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  • Omnium said:

    Suppose I suggested that a council tenant should surrender 12% of everything he owns when he moves. How would that go down?

    Osborne has sadly shown that he is a spineless lightweight. His only motivation is to win votes.

    We need some new politicians. The stage has never been better set for UKIP. Or for that matter Monster Raving Loony.

    "His only motivation is to win votes."
    Quite right too, for a democratic politician. Have you got a beef against democracy or is it just Osborne that you oppose ?
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    yes, look at the size of that Tory majority

    Your churlish attitude towards Osborne is beneath your usual high standards. He's plainly excellent.
    LOL I'll happily churl. The main challenge to Osborne remains as it always has this Parliament from the fiscal right - Labour have no policies. Osborne has wasted an entire Parliament by refusing to address overdue reforms. GO =Gordon Osborne politics triumphs over economic need.
    Osborne's challenge was to get the private sector growing and generating jobs again. He's succeeded in that beyond all expectation.
    Yes. Take a look at the nett growth in jobs despite the massive and continuing loss of jobs in the public sector.
    Perhaps the most amazing thing in recent years has been the transformation in Jaguar Land Rover. Its a great tribute to British design and engineering - if not management and investment.

    The other point is that the higher rate tax payers are paying record sums and so is Corporation tax.

    Anyone remember that clever wheeze - abolition of Advance Payment of Corporation Tax?
    A double tragedy when you think how Brown blew the money away on inefficient spending. Clawing it back is not so easy.
    And of course thats before you even think about the destruction of the pensions industry. People have pathetically short memories when it comes to considering and comparing economic competence.

  • glwglw Posts: 9,954

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    It's hard to believe but only a few months ago, in response to the debate about the size of the oil reserve, there were nationalists who were saying 'it doesn't matter any way, oil prices are headed to the moon'.

    Whoops!

  • MonikerDiCanioMonikerDiCanio Posts: 5,792
    edited December 2014

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    Osborne said that the UK was the fastest growing major advanced economy, which is true according to forecasts.

  • My guess is that the Tories are relying on Osborne's Autumn Statement today as a useful and much needed political tool to propel them forward a couple of points in the polls over the next 7-10 days and in that context next week's ICM could prove interesting.
  • Wait, what?

    Revealed: why Nick Clegg boycotted the Autumn statement

    Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg no longer wants to be seen sitting alongside David Cameron or George Osborne

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nick-clegg/11271635/Revealed-why-Nick-Clegg-boycotted-the-Autumn-statement.html
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    I don't think enough credit is being given to Cameron for so quickly and adroitly linking Scottish devolution with English Votes For English Laws.
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    Wait, what?

    Revealed: why Nick Clegg boycotted the Autumn statement

    Deputy Prime Minister Nick Clegg no longer wants to be seen sitting alongside David Cameron or George Osborne

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/nick-clegg/11271635/Revealed-why-Nick-Clegg-boycotted-the-Autumn-statement.html

    As someone pointed out it has not done his ratings much good.
    I doubt it will last long, but it shows exactly why the LDs have so mismanaged their time in government and contributed to their own downfall.
  • 1. Drop Bobby Sol
    2. Concede bad goals
    3. Lose 4-0

    Off to I'm a Celeb.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,341

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    I don't think enough credit is being given to Cameron for so quickly and adroitly linking Scottish devolution with English Votes For English Laws.
    Early days yet - for both. Osborne's speech did lasting damage by arguing that the Scots were inferior partners within the UK.

  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
  • compouter2compouter2 Posts: 2,371
    1 opinion poll lead in the last seventeen.GO, pure genius. Tic Toc!
  • SquareRootSquareRoot Posts: 7,095
    Omnium said:

    Suppose I suggested that a council tenant should surrender 12% of everything he owns when he moves. How would that go down?

    Osborne has sadly shown that he is a spineless lightweight. His only motivation is to win votes.

    We need some new politicians. The stage has never been better set for UKIP. Or for that matter Monster Raving Loony.

    You are obviously a contender for the "upper Class Twit of the year" contest. I hope you get on the podium.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    I agree with OGH. This was a good budget by Osborne. More progressiveness on stamp duty is both fairer and more economically efficient seeing that we need to convert more large houses into smaller places with the current shortage. It's also great to see him clamp down on profit shifting. Shows he's not a right wing ideologue.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    The Scots seemed to have palyed a blinder. They've managed to get some new tax powers whilst maintaining the Barnett formula whilst decreased north sea oil revenues will make Scotland a considerable net recipient of UK funds.
    The Barnett formula is a monstrosity that isn't even supported by the person that designed it.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    Osborne said that the UK was the fastest growing major advanced economy, which is true according to forecasts.

