what the left can be, or so I would like to hope. And I am pretty good friends with a reasonably well known Labour person with whom I've discussed many of the same issues and who seems to share quite a lot of my concerns.

    Civil liberties (not just ID cards) are a key issue for me and Labour's adoption of policies which I intensely dislike was the start of a process whereby it seems to me that Labour's default instinct - its moral compass, if you will - has moved away from the best of itself to something really quite ghastly, irrespective of whether individual policies are attractive or not.

    The embrace of Islamism is not a recent matter - it started, in a small way, when the Rushdie fatwa was issued and people like Roy Hattersley were somewhat reluctant to criticise those who seemed to think that attacking a writer in such a way was understandable. That point of view leads - eventually, as we have seen - to writers and cartoonists being murdered in an office in Paris.

    Christopher Hitchens in his autobiography describes very well his reaction to the fatwa and I find many echoes in what he wrote in my own reactions at the time.

    Anyway, clearly I won't be able to persuade you but I would hope that some of what I say may, just may, resonate. I don't assume that all lefties are somehow evil but I think that now too many of them have ended up- perhaps without realising it or without wanting to - in a morally repulsive cul de sac.

    At any event, I don't want to derail this thread. I appreciate your answers. No doubt we will resume the debate at some point, or perhaps in person at a PB meet.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Danny565 said:

    Wanderer said:

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    I was reading a piece the other day (can't find the link now) which argued that he was the only other candidate in Trump's "lane" - ie, strong man who gets stuff done - and that if Trump imploded he could pick up a lot of his support. I think the article suggested he had about a 10% chance.
    Yes, that article struck a chord with me too. Christie could have the winning combination of moderate enough policies to get the Establishment on side, with the "blunt-speaking" strong-man persona to win over some Trump voters.

    I went deep on Rubio a while ago, but I'm having doubts now: he couldn't have asked for better media attention in the past few months, yet he's still barely above 10% in the polls.
    Rubio's price is, remarkably, as low as it has ever been. Lay him out at 2.54 on Betfair Danny.
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    PongPong Posts: 4,693
    Pulpstar said:

    Danny565 said:

    Wanderer said:

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    I was reading a piece the other day (can't find the link now) which argued that he was the only other candidate in Trump's "lane" - ie, strong man who gets stuff done - and that if Trump imploded he could pick up a lot of his support. I think the article suggested he had about a 10% chance.
    Yes, that article struck a chord with me too. Christie could have the winning combination of moderate enough policies to get the Establishment on side, with the "blunt-speaking" strong-man persona to win over some Trump voters.

    I went deep on Rubio a while ago, but I'm having doubts now: he couldn't have asked for better media attention in the past few months, yet he's still barely above 10% in the polls.
    Rubio's price is, remarkably, as low as it has ever been. Lay him out at 2.54 on Betfair Danny.
    That price might come in a bit further tonight.

    It's still clearly a lay though, IMO.
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    Forget Trump and Cruz. The key factor might be what happens to Carson's supporters. Though also an outsider, he is fishing in a different pool from Trump, and his on-his-sleeve Christianity is not the evangelical sort that Cruz is courting in Alistair's link.
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    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    Pulpstar said:

    Danny565 said:

    Wanderer said:

    I thought Christie had been dismissed as No Chance age ago - his odds are strange.

    Pulpstar said:

    Rubio needs to start polling better in NH to justify any sort of odds on himself.

    To be honest ALL the 'establishment' candidate's odds are wrong.

    Rubio, Bush, Christie all far too short.

    I was reading a piece the other day (can't find the link now) which argued that he was the only other candidate in Trump's "lane" - ie, strong man who gets stuff done - and that if Trump imploded he could pick up a lot of his support. I think the article suggested he had about a 10% chance.
    Yes, that article struck a chord with me too. Christie could have the winning combination of moderate enough policies to get the Establishment on side, with the "blunt-speaking" strong-man persona to win over some Trump voters.

    I went deep on Rubio a while ago, but I'm having doubts now: he couldn't have asked for better media attention in the past few months, yet he's still barely above 10% in the polls.
    Rubio's price is, remarkably, as low as it has ever been. Lay him out at 2.54 on Betfair Danny.
    Yes thanks, I will do.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559
    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    Trump's non-interventionist foreign policy stance is a serious disaster for the powers that be in the US. It must and will be stopped at all costs. If I were Trump, I'd be limiting unnecessary air travel, skiing holidays, and extended periods in open topped vehicles.
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    Go [..] ABT

    Anyone but TSE?

