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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » George needs to find a way of making UKIP voters less econ

SystemSystem Posts: 11,688
edited August 2014 in General

politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » George needs to find a way of making UKIP voters less economically pessimistic

One of the great things about taking part in Edinburgh Festival of Politics was being able to meet up again with Professor John Curtice, who must be the county’s leading political scientist.

Read the full story here


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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,489
    edited August 2014
    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    Hard to do, given economic reality lends itself to pessimism.

    Growth is strong but the deficit is too large, the debt's enormous, and the EU appears to be on the verge of another eurozone crisis.

    There's a serious risk with an attempt at a giveaway. Could cut the legs from under the Conservatives' economic standing and make floating voters think it's 'safe' to vote for taxey taxey, spendey spendey Labour again.
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    DaemonBarberDaemonBarber Posts: 1,626
    Grumpy UKIP voters are grumpy...
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    JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380
    4th?

    Hello everyone,

    I'm not sure how friendly some of the tory journos are being to me-

    However, I read today in The Times (not paywall, sorry no link) an article in the T2, P5, about Murakami (Headline - Murakami, The Name To Drop Now).

    FYI, I have read lots of Murakami - off the top of my head (in no particular order), these are-

    Kafka on the Shore
    A Wind up Bird Chronicle
    A Wild Sheep Chase

    I've read a couple of more, but I can't remember them now, off the top of my head.

    That's all for now,

    I'll see how Kay Burley treats me.
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    George Osborne's masterful strategy will yield a vote winning budget in 2015.

    Let's not forget, it was his policies that stopped the election that never was in 2007, and helped the Tory revival this year post the budget.
  • Options
    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited August 2014
    second.
    And UKIP don't believe anything that George says or might say. So no help to the Tories or any of the Lab/Lib/Con parties and I include the Greens in that too.
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    UKIP and Labour seem to be canvassing the same slough of despond.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited August 2014

    George Osborne's masterful strategy will yield a vote winning budget in 2015.

    Let's not forget, it was his policies that stopped the election that never was in 2007, and helped the Tory revival this year post the budget.

    It was a Frit Gordon that stopped the election. Georgie Porgie got undeserved kudos for a policy he never fully carried out when in power.
  • Options
    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    Falls in oil and property prices might help Osborne a bit.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,933
    Has anyone read "Revolt on the Right"?!!!!

    Actually, I haven't, but from reading Ford & Goodwin's blogs it is blatantly obvious why UKIP voters don't think things will get better for them. It's because things have been getting worse for them for decades, and when they point out why they get called racist bigots by rich people who carry on with the same policies!
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    taffys said:

    Falls in oil and property prices might help Osborne a bit.

    What! All those mugs that bought houses at the top of the market will not look kindly on Georgie Porgie pulling the pudding and pie from under them.
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    MikeK said:

    George Osborne's masterful strategy will yield a vote winning budget in 2015.

    Let's not forget, it was his policies that stopped the election that never was in 2007, and helped the Tory revival this year post the budget.

    It was a Frit Gordon that stopped the election. Georgie Porgie got undeserved kudos for a policy he never fully carried out when in power.
    There's so much wrong with that post, I don't know where to start.

    But I'll try

    George Osborne's 2007 announcement that only millionaires would pay inheritance tax under a Conservative government was credited with heading off the threat of the then prime minister Gordon Brown calling a snap election.

    Have you forgotten the polling from the time, mahoosive Tory swings.

    The reason he hasn't been able to deliver on it, is the economy went mammary glands up, and he had to prioritise elsewhere

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/mar/24/cameron-tories-raise-inheritance-threshold
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637
    "Glass half empty? Vote UKIP!"
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    felixfelix Posts: 15,124
    I think UKIP voters are generally older - years of very low interest rates has affected their savings - this is not going to improve quickly. However, I'm completely unclear why they believe any UKIP policy would make their situation any better.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    More likely they do the sort of jobs and live in the sorts of places where being economically pessimistic reflects reality.
  • Options
    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    MikeK said:

    George Osborne's masterful strategy will yield a vote winning budget in 2015.

    Let's not forget, it was his policies that stopped the election that never was in 2007, and helped the Tory revival this year post the budget.