    I could not find those exact words but these are close "Manufacturing is growing faster than any other sector; and investment is set to be up 11% this year – growing faster in the UK than any other major advanced economy." So this statement may be manufacturing.

    From: http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/the-spectator/2014/12/full-text-george-osbornes-2014-autumn-statement/

  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited December 2014
    I think we have to wait, like always we won't know the impact of Osborne's statement until Monday night.

    However I will focus on 2 things, the first is that apart from the stamp duty reductions there's not much else, the second is that if the economy is so good then voters will change their priorities and feel safe enough to vote Labour.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    edited December 2014
    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
  • compouter2compouter2 Posts: 2,371
    Socrates said:

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    The Scots seemed to have palyed a blinder. They've managed to get some new tax powers whilst maintaining the Barnett formula whilst decreased north sea oil revenues will make Scotland a considerable net recipient of UK funds.
    The Barnett formula is a monstrosity that isn't even supported by the person that designed it.
    Pretty hard to support it when you are deceased. He did admit in his later years that it needed replacing.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
    A government is elected for 5 years, right ?
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Socrates said:

    I agree with OGH. This was a good budget by Osborne. More progressiveness on stamp duty is both fairer and more economically efficient seeing that we need to convert more large houses into smaller places with the current shortage. It's also great to see him clamp down on profit shifting. Shows he's not a right wing ideologue.

    The irony is that a "winning budget" is not a right wing one. Interesting ! Perhaps, he should follow this dictum more often.

    The 45% slab has brought f**k all !
  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    The Scots seemed to have palyed a blinder. They've managed to get some new tax powers whilst maintaining the Barnett formula whilst decreased north sea oil revenues will make Scotland a considerable net recipient of UK funds.

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    The Scots seemed to have palyed a blinder. They've managed to get some new tax powers whilst maintaining the Barnett formula whilst decreased north sea oil revenues will make Scotland a considerable net recipient of UK funds.

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    The Scots seemed to have palyed a blinder. They've managed to get some new tax powers whilst maintaining the Barnett formula whilst decreased north sea oil revenues will make Scotland a considerable net recipient of UK funds.
    I'm not quite sure what your point is. The Scottish government will receive all income tax paid by Scottish taxpayers on their non-savings and non-dividend income, with a corresponding adjustment in the block grant it receives from the UK Government.
    There has to be a funding formula - but
    ''the revised funding framework should result in the devolved Scottish budget benefiting in full from policy decisions by the Scottish government that increase revenues or reduce expenditure, and the devolved Scottish budget bearing the full costs of policy decisions that reduce revenues or increase expenditure.'' (BBC)

  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
    A government is elected for 5 years, right ?
    Yes. I think it's entirely reasonable to judge the Coalition on their economic record from about a year into power to the time when they leave power. They should be benchmarked against other large developed countries for that period.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,566
    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
    A government is elected for 5 years, right ?
    Yes. I think it's entirely reasonable to judge the Coalition on their economic record from about a year into power to the time when they leave power. They should be benchmarked against other large developed countries for that period.
    Let's start with the US then.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
    A government is elected for 5 years, right ?
    Yes. I think it's entirely reasonable to judge the Coalition on their economic record from about a year into power to the time when they leave power. They should be benchmarked against other large developed countries for that period.
    The government hasn't done bad with the economy, thanks to it's u-turn in economic policy they did what Labour would have done anyway.
    And that's a point, Balls, Darling and Osborne had the same ideas and plans, the economy will be the same regardless of who's in power.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    surbiton said:


    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !

    I personally know ones working for half that at 5* hotels with £200 a pop restaurants.



  • FrankBoothFrankBooth Posts: 9,928

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    Osborne said that the UK was the fastest growing major advanced economy, which is true according to forecasts.

    You seem to be confused between the present and future tense.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Why not train up people without cooking experience? It's only whipping up a balti, it's hardly rocket science.

    And it sounds like the work conditions weren't great either.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,723
    The Government has found two "cut through" announcements that cost nothing (overall) yet are very popular:

    1. 2014 Budget - No longer have to buy an annuity
    2. 2014 Autumn Statement - Stamp Duty

    The annuity change actually raises money for the Government.

