Things are happening in Rotherham, albeit nowhere near fast enough seeing that the grooming is still going on as we speak, according to victims. But I do feel mostly confident that we will eventually get to grips with it there.
My worry is about all the other places where nothing is going on. The NCA needs to expand its Rotherham investigation into these groups nationwide. And then we need Jay reports for each of these other towns, or a single super-Jay report covering all of them.
Thinking politically on a day when we see a bit more light into the horror of racially motivated mass child rape is a bit Macchiavellian - so forgive me - but will the Tories start to make more of Rotherham (and elsewhere)? The abuse is, I'm sure, not limited to Labour conuncils - but the scale of it and the cover ups do seem to have a very lefty PC agenda behind them. I have no doubt Farage will be working on his speech right now. Dave too? Labour have collapsed in Scotland and this might do serious damage in England.
Maybe Dave has a bit more class than to try to make party political capital out of this and enough nous to let the relevant authorities follow the evidence wherever it leads.
Hmmm...Maybe. Farage will not be able to resist though. One way or other, be it via Farage, Daily Mail, the Sun, blogosphere, CPS, international news, Guido, or whatever, the heat is for sure going to ramp up pretty sharply. On balance I think that is very very likely to do Ed more harm than good and Dave more good than harm. Perhaps you're right and Dave just needs to sit back and let it happen with others doing the shoving.
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
In Rotherham we got about 15 convictions, and when there was an inquiry into the gangs it turned out at least 1400 girls had been raped and there were probably hundreds of rapists that had gone free. We can have no idea about whether the 7 convictions in Oxford got to the bottom of it there, or whether it was similarly widespread as in Rotherham. Given the Rotherham example, the police saying they are doing something doesn't fill me with confidence.
Oh, and the only reason Oxford is an example I can bring up is because there were actually convictions there. Who knows how many places aren't even on the list because the police haven't convicted anyone at all.
The Oxford case (and related local ones) are still ongoing investigations. Recently one of the key locations for the abuse was raided and more arrests followed. The local police are taking it very seriously. As they should - of course. But it is good to know that they are. And I know how it is personally affecting them - it isn't easy work and that is spurring them on to do the best job possible.
Let's hope so. But what about Preston, and Blackpool, and Barking? It's pretty clear locations are going to slip through the net in terms of monitoring unless central government gets a grip and takes a systematic approach to this.
Thinking politically on a day when we see a bit more light into the horror of racially motivated mass child rape is a bit Macchiavellian - so forgive me - but will the Tories start to make more of Rotherham (and elsewhere)? The abuse is, I'm sure, not limited to Labour conuncils - but the scale of it and the cover ups do seem to have a very lefty PC agenda behind them. I have no doubt Farage will be working on his speech right now. Dave too? Labour have collapsed in Scotland and this might do serious damage in England.
Vote harvesting on the back of child abuse seems a bit distasteful.
Let the law deal with this horror, not publicity seeking politicians.
And it would appear progress is being made - perhaps too slow but faster and wider than before.
The new child abuse inquiry has a New Zealand judge and new statutory authority. ''Victims' spokesman Peter Saunders said Justice Goddard would "enhance the whole credibility of the inquiry".'' (BBC) Hopefully this will satisfy the trolling on here. The issue of so called 'delays' in publishing the Pickles report and the composition of the inquiry do seem linked and it seems sensible and understandable to see them both resolved together.
It will take longer however and according to the BBC participants are likely to "lawyer up".
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Also, is it now safe to say Jim Murphy has made f-all difference?
For the life of me I still can't understand what all the hype surrounding him was about. I'm not even talking about him being a "Blairite" really. So much of the media, and some Scottish PB posters (including DavidL who is one of my favourite non-leftie posters on here) were talking about how charismatic he was.....I'm sure Murphy has many qualities, but "charismatic" is just about the last word I would ever have used to describe him. "Funereal" is more fitting based on whenever I've seen him being interviewed.
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
In Rotherham we got about 15 convictions, and when there was an inquiry into the gangs it turned out at least 1400 girls had been raped and there were probably hundreds of rapists that had gone free. We can have no idea about whether the 7 convictions in Oxford got to the bottom of it there, or whether it was similarly widespread as in Rotherham. Given the Rotherham example, the police saying they are doing something doesn't fill me with confidence.
Oh, and the only reason Oxford is an example I can bring up is because there were actually convictions there. Who knows how many places aren't even on the list because the police haven't convicted anyone at all.
The rate of convictions in Rotherham is disturbingly and disgracefully low. We know this because at least 100 of the raped underage girls produced babies by their violators.
These children can be DNA tested and the fathers - the rapists - the criminals - arrested and convicted immediately. Why isn't that happening? Is it beyond the wit of South Yorkshire Police to do basic police work? Or is something holding them back? What could it be?