    It was a Frit Gordon that stopped the election. Georgie Porgie got undeserved kudos for a policy he never fully carried out when in power.
    There's so much wrong with that post, I don't know where to start.

    But I'll try

    George Osborne's 2007 announcement that only millionaires would pay inheritance tax under a Conservative government was credited with heading off the threat of the then prime minister Gordon Brown calling a snap election.

    Have you forgotten the polling from the time, mahoosive Tory swings.

    The reason he hasn't been able to deliver on it, is the economy went mammary glands up, and he had to prioritise elsewhere

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/mar/24/cameron-tories-raise-inheritance-threshold
    I'll repeat. Frit Gordon Brown squashed winnable election because he was scared of a chimera. The Tory swing was not enough at that point to stop Labour winning.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    edited August 2014
    Mr. Rentool, surely:
    Glass half empty? Finish off your pint - and then join UKIP!
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    isam said:

    Has anyone read "Revolt on the Right"?!!!!

    Actually, I haven't, but from reading Ford & Goodwin's blogs it is blatantly obvious why UKIP voters don't think things will get better for them. It's because things have been getting worse for them for decades, and when they point out why they get called racist bigots by rich people who carry on with the same policies!

    Good book. Well worth a read, though far from agreeing with much of it.
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    edited August 2014
    ''All those mugs that bought houses at the top of the market will not look kindly on Georgie Porgie pulling the pudding and pie from under them. '

    The number waiting to get on the ladder is far, far larger. And one reason why the tories did so badly in London last May.

    If rents also fall that would be a bit helpful to the tories too.
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    Rexel56Rexel56 Posts: 807
    UKIP voters are sick of living under the oppressive yoke of hospital car park charges...
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    isam said:

    Has anyone read "Revolt on the Right"?!!!!

    Actually, I haven't, but from reading Ford & Goodwin's blogs it is blatantly obvious why UKIP voters don't think things will get better for them. It's because things have been getting worse for them for decades, and when they point out why they get called racist bigots by rich people who carry on with the same policies!

    I have, recommended it several times on here.
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    taffys said:

    ''All those mugs that bought houses at the top of the market will not look kindly on Georgie Porgie pulling the pudding and pie from under them. '

    The number waiting to get on the ladder is far, far larger. And one reason why the tories did so badly in London last May.

    If rents also fall that would be a bit helpful to the tories too.

    Rents will help but a fall in house prices will only hinder.
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    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 35,850

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637

    Mr. Rentool, surely:
    Glass half empty? Finish off your pint - and then join UKIP!

    MD - Are suggesting a state of mild intoxication is required to become a Kipper?
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    Mr. Rentool, perhaps. You'd need to be thoroughly inebriated to think Prime Minister Ed Miliband sounds good, though ;)
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    MikeK said:

    MikeK said:

    George Osborne's masterful strategy will yield a vote winning budget in 2015.

    Let's not forget, it was his policies that stopped the election that never was in 2007, and helped the Tory revival this year post the budget.

    It was a Frit Gordon that stopped the election. Georgie Porgie got undeserved kudos for a policy he never fully carried out when in power.
    There's so much wrong with that post, I don't know where to start.

    But I'll try

    George Osborne's 2007 announcement that only millionaires would pay inheritance tax under a Conservative government was credited with heading off the threat of the then prime minister Gordon Brown calling a snap election.

    Have you forgotten the polling from the time, mahoosive Tory swings.

    The reason he hasn't been able to deliver on it, is the economy went mammary glands up, and he had to prioritise elsewhere

    http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/mar/24/cameron-tories-raise-inheritance-threshold
    I'll repeat. Frit Gordon Brown squashed winnable election because he was scared of a chimera. The Tory swing was not enough at that point to stop Labour winning.
    Your memory appears to be faulty. Straight after the Tory conference

    http://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2007/10/06/icm-poll-gives-tories-6-lead-in-50-marginals/
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    F1: forgot about this until just now. Working on, er, work at the moment, but when I finish the little bit I'm on I'll see about putting up an Early Thoughts mini-piece for Spa (as sort of suggested by Mr. Putney).
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    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,637
    MD - just when I thought we had found common cause in picking on the Kippers, and then you go and spoil it!
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    isam said:

    Has anyone read "Revolt on the Right"?!!!!

