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  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Speedy said:

    This is interesting:
    Liverpool Echo ‏@LivEchonews 2h2 hours ago
    Ukip's Paul Nuttall says party has set its sights on Southport win

    I've been to Southport many times, it's a lovely coastal town in the summer, much cleaner and with more open spaces than Blackpool.
    It's demographics are old, very old, and very white, and relatively wealthy.
    Although a Liberal stronghold since I don't know when, UKIP did do well locally there last May.

    UKIP's candidate is also a local Mike Smithson lookalike:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iA6jI6MYvQ0

    Thanks for this, I didn't know UKIP had selected a candidate yet.
  • chestnutchestnut Posts: 7,341
    edited November 2014
    Scott_P said:

    @tnewtondunn: EXCL: Tories will stay in power at the general election six months from tomorrow, Brits now think - YouGov/Sun poll http://t.co/Uy3Zi3yAnz

    The wisdom of the crowd.

    It's been obvious in his personal polling for years that the electorate will not elect Miliband.

  • HughHugh Posts: 955
    Speedy said:

    This is interesting:
    Liverpool Echo ‏@LivEchonews 2h2 hours ago
    Ukip's Paul Nuttall says party has set its sights on Southport win

    I've been to Southport many times, it's a lovely coastal town in the summer, much cleaner and with more open spaces than Blackpool.
    It's demographics are old, very old, and very white, and relatively wealthy.
    Although a Liberal stronghold since I don't know when, UKIP did do well locally there last May.

    UKIP's candidate is also a local Mike Smithson lookalike:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iA6jI6MYvQ0

    Southport's lovely. Though as you say, the Mails and Expresses fly out the shops to tottering pearl necklaced bigots.

    Still can't see UKIP winning there.
  • HughHugh Posts: 955

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Yet immigration is an even bigger issue where there isn't much immigration. But lots of Daily Mails.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness".

    Going well then...
  • JonnyJimmyJonnyJimmy Posts: 2,548
    Research team responsible for the latest report on the effects of immigration might contain one or two, or seventeen or eighteen out of twenty, immigrants
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    @Speedy.

    It's a shame tim isn't about. I would guess that a Scouse wine merchant would know Southport well, and be able to comment on how nice the place is and what the chances of UKIP winning there are.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited November 2014

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Some people live in an area of high immigration AND have done a bit of white flight!

    Not all immigrants are the same.. some leave their home land and do well enough abroad to send their kids to posh fee paying schools.. even if sadly these elite establishments are mainly the kind that don't mix immigrant kids with the natives

    Some even let their missus earn all the dough! #progressive
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Hugh said:

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Yet immigration is an even bigger issue where there isn't much immigration. But lots of Daily Mails.
    Isn't big issue where you live ? I wonder why that could be.

  • TapestryTapestry Posts: 153

    Floater said:

    Tapestry said:

    The planes crashing into the towers were not all you imagine either.
    http://tapnewswire.com/2010/11/planes-hitting-twin-towers-were-computer-graphics/

    LMAO - oh dear.

    Of course tapestry, of course.... slowly backs away........

    I remember when the claim was KC135's with laser pods.... happy days......
    Tapestry has also claimed it involved military drones, and separately, the HAARP weather manipulator cum death ray.
    Not military drones, Watcher.

    http://youtu.be/SHcUl3iJQUY
  • bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 22,736
    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:

    And that's just in one town. Across the country there are probably THOUSANDS of Muslims that have got a huge kick out of gang-raping white children, torturing them through things like petrol-dousing and branding irons, and threatening to kill their parents if they tell anyone. And they're all walking around laughing at the rest of us that our government won't look into the matter properly, because they're scared of being called racist.

    Where have you picked up the TENS OF THOUSANDS thing?
    You have edited your post I see
    I took it out because it probably can't be sustained, but I still think a five figure number is very possible. There were 250 rapists named by one girl in Rotherham. Let's say there were perhaps 100 more that raped her and she didn't know/remember, or that raped other girls (out of the 1400) but not this one. So 350 in Rotherham.

    We know of about 25 towns where this model of abuse has happened through convictions so far. If we say there's another 5 where a conviction hasn't happened yet (highly possible given the number of Pakistani communities around the country), then that's 30 tows. 30 times 350 is more than ten thousand.
    At 10.43 you said there were TENS OF THOUSANDS of Muslims that have got a huge kick out of gang-raping white children, torturing them through things like petrol-dousing and branding irons, and threatening to kill their parents if they tell anyone. And they're all walking around laughing at the rest of us,

    I think what happened in Rotherham is terrible but you are exaggerating the numbers involved IMO
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    What's the name of the UKIP candidate in Southport?
  • Tonights YG EICIPM

    It's possible - it's probable in fact on tonights you gov. But I think labour will both lose vote share in an election campaign and underperform on the day. So I suspect EIC will never be PM
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    Research team responsible for the latest report on the effects of immigration might contain one or two, or seventeen or eighteen out of twenty, immigrants

    It was an entirely biased piece of research that ignored immigrants from before 2001 to take out the oldies, and then report it's results headlining on the EU migrants, when the much bigger number was the huge cost to the Treasury of non-EU migrants.
  • TapestryTapestry Posts: 153
    And while we're at it, here's that Pentagon 'plane' too from 9/11
    http://youtu.be/YphhhR47JiU
  • HughHugh Posts: 955

    Hugh said:

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Yet immigration is an even bigger issue where there isn't much immigration. But lots of Daily Mails.
    Isn't big issue where you live ? I wonder why that could be.

    Because where I live people aren't gnarled old pub bores blaming everyone but themselves for their bitterness and selling golliwogs in their run down seaside souvenir shops to show how "un PC" they are.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    Hugh said:

    Speedy said:

    This is interesting:
    Liverpool Echo ‏@LivEchonews 2h2 hours ago
    Ukip's Paul Nuttall says party has set its sights on Southport win

    I've been to Southport many times, it's a lovely coastal town in the summer, much cleaner and with more open spaces than Blackpool.
    It's demographics are old, very old, and very white, and relatively wealthy.
    Although a Liberal stronghold since I don't know when, UKIP did do well locally there last May.

    UKIP's candidate is also a local Mike Smithson lookalike:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iA6jI6MYvQ0

    Southport's lovely. Though as you say, the Mails and Expresses fly out the shops to tottering pearl necklaced bigots.