It's almost as if they had clients and protectors in the council and the police. And it's highly possible that that is happening elsewhere. But of course, according to Neil, central government should "let the relevant authorities" deal with it.
Interesting threads below the Mail's report on the SNP Tsunami.
THe most liked comments in the thread underneath are
'whatever you do, don't vote labour in England'. Not 'its UKIP for me' but 'anybody but labour'.
OK its the Mail. Usual caveats.
Surprisingly, readers of the Mail (16%) did not have the lowest support for Labour in 2010. Nor was that accolade taken by the Express (19%). Instead, come forward the Telegraph, which had Labour support at just 7% among its readers.
I wonder if the Lib Dems holding West Aberdeenshire might be worth a punt? The Gordon poll has me wondering -- a muted rise for the SNP (and presumably even that is being boosted by Salmond's personal vote) and a comparatively respectable decline for the Lib Dems,
On the other side of the coin for the Lib Dems, Charlie Kennedy now looks in serious danger judging by the swing next door in Inverness.
In seats the SNP already hold their vote maps almost 1-to-1 with the areas Yes vote. Aberdeenshire West, which matched an SNP constituency demographic pretty well would be a easy SNP gain under that assumption.
You know if Dave went big on ALL child abuse and gave Labour councils and Tory grandees an equal hammering I can think it would do him nothing but good politically. What are our public servants for? I think all 3 mian party leaders are very decent individuals and should collectively rise above party politics to pull back the curtains completely on this abhorrent shite.
Agreed. Give the relevant authorities the resources they need and full backing. Urge other parties to commit to this too. Now. Publicly. Before the election.
And say that whoever is guilty, whoever they are, however grand, lowly, will be pursued. And keep on going, even when the press have turned their attention elsewhere.
Well said, and if that were to happen perhaps our politicians would garner some of the respect they have lost.
Campaigner Shaista Gohir MBE detailed abuse of the young vulnerable Asian girl in a shocking report highlighting how rife grooming was within ethnic communities.
She claimed that sexual exploitation and grooming of young Asian girls by men of the same ethnic origins was happening under the noses of authorities - with community leaders, schools and families are all too ready to dismiss the attacks or even cover them up.
'People tell me they have heard about Rochdale and Oxford and see it as something which happens elsewhere to other people, but it is happening in Birmingham, it's happening everywhere.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
If it were the Kippers used a line yesterday on another religious dispute
"“This isn’t aimed at you – it’s aimed elsewhere – it’s aimed at others. “You’ve been caught in the crossfire; collateral damage. You know what I mean."”
Agreed. Give the relevant authorities the resources they need and full backing. Urge other parties to commit to this too. Now. Publicly. Before the election.
And say that whoever is guilty, whoever they are, however grand, lowly, will be pursued. And keep on going, even when the press have turned their attention elsewhere.
Something like this, perhaps?
I have said before, and I shall say again, that what we have seen so far – in Rotherham, Oxford, and Greater Manchester and elsewhere – is only the tip of the iceberg. ... With every passing day, every new revelation, it is clear that the sexual abuse of children has taken place – and is still taking place – on a scale that we still cannot fully comprehend. ... So let me be clear, I am now more determined than ever to expose the people behind these despicable crimes and the people and institutions that knew about abuse but didn’t act, that failed to help when it was their duty - sometimes their very purpose - to do so, and the people and institutions that - in some cases - positively covered up evidence of abuse.
Yes. Thank you. That bears repeating and what is also needed is for Labour and the Lib Dems to agree and to commit to this as well. There must be no suspicion that - should Labour form the next government - they will drop this because it might embarrass Labour councils or, conversely, that the Tories will not inquire into alleged abuse/cover ups by senior Tories from the Thatcher era.
Also, is it now safe to say Jim Murphy has made f-all difference?
For the life of me I still can't understand what all the hype surrounding him was about. I'm not even talking about him being a "Blairite" really. So much of the media, and some Scottish PB posters (including DavidL who is one of my favourite non-leftie posters on here) were talking about how charismatic he was.....I'm sure Murphy has many qualities, but "charismatic" is just about the last word I would ever have used to describe him. "Funereal" is more fitting based on whenever I've seen him being interviewed.
Did you really expect anything different?
Murphy looks like what he is - an man from the London Labour establishment. He might sit for a Scottish seat and have the right accent. But in Scottish political terms, he is part of the London elite. He is a reminder of all things not-Scottish. Irrespective of his position on the Brownite-Blairite spectrum, his position within the party is what makes him unattractive.
SLAB should have elected someone who sits in the Scottish Parliament. Someone who can stand up and challenge directly.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
What could it be? The people of South Yorkshire. They had the chance to shatter the labour hegemony with a UKIP police commissioner. They failed with a 13 per cent turnout. Labour, Labour and more labour.