    Actually, I haven't, but from reading Ford & Goodwin's blogs it is blatantly obvious why UKIP voters don't think things will get better for them. It's because things have been getting worse for them for decades, and when they point out why they get called racist bigots by rich people who carry on with the same policies!

    Although the title, referring to "the right", is probably a bit misleading. I don't think it's a left/right thing most of the time.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    Mr. Rentool, when I'm not being mistaken for a 'PBTory' I'm usually being mistaken for a Kipper!

    I have voted for them (the purples) a couple of times.
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    Mr. Rentool, when I'm not being mistaken for a 'PBTory' I'm usually being mistaken for a Kipper!

    I have voted for them (the purples) a couple of times.

    Splitter.

    You're making it more likely Ed Miliband becomes PM and Ed Balls becomes Chancellor.
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    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    Measures such pumping government money into schemes like “help to buy” properties really don’t impact on many UKIPers.

    Increasing the minimum wage, however, might resonate.
    I don't think the minimum wage would help with targeting UKIP voters that much. UKIP voters are disproportionately to be found among the retired.

    The only single thing that I can think of is the idea of cutting alcohol duty rates for on licence sales, to help pubs compete against supermarkets.
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    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    "CEOs earning 143 times more than company averages, pay study shows
    Pay gap widest at mining company Rangold Resources, where Mark Bristow was paid £4.4m last year – nearly 1,500 times the average"

    http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/aug/18/pay-gap-grows-ftse-bosses
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    Mr. Rentool, when I'm not being mistaken for a 'PBTory' I'm usually being mistaken for a Kipper!

    I have voted for them (the purples) a couple of times.

    Splitter.

    You're making it more likely Ed Miliband becomes PM and Ed Balls becomes Chancellor.
    As would a NO vote in the IndyRef? :)
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    Forbes ‏@Forbes 9m
    The fact that "The Expendables 3" opened with $16.2m is something of a shock: http://onforb.es/VyOtcI

    Small attendances, plus expensive superstars, (so called) = Great flop in the making.
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    isamisam Posts: 40,933

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    It's all they've got
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    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
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    CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 59,757
    Given their demographic profile - isn't a degree if economic pessimism in order? And I'm not sure there is much George can do about that - they expected (some of them, by birthright) to be in the top half of the heap - now they are well into the bottom half with no likely way out. Though a Miliband premiership is unlikely to improve their lot.....
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    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    Kippers are probably non-green drivers and might like it if the Chancellor reduced fuel duty.

    Coupled with oil price falls, that might help the tories significantly.
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited August 2014
    A very interesting chart.

    I wonder which is cause and which is effect. For example, does the notably much higher level of optimism of Conservative supporters mean that people who think things are going well for them (and the country) reward the Conservatives by giving the party their support, or does it mean that the Conservative-led government's policies favour Conservative supporters?

    Obviously Labour will try to argue the latter, but Labour making that argument doesn't make it true.

    Conversely, the Conservatives will try to argue that their 'long-term economic plan is working', and hope to pull some of those not currently giving them credit for it into the fold.

    [Edit: Alternatively it might simply be that Labour and UKIP supporters say they are pessimistic because they don't want to give credit to the government for the improving economy].

    It would be interesting also to have the Labour grumpiness broken down into those working in the public sector, those working in the private sector, and those not in employment. Different policies, and different rhetoric, could potentially appeal to each of these groups.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Maybe a lot of UKIP voters don't believe that Ed Miliband is going to win the election whatever happens, which gives them more freedom to support the party. If Labour had a more impressive leader more of them would consider voting Tory to stop it happening.
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    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
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    Pay gap widest at mining company Rangold Resources, where Mark Bristow was paid £4.4m last year – nearly 1,500 times the average"

    So the average pay at Rangold Resources is 2,933 quid a year? Sounds like someone at the Grauniad can't do sums to me.
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    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
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    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
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    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,873

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Put me down as a maybe
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820
    edited August 2014
    Patrick said:

    Pay gap widest at mining company Rangold Resources, where Mark Bristow was paid £4.4m last year – nearly 1,500 times the average"

    So the average pay at Rangold Resources is 2,933 quid a year? Sounds like someone at the Grauniad can't do sums to me.