    Still can't see UKIP winning there.
    Lots of LD votes up for grabs, it's not a red liberal seat, more classic liberal.
    Also UKIP came second just 9% behind the LD last May in Southport.
    Though I will be surprised if UKIP win, a strong second is the most probable outcome.
  • Good evening, scouts. I hope we enjoyed the fireworks
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:

    And that's just in one town. Across the country there are probably THOUSANDS of Muslims that have got a huge kick out of gang-raping white children, torturing them through things like petrol-dousing and branding irons, and threatening to kill their parents if they tell anyone. And they're all walking around laughing at the rest of us that our government won't look into the matter properly, because they're scared of being called racist.

    Where have you picked up the TENS OF THOUSANDS thing?
    You have edited your post I see
    I took it out because it probably can't be sustained, but I still think a five figure number is very possible. There were 250 rapists named by one girl in Rotherham. Let's say there were perhaps 100 more that raped her and she didn't know/remember, or that raped other girls (out of the 1400) but not this one. So 350 in Rotherham.

    We know of about 25 towns where this model of abuse has happened through convictions so far. If we say there's another 5 where a conviction hasn't happened yet (highly possible given the number of Pakistani communities around the country), then that's 30 tows. 30 times 350 is more than ten thousand.
    At 10.43 you said there were TENS OF THOUSANDS of Muslims that have got a huge kick out of gang-raping white children, torturing them through things like petrol-dousing and branding irons, and threatening to kill their parents if they tell anyone. And they're all walking around laughing at the rest of us,

    I think what happened in Rotherham is terrible but you are exaggerating the numbers involved IMO
    I actually reconsidered my claim and edited it before you said anything, to be more conservative with numbers.

    But I really suspect it is higher than I am claiming. If we had a full nationwide investigation, we would be able to know. But the government is resisting it for entirely this reason: if the true numbers came out, there would be a national uproar. So they're sweeping it under the carpet. They'll have the child abuse inquiry into the authorities' response and then claim that's enough, without any actual investigation of the grooming gangs operating throughout the country.

    It is a sick, evil decision made by a decadent and corrupt political class.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    AndyJS said:

    What's the name of the UKIP candidate in Southport?

    Terry Durrance.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Speedy said:

    AndyJS said:

    What's the name of the UKIP candidate in Southport?

    Terry Durrance.
    Thanks.
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    Hugh said:

    Hugh said:

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from
    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Yet immigration is an even bigger issue where there isn't much immigration. But lots of Daily Mails.
    Isn't big issue where you live ? I wonder why that could be.

    Because where I live people aren't gnarled old pub bores blaming everyone but themselves for their bitterness and selling golliwogs in their run down seaside souvenir shops to show how "un PC" they are.
    Lol. This whole lets go back to 1950 when the future was bright and white is frankly becoming ridiculous and boring. We are where we are - it can't be undone.
  • HughHugh Posts: 955
    It is a sick, evil decision made by a decadent and corrupt political class.

    Jawohl
  • TGOHFTGOHF Posts: 21,633
    AndyJS said:

    What's the name of the UKIP candidate in Southport?

    Eugene Terrablanche ?
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    Speedy said:

    Socrates said:

    @SeanT

    You should do a column on this by the way:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/11211018/You-dont-frighten-me-Jean-Claude-Juncker-taunts-David-Cameron.html

    It hasn't got as much news attention as it clearly should.

    Is this humiliating or not?
    It's completely humiliating. Juncker has claimed he's not bothered by Cameron, implying that Cameron will back down. If Cameron now returns with his tail between his legs, having backed down on both free movement and paying most of the £1.7 billion, it will be quite clear he cares more about his boss in Brussels than his electorate in the UK.
  • Tapestry said:

    And while we're at it, here's that Pentagon 'plane' too from 9/11
    http://youtu.be/YphhhR47JiU

    Conspiracy theories appear to be popular today. I logged in earlier and had to depart when Lucky Guy was critiquing the official account of 9/11.
  • Scott_P said:

    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness"..

    Ed M does seem to be surrounding himself with cronies.

    Regular readers might have noticed that I'm no fan of Gordon Brown, but he did make one quite extraordinarily bold and effective move which must have been quite outside his comfort zone, namely bringing back Lord Mandelson and given him a pretty free rein. I suspect this move saved dozens of Labour seats.

    Ed grips his comfort blanket and winds himself even deeper into it.
  • foxinsoxukfoxinsoxuk Posts: 23,548
    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:

    And that's just in one town. Across the country there are probably THOUSANDS of Muslims that have got a huge kick out of gang-raping white children, torturing them through things like petrol-dousing and branding irons, and threatening to kill their parents if they tell anyone. And they're all walking around laughing at the rest of us that our government won't look into the matter properly, because they're scared of being called racist.

    Where have you picked up the TENS OF THOUSANDS thing?
    You have edited your post I see
    I took it out because it probably can't be sustained, but I still think a five figure number is very possible. There were 250 rapists named by one girl in Rotherham. Let's say there were perhaps 100 more that raped her and she didn't know/remember, or that raped other girls (out of the 1400) but not this one. So 350 in Rotherham.

    We know of about 25 towns where this model of abuse has happened through convictions so far. If we say there's another 5 where a conviction hasn't happened yet (highly possible given the number of Pakistani communities around the country), then that's 30 tows. 30 times 350 is more than ten thousand.
    The girls were trafficked across the North; we simply do not know where most of the abusers came from. It is quite possible that the same few hundred men were/are abusing othef girls in Rochdale, Oldham, Keighley, Manchester, Derby etc. Or it might be different men. We simply do not know until a proper forensic investigation is done.

    But even that is only part of the story. While these men are clearly dangerous to white girls, it is very unlikely that they suddenly turn into model husbands and brothers when they get home. We have not even scratched thd surface of how much abuse goes on within communities.

    Read Ruzwana Bashirs article and weep:

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/aug/29/-sp-untold-story-culture-of-shame-ruzwana-bashir?CMP=share_btn_tw

    It is not Liberal or Progressive to tolerate male abuse of a patriachal system.
  • HughHugh Posts: 955

    Scott_P said:

    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness"..

    Ed M does seem to be surrounding himself with cronies.