    :lol::lol:
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    Interesting little piece on some 1930s correspondence from Mao to Attlee:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35103383

    I especially enjoyed the last section about Mao. Compare the first and last sentences there.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559
    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
    Are non-US citizens not allowed to have an opinion?
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    Trump's non-interventionist foreign policy stance is a serious disaster for the powers that be in the US. It must and will be stopped at all costs. If I were Trump, I'd be limiting unnecessary air travel, skiing holidays, and extended periods in open topped vehicles.
    If Trump is non-interventionist then what does that make Obama?
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    I can see the GOP race easily becoming a Cruz vs Trump contest. I was never sold on Rubio gathering any momentum.

    Very interesting that the Times editorial (apparently) is pro votes of 16-17 year olds. The Times have clearly become massive lefties now.

    And you have to really despair at the Labour party at this minute. Not because of Labour MPs. Or even those (including Milne) at Labour party HQ right now. But because of the kind of people now a part of the activist and membership base. That is, at least if The Guardian was anything to go by. CIFers have surely go to be among the most intolerant people in Britain alongside Daily Mail readers. They really cannot bare any kind of criticism against Corbyn. The comments under the Jess Philips article speak for themselves, and I can't bring myself to see how they've responded to Stella Creasy's recent piece. Sometimes, I almost want Labour to do rubbish in May purely to put two fingers up to them. It's one thing disagreeing, it's another thing to believe the only people only earth worth anything are Corbyn supporters, which is what a fair amount of people in the Labour party appear to believe these days.
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    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
    Are non-US citizens not allowed to have an opinion?
    Absolutely!

    But if you are not here, familiar with the ebbs and flows of the US political environment - as most on here are not - it's of diminished value. Hence the slavish devotion to opinion polls. It's like betting on a Bolivian betting exchange on the outcome of an election in Botswana.

    You didn't answer my question. - and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,990

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    It's an 'abundance of caution'. Whatever that means.

    It might be someone riding a bicycle without lights, but this tends to be more serious when it's dark.
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    It's one thing disagreeing, it's another thing to believe the only people only earth worth anything are Corbyn supporters, which is what a fair amount of people in the Labour party appear to believe these days.

    "The Force can have a strong influence on the Weak-Minded!"
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    Was that the school named after Chester Somebody?
    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,446
    edited December 2015
    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    THIRD Die Hard film - Die Hard with a Vengeance.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_Hard_with_a_Vengeance

    Still, stay safe, Rob!
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,584
    edited December 2015
    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film

    I think you're think of Die Hard 3
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,990

    Was that the school named after Chester Somebody?

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    What is 21 out of 42?
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    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film
    Wrong film - that's the one where Colm Meaney's plane crashes.
  • Options
    RobDRobD Posts: 58,990

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film

    I think you're think of Die Hard 3
    Quite right, I bow to your superior knowledge of the classics. :D
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    Mr. Eagles, the original is better.
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    RobD said:

    Was that the school named after Chester Somebody?

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    What is 21 out of 42?
    He succeeded a cat as President didn't he?
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,990

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film
    Wrong film - that's the one where Colm Meaney's plane crashes.
    Spoiler alert! Jeez. :p
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    Mr. Eagles, the original is better.

    I wrote a PB thread whilst watching Die Hard 5.

    That's how bad Die Hard 5 was.
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    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film
    Wrong film - that's the one where Colm Meaney's plane crashes.
    Spoiler alert! Jeez. :p
    "Sunil says..." :lol:
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    RobD said:

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film

    I think you're think of Die Hard 3
    Quite right, I bow to your superior knowledge of the classics. :D
    TSE edited his post after seeing mine immediately upthread! :)
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film

    I think you're think of Die Hard 3
    I can hear it now - "After 4 hours fruitless search, they found a pineapple".
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    Mr. D, Colm Meaney suffering tech problems is like Sean Bean dying. It goes without saying.

    Mr. Eagles, I haven't seen the fifth one. I may watch it if it's on TV.

    Four was weakened by the terminal decline in villain quality. The first had a German super-thief. The fourth had a disgruntled ex-IT worker.

