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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » UKIP drop into single figures, LDs 6% as LAB move to 36% in

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  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,975
    I thought this was interesting from the BBC at the time of the Jimmy Carr expose. I think Using the Cyclefree moral compass just from this one article Cameron has questions to answer and Alexander isn't fit to hold public office..........

    "Comedian Jimmy Carr has apologised for using a legal tax avoidance scheme...............

    Criticism of the morality of his actions has come from the top. Prime Minister David Cameron intoned that "some of these schemes we have seen are quite frankly morally wrong", and Danny Alexander, chief secretary to the Treasury, maintained tax avoiders are the moral equivalent of benefit cheats.

    Acccording to the Times (which revealed Carr's tax arrangements), the comedian responded at a gig to his critics: "I've not broken the law. I've not done anything illegal. But morally, morally...".
  • rural_voterrural_voter Posts: 2,038
    Do these polls allow for the reduced voter registration?
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Pulpstar said:

    JackW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    JackW said:

    One of the weaknesses of PB within a political institution that is of course a naughty indulgence for us all is that OGH's mighty organ has a tendency to go all weak at the knees over a single opinion poll that it must be said has been shamelessly hyped and is frankly drearily within the margin of error.

    For the want of doubt let PB be clear and being mindful of PBers bank balances, Swiss or not, that :

    Ed Miliband Will Never Be Prime Minister

    What was your prediction for the referendum, Yes @ 41%+/-1.5% with a certainty of 90-95% was it ?
    The result was an outlier. :smiley:

    For over 2 years I was advising PB that YES would not win and the scale of the defeat was the only matter in question. I also advised early on that turnout would exceed 80% and my final projection, one month out, was 85%.

    If I had stayed on PB to polling day the projection would have moved to around 56/44 - not too shabby but still 2 points out.

    My success at GE's here and in the US is unparalleled in the history of mankind - I am of course TOTY and have been since 2010. :smile:

    You'll need some good tips to retain that title this year.

    Got any ?

    @Antifrank and @Peterthepunter are in a clear lead right now.
    My ground game will ensure my continuance as TOTY as PtP will testify. :wink:

  • Just read this:

    http://news.sky.com/story/1426282/miliband-stands-by-fink-tax-avoidance-claims

    Surely that leaves the way open for Ed to be accused of avoidance with his Deed of Variation?

    In fact anyone with an ISA could be claimed to take part in avoidance?

  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,326
    Dair said:

    Cyclefree said:

    Dair said:

    Then you will know that the HMRC will appeal where it loses, will persist to the end and all your costs are likely to be unrecoverable even if you are one of the lucky ones that win. Perhaps the stringency of your argument is based more on personal slight at being pursued by HMRC rather than any genuine analysis of Tax Avoidance.

    Not me personally. I am involved in this in a professional capacity.

    Still nice to see that your response was to level an ad hominem insult without knowing the facts.
    Personal slight or personal interest, it's the same effect. Your interest blinds you to the reality. Tax Avoidance is not anything like Tax Efficiency as while both are legal, one can have quite significant consequences.
    Give it up. I have no personal interest in the matter whatsoever.

    All you've said is that taxpayers involved in litigation with the HMRC may end up incurring significant costs even if they win. This is usually the case in most litigation - and not just in HMRC cases.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    Roger said:

    I thought this was interesting from the BBC at the time of the Jimmy Carr expose. I think Using the Cyclefree moral compass just from this one article Cameron has questions to answer and Alexander isn't fit to hold public office..........

    "Comedian Jimmy Carr has apologised for using a legal tax avoidance scheme...............

    Criticism of the morality of his actions has come from the top. Prime Minister David Cameron intoned that "some of these schemes we have seen are quite frankly morally wrong", and Danny Alexander, chief secretary to the Treasury, maintained tax avoiders are the moral equivalent of benefit cheats.

    Acccording to the Times (which revealed Carr's tax arrangements), the comedian responded at a gig to his critics: "I've not broken the law. I've not done anything illegal. But morally, morally...".

    Oops.

    Bit of a hostage to fortune that one - I'll say one thing though, Osborne has genuinely done a hell of alot more than the last Labour Gov't did on anti-avoidance stuff.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Smarmeron said:

    @JackW
    When you post the results of your arse, have you ever considered using a pie chart to illustrate them?

    :smile:



  • Blimey some Tory donor is offering big money for anyone wanting to back Lab most seats or lays tory most seats on Betfair.... 10k and 8k available!

    GE 2015 betting starting to get serious!
    In a similar vein, there is nearly £2k available for laying on Jeb Bush, about 50x what is on other candidates. Somebody seems sure he's not gonna win.
  • Roger said:

    I thought this was interesting from the BBC at the time of the Jimmy Carr expose. I think Using the Cyclefree moral compass just from this one article Cameron has questions to answer and Alexander isn't fit to hold public office..........

    "Comedian Jimmy Carr has apologised for using a legal tax avoidance scheme...............

    Criticism of the morality of his actions has come from the top. Prime Minister David Cameron intoned that "some of these schemes we have seen are quite frankly morally wrong", and Danny Alexander, chief secretary to the Treasury, maintained tax avoiders are the moral equivalent of benefit cheats.

