I read that someone threatened that if Scotland voted for independence, England would stop buying our excess electricity. Good luck with that idea this winter.
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
Nevermind Christmas. It could all be over in a fortnight! :^O
But Ed must do the same after failing to deliver his own voters. And it's not the first time, look at the 2011 Scottish Election which started all this off.
For one reason or another Scots seem to hate Ed Milliband and what he was doing in Scotland this week I have no idea because he just looked like a joke quite frankly.
I love Ed Miliband. The man is a total gift to the Yes campaign. And don't even get me started on Johann Lamont. I adore that women.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No. About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No. Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes. But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes. What on earth were they playing at?
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
One problem with the theory. Nobody would be mad enough to trust Ed Milliband and 50-60 Labour MP's (who are about to return North of the Border in 2016) to negotiate the divorce with Salmond and get the best deal for RUK.
Why? A lot of people don't think anyone would be mad enough to trust Ed M to run the country from 2015 onwards, but millions of others do think that and the polls have steadily suggested it will happen, despite all his weaknesses and tightening polls.
I do think any new Tory leadership candidate would promise a referendum in 2015 should they win the GE, if they wanted to win. Even those who don't think that would be a good idea will likely change their position if they want to win.
We'll see.
I think your being very complacent about the danger a YES vote presents to Labour in 2015.
The whole election will basically become about who is best placed to deal with Salmond and Scotland in the negotiations, pretty much to the exclusion of everything else actually.
I think Yes has profound dangers for Labour in the medium and long term, I assure you. I merely suspect that in the short term, the immediate impact, the implosion of the Tories and, though not really his fault as much, Cameron being the PM, will shield them from the worst of it.
As you say, we will see. Or rather, we may well see, though I hope the question does not arise.
Are there any decent and detailed proposals for a Federal UK floating around somewhere? Given, if we can squeak a No, it seems the best way to secure the longer term future of the Union, I think I should do some research on the possibility. The status quo is clearly doomed, and not in the short term either.
And now they lose and the rUK will be impoverished without Scots subsidies. Especially the VAT and Corporation Tax which are classed as "London Region" but are based on Scottish economic activity.
Can you explain? Presumably you are talking about oil profits received by the majors?
Not just Oil profits. Diageo makes most of its money from Whisky and all the VAT and Corporation Tax is classed as London revenue because their HQ is there. Same with any chain store which is based in England which is pretty much all of them. Every penny of VAT and Corporation Tax counts as English revenue in the GERS figures. You're looking at between £15bn and £25bn which Scotland will get after Independence.
England is very, very, very fucked economically. Part of the reason they will be desperate for a Currency Union as it's the only way to avoid a Devaluation on Sterling.
Plus if England wishes to act as Uncle Sam's boy and throw a few toys here and there, Scotland will not be paying for those. Might even charge for Faslane until England finds another suitable place.
Er, what if they decide to move the businesses lock stock and barrel to England? All the offices, everything? Just do a bit of manufacturing up there?
This is far more likely. Expect businesses to relocate down south pronto. Quebec never recovered from NEARLY going indy. Businesses relocated to Toronto.
Our of interest, which English city would like Nuclear Weapons stored there and be the first target of a nuclear strike? This is a population that object to windmills ffs.
I'd have no problem living close to a nuclear sub base, in any English city.
If it came to a nuclear war, there'd be no hiding places anywhere in the UK, but it wouldn't do much good for the enemy because all the subs would be out under the ocean.
They'd be much better going for the military command centres - which means Northwood is probably first, and London would be the worst place to be.
All this absurd panic has been caused by implausible changes in YouGov numbers. The other pollsters haven't moved for weeks.
I don't understand what YouGov have done for their results to be so heavily relied on. Fair enough they're all we have to go on at the moment but we wouldn't trust a single Westminster poll.
Oh dear what ? Scottish independence or Yorkshire may win the county championship ;-)
Oh dear. Oh dear
Where is McArse when you want to take the Piss
Surely "Oh dear, what a numpty I would look if I had been greeting every poll on the subject with "Better Together is crap has won the referendum" for the past eight months, perhaps I should reconsider my whole approach to polling?""
@FrankBooth "Englishness" was pretty debased at one time, people used to tell you their region or town. I thought it had come back a bit over the years though.
'Amid signs of panic and recrimination among unionist ranks about the prospects of a yes vote on 18 September, the Observer has learned that a devolution announcement designed to halt the nationalist bandwagon is due to be made within days by the anti-independence camp.
The plan, in the event of a no vote, is that people from all parts of Scottish society – rather than just politicians – would be invited to take part in a Scottish conference or convention that would decide on further large-scale transfers of power from London to Holyrood.' http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/06/scots-radical-new-deal-save-the-union
I suggested this a few days ago. In fact, I said the only way to turn this around for NO was for all mainstream UK parties to get together *this* weekend and come up with a major comprehensive attractive Devomax offer for Scotland: they can then argue for the positives of this offer, rather than relentlessly drumming on about the negatives if Scotland leaves the UK, which clearly isn't working.
I'm glad someone was listening. I just hope it's not too late.
Here we go again,more powers and proberly more money for Scotland,where does that leave England ? Where's the English parliament ?