    Regular readers might have noticed that I'm no fan of Gordon Brown, but he did make one quite extraordinarily bold and effective move which must have been quite outside his comfort zone, namely bringing back Lord Mandelson and given him a pretty free rein. I suspect this move saved dozens of Labour seats.

    Ed grips his comfort blanket and winds himself even deeper into it.
    How's Andrew Lansley's stellar career going?
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    Hugh said:

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Yet immigration is an even bigger issue where there isn't much immigration. But lots of Daily Mails.
    I do like pro-immigration shills making complete fools of themselves.

    They seem to understand the concept of people emigrating from thousands of miles away, but seem to find the idea of natives moving from the city to the suburbs/countryside incredible.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    Hugh said:

    It is a sick, evil decision made by a decadent and corrupt political class.

    Jawohl

    Are you suggesting I'm a Nazi?
  • Scott_P said:

    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness"..

    Ed M does seem to be surrounding himself with cronies.

    Regular readers might have noticed that I'm no fan of Gordon Brown, but he did make one quite extraordinarily bold and effective move which must have been quite outside his comfort zone, namely bringing back Lord Mandelson and given him a pretty free rein. I suspect this move saved dozens of Labour seats.

    Ed grips his comfort blanket and winds himself even deeper into it.
    The irony is that despite having seen the damage cowardice and complacency did to his brother's leadership ambitions EdM's leadership has been based on cowardice and complacency.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited November 2014
    Socrates said:

    @Speedy.

    It's a shame tim isn't about. I would guess that a Scouse wine merchant would know Southport well, and be able to comment on how nice the place is and what the chances of UKIP winning there are.

    I'm not a living in Southport unfortunately, however I've been there many times since the 90's.
    It's like a mini version of Blackpool but without the decaying hotels and the tower, it really looks like a wealthy liberal area.
    If my memory serves me well, the town centre has retained it's victorian looks and most of the town is actually separated from the sea by a series of lagoons, and the sandy beach extends all the way to Liverpool.
    There is of course lots of pressure for vast real estate developments in the area and equal counter pressure by the locals who don't want to spoil it's looks.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    TGOHF said:



    Lol. This whole lets go back to 1950 when the future was bright and white is frankly becoming ridiculous and boring. We are where we are - it can't be undone.

    We can stop making it worse.
  • Southport sounds lovely. Sandy beaches, and the lovely sea for a hot camel to splash about in. Much like home, but with more skulking Scousers than we have over here. They do get around don't they - a bit like lice.
  • HughHugh Posts: 955
    Socrates said:

    Hugh said:

    It is a sick, evil decision made by a decadent and corrupt political class.

    Jawohl

    Are you suggesting I'm a Nazi?
    Naturlich nicht
  • Socrates said:

    Speedy said:

    Socrates said:

    @SeanT

    You should do a column on this by the way:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/11211018/You-dont-frighten-me-Jean-Claude-Juncker-taunts-David-Cameron.html

    It hasn't got as much news attention as it clearly should.

    Is this humiliating or not?
    It's completely humiliating. Juncker has claimed he's not bothered by Cameron, implying that Cameron will back down. If Cameron now returns with his tail between his legs, having backed down on both free movement and paying most of the £1.7 billion, it will be quite clear he cares more about his boss in Brussels than his electorate in the UK.
    You Kippers have a weird perspective. What on earth is humiliating about Cameron being shown to have been right in his opposition to Juncker's appointment? No doubt our EU partners will be thinking that maybe Cameron had a point - Mr Juncker is showing himself to be totally unsuited to a job which requires, above all things, diplomacy and an appreciation of the dynamics of the relationships between EU states and between governments and the EU institutions.
  • TapestryTapestry Posts: 153
    I give you five videos each proving in a different way that the whole 9/11 official version is bunkum, and you still call it 'conspiracy theory'? Here are facts. The government is the conspiracy, no theory required.
  • Hugh said:

    How's Andrew Lansley's stellar career going?

    I've no idea.

    Is this an entry for the most irrelevant PB comment of 2014? If so, I'm afraid there is some strong competition.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    @TGOHF posted - Lol. This whole lets go back to 1950 when the future was bright and white is frankly becoming ridiculous and boring. We are where we are - it can't be undone.

    I agree,but I want people like Hughie to join our rainbow nation,the man gives it big on more mass immigration and lives a life well away from it.

    Bring mass immigration on,has long has everyone shares in it.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    Socrates said:

    Speedy said:

    Socrates said:

    @SeanT

    You should do a column on this by the way:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/11211018/You-dont-frighten-me-Jean-Claude-Juncker-taunts-David-Cameron.html

    It hasn't got as much news attention as it clearly should.

    Is this humiliating or not?
    It's completely humiliating. Juncker has claimed he's not bothered by Cameron, implying that Cameron will back down. If Cameron now returns with his tail between his legs, having backed down on both free movement and paying most of the £1.7 billion, it will be quite clear he cares more about his boss in Brussels than his electorate in the UK.
    You Kippers have a weird perspective. What on earth is humiliating about Cameron being shown to have been right in his opposition to Juncker's appointment? No doubt our EU partners will be thinking that maybe Cameron had a point - Mr Juncker is showing himself to be totally unsuited to a job which requires, above all things, diplomacy and an appreciation of the dynamics of the relationships between EU states and between governments and the EU institutions.
    I supported Cameron on his reaction to Juncker's appointment, for the record.

    It won't be humiliating if Cameron responds boldly to Juncker, with a clear points system for EU migration (or at least an emergency brake), and a refusal to pay a penny of the shakedown. If Cameron responds to Juncker's "I'm not scared" taunts by backing down on both issues THAT will be humiliating.
  • Socrates said:


    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.

    What's the very-different-looking equivalent number without the 2001 cut-off? I couldn't work it out from the Migration Watch site, because they seem to want to mix it in with a bunch of other adjustments they want to make.

    I'd be a bit surprised if it made a big difference, since most of the poorer countries that generated a lot of immigration didn't join the EU until 2004 or later, and I'd have thought immigration from the western European countries before that had a more similar demographic profile to the people already in Britain. Are there a bunch of Irish people retiring to the south coast or something?
  • The irony is that despite having seen the damage cowardice and complacency did to his brother's leadership ambitions EdM's leadership has been based on cowardice and complacency.

