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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Methinks that Burnham’s nationalise the railways plan could

SystemSystem Posts: 11,685
edited August 2015 in General

imagepoliticalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Methinks that Burnham’s nationalise the railways plan could come back to have haunt him

Although Burnham has been careful to say that he’d move the railways back into the public sector line by line it is the headline that is going to stick and will be used by the Tories.

Read the full story here


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Comments

  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,012
    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    rcs1000 said:

    @Dair

    In a world where everyone has a mobile phone (even people in Eritrea), information travel fast and widely.

    People know there are jobs in the UK. They know there are no ID cards. They know there is a large cash economy.

    Migrants, just like the rest of us, are economically rational. They do what makes sense for them. And putting up walls at Calais, even shutting the tunnel, doesn't make the UK a less attractive destination.

    There are two ways to reduce the pull of Britain:

    1. Make it much harder to be employed in the black economy
    2. Make sure migrants are processed in camps far away from population centers

    If you do those then you dramatically reduce the number of people who want to get into Britain.

    But your solutions are not viable.

    There are 420k restaurants alone in the United Kingdom and the UK Border Force has 8000 personal, of which a very small proportion are involved in internal enforcement. You need huge sums to make this viable.

    You then have the entire legal framework in the way. Not just the big things like the ECHR but rights like Habeus Corpus would need repealed (as they are not dependant on citizenship) and I'm not sure that would even be possible.

    Changing the legal framework probably is the only viable approach. But not to create concentration camps and somehow become the first place on earth to eliminate the black economy. More realistically to allow immediate and utterly uncompromising removal from the country.
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
  • Options
    PaulyPauly Posts: 897
    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    1. Nationalisation was always meant to be temporary.
    2. Profit will be made if you collate the figures for all the bank bailouts together. (Lloyds, RBS, UKAR)
    Government can't run a bank better than the private sector. :D
  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,012

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    Can Osbo do no wrong?

    I seem to recall one G Brown (Proprietor, HM Treasury) under long-term fire for selling gold under similarly dim circumstances.

    There was plenty of confidence in RBS before the election - when the share price was 25 per cent higher.
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,770
    I think more threads should begin with 'methinks'.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    edited August 2015

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,788
    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    Getting rid of them. It is not the purpose of the state to own banks. I can see the point in owning a bank on an emergency basis. But once the emergency is over, get rid of it.

  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,930
    kle4 said:

    I think more threads should begin with 'methinks'.

    I was going to say almost exactly that!

    Excellent use of "methinks"
  • Options
    geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,165
    kle4 said:

    I think more threads should begin with 'methinks'.

    but not end with 'to have haunt him'.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Pauly said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    1. Nationalisation was always meant to be temporary.
    2. Profit will be made if you collate the figures for all the bank bailouts together. (Lloyds, RBS, UKAR)
    Government can't run a bank better than the private sector. :D
    Given the actual current structure and governance of RBS, what difference do you see in how it is being run as to how it would be run with 100% private ownership?

    It appears that it is being run on a commercial basis by banking professionals hired based on their track record in banking. If you believe this is incorrect, please feel free to clarify.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Disagree, this has been Burnham policy for over a month and he needs some red meat to win over activists. 60% + of the public want the railways renationalised anyway in most polls (even Peter Hitchens backs the policy) so the Tories will be unable to make much hay with it.

    In any case, as this week's Opinium shows Burnham remains the most popular choice with Labour voters and Tory floaters

    Burnham is on 39% with Labour voters, Corbyn on 24%, Cooper on 22%, Kendall on 15%

    Amongst Tory voters who would consider Labour, Burnham is on 17%, Cooper and Kendall on 11% each, Corbyn on 4%. Amongst Green leaners Corbyn is on 32%, Burnham 13%, Kendall 9%, Cooper 6%
    http://ourinsight.opinium.co.uk/survey-results/burnham-ahead-among-labour-voters
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,788
    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    Competence is not the question. Propriety is.

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    edited August 2015
    Corbyn also expresses the views of a lot of Labour activists at the moment as his polling shows, indeed, some Burnham MPs may well have moved to Corbyn had they not already declared for Burnham first
  • Options
    FinancierFinancier Posts: 3,916
    Just wondering how much of that £3m will stay with Camila B and her friends.
  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,012
    Sorry to derail railway thread in first post.

    But a competent opposition that cared about its image on financial stewardship would subject Osborne to the Brown treatment on this one.

    That means it probably won't happen

    As for railways, it probably doesn't matter whether the government owns them or not. Between public and private sources, British people spend more on the railway than they used to, and the service is better. Long-term, the oil price also moved in favour of the railways. It is very hard to see how this plan can chime with European Commission rail competition directives, but I bet Burnham didn't even know they exist.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    viewcode said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    Competence is not the question. Propriety is.

    Unless it is a purely ideological decision, then timing and commercial judgement should be applied. At best, Osborne has waited too long to sell if the sole judgement is "propriety".
  • Options
    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    edited August 2015
    A misunderstanding of the Labour electorate, again. Not even for most moderate Labour activists would "nationalising the railways" be considered as a particularly left-wing policy.

    Burnham's only real mistake is that he's come to this type of thing so late in the day, after making people so distrustful of him by starting the campaign spouting all the ultra-Blairite nonsense.
  • Options
    The_ApocalypseThe_Apocalypse Posts: 7,830
    edited August 2015
    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn also expresses the views of a lot of Labour activists at the moment as his polling shows, indeed, some Burnham MPs may well have moved to Corbyn had they not already declared for Burnham first

    They aren't that mad!
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    Cameron doesn't understand how the Internet works?
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    @Toms FPT

    I'd look at CAF's website. They're quite a good vehicle for retail giving to charity. Of course, if you're looking for something a little more bespoke then you can PM me :)

    https://www.cafonline.org/?gclid=CIaM47HUkscCFYbItAodFI8MTQ
  • Options
    ***** BETTING POST *****

    After winning 3 Gold Medals for GB in the current World Swimming Championships - the first time this has ever been achieved incidentally, Adam Peaty looks to have a great chance in this year's SPOTY. Not necessarily to win outright, swimming is after all a minority sport, but of at least achieving a place which pays one quarter the 40/1 win odds for a top three finish.
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,567
    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    Do you really trust *any* politician to keep their fingers out of any pots of money more politically easy to get at than new taxes?