    Acccording to the Times (which revealed Carr's tax arrangements), the comedian responded at a gig to his critics: "I've not broken the law. I've not done anything illegal. But morally, morally...".

    I attended an otherwise tedious awards ceremony which was enlivened by Jimmy Carr as the host talking about his tax affairs. In his own words: "you realise that you're in really deep shit when the Prime Minister breaks away from the G20 summit to criticise you".
  • If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow
  • If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
  • PongPong Posts: 4,693



    If the Greens changed to a leader who wasn't bat-shit crazy, that might shake things up too....

    You've got to remember that the green party don't really *do* leaders.

    I know this confuses a lot of PB'ers.
  • If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
    Not happening unless the DUP, Mebyon Kernow and Disabled Black Welsh Lesbians Communist Party are also invited.
  • MarkSeniorMarkSenior Posts: 4,699

    If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
    UKIP are defending a council seat in Harlow today . I expect it will be a Labour gain .
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411

    If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
    Dunno,

    Who needs them most at this point ?

    Who needs them least ?

    Ed Miliband probably doesn't, be interesting to see how long he can keep this tax rumpus going on for.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411

    If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
    UKIP are defending a council seat in Harlow today . I expect it will be a Labour gain .
    Hope this goes better than that Fife prediction...
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411

    If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
    Not happening unless the DUP, Mebyon Kernow and Disabled Black Welsh Lesbians Communist Party are also invited.
    Surely it's worth the gamble for Cameron now - if Labour are within 1% in England, he's lost.
  • PClippPClipp Posts: 2,138

    I believe* that "corker" came from the concept of closing the matter down (i.e. putting the cork in bottle). Eg such an amazing argument that it wins hands down.

    I don't see how this poll comes anywhere close to that. Unless it refers to the LibDem position - and how it shows it's all over for them?

    The Ipsos headline is "LDs at lowest level of support since 1990"

    https://www.ipsos-mori.com/researchpublications/researcharchive/3527/Liberal-Democrats-at-lowest-level-of-support-since-1990.aspx
    If, and only if, you are considering those who have definitely made up their minds how they will vote, and who are also 100% certain they will vote.

    Since Lib Dem voters are usually more thoughtful people, many of them are still waiting and seeing.

    You Tories, like Labour, want to close down the whole election campaigning before it has even started.
  • BenMBenM Posts: 1,795
    Cathy Newman of C4 news is the latest to crash and burn.

    Why did the apology take so long?
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,975
    edited February 2015
    There has been a minor explosion of new pollsters from this site. Sunil as the new kid on the block has understanably been giving his poll plenty of exposure . The lead up to Jack's ARSE is now days with almost hourly updates and audreyanne's new piece of research IAACTTWGAOM (I Am Absolutely Certain The Tories Will Get An Overall Majority) though in for recalibration had become a regular morning feature.

    Can I just say May the best person win
  • As a matter of interest is there any research which shows whether only counting those with an absolute certain to vote and also not to have any political weighting has any influence on the accuracy of that poll compared to others such as YouGov and ICM who do include (as I understand it) those two factors? Just interested.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,326
    If Labour do form the next government it will be interesting to see what action they do take to close down tax loopholes and whether they will be more successful than the current government.

    Does anyone know what specific measures they have actually proposed? Have they actually identified some specific action that should be taken by the British government which the current government has refused to enact?

    Roger? Dair? Perhaps you know?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    Lib Dems could be in third with ICM... I'm serious.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787
    Roger said:

    There has been a minor explosion of new pollsters from this site. Sunil as the new kid on the block has understanably been giving his poll plenty of exposure . The lead up to Jack's ARSE is now days with almost hourly updates and audreyanne's new piece of research IAACTTWGAOM (I Am Absolutely Certain The Tories Will Get An Overall Majority) though in for recalibration had become a regular morning feature.

    Can I just say May the best person win

    You may and I will.

    JackW - PB TOTY Since 2010.

  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    I believe* that "corker" came from the concept of closing the matter down (i.e. putting the cork in bottle). Eg such an amazing argument that it wins hands down.

    I don't see how this poll comes anywhere close to that. Unless it refers to the LibDem position - and how it shows it's all over for them?

    *I might be wrong. It has been known. Occasionally.

    I think you are half right and all right.
    'Corker' can also mean something like astonishing or brilliant, as in corker of a joke, if you live in the world of Jeeves and Wooster. Maybe it comes from champagne corks popping. ??

    In neither sense is this poll a corker. Its interesting. Especially for UKIP. But not much more except that Labour are still ahead.
    What we did have was a corker of an accusation from Miliband which he is now attempting to push back in the bottle.
    Miliband has also said that the opinion that everyone engages in tax avoidance 'is not the view of most people'. Clearly he is forgetting Ken Livingstone and not studied his tax affairs.
    http://www.newstatesman.com/uk-politics/2012/03/income-tax-mayor-livingstone
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    It seems almost paradoxical that Douglas Alexander is in grave danger of losing his seat and Labour are on course to form the next Gov't - but that's the truth.
  • JackW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    JackW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    JackW said:

    One of the weaknesses of PB within a political institution that is of course a naughty indulgence for us all is that OGH's mighty organ has a tendency to go all weak at the knees over a single opinion poll that it must be said has been shamelessly hyped and is frankly drearily within the margin of error.