    The Stamp Duty change costs a little bit - less than £1 billion - but it's popularity is very, very high relative to its cost.

    So two questions:

    1. Why did nobody make these changes earlier?
    2. What popular measure is Osborne holding back for the 2015 Budget?

    If he originally thought of three ideas you would think he would do one at each of the last three set piece occasions.

    If he originally only had two ideas, surely one would have been kept back for the 2015 Budget?

    Which suggests he has one more up his sleeve. But what could it be?
  • Moses_Moses_ Posts: 4,865

    George's statements always look good. Until they start being unpicked. Don't join the chorus OGH..

    As I previously mentioned the guy you are referring too resigned yesterday

    TFFT
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Why not train up people without cooking experience? It's only whipping up a balti, it's hardly rocket science.

    And it sounds like the work conditions weren't great either.
    You can make it into a reality show starring Gordon Ramsay, you could name it Hell's Kitchen.
  • George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    Osborne said that the UK was the fastest growing major advanced economy, which is true according to forecasts.

    You seem to be confused between the present and future tense.
    GO " The UK is......."
    GO said the UK was....
    Get it, smarty pants ?

  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758
    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Why not train up people without cooking experience? It's only whipping up a balti, it's hardly rocket science.

    And it sounds like the work conditions weren't great either.
    Now try working long hours, in an overheated kitchen, and whipping up 30 meals in 30 minutes, each perfectly cooked and in line with the whims of the customer

    "It's only a balti" understates the skill and dedication of our service sector workers
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    MikeL said:

    The Government has found two "cut through" announcements that cost nothing (overall) yet are very popular:

    1. 2014 Budget - No longer have to buy an annuity
    2. 2014 Autumn Statement - Stamp Duty

    The annuity change actually raises money for the Government.

    The Stamp Duty change costs a little bit - less than £1 billion - but it's popularity is very, very high relative to its cost.

    So two questions:

    1. Why did nobody make these changes earlier?
    2. What popular measure is Osborne holding back for the 2015 Budget?

    If he originally thought of three ideas you would think he would do one at each of the last three set piece occasions.

    If he originally only had two ideas, surely one would have been kept back for the 2015 Budget?

    Which suggests he has one more up his sleeve. But what could it be?

    On the 2015 Budget there's nothing, that it's.
    The autumn statement is regarded and has been agreed by the coalition partners to be the last throw of this government, since the 2015 budget will be too close to the election to be of any concrete meaning.
  • TCPoliticalBettingTCPoliticalBetting Posts: 10,819
    edited December 2014

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn? Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Was he offering more money than an average cook gets......?
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Charles said:

    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Why not train up people without cooking experience? It's only whipping up a balti, it's hardly rocket science.

    And it sounds like the work conditions weren't great either.
    Now try working long hours, in an overheated kitchen, and whipping up 30 meals in 30 minutes, each perfectly cooked and in line with the whims of the customer

    "It's only a balti" understates the skill and dedication of our service sector workers
    Presumably there are lots of second generation Bengali chefs, whose fathers were in the trade.

    Better than being on the dole.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,723
    Speedy said:

    MikeL said:

    The Government has found two "cut through" announcements that cost nothing (overall) yet are very popular:

    1. 2014 Budget - No longer have to buy an annuity
    2. 2014 Autumn Statement - Stamp Duty

    The annuity change actually raises money for the Government.

    The Stamp Duty change costs a little bit - less than £1 billion - but it's popularity is very, very high relative to its cost.

    So two questions:

    1. Why did nobody make these changes earlier?
    2. What popular measure is Osborne holding back for the 2015 Budget?

    If he originally thought of three ideas you would think he would do one at each of the last three set piece occasions.

    If he originally only had two ideas, surely one would have been kept back for the 2015 Budget?

    Which suggests he has one more up his sleeve. But what could it be?

    On the 2015 Budget there's nothing, that it's.
    The autumn statement is regarded and has been agreed by the coalition partners to be the last throw of this government, since the 2015 budget will be too close to the election to be of any concrete meaning.
    No way of you, me or anyone else knowing what's in the 2015 Budget.

    It's entirely possible there will be a popular announcement - albeit that it might not actually come in until after the GE.