To be fair, the Labour candidate who replaced Shaun Wright seems to be a very credible figure, untainted by the events of the past.
This is the point. If Labour can find credible figures. On issues nothing to do with child abuse I would not vote Labour. But not everyone is the same.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Instead, come forward the Telegraph, which had Labour support at just 7% among its readers.
Interesting. I suppose my point was that there has long been an 'anybody but tory' meme in British politics. THere have never been an 'anyone but labour' meme. That could change, however
Yes. Thank you. That bears repeating and what is also needed is for Labour and the Lib Dems to agree and to commit to this as well. There must be no suspicion that - should Labour form the next government - they will drop this because it might embarrass Labour councils or, conversely, that the Tories will not inquire intoalleged abuse/cover ups by senior Tories from the Thatcher era.
Don't thank me, thank Theresa May. Yvette Cooper gave full support in her response.
The wheels turn slowly, but they do turn. In particular, police investigations into criminality on this scale, especially involving rape and coercion, are inevitably going to take time.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes. Do dry up @Watcher; you're getting pretty well pathetic!
The Sketch Team spent the morning drowning kittens to train for PMQs. Piteous sights and sounds we beheld, quite wither-wringing. On a positive note, we got through the carnage of Ed Miliband’s performance without a tear.
I have just completed a survey for the Political Studies Association. It is asking its members for the percentage party shares and seats won in the GE. The collective result will be published.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
Nope, I find politicians harvesting votes off the back of child abuse, almost as vile as the crimes themselves. But perhaps that's just me. I'd consider it equally disgusting if Labour or the Tories tried the same stunt.
We might need to pass the hat round to fund Shadsy's Xmas bonus:
Oh dear. The Ashcroft Scottish constituency polling may have been very bad news for Jim Murphy, but it wasn’t much better for Ladbrokes. We were hoping it might show some encouragement for Labour in some of their safest seats, but no. We are now sitting on some hefty losses if the SNP do as well as this polling suggests.
The SNP are now clear favourites in 40 seats in Scotland.
In fairness to Eric Pickles, I think he's done exactly the right thing here.
Yes, but "here" is the operative word. But he hasn't yet done anything about Keighley or Skipton or Sheffield. I can't help but feel the government is trying to pretend this is just a single case by a single poor council.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
It was not 'nationality' it was religion. He said the word all kippers have grown to love - 'muslim'.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Well "if" they were "local white Christians" I'd hope so too. But the fact is they weren't and your handwringing is a perfect example of why this was allowed to carry on for so long.
We might need to pass the hat round to fund Shadsy's Xmas bonus:
Oh dear. The Ashcroft Scottish constituency polling may have been very bad news for Jim Murphy, but it wasn’t much better for Ladbrokes. We were hoping it might show some encouragement for Labour in some of their safest seats, but no. We are now sitting on some hefty losses if the SNP do as well as this polling suggests.
The SNP are now clear favourites in 40 seats in Scotland.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
Nope, I find politicians harvesting votes off the back of child abuse, almost as vile as the crimes themselves. But perhaps that's just me. I'd consider it equally disgusting if Labour or the Tories tried the same stunt.
"almost as vile as the crimes themselves"
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
Interesting if you watched 'Inside the House of Commons' last night. Sarah Champion, the MP for Rotherham, was heavily featured.
She seemed pleasant enough, and did make a minor amendment to a government bill on child protection, but also very green.
Who knows if she will keep her seat in May.
As others have said, I think UKIP's chances are better in Rother Valley, although who knows what the effect of today's announcement will be?
It depends on UKIP getting the tone and balance right (campaign hard for justice, yes, but not going in too aggressively) so all non-Labour voters and swing voters can rally around them. Also depends on the quality and credibility of the candidate.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Well "if" they were "local white Christians" I'd hope so too. But the fact is they weren't and your handwringing is a perfect example of why this was allowed to carry on for so long.
This attitude of handwringing (in the local council) is one of the things that the report criticises.
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
In Rotherham we got about 15 convictions, and when there was an inquiry into the gangs it turned out at least 1400 girls had been raped and there were probably hundreds of rapists that had gone free. We can have no idea about whether the 7 convictions in Oxford got to the bottom of it there, or whether it was similarly widespread as in Rotherham. Given the Rotherham example, the police saying they are doing something doesn't fill me with confidence.
Oh, and the only reason Oxford is an example I can bring up is because there were actually convictions there. Who knows how many places aren't even on the list because the police haven't convicted anyone at all.
The rate of convictions in Rotherham is disturbingly and disgracefully low. We know this because at least 100 of the raped underage girls produced babies by their violators. These children can be DNA tested and the fathers - the rapists - the criminals - arrested and convicted immediately. Why isn't that happening? Is it beyond the wit of South Yorkshire Police to do basic police work? Or is something holding them back? What could it be?
