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politicalbetting.com » Blog Archive » Both LAB and Ukip drop 4% in latest Ipsos-MORI poll with th

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  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Pulpstar said:

    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    Was it ever in doubt ?
    No more than it was ever in doubt that Labour would win Bradford West...

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    Btw the "Real" Betfair price is 1.54 not 2/7 (1.28) just because someone has £20 @ 1.31 doesn't mean it is there yet... I could put my house up at 50%+ it's price... doesn't mean it'll sell for that much ;)
  • JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,291

    ToryJim said:

    Rory Stewart has been elected to chair the Defence select committee. Intriguing.

    Other MP's going "ooh look, that bloke off the telly...."
    Colonel Bob won't be a happy bunny this afternoon.

    Triumph for yet another Old Etonian.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337

    The Scottish sub sample would see the Tories gaining Berwickshire from the Libs and Dumfries and Renfrewshire East from Labour, but losing out to the SNP in Argyll, Fife, Aberdeenshire West and parts of Ayrshire and Edinburgh.
    Surely Lab can't slump to 22 in Scotland?!

    I wondered too. I'm well aware of error sizes and am not too inclined to take it very seriously. But when the Herald (the - mainly - pro-Unionist daily, from Labour's Glasgow heartland, remember) is publishing stuff like this, I do wonder.

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/labour-has-lost-sight-of-what-it-stands-for.1399979290

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/poll-position-defies-labour-on-both-sides-of-the-border.1400060291

  • stodgestodge Posts: 13,986
    Afternoon all :)

    I always find it amusing when people are so certain of how those politically opposed to them are going to behave. It's the "people of Party A will vote for Party B if Party A is on the slide/has no chance".mentality.

    It seems almost a maxim that political activists understand their enemies far better than their friends.(assuming they have any).

    Anyhow, polls a-plenty and for some the message seems clear though with ratings ranging from 31-34%, the Conservatives aren't really in a game-winning position yet. In truth, the statistical dead-heat has been there for a while with some pollsters.

    Those who follow ICM over the years know it throws out occasional Party outliers both on the high and low sides so the 31% Labour number may change considerably next month and as the Ashcroft poll is first time out it remains to be seen how those numbers will change/develop.

    Even so, we come rolling back to the same questions about Labour and how a Labour-governed Britain would differ from a Conservative-governed Britain or what we have now. Many on here will condemn anything and everything Labour propose almost on instinct. A more serious analysis would be in order but there's nothing yet to analyse.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406

    Pulpstar said:

    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    Was it ever in doubt ?
    No more than it was ever in doubt that Labour would win Bradford West...

    UKIP & Labour are no match for Galloway when it comes to a trench war ground game ;)
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143

    ToryJim said:

    The polling has gone a bit Second Punic War for Labour in this parliament.

    Some of us kept on telling you that Labour's lead/Cannae were overrated and just not good enough.

    Labour must be worried that the next election will be their Zama.

    Ed Miliband = Hannibal.

    Perhaps after the election Doncaster will be razed and the remnants sown with salt ;)
    The only good thing in Doncaster is the m18. Because that leads to Sheffield.
    Sheffield, another place that would be improved by a smallish nuclear device.
    Sheffield apparently/allegedly has the highest number of trees per person of any city in Europe, though this might say more about where the city boundary is drawn than anything else.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    Just been our posting ukip leaflets in Upminster and I've come over all Nick Palmer

    100% of people I spoke to said they were voting ukip at the Euros

    Both unprompted!

    One cited media/other parties ganging up to dig dirt on kippers as his motive... He said he'd prob vote Tory at the GE though.... He did say he wanted out of EU, and that he was from Newham but you need a passport to get in there now

    The other guy said this country needs a change and the others are all the same

    Over and out



  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    For those punters who believe the Greens have somehow magically and in no time at all doubled their share of the vote, which I most assuredly do not, then Brighton Pavilion is surely the place to invest where those nice people at both Ladbrokes an Paddy Power will offer you evens on Ms Lucas retaining her seat.

    If there's a type of person who'd switch lib/lab -> green, most in Brighton would already have done it
  • ToryJim said:

    The polling has gone a bit Second Punic War for Labour in this parliament.

    Some of us kept on telling you that Labour's lead/Cannae were overrated and just not good enough.

    Labour must be worried that the next election will be their Zama.