    El Gordo was willing to borrow on 60 year terms to pay for assets with 25-30 year useful lives.

    The Nats were willing to promise pots of gold at the end of potemkin rainbows...

    Need I continue?
  • Options

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Danny565 said:

    A misunderstanding of the Labour electorate, again. Not even for most moderate Labour activists would "nationalising the railways" be considered as a particularly left-wing policy.

    Burnham's only real mistake is that he's come to this type of thing so late in the day, after making people so distrustful of him by starting the campaign spouting all the ultra-Blairite nonsense.

    In some ways it is a good thing as he has started off ensuring floating voters will give him a hearing before shoring up his support with activists in order to get the leadership and get the chance to get that hearing
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,567
    Danny565 said:

    A misunderstanding of the Labour electorate, again. Not even for most moderate Labour activists would "nationalising the railways" be considered as a particularly left-wing policy.

    Burnham's only real mistake is that he's come to this type of thing so late in the day, after making people so distrustful of him by starting the campaign spouting all the ultra-Blairite nonsense.

    Hmm. The electorate are not the same as the activists.

    Which is one reason why Mr Milliband just got a kick in the rear.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn also expresses the views of a lot of Labour activists at the moment as his polling shows, indeed, some Burnham MPs may well have moved to Corbyn had they not already declared for Burnham first

    They aren't that mad!
    Some of those who initially joined Burnham's campaign did so because there was no genuine leftwing in the race at that time
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 18,567
    Financier said:

    Just wondering how much of that £3m will stay with Camila B and her friends.

    Not sure.

    But should the CC choose to pursue it, the Trustees are very liable.

    The CC very rarely pursue it, though.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 18,788
    edited August 2015
    Dair said:

    viewcode said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    Competence is not the question. Propriety is.

    Unless it is a purely ideological decision, then timing and commercial judgement should be applied. At best, Osborne has waited too long to sell if the sole judgement is "propriety".
    Not really. If I was Chancellor (only a matter of time, obviously[1]), I'd give them for free to all the taxpayers, in proportion to their tax payment for the previous year, at the earliest opportunity. Then they could keep or sell them as they wished.

    Government shouldn't run banks. It's already got its hands full running the Government.

    [1] Admittedly, it would have to be a very long time...:-)

  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    MattW said:

    Financier said:

    Just wondering how much of that £3m will stay with Camila B and her friends.

    Not sure.

    But should the CC choose to pursue it, the Trustees are very liable.

    The CC very rarely pursue it, though.
    The CC should pursue it on this occasion. They need to make an example.
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    Charles said:

    @Toms FPT

    I'd look at CAF's website. They're quite a good vehicle for retail giving to charity. Of course, if you're looking for something a little more bespoke then you can PM me :)

    https://www.cafonline.org/?gclid=CIaM47HUkscCFYbItAodFI8MTQ

    Thanks Charles. Thus far I've been doing it like an Old Testament lefty, but I thought I'd better look into the modern ways!
  • Options
    kle4kle4 Posts: 91,770
    Dair said:

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    Cameron doesn't understand how the Internet works?
    Not the first sign of that we've seen, admittedly.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    OK, I'll bite.

    Surely being Chris Christie is a pretty effective contraception in itself.

    Boom, boom.
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    An interesting poll from WMUR Granite State. The poll was taken July 22-30, before both the federal judge's ruling and the news the FBI is investigating her email server.

    The 2016 NH Democratic Primary -

    Clinton 42%, Sanders 36%. MOE +-5.9%

    It's only a single poll, but it has to worry Hillary.

    Is it time for Go Joe Go?

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
    Indeed, not an image most of us would want embedded in our brains
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    He may be reacting to Corbyn, but (perhaps I know the wrong people) most of my friends and most of the guards on my local train agree that re-nationalising would be best. Something like "Public Money for Public Services" might be a good way to put it.
  • Options
    AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    Nick Palmer gave a bit of a clue on the last thread when he said that he was flirting with Jeremy Corbyn but still leaning towards Yvette Cooper. Andy Burnham doesn't feature in the thinking of one Corbyn considerer.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Dair said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    OK, I'll bite.

    Surely being Chris Christie is a pretty effective contraception in itself.

    Boom, boom.
    Indeed, a former lover of Nicholas Soames said 'it was like having a wardrobe fall on top of you with the key still in the lock', I imagine Christe's wife has had a similar experience
  • Options

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

    The depths teenage boys will go to see porn always amazes me.

    All anyone really needs is an imagination (which is far better than online porn).
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
    Indeed, not an image most of us would want embedded in our brains
    The political pundits are calling it 'over sharing'.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    edited August 2015

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

    The depths teenage boys will go to see porn always amazes me.

    All anyone really needs is an imagination (which is far better than online porn).
    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!
  • Options
    Dair said:

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

    The depths teenage boys will go to see porn always amazes me.

    All anyone really needs is an imagination (which is far better than online porn).
    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!
    Given that women's 'imaginations' will produce visual images (inside their head) I can't see how women aren't somewhat visual anyway. I've always thought visual was a nice way of saying shallow, basically.

    And I see you're a fan of the Great British Bake Off. Although I hate Black Forest Gateu with a passion. In fact I find gateus 'meh' in general....
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Dair said:

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

    The depths teenage boys will go to see porn always amazes me.