Is this why the National Crime Agency have moved in? Rotherham/South Yorks police cannot be trusted?
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
Nope, I find politicians harvesting votes off the back of child abuse, almost as vile as the crimes themselves. But perhaps that's just me. I'd consider it equally disgusting if Labour or the Tories tried the same stunt.
"almost as vile as the crimes themselves"
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
Nope, that's not what I said at all Socrates, so please don't make false statements on my behalf. I'm referring to politicians seeking to make political capital out of child rape. Disgusting.
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
It was not 'nationality' it was religion. He said the word all kippers have grown to love - 'muslim'.
Sorry watcher - I've just reread your bit and spotted religion. The report clearly mentions Pakistani counsellors in relation to taxi drivers. It is quite clear about the ethnic side to this and Pakistanis need to face up to it. The taxi (and 'night industry') aspect of this of course important in that it offers a way in to these crimes. How are taxi drivers checked and licenced?
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
Nope, I find politicians harvesting votes off the back of child abuse, almost as vile as the crimes themselves. But perhaps that's just me. I'd consider it equally disgusting if Labour or the Tories tried the same stunt.
"almost as vile as the crimes themselves"
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
What the fuck is wrong with you?
Don't be dragged down into wrestling in the cow slurry with him.
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
In Rotherham we got about 15 convictions, and when there was an inquiry into the gangs it turned out at least 1400 girls had been raped and there were probably hundreds of rapists that had gone free. We can have no idea about whether the 7 convictions in Oxford got to the bottom of it there, or whether it was similarly widespread as in Rotherham. Given the Rotherham example, the police saying they are doing something doesn't fill me with confidence.
Oh, and the only reason Oxford is an example I can bring up is because there were actually convictions there. Who knows how many places aren't even on the list because the police haven't convicted anyone at all.
The rate of convictions in Rotherham is disturbingly and disgracefully low. We know this because at least 100 of the raped underage girls produced babies by their violators. These children can be DNA tested and the fathers - the rapists - the criminals - arrested and convicted immediately. Why isn't that happening? Is it beyond the wit of South Yorkshire Police to do basic police work? Or is something holding them back? What could it be?
Is this why the National Crime Agency have moved in? Rotherham/South Yorks police cannot be trusted?
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
Nope, I find politicians harvesting votes off the back of child abuse, almost as vile as the crimes themselves. But perhaps that's just me. I'd consider it equally disgusting if Labour or the Tories tried the same stunt.
"almost as vile as the crimes themselves"
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
Nope, that's not what I said at all Socrates, so please don't make false statements on my behalf. I'm referring to politicians seeking to make political capital out of child rape. Disgusting.
Do you need a new monocle?
Why don't you quote me the "making of political capital" done by Farage that's "almost as vile" as the forced sexual slavery and torture of kids?
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
In fairness to Eric Pickles, I think he's done exactly the right thing here.
Yes, but "here" is the operative word. But he hasn't yet done anything about Keighley or Skipton or Sheffield. I can't help but feel the government is trying to pretend this is just a single case by a single poor council.
Thus speaks the man who wants to grade rape. We all know that what upsets you is the rapists were Pakistani.
Unfortunatley the Rotherham case is one which could happen in many areas of the country where councils who have won elections on the back of small turnouts but the backing of large turnouts from minority groups are beholden to those groups. wheteher it is occurring is another thing but the ability for it to do so as illustrated by Rotherham is a reality.
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
In Rotherham we got about 15 convictions, and when there was an inquiry into the gangs it turned out at least 1400 girls had been raped and there were probably hundreds of rapists that had gone free. We can have no idea about whether the 7 convictions in Oxford got to the bottom of it there, or whether it was similarly widespread as in Rotherham. Given the Rotherham example, the police saying they are doing something doesn't fill me with confidence.
Oh, and the only reason Oxford is an example I can bring up is because there were actually convictions there. Who knows how many places aren't even on the list because the police haven't convicted anyone at all.
The rate of convictions in Rotherham is disturbingly and disgracefully low. We know this because at least 100 of the raped underage girls produced babies by their violators. These children can be DNA tested and the fathers - the rapists - the criminals - arrested and convicted immediately. Why isn't that happening? Is it beyond the wit of South Yorkshire Police to do basic police work? Or is something holding them back? What could it be?
Is this why the National Crime Agency have moved in? Rotherham/South Yorks police cannot be trusted?
Obviously. The events are being investigated despite the claims of those who want to weaponise the issue to whip up racial hatred.
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Those parallels (and it's hard to avoid them) dont bode particularly well for future of the Union. Time to occupy the north-east corner of Scotland! Is there anything valuable there?