    Most of their employees are in Mali and South Africa. It's a silly statistic.
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    Patrick said:

    Pay gap widest at mining company Rangold Resources, where Mark Bristow was paid £4.4m last year – nearly 1,500 times the average"

    So the average pay at Rangold Resources is 2,933 quid a year? Sounds like someone at the Grauniad can't do sums to me.

    Aren't a lot of their employees in Africa, so it is possible.

    I know, one of the papers did a similar trick when comparing the Nike CEO's salary to what one of their employees in Bangladesh does.
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    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
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    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,008

    A very interesting chart.

    I wonder which is cause and which is effect. For example, does the notably much higher level of optimism of Conservative supporters mean that people who think things are going well for them (and the country) reward the Conservatives by giving the party their support, or does it mean that the Conservative-led government's policies favour Conservative supporters?

    Obviously Labour will try to argue the latter, but Labour making that argument doesn't make it true.

    Conversely, the Conservatives will try to argue that their 'long-term economic plan is working', and hope to pull some of those not currently giving them credit for it into the fold.

    [Edit: Alternatively it might simply be that Labour and UKIP supporters say they are pessimistic because they don't want to give credit to the government for the improving economy].

    It would be interesting also to have the Labour grumpiness broken down into those working in the public sector, those working in the private sector, and those not in employment. Different policies, and different rhetoric, could potentially appeal to each of these groups.

    Some very good questions.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,489
    edited August 2014

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Put me down as a maybe
    We also increased the NHS budget, when Labour wanted to cut it.

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!
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    Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,820

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!

    There's an op to make you vote Tory?
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    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    edited August 2014

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
  • Options

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!

    There's an op to make you vote Tory?
    Under Jeremy Hunt's brilliant leadership, there soon will be.
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    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    I see you can't rebut any of those achievements.
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    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
  • Options

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!

    There's an op to make you vote Tory?
    Of course: 'Voting Tory will cause your wife to have bigger breasts and increase your chances of owning a BMW M3'
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    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    edited August 2014
    taffys said:

    Kippers are probably non-green drivers and might like it if the Chancellor reduced fuel duty.

    Coupled with oil price falls, that might help the tories significantly.

    I thought of fuel duty, but Osborne has foregone a lot of revenue for the Treasury by cutting fuel duty and cancelling planned increases, without much sign of blunting the UKIP surge, so I don't think he could afford to do enough to be noticed.

    That's why my thoughts turned to alcohol duties, and supporting that struggling British Institution, the pub.
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    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    Since Blair and Cameron arrived on the political stage, there is really very little difference between modern Labour and Tory parties.
  • Options

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
  • Options
    Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 60,988
    F1: vague early musings here:
    http://enormo-haddock.blogspot.co.uk/2014/08/belgium-early-thoughts.html

    Do feel free to add your own rambly thoughts.
  • Options
    OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 32,008
    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    I thought gay marriage was the thing that REALLY p****d off the Kippers.
  • Options
    taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    That's why my thoughts turned to alcohol duties, and supporting that struggling British Institution, the pub.

    I know UKIP are in favour of easing the smoking ban in pubs. I guess cutting alcohol duties would be a coherent step.
  • Options
    Eh?...when did India become a success?
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395

    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    I thought gay marriage was the thing that REALLY p****d off the Kippers.
    Farage has said UKIP policy is not to repeal gay marriage.
  • Options
    For those that may have missed it from yesterday:

    Exclusive! The Sunil on Sunday's inaugural ELBOW!

    Electoral Leader-Board Of the Week (10 polls field-work 10th Aug to 15th Aug):

    Labour 36.2%
    Cons 33.1%
    UKIP 13.1%
    LibDems 8.8%

    Um, we can't give any net changes as this is our first time, but we promise to do so next week [ie. Sunday] :)

    Now JackW will be able to discern his ARSE from our ELBOW!
  • Options

    taffys said:

    Kippers are probably non-green drivers and might like it if the Chancellor reduced fuel duty.

    Coupled with oil price falls, that might help the tories significantly.

    I thought of fuel duty, but Osborne has foregone a lot of revenue for the Treasury by cutting fuel duty and cancelling planned increases, without much sign of blunting the UKIP surge, so I don't think he could afford to do enough to be noticed.