    Complacency yes, but I'm not sure cowardice is correct. I think that Ed truly believes in himself, that he thinks he's doing everything right. It's why he'll be, if he becomes PM, such an unmitigated disaster.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    Hugh said:

    How's Andrew Lansley's stellar career going?

    I've no idea.

    Is this an entry for the most irrelevant PB comment of 2014? If so, I'm afraid there is some strong competition.
    You know I've completely forgotten about even the existence of Andrew Lansley.
    He must have been buried into a desert hole by the coalition long ago.
  • Scott_P said:

    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness".

    Going well then...

    From the Beeb's report:

    Ms Powell, who was previously an education spokeswoman, said shadow ministers "need to be more visible and I will enable them to do that" in her role - previously held by Mr Dugher.

    She added: "I am going to get Ed Miliband out there more because he is a fantastic asset out in the country meeting people directly and talking to people directly, not seeing things through the prism of the media down here [in London], who do not always give him the best ride."


    Can't wait.
  • Ishmael_XIshmael_X Posts: 3,664
    Socrates said:

    Hugh said:

    It is a sick, evil decision made by a decadent and corrupt political class.

    Jawohl

    Are you suggesting I'm a Nazi?
    What he is, is a prat. Look down thread for the revelation that he doesn't understand, or believe, the statement that the evidence for the health effects of smoking is statistical. Just as one example. So just ignore.

  • hunchmanhunchman Posts: 2,591
    So much deluded nonsense on AGW from Hugh and others here tonight. I'm quite happy to take anyone on on this subject any place any time. The deceit of the MSM seemingly knows no bounds. Now it needs a bone chillingly snowy cold winter here to shut up a great number of people here. Already a lot of snow in the northern hemisphere this winter, which simply isn't reported on the MSM:

    http://iceagenow.info/

    We stand on the verge of a Dalton minima mini-ice age, thanks to the 300 year cycle of the sun, and this one looks as though it will be cooler than the Maunder minimum from 1640-1715. It won't be good news for agriculture for sure.

    And I'm still waiting for an apology from the BBC when they stated categorically that the Arctic would be ice free in 7 years time back in 2007. Arctic sea ice is on the rise, following behind the rising sea ice cover around Antartica. The southern hemisphere always leads, and the northern hemisphere is now starting to follow.
  • HughHugh Posts: 955
    the man gives it big on more mass immigration and lives a life well away from it.

    This is another pernicious trend from the far right.

    Anyone who doesn't join in the nasty anti-immigrant chorus just doesn't understand what real life is like.

    So say ex-Tory, ex-City banker UKIP types. So repeat privately educated, highly paid suburban dwelling journalists who work for super-rich foreign exiled media moguls.
  • Scott_P said:

    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness".

    Going well then...

    From the Beeb's report:

    Ms Powell, who was previously an education spokeswoman, said shadow ministers "need to be more visible and I will enable them to do that" in her role - previously held by Mr Dugher.

    She added: "I am going to get Ed Miliband out there more because he is a fantastic asset out in the country meeting people directly and talking to people directly, not seeing things through the prism of the media down here [in London], who do not always give him the best ride."


    Can't wait.
    Yes, great idea. Ed out there meeting ordinary people should provide a wealth of photo-opportunities
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Ninoinoz said:

    Hugh said:

    Hugh said:

    SeanT said:

    Hugh said:

    Socrates said:

    SeanT said:

    Oh god. Yawn. Climate change?

    Can't we talk about immigration instead?

    That UCL analysis, much lauded by let-em-all-in-liberals, identifying the *benefits* of immigration, also, rather quietly, says this:


    "Immigrants from outside the EU cost Britain almost £120 BILLION over 17 years"

    What's more, there was no year in this period when Britain benefited, financially, from non-EU immigration. Not one single year. "Non-EU migrants took more from the public purse, than they contributed, in each of the 17 years".

    Still, we get all that free childcare from Rotherham taxi drivers, so maybe there are uncosted benefits to native Brits.

    Migration Watch have also pointed out that they cut off the analysis to exclude EU immigrants from 2001. Unsurprisingly, the ones that got here earlier are older than the post-2001 group, and as a result claim more pensions and healthcare. The numbers look very different when you include all EU migrants.
    Ahh, MigrationWatch. A thoroughly nasty and grubby anti-immigration pressure group, who along with UKIP and other far-right bigots, for example those who obsess about Muslims and immigrants on message boards, particularly when there are crimes involved, are setting race relations back 60 years.

    All very pleasant.
    Have you actually got a point to make, and to prove, or are you just frothing at your laptop in your personal Emirate of Idiocy?
    It's OK for you posh metropolitan Establishment types, some of are actually at the sharp end of the increasing racism, xenophobia and fearmongering that some quarters are stoking.
    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..
    Yet immigration is an even bigger issue where there isn't much immigration. But lots of Daily Mails.
    I do like pro-immigration shills making complete fools of themselves.

    They seem to understand the concept of people emigrating from thousands of miles away, but seem to find the idea of natives moving from the city to the suburbs/countryside incredible.

    You made a fool over yourself last night pal over india,couldn't believe you gave that as a example - lol
  • Hugh said:

    How's Andrew Lansley's stellar career going?

    I've no idea.

    Is this an entry for the most irrelevant PB comment of 2014? If so, I'm afraid there is some strong competition.
    He's mistaking you for Cousin Seth.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    The irony is that despite having seen the damage cowardice and complacency did to his brother's leadership ambitions EdM's leadership has been based on cowardice and complacency.

    Complacency yes, but I'm not sure cowardice is correct. I think that Ed truly believes in himself, that he thinks he's doing everything right. It's why he'll be, if he becomes PM, such an unmitigated disaster.
    Lets see if he can defeat the SNP surge in scotland, if he does then he might not be that disaster you think he'll be.
    Anyone beating the SNP deserves in my opinion a medal.
  • Hugh said:

    How's Andrew Lansley's stellar career going?

    I've no idea.

    Is this an entry for the most irrelevant PB comment of 2014? If so, I'm afraid there is some strong competition.
    He's mistaking you for Cousin Seth.
    Ah, yes. That makes sense.
  • Speedy said:


    Lets see if he can defeat the SNP surge in scotland, if he does then he might not be that disaster you think he'll be.
    Anyone beating the SNP deserves in my opinion a medal.