Enough is enough,let them go.
I think there should be an English parliament. Where have I said I think the West Lothian question should remain "unanswered" ?
Unlike you, I think the break-up of the UK would be a disaster for both our countries. It would leave us both irremediably weaker.
I agree. And I don't think a narrow yes will necessarily lead to the break-up of the UK. A way will be found to hold another referendum on maybe a federal constituton or a legal status similar to that of the Channel Islands for Scotland. Referendums rarely solve issues - the 1975 referendum was supposed to resolve Britain's position in the EU but it did not do that - the subject remains deeply controversial and there are incessant demands for the referendum to be rerun.
If it's Yes, we could get an EU referendum earlier than 2017
You're kidding. Negotiate with Brussels at the same time as negotiating with Scotland in the middle of what would be a constitutional crisis and likely a political upheaval for all the establishment parties? Not a chance. Its more likely that out of expedience we just withdraw from the EU to make the workload of Government more manageable (it won't happen).
Whilst losing Scotland might advance the likelihood of a referendum about withdrawal from Brussels it would definitely not bring forward the question prior to 2017. In fact it would probably push it back. Losing Scotland is not in the plan......
All this absurd panic has been caused by implausible changes in YouGov numbers. The other pollsters haven't moved for weeks.
I don't understand what YouGov have done for their results to be so heavily relied on. Fair enough they're all we have to go on at the moment but we wouldn't trust a single Westminster poll.
YouGov was the most accurate pollster when it came to Scotland in the Euros
I've refrained from saying what the 'Better Together' campaign should have done, there seems little point, but I do think they should still do some campaigning with Scottish holidaymakers in Blackpool. Good place for it demonstrating the connections between England and Scotland, no nats around, people in a good mood.
All this absurd panic has been caused by implausible changes in YouGov numbers. The other pollsters haven't moved for weeks.
I don't understand what YouGov have done for their results to be so heavily relied on. Fair enough they're all we have to go on at the moment but we wouldn't trust a single Westminster poll.
The fact that in such a short space of time they have gone from a stable and sizable No lead to a Yes lead is concerning, even if it does turn out to be nonsense. Even if the trend is not as pronounced as these polls suggest, it has been remarkably stable up to now, so it seems likely there has been potentially significant movement toward Yes even if the extent is exaggerated.
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
Nevermind Christmas. It could all be over in a fortnight! :^O
But Ed must do the same after failing to deliver his own voters. And it's not the first time, look at the 2011 Scottish Election which started all this off.
For one reason or another Scots seem to hate Ed Milliband and what he was doing in Scotland this week I have no idea because he just looked like a joke quite frankly.
I love Ed Miliband. The man is a total gift to the Yes campaign. And don't even get me started on Johann Lamont. I adore that women.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No. About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No. Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes. But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes. What on earth were they playing at?
It's a total Labour clusterf*ck. They f*cked the UK economically, now they're going to do so politically - and irrevocably.
Wasn't it you, Stuart, that told me that if Westminster governments had treated Scotland with less arrogance and more respect over the last 30 years, we might never have been in this position?
Think you said, 25-30% of Scots would always have backed independence, but to get to 50%+ now is an astonishing feat.
Oh dear what ? Scottish independence or Yorkshire may win the county championship ;-)
Oh dear. Oh dear
Where is McArse when you want to take the Piss
Surely "Oh dear, what a numpty I would look if I had been greeting every poll on the subject with "Better Together is crap has won the referendum" for the past eight months, perhaps I should reconsider my whole approach to polling?""
Oh dear what ? Scottish independence or Yorkshire may win the county championship ;-)
Oh dear. Oh dear
Where is McArse when you want to take the Piss
Surely "Oh dear, what a numpty I would look if I had been greeting every poll on the subject with "Better Together is crap has won the referendum" for the past eight months, perhaps I should reconsider my whole approach to polling?""
I notice they haven't asked (or the paper hasn't put it in a graphic) whether people in Scotland trust Nick Clegg. I should think the positive responses would be statistically insignificant.
And now they lose and the rUK will be impoverished without Scots subsidies. Especially the VAT and Corporation Tax which are classed as "London Region" but are based on Scottish economic activity.
Can you explain? Presumably you are talking about oil profits received by the majors?
Not just Oil profits. Diageo makes most of its money from Whisky and all the VAT and Corporation Tax is classed as London revenue because their HQ is there. Same with any chain store which is based in England which is pretty much all of them. Every penny of VAT and Corporation Tax counts as English revenue in the GERS figures. You're looking at between £15bn and £25bn which Scotland will get after Independence.
England is very, very, very fucked economically. Part of the reason they will be desperate for a Currency Union as it's the only way to avoid a Devaluation on Sterling.
Well, the VAT on whisky will be charged at the point of sale, so will be English not Scottish (in fact, independence might reduce Diageo's ability to offset input prices against VAT so increase the English tax take). In terms of the profits, I'd imagine (don't know but this is the way I'd set it up) that the Scottish companies are manufacturing units with a fixed mark-up, that then sells their product to a distribution company which also owns the brand. That international distribution company then onsells to each of the local affiliates. So I doubt many of the profits end up in the Scottish company.