    All anyone really needs is an imagination (which is far better than online porn).
    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!
    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Tim_B said:

    An interesting poll from WMUR Granite State. The poll was taken July 22-30, before both the federal judge's ruling and the news the FBI is investigating her email server.

    The 2016 NH Democratic Primary -

    Clinton 42%, Sanders 36%. MOE +-5.9%

    It's only a single poll, but it has to worry Hillary.

    Is it time for Go Joe Go?

    Not quite yet, but if he is polling better than her over the next few months he may get in by late September/October. As incumbent VP he could also get in at any time up and until the convention if needs be and something blows her campaign below the waterline. In the meantime it confirms that Hillary will have to see off a tougher than expected challenge from Sanders first before she can even face whoever the GOP eventually put up
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
    Indeed, not an image most of us would want embedded in our brains
    The political pundits are calling it 'over sharing'.
    That is putting it mildly
  • Options
    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

    The depths teenage boys will go to see porn always amazes me.

    All anyone really needs is an imagination (which is far better than online porn).
    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!
    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
    In Britain there are also food channels - we have the Food Network and Good Food.
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
    Indeed, not an image most of us would want embedded in our brains
    The political pundits are calling it 'over sharing'.
    That is putting it mildly
    Over sharing, overweight and over there
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    Given that women's 'imaginations' will produce visual images (inside their head) I can't see how women aren't somewhat visual anyway. I've always thought visual was a nice way of saying shallow, basically.

    And I see you're a fan of the Great British Bake Off. Although I hate Black Forest Gateu with a passion. In fact I find gateus 'meh' in general....
    It's based on the cues that various stimuli cause.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolution-the-self/201205/the-triggers-sexual-desire-men-vs-women

    Randomly pulled article, all the research points to the same thing.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
    I can happily enjoy food programmes but cakes are troublingly tempting.

    The Richman type programmes do make me quite jealous of US food. For example, outside of multi-national chains it is almost impossible to buy a burger in the UK. Almost everywhere that's not a chain sells meatballs pretending to be burgers. Quite disgusting.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,023
    A significant problem for the unthinking railway renationalisation feticishts is that the part of the system that is failing is the part that has already been nationalised. Network Rail's failures at Christmas were bad enough; their failures on the CP5 program are unforgivable.

    And it is 100% NR's fault. They developed the program; they were given the money, yet they've failed Iin just the first year.
  • Options
    ReggieCideReggieCide Posts: 4,312
    EPG said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    Can Osbo do no wrong?

    I seem to recall one G Brown (Proprietor, HM Treasury) under long-term fire for selling gold under similarly dim circumstances.

    There was plenty of confidence in RBS before the election - when the share price was 25 per cent higher.
    Gold is a commodity, RBS is a business (kinda).
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Isn't nationalising the railways quite a popular policy among the electorate anyway?
    EDIT: And I wonder what PBers thoughts are on this: http://www.theguardian.com/culture/2015/jul/30/cameron-promises-action-to-restrict-under18s-accessing-pornography

    When this issue came up on here previously.
    It produced one of my favourite PB comments ever.
    One poster opined that the one of the most tech savvy goups in the world are teenage boys seeking porn.

    The depths teenage boys will go to see porn always amazes me.

    All anyone really needs is an imagination (which is far better than online porn).
    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!
    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
    But who doesn't love Ace of Cakes?
  • Options
    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    Given that women's 'imaginations' will produce visual images (inside their head) I can't see how women aren't somewhat visual anyway. I've always thought visual was a nice way of saying shallow, basically.

    And I see you're a fan of the Great British Bake Off. Although I hate Black Forest Gateu with a passion. In fact I find gateus 'meh' in general....
    It's based on the cues that various stimuli cause.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolution-the-self/201205/the-triggers-sexual-desire-men-vs-women

    Randomly pulled article, all the research points to the same thing.
    So men are less creative than women then.

    Also, judging by that link I assume you think sexual objectification is natural - I'd argue being attracted to someone and objectification are two different things, mind.

  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    @Toms. Darn you! I'm now getting CAF banner ads!
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    An interesting poll from WMUR Granite State. The poll was taken July 22-30, before both the federal judge's ruling and the news the FBI is investigating her email server.

    The 2016 NH Democratic Primary -

    Clinton 42%, Sanders 36%. MOE +-5.9%

    It's only a single poll, but it has to worry Hillary.

    Is it time for Go Joe Go?

    Not quite yet, but if he is polling better than her over the next few months he may get in by late September/October. As incumbent VP he could also get in at any time up and until the convention if needs be and something blows her campaign below the waterline. In the meantime it confirms that Hillary will have to see off a tougher than expected challenge from Sanders first before she can even face whoever the GOP eventually put up
    There is already a draft Biden movement. He says he will decide in August.

    It isn't simply a matter of declaring and then barnstorming. He has to get campaign chairmen in all states, line up money and donors, and get a staff together. Other than one of his guys meeting with a donor, he has done none of these things.

    His late son Beau and his brother have both urged him to run.

    I'm starting to think Hillary is in trouble, mainly legally but her polls aren't that good either.

    She is a weak candidate as her TV ads which started yesterday show. She is trying to relaunch yet again, and again 'reintroduce herself' to the American people. She was first lady for 8 years, a US senator for 8 years, and Sec of State for 4 years.
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    Charles said:

    @Toms. Darn you! I'm now getting CAF banner ads!

    Nothing to do with me gov. Really.

    If it happens to me they will put me off for good.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    Given that women's 'imaginations' will produce visual images (inside their head) I can't see how women aren't somewhat visual anyway. I've always thought visual was a nice way of saying shallow, basically.