    Though even then it might come in straight away - the Stamp Duty change comes in today.
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 2,000

    AndyJS said:

    Brent Crude drops below $70:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/

    The notion of Scotttish indepencdence falls through the floor. What fools all those who voted YES must feel now after believig Salmonds rubbish. And of course we can now see why the notion of independence with a £ currency union was such a non starter for rUK
    It will also hit UK arms exports (67% of which goes to th middle east)
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
    You do know that a restaurant is open 7 days a week ! Who will cook the other 2 days ? Fairy godmother ?
    chestnut said:

    surbiton said:


    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !

    I personally know ones working for half that at 5* hotels with £200 a pop restaurants.

    In London ? Does anybody eat in there ?
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549
    Arsenal sinking !
  • saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
    The more that is revealed about the fantasy world that Surbiton inhabits, the odder it gets.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Moses_ said:

    Tom Whipple @whippletom
    We are moving home next week. Osborne just saved us £400. I'm calling our new fridge freezer George. #AS2014

    Unless I have calculated incorrectly that wonderful man has just saved me thousands.
  • CharlesCharles Posts: 35,758

    Charles said:

    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Why not train up people without cooking experience? It's only whipping up a balti, it's hardly rocket science.

    And it sounds like the work conditions weren't great either.
    Now try working long hours, in an overheated kitchen, and whipping up 30 meals in 30 minutes, each perfectly cooked and in line with the whims of the customer

    "It's only a balti" understates the skill and dedication of our service sector workers
    Presumably there are lots of second generation Bengali chefs, whose fathers were in the trade.

    Better than being on the dole.
    I agree. I just didn't like the rather arrogant way that Socrates dismissed the job that so many of our fellow countrymen and women do.
  • Fantastic - Arsenal did their usual last minute winner and triumphantly we avoided the 4-0 defeat.

    Glory be.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
    The more that is revealed about the fantasy world that Surbiton inhabits, the odder it gets.
    So why do people not become a chef for less than £30k ? Are you saying the owners deliberately want to pay more ?

    The second / third generation kids are more interested playing with X Box. Just like miner's sons didn't want to go down the pits when an alternative came up.

    London is not a god forsaken country hole !
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    surbiton said:

    Arsenal sinking !

    Everton busting me coupon.
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245
    surbiton said:

    saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
    You do know that a restaurant is open 7 days a week ! Who will cook the other 2 days ? Fairy godmother ?
    chestnut said:

    surbiton said:


    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !

    I personally know ones working for half that at 5* hotels with £200 a pop restaurants.

    In London ? Does anybody eat in there ?
    You're just embarrassing yourself now.
  • TGOHF said:

    surbiton said:

    Arsenal sinking !

    Everton busting me coupon.
    Burst coupon over Alloa also I imagine.
  • surbitonsurbiton Posts: 13,549

    Fantastic - Arsenal did their usual last minute winner and triumphantly we avoided the 4-0 defeat.

    Glory be.

    I can see it is not easy being a Spurs fan !
  • sarissasarissa Posts: 2,000

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    TGOHF said:

    surbiton said:

    Arsenal sinking !

    Everton busting me coupon.
    Burst coupon over Alloa also I imagine.
    Full of chancers from top to bottom especially in the boardroom - still we can always win that trophy next season...
  • MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention

    OR his intervention made sure they didn't change their minds.

  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?
  • TGOHF said:

    TGOHF said:

    surbiton said:

    Arsenal sinking !

    Everton busting me coupon.
    Burst coupon over Alloa also I imagine.
    Full of chancers from top to bottom especially in the boardroom - still we can always win that trophy next season...
    Have you joined the 'Ally must go' brigade? He's a likeable lad, but..
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    No grannies living in a 2M pound house will pay a penny every year - not like under Labour.
  • George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    Thank God you've retired from the NHS.
  • glwglw Posts: 9,954

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    GO is taxing the rich, Ed Balls wants to tax granny.
  • wumperwumper Posts: 35
    If the Tories win in 2015 it will because the electorate are gullible
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,016
    I am slightly bemused that he was able to announce that the deficit will be lower this year than last. I really thought he was snookered on that and so did most of the analysts I read. He is several billion behind last year at the moment.

    Surely George would not have achieved some slight of hand such as some deferred payments?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
    Very true, it took years for Labour to feck us over so completely.
  • sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
    Have you a link to polling on the motivations of the other 38%?