    He's not showing much sign of defeating the SNP surge so far.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100

    Scott_P said:

    @GuidoFawkes: Shad Cab member raging about "cronyism". Talks of "huge kick off over Powell promotion." Creagh said to be "raging" at "wilderness".

    Going well then...

    From the Beeb's report:

    Ms Powell, who was previously an education spokeswoman, said shadow ministers "need to be more visible and I will enable them to do that" in her role - previously held by Mr Dugher.

    She added: "I am going to get Ed Miliband out there more because he is a fantastic asset out in the country meeting people directly and talking to people directly, not seeing things through the prism of the media down here [in London], who do not always give him the best ride."


    Can't wait.
    Yes, great idea. Ed out there meeting ordinary people should provide a wealth of photo-opportunities
    I think it's best if Ed get's some experience in dealing with normal people in the outside, away from the cameras.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564



    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..

    Can't speak for Hugh, but I live in Holloway, which is multicultural to a fault. It's a nice place and people generally get along very well. Used to live in the posh bit of High Wycombe up the hill, surrounded by mono-ethnic bankers and horse-riders, and IMO it was dead boring, though I did like the deer who used to wander into the garden.

    Others might disagree. That's OK, we don't all have to live in the same place.
  • The irony is that despite having seen the damage cowardice and complacency did to his brother's leadership ambitions EdM's leadership has been based on cowardice and complacency.

    Complacency yes, but I'm not sure cowardice is correct. I think that Ed truly believes in himself, that he thinks he's doing everything right. It's why he'll be, if he becomes PM, such an unmitigated disaster.
    EdM only believes in himself because he's never had the courage to leave his comfort zone.

    If he did have the courage to experience more of the world he wouldn't be so complacent although he would be a better man and a better politician.
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited November 2014

    Speedy said:


    Lets see if he can defeat the SNP surge in scotland, if he does then he might not be that disaster you think he'll be.
    Anyone beating the SNP deserves in my opinion a medal.

    He's not showing much sign of defeating the SNP surge so far.
    It's only a month old.
    And I leave you with the guardian front page story about EU corruption in Kosovo, and also this:

    Sky News ‏@SkyNews 46m46 minutes ago
    MIRROR FRONT PAGE: "Coalition minister abused me when I was 14" #skypapers

    Goodnight.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    SeanT said:


    I think Socrates was (probably) wrong with his estimate of TENS of thousands of Muslim gang rapists. It is probably more like thousands.

    But given that an estimated 100-300 persistent rapists in Rotherham (tolerated by their own Pakistani Muslim community, see much evidence passim) caused 1400 mainly white children to be raped, multiple times, the reasonably extrapolated figures are still horrific.

    We have ample evidence Rotherham has been repeated in towns across the UK (Telford, Derby, High Wycombe, Rochdale, Bradford, Manchester, Coventry, Oxford, on and on and on). So we have a mathematical basis to work on.

    So. Here's the maths. 10,000 Pakistani Muslims living in Rotherham *culturally resulted in* 1400 raped white kids.

    There are maybe 1m Pakistani Muslims in the UK (figures are hard to pin down, it could be 1.5m). If Rotherham is repeated nationwide, then that means 140,000-200,000 raped white children.

    But of course Rotherham can't be repeated, can it? Everywhere? Who the F knows? Please tell us not. Trouble is, we don't have a proper nationwide inquiry, so we don't know.

    But even if we say Rotherham was unique, and the average must be reduced by an enormous 90%, nationwide, you still get a figure of fourteen thousand white children raped by Pakistani Muslims.

    14,000. 14,000 white British children persistently groomed, tortured and raped by racist Muslim gangs. On our watch.

    And that, as we have seen, is a deeply conservative estimate.

    One girl in Rotherham handed a list to the police of 250 men that raped her. And there were 1400 victims. Did everyone involved in those 1400 victims happen to rape that one girl? I struggle to believe so. There's bound to be at least 300 involved in the Rotherham scandal. As you say, 10,000 Muslims live in the place, so 300 out of 10,000 is 3%. 3% of your 1,000,000 figure is 30,000.
  • Speedy said:

    I think it's best if Ed get's some experience in dealing with normal people in the outside, away from the cameras.

    Certainly his minders will be of that view. The further away from the cameras, the better.
  • HughHugh Posts: 955

    Hugh said:

    How's Andrew Lansley's stellar career going?

    I've no idea.

    Is this an entry for the most irrelevant PB comment of 2014? If so, I'm afraid there is some strong competition.
    He's mistaking you for Cousin Seth.
    Ah, yes. That makes sense.
    Actually it was more that Cameron holds the gold medal for surrounding himself with chums and cronies, even worse than "The Master", and this led directly to Lansley coming up with his insane plan for the NHS that wrecked the Tories credibility on the issue for another generation.

    Without gormless Dave even knowing what he'd done until it was too late.

    But you kinda knew that.

    But yeah, it would have worked better on Seth.
  • Just looking at the new Shadow Cabinet, you have to say that they've not exactly set the world alight. True, the government front bench isn't that packed with big hitters but contrast with Blair's pre-1997 team:

    Tony Blair – Leader of Her Majesty's Most Loyal Opposition and Leader of the Labour Party
    John Prescott – Deputy Leader of Her Majesty's Most Loyal Opposition and Deputy Leader of the Labour Party
    Lord Richard – Leader of the Opposition in the House of Lords
    Donald Dewar – Labour Chief Whip in the House of Commons
    Lord Graham of Edmonton – Labour Chief Whip in the House of Lords
    Lord Irvine of Lairg – Shadow Lord Chancellor
    Gordon Brown – Shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer
    Robin Cook – Shadow Foreign Secretary
    Jack Straw – Shadow Home Secretary
    David Clark – Shadow Secretary of State for Defence
    David Blunkett – Shadow Secretary of State for Education and Employment
    Frank Dobson – Shadow Secretary of State for the Environment
    Harriet Harman – Shadow Secretary of State for Health
    Ann Taylor – Shadow Leader of the House of Commons
    Chris Smith – Shadow Secretary of State for Social Security
    Jack Cunningham – Shadow Secretary of State for National Heritage and Shadow Minister with special responsibility for the Information Superhighway
    Margaret Beckett – Shadow Secretary of State for Trade and IndustryAndrew Smith – Shadow Secretary of State for Transport
    George Robertson – Shadow Secretary of State for Scotland
    Ron Davies – Shadow Secretary of State for Wales
    Mo Mowlam – Shadow Secretary of State for Northern Ireland
    Clare Short – Shadow Minister for Overseas Development
    Gavin Strang – Shadow Minister of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food
    Derek Foster – Shadow Minister for the Citizen's Charter
    Tom Clarke – Shadow Minister for Disabled People's Rights

    Not all successes, it's true, but there are at least half a dozen who are bigger names than any member of the current shadow cabinet.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322



    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..