    Hans Gruber shot people in the head when he was calm. Fourth-Villain-Whose-Name-I-Do-Not-Know swept some paper onto the floor when he was angry.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559
    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    Trump's non-interventionist foreign policy stance is a serious disaster for the powers that be in the US. It must and will be stopped at all costs. If I were Trump, I'd be limiting unnecessary air travel, skiing holidays, and extended periods in open topped vehicles.
    If Trump is non-interventionist then what does that make Obama?
    Interventionist.

    Just because you're sponsoring men with beards to blow things up rather than putting boots on the ground doesn't mean you're not intervening.
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    Mr. Eagles, the original is better.

    I wrote a PB thread whilst watching Die Hard 5.

    That's how bad Die Hard 5 was.
    It was the first Die Hard film to be released in the IMAX format. - even that couldn't save it...
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    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,446
    edited December 2015

    Mr. Eagles, the original is better.

    I wrote a PB thread whilst watching Die Hard 5.

    That's how bad Die Hard 5 was.
    I haven't seen it, but it has Sebastian Koch from Black Book and Cole Hauser from Pitch Black
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559
    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
    Are non-US citizens not allowed to have an opinion?
    Absolutely!

    But if you are not here, familiar with the ebbs and flows of the US political environment - as most on here are not - it's of diminished value. Hence the slavish devotion to opinion polls. It's like betting on a Bolivian betting exchange on the outcome of an election in Botswana.

    You didn't answer my question. - and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
    You didn't ask me it. It was Danny who said Cruz seemed less electable.
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    Mr. D, Colm Meaney suffering tech problems is like Sean Bean dying. It goes without saying.

    Mr. Eagles, I haven't seen the fifth one. I may watch it if it's on TV.

    Four was weakened by the terminal decline in villain quality. The first had a German super-thief. The fourth had a disgruntled ex-IT worker.

    Hans Gruber shot people in the head when he was calm. Fourth-Villain-Whose-Name-I-Do-Not-Know swept some paper onto the floor when he was angry.

    I believe the Die Hard 5 is on Channel 4 over Christmas
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    This is a properly fun tool from 538 - you can shift partisanship and turnout amongst different groups of the electorate to see how the election outcome changes:

    http://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/2016-swing-the-election/
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559

    Mr. Eagles, the original is better.

    I wrote a PB thread whilst watching Die Hard 5.

    That's how bad Die Hard 5 was.
    It was the first Die Hard film to be released in the IMAX format. - even that couldn't save it...
    Was that the one where Bruce takes down a helicopter (or an airborne conveyance of some kind - maybe even a plane?) with a lorry?

    Awful. I hope everyone involved got paid enough to salve their consciences.
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    Mr. Eagles, I may see if it deserves the rotten reputation.

    I thought the fourth Indiana Jones film got a slightly rough reception (though one hopes Shia Laboeuf's[sp] character gets killed off).

    Mr. 1983, that may have occurred in the fifth, but he also took down a helicopter with a car in the fourth.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    Trump's non-interventionist foreign policy stance is a serious disaster for the powers that be in the US. It must and will be stopped at all costs. If I were Trump, I'd be limiting unnecessary air travel, skiing holidays, and extended periods in open topped vehicles.
    If Trump is non-interventionist then what does that make Obama?
    Interventionist.

    Just because you're sponsoring men with beards to blow things up rather than putting boots on the ground doesn't mean you're not intervening.
    Obama has no interest in foreign affairs whatever. He's only doing the minimum he has to, with the incremental approach he's taking, because of pressure from Democrats to give them political cover.

    He gave an Oval Office address last week, and it got panned because he had nothing new to say about a policy everyone knows has failed. He went to the Pentagon yesterday and then gave an address, also panned because he still had nothing new to say about his failed policy.

    Trump wants to "bomb the shit out of ISIS". Obama's air campaign is minimal at best. Hardly comparable.
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    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,144

    RobD said:

    All schools closed in LA due to a credible threat.

    "Schools Superintendent Ramon Cortines said every school in the 700,000-pupil district would be searched. The district includes 1,124 schools plus other facilities, including ones for adult language instruction."

    Reminded me of the second die hard film. Let's hope it turns out to be a hoax....
    Die Hard 2 is my favourite Christmas film

    I think you're think of Die Hard 3
    The original Die Hard is a squillion times better than any of its sequels.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
    Are non-US citizens not allowed to have an opinion?
    Absolutely!