    That's why my thoughts turned to alcohol duties, and supporting that struggling British Institution, the pub.
    I said at the time, you don't get credit for cancelling future tax rises.

    Say if your fuel costs per week are maybe £100 per week, and they still remain £100 per week because of the cancelled increases, you're not going to feel any better off.
  • Options
    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    I see you can't rebut any of those achievements.
    I'll hand you a wet sponge to calm your brow. :)
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,873

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Put me down as a maybe
    We also increased the NHS budget, when Labour wanted to cut it.

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!
    Thanks Its on Thursday. I will be back on PB end of next week hopefully

    When do you reckon the Manchester PB meet will be?

    I am hoping to be recovered enough to attend.
  • Options
    Patrick said:

    Eh?...when did India become a success?

    Once proudly socialist and nonaligned, India is being remade as a roaring capitalist success story and emerging strategic partner of the United States. Economic reforms have raised per capita GDP and lowered poverty rates, while New Delhi's growing self-confidence may help it become the swing state in the global balance of power.

    http://www.foreignaffairs.com/features/collections/the-rise-of-india
  • Options

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933

    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    Since Blair and Cameron arrived on the political stage, there is really very little difference between modern Labour and Tory parties.
    Ah someone gets it!
  • Options
    Patrick said:

    Eh?...when did India become a success?

    You're right! The Caste-botherers got soundly thrashed in the last two Test Matches :)
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,873

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!

    There's an op to make you vote Tory?
    Didn't mention it in the fact sheet I will check out if its a side effect before I let the knife anywhere near me.
  • Options

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Put me down as a maybe
    We also increased the NHS budget, when Labour wanted to cut it.

    Honestly, keep on meeting me more often, and I'll have you voting Tory next year, I'm very persuasive.

    PS - Did I read that you were having an op soon? If so best of luck!
    Thanks Its on Thursday. I will be back on PB end of next week hopefully

    When do you reckon the Manchester PB meet will be?

    I am hoping to be recovered enough to attend.
    Tuesday the 23rd of September
  • Options
    JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380
    Back on topic for me-

    Oh my, just looked at the graph.

    25% for the LDs - once again the LDs playing their part in team GB-

    Honestly, What more do you want from us.
  • Options

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933

    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    I thought gay marriage was the thing that REALLY p****d off the Kippers.
    Yeah that'll get Kippers back

    We did something that made you vote UKIP, made London house prices soar and implemented a Lib Dem policy we used to disagree with

    Vote Tory!
  • Options
    bigjohnowlsbigjohnowls Posts: 21,873

    For those that may have missed it from yesterday:

    Exclusive! The Sunil on Sunday's inaugural ELBOW!

    Electoral Leader-Board Of the Week (10 polls field-work 10th Aug to 15th Aug):

    Labour 36.2%
    Cons 33.1%
    UKIP 13.1%
    LibDems 8.8%

    Um, we can't give any net changes as this is our first time, but we promise to do so next week [ie. Sunday] :)

    Now JackW will be able to discern his ARSE from our ELBOW!

    Boom Tish
  • Options
    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    For those that may have missed it from yesterday:

    Exclusive! The Sunil on Sunday's inaugural ELBOW!

    Electoral Leader-Board Of the Week (10 polls field-work 10th Aug to 15th Aug):

    Labour 36.2%
    Cons 33.1%
    UKIP 13.1%
    LibDems 8.8%

    Um, we can't give any net changes as this is our first time, but we promise to do so next week [ie. Sunday] :)

    Now JackW will be able to discern his ARSE from our ELBOW!

    More power to your ELBOW Sunnil. I hope it prospers and give JackW a kick up his ARSE. ;)
  • Options

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
  • Options
    AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    Re-post from yesterday:

    New general election forecasting model designed by academics from LSE, UEA, Durham:

    http://electionforecast.co.uk/
  • Options
    JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    I wouldn't know-

    As, I keep telling you all - the OU did not teach me high Politics-

    Bangladesh are top right and the Christians???

  • Options
    MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    Stop taking the Piss, TSE.
  • Options
    MarkHopkinsMarkHopkins Posts: 5,584
    isam said:

    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    Since Blair and Cameron arrived on the political stage, there is really very little difference between modern Labour and Tory parties.
    Ah someone gets it!
    Blair/Cameron act(ed) that way to go for the centre ground. Whether you agree with that or not, it is only the way to win a majority.