    For the want of doubt let PB be clear and being mindful of PBers bank balances, Swiss or not, that :

    Ed Miliband Will Never Be Prime Minister

    What was your prediction for the referendum, Yes @ 41%+/-1.5% with a certainty of 90-95% was it ?
    The result was an outlier. :smiley:

    For over 2 years I was advising PB that YES would not win and the scale of the defeat was the only matter in question. I also advised early on that turnout would exceed 80% and my final projection, one month out, was 85%.

    If I had stayed on PB to polling day the projection would have moved to around 56/44 - not too shabby but still 2 points out.

    My success at GE's here and in the US is unparalleled in the history of mankind - I am of course TOTY and have been since 2010. :smile:

    You'll need some good tips to retain that title this year.

    Got any ?

    @Antifrank and @Peterthepunter are in a clear lead right now.
    My ground game will ensure my continuance as TOTY as PtP will testify. :wink:

    Nobody performs quite like you on the ground, Jack.

    Sigh.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    It seems wrong that UKIP are just 2 points ahead of the Greens. YouGov are putting the purples on 15% in most polls.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,975
    Ben

    "Cathy Newman of C4 news is the latest to crash and burn."

    Her only interest is sex exposes. No wonder she looked dazed and confused in a mosque
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,411
    A betting non tip if I may - do not whatever you do lay Labour majority at 19.0.

  • Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    There's definitely blood in the water now on this.... If Lord Fink isn't the dodgy donor he was referring to - then who is?

    By teatime, Labour will be trying to tell us that Hansard has it wrong, and Ed was ACTUALLY referring to a dodgy donner kebab he had when out with Gareth...
    Ed Miliband referred to two 'dodgy donors' in his Q&A - Michael Spencer, he of Libor fame and I believe Lord Laidlaw, who had to step down from the Lords after not bringing his tax affairs onshore. As for Hansard, it's fairly clear what he said - why hasn't the PM asked questions about Lord Fink's tax status, followed by his next question about Tory 'dodgy donors', a fact that Lord Fink in his original letter seemed to be aware of.

    It would be helpful if you know, you listened to what he said before attacking him for what you assume he did or didn't say.

  • Pulpstar said:

    It seems almost paradoxical that Douglas Alexander is in grave danger of losing his seat and Labour are on course to form the next Gov't - but that's the truth.

    Chris Patten again?
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    AndyJS said:

    It seems wrong that UKIP are just 2 points ahead of the Greens. YouGov are putting the purples on 15% in most polls.

    Dan Hodges may keep his clothes on yet.

    The election is focussing minds..
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    JackW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    JackW said:

    Pulpstar said:

    JackW said:

    One of the weaknesses of PB within a political institution that is of course a naughty indulgence for us all is that OGH's mighty organ has a tendency to go all weak at the knees over a single opinion poll that it must be said has been shamelessly hyped and is frankly drearily within the margin of error.

    For the want of doubt let PB be clear and being mindful of PBers bank balances, Swiss or not, that :

    Ed Miliband Will Never Be Prime Minister

    What was your prediction for the referendum, Yes @ 41%+/-1.5% with a certainty of 90-95% was it ?
    The result was an outlier. :smiley:

    For over 2 years I was advising PB that YES would not win and the scale of the defeat was the only matter in question. I also advised early on that turnout would exceed 80% and my final projection, one month out, was 85%.

    If I had stayed on PB to polling day the projection would have moved to around 56/44 - not too shabby but still 2 points out.

    My success at GE's here and in the US is unparalleled in the history of mankind - I am of course TOTY and have been since 2010. :smile:

    You'll need some good tips to retain that title this year.

    Got any ?

    @Antifrank and @Peterthepunter are in a clear lead right now.
    My ground game will ensure my continuance as TOTY as PtP will testify. :wink:

    Nobody performs quite like you on the ground, Jack.

    Sigh.
    You have your moments too ... although I understand as age creeps upon you that you prefer the ground to be good to firm but occasionally with soft patches. :smile:

  • TGOHF said:

    AndyJS said:

    It seems wrong that UKIP are just 2 points ahead of the Greens. YouGov are putting the purples on 15% in most polls.

    Dan Hodges may keep his clothes on yet.

    The election is focussing minds..
    How many will switch their votes just to stop Dan Hodges running naked down Whitehall?

  • Cyclefree said:

    If Labour do form the next government it will be interesting to see what action they do take to close down tax loopholes and whether they will be more successful than the current government.

    Does anyone know what specific measures they have actually proposed? Have they actually identified some specific action that should be taken by the British government which the current government has refused to enact?

    Roger? Dair? Perhaps you know?

    "Labour supports tough penalties on tax evasion and relentless action to close down loopholes that allow people and businesses to unfairly avoid tax. The current government is failing to tackle tax avoidance and evasion, with the value of the tax gap now £35 billion."