    Ed Miliband = Hannibal.

    Perhaps after the election Doncaster will be razed and the remnants sown with salt ;)
    The only good thing in Doncaster is the m18. Because that leads to Sheffield.
    Sheffield, another place that would be improved by a smallish nuclear device.
    Sheffield apparently/allegedly has the highest number of trees per person of any city in Europe, though this might say more about where the city boundary is drawn than anything else.

    Taking in part of Sherwood Forest you mean?

  • JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380
    stodge said:

    Many on here will condemn anything and everything Labour propose almost on instinct.

    Afternoon Stodge. They don't propose much though do they? We'll cut the deficit. How? We won't tell you.

  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    The idea that the Greens are within 3% of UKIP is absolutely bonkers.
  • MrJones said:

    For those punters who believe the Greens have somehow magically and in no time at all doubled their share of the vote, which I most assuredly do not, then Brighton Pavilion is surely the place to invest where those nice people at both Ladbrokes an Paddy Power will offer you evens on Ms Lucas retaining her seat.

    If there's a type of person who'd switch lib/lab -> green, most in Brighton would already have done it
    Er yes ..... quite ...... so all Ms Lucas has to do is to hold onto such votes and hey presto she's a winner - simples really!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 52,937
    On recent polling in general - to be honest, we Tories have no better crystal balls than any other party. But after all the schtick that we get (pbTories are always wrong, pbTories never learn...yada yada yada....) it is somewhat heartening that things do at least appear - for now at least - to be turning in our direction.

    And quite rightly, too. The turn around in the economy may have uncertain footings, but it has been faster and broader than any pom-pom shaker for the Tories could have sanely hoped for.

    But if the Right has been wrong-footed by this turn around, the Left has been shown to be horribly, 180 degrees wrong in its assessment of how the economy would perform. Being shown up must hurt. It might explain the worst of their visceral hatred towards Tories. No-one likes to be shown to be wrong. Again....and again...and again....

    But Labour are always wrong. They never learn. Yada yada yada....

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406

    ToryJim said:

    The polling has gone a bit Second Punic War for Labour in this parliament.

    Some of us kept on telling you that Labour's lead/Cannae were overrated and just not good enough.

    Labour must be worried that the next election will be their Zama.

    Ed Miliband = Hannibal.

    Perhaps after the election Doncaster will be razed and the remnants sown with salt ;)
    The only good thing in Doncaster is the m18. Because that leads to Sheffield.
    Sheffield, another place that would be improved by a smallish nuclear device.
    Sheffield apparently/allegedly has the highest number of trees per person of any city in Europe, though this might say more about where the city boundary is drawn than anything else.

    Taking in part of Sherwood Forest you mean?

    Yep, that's the forest, Peter_from_Chelsea
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @BBCNormanS: Austin Mitchell refuses to apologise on air when pressed over Pfizer rape tweet
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    Scott_P said:

    @BBCNormanS: Austin Mitchell refuses to apologise on air when pressed over Pfizer rape tweet

    Y'what?!? That's unbelievable.

  • EastwingerEastwinger Posts: 354
    antifrank said:

    Anyone who wants to surf the Green tide should note that they are available at 25/1 in Norwich South with Paddy Power, where in theory they require only an 7.3% swing to take the seat.

    There are sillier bets out there.

    Green Party posters outnumber Labour 2-1 in my part of Norwich South.
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @BBCNormanS: Austin Mitchell says 'rape" tweet row has been "whipped up by over sensitive Tories"
  • SpeedySpeedy Posts: 12,100
    edited May 2014
    I think the euros are influencing westminster polls to much these days.
    In the beggining of the euro election campaign people's preference for the euros was influenced by what they would vote for westminster, now its the opposite effect.
  • isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited May 2014
    Conservative porky pies in Rommo


    Romford Conservatives falsely quote residents in newsletters

    "To one man’s outrage he was quoted as insulting Barking and Dagenham - where his family live.

    The newsletters were sent to wards across the Romford constituency and claim to contain messages from local residents.

    Thomas Waller, 62, of Garrick House, appears to say in the Hylands leaflet: “People in this area do not want Havering turning into another Barking and Dagenham.”

    But speaking to the Recorder he said: “For the life of me, I didn’t say it and I would never have said it

    My daughter and grandchild live in Barking and Dagenham, my wife was brought up there. There’s no way I would’ve said it.