    But if you are not here, familiar with the ebbs and flows of the US political environment - as most on here are not - it's of diminished value. Hence the slavish devotion to opinion polls. It's like betting on a Bolivian betting exchange on the outcome of an election in Botswana.

    You didn't answer my question. - and your criteria would be, as a US citizen?
    You didn't ask me it. It was Danny who said Cruz seemed less electable.
    Forgive me I'm old and decrepit.
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    Mr. Mark, it is the best, although I like Jeremy Irons in the third.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    edited December 2015
    @Tim_B Are you resident in Florida, or was in Georgia ?

    Any idea which GOP candidate yr state is likely to go for ?
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    Mr. Eagles, I may see if it deserves the rotten reputation.

    I thought the fourth Indiana Jones film got a slightly rough reception (though one hopes Shia Laboeuf's[sp] character gets killed off).

    Mr. 1983, that may have occurred in the fifth, but he also took down a helicopter with a car in the fourth.

    It's not rotten per se, just not as good as the first three. It is closer to the fourth one
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    Mr. Eagles, I may see if it deserves the rotten reputation.

    I thought the fourth Indiana Jones film got a slightly rough reception (though one hopes Shia Laboeuf's[sp] character gets killed off).

    Mr. 1983, that may have occurred in the fifth, but he also took down a helicopter with a car in the fourth.

    Mr Dancer,

    These aren't the sequels you're looking for!
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    BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    The idea of this coming down to Trump V Cruz, is almost bringing me to tears. Perhaps as a few more drop out that with give anough space for somebody else to gain momentum.

    I would love that to be my favourite Carly Fiorine, to me she is the one that 'gets it' That actchaly seems to have an understanding of what the role of government in a free society should be. And could be somebody that the rest of the would looked up to when looking at the leader of the 'free would'

    But I am also realistic if you are polling at under 5% both nationally and in the early states at this stage, well, its going to be hard to say the least.

    Just hoping that she shines in tonight's debate, and is not overshadowed by idiots making outlandish remarks that will dominate the news cycle for the next few days.
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    Wanderer said:

    "After each round of balloting, the participants paused to pray collectively"

    This is talking about the 2001 Tory leadership contest, yes?
    If so, their prayers weren't answered.
    "Convinced that Republicans lost in 2008 and 2012 because the party nominated moderates who failed to galvanize the conservative base"

    Gosh, sounds familiar
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    Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453

    Mr. Eagles, I haven't seen the fifth one. I may watch it if it's on TV.

    Don't.

    It's not as bad as SPECTRE, but it is a disgrace to the Die Hard franchise
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Pulpstar said:

    @Tim_B Are you resident in Florida, or was in Georgia ?

    Any idea which GOP candidate yr state is likely to go for ?

    Georgia. I have seen many TV ads for Rubio, many for Jeb and a couple for Christie.
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    Tremendous stuff here from the BBC on China's militarisation of the South China Sea - the before & after pics of the atolls are eye-opening:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35031313
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Either Rubio or Cruz would be the 3rd youngest president,
    Hilary would be the 2nd oldest;
    Trump the oldest.
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    Mr. Price, aye, I singled out the TV report (yesterday at ten) for praise earlier today.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    I notice the LA schools superintendent made the announcement wearing a cap with the shape of Massachusetts on it. No relevance, just an observation.

    Shutting down an entire school district like this is almost unprecedented.
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    On the subject of Barack Obama's hawkishness or otherwise, here's a thoughtful piece on the USA's policy options in Syria:

    http://nationalinterest.org/feature/why-islamic-state-will-haunt-obamas-successor-14583

    "Obama, as Peter Beinart noted recently in a column in The Atlantic, tends to view the threat of ISIL differently than his Republican counterparts. In Obama’s view, while ISIL has indeed proved problematic, the organization’s threat to the security of the U.S. homeland remains minimal. So ISIL is Europe and the Middle East’s problem. This viewpoint has been consistently echoed in his approach to Syria and Iraq—treating Baghdad’s political challenges and Syria’s civil war and its effects as problems that he may have underestimated, but not ones that merit any deep policy commitment from the U.S."

    "The American Enterprise Institute recently published the most comprehensive anti-ISIL strategy to date, in collaboration with the Institute for the Study of War. While a number of elements of the strategy are cogent, it’s unclear whether either President Obama or his potential successors will assume the political risk of adopting them.