    (http://www.yourbritain.org.uk/agenda-2015/policy-commissions/stability-and-prosperity-policy-commission/stability-and-prosperity-policy-consultation-1)

    Precious detail, but then again you don't want to tell all the tax avoiders too far in advance how you are going to stop them as they'll just move the money to another scheme.
  • Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    According to the Beeb, Ed has already backed down - apparently the claim he made at PMQs was not targeted directly at Lord Fink, but a more generalised smear against Bill Somebody who doesn’t donate to the Labour party.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-31438865
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    edited February 2015

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    There's definitely blood in the water now on this.... If Lord Fink isn't the dodgy donor he was referring to - then who is?

    By teatime, Labour will be trying to tell us that Hansard has it wrong, and Ed was ACTUALLY referring to a dodgy donner kebab he had when out with Gareth...
    Ed Miliband referred to two 'dodgy donors' in his Q&A - Michael Spencer, he of Libor fame and I believe Lord Laidlaw, who had to step down from the Lords after not bringing his tax affairs onshore. As for Hansard, it's fairly clear what he said - why hasn't the PM asked questions about Lord Fink's tax status, followed by his next question about Tory 'dodgy donors', a fact that Lord Fink in his original letter seemed to be aware of.

    It would be helpful if you know, you listened to what he said before attacking him for what you assume he did or didn't say.

    You don't have the protection of Parliamentary Privilege. Bold.
  • AndyJS said:

    It seems wrong that UKIP are just 2 points ahead of the Greens. YouGov are putting the purples on 15% in most polls.

    If Ipsos-Mori were polling every day and YouGov once a month your statement would doubtless be reversed.
  • If the UKIP fade is confirmed by some other pollsters in the next week or so, it might be worth revisiting marginals where they are currently in the range 7/1 - 12/1 i.e. seat #s 33-84 for them. If they're not going to be winning these then there may well be some value about on another party.

    Seats like:

    Plymouth Moor View
    Crawley
    Telford
    Redditch
    St Ives
    Harlow

    Counter-argument to this would be the debates. What's the latest on them?
    Not happening unless the DUP, Mebyon Kernow and Disabled Black Welsh Lesbians Communist Party are also invited.
    Rumour is he's angling for Mumsnet, but they're playing hard to get.
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865
    Vicky Pryce now giving her views on European economic situation


    On CNN
  • JackW said:

    Roger said:

    There has been a minor explosion of new pollsters from this site. Sunil as the new kid on the block has understanably been giving his poll plenty of exposure . The lead up to Jack's ARSE is now days with almost hourly updates and audreyanne's new piece of research IAACTTWGAOM (I Am Absolutely Certain The Tories Will Get An Overall Majority) though in for recalibration had become a regular morning feature.

    Can I just say May the best person win

    You may and I will.

    JackW - PB TOTY Since 2010.

    That's like Jeffrey Archer boasting that he's the reigning 100 yards record holder at Oxford University. They switched to 100 metres shortly after his record which has remained.

  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,975
    Antifrank

    "I attended an otherwise tedious awards ceremony which was enlivened by Jimmy Carr as the host talking about his tax affairs. In his own words: "you realise that you're in really deep shit when the Prime Minister breaks away from the G20 summit to criticise you". "

    LOL. I've always liked jimmy Carr.

    Cyclefree take note.The classier tax avoider says 'fair cop' NOT 'it's no different from an ISA'
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited February 2015

    As for Hansard, it's fairly clear what he said - why hasn't the PM asked questions about Lord Fink's tax status, followed by his next question about Tory 'dodgy donors',

    Sorry, but you really can't get away with that piece of ludicrous re-writing of what Ed said. There were not two separate questions on different topics, there was a follow on. The exact words of the beginning of the next question were:

    The Prime Minister cannot get away from it: he is a dodgy Prime Minister surrounded by dodgy donors.

    The phrase 'The Prime Minister cannot get away from it' cannot, in any possible interpetation, mean anything other than referring to what Miliband had just said, i.e referring to Lord Fink at least.

    It's just smearing, under cover of parliamentary privilege. Pure, simple, and disgusting, and Labour supporters should be ashamed that their party is, once again, reduced to it.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    TGOHF said:

    AndyJS said:

    It seems wrong that UKIP are just 2 points ahead of the Greens. YouGov are putting the purples on 15% in most polls.

    Dan Hodges may keep his clothes on yet.

    The election is focussing minds..
    How many will switch their votes just to stop Dan Hodges running naked down Whitehall?

    Until you just blew the secret that was a critical aspect of calculations from my ARSE !!

  • PongPong Posts: 4,693

    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    Also, whether or not there's a case, I expect CCHQ would be doing everything possible to put off any legal action until after the election.
  • JackWJackW Posts: 14,787

    JackW said:

    Roger said:

    There has been a minor explosion of new pollsters from this site. Sunil as the new kid on the block has understanably been giving his poll plenty of exposure . The lead up to Jack's ARSE is now days with almost hourly updates and audreyanne's new piece of research IAACTTWGAOM (I Am Absolutely Certain The Tories Will Get An Overall Majority) though in for recalibration had become a regular morning feature.

    Can I just say May the best person win

    You may and I will.

    JackW - PB TOTY Since 2010.