    Can't speak for Hugh, but I live in Holloway, which is multicultural to a fault. It's a nice place and people generally get along very well. Used to live in the posh bit of High Wycombe up the hill, surrounded by mono-ethnic bankers and horse-riders, and IMO it was dead boring, though I did like the deer who used to wander into the garden.

    Others might disagree. That's OK, we don't all have to live in the same place.
    77% of people want to reduce immigration though Nick. Don't you think the preferences of the 77% should be catered to more than the preferences of the small minority of people like you that prefer the multiculturalism?
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362
    Hugh said:

    the man gives it big on more mass immigration and lives a life well away from it.

    This is another pernicious trend from the far right.

    Anyone who doesn't join in the nasty anti-immigrant chorus just doesn't understand what real life is like.

    So say ex-Tory, ex-City banker UKIP types. So repeat privately educated, highly paid suburban dwelling journalists who work for super-rich foreign exiled media moguls.

    I'm not joining the anti immigrant chorus,I'm asking people like you Hughie to join our rainbow nation,then I would have more respect for you on the immigration debate.


  • FlightpathFlightpath Posts: 4,012
    SeanT said:

    Socrates said:

    Socrates said:

    And that's just in one town. Across our government won't look into the matter properly, because they're scared of being called racist.

    Where have you picked up the TENS OF THOUSANDS thing?
    You have edited your post I see
    I took it out because it probably can't be sustained, but I still think a five figure number is very possible. There were 250 rapists named by one girl in Rotherham. Let's say there were perhaps 100 more that raped her and she didn't know/remember, or that raped other girls (out of the 1400) but not this one. So 350 in Rotherham.

    We know of about 25 towns where this model of abuse has happened through convictions so far. If we say there's another 5 where a conviction hasn't happened yet (highly possible given the number of Pakistani communities around the country), then that's 30 tows. 30 times 350 is more than ten thousand.

    I think what happened in Rotherham is terrible but you are exaggerating the numbers involved IMO
    I think Socrates was (probably) wrong with his estimate of TENS of thousands of Muslim gang rapists. It is probably more like thousands.

    But given that an estimated 100-300 persistent rapists in Rotherham (tolerated by their own Pakistani Muslim community, see much evidence passim) caused 1400 mainly white children to be raped, multiple times, the reasonably extrapolated figures are still horrific.

    We have ample evidence Rotherham has been repeated in towns across the UK (Telford, Derby, High Wycombe, Rochdale, Bradford, Manchester, Coventry, Oxford, on and on and on). So we have a mathematical basis to work on.

    So. Here's the maths. 10,000 Pakistani Muslims living in Rotherham *culturally resulted in* 1400 raped white kids.

    There are maybe 1m Pakistani Muslims in the UK (figures are hard to pin down, it could be 1.5m). If Rotherham is repeated nationwide, then that means 140,000-200,000 raped white children.

    But of course Rotherham can't be repeated, can it? Everywhere? Who the F knows? Please tell us not. Trouble is, we don't have a proper nationwide inquiry, so we don't know.

    But even if we say Rotherham was unique, and the average must be reduced by an enormous 90%, nationwide, you still get a figure of fourteen thousand white children raped by Pakistani Muslims.

    14,000. 14,000 white British children persistently groomed, tortured and raped by racist Muslim gangs. On our watch.

    And that, as we have seen, is a deeply conservative estimate.

    Your statistics (let alone your assumptions) are so much garbage as to be verging on the criminal.
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322
    @FlightPath

    We wouldn't need these arbitrary assumptions if the government did a damn nationwide investigation on the biggest child rape scandal this country has ever seen.
  • Just looking at the new Shadow Cabinet, you have to say that they've not exactly set the world alight. True, the government front bench isn't that packed with big hitters but contrast with Blair's pre-1997 team.

    The current Shadow Cabinet is the weakest in the nearly 50 years I've been following politics. What makes it even more remarkable is how completely unprepared they are for government, at a time when (unlike many previous shadow cabinets) they might actually be in office in a few months' time. They don't even seem to be going through the motions of looking as though they are gearing up to take over departments.

    Perhaps this is unfair on the individuals concerned; maybe with a smidgen of leadership and some policy direction they would be quite different. It must be very hard to look all fired up to get into government ready to implement a blank sheet of paper.
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "THE UKIP Parliamentary Candidate for Cannock Chase, Grahame Wiggin, has today sent out a sharp warning to his rivals following the release of the Lord Ashcroft’s latest polls.

    It now seems more likely than ever that the Cannock Chase Parliamentary seat will be a three way contest next May when residents vote on who they wish to represent them.

    According to the polls, which were collected between 22 and 27 October, 34% of those polled in the Cannock Chase area would choose UKIP if given the chance to vote in a general election tomorrow.

    This is a lead of 3% over Labour and 6% on the Conservatives, the party currently in control of both the UK and also the Cannock area."


    http://www.cannockmercury.co.uk/8216-surprises-8217-declares-Cannock-Chase-UKIP/story-24198155-detail/story.html
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362



    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..

    Can't speak for Hugh, but I live in Holloway, which is multicultural to a fault. It's a nice place and people generally get along very well. Used to live in the posh bit of High Wycombe up the hill, surrounded by mono-ethnic bankers and horse-riders, and IMO it was dead boring, though I did like the deer who used to wander into the garden.

    Others might disagree. That's OK, we don't all have to live in the same place.
    Good for you nick,when you get back in power,you can finish the job of every part of the UK to be multicultural and multi-racial,then we won't have places been left out of our rainbow nation,the hughies of this world can't be left to feel left out.

  • Others might disagree. That's OK, we don't all have to live in the same place.