With the retail companies, you'd get to keep the VAT, that's true, but again, I'd assume that the products are bought into an ex-Scottish central company which then would sell on to the Scottish subisidiary on a transfer price basis (or they might even use one of those low-risk distributor models, whereby the English parent underwrites the P&L in return for a fixed gross margin).
I guess it depends on what the iScot government does to corporation tax - if it goes up significantly then the taxes will flow south.
Scotland definitely will follow the Irish model of 12% Corporation Tax. They have more or less said it all along.
Basic error. Nobody knows what a newly independent Scottish government would look like. And there's no guarantee Alex Salmond would be in charge.
So Ed campaigns for Yes2AV, and Yes2AV gets pounded like a dockside hooker.
This week Ed campaigns for No, and Yes takes the lead.
It's going to be absolute carnage for Labour in the general election campaign.
Perhaps he could not officially come out for Labour during it? They seem to do well enough without bringing him into the picture, so maybe he could imply that while he is a fan of Labour (being its leader), he's not definitively saying people should vote for it. Unconventional, I know.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
There would be a reasonable constitutional argument that the Scottish MPs only should have their mandate extended from May 2015 to i-day. But that they should be restricted from voting on anything that is a devolved power.
Dair London puts in more than it takes out compared to Scotland, but of course Scotland will have to get its own currency as England and Wales do not want currency union, or it could join the euro
Every penny London spends on its infrastructure is subsidised by the rest of the UK. Almost all London infrastructure is classed as "UK spending" by the government. Most of that is from the Scottish subsidy, Scotland would be at least £600bn better off since 1980 had it been independent and not pauing for English debt and London subsidy. that's the bottom line and why Scotland needs independence to choose its own destiny based on its enormous wealth.
If this is the result could Andy Murray end up being booed rather than cheered at Wimbledon next year? The Six Nations clash between Scotland and England will be interesting
David Coburn MEP @DavidCoburnUKip 3 hrs BetterTogether bean counters have been making a hash of it of late- That is about to change - Mr Farage - Glasgow - 12th Sept
So Ed campaigns for Yes2AV, and Yes2AV gets pounded like a dockside hooker.
This week Ed campaigns for No, and Yes takes the lead.
It's going to be absolute carnage for Labour in the general election campaign.
Perhaps he could not officially come out for Labour during it? They seem to do well enough without bringing him into the picture, so maybe he could imply that while he is a fan of Labour (being its leader), he's not definitively saying people should vote for it. Unconventional, I know.
Dair London puts in more than it takes out compared to Scotland, but of course Scotland will have to get its own currency as England and Wales do not want currency union, or it could join the euro
Every penny London spends on its infrastructure is subsidised by the rest of the UK. Almost all London infrastructure is classed as "UK spending" by the government. Most of that is from the Scottish subsidy, Scotland would be at least £600bn better off since 1980 had it been independent and not pauing for English debt and London subsidy. that's the bottom line and why Scotland needs independence to choose its own destiny based on its enormous wealth.
Have you included RBS and BoS in your satirical fairy tale?
Oh dear what ? Scottish independence or Yorkshire may win the county championship ;-)
Oh dear. Oh dear
Where is McArse when you want to take the Piss
Surely "Oh dear, what a numpty I would look if I had been greeting every poll on the subject with "Better Together is crap has won the referendum" for the past eight months, perhaps I should reconsider my whole approach to polling?""
Wheras 22 month trends ..........
Show Labour's lead falling
Correct
And if GE2015 was 22 months away Ed is Crap is not PM but its 8 months away
FWIW you know I actually think Ed is pretty Crap and a drag on Lab.
I also think GE 2015 will be a close run affair but Ed will be PM (just about)
If there is a yes vote clearly he could be the last maj Lab PM and I will have to move to Scotland. (Shh dont tell Mrs BJ)
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
Nevermind Christmas. It could all be over in a fortnight! :^O
But Ed must do the same after failing to deliver his own voters. And it's not the first time, look at the 2011 Scottish Election which started all this off.
For one reason or another Scots seem to hate Ed Milliband and what he was doing in Scotland this week I have no idea because he just looked like a joke quite frankly.
I love Ed Miliband. The man is a total gift to the Yes campaign. And don't even get me started on Johann Lamont. I adore that women.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No. About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No. Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes. But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes. What on earth were they playing at?
It's a total Labour clusterf*ck. They f*cked the UK economically, now they're going to do so politically - and irrevocably.
Wasn't it you, Stuart, that told me that if Westminster governments had treated Scotland with less arrogance and more respect over the last 30 years, we might never have been in this position?
Think you said, 25-30% of Scots would always have backed independence, but to get to 50%+ now is an astonishing feat.
Yepp. That was me.
With a starting point 30 years ago the Union could easily have been saved, but far too many Unionists did the exact opposite of what they should be doing. And they still are.
If I was a consultant for No I could have helped you lot to resoundingly save the Union as recently as 2 years ago. But that ship has sailed. Now your very, very best result would be a narrow No, but you seem to have a wiful deathwish and are even doing your best to chuck that faint hope down the pan too.
So Ed campaigns for Yes2AV, and Yes2AV gets pounded like a dockside hooker.
This week Ed campaigns for No, and Yes takes the lead.