    And I see you're a fan of the Great British Bake Off. Although I hate Black Forest Gateu with a passion. In fact I find gateus 'meh' in general....
    It's based on the cues that various stimuli cause.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolution-the-self/201205/the-triggers-sexual-desire-men-vs-women

    Randomly pulled article, all the research points to the same thing.
    So men are less creative than women then.

    Also, judging by that link I assume you think sexual objectification is natural - I'd argue being attracted to someone and objectification are two different things, mind.
    I don't need a subjective opinion (or as you put it "I think") because there is pretty extensive, properly founded scientific research which a few hours on the internet lets you fill in pretty much all the blanks.

    I know what works for me personally and it seems I'm reasonably average (was going to put normal but that's almost a pejorative word in the situation) but I wouldn't extend that to believe it is the same for everyone without doing some reading and seeing what the science says.

    You don't have to argue one way or another. Just read up on it. Of course, not everyone will like what they read.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,205
    Charles said:

    MattW said:

    Financier said:

    Just wondering how much of that £3m will stay with Camila B and her friends.

    Not sure.



    The CC very rarely pursue it, though.
    The CC should pursue it on this occasion. They need to make an example.
    Yes. And the government should be freezing the accounts of the company, the Fat Woman etc so as to get as much of the £3 mio back.

    This is quite a disgrace. Antifrank said on a previous thread that £3 mio was not that much in the context of government spending. True. But it's not just £3 mio; it's the other £5 mio given in April (where the hell has that gone?) and the two other occasions at least where money was given after Cameron overruled his officials. So let's say £10 - £12 mio in the last couple of years or so.

    To put that in another context: last year Nick Clegg pledged an additional £120 mio for mental health. Ca. 10% of that budget has been thrown at just one charity. That money could have gone to mental health services for children, a very worthy cause, and one which could really do with the additional funding.

    And think of the other charities which went through all the hoops to get some help from government and were not given as much as they would have liked or were denied it. And then Camilla Lardarse just rings up her mate, the PM, and overrides the rules which apply to every other charity. It's all too reminiscent of a "the rules are only for the little people not for me" arrogance. "I'm so good for the kids that I shouldn't be expected to account for money I get or explain myself to anyone."

    This is the arrogance of those who think that because of their superior morality (I run a charity! For children!!), because of their connections (Don't you know who my friends are) they are not subject to the same requirements as everyone else. It is the m.o. of every shyster through the ages. It is eerily reminiscent - to me anyway - of every dodgy trader and banker I've ever interviewed who has managed to convince themselves that they have a wonderful reason for not complying with the rules which apply to everyone else.

    Some enterprising and properly investigative journalist ought to be digging deeply into what this charity actually did, where the money went, the names of those working there, what they did, CB's background and qualifications, the role of the trustees etc. I'm willing to bet that if you lifted a few stones you'd find quite a lot.

    Whether any of this will happen is another matter. Too many people - including journalists themselves - seem to have been all too willing to be taken in.

    And I reserve particular contempt for a woman who blames others for her decision to abandon children a week after receiving THREE MILLION POUNDS AND TROUSERING A THIRD OF IT FOR HER STAFF.

  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    edited August 2015
    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
    I can happily enjoy food programmes but cakes are troublingly tempting.

    The Richman type programmes do make me quite jealous of US food. For example, outside of multi-national chains it is almost impossible to buy a burger in the UK. Almost everywhere that's not a chain sells meatballs pretending to be burgers. Quite disgusting.
    There is a huge choice of food here. For burgers there is Five Guys, where nothing is frozen and everything is made on the premises. Another of my favorites is Ted's Montana Grill, where again nothing is frozen and all made on the premises. Their bison meatloaf with buttered carrots and mashed potato (they put the gravy in a hollow in the top) is to die for.

    I also love southern food like shrimp and grits - and adore peanut butter pie.

    I don't cook so eat out all the time and love food.
  • Options
    ReggieCideReggieCide Posts: 4,312
    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Toms said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
    Indeed, not an image most of us would want embedded in our brains
    The political pundits are calling it 'over sharing'.
    That is putting it mildly
    Over sharing, overweight and over there
    Toms said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Too much information from Chris Christie at a NH rally

    NEW Jersey Gov. Chris Christie (R) is a Catholic, but, as he told a crowd in New Hampshire, that hasn't stopped him from using birth control.
    "I'm a Catholic but I've used birth control, and not just the rhythm method," the presidential candidate said in the town hall event.

    "My church has a teaching against birth control. Does that make me an awful Catholic? Because I believe and practiced that function during part of my life? I don't think so," he said.
    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/chris-christie-rhythm-method-birth-control

    You need to see the video - as he says this a man in front of him buries his face in his hand. It's hilarious. I bet Mary Pat isn't thrilled.
    Indeed, not an image most of us would want embedded in our brains
    The political pundits are calling it 'over sharing'.
    That is putting it mildly
    Over sharing, overweight and over there
    Very good
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Toms said:

    Charles said:

    @Toms. Darn you! I'm now getting CAF banner ads!

    Nothing to do with me gov. Really.

    If it happens to me they will put me off for good.
    I don't like charities that spend money on fundraising through advertising.

    And we have a general rule that we don't support organisations that employ professional fundraisers. Our application form is just 2 pages long, but difficult enough that it need the senior leadership team to actually put some thought into it ;)
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    An interesting poll from WMUR Granite State. The poll was taken July 22-30, before both the federal judge's ruling and the news the FBI is investigating her email server.

    The 2016 NH Democratic Primary -

    Clinton 42%, Sanders 36%. MOE +-5.9%

    It's only a single poll, but it has to worry Hillary.

    Is it time for Go Joe Go?

    Not quite yet, but if he is polling better than her over the next few months he may get in by late September/October. As incumbent VP he could also get in at any time up and until the convention if needs be and something blows her campaign below the waterline. In the meantime it confirms that Hillary will have to see off a tougher than expected challenge from Sanders first before she can even face whoever the GOP eventually put up
    There is already a draft Biden movement. He says he will decide in August.