I actually feel quite sad about Danny Alexander. I don't think he deserves to lose.
If there were such a thing as a Lib-Dem safe seat, I'd be tipping him to stand for selection if there were a retirement during the next parliament. But I don't know how he'd fair in an English by-election (and it would be English) and 2020GE is too far away to see politically.
I guess an outside chance if there's a 2nd general election inside a year or two.
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Correct. And for not entirely dissimilar reasons either.
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Those parallels (and it's hard to avoid them) dont bode particularly well for future of the Union. Time to occupy the north-east corner of Scotland! Is there anything valuable there?
Or follow the example of Edward III, and annex the three border constituencies.
I actually feel quite sad about Danny Alexander. I don't think he deserves to lose.
If there were such a thing as a Lib-Dem safe seat, I'd be tipping him to stand for selection if there were a retirement during the next parliament. But I don't know how he'd fair in an English by-election (and it would be English) and 2020GE is too far away to see politically.
I guess an outside chance if there's a 2nd general election inside a year or two.
Yes, he's been a very good minister and I personally think he's done a better job of positioning the LibDems as distinct from the Conservatives than any other LibDem minister.
I actually feel quite sad about Danny Alexander. I don't think he deserves to lose.
If there were such a thing as a Lib-Dem safe seat, I'd be tipping him to stand for selection if there were a retirement during the next parliament. But I don't know how he'd fair in an English by-election (and it would be English) and 2020GE is too far away to see politically.
I guess an outside chance if there's a 2nd general election inside a year or two.
Critics of Sarah Champion will be pleased to see she is active on the matter of child abuse.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
The rate of convictions in Rotherham is disturbingly and disgracefully low. We know this because at least 100 of the raped underage girls produced babies by their violators.
These children can be DNA tested and the fathers - the rapists - the criminals - arrested and convicted immediately. Why isn't that happening? Is it beyond the wit of South Yorkshire Police to do basic police work? Or is something holding them back? What could it be?
Unless all these children where conceived when the mother was under the age of consent it doesn't prove rape. I wish it was that easy to get a conviction, but it isn't. It will probably take years for this number of allegations to be fully investigated and tried. Its massively frustrating, but the fact is it will take years.
Betting tip from the New Statesman... ''Outside of the main exchanges, a notable moment came when Labour MP and shadow justice minister Dan Jarvis questioned Cameron about support for a solar panel business in his Barnsley constituency. The respectful silence with which he was heard was a good example of why many believe he could one day lead his party. ''
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Correct. And for not entirely dissimilar reasons either.
Well, at least the Brits didn't put Salmond & Co up against the wall and shoot them...
First F1 test of 2015 is over. Didn't learn much, to be honest. Lotus appears to be at least driveable, which is a step up from the 2014 horror show. Grosjean's points in the spread-betting has the potential for interest.
Socrates - Don't talk about Rotherham or grooming going forward.
Again, you've accused people of being guilty of crimes, that they weren't found being guilty of, they were found guilty of other crimes.
Your comments are likely to get Mike into trouble.
Everyone else - Tone it down - The spam trap is now set to automatically anyone who swears, including those who use asterikses.
Do you mean that no one is allowed to mention the Rotherham case from now on. I thought you and your dad were for Je suis Charlie? Now you are banning discussion?
Critics of Sarah Champion will be pleased to see she is active on the matter of child abuse.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
Socrates - Don't talk about Rotherham or grooming going forward.
Again, you've accused people of being guilty of crimes, that they weren't found being guilty of, they were found guilty of other crimes.
Your comments are likely to get Mike into trouble.
Everyone else - Tone it down - The spam trap is now set to automatically anyone who swears, including those who use asterikses.
Do you mean that no one is allowed to mention the Rotherham case from now on. I thought you and your dad were for Je suis Charlie? Now you are banning discussion?
Critics of Sarah Champion will be pleased to see she is active on the matter of child abuse.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
A note of SNP caution, especially for spread buyers - their total "expected" seats, based on prices in all 59 seats, is only 34, with Labour retaining 20 [Tories 2, LDs 3.5]. The SNP are narrow favourites far more often than they are narrow underdogs.
I actually feel quite sad about Danny Alexander. I don't think he deserves to lose.
If there were such a thing as a Lib-Dem safe seat, I'd be tipping him to stand for selection if there were a retirement during the next parliament. But I don't know how he'd fair in an English by-election (and it would be English) and 2020GE is too far away to see politically.
I guess an outside chance if there's a 2nd general election inside a year or two.
I would say the only 100% safe Lib Dem seat in England is Westmorland & Lonsdale, and even that is only because Tim Farron seems to have weirdly sky-high popularity there.
If Cameron will do nothing it will be because there are equally horrific allegations around about Tories. So there is no political advantage to him.