    UKIP (unless they change) will always be a protest party, and whilst that will have appeal to some, they will never form a government from where they stand, and have no hope of implementing their agenda.

  • Options
    OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    taffys said:

    Kippers are probably non-green drivers and might like it if the Chancellor reduced fuel duty.

    Coupled with oil price falls, that might help the tories significantly.

    I thought of fuel duty, but Osborne has foregone a lot of revenue for the Treasury by cutting fuel duty and cancelling planned increases, without much sign of blunting the UKIP surge, so I don't think he could afford to do enough to be noticed.

    That's why my thoughts turned to alcohol duties, and supporting that struggling British Institution, the pub.
    For example, the government forecasts for 2012-13 were that fuel duties would raise £27.3bn for the Exchequer and Alcohol duties £10.6bn.

    It's also worth noting that - since 1998 - tax as a percentage of retail price has increased for Beer, Wine and Spirits, but decreased for fuel.
  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,329
    edited August 2014
    JBriskin said:

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    I wouldn't know-

    As, I keep telling you all - the OU did not teach me high Politics-

    Bangladesh are top right and the Christians???

    Location correct, but Christians only a minority (along with Hindus), the Bangladeshis are ~85% Muslim.
  • Options
    JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380
    I think I need a comprehensive education, to make up for my comprehensive education.

    Black family of dude shot yappying on Sky news now.
  • Options

    Patrick said:

    Eh?...when did India become a success?

    Once proudly socialist and nonaligned, India is being remade as a roaring capitalist success story and emerging strategic partner of the United States. Economic reforms have raised per capita GDP and lowered poverty rates, while New Delhi's growing self-confidence may help it become the swing state in the global balance of power.

    http://www.foreignaffairs.com/features/collections/the-rise-of-india
    Hmm....the direction of travel is once again (probably) improving with the new government....but there's an AWFUL long way to go. I always thought India was basically unreformable, unmodernisable. I hope I'm wrong. It's still a tragically poor and backwards place. The life opportunities of a rural Untouchable are frankly an outrage.
  • Options
    JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380

    JBriskin said:

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    I wouldn't know-

    As, I keep telling you all - the OU did not teach me high Politics-

    Bangladesh are top right and the Christians???

    Location correct, but Christians only a minority (along with Hindus), the Bangladeshis are ~85% Muslim.
    Thanks Sunil - yet more info for me (I'm not taking the piss either), I was under the impression that the whole principle of Bangladesh was to protect the Christians (probably misread something from channel 4)
  • Options
    SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    Miserable buggers, - that’s what happens when spend all day hanging around the Mail and Telegraph comment section….!


    ; )
  • Options
    isamisam Posts: 40,933

    isam said:

    MikeK said:

    Sean_F said:

    Kippers really are a bunch of miserable old gits aren't they?

    Only if you think that (a) their financial circumstances are improving (b) they ought to give credit to George Osborne for it.

    Overall, levels of economic optimism depend on where you are in the food chain.

    I'm sure helping in usher in Ed Miliband as Prime Minister will cheer them up and improve their financial circumstances.
    Isn't it negative campaigning of the worst kind for supporters of Party A to tell supporters of Party B that to vote B will let Party C in?

    You have to give B supporters a positive reason to vote A.
    Vote conservative, we're the party that introduced gay marriage, see the economy become one of the best performers in the world, we increased the personal allowance, making sure low paid people don't pay any tax, lots of great employment stats.

    Those are some of the many reasons to vote Tory next year.
    Mr Eagles is Sweating !!!! A thing I never thought to see. A paragraph of pure Tory propaganda is espoused.

    The Tories must really be afraid of UKIP as they see that past failures to suppress it has only made it grow faster. I really hope that the Mycelium of the UKIP body, will choke the Tories especially, because they've reneged on all that Conservatives used to stand for.
    Since Blair and Cameron arrived on the political stage, there is really very little difference between modern Labour and Tory parties.
    Ah someone gets it!
    Blair/Cameron act(ed) that way to go for the centre ground. Whether you agree with that or not, it is only the way to win a majority.