It's going to be absolute carnage for Labour in the general election campaign.
Perhaps he could not officially come out for Labour during it? They seem to do well enough without bringing him into the picture, so maybe he could imply that while he is a fan of Labour (being its leader), he's not definitively saying people should vote for it. Unconventional, I know.
True. At least Salmond won't have to whinge about not being included (or rather an SNP rep not being included). Somehow it doesn't have the same impact when Plaid Cymru try it, though I guess their day will come.
What I really want to know is how the Greens will continue to not seize the opportunity of so much distrust of and chaos within the main parties.
The baffling thing is the SNP is promising the WWC Salmond's Scottish soviet socialist republic when what they will end up with is Thatcherism on steroids.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
There would be a reasonable constitutional argument that the Scottish MPs only should have their mandate extended from May 2015 to i-day. But that they should be restricted from voting on anything that is a devolved power.
Doubt this will be implementable. More likely is that the Scots MPs will disappear in 2016 and what ever arithmetic remains will be sorted out, in consultation, with the Queen, or the PM will call an election.
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
Nevermind Christmas. It could all be over in a fortnight! :^O
But Ed must do the same after failing to deliver his own voters. And it's not the first time, look at the 2011 Scottish Election which started all this off.
For one reason or another Scots seem to hate Ed Milliband and what he was doing in Scotland this week I have no idea because he just looked like a joke quite frankly.
I love Ed Miliband. The man is a total gift to the Yes campaign. And don't even get me started on Johann Lamont. I adore that women.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No. About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No. Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes. But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes. What on earth were they playing at?
It's a total Labour clusterf*ck. They f*cked the UK economically, now they're going to do so politically - and irrevocably.
Wasn't it you, Stuart, that told me that if Westminster governments had treated Scotland with less arrogance and more respect over the last 30 years, we might never have been in this position?
Think you said, 25-30% of Scots would always have backed independence, but to get to 50%+ now is an astonishing feat.
Yepp. That was me.
With a starting point 30 years ago the Union could easily have been saved, but far too many Unionists did the exact opposite of what they should be doing. And they still are.
If I was a consultant for No I could have helped you lot to resoundingly save the Union as recently as 2 years ago. But that ship has sailed. Now your very, very best result would be a narrow No, but you seem to have a wiful deathwish and are even doing your best to chuck that faint hope down the pan too.
Sometimes I just look on agog and shake my head.
It's far too much for me to digest, right now. I love the Union we both built together - and I have nothing but respect for Scotland. It's a tragedy.
Right, I'm off to bed to practice my thousand-yard stare. Goodnight all.
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
Nevermind Christmas. It could all be over in a fortnight! :^O
But Ed must do the same after failing to deliver his own voters. And it's not the first time, look at the 2011 Scottish Election which started all this off.
For one reason or another Scots seem to hate Ed Milliband and what he was doing in Scotland this week I have no idea because he just looked like a joke quite frankly.
I love Ed Miliband. The man is a total gift to the Yes campaign. And don't even get me started on Johann Lamont. I adore that women.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No. About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No. Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes. But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes. What on earth were they playing at?
It's a total Labour clusterf*ck. They f*cked the UK economically, now they're going to do so politically - and irrevocably.
Wasn't it you, Stuart, that told me that if Westminster governments had treated Scotland with less arrogance and more respect over the last 30 years, we might never have been in this position?
Think you said, 25-30% of Scots would always have backed independence, but to get to 50%+ now is an astonishing feat.
Yepp. That was me.
With a starting point 30 years ago the Union could easily have been saved, but far too many Unionists did the exact opposite of what they should be doing. And they still are.
If I was a consultant for No I could have helped you lot to resoundingly save the Union as recently as 2 years ago. But that ship has sailed. Now your very, very best result would be a narrow No, but you seem to have a wiful deathwish and are even doing your best to chuck that faint hope down the pan too.
Sometimes I just look on agog and shake my head.
Only a few more days for you to enjoy your sadistic voyeurism and then you'll vanish.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
The baffling thing is the SNP is promising the WWC Salmond's Scottish soviet socialist republic when what they will end up with is Thatcherism on steroids.
That's not baffling. It could well be totally wrong, but clearly no-one believes they will end up with that. Really it's just depressing if that is a) True and b) not believed.
Still, could Clegg be installed as interim PM while the Tories conduct a leadership campaign, the winner of which would take over until the GE? Probably not, but pretty hilarious.
Hague will be the interim PM. He's FSoS, well respected by most Tory MPs, and the only senior enough figure not to be a candidate for the full-time gig.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
Because all parties at Westminster, Con, Lab and LD all realise that in the event of a Yes vote, taking a pro-Scottish viewpoint will be toxic in England.
Adam Boulton has done his column in the Sunday Times
it is headlined with
Cheer up, PM. At this rate you will all be over by Christmas
and signs off with
But this is Cameron’s watch and, as every Tory tells me, “we are the Conservative and Unionist party”. If Cameron loses Scotland, it won’t just be etched on his record: it will be his tombstone.
Nevermind Christmas. It could all be over in a fortnight! :^O
But Ed must do the same after failing to deliver his own voters. And it's not the first time, look at the 2011 Scottish Election which started all this off.