    If they do, they risk committing the U.S. into an open-ended strategy with an end goal that isn’t fiscally, strategically or politically sustainable. As much as Washington has tried to use its diplomatic and military tools to support regional states and parties in these states to resolve conflicts and deny ISIL a safe haven, there’s also a limit to what the U.S. can realistically do in these situations."
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    It's one thing disagreeing, it's another thing to believe the only people only earth worth anything are Corbyn supporters, which is what a fair amount of people in the Labour party appear to believe these days.

    "The Force can have a strong influence on the Weak-Minded!"
    No doubt Corbynites think that the force is with them (and only them).
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559
    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    Trump's non-interventionist foreign policy stance is a serious disaster for the powers that be in the US. It must and will be stopped at all costs. If I were Trump, I'd be limiting unnecessary air travel, skiing holidays, and extended periods in open topped vehicles.
    If Trump is non-interventionist then what does that make Obama?
    Interventionist.

    Just because you're sponsoring men with beards to blow things up rather than putting boots on the ground doesn't mean you're not intervening.
    Obama has no interest in foreign affairs whatever. He's only doing the minimum he has to, with the incremental approach he's taking, because of pressure from Democrats to give them political cover.

    He gave an Oval Office address last week, and it got panned because he had nothing new to say about a policy everyone knows has failed. He went to the Pentagon yesterday and then gave an address, also panned because he still had nothing new to say about his failed policy.

    Trump wants to "bomb the shit out of ISIS". Obama's air campaign is minimal at best. Hardly comparable.
    I have not seen Trump's statements to the effect that he wants to commit more forces to Syria. I have seen statements that he thinks Ukraine is Europe's problem, the Iraq war was a mess (he opposed it at the time), and that the Russians should be left to deal with Syria. It has been widely commented that he has stolen a lot of Rand Paul's foreign policy clothes, but is managing to articulate them in a more bullish, pro-American sounding way.

    However, be that as it may, I would profoundly disagree that the limited bombing campaign against ISIS represents non-intervention. On the contrary, it allowed ISIS to metastasize, allowed its oil trade to grow, allowed its sponsors to continue to ressuply it, and allowed it to continue to take territory from the Assad government. At the same time, it represented the beginnings of a 'no fly zone' strategy in Syria that would almost certainly have led to the downfall of Assad - the USA's original objective.
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    BigRichBigRich Posts: 3,489
    BigRich said:

    The idea of this coming down to Trump V Cruz, is almost bringing me to tears. Perhaps as a few more drop out that with give anough space for somebody else to gain momentum.

    I would love that to be my favourite Carly Fiorine, to me she is the one that 'gets it' That actchaly seems to have an understanding of what the role of government in a free society should be. And could be somebody that the rest of the would looked up to when looking at the leader of the 'free would'

    But I am also realistic if you are polling at under 5% both nationally and in the early states at this stage, well, its going to be hard to say the least.

    Just hoping that she shines in tonight's debate, and is not overshadowed by idiots making outlandish remarks that will dominate the news cycle for the next few days.

    For anybody that is interested in why I like Fiorine so much here is a video of her in the last debate:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3pnp3URpfw
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    Tremendous stuff here from the BBC on China's militarisation of the South China Sea - the before & after pics of the atolls are eye-opening:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35031313

    "We want the UK to be China's best partner in the West." - George Osborne, Sept. 2015
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    Dr. Prasannan, quite, although the other Western countries worried about the South China Sea are hardly ignoring the Chinese market.
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    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669

    Tim_B said:

    Tim_B said:

    Danny565 said:

    Ted Cruz being the latest "establishment choice" (if true) is baffling. To me he seems even less electable than Trump.

    Trump's non-interventionist foreign policy stance is a serious disaster for the powers that be in the US. It must and will be stopped at all costs. If I were Trump, I'd be limiting unnecessary air travel, skiing holidays, and extended periods in open topped vehicles.
    If Trump is non-interventionist then what does that make Obama?
    Interventionist.

    Just because you're sponsoring men with beards to blow things up rather than putting boots on the ground doesn't mean you're not intervening.
    Obama has no interest in foreign affairs whatever. He's only doing the minimum he has to, with the incremental approach he's taking, because of pressure from Democrats to give them political cover.