    “I’m certainly not a member of the Conservative party,” he said. “My dad would turn in his grave if he thought I was,”

    http://www.romfordrecorder.co.uk/news/politics/romford_conservatives_falsely_quote_residents_in_newsletters_1_3598463
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    edited May 2014

    MrJones said:

    For those punters who believe the Greens have somehow magically and in no time at all doubled their share of the vote, which I most assuredly do not, then Brighton Pavilion is surely the place to invest where those nice people at both Ladbrokes an Paddy Power will offer you evens on Ms Lucas retaining her seat.

    If there's a type of person who'd switch lib/lab -> green, most in Brighton would already have done it
    Er yes ..... quite ...... so all Ms Lucas has to do is to hold onto such votes and hey presto she's a winner - simples really!
    Shifting the goal posts. Your original point was

    "For those punters who believe the Greens have somehow magically and in no time at all doubled their share of the vote, which I most assuredly do not, then Brighton Pavilion is surely the place to invest"

    I am saying if there is a specific type of voter who would shift lib/lab -> green, under the right circumstances then that would already have happened in Brighton so your original point wouldn't necessarily apply.

    Also I'm not saying the Green vote has doubled. I'm saying that's where the Core Lib vote would go if they gave up.

    Given that i'd say *if* this poll is a bit out of whack then the reason might be over sampling Lib voters.

    edit: I see the other point you might be making now. In which case fair enough.
  • RodCrosbyRodCrosby Posts: 7,737

    ToryJim said:

    The polling has gone a bit Second Punic War for Labour in this parliament.

    Some of us kept on telling you that Labour's lead/Cannae were overrated and just not good enough.

    Labour must be worried that the next election will be their Zama.

    Ed Miliband = Hannibal.

    Perhaps after the election Doncaster will be razed and the remnants sown with salt ;)
    The only good thing in Doncaster is the m18. Because that leads to Sheffield.
    Sheffield, another place that would be improved by a smallish nuclear device.
    Sheffield apparently/allegedly has the highest number of trees per person of any city in Europe, though this might say more about where the city boundary is drawn than anything else.
    If you love trees, come to the 'Pool...

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/liverpool/content/articles/2007/11/14/nob_autumnwatch_favourite_tree_feature.shtml
    http://www.allertonoak.com/images/MenloveAvenue.jpg
    http://www.allertonoak.com/merseyWalks/GreenBeltTrail.html
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564
    For a change, a Ukrainian poll, to be taken with more than usual caution but generally interesting and maybe even useful:

    http://comresupdates.eu.com/DCJ-2GEZW-F21LMD8E11/cr.aspx

    As I've said here before, I've always thought that pro-Russian separatism was very strong in Crimea but much more nuanced in the rest of the east of Ukraine: the idea of getting westernised and rich has its attractions and not everyone wants to sign up with the nationalist zealots on either side. If the poll is accurate it's delicately balanced, which is perhaps why both Kiev and Moscow have refrained from massive military intervention and the local rebels have been obscuring whether they want separation or merely regionalism. A deal still looks possible if there was someone trusted to make it work, and perhaps Merkel is the right person to put it forward once the further referendum and election are out of the way.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    edited May 2014
    ToryJim said:

    Scott_P said:

    @BBCNormanS: Austin Mitchell refuses to apologise on air when pressed over Pfizer rape tweet

    Y'what?!? That's unbelievable.

    Let's see if Ed fires up his intellectual superiority, and takes the whip away.

    Or cowers, until the sisterhood tell him to do something about it.

    Has Harman said anything?
  • FloaterFloater Posts: 14,207
    ToryJim said:

    Labour MP calls Pfizer rapists and incurs wrath of the Tory ladies...

    http://www.newstatesman.com/media/2014/05/labour-mp-austin-mitchell-seems-call-pfizer-rapists-twitter

    Labour classy as always.

    What has Ms Harman got to say about that?
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    Floater said:

    ToryJim said:

    Labour MP calls Pfizer rapists and incurs wrath of the Tory ladies...

    http://www.newstatesman.com/media/2014/05/labour-mp-austin-mitchell-seems-call-pfizer-rapists-twitter

    Labour classy as always.

    What has Ms Harman got to say about that?
    Nothing
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,779
    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262

    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.