    With respect Nick, but that's bollocks. Some of us don't have so much choice where we get to live.

    Right now I'm living in one of the cheapest parts of Exeter. I don't get to choose to live in the bit where deer might wander past the end of the back garden because I can't afford it. Looking at house prices in Edinburgh where I expect I'll be moving soon, and I'm left to wonder whether deer are often found wondering around Sighthill, Wester Hailes or Musselburgh. I know they have a field of Shetland Ponies in Cramond, but somehow I think prices might be out of my reach there...
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564
    Socrates said:



    77% of people want to reduce immigration though Nick. Don't you think the preferences of the 77% should be catered to more than the preferences of the small minority of people like you that prefer the multiculturalism?

    Well, I was answering Tyke, who apparently believes that all middle-class lefties prefer to live in all-white areas. It's a mistake to generalise like that.

    To respond to your point, I favour what we've got, namely EU membership (which I think demonstrably does require free movement whether we like it or not) and a points system for non-EU nationals. I don't make a secret of it, or of my liking for multiculturalism, and people are free to vote for me or to vote for anyone else. On that point, as on most social issues (gay marriage and so on) I think the Conservative MP in my patch feels exactly the same as I do, but there's a UKIP candidate who probably disagrees. We'll see quite soon how he gets on.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "I want to see a British Asian Prime Minister, says David Cameron

    The Prime Minister tells an awards ceremony that he wants to see British Asians in positions of power 'not to fill quotas but to realise our full potential'"

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11212217/I-want-to-see-a-British-Asian-Prime-Minister-says-David-Cameron.html
  • SocratesSocrates Posts: 10,322

    Socrates said:



    77% of people want to reduce immigration though Nick. Don't you think the preferences of the 77% should be catered to more than the preferences of the small minority of people like you that prefer the multiculturalism?

    Well, I was answering Tyke, who apparently believes that all middle-class lefties prefer to live in all-white areas. It's a mistake to generalise like that.

    To respond to your point, I favour what we've got, namely EU membership (which I think demonstrably does require free movement whether we like it or not) and a points system for non-EU nationals. I don't make a secret of it, or of my liking for multiculturalism, and people are free to vote for me or to vote for anyone else. On that point, as on most social issues (gay marriage and so on) I think the Conservative MP in my patch feels exactly the same as I do, but there's a UKIP candidate who probably disagrees. We'll see quite soon how he gets on.

    What do you think your prospective constituents think about the current levels of immigration?
  • Socrates said:

    @FlightPath

    We wouldn't need these arbitrary assumptions if the government did a damn nationwide investigation on the biggest child rape scandal this country has ever seen.

    Notice that a PB Tory is more upset about what SeanT has calculated than he is about what happened and continues to happen in Rotherham.

    Or for that matter this government's non-action towards it.

    On the actual numbers issue I don't think you can take Rotherham as a stand-alone case. There will certainly be abusers who come from other places and likewise there will be more victims from similar socioeconomic districts in adjacent Sheffield.

    Its just that the authorities have so far managed to keep things quiet there, unlike in Rotherham.
  • TykejohnnoTykejohnno Posts: 7,362

    Socrates said:



    77% of people want to reduce immigration though Nick. Don't you think the preferences of the 77% should be catered to more than the preferences of the small minority of people like you that prefer the multiculturalism?

    Well, I was answering Tyke, who apparently believes that all middle-class lefties prefer to live in all-white areas. It's a mistake to generalise like that.

    To respond to your point, I favour what we've got, namely EU membership (which I think demonstrably does require free movement whether we like it or not) and a points system for non-EU nationals. I don't make a secret of it, or of my liking for multiculturalism, and people are free to vote for me or to vote for anyone else. On that point, as on most social issues (gay marriage and so on) I think the Conservative MP in my patch feels exactly the same as I do, but there's a UKIP candidate who probably disagrees. We'll see quite soon how he gets on.

    Nick,get it right,I was referring to Hughie on the white lefty middleclass types.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    I think Nuttall's just talking big because there's some conference on at the Floral Hall.

    The LDs are well dug in, and Pugh is a strong incumbent. Over the last few sets of council elections, while the LDs have been wiped out almost everywhere else in Sefton they have held virtually every seat within Southport constituency. Tories in the borough are in disarray.

    It's a very affluent place, big detached houses, long, long roads, beautifully kept. A beach where the tide never comes in, and sometimes stays out 10 miles, the furthest in Britain. Has very affluent urban villages; Ainsdale, Birkdale and Churchtown. Known as the "Geriatric Riviera" owing to the number of pensioners and retirement homes in the area. 97% White British.

    Nathaniel Hawthorne, who was billeted there during his period as consul in Liverpool, hated it (but he hated everything). Napoleon III spent part of his exile there, and is believed to have instructed Haussmann to rebuild Paris based on Lord Street, Southport.
    Kerensky's son later became borough engineer. Ribbentrop was supposed to have had a summer house there, during his period as ambassador to England, although I've not been able to nail that story with certainty...
  • IndigoIndigo Posts: 9,966
    dr_spyn said:

    ah, how predictable.

    Laurie Penny ‏@PennyRed 21m21 minutes ago
    I'm actually from Lewes. I grew up there and went to Bonfire Night every year. I'm appalled by the Salmond effigy. #LewesBonfire

    Hrm..

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurie_Penny
    Penny was born in London and grew up in Brighton.
  • JohnLoonyJohnLoony Posts: 1,790
    (FPT)

    He's welcome to tell me how aviation fuel or burning debris is capable of bringing down a steel framed skyscraper -I look forward to it.

    I refer the honourable member to the very good and informative documentary programme "Missing Evidence" on Channel 5 the other day, which explained how the explosive force of molten aluminium (three times as powerful as TNT, on an energy-output-per-unit-mass basis) was enough to cause the "explosion" sounds which were reported by numerous witnesses just before the collapse of the towers. The presence of 30 tonnes of aluminium from the bodies of the crashed planes within the building was not factored into the office-fire tests which were done by the official investigation.

    In other words, the programme helped to de-bunk some of the conspiracy theories.
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    SeanT said:



    The loathsomeness of the High Multiculti Left in one comment.

    Millionaire Labour ex-MP nephew of millionaire Tory admirals *dislikes* being FORCED to live in rich "boring" white British places, though he tolerates the deer, and on the whole he much prefers the millionaire-paradise of Switzerland, where they have referendums which ban minarets.