For one reason or another Scots seem to hate Ed Milliband and what he was doing in Scotland this week I have no idea because he just looked like a joke quite frankly.
I love Ed Miliband. The man is a total gift to the Yes campaign. And don't even get me started on Johann Lamont. I adore that women.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No. About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No. Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes. But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes. What on earth were they playing at?
It's a total Labour clusterf*ck. They f*cked the UK economically, now they're going to do so politically - and irrevocably.
Wasn't it you, Stuart, that told me that if Westminster governments had treated Scotland with less arrogance and more respect over the last 30 years, we might never have been in this position?
Think you said, 25-30% of Scots would always have backed independence, but to get to 50%+ now is an astonishing feat.
Yepp. That was me.
With a starting point 30 years ago the Union could easily have been saved, but far too many Unionists did the exact opposite of what they should be doing. And they still are.
If I was a consultant for No I could have helped you lot to resoundingly save the Union as recently as 2 years ago. But that ship has sailed. Now your very, very best result would be a narrow No, but you seem to have a wiful deathwish and are even doing your best to chuck that faint hope down the pan too.
Sometimes I just look on agog and shake my head.
It's far too much for me to digest, right now. I love the Union we both built together - and I have nothing but respect for Scotland. It's a tragedy.
Right, I'm off to bed to practice my thousand-yard stare. Goodnight all.
Dair London puts in more than it takes out compared to Scotland, but of course Scotland will have to get its own currency as England and Wales do not want currency union, or it could join the euro
Every penny London spends on its infrastructure is subsidised by the rest of the UK. Almost all London infrastructure is classed as "UK spending" by the government. Most of that is from the Scottish subsidy, Scotland would be at least £600bn better off since 1980 had it been independent and not pauing for English debt and London subsidy. that's the bottom line and why Scotland needs independence to choose its own destiny based on its enormous wealth.
Touching how you think Scotland is going to be able to keep all its *ahem* massive wealth, when Salmond has more or less publicly promised the oil and the fish stocks (and Christ knows what else) away to buy his way back into the EU.
And now they lose and the rUK will be impoverished without Scots subsidies. Especially the VAT and Corporation Tax which are classed as "London Region" but are based on Scottish economic activity.
Can you explain? Presumably you are talking about oil profits received by the majors?
Not just Oil profits. Diageo makes most of its money from Whisky and all the VAT and Corporation Tax is classed as London revenue because their HQ is there. Same with any chain store which is based in England which is pretty much all of them. Every penny of VAT and Corporation Tax counts as English revenue in the GERS figures. You're looking at between £15bn and £25bn which Scotland will get after Independence.
England is very, very, very fucked economically. Part of the reason they will be desperate for a Currency Union as it's the only way to avoid a Devaluation on Sterling.
Plus if England wishes to act as Uncle Sam's boy and throw a few toys here and there, Scotland will not be paying for those. Might even charge for Faslane until England finds another suitable place.
Er, what if they decide to move the businesses lock stock and barrel to England? All the offices, everything? Just do a bit of manufacturing up there?
This is far more likely. Expect businesses to relocate down south pronto. Quebec never recovered from NEARLY going indy. Businesses relocated to Toronto.
Our of interest, which English city would like Nuclear Weapons stored there and be the first target of a nuclear strike? This is a population that object to windmills ffs.
Andrew Neil @afneil 1m Murdoch/Scot Independence. He thinks hacking scandal was revenge of British Establishment on him. Break up of Britain would be his revenge
The baffling thing is the SNP is promising the WWC Salmond's Scottish soviet socialist republic when what they will end up with is Thatcherism on steroids.
That's not baffling. It could well be totally wrong, but clearly no-one believes they will end up with that. Really it's just depressing if that is a) True and b) not believed.
What I meant is that it is baffling that so many people are falling for it. Salmond is a snake oil salesman and independence is his cure all.
"The chart at the top of this post comes from the government’s National (sic) Infrastructure Plan 2013. (Sic because it is largely a plan for England.) You can find it on page 30. You may notice that one rather large part of England is not listed on this chart: London. Perhaps that is because the value of infrastructure spending in London comes in at a nifty £36 billion. Or, to put it another way, spending on infrastructure in London is equivalent to the total amount of infrastructure spending in every other part of England save the south-west. And the south-west’s figure is chiefly so high because of a single project: the new nuclear power station at Hinckley Point." http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/alex-massie/2013/12/london-is-different-the-government-will-spend-money-there/
He sounded like a Tory when he maintained all was fine and dandy with the NHS and that the coalition had increased spending on it. Then there was the poll showing Darling had higher favouribility ratings with the Tories and Lib Dems, but Salmond led with Labour and SNP voters.
BBC News- Gordon Brown has written an article for a newspaper blaming the Tories and their policies for the narrowing in the polls. Sounds like #fallingapart
Hardly surprising that the most malign, poisonous and probably insane politician in the UK should do this....
The turning point was when Salmond accused Darling for being a "Tory".