    It isn't simply a matter of declaring and then barnstorming. He has to get campaign chairmen in all states, line up money and donors, and get a staff together. Other than one of his guys meeting with a donor, he has done none of these things.

    His late son Beau and his brother have both urged him to run.

    I'm starting to think Hillary is in trouble, mainly legally but her polls aren't that good either.

    She is a weak candidate as her TV ads which started yesterday show. She is trying to relaunch yet again, and again 'reintroduce herself' to the American people. She was first lady for 8 years, a US senator for 8 years, and Sec of State for 4 years.
    He has run for president before so it is not like he is starting from scratch. I have always been of the view that Hillary will win or lose by less than 1% if she gets the Democratic nomination, nothing that has happened has changed that view. If her poll ratings really nosedive or she is indicted then Biden will most likely replace her as candidate anyway whether she continues to run or not
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478
    Charles said:

    Toms said:

    Charles said:

    @Toms. Darn you! I'm now getting CAF banner ads!

    Nothing to do with me gov. Really.

    If it happens to me they will put me off for good.
    I don't like charities that spend money on fundraising through advertising.

    And we have a general rule that we don't support organisations that employ professional fundraisers. Our application form is just 2 pages long, but difficult enough that it need the senior leadership team to actually put some thought into it ;)
    My partner says, and in my naivety I agree with her, that charity fund raising outfits should receive NO (her emphasis) public money. Are you reading this Mr. DC?
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    MattW said:

    Financier said:

    Just wondering how much of that £3m will stay with Camila B and her friends.

    Not sure.



    The CC very rarely pursue it, though.
    The CC should pursue it on this occasion. They need to make an example.
    Yes. And the government should be freezing the accounts of the company, the Fat Woman etc so as to get as much of the £3 mio back.

    [snip]

    Some enterprising and properly investigative journalist ought to be digging deeply into what this charity actually did, where the money went, the names of those working there, what they did, CB's background and qualifications, the role of the trustees etc. I'm willing to bet that if you lifted a few stones you'd find quite a lot.

    ...[snip] ...

    And I reserve particular contempt for a woman who blames others for her decision to abandon children a week after receiving THREE MILLION POUNDS AND TROUSERING A THIRD OF IT FOR HER STAFF.

    There's a Speccie writer doing just that. Apparently a write up in the MoS this weekend.

    The thing which strikes me as odd is the reports there were commitments that the money wouldn't be used to pay staff. If that's true, then they should go after the trustees personally. That's basically fraud.

  • Options
    MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 50,125
    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
    I can happily enjoy food programmes but cakes are troublingly tempting.

    The Richman type programmes do make me quite jealous of US food. For example, outside of multi-national chains it is almost impossible to buy a burger in the UK. Almost everywhere that's not a chain sells meatballs pretending to be burgers. Quite disgusting.
    We have several local farm shops here in south Devon that do excellent burgers. Both beef and venison.
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    edited August 2015
    CB must go down as the most ungrateful recipient of government largesse for a long time. £3 million of taxpayers money and now it's everyone else's fault.
  • Options
    Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091
    antifrank said:

    Nick Palmer gave a bit of a clue on the last thread when he said that he was flirting with Jeremy Corbyn but still leaning towards Yvette Cooper. Andy Burnham doesn't feature in the thinking of one Corbyn considerer.

    I'm personally on the fence between my heart saying Corbyn and head saying Burnham.

    Also, anecdotally, a lot of the new Corbyn surge over the past couple of weeks has come disproportionately from former Burnham supporters who were upset about the Welfare Bill. IF (and it's still an if) people get cold feet on Corbyn, one would expect them to go back to their former "mainstream" choice of Andy rather than Yvette.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    An interesting poll from WMUR Granite State. The poll was taken July 22-30, before both the federal judge's ruling and the news the FBI is investigating her email server.

    The 2016 NH Democratic Primary -

    Clinton 42%, Sanders 36%. MOE +-5.9%

    It's only a single poll, but it has to worry Hillary.

    Is it time for Go Joe Go?

    Not quite yet, but if he is polling better than her over the next few months he may get in by late September/October. As incumbent VP he could also get in at any time up and until the convention if needs be and something blows her campaign below the waterline. In the meantime it confirms that Hillary will have to see off a tougher than expected challenge from Sanders first before she can even face whoever the GOP eventually put up
    There is already a draft Biden movement. He says he will decide in August.

    It isn't simply a matter of declaring and then barnstorming. He has to get campaign chairmen in all states, line up money and donors, and get a staff together. Other than one of his guys meeting with a donor, he has done none of these things.

    His late son Beau and his brother have both urged him to run.

    I'm starting to think Hillary is in trouble, mainly legally but her polls aren't that good either.

    She is a weak candidate as her TV ads which started yesterday show. She is trying to relaunch yet again, and again 'reintroduce herself' to the American people. She was first lady for 8 years, a US senator for 8 years, and Sec of State for 4 years.
    He has run for president before so it is not like he is starting from scratch. I have always been of the view that Hillary will win or lose by less than 1% if she gets the Democratic nomination, nothing that has happened has changed that view. If her poll ratings really nosedive or she is indicted then Biden will most likely replace her as candidate anyway whether she continues to run or not
    The elephant in the room is which one of them Obama will endorse and set his campaign organization to back.

    I have a feeling - for no particular reason - that Joe will run. I could easily be wrong though!
  • Options
    Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Toms said:

    Charles said:

    Toms said:

    Charles said:

    @Toms. Darn you! I'm now getting CAF banner ads!

    Nothing to do with me gov. Really.

    If it happens to me they will put me off for good.
    I don't like charities that spend money on fundraising through advertising.