    I'm still chuckling at those predicting a No vote would cause an SNP implosion.
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    Speedy said:

    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    surbiton said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    IMF ...
    ''Britain's economy is growing faster than those of every other major developed country, the International Monetary Fund has disclosed.
    Britain is expected to grow faster than countries including America, Germany, France and Canada'' (Telegraph)
    Where does Britain stand in the G20 growth table since 2010 ? They were not elected in 2013.
    You realise that government policy isn't instantaneous in its effects, right?
    A government is elected for 5 years, right ?
    Yes. I think it's entirely reasonable to judge the Coalition on their economic record from about a year into power to the time when they leave power. They should be benchmarked against other large developed countries for that period.
    The government hasn't done bad with the economy, thanks to it's u-turn in economic policy they did what Labour would have done anyway.
    And that's a point, Balls, Darling and Osborne had the same ideas and plans, the economy will be the same regardless of who's in power.
    Help me out here. If the tories did what Labour would have done (stop sniggering at the back) can you explain what Labour have been whining about?

    you seem to be saying that Labour are opportunistic little shits.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
    Have you a link to polling on the motivations of the other 38%?

    I'm still chuckling at those predicting a No vote would cause an SNP implosion.
    We shall see.

    Still crying in your beer?
  • sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
    Have you a link to polling on the motivations of the other 38%?

    I'm still chuckling at those predicting a No vote would cause an SNP implosion.
    BTW your French Canadian pal looks a right charlie after Sturgeon rightly purged the Nat book-burners.
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245

    sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
    Have you a link to polling on the motivations of the other 38%?

    I'm still chuckling at those predicting a No vote would cause an SNP implosion.
    We're still chuckling at yes supporters genuinely believing they'd win.
  • sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
    Have you a link to polling on the motivations of the other 38%?

    I'm still chuckling at those predicting a No vote would cause an SNP implosion.
    We shall see.

    Still crying in your beer?
    Zinger!
    (not)

    So, no link then?
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    sarissa said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy. Does he not consider the US a major economy?

    He said third fastest growing major economy.
    Alistair said:

    I don't think enough credit is given to Osborne for also saving the Union with his unforgettable speech this February in Edinburgh when he exploded Salmond's position on sterling. A formidable statesman.

    Support for independence went up after his speech. At the start of the year Indy was polling at 35%.
    No currency Union was cited by many of the 55% as the reason to vote No.
    62% (Ashcroft poll) of No voters had made up their minds well in advance of his intervention
    62% of 55% = 34%

    So the other 38% of 55% = 21% who made all the difference.

    (BTW anyone still chucking at SeanT's panic?)
    Have you a link to polling on the motivations of the other 38%?

    I'm still chuckling at those predicting a No vote would cause an SNP implosion.
    We shall see.

    Still crying in your beer?
    Zinger!
    (not)

    So, no link then?
    Why do you think that the majority of Scots voted against independence?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207

    saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
    The more that is revealed about the fantasy world that Surbiton inhabits, the odder it gets.
    don't worry they get 50K for the other 2 days (see his other post)

  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    saddened said:

    surbiton said:

    Socrates said:

    antifrank said:

    Ishmael_X said:

    By the way: amazingly positive responses on BBC News just now from random and mixed people in Northampton, who were also extremely well informed.

    It WILL come down to the economy. The only reason immigration matters is that some people think it affects their economic well-being. It's bugger all to do with anything else. Put crudely, white van man likes his tikka masala.

    You think tikka massala, or any other significant ethnic food, is made or sold by first generation immigrants (or in other words, immigrants)?

    You probably do.
    I do:

    http://www.workpermit.com/news/2013-12-05/uk-prime-minister-says-asian-chefs-will-be-able-to-come-to-uk
    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.
    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !
    Seriously?

    http://www.gumtree.com/chef-de-partie-jobs/london/monday+to+friday
    You do know that a restaurant is open 7 days a week ! Who will cook the other 2 days ? Fairy godmother ?
    chestnut said:

    surbiton said:


    Try to get a chef born in the UK for less than £50k in London !

    I personally know ones working for half that at 5* hotels with £200 a pop restaurants.

    In London ? Does anybody eat in there ?
    You're just embarrassing yourself now.
    Yeah, but it is hugely amusing for the rest of us.
  • What were the two or three most important issues in deciding on how you voted?

    57% of no voters, it was the pound

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Lord-Ashcroft-Polls-Referendum-day-poll-summary-1409191.pdf
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    TGOHF said:

    George claimed we were the fastest growing major economy.