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
So exactly what are these Scottish MP's going to do in Westminster other than interfere in English business? Salmond will not let them (i.e. Scottish Labour) decide (sabotage the SNP) Scottish Affairs from Westminster if he's already won an independence referendum. He will demand that all Scottish related decisions are addressed directly between Edinburgh and Downing Street. There will be 60 Scottish MP's kicking their heals eating up expenses for no good reason.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
So exactly what are these Scottish MP's going to do in Westminster other than interfere in English business? Salmond will not let them (i.e. Scottish Labour) decide (sabotage the SNP) Scottish Affairs from Westminster if he's already won an independence referendum. He will demand that all Scottish related decisions are addressed directly between Edinburgh and Downing Street. There will be 60 Scottish MP's kicking their heals eating up expenses for no good reason.
How can a part of the UK not be represented at Westminster? Obviously there will be negotiations on a post-independence settlement, but Scotland should still be represented at Westminster. There will be budgets to be voted through, laws to be made and if there were MPs of other Parties, why would they necessarily dance to Salmond's tune?
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
There would be a reasonable constitutional argument that the Scottish MPs only should have their mandate extended from May 2015 to i-day. But that they should be restricted from voting on anything that is a devolved power.
Doubt this will be implementable. More likely is that the Scots MPs will disappear in 2016 and what ever arithmetic remains will be sorted out, in consultation, with the Queen, or the PM will call an election.
But what would the point of the Scots voting in a GE in 2015 for a soon-to-be-foreign Parliament when, as you say, they will disappear a year later.
Additionally, Parliament won't be that involved in the negotiation, so literally there would be no point.
This terms of this referendum are in themselves another lamentable own goal by the unionists - and in this case Cameron must bear most of the blame. It was clear from the start that the most popular option is "devomax" - Scots do not want separation but they do want more powers. But Dave in his wisdom contrived to offer a referendum which did not allow Scots to vote for that option. They can opt only for no change - the world as it is - or independence - the world of their dreams. The no campaign has been left in the absurd position of saying "vote for no change but that doesn't in fact mean no change - we'll be offering you loads of goodies which are...er....we'll let you know later. Trust us." Ridiculous.
Which is why Cameron must take the lion's share of the blame if the yes side wins - he offered them an open goal - he did not need to do that, he could and should have insisted on a less divisive process and more than one option on the ballot paper.
@Charles Ozzie shouldn't have scored out 4 and written in 5 on the fixed parliament bill then? (To be fair, he had assumed the "recovery" would follow the normal pattern)
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
So exactly what are these Scottish MP's going to do in Westminster other than interfere in English business? Salmond will not let them (i.e. Scottish Labour) decide (sabotage the SNP) Scottish Affairs from Westminster if he's already won an independence referendum. He will demand that all Scottish related decisions are addressed directly between Edinburgh and Downing Street. There will be 60 Scottish MP's kicking their heals eating up expenses for no good reason.
How can a part of the UK not be represented at Westminster? Obviously there will be negotiations on a post-independence settlement, but Scotland should still be represented at Westminster. There will be budgets to be voted through, laws to be made and if there were MPs of other Parties, why would they necessarily dance to Salmond's tune?
But Scotland will no longer be part of the UK for all intents and purposes. They will have voted to leave. The referendum is ;like going to court to get a divorce and once the divorce is granted (a Yes vote in the referendum) that is it. Once a divorce is granted the two people don't live as a couple until the decree absolute comes through do they?
Almost two thirds of the public would support some form of British military action against jihadist fighters in Iraq, an exclusive poll for The Telegraph suggests.
The survey, by Opinium Research, found 60 per cent of people were in favour of taking action to deal with the threat from the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (Isil).
@Charles Ozzie shouldn't have scored out 4 and written in 5 on the fixed parliament bill then? (To be fair, he had assumed the "recovery" would follow the normal pattern)
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
icking their heals eating up expenses for no good reason.
How can a part of the UK not be represented at Westminster? Obviously there will be negotiations on a post-independence settlement, but Scotland should still be represented at Westminster. There will be budgets to be voted through, laws to be made and if there were MPs of other Parties, why would they necessarily dance to Salmond's tune?
But Scotland will no longer be part of the UK for all intents and purposes. They will have voted to leave. The referendum is ;like going to court to get a divorce and once the divorce is granted (a Yes vote in the referendum) that is it. Once a divorce is granted the two people don't live as a couple until the decree absolute comes through do they?
They may well still do so while they sort out the alternate living arrangements and the like, or continue to forward mail and so on. Depending on the circumstances, there might still be a lot of co-operation required before things are completely done, especially if kids (eg, millions of citizens) are involved and still need proper looking after.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
icking their heals eating up expenses for no good reason.
How can a part of the UK not be represented at Westminster? Obviously there will be negotiations on a post-independence settlement, but Scotland should still be represented at Westminster. There will be budgets to be voted through, laws to be made and if there were MPs of other Parties, why would they necessarily dance to Salmond's tune?
But Scotland will no longer be part of the UK for all intents and purposes. They will have voted to leave. The referendum is ;like going to court to get a divorce and once the divorce is granted (a Yes vote in the referendum) that is it. Once a divorce is granted the two people don't live as a couple until the decree absolute comes through do they?
They may well still do so while they sort out the alternate living arrangements and the like, or continue to forward mail and so on. Depending on the circumstances, there might still be a lot of co-operation required before things are completely done, especially if kids (eg, millions of citizens) are involved and still need proper looking after.