    And we have a general rule that we don't support organisations that employ professional fundraisers. Our application form is just 2 pages long, but difficult enough that it need the senior leadership team to actually put some thought into it ;)
    My partner says, and in my naivety I agree with her, that charity fund raising outfits should receive NO (her emphasis) public money. Are you reading this Mr. DC?
    I agree - isn't the whole point of a charity to serve a need unmet by government.
  • Options
    DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Dair said:

    Tim_B said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    You're lucky - we have 2 24/7 networks that do nothing but food - the Food Network and the Cooking Channel. Not to mention the endless bbq competitions on Destination USA.
    I can happily enjoy food programmes but cakes are troublingly tempting.

    The Richman type programmes do make me quite jealous of US food. For example, outside of multi-national chains it is almost impossible to buy a burger in the UK. Almost everywhere that's not a chain sells meatballs pretending to be burgers. Quite disgusting.
    We have several local farm shops here in south Devon that do excellent burgers. Both beef and venison.
    I was really meaning restaurants. The thickness of a cook at home burger can be fixed with a rolling pin. Sadly restaurants don't seem to undestand that I don't want a meatball in a bun even when I tell them to ensure it's less than 6mm thick.
  • Options
    EPGEPG Posts: 6,012
    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    Lost hundreds of millions on this transaction compared to selling it in February - but all the chat is about how about one per cent of that sum was lost on a charity. Good spin but hardly good public stewardship.
  • Options
    TomsToms Posts: 2,478

    A significant problem for the unthinking railway renationalisation feticishts is that the part of the system that is failing is the part that has already been nationalised. Network Rail's failures at Christmas were bad enough; their failures on the CP5 program are unforgivable.

    And it is 100% NR's fault. They developed the program; they were given the money, yet they've failed Iin just the first year.

    I hope you're healing ok. I too had quick treatment for a hill running injury in Scotland in Stirling. Actually, the cast they put on was unnecessary, but running around on crutches was a new kind of exercise.
    I do wish you could meet my friend John, who is a seventh generation train worker.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,205
    edited August 2015
    Charles said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Charles said:

    MattW said:

    Financier said:

    Just wondering how much of that £3m will stay with Camila B and her friends.

    Not sure.



    The CC very rarely pursue it, though.
    The CC should pursue it on this occasion. They need to make an example.
    Yes. And the government should be freezing the accounts of the company, the Fat Woman etc so as to get as much of the £3 mio back.

    [snip]

    Some enterprising and properly investigative journalist ought to be digging deeply into what this charity actually did, where the money went, the names of those working there, what they did, CB's background and qualifications, the role of the trustees etc. I'm willing to bet that if you lifted a few stones you'd find quite a lot.

    ...[snip] ...

    And I reserve particular contempt for a woman who blames others for her decision to abandon children a week after receiving THREE MILLION POUNDS AND TROUSERING A THIRD OF IT FOR HER STAFF.

    There's a Speccie writer doing just that. Apparently a write up in the MoS this weekend.

    The thing which strikes me as odd is the reports there were commitments that the money wouldn't be used to pay staff. If that's true, then they should go after the trustees personally. That's basically fraud.

    I quite agree. But I suspect that the government did not tie the charity down so that it would be hard to prove fraud. Trading while insolvent on the other hand..... I'm quite certain that if someone did some digging there are any number of actions that could be taken against all sorts of people involved. All it needs is the will.

    The cynic in me says that the politicians - all of them happy to be seen with the charity - are just hoping that they can minimise any embarrassment and there will be no pressure from anyone to do the sort of inquiry needed. The CC will have other priorities and the SFO is far too busy with Libor and other cases. And in any case it simply won't concern itself with a mere £3 mio case, especially if it would cause embarrassment to a government which it wants to impress in order to save itself from closure or merger.

  • Options
    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    Not really.

    Male and Female brains are wired somewhat differently. While it's true that (generally) a woman will be stimulated more by imagination, men are very much visual creatures.

    On the subject of porn. When will the government do something about the BBC showing Hardcore Food Porn in primetime! All I can think about is heading down to Asda for an utterly enormous Black Forest Gateau. Won't somebody think of the children!

    Given that women's 'imaginations' will produce visual images (inside their head) I can't see how women aren't somewhat visual anyway. I've always thought visual was a nice way of saying shallow, basically.

    And I see you're a fan of the Great British Bake Off. Although I hate Black Forest Gateu with a passion. In fact I find gateus 'meh' in general....
    It's based on the cues that various stimuli cause.

    https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/evolution-the-self/201205/the-triggers-sexual-desire-men-vs-women

    Randomly pulled article, all the research points to the same thing.
    So men are less creative than women then.

    Also, judging by that link I assume you think sexual objectification is natural - I'd argue being attracted to someone and objectification are two different things, mind.
    I don't need a subjective opinion (or as you put it "I think") because there is pretty extensive, properly founded scientific research which a few hours on the internet lets you fill in pretty much all the blanks.

    I know what works for me personally and it seems I'm reasonably average (was going to put normal but that's almost a pejorative word in the situation) but I wouldn't extend that to believe it is the same for everyone without doing some reading and seeing what the science says.

    You don't have to argue one way or another. Just read up on it. Of course, not everyone will like what they read.
    I have read up on it. And the trouble is, both men and women see women as sexual objects - which doesn't make sense, given that most women aren't attracted to other women.

    That's why I don't agree sexual objectification is natural. It's something conditioned by society, and its representation of women.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    'Former president Bill Clinton had a private telephone conversation in late spring with Donald Trump at the same time that the billionaire investor and reality-television star was nearing a decision to run for the White House, according to associates of both men.