The whole stinking cesspit needs to be cleaned out - not for political reasons - but because it is the right thing to do.
Err, have you read the news today? The suggestion that nothing is being done is beyond parody.
Can you tell me the state of the investigations in, say, High Wycombe and Oxford?
In Oxford there seems to have been 7 convictions and police say they are following inquiries in relation to dozens of other suspects.
The rate of convictions in Rotherham is disturbingly and disgracefully low. We know this because at least 100 of the raped underage girls produced babies by their violators.
These children can be DNA tested and the fathers - the rapists - the criminals - arrested and convicted immediately. Why isn't that happening? Is it beyond the wit of South Yorkshire Police to do basic police work? Or is something holding them back? What could it be?
Unless all these children where conceived when the mother was under the age of consent it doesn't prove rape. I wish it was that easy to get a conviction, but it isn't. It will probably take years for this number of allegations to be fully investigated and tried. Its massively frustrating, but the fact is it will take years.
That is understandable if we want safe convictions, but could they at least make an effort to stop the ongoing abuse.
Socrates - Don't talk about Rotherham or grooming going forward.
Again, you've accused people of being guilty of crimes, that they weren't found being guilty of, they were found guilty of other crimes.
Your comments are likely to get Mike into trouble.
Everyone else - Tone it down - The spam trap is now set to automatically anyone who swears, including those who use asterikses.
Do you mean that no one is allowed to mention the Rotherham case from now on. I thought you and your dad were for Je suis Charlie? Now you are banning discussion?
Critics of Sarah Champion will be pleased to see she is active on the matter of child abuse.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
Socrates - Don't talk about Rotherham or grooming going forward.
Again, you've accused people of being guilty of crimes, that they weren't found being guilty of, they were found guilty of other crimes.
Your comments are likely to get Mike into trouble.
Everyone else - Tone it down - The spam trap is now set to automatically anyone who swears, including those who use asterikses.
Do you mean that no one is allowed to mention the Rotherham case from now on. I thought you and your dad were for Je suis Charlie? Now you are banning discussion?
Critics of Sarah Champion will be pleased to see she is active on the matter of child abuse.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
OMFG - how pathetic. Time to get serious on this - not play around with gimmicks
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Those parallels (and it's hard to avoid them) dont bode particularly well for future of the Union. Time to occupy the north-east corner of Scotland! Is there anything valuable there?
Or follow the example of Edward III, and annex the three border constituencies.
Historically, on both sides in Northumbria and in Scotland, the borders were a fairly lawless ungoverned region. Both Scots and English regularly ebbed and flowed across.
Even today it can feel pretty isolated and even desolate. Politically it has much stronger links to England than the rest of Scotland, both due to proximity, more mixed settlement patterns (plenty with English ancestry too) and because it lies on the trade routes between Edinburgh/Glasgow and the big cities in England.
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Those parallels (and it's hard to avoid them) dont bode particularly well for future of the Union. Time to occupy the north-east corner of Scotland! Is there anything valuable there?
RAF Lossiemouth - first line of defence against the Russian air force.
In fairness to Eric Pickles, I think he's done exactly the right thing here.
Yes, but "here" is the operative word. But he hasn't yet done anything about Keighley or Skipton or Sheffield. I can't help but feel the government is trying to pretend this is just a single case by a single poor council.
Thus speaks the man who wants to grade rape. We all know that what upsets you is the rapists were Pakistani.
Typical disgusting comment from someone unhappy that the truth has come out.
Critics of Sarah Champion will be pleased to see she is active on the matter of child abuse.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Those parallels (and it's hard to avoid them) dont bode particularly well for future of the Union. Time to occupy the north-east corner of Scotland! Is there anything valuable there?
Or follow the example of Edward III, and annex the three border constituencies.
Historically, on both sides in Northumbria and in Scotland, the borders were a fairly lawless ungoverned region. Both Scots and English regularly ebbed and flowed across.
Even today it can feel pretty isolated and even desolate. Politically it has much stronger links to England than the rest of Scotland, both due to proximity, more mixed settlement patterns (plenty with English ancestry too) and because it lies on the trade routes between Edinburgh/Glasgow and the big cities in England.
George Macdonald Fraser wrote a very good history of the region.
Betting tip from the New Statesman... ''Outside of the main exchanges, a notable moment came when Labour MP and shadow justice minister Dan Jarvis questioned Cameron about support for a solar panel business in his Barnsley constituency. The respectful silence with which he was heard was a good example of why many believe he could one day lead his party. ''
The Guardian had a slightly different take on this. Not so much a good example, but:
...perhaps due to MPs wanting to form a view about a man sometimes named as a future Labour leader.
They'll go back to jeering him once they've made up their mind about him.
Socrates - Don't talk about Rotherham or grooming going forward.