    He didn't.
    How do you manage to get everything wrong?

    "Today, in the last Autumn Statement of this Parliament, I present a forecast that shows the UK is the fastest growing of any major advanced economy in the world

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/autumn-statement-2014-george-osbornes-speech-in-full--see-the-word-cloud-9901045.html

  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    How? Stamp duty ( I assume you mean ) is a tax on a transaction. No transaction, no tax.

    I would say this removal of the "slab tax" should've been done years ago, and both parties are guilty of letting this idiocy fester. I probably got stuffed by about 5k in recent times because of it, but on the bright side a close relative buying a house is over 3.5k better off today - and he's well chuffed.
  • George Osborne was impressive today. Food for thought.

    We'll see how it all stacks up once the figures are unpicked. Either way, he's a very smooth operator. I'd be interested in backing him as next Tory leader, possibly over May or Boris.
  • FrancisUrquhartFrancisUrquhart Posts: 82,507
    edited December 2014
    I see the Guardian are screaming CUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTSSSSS...apparently 1930 style cuts are on their way. And Mirror claim he had a stinker.

    Not fans of Georgey boys budget, i mean autumn statement.
  • glw said:

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    GO is taxing the rich, Ed Balls wants to tax granny.
    The logic is that you tax at the point of transaction or, in case of income tax or VAT, point of payment, or in case of CGT the point of sale. The problem with the mansion tax is that it introduces something new - a ground rent on property - a tax on ownership rather than at point of transaction. IMHO, as I have said before, the issue is that by doing this you are changing the tax system in a major way that could have ramifications over the long term. I'm all for the rich shouldering a bit more of the burden, but I remain to be convinced that mansion tax is the way to do it.
  • welshowlwelshowl Posts: 4,464

    glw said:

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    GO is taxing the rich, Ed Balls wants to tax granny.
    The logic is that you tax at the point of transaction or, in case of income tax or VAT, point of payment, or in case of CGT the point of sale. The problem with the mansion tax is that it introduces something new - a ground rent on property - a tax on ownership rather than at point of transaction. IMHO, as I have said before, the issue is that by doing this you are changing the tax system in a major way that could have ramifications over the long term. I'm all for the rich shouldering a bit more of the burden, but I remain to be convinced that mansion tax is the way to do it.
    Quite so.
  • ArtistArtist Posts: 1,893
    Alan Titchmarsh is the latest celebrity to come out against the mansion tax. (front page of Mirror)
  • Tim_BTim_B Posts: 7,669
    Another controversial Grand Jury decision today - this time in New York over Eric Garner, selling loose cigarattes on the street. He died after being placed in a chokehold by a police officer.

    The Ferguson grand jury decision, after reading the evidence, I'm comfortable with.

    This one is diffferent - and the event is on videotape - not so much. Do we really want a death sentence for selling loose cigarettes?

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/04/nyregion/grand-jury-said-to-bring-no-charges-in-staten-island-chokehold-death-of-eric-garner.html?_r=0
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    1 USAGRUNT ‏@1usagrunt 1h1 hour ago
    Over 8,000 Christians massacred and 700,000 displaced by devout Muslims in Nigeria http://wp.me/p2CcQu-8WC via @TheMuslimIssue
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    Thank God you've retired from the NHS.
    Highly recommended

    Gives you plenty of time to work out how many seats each party would get if the results of polls were replicated at GE2015

    and who would be PM
  • What were the two or three most important issues in deciding on how you voted?

    57% of no voters, it was the pound

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Lord-Ashcroft-Polls-Referendum-day-poll-summary-1409191.pdf

    How many of them were among the 62% that were always going to vote no?
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Artist said:

    Alan Titchmarsh is the latest celebrity to come out against the mansion tax. (front page of Mirror)

    Excellent
  • Most of the fieldwork for tonight's YouGov would have been conducted before the Autumn statement, so I wouldn't read too much into either way tonight
  • What were the two or three most important issues in deciding on how you voted?

    57% of no voters, it was the pound

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Lord-Ashcroft-Polls-Referendum-day-poll-summary-1409191.pdf

    That doesn't look good for Unionists in the long-term. A majority under 54 favoured the Nats and it was only the oldies that swing it.

    Also depressing that so few Scottish NO voters voted that way because of identity with the UK's history and traditions. I thought it'd be far higher than in the 20s.
  • saddenedsaddened Posts: 2,245

    George introduces mansion tax a year early

    No whinging from PB Tories?