    He's blaming Autocorrect on his phone. Meant to type 'rapaciousness'.
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    I think the pfizer deal stinks. Essentially they are a giant mediocrity of a company gobling up competitors just to stand still.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    The sharks begin to circle for Ed. Brogan seriously questioning the position of Labour. I reckon Miliband could get a hammering in the media if the elections are disappointing. If I were Labour I'd hope there were good results in a week, and not just turfing Rahman out in East London, because otherwise I think the narrative will move heavily against them.

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/benedictbrogan/100271565/is-cheerful-ed-miliband-oblivious-to-the-desperate-mess-hes-in/
  • Scott_PScott_P Posts: 51,453
    @CCHQPress: Things don't start so well for Ed Balls on LBC this afternoon. Ed Balls: 'Good Morning.' It's ten past five. Labour turning back the clock.
  • SlackbladderSlackbladder Posts: 9,779

    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.

    He's blaming Autocorrect on his phone. Meant to type 'rapaciousness'.
    I'm not sure he knows words longer than 5 letters..
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.

    He's blaming Autocorrect on his phone. Meant to type 'rapaciousness'.
    Yes, but not apologising for inadvertently causing offence is doltishness of staggering proportions
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    taffys said:

    I think the pfizer deal stinks. Essentially they are a giant mediocrity of a company gobling up competitors just to stand still.

    Funny. It never seems to be an issue when a British company takes over a foreign competitor.
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976

    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.

    He's blaming Autocorrect on his phone. Meant to type 'rapaciousness'.
    I'm not sure he knows words longer than 5 letters..
    My thought exactly - the original wording is far more his style.
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,844
    I think the key issue with the Mitchell/Rape story is the hypocrisy of the left with regards to the reaction. If a Tory backbencher had made a similar comment, the left would have jumped up and down for days over it. But as it is one of their own, they are trying to claim it as a non-story.

    Mitchell knew exactly what he was doing - he just loves the limelight. And probably enjoys making Ed's life a little bit more difficult this week as well...
  • corporealcorporeal Posts: 2,549

    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.

    He's blaming Autocorrect on his phone. Meant to type 'rapaciousness'.
    I thought this was quite a funny joke, now I find out it's true.
  • TheWatcherTheWatcher Posts: 5,262
    edited May 2014

    I see Austin Mitchell's been a bit of a idiot..

    Nothing new there then.

    He's blaming Autocorrect on his phone. Meant to type 'rapaciousness'.
    I'm not sure he knows words longer than 5 letters..
    Well done to the Party Spad who's spent the afternoon searching for a suitable 'get out of jail' word. And failing.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    I think the key issue with the Mitchell/Rape story is the hypocrisy of the left with regards to the reaction. If a Tory backbencher had made a similar comment, the left would have jumped up and down for days over it. But as it is one of their own, they are trying to claim it as a non-story.

    Mitchell knew exactly what he was doing - he just loves the limelight. And probably enjoys making Ed's life a little bit more difficult this week as well...

    Yes it's the standard approach lefty shoes something accidentally offensive and it's an innocent mistake etc righty does the same and it's "x shows true colours" rubbish
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    ToryJim said:

    I think the key issue with the Mitchell/Rape story is the hypocrisy of the left with regards to the reaction. If a Tory backbencher had made a similar comment, the left would have jumped up and down for days over it. But as it is one of their own, they are trying to claim it as a non-story.

    Mitchell knew exactly what he was doing - he just loves the limelight. And probably enjoys making Ed's life a little bit more difficult this week as well...

    Yes it's the standard approach lefty shoes something accidentally offensive and it's an innocent mistake etc righty does the same and it's "x shows true colours" rubbish
    All very true, but I'm not letting it spoil my enjoyment of watching them squirm. The silence of high ranking women in the Labour party will be noticed and commented on soon enough. I'll enjoy that too :)
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,844
    Anorak said:

    The silence of high ranking women in the Labour party will be noticed and commented on soon enough. I'll enjoy that too :)

    Harriet has made it quite difficult for herself to speak out on the subject of abuse and rape recently.

  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    Anorak said:

    The silence of high ranking women in the Labour party will be noticed and commented on soon enough. I'll enjoy that too :)

    Harriet has made it quite difficult for herself to speak out on the subject of abuse and rape recently.