    That's like Jeffrey Archer boasting that he's the reigning 100 yards record holder at Oxford University. They switched to 100 metres shortly after his record which has remained.

    Comparing JackW to Jeffrey Archer - I'll sue. :smile:

  • PongPong Posts: 4,693
    Btw, when do candidate registrations close for the GE?

    Specifically, i'm trying to figure out how late an MP could defect to another party and still appear on the ballot paper.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,326
    Roger said:

    Antifrank

    "I attended an otherwise tedious awards ceremony which was enlivened by Jimmy Carr as the host talking about his tax affairs. In his own words: "you realise that you're in really deep shit when the Prime Minister breaks away from the G20 summit to criticise you". "

    LOL. I've always liked jimmy Carr.

    Cyclefree take note.The classier tax avoider says 'fair cop' NOT 'it's no different from an ISA'

    Roger: I told you downthread that I didn't know about the J Carr affair. I have not commented on his tax affairs since I know nothing about them. Given all that I don't know why you are putting my name next to the phrase "the classier tax avoider" in reference to him.

    It sounds a bit smeary to me. Don't. You should be better than that.
  • Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    Also, whether or not there's a case, I expect CCHQ would be doing everything possible to put off any legal action until after the election.
    I'm not a lawyer, but suing for defamation is generally a precarious business. There's all sorts of stuff about 'public interest', fair reporting of allegations already in public domain etc etc. Much fun for lawyers and also time consuming.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    Also, whether or not there's a case, I expect CCHQ would be doing everything possible to put off any legal action until after the election.
    Theoretically, were such a case to go to Court, nothing would happen until long after May, many months, perhaps even next year, such is the slow progress of defamation.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,975
    SimonStC.

    Did you read the article you posted? Does this sound like Ed's already backed down?

    "Ed Miliband has accused Lord Fink of an "extraordinary U-turn" after the Tory donor appeared to drop his threat of legal action over tax avoidance claims.

    Lord Fink had accused the Labour leader of making defamatory comments in the Commons about his tax affairs.

    But the peer told the Evening Standard he did not want to sue Mr Miliband and the definition of tax avoidance was so broad that "everyone does it".

    Mr Miliband challenged David Cameron to say whether he agreed with that view."
  • Pong said:

    Btw, when do candidate registrations close for the GE?

    Specifically, i'm trying to figure out how late an MP could defect to another party and still appear on the ballot paper.

    9th April.
  • I'm at this predicting the 2015GE conference and have actually just heard a corker of a 'nowcast' constituency forecast from the British Election Study, by Ed Fieldhouse at the University of Manchester.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    edited February 2015

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    Also, whether or not there's a case, I expect CCHQ would be doing everything possible to put off any legal action until after the election.
    Theoretically, were such a case to go to Court, nothing would happen until long after May, many months, perhaps even next year, such is the slow progress of defamation.
    Speccie has the amount paid in tax last year by the parties.

    LDs £14 (£7.3m)
    Con £187,000 (turnover £25.4m)
    Labour £14,000 (turnover £33.3m)

    David Blackburn blog from last summer..

    http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2014/07/labour-wants-you-to-pay-more-tax-but-what-about-its-tax-bill/
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,937
    One to watch: Nigel Farage's satisfaction rating is now only a gnat's cock ahead of the Government. Given that he embodies the public perception of UKIP, he - and by extension they - are looking like UKIP may be a less attractive option than continuing with this Govt....
  • PongPong Posts: 4,693

    Pong said:

    Btw, when do candidate registrations close for the GE?

    Specifically, i'm trying to figure out how late an MP could defect to another party and still appear on the ballot paper.

    9th April.
    Thanks a lot.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Greens ahead of UKIP on the "all giving a voting intention" indicator is startling.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Roger said:

    SimonStC.

    Did you read the article you posted? Does this sound like Ed's already backed down?

    "Ed Miliband has accused Lord Fink of an "extraordinary U-turn" after the Tory donor appeared to drop his threat of legal action over tax avoidance claims.

    Lord Fink had accused the Labour leader of making defamatory comments in the Commons about his tax affairs.

    But the peer told the Evening Standard he did not want to sue Mr Miliband and the definition of tax avoidance was so broad that "everyone does it".

    Mr Miliband challenged David Cameron to say whether he agreed with that view."

    The Beano have a character called Roger the Dodger. He also has a friend called Dave.

    You should get your lawyers onto it asap.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    I'm at this predicting the 2015GE conference and have actually just heard a corker of a 'nowcast' constituency forecast from the British Election Study, by Ed Fieldhouse at the University of Manchester.

    Well the nowcast is with polls, the forecast was always with past elections.
    If you use the polls as there are now, Labour are about 20 seats from a majority.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    One to watch: Nigel Farage's satisfaction rating is now only a gnat's cock ahead of the Government. Given that he embodies the public perception of UKIP, he - and by extension they - are looking like UKIP may be a less attractive option than continuing with this Govt....

    One to watch: Nigel Farage's satisfaction rating is now only a gnat's cock ahead of the Government. Given that he embodies the public perception of UKIP, he - and by extension they - are looking like UKIP may be a less attractive option than continuing with this Govt....