    Thank God you've retired from the NHS.
    Highly recommended

    Gives you plenty of time to work out how many seats each party would get if the results of polls were replicated at GE2015

    and who would be PM
    Hopefully you had a better understanding of your previous admin job (by admin job I obviously mean 30 years of sacrifice to the NHS), than you do about what the polls are indicating.
  • All the left leaning media are focusing on the "massive" cuts programmed in by George. I kinda of wonder if he doesn't mind that. I mean we have had 4 years of those same voices telling us the world will end due to cuts and it hasn't happened. The boy that cried wolf and all that. Also, the question then becomes, well what would Labour do, given they say they will basically follow general George's plans on borrowing.
  • MikeLMikeL Posts: 7,723
    YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Tories take one-point lead, Lib Dems fall to fifth: CON 32%, LAB 31%, LD 6%, UKIP 17%, GRN 7%
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    Sun Politics @Sun_Politics

    YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Tories take one-point lead, Lib Dems fall to fifth: CON 32%, LAB 31%, LD 6%, UKIP 17%, GRN 7%

  • What were the two or three most important issues in deciding on how you voted?

    57% of no voters, it was the pound

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Lord-Ashcroft-Polls-Referendum-day-poll-summary-1409191.pdf

    How many of them were among the 62% that were always going to vote no?
    I'm off to bed now, so don't have the energy to work it out now, will look at it over the weekend, but you can extrapolate from the full data tables here

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/LORD-ASHCROFT-POLLS-Post-referendum-poll-tables-Sept-2014.pdf
  • Scrapheap_as_wasScrapheap_as_was Posts: 10,069
    edited December 2014
    MikeL said:

    YouGov/Sun poll tonight - Tories take one-point lead, Lib Dems fall to fifth: CON 32%, LAB 31%, LD 6%, UKIP 17%, GRN 7%

    A handy starting point for tomorrow... will we see a bigger Tory lead than the odd 1% ones we've been seeing more and more....

    Will Bobby Sol be back up front on Saturday...

    Will Chelsea complete their usual double over Spurs in a few short weeks.

    At least one is a cert.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    Charles said:

    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:



    Keith Vaz is a numpty. If a job is paid less than £30k a year (and I think he's got his numbers wrong on that anyway) you can definitely train someone up in the UK to do it.

    Not following the logic. You say that anything paid less than £30K is definitely easy to learn?

    Anecdotally, in the specific case, I talked last year to an Asian restaurant manager who said he'd made a deliberate attempt to recruit non-Asian cooks to save the hassle of getting visas - he only asked that they should have general cooking experience, and offered to train them in Asian food - but got only two applicants, who gave up after a week and a fortnight respectively. "They just found it outside their comfort zone," he said.
    Why not train up people without cooking experience? It's only whipping up a balti, it's hardly rocket science.

    And it sounds like the work conditions weren't great either.
    Now try working long hours, in an overheated kitchen, and whipping up 30 meals in 30 minutes, each perfectly cooked and in line with the whims of the customer

    "It's only a balti" understates the skill and dedication of our service sector workers
    It's a very rare curry house that whips up 30 meals in 30 minutes. Most only have a dozen or two tables.
  • Danny565Danny565 Posts: 8,091

    All the left leaning media are focusing on the "massive" cuts programmed in by George. I kinda of wonder if he doesn't mind that. I mean we have had 4 years of those same voices telling us the world will end due to cuts and it hasn't happened. The boy that cried wolf and all that. Also, the question then becomes, well what would Labour do, given they say they will basically follow general George's plans on borrowing.

    60% of the public say they think 5 years more of cuts are unnecessary, according to Ashcroft.

    That said, your second point is pertinent: Labour still don't seem to have realised they can't (justifiably) complain about the harshness of Tory economic policies when they're committed to the same policies.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548

    What were the two or three most important issues in deciding on how you voted?

    57% of no voters, it was the pound

    http://lordashcroftpolls.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Lord-Ashcroft-Polls-Referendum-day-poll-summary-1409191.pdf

    How many of them were among the 62% that were always going to vote no?
    Why did the others decide to vote no? Was it Salmonds smug visage? The unconvincing economics? The lack of a real defence policy? Or the lack of a viable currency?

    Personally, I think the currency was critical, but possibly you are right and the Scottish public saw through another part of Salmonds bluff and bluster.
This discussion has been closed.