    Four Trump allies and one Clinton associate familiar with the exchange said that Clinton encouraged Trump’s efforts to play a larger role in the Republican Party and offered his own views of the political landscape'
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bill-clinton-called-donald-trump-ahead-of-republicans-2016-launch/2015/08/05/e2b30bb8-3ae3-11e5-b3ac-8a79bc44e5e2_story.html
  • Options
    tlg86tlg86 Posts: 25,190
    EPG said:

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    Lost hundreds of millions on this transaction compared to selling it in February - but all the chat is about how about one per cent of that sum was lost on a charity. Good spin but hardly good public stewardship.
    It should not have been nationalised in the first place. It's the millions lost in the last few years that annoy me as much as anything.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    That I doubt. Some friends work at UKFI, and they are very hard-nosed. There's a clear argument that increasing liquidity at this point will increase the potential to maximise value going forward
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    'Former president Bill Clinton had a private telephone conversation in late spring with Donald Trump at the same time that the billionaire investor and reality-television star was nearing a decision to run for the White House, according to associates of both men.

    Four Trump allies and one Clinton associate familiar with the exchange said that Clinton encouraged Trump’s efforts to play a larger role in the Republican Party and offered his own views of the political landscape'
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bill-clinton-called-donald-trump-ahead-of-republicans-2016-launch/2015/08/05/e2b30bb8-3ae3-11e5-b3ac-8a79bc44e5e2_story.html

    LOL, Bill Clinton knew exactly what he was doing!
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,205
    EPG said:

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    Lost hundreds of millions on this transaction compared to selling it in February - but all the chat is about how about one per cent of that sum was lost on a charity. Good spin but hardly good public stewardship.
    The argument for selling a few RBS shares now at a loss is the same as that used by supermarkets who sell a product as a loss leader. It gets people interested in the rest. The argument is that by signalling the start of RBS being prepared for being put back into private ownership it will increase interest and therefore the price at which the shares can be sold when a large amount goes onto the market.

  • Options
    MyBurningEarsMyBurningEars Posts: 3,651
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn also expresses the views of a lot of Labour activists at the moment as his polling shows, indeed, some Burnham MPs may well have moved to Corbyn had they not already declared for Burnham first

    They aren't that mad!
    Some of those who initially joined Burnham's campaign did so because there was no genuine leftwing in the race at that time
    I've certainly heard this put forward as the reason why Corbyn struggled so much to find the nominations (Burnham had already hoovered the lefties up already), though it strikes me as odd given that (from memory - anyone help me out here?) Diane Abbott also struggled to make up the numbers during the nomination period in the previous leadership election, and she'd have been drawing from a similar pool to Corbyn.
  • Options
    SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    I come back after 2 weeks to find that Trump and Corbyn are still on course for victory.

    I guess 2 weeks in the summer is not a long time in politics.
  • Options
    TheWhiteRabbitTheWhiteRabbit Posts: 12,388
    Charles said:

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    That I doubt. Some friends work at UKFI, and they are very hard-nosed. There's a clear argument that increasing liquidity at this point will increase the potential to maximise value going forward
    A staged withdrawal over five years is lining the pockets of his friends? Hardly.

    True enough he doesn't believe the state should own businesses solely to receive a return, but even Jeremy Corbyn does not want a return to the days HMG owned a random collection of things unrelated to the business of government.
  • Options
    CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Tim_B said:

    Toms said:

    Charles said:

    Toms said:

    Charles said:

    @Toms. Darn you! I'm now getting CAF banner ads!

    Nothing to do with me gov. Really.

    If it happens to me they will put me off for good.
    I don't like charities that spend money on fundraising through advertising.

    And we have a general rule that we don't support organisations that employ professional fundraisers. Our application form is just 2 pages long, but difficult enough that it need the senior leadership team to actually put some thought into it ;)
    My partner says, and in my naivety I agree with her, that charity fund raising outfits should receive NO (her emphasis) public money. Are you reading this Mr. DC?
    I agree - isn't the whole point of a charity to serve a need unmet by government.
    There are situations where a charity is the best organisation to provide a service that government has decided it wants to do. In that case, it makes sense for them to be funded. An example, for instance, is some of the work we do on behalf of regional museums - and we are very grateful for the support of the Arts Council. Would we do it without their support? Probably, but it would be more limited in scope, and we would fund it year to year, whereas ACE commitments are for multiple years, allowing the CEO to take a more strategic view.

    But government shouldn't be in the business of making charitable donations with taxpayers money.
  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    @Cyclefree - sent you a vanillamail
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,205
    AndyJS said:

    CB must go down as the most ungrateful recipient of government largesse for a long time. £3 million of taxpayers money and now it's everyone else's fault.

    That's because her bubble has burst and she might find her halo slipping. She's an ex-charity head now with questions about financial incompetence hanging around her not to mention the police inquiry into child abuse allegations at the charity. She might actually have to start answering some questions instead of charming journalists who couldn't take the skin off a rice pudding.

  • Options
    Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    EPG said:

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    Lost hundreds of millions on this transaction compared to selling it in February - but all the chat is about how about one per cent of that sum was lost on a charity. Good spin but hardly good public stewardship.
    I don't recall you agitating for a sale in February. Aftertimer.
  • Options
    ReggieCideReggieCide Posts: 4,312
    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    You confirm my reading of your competence in this matter. An elementary lesson, simply put - shareholders ultimately call the shots in all companies and RBS's majority shareholder has flexed and continues to flex its muscles both publicly and privately. You correctly identify Osborne's motivation in managing the UK's nationalised shareholding but the issues here are much more complicated so I will leave them fallow as you are clearly pretty much out of your depth on this subject.
  • Options
    dr_spyndr_spyn Posts: 11,288
    Burnham hits the buffers.
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,205

    @Cyclefree - sent you a vanillamail

    Thank you. Have seen and replied.

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008
    edited August 2015
    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    HYUFD said:

    Tim_B said:

    An interesting poll from WMUR Granite State. The poll was taken July 22-30, before both the federal judge's ruling and the news the FBI is investigating her email server.