    He gave an Oval Office address last week, and it got panned because he had nothing new to say about a policy everyone knows has failed. He went to the Pentagon yesterday and then gave an address, also panned because he still had nothing new to say about his failed policy.

    Trump wants to "bomb the shit out of ISIS". Obama's air campaign is minimal at best. Hardly comparable.
    I have not seen Trump's statements to the effect that he wants to commit more forces to Syria. I have seen statements that he thinks Ukraine is Europe's problem, the Iraq war was a mess (he opposed it at the time), and that the Russians should be left to deal with Syria. It has been widely commented that he has stolen a lot of Rand Paul's foreign policy clothes, but is managing to articulate them in a more bullish, pro-American sounding way.

    However, be that as it may, I would profoundly disagree that the limited bombing campaign against ISIS represents non-intervention. On the contrary, it allowed ISIS to metastasize, allowed its oil trade to grow, allowed its sponsors to continue to ressuply it, and allowed it to continue to take territory from the Assad government. At the same time, it represented the beginnings of a 'no fly zone' strategy in Syria that would almost certainly have led to the downfall of Assad - the USA's original objective.
    I'm merely saying that Trump would increase the air campaign more than Obama would - it's all relative. In neither case would it 'commit more forces'.
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    RobDRobD Posts: 58,990
    edited December 2015

    Tremendous stuff here from the BBC on China's militarisation of the South China Sea - the before & after pics of the atolls are eye-opening:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-35031313

    China's claimed maritime border is ridiculous. Look how far south it extends!
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,002
    Donald Trump = level 21 demi-lich, Lamarkin's Rod of Disease, Cloak of Revulsion

    Mike Huckabee = gelatinous cube

    Marco Rubio = paladin, 18 charisma, all other stats 9, cursed broadsword

    Ben Carson = necromancer, 19 intelligence, 4 wisdom

    Jeb Bush = NPC with 8s in all attributes and leather armor

    Rand Paul = halfling thief

    Carly Fiorina = level 5 Drow elf with a + 1 Ring of Vampiric regeneration

    Chris Christie = shambling mound

    John Kasich = level 4 fighter with standard plate armor and a standard long sword, 10 strength

    Ted Cruz = dwarf cleric with 3 Charisma
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    Mr. D, not only that, it's practically to the coastline of multiple nations.

    The extent may be piss-taking, so they can be conciliatory (ahem) and graciously allow countries a mile or two of coastal water to call their own.
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    I don't if this has been posted before, but Dan Hodges has left the Labour party.
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    Ms. Apocalypse, it has (both earlier today and a few years ago :p ), but multiple posting of news often happens.

    One's gast is not flabbered.
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/Jeremy_Corbyn/12051510/Jeremy-Corbyn-has-become-the-Lefts-Enoch-Powell.html

    I don't if this has been posted before, but Dan Hodges has left the Labour party.

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    I don't if this has been posted before, but Dan Hodges has left the Labour party.

    Yes, in 2013: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/10277706/Syria-was-the-last-straw-Ive-now-quit-the-Labour-Party.html
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    Plato_SaysPlato_Says Posts: 11,822
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/12052028/Los-Angeles-closes-all-schools-due-to-electronic-threat-live.html#update-20151215-1540
    Los Angeles police contacted Ramon Cortines, superintendent of schools, early this morning to report an "electronic threat".

    The nature of the threat is unknown, but Mr Cortines said it involved backpacks or packages.

    While he said the schools are threatened "all the time", this threat was serious enough for Mr Cortines to issue the order that all schools be closed for the day.

    "It was not a threat to one school two schools or three schools, it was many schools not specifically identified. There were many schools- that's the reason I took the action that I did."
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    Time for a sanity check for those who think this is coming down to Trump vs Cruz.

    Iowa, four years ago:

    http://www2.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2011/12/14/has-the-gingrich-surge-run-out-of-steam/

    Caveat punter.
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    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,559

    Mr. D, not only that, it's practically to the coastline of multiple nations.

    The extent may be piss-taking, so they can be conciliatory (ahem) and graciously allow countries a mile or two of coastal water to call their own.

    It's apalling behaviour. However there's bugger all we can do about it, and China knows there's bugger all we can do about it. If anyone thinks differently, they can take their complaint to the last century of policians who've reduced us to our current state.
This discussion has been closed.