Sure, but the soon-to-be-exes don't try to tell each other how to run their lives.
Any joint matters are dealt with in a bilateral discussion
Eric Joyce MP @ericjoyce 10m Note to EdM's not especially good staff. Project Fear, e.g border guards, will lose you everything now. Shut tf up.
Ouch, being told you're not very good by Eric Joyce a few minutes before closing time. Well, probably hurts less than being physically attacked by Eric Joyce a few minutes before closing time.
If the 59 Scottish seats are removed at the next election, how will the bookies interpret the seat bands? Will the bets be voided?
Voided
The Scottish seats will be contested in next May's GE so the question doesn't arise.
If I read this Sunday Times article correctly, Tories will either demand Dave's head, or Scottish MPs banned from the 2015 General election
Ridiculous. And how could Cameron possibly promise not to let Scottish MPs stand? Do they not realise they don't have a majority. The Lib Dems wouldn't stand for it.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
ng up expenses for no good reason.
How can a part of the UK not be represented at Westminster? Obviously there will be negotiations on a post-independence settlement, but Scotland should still be represented at Westminster. There will be budgets to be voted through, laws to be made and if there were MPs of other Parties, why would they necessarily dance to Salmond's tune?
But Scotland will no longer be part of the UK for all intents and purposes. They will have voted to leave. The referendum is ;like going to court to get a divorce and once the divorce is granted (a Yes vote in the referendum) that is it. Once a divorce is granted the two people don't live as a couple until the decree absolute comes through do they?
'But Scotland will no longer be part of the UK for all intents and purposes.' Yes it will be and will remain so until the legal process is complete.
You are saying that Scots should be denied seats at Westminster. Why should they pay tax if they have no representation? And anyway, the referendum is merely the beginning of the divorce process, a statement of intent.
Eric Joyce MP @ericjoyce 10m Note to EdM's not especially good staff. Project Fear, e.g border guards, will lose you everything now. Shut tf up.
Ouch, being told you're not very good by Eric Joyce a few minutes before closing time. Well, probably hurts less than being physically attacked by Eric Joyce a few minutes before closing time.
Eric Joyce MP @ericjoyce 10m Note to EdM's not especially good staff. Project Fear, e.g border guards, will lose you everything now. Shut tf up.
Ouch, being told you're not very good by Eric Joyce a few minutes before closing time. Well, probably hurts less than being physically attacked by Eric Joyce a few minutes before closing time.
Naughty.
And I owe you an apology, you were the one to advise to back Yes, yesterday when Roger said no was going to win.
Dair London puts in more than it takes out compared to Scotland, but of course Scotland will have to get its own currency as England and Wales do not want currency union, or it could join the euro
Every penny London spends on its infrastructure is subsidised by the rest of the UK. Almost all London infrastructure is classed as "UK spending" by the government. Most of that is from the Scottish subsidy, Scotland would be at least £600bn better off since 1980 had it been independent and not pauing for English debt and London subsidy. that's the bottom line and why Scotland needs independence to choose its own destiny based on its enormous wealth.
Have you included RBS and BoS in your satirical fairy tale?
Bank bailouts, if chosen by the government (as opposed to jailing crooked bankers as Iceland did - higher GDP than the UK today BTW) Those bailouts are paid by the governments where the economic activity is, 50% of "British" banks were bailed out by the US government.
Scotland's financial services are almost entirely low risk investment funds. Pensions and Current Accounts, the entirety of the bank bail out was London based activity and if it happened today, would be paid 100% by the Westminster government.
Comments
Good luck with that idea this winter.
Nearly 100% of Tory voters are No.
About 80% of Lib Dem voters are No.
Nearly 100% of SNP and Green voters are Yes.
But Miliband and Lamont have allowed up to 40% of the Labour vote to go to Yes.
What on earth were they playing at?
As you say, we will see. Or rather, we may well see, though I hope the question does not arise.
Are there any decent and detailed proposals for a Federal UK floating around somewhere? Given, if we can squeak a No, it seems the best way to secure the longer term future of the Union, I think I should do some research on the possibility. The status quo is clearly doomed, and not in the short term either.
Lord Ashcroft @LordAshcroft 4s
Cameron to save the Union by offering to resign if there's a NO vote in the Scottish referendum #notso
If it came to a nuclear war, there'd be no hiding places anywhere in the UK, but it wouldn't do much good for the enemy because all the subs would be out under the ocean.
They'd be much better going for the military command centres - which means Northwood is probably first, and London would be the worst place to be.
"Englishness" was pretty debased at one time, people used to tell you their region or town.
I thought it had come back a bit over the years though.
Whilst losing Scotland might advance the likelihood of a referendum about withdrawal from Brussels it would definitely not bring forward the question prior to 2017. In fact it would probably push it back. Losing Scotland is not in the plan......
Sounds crazy, but it could just work!
He hasn't made many friends on the "left" either.
Wasn't it you, Stuart, that told me that if Westminster governments had treated Scotland with less arrogance and more respect over the last 30 years, we might never have been in this position?
Think you said, 25-30% of Scots would always have backed independence, but to get to 50%+ now is an astonishing feat.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bw4QxuZIIAAMmxF.jpg
It's far, far too close for comfort though. And Yes have the mo.