    Hence why support for them is falling. Toxification paying dividends.
  • antifrank said:

    Not my idea of a corker of a poll. Maybe I'm just too demanding (maybe I'm just like my father, too bold).

    ...in my pants

  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Swiss government proposes draft law to curb immigration from EU


    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/02/11/us-swiss-immigration-idUSKBN0LF1Q320150211
  • RogerRoger Posts: 19,975
    Cyclefree

    "Does anyone know what specific measures they have actually proposed? Have they actually identified some specific action that should be taken by the British government which the current government has refused to enact?"

    They don't need specific measures just a change of culture. It happened with MP's expenses to such an extent that unfortunate MPs who have Northern or Scottish seats have to travel 2nd class. The public are now asking questions and if the bosses of our public companies wish to keep their tax affairs private people will want to know why. All we need is to know that there isn't one law for the rich and another for everyone else. Cameron and the Tories were never the people to do it
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108
    Cyclefree said:

    Roger said:

    Antifrank

    "I attended an otherwise tedious awards ceremony which was enlivened by Jimmy Carr as the host talking about his tax affairs. In his own words: "you realise that you're in really deep shit when the Prime Minister breaks away from the G20 summit to criticise you". "

    LOL. I've always liked jimmy Carr.

    Cyclefree take note.The classier tax avoider says 'fair cop' NOT 'it's no different from an ISA'

    Roger: I told you downthread that I didn't know about the J Carr affair. I have not commented on his tax affairs since I know nothing about them. Given all that I don't know why you are putting my name next to the phrase "the classier tax avoider" in reference to him.

    It sounds a bit smeary to me. Don't. You should be better than that.
    Are you still claiming that Tax Efficiency and Tax Avoidance are the same thing or have you withdrawn this claim?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    O/T:

    Andy Murray in action against Vasek Pospisil in Rotterdam:

    https://www.betfair.com/exchange/tennis/event?id=27367263
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    Also, whether or not there's a case, I expect CCHQ would be doing everything possible to put off any legal action until after the election.
    Theoretically, were such a case to go to Court, nothing would happen until long after May, many months, perhaps even next year, such is the slow progress of defamation.
    Would any politician risk a Libel suit where they might win yet still find the judge deem their reputation so worthless that they are awarded a mere £1 in damages?
  • BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    AndyJS said:

    Greens ahead of UKIP on the "all giving a voting intention" indicator is startling.

    I believe that the Mori poll is an oulier and for more reasons than just being the only pollster to push the Greens in 3rd place.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited February 2015

    BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1

    Really?
    In order to push the Tories in having the most seats they reduced the LD seat number to 1?
    BES is trash if that is their forecast.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    Dair said:

    Pong said:

    Pong said:

    Dair said:

    Smarmeron said:

    You pays your money, you takes your choice.

    "Miliband is likely to be very specific in what he repeats. In the Commons he referred to tax avoidance, not evasion, and did not describe Lord Fink directly as a dodgy donor. Tax avoidance is legal but deprives the Treasury of income."

    Let's hope some journalist asks: "So, Mr. Miliband, for the avoidance of doubt, would you care to confirm that you were not in any way suggesting that Lord Fink is a 'dodgy donor? "

    and a follow-up question:

    "In that case, Mr Miliband, why did you mention Lord Fink at all?"

    [It also beggars belief that anyone is defending Ed. He is showing himself unfit to be an MP, let alone PM]
    What if the Miliband tax issue (eek, nearly wrote "dodge" wouldn't want Eddie suing) really blows up and dominates the press?

    Imagine it became so big that Miliband was forced to resign and Labour somehow came up with a credible leader. I mean, surely they have one somewhere in their ranks.
    Having a rich tory donor trying to sue EdM during the campaign would do wonders for his poll ratings.
    Not going to happen, since Miliband won't repeat his exact comments outside the HoC.
    Also, whether or not there's a case, I expect CCHQ would be doing everything possible to put off any legal action until after the election.
    Theoretically, were such a case to go to Court, nothing would happen until long after May, many months, perhaps even next year, such is the slow progress of defamation.
    Would any politician risk a Libel suit where they might win yet still find the judge deem their reputation so worthless that they are awarded a mere £1 in damages?
    Dunno. But it's irrelevant - Fink isn't a politician.
  • AlistairAlistair Posts: 23,670
    Fair does, this is indeed a corker.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative
  • As for Hansard, it's fairly clear what he said - why hasn't the PM asked questions about Lord Fink's tax status, followed by his next question about Tory 'dodgy donors',

    Sorry, but you really can't get away with that piece of ludicrous re-writing of what Ed said. There were not two separate questions on different topics, there was a follow on. The exact words of the beginning of the next question were:

    The Prime Minister cannot get away from it: he is a dodgy Prime Minister surrounded by dodgy donors.

    The phrase 'The Prime Minister cannot get away from it' cannot, in any possible interpetation, mean anything other than referring to what Miliband had just said, i.e referring to Lord Fink at least.

    It's just smearing, under cover of parliamentary privilege. Pure, simple, and disgusting, and Labour supporters should be ashamed that their party is, once again, reduced to it.
    If Labour supporters had any sense of shame, they wouldn't be Labour supporters in the first place, Richard. So you're on a bit of a loser there.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Speedy said:

    AndyJS said:

    Greens ahead of UKIP on the "all giving a voting intention" indicator is startling.