Again, you've accused people of being guilty of crimes, that they weren't found being guilty of, they were found guilty of other crimes.
Your comments are likely to get Mike into trouble.
Everyone else - Tone it down - The spam trap is now set to automatically anyone who swears, including those who use asterikses.
Do you mean that no one is allowed to mention the Rotherham case from now on. I thought you and your dad were for Je suis Charlie? Now you are banning discussion?
PBModerator is TheScreamingEagles, not rcs1000.
Nooooo???!
Apparently I'm wrong on at lest this occasion, but it's my understanding PBModerator is sometimes the account used by TSE.
However, I would like to know from whoever is using the account right now the minimum on how long my ban on discussing the biggest scandal in British politics for decades will last for. It seems like a huge restriction on free discussion when I have always done my best to respect the rules of the site, and to retract claims when I have overstepped. I don't believe Mike is put at any real risk for my comments if I continue to act in such a way.
Comments
Things are happening in Rotherham, albeit nowhere near fast enough seeing that the grooming is still going on as we speak, according to victims. But I do feel mostly confident that we will eventually get to grips with it there.
My worry is about all the other places where nothing is going on. The NCA needs to expand its Rotherham investigation into these groups nationwide. And then we need Jay reports for each of these other towns, or a single super-Jay report covering all of them.
The people of South Yorkshire. They had the chance to shatter the labour hegemony with a UKIP police commissioner.
They failed with a 13 per cent turnout. Labour, Labour and more labour.
Hopefully this will satisfy the trolling on here. The issue of so called 'delays' in publishing the Pickles report and the composition of the inquiry do seem linked and it seems sensible and understandable to see them both resolved together.
It will take longer however and according to the BBC participants are likely to "lawyer up".
Farage has spoken about child grooming. Above is a smiggin of what he said.
I note Farage's emphasis on the religion, and implied nationality of the abusers. I trust he'd make as much noise on the topic if local white Christians were perpetrating similar crimes.
For the life of me I still can't understand what all the hype surrounding him was about. I'm not even talking about him being a "Blairite" really. So much of the media, and some Scottish PB posters (including DavidL who is one of my favourite non-leftie posters on here) were talking about how charismatic he was.....I'm sure Murphy has many qualities, but "charismatic" is just about the last word I would ever have used to describe him. "Funereal" is more fitting based on whenever I've seen him being interviewed.
Campaigner Shaista Gohir MBE detailed abuse of the young vulnerable Asian girl in a shocking report highlighting how rife grooming was within ethnic communities.
She claimed that sexual exploitation and grooming of young Asian girls by men of the same ethnic origins was happening under the noses of authorities - with community leaders, schools and families are all too ready to dismiss the attacks or even cover them up.
'People tell me they have heard about Rochdale and Oxford and see it as something which happens elsewhere to other people, but it is happening in Birmingham, it's happening everywhere.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2564678/Teenage-girl-victim-grooming-gang-raped-30-men-just-six-hours-including-father-schoolboy-son.html
If it were the Kippers used a line yesterday on another religious dispute
"“This isn’t aimed at you – it’s aimed elsewhere – it’s aimed at others.
“You’ve been caught in the crossfire; collateral damage. You know what I mean."”
On topic, incumbency doesn't help you much if there's a swing of 27% underway against your party.
Murphy looks like what he is - an man from the London Labour establishment. He might sit for a Scottish seat and have the right accent. But in Scottish political terms, he is part of the London elite. He is a reminder of all things not-Scottish. Irrespective of his position on the Brownite-Blairite spectrum, his position within the party is what makes him unattractive.
SLAB should have elected someone who sits in the Scottish Parliament. Someone who can stand up and challenge directly.
Tesco's online banking operation has been hit by a computer fault, with customers unable to view their accounts.
Tesco in trouble again.
Right on cue. You're more worried about UKIP gaining politically from this than you are about the substantive issue.
Therein lies the problem.
Interesting. I suppose my point was that there has long been an 'anybody but tory' meme in British politics. THere have never been an 'anyone but labour' meme. That could change, however
The wheels turn slowly, but they do turn. In particular, police investigations into criminality on this scale, especially involving rape and coercion, are inevitably going to take time.
Do dry up @Watcher; you're getting pretty well pathetic!
She seemed pleasant enough, and did make a minor amendment to a government bill on child protection, but also very green.
Who knows if she will keep her seat in May.
Nope, I find politicians harvesting votes off the back of child abuse, almost as vile as the crimes themselves. But perhaps that's just me. I'd consider it equally disgusting if Labour or the Tories tried the same stunt.
Oh dear. The Ashcroft Scottish constituency polling may have been very bad news for Jim Murphy, but it wasn’t much better for Ladbrokes. We were hoping it might show some encouragement for Labour in some of their safest seats, but no. We are now sitting on some hefty losses if the SNP do as well as this polling suggests.