    The 2016 NH Democratic Primary -

    Clinton 42%, Sanders 36%. MOE +-5.9%

    It's only a single poll, but it has to worry Hillary.

    Is it time for Go Joe Go?

    Not quite yet, but if he is polling better than her over the next few months he may get in by late September/October. As incumbent VP he could also get in at any time up and until the convention if needs be and something blows her campaign below the waterline. In the meantime it confirms that Hillary will have to see off a tougher than expected challenge from Sanders first before she can even face whoever the GOP eventually put up
    There is already a draft Biden movement. He says he will decide in August.

    It isn't simply a matter of declaring and then barnstorming. He has to get campaign chairmen in all states, line up money and donors, and get a staff together. Other than one of his guys meeting with a donor, he has done none of these things.

    His late son Beau and his brother have both urged him to run.

    I'm starting to think Hillary is in trouble, mainly legally but her polls aren't that good either.

    She is a weak candidate as her TV ads which started yesterday show. She is trying to relaunch yet again, and again 'reintroduce herself' to the American people. She was first lady for 8 years, a US senator for 8 years, and Sec of State for 4 years.
    He has run for president before so it is not like he is starting from scratch. I have always been of the view that Hillary will win or lose by less than 1% if she gets the Democratic nomination, nothing that has happened has changed that view. If her poll ratings really nosedive or she is indicted then Biden will most likely replace her as candidate anyway whether she continues to run or not
    The elephant in the room is which one of them Obama will endorse and set his campaign organization to back.

    I have a feeling - for no particular reason - that Joe will run. I could easily be wrong though!
    Obama would silently back Biden (he got Bill Clinton's endorsement in 2012 on the basis he would not stop Hillary in 2016)
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008

    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    Corbyn also expresses the views of a lot of Labour activists at the moment as his polling shows, indeed, some Burnham MPs may well have moved to Corbyn had they not already declared for Burnham first

    They aren't that mad!
    Some of those who initially joined Burnham's campaign did so because there was no genuine leftwing in the race at that time
    I've certainly heard this put forward as the reason why Corbyn struggled so much to find the nominations (Burnham had already hoovered the lefties up already), though it strikes me as odd given that (from memory - anyone help me out here?) Diane Abbott also struggled to make up the numbers during the nomination period in the previous leadership election, and she'd have been drawing from a similar pool to Corbyn.
    True, but most of the new 2015 intake was from the left
  • Options
    ReggieCideReggieCide Posts: 4,312

    Dair said:

    Dair said:

    EPG said:

    Evening

    I note the letters "RBS" did not appear here today. What on earth is Britain doing selling bank shares into a low interest rate environment after a sovereign debt crisis?

    The government is not an investment company. It does not hold stakes in businesses simply in the belief that they'll produce a return. Not even Jeremy Corbyn wants that. Nor is there any indication that RBS shares will rise particularly - but hopefully they will as a result of the government playing its only remaining card: implanting the idea that starting to sell RBS implies confidence in its business.
    If the nation is competent enough to manage a significant holding of debt, it must surely be competent enough to manage a portfolio of assets.
    On first reading I thought this has to be a joke but I now suspect that it isn't intended as such. Therefore it can only be the product of a total lack of understanding of business/ finance. RBS is also not a portfolio and I suspect we could all grow a lot older, or die in the process of waiting for RBS to turn a profit.
    RBS is not run by the UK government. The UK government owns a stake in the bank which is an asset in its portfolio of assets. It has no governance role in RBS. The bank is run exactly the same, in every conceivable way, as it would be if it were owned entirely outwith the state.

    The only decision which Osborne should be making is "how do I get the best return for the public purse". That's clearly not how he is making the decision. It is either being done purely on an ideological basis or on a basis of rewarding his friends in the typical way of high level British state corruption.
    You confirm my reading of your competence in this matter. An elementary lesson, simply put - shareholders ultimately call the shots in all companies and RBS's majority shareholder has flexed and continues to flex its muscles both publicly and privately. You correctly identify Osborne's motivation in managing the UK's nationalised shareholding but the issues here are much more complicated so I will leave them fallow as you are clearly pretty much out of your depth on this subject.
    Just to clarify, Osborne's motivation is "how do I get the best return for the public purse"?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,008

    HYUFD said:

    'Former president Bill Clinton had a private telephone conversation in late spring with Donald Trump at the same time that the billionaire investor and reality-television star was nearing a decision to run for the White House, according to associates of both men.

    Four Trump allies and one Clinton associate familiar with the exchange said that Clinton encouraged Trump’s efforts to play a larger role in the Republican Party and offered his own views of the political landscape'
    http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/bill-clinton-called-donald-trump-ahead-of-republicans-2016-launch/2015/08/05/e2b30bb8-3ae3-11e5-b3ac-8a79bc44e5e2_story.html

    LOL, Bill Clinton knew exactly what he was doing!
    Memories of Perot indeed
  • Options
    notmenotme Posts: 3,293
    Toms said:

    A significant problem for the unthinking railway renationalisation feticishts is that the part of the system that is failing is the part that has already been nationalised. Network Rail's failures at Christmas were bad enough; their failures on the CP5 program are unforgivable.

    And it is 100% NR's fault. They developed the program; they were given the money, yet they've failed Iin just the first year.

    I hope you're healing ok. I too had quick treatment for a hill running injury in Scotland in Stirling. Actually, the cast they put on was unnecessary, but running around on crutches was a new kind of exercise.
    I do wish you could meet my friend John, who is a seventh generation train worker.
    The most important graph you will ever see about railway usage.
    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e8/GBR_rail_passenegers_by_year.gif

    I wonder what happened at the end of the 1940s, and what happened in the mid 1990s to directly result in a massive change.
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