This week Ed campaigns for No, and Yes takes the lead.
It's going to be absolute carnage for Labour in the general election campaign.
But a tragedy for the rest of us. The end of the Union.
David Coburn MEP @DavidCoburnUKip 3 hrs
BetterTogether bean counters have been making a hash of it of late- That is about to change - Mr Farage - Glasgow - 12th Sept
And if GE2015 was 22 months away Ed is Crap is not PM but its 8 months away
FWIW you know I actually think Ed is pretty Crap and a drag on Lab.
I also think GE 2015 will be a close run affair but Ed will be PM (just about)
If there is a yes vote clearly he could be the last maj Lab PM and I will have to move to Scotland. (Shh dont tell Mrs BJ)
My worries turned to outright pessimism when I saw Rodger's prediction.
With a starting point 30 years ago the Union could easily have been saved, but far too many Unionists did the exact opposite of what they should be doing. And they still are.
If I was a consultant for No I could have helped you lot to resoundingly save the Union as recently as 2 years ago. But that ship has sailed. Now your very, very best result would be a narrow No, but you seem to have a wiful deathwish and are even doing your best to chuck that faint hope down the pan too.
Sometimes I just look on agog and shake my head.
What I really want to know is how the Greens will continue to not seize the opportunity of so much distrust of and chaos within the main parties.
Right, I'm off to bed to practice my thousand-yard stare. Goodnight all.
Why are these Tory MPs so thick as to believe that in the event of a Yes vote there will be a Labour government with Scottish MPs in it after the election? If there is a Yes vote the Scottish Labour party will immediately disband from the UK one in order to fight the SNP. Ed Miliband would have to make clear in the election campaign whether he would endorse a coalition with Scottish Labour. If he did he might well pay an electoral price. Some kind of national government might be the only answer.
Goodnight all.
Where is the McGold standard when you need it.
Murdoch/Scot Independence. He thinks hacking scandal was revenge of British Establishment on him. Break up of Britain would be his revenge
Murdoch/Scot Independence. He thinks hacking scandal was revenge of British Establishment on him. Break up of Britain would be his revenge
Perhaps that is because the value of infrastructure spending in London comes in at a nifty £36 billion. Or, to put it another way, spending on infrastructure in London is equivalent to the total amount of infrastructure spending in every other part of England save the south-west. And the south-west’s figure is chiefly so high because of a single project: the new nuclear power station at Hinckley Point."
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/alex-massie/2013/12/london-is-different-the-government-will-spend-money-there/
Dan Hodges
@DPJHodges
@adelegeras Despite the best efforts of its defenders, the Union is safe.
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danhodges/100258639/what-will-the-eurosceptics-and-scottish-nationalists-do-once-theyve-been-defeated/
I wonder if the swing to "Yes" can be traced back to the publication of that article.
Additionally, Parliament won't be that involved in the negotiation, so literally there would be no point.
This terms of this referendum are in themselves another lamentable own goal by the unionists - and in this case Cameron must bear most of the blame. It was clear from the start that the most popular option is "devomax" - Scots do not want separation but they do want more powers. But Dave in his wisdom contrived to offer a referendum which did not allow Scots to vote for that option. They can opt only for no change - the world as it is - or independence - the world of their dreams. The no campaign has been left in the absurd position of saying "vote for no change but that doesn't in fact mean no change - we'll be offering you loads of goodies which are...er....we'll let you know later. Trust us." Ridiculous.
Which is why Cameron must take the lion's share of the blame if the yes side wins - he offered them an open goal - he did not need to do that, he could and should have insisted on a less divisive process and more than one option on the ballot paper.
http://order-order.com/2014/09/02/brown-effect-gap-closes-12-points-since-gordon-joined-no/
Ozzie shouldn't have scored out 4 and written in 5 on the fixed parliament bill then?
(To be fair, he had assumed the "recovery" would follow the normal pattern)
The survey, by Opinium Research, found 60 per cent of people were in favour of taking action to deal with the threat from the Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant (Isil).
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/11079549/Poll-Majority-back-military-action-against-Islamic-State.html
A year less of the Tories might have saved handing "YES" a bucket load of votes?
Labour #clusterfcuk.
http://www.politicshome.com/uk/article/104260/the_mail_on_sunday_sunday_7th_september_2014.html
Note to EdM's not especially good staff. Project Fear, e.g border guards, will lose you everything now. Shut tf up.
Any joint matters are dealt with in a bilateral discussion
From the Sunday Times,
UKIP is planning to target the parliamentary seat of John Bercow if MPs topple him with a vote of no confidence.
You are saying that Scots should be denied seats at Westminster. Why should they pay tax if they have no representation? And anyway, the referendum is merely the beginning of the divorce process, a statement of intent.
And I owe you an apology, you were the one to advise to back Yes, yesterday when Roger said no was going to win.
Scotland's financial services are almost entirely low risk investment funds. Pensions and Current Accounts, the entirety of the bank bail out was London based activity and if it happened today, would be paid 100% by the Westminster government.
http://yougov.co.uk/news/2014/07/01/why-do-polls-scotland-vary-so-much/