    I believe that the Mori poll is an oulier and for more reasons than just being the only pollster to push the Greens in 3rd place.
    You'd struggle to come up with a list of more than about 100 seats out of 650 where the Greens are likely to get more votes than UKIP.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    Ipsos has seen UKIP drop 7 since October, 4 going to the Tories, 3 to Labour.

    Greens and LDs have swapped two points.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    edited February 2015
    Roger said:

    Cyclefree

    "Does anyone know what specific measures they have actually proposed? Have they actually identified some specific action that should be taken by the British government which the current government has refused to enact?"

    They don't need specific measures just a change of culture. It happened with MP's expenses to such an extent that unfortunate MPs who have Northern or Scottish seats have to travel 2nd class. The public are now asking questions and if the bosses of our public companies wish to keep their tax affairs private people will want to know why. All we need is to know that there isn't one law for the rich and another for everyone else. Cameron and the Tories were never the people to do it

    MPs serve us.

    The bosses of publicly listed companies are accountable to their shareholders, not the 'public' as such.

    It's hard to see why their tax affairs shouldn't be private. If you don't like X Corp, avoid their products, and shares.
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108

    Dair said:


    Would any politician risk a Libel suit where they might win yet still find the judge deem their reputation so worthless that they are awarded a mere £1 in damages?

    Dunno. But it's irrelevant - Fink isn't a politician.
    So there's no reputational damage from being Treasurer of the Conservative Party.

    Shurely Shome Mishtake.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    AndyJS said:

    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative

    I think the real story is that Ed Miliband won a big extra-parliamentary fight and won it big, which is surprising as people in general thought he was a loser (ignoring that he won past big battles like the Labour leadership and the Syria war debate).
  • PongPong Posts: 4,693

    BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1

    Alistair Carmichael for LD leader!
  • BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1

    LOL, I had a bit of a double-take on that, thinking the Labour figure looked too high given the Con and SNP figures. Then I realised where the explanation lay...
  • Wow. Just heard an ever more corking one.
  • richardDoddrichardDodd Posts: 5,472
    Everyone I know has at some time or other taken steps to avoid paying some taxes..some were even high ups in the Trade Union movement...shockin innit..
  • As for Hansard, it's fairly clear what he said - why hasn't the PM asked questions about Lord Fink's tax status, followed by his next question about Tory 'dodgy donors',

    Sorry, but you really can't get away with that piece of ludicrous re-writing of what Ed said. There were not two separate questions on different topics, there was a follow on. The exact words of the beginning of the next question were:

    The Prime Minister cannot get away from it: he is a dodgy Prime Minister surrounded by dodgy donors.

    The phrase 'The Prime Minister cannot get away from it' cannot, in any possible interpetation, mean anything other than referring to what Miliband had just said, i.e referring to Lord Fink at least.

    It's just smearing, under cover of parliamentary privilege. Pure, simple, and disgusting, and Labour supporters should be ashamed that their party is, once again, reduced to it.
    No, it's a standard piece of political rhetoric of the form Cameron often uses, for example on the unions, or by taking an out of context quote and claiming it shows some horrific general truth about the Labour Party. Take an individual issue of possible embarrassment on which you can tie your opponent to specifics, then make a wider but more aggressive point which is thematically if not causally linked.

    Clearly it's an over simplification - party funding and the possible soft peddling of influence isn't historically unique to David Cameron's Tory party, and there's a reason that politicians haven't solved party funding despite it being 20 years since sleaze became a defining political issue. However that's politics - worse is almost certainly destined to be flung at Ed M between now and May and CCHQ will no doubt jump on any media storm no matter how confected it is, as is their right.

    Ed M used the general knock-about tactics of PMQs, which probably would've passed off how it initially was reported - as Miliband missing a bit of an open goal in failing to pin Cameron down, if Lord Fink hadn't decided to say he'd sue Ed Miliband. He did when he didn't really have a leg to stand on, and helpfully booted the ball into the net for Ed by turning it into a major story.

    Whether it's a defining moment, or eventually rebounds on the Labour leader will largely depend on the positive side of things - what does he plan to do about the problem of party political funding and tax avoidance? Especially the former which is far more complex to solve than the latter given that almost every option is unpalatable to one party who you'd need to agree.
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    edited February 2015

    BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1

    I'm all for producing forecasts that diverge from the accepted wisdom. Otherwise what would be the point of modelling at all? For example, LD 11 would be an interesting forecast, stretching credulity but not snapping it.

    But surely when you get these sorts of results, you need to re-check your assumptions.
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    edited February 2015
    AndyJS said:

    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative

    AndyJS said:

    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative

    Really.. If you put money into an ISa you are avoiding tax, if you put money into a pension scheme you are avoiding tax. If you make sure you don't trip a tax threshoild, you are avoiding tax, if you earn less than the single p;ersons tax threshold you are avoiding tax.