The SNP are now clear favourites in 40 seats in Scotland.
http://politicalbookie.com/
http://politicalbookie.com/2015/02/04/snp-now-favourites-in-40-seats/?hootPostID=4e26e554908d1186cd96abbc6f317290
I still think that there may be some value in some corners for betting on the SNP here, even now. But the party is mostly over.
It was not 'nationality' it was religion. He said the word all kippers have grown to love - 'muslim'.
Well "if" they were "local white Christians" I'd hope so too. But the fact is they weren't and your handwringing is a perfect example of why this was allowed to carry on for so long.
I think Shadsy did as well as he could.
"almost as vile as the crimes themselves"
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
What the fuck is wrong with you?
This attitude of handwringing (in the local council) is one of the things that the report criticises.
The threat of that might stop grown blokes raping children.
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
Nope, that's not what I said at all Socrates, so please don't make false statements on my behalf. I'm referring to politicians seeking to make political capital out of child rape. Disgusting.
Do you need a new monocle?
http://www.oddschecker.com/politics/british-politics/next-uk-general-election/danny-alexander-to-be-an-mp-after-the-election
Sorry watcher - I've just reread your bit and spotted religion. The report clearly mentions Pakistani counsellors in relation to taxi drivers. It is quite clear about the ethnic side to this and Pakistanis need to face up to it.
The taxi (and 'night industry') aspect of this of course important in that it offers a way in to these crimes. How are taxi drivers checked and licenced?
You find a politician saying 'these crimes were committed by men of this ethnic group and weren't investigated' almost as vile as the systematic rape, physical beatings, death threats and forced prostitution of children as young as 11?!?
What the fuck is wrong with you?
Don't be dragged down into wrestling in the cow slurry with him.
Do you need a new monocle?
Why don't you quote me the "making of political capital" done by Farage that's "almost as vile" as the forced sexual slavery and torture of kids?
Please keep your fantasies to yourself
WRT the electoral earthquake that's impending in Scotland, the only equivalents that I can think of are the rise of the Irish Parliamentary Party (outside Ulster) in 1885/86, and its disappearance in 1918.
Must be an article there somewhere, surely.
wheteher it is occurring is another thing but the ability for it to do so as illustrated by Rotherham is a reality.
U.S. Seen in Middle East as Ally of Terrorists
Total cretinous rubbish. What upsets him is they are above the law because they are Pakistani.
Again, you've accused people of being guilty of crimes, that they weren't found being guilty of, they were found guilty of other crimes.
Your comments are likely to get Mike into trouble.
Everyone else - Tone it down - The spam trap is now set to automatically anyone who swears, including those who use asterikses.
If there were such a thing as a Lib-Dem safe seat, I'd be tipping him to stand for selection if there were a retirement during the next parliament. But I don't know how he'd fair in an English by-election (and it would be English) and 2020GE is too far away to see politically.
I guess an outside chance if there's a 2nd general election inside a year or two.
I read on her website of her innovative campaign :
"Sarah has become the first foster Mum of a teddy bear called Mistoffelees. The bear represents victims of child abuse; a companion of a child who has seen and experienced what the victim went through. The idea is for Mistoffolees to be handed around Westminster, with each politician having pictures taken with him and writing a message in his accompanying book to show their support against child abuse."
''Outside of the main exchanges, a notable moment came when Labour MP and shadow justice minister Dan Jarvis questioned Cameron about support for a solar panel business in his Barnsley constituency. The respectful silence with which he was heard was a good example of why many believe he could one day lead his party. ''
First F1 test of 2015 is over. Didn't learn much, to be honest. Lotus appears to be at least driveable, which is a step up from the 2014 horror show. Grosjean's points in the spread-betting has the potential for interest.
FYI - I'm not TSE.
Anyway took 1-4 on the SNP there this morning.
25-1 was too long though
You can see a picture of Sarah with Mistoffeles here:
http://tinyurl.com/px3jb5n
You aren't
http://www.sarahchampionmp.com/sarah-champion-becomes-first-mp-to-join-innovative-campaign-raising-awareness-of-child-abuse/
Even today it can feel pretty isolated and even desolate. Politically it has much stronger links to England than the rest of Scotland, both due to proximity, more mixed settlement patterns (plenty with English ancestry too) and because it lies on the trade routes between Edinburgh/Glasgow and the big cities in England.
George Macdonald Fraser wrote a very good history of the region.
However, I would like to know from whoever is using the account right now the minimum on how long my ban on discussing the biggest scandal in British politics for decades will last for. It seems like a huge restriction on free discussion when I have always done my best to respect the rules of the site, and to retract claims when I have overstepped. I don't believe Mike is put at any real risk for my comments if I continue to act in such a way.