    How?
  • AndyJSAndyJS Posts: 29,395
    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    I still think UKIP have a good chance in Newark.
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    BBC on-line, front page - "Labour MP slammed over 'rape' tweet"

    Things have certainly improved over at the Beeb, any mention of a Labour MP used to be filed under Scottish weather...!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27411712
  • oxfordsimonoxfordsimon Posts: 5,844
    As Guido has just tweeted, it is only a matter of weeks since a Tory Councillor was forced to step down for likening house-building to rape...

    How is that different to what Mitchell has done?
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    BBC on-line, front page - "Labour MP slammed over 'rape' tweet"

    Things have certainly improved over at the Beeb, any mention of a Labour MP used to be filed under Scottish weather...!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27411712

    Stella Creasey's comment is staggering in that article.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621

    BBC on-line, front page - "Labour MP slammed over 'rape' tweet"

    Things have certainly improved over at the Beeb, any mention of a Labour MP used to be filed under Scottish weather...!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27411712

    Labour MP for Walthamstow Stella Creasy replied: "I'm glad you've discovered feminism Claire, even if just for political expediency."

    But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise."


    Told you I'd enjoy it.
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523
    AndyJS said:

    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    I still think UKIP have a good chance in Newark.
    I think it depends on whether that Lab thing about soft-pedaling in Newark was true or spin. If it was spin because their vote had evaporated then strange things could be happening.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    UPDATE: Ed Balls has hardly helped things, saying that what Mitchell said was “stupid” and that he should apologise but defended him as “a character”:...

    Oh Ed !
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189
    Anorak said:

    BBC on-line, front page - "Labour MP slammed over 'rape' tweet"

    Things have certainly improved over at the Beeb, any mention of a Labour MP used to be filed under Scottish weather...!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27411712

    Labour MP for Walthamstow Stella Creasy replied: "I'm glad you've discovered feminism Claire, even if just for political expediency."

    But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise."


    Told you I'd enjoy it.
    It's interesting that this has broken in the way it has, I think it shows a few things

    1. The General election campaign has started
    2. The Tories are up for the fight and going to hit Labour mercilessly on everything
    3. Labour aren't prepared for it

    How that plays out/influences opinion remains to be seen but Labour need to brace themselves for one hell of a lot of incoming.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Anorak said:

    Labour MP for Walthamstow Stella Creasy replied: "I'm glad you've discovered feminism Claire, even if just for political expediency."

    But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise."

    Told you I'd enjoy it.

    Normally the silly season doesn't start until July. Whilst Austin Mitchell is a twerp of the highest order, this is about as synthetic a row about nothing as you could possibly hope for.

    The issue shouldn't be his choice of word, but the anti-business sentiment behind it.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    Pulpstar said:

    UPDATE: Ed Balls has hardly helped things, saying that what Mitchell said was “stupid” and that he should apologise but defended him as “a character”:...

    Oh Ed !

    Finally someone with enough sense not to defend the indefensible.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    Anorak said:

    Labour MP for Walthamstow Stella Creasy replied: "I'm glad you've discovered feminism Claire, even if just for political expediency."

    But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise."

    Told you I'd enjoy it.

    Normally the silly season doesn't start until July. Whilst Austin Mitchell is a twerp of the highest order, this is about as synthetic a row about nothing as you could possibly hope for.

    The issue shouldn't be his choice of word, but the anti-business sentiment behind it.
    Oh I agree but Labour have claimed 100% ownership in the field of "wimmins ishoos" for far too long. About time some of our ladies took them on over that.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216

    ToryJim said:

    Rory Stewart has been elected to chair the Defence select committee. Intriguing.

    Other MP's going "ooh look, that bloke off the telly...."
    I think he's a good choice - he had Labour support and will take no nonsense from the coalition.

    http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2014/05/senior-labour-figures-back-rory-stewart-top-defence-post
  • HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    "But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise.""

    She said that to Stella Creasy? Arf, Arf! I might even go so far as to give my other dog impersonation, "Woof, woof, woof!" Hilarious and is this available on video anywhere? I'd love to see Creasy's face.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    "But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise.""

    She said that to Stella Creasy? Arf, Arf! I might even go so far as to give my other dog impersonation, "Woof, woof, woof!" Hilarious and is this available on video anywhere? I'd love to see Creasy's face.