    If you pay someone cash in hand, you are avoiding tax.. possibly illegally.
    If you pay someone who does not need to be registered for VAT, you are avoiding tax..


    the list is endless and everyone does it.
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    PinkVanGate: Harriet Harman denies telling Karen Danczuk to join Girls Aloud

    Danczuk standing by her statement...

    Will there be hair pulling and everything???
  • Tissue_PriceTissue_Price Posts: 9,039
    edited February 2015

    Wow. Just heard an ever more corking one.

    Academics giving academia a bad name again? No wonder people look at the bookies (who are far from infallible!)
  • DairDair Posts: 6,108

    BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1

    This makes no sense. Of the 53 seats the SNP do not hold in Scotland, if they were to fail in 12 seats on UNS, then there would be 3 Liberals left in Scotland.
  • Dair said:

    BES 2015 GE constituency forecast - median forecast:

    Con - 296
    Lab - 282
    LD - 1
    UKIP - 3
    SNP - 47
    PC - 1

    This makes no sense. Of the 53 seats the SNP do not hold in Scotland, if they were to fail in 12 seats on UNS, then there would be 3 Liberals left in Scotland.
    Obviously the SNP are taking everything bar Orkney off the LDs, but not cleaning out Labour. Tories are presumably picking up BR&S (and possibly Aberdeenshire West etc.)
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    TGOHF said:

    One to watch: Nigel Farage's satisfaction rating is now only a gnat's cock ahead of the Government. Given that he embodies the public perception of UKIP, he - and by extension they - are looking like UKIP may be a less attractive option than continuing with this Govt....

    One to watch: Nigel Farage's satisfaction rating is now only a gnat's cock ahead of the Government. Given that he embodies the public perception of UKIP, he - and by extension they - are looking like UKIP may be a less attractive option than continuing with this Govt....

    Hence why support for them is falling. Toxification paying dividends.
    ''Its a state of mind''. Who needs policies?
  • PurseybearPurseybear Posts: 766
    edited February 2015

    JackW said:

    Roger said:

    There has been a minor explosion of new pollsters from this site. Sunil as the new kid on the block has understanably been giving his poll plenty of exposure . The lead up to Jack's ARSE is now days with almost hourly updates and audreyanne's new piece of research IAACTTWGAOM (I Am Absolutely Certain The Tories Will Get An Overall Majority) though in for recalibration had become a regular morning feature.

    Can I just say May the best person win

    You may and I will.

    JackW - PB TOTY Since 2010.

    That's like Jeffrey Archer boasting that he's the reigning 100 yards record holder at Oxford University. They switched to 100 metres shortly after his record which has remained.

    That man has form! He said he went to Wellington. Turned out to be the small school in Somerset not the more prestigious Wellington College in Berkshire. :-)

    Movement to Labour on betfair, into 17.5, but small volumes. Still cannot understand why the huge Labour lay yesterday afternoon? They went to 30's at one stage. Anyone know?

    Gotta be value in a Lab majority + LAB-SNP odds-on surely?
  • Speedy said:

    AndyJS said:

    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative

    I think the real story is that Ed Miliband won a big extra-parliamentary fight and won it big, which is surprising as people in general thought he was a loser (ignoring that he won past big battles like the Labour leadership and the Syria war debate).
    The problem is that when "winning" means smearing people for doing what you yourself have done, knifing your brother, and sabotaging the national interest to score a student politics point, it doesn't make you look like a winner or statesmanlike. It makes you look like a scumbag.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    AndyJS said:

    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative

    AndyJS said:

    Lord Fink says everyone does tax avoidance. He's completely wrong: a lot of people don't have the energy, time or expertise to do it.

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/feb/12/tax-avoidance-lord-fink-ed-miliband-labour-conservative

    Really.. If you put money into an ISa you are avoiding tax, if you put money into a pension scheme you are avoiding tax. If you make sure you don't trip a tax threshoild, you are avoiding tax, if you earn less than the single p;ersons tax threshold you are avoiding tax.

    If you pay someone cash in hand, you are avoiding tax.. possibly illegally.
    If you pay someone who does not need to be registered for VAT, you are avoiding tax..


    the list is endless and everyone does it.
    Absolute rubbish. Do you think the bottom 30% of the population have the know-how to engage in tax avoidance?
  • depressing polling showing Labour on course for largest party, miliband gaining traction with his populist anti-business garbage

    I am reduced to hoping the eurozone goes t1ts up and the labour government presides over an economic disaster. But they will probably blame someone else successfully even then.

    Bah. But then I deserve to be miserable, i am a tax avoider with 2 (TWO!!!) ISAs. #IAmScum
  • Matt Lebo of Stony Brook University "Victory without Power: A Forecast of the 2015 British Election"

    Uses dynamic forecasting. Very strong historical correlation between positive PM ratings, electoral fatigue and electoral cycles. Cameron doing well historically and after one term historically Britain has generally supported party in power for 2 terms, rather than one.

    He's back fitted the model to 1945. Predicts 18 of 18 results accurately - seat model 96% accuracy since 1945.

    Prediction:

    Con - 322
    Lab - 254

    1 million Monte Carlo simulations: 9.76% vote lead for Con. Uncertainty in model: 40.26% chance of Con majority and 98.68% chance of Con largest party.
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