    These, by the way, are referendums of which he approves. Yet he also, simultaneously, thinks the British should not be allowed a referendum on EU membership, and he despises British patriotism, and finds it "mystifying".

    And this, dear reader, is the kind of millionaire c*nt who will decide YOUR immigration policy, impacting on the poorer parts of the UK, should you vote Labour.
    Yes, London is less than 50% White British and Nick LOVES living there.

    Which makes it all the stranger he wishes to work in parliament where one doubts there is a minority of White British working there, despite its being in London.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    SeanT said:



    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..

    Can't speak for Hugh, but I live in Holloway, which is multicultural to a fault. It's a nice place and people generally get along very well. Used to live in the posh bit of High Wycombe up the hill, surrounded by mono-ethnic bankers and horse-riders, and IMO it was dead boring, though I did like the deer who used to wander into the garden.

    Others might disagree. That's OK, we don't all have to live in the same place.
    The loathsomeness of the High Multiculti Left in one comment.

    Millionaire Labour ex-MP nephew of millionaire Tory admirals *dislikes* being FORCED to live in rich "boring" white British places, though he tolerates the deer, and on the whole he much prefers the millionaire-paradise of Switzerland, where they have referendums which ban minarets.

    These, by the way, are referendums of which he approves. Yet he also, simultaneously, thinks the British should not be allowed a referendum on EU membership, and he despises British patriotism, and finds it "mystifying".

    And this, dear reader, is the kind of millionaire c*nt who will decide YOUR immigration policy, impacting on the poorer parts of the UK, should you vote Labour.
    Shit holes are always more pleasant places to live when you can afford to move

    Its the anxiety caused by a feeling of being trapped, or lack of it, that separates rich from poor on almost every issue
  • NinoinozNinoinoz Posts: 1,312
    isam said:

    SeanT said:



    It's ok for you white middleclass lefty types,living well away from our new Britain,of mass immigration and multiculturalism.

    Telling people like me that we should have more and more,while two faced propagandist like you pal live in the past of the old Britain,of mainly indigenous white area's.

    I've got a feeling about you Hughie,if the area you lived in started to increase in immigration,I imagine you to be joining the growing numbers of what we call now white flight..

    Can't speak for Hugh, but I live in Holloway, which is multicultural to a fault. It's a nice place and people generally get along very well. Used to live in the posh bit of High Wycombe up the hill, surrounded by mono-ethnic bankers and horse-riders, and IMO it was dead boring, though I did like the deer who used to wander into the garden.

    Others might disagree. That's OK, we don't all have to live in the same place.
    The loathsomeness of the High Multiculti Left in one comment.

    Millionaire Labour ex-MP nephew of millionaire Tory admirals *dislikes* being FORCED to live in rich "boring" white British places, though he tolerates the deer, and on the whole he much prefers the millionaire-paradise of Switzerland, where they have referendums which ban minarets.

    These, by the way, are referendums of which he approves. Yet he also, simultaneously, thinks the British should not be allowed a referendum on EU membership, and he despises British patriotism, and finds it "mystifying".

    And this, dear reader, is the kind of millionaire c*nt who will decide YOUR immigration policy, impacting on the poorer parts of the UK, should you vote Labour.
    Shit holes are always more pleasant places to live when you can afford to move

    Its the anxiety caused by a feeling of being trapped, or lack of it, that separates rich from poor on almost every issue
    Of course, the rich can always send their children to a boarding school, private school or selective state school. No mixing at the local comp for their precise Tarquins.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564
    Socrates said:



    What do you think your prospective constituents think about the current levels of immigration?

    It's not often mentioned - I talk to a few hundred people a week and it typically comes up once or twice. We did a freepost survey asking neutrally "what issues concern you?" and got a couple of thousand replies: it came 5th (NHS, cost of living, jobs and housing came 1st-4th: people could choose several).

    I genuinely don't think it's an issue with very much traction in the patch, though the fact that AS and I have similar views may be dampening response since neither of us are campaigning on it. In fact, the constituency has elected pro-EU centrists for nearly 40 years - AS, me and Jim Lester (who, like AS, was close to Ken Clarke). UKIP did win the Euros here as in most places, though, so we'll see how it works out. Their first leaflet emphasised the issue big time.

  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737
    AndyJS said:

    "I want to see a British Asian Prime Minister, says David Cameron

    The Prime Minister tells an awards ceremony that he wants to see British Asians in positions of power 'not to fill quotas but to realise our full potential'"

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11212217/I-want-to-see-a-British-Asian-Prime-Minister-says-David-Cameron.html

    Luckily, he's only got one vote, like the rest of us...
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    The Twitter handle of Tanya Jones, the Green candidate for Fermanagh & South Tyrone, is "decombustion":

    https://twitter.com/decombustion
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    Socrates said:



    What do you think your prospective constituents think about the current levels of immigration?

    It's not often mentioned - I talk to a few hundred people a week and it typically comes up once or twice. We did a freepost survey asking neutrally "what issues concern you?" and got a couple of thousand replies: it came 5th (NHS, cost of living, jobs and housing came 1st-4th: people could choose several).

    I genuinely don't think it's an issue with very much traction in the patch, though the fact that AS and I have similar views may be dampening response since neither of us are campaigning on it. In fact, the constituency has elected pro-EU centrists for nearly 40 years - AS, me and Jim Lester (who, like AS, was close to Ken Clarke). UKIP did win the Euros here as in most places, though, so we'll see how it works out. Their first leaflet emphasised the issue big time.

    It's a pity Jim Lester's Wikipedia entry is so short:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Lester
  • SeanT said:

    AndyJS said:

    "I want to see a British Asian Prime Minister, says David Cameron

    The Prime Minister tells an awards ceremony that he wants to see British Asians in positions of power 'not to fill quotas but to realise our full potential'"

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11212217/I-want-to-see-a-British-Asian-Prime-Minister-says-David-Cameron.html

    "I don't just want a British Asian prime minister. I want a British Asian Muslim kebab-shop owning taxi-driver living in a northern industrial city who hangs outside every school in the UK simultaneously. As prime minister." Says prime minister.
    I want to be Minister-President of the Commonwealth of All English-speaking States and Peoples.
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