    UKIP (unless they change) will always be a protest party, and whilst that will have appeal to some, they will never form a government from where they stand, and have no hope of implementing their agenda.

    Ah Cameron and Blair.. two geniuses that changed the country so politics could only be done their way... forever!
  • Options
    DavidLDavidL Posts: 51,311
    Rexel56 said:

    UKIP voters are sick of living under the oppressive yoke of hospital car park charges...

    LOL

  • Options
    Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 49,329
    edited August 2014
    JBriskin said:

    JBriskin said:

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    I wouldn't know-

    As, I keep telling you all - the OU did not teach me high Politics-

    Bangladesh are top right and the Christians???

    Location correct, but Christians only a minority (along with Hindus), the Bangladeshis are ~85% Muslim.
    Thanks Sunil - yet more info for me (I'm not taking the piss either), I was under the impression that the whole principle of Bangladesh was to protect the Christians (probably misread something from channel 4)
    Nah, it split from Pakistan in late 1971 (after Indian intervention). Throughout 1971 there was a bloody civil war between the Pakistan military and the Bangladeshi separatists

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangladesh_Liberation_War
  • Options
    JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380

    JBriskin said:

    JBriskin said:

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    I wouldn't know-

    As, I keep telling you all - the OU did not teach me high Politics-

    Bangladesh are top right and the Christians???

    Location correct, but Christians only a minority (along with Hindus), the Bangladeshis are ~85% Muslim.
    Thanks Sunil - yet more info for me (I'm not taking the piss either), I was under the impression that the whole principle of Bangladesh was to protect the Christians (probably misread something from channel 4)
    Nah, it split from Pakistan in late 1971 (after Indian intervention). Throughout 1971 there was a bloody civil war between the Pakistan military and the Bangladeshi separatists

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangladesh_Liberation_War
    Ah, yes, I remember now - there was left Pakistan and right Pakistan. Difficult to keep up with.

  • Options
    Patrick said:

    Patrick said:

    Eh?...when did India become a success?

    Once proudly socialist and nonaligned, India is being remade as a roaring capitalist success story and emerging strategic partner of the United States. Economic reforms have raised per capita GDP and lowered poverty rates, while New Delhi's growing self-confidence may help it become the swing state in the global balance of power.

    http://www.foreignaffairs.com/features/collections/the-rise-of-india
    Hmm....the direction of travel is once again (probably) improving with the new government....but there's an AWFUL long way to go. I always thought India was basically unreformable, unmodernisable. I hope I'm wrong. It's still a tragically poor and backwards place. The life opportunities of a rural Untouchable are frankly an outrage.
    If they carry on adhering to the Caste system (especially through marriage), believing in Astrology (it's considered a science at University level - strange but true!), and playing frakking Cricket, they will always lag behind!
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    JBriskin said:

    JBriskin said:

    JBriskin said:

    Mr. Eagles, short of a Yes and a currency union, I'm nailed on to vote Conservative at the General Election, in a bid to thwart Balls being an MP, let alone Chancellor.

    If Cameron had spent more on Defence and was less of a greenist I may have voted blue last time.

    Those are minor flaws.

    Dave's used the military efficiently, he's toppled the vile dictator Qadaffi
    And Libya's a bed of roses now, isn't it?
    Give it time.
    Three years and counting...
    Nation building takes time, look how long it took India to become a success after Independence.
    How about Pakistan and Bangladesh, out of interest?
    Once they re-unite, within in weeks.
    You are dreaming!
    I wouldn't know-

    As, I keep telling you all - the OU did not teach me high Politics-

    Bangladesh are top right and the Christians???

    Location correct, but Christians only a minority (along with Hindus), the Bangladeshis are ~85% Muslim.
    Thanks Sunil - yet more info for me (I'm not taking the piss either), I was under the impression that the whole principle of Bangladesh was to protect the Christians (probably misread something from channel 4)
    Nah, it split from Pakistan in late 1971 (after Indian intervention). Throughout 1971 there was a bloody civil war between the Pakistan military and the Bangladeshi separatists

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bangladesh_Liberation_War
    Ah, yes, I remember now - there was left Pakistan and right Pakistan. Difficult to keep up with.

    Yep, separated by 1,500 miles of often hostile Indian territory! Geographically absurd!
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