    Afraid it seems it was a twitter spat.
  • NickPalmerNickPalmer Posts: 21,564
    MrJones said:

    AndyJS said:

    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    I still think UKIP have a good chance in Newark.
    I think it depends on whether that Lab thing about soft-pedaling in Newark was true or spin. If it was spin because their vote had evaporated then strange things could be happening.
    Some of the support I've been getting in Broxtowe has been whisked off to Newark for the whole month and I'm getting repeated invitations from Nottingham canvass groups to go there, so it's not true in any simple sense of not bothering. The article that started the story suggested that Labour wasn't going to spend a huge amount of money on it with lots of leaflets, and that might be true - I'm in Asia at the moment so don't have any basis for assessing how it's going. I'd trust Richard Tyndall to give us a fair picture if he's willing to, even though his sympathies are with UKIP. What are you seeing?

  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    ToryJim said:

    BBC on-line, front page - "Labour MP slammed over 'rape' tweet"

    Things have certainly improved over at the Beeb, any mention of a Labour MP used to be filed under Scottish weather...!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27411712

    Stella Creasey's comment is staggering in that article.
    Hmm, 'staggering' ? - just a fairly typical response from the Labour Ladies. – Screaming from the table top when it’s not one of theirs, hiding under a chair when it is.

    See John Prescott and Eric Joyce for details.
  • OblitusSumMeOblitusSumMe Posts: 9,143
    ToryJim said:

    I think the key issue with the Mitchell/Rape story is the hypocrisy of the left with regards to the reaction. If a Tory backbencher had made a similar comment, the left would have jumped up and down for days over it. But as it is one of their own, they are trying to claim it as a non-story.

    Mitchell knew exactly what he was doing - he just loves the limelight. And probably enjoys making Ed's life a little bit more difficult this week as well...

    Yes it's the standard approach lefty shoes something accidentally offensive and it's an innocent mistake etc righty does the same and it's "x shows true colours" rubbish
    That sounds like a failure of Theory of Mind - this would be a bit of a problem for a political tradition based on social solidarity.

    I'm tempted to suggest that this is symptomatic of the fact that the Left have not yet dealt with their defeats in the 80s. In other words, this is all Thatcher's fault ;-)
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    edited May 2014

    Anorak said:

    Labour MP for Walthamstow Stella Creasy replied: "I'm glad you've discovered feminism Claire, even if just for political expediency."

    But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise."

    Told you I'd enjoy it.

    Normally the silly season doesn't start until July. Whilst Austin Mitchell is a twerp of the highest order, this is about as synthetic a row about nothing as you could possibly hope for.

    The issue shouldn't be his choice of word, but the anti-business sentiment behind it.
    Hmmm. I think rape, and the abuse of the word, is a more sensitive topic than you think.

    My feeling is that the level of sensitivity varies a lot by age and gender (as you might expect). I also think that Mitchell's application of a spade to the hole he's in, by dismissing it as a lot of fuss about nothing, is worse than the initial tweet.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,578

    I think the key issue with the Mitchell/Rape story is the hypocrisy of the left with regards to the reaction. If a Tory backbencher had made a similar comment, the left would have jumped up and down for days over it. But as it is one of their own, they are trying to claim it as a non-story.

    That's not a Left thing, it's a politics thing.

    Actually, scratch that, it's not even a politcs thing, it's a human thing. Something we or our friends/allies do which might be seen as bad has to be contextualised, justified, trivialised. Something our opponents do is a disgrace, no explanation or dissembling permitted.
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    I still think UKIP have a good chance in Newark.

    Hmmn. quite tempted now...
  • MrJonesMrJones Posts: 3,523

    MrJones said:

    AndyJS said:

    taffys said:

    Prices for Con in Newark all contracting,the 2-7 on Betfair is approaching the true price so the 4-9 generally available by the books still represents value.

    Does anybody still think CON won;t do it?

    I still think UKIP have a good chance in Newark.
    I think it depends on whether that Lab thing about soft-pedaling in Newark was true or spin. If it was spin because their vote had evaporated then strange things could be happening.
    Some of the support I've been getting in Broxtowe has been whisked off to Newark for the whole month and I'm getting repeated invitations from Nottingham canvass groups to go there, so it's not true in any simple sense of not bothering. The article that started the story suggested that Labour wasn't going to spend a huge amount of money on it with lots of leaflets, and that might be true - I'm in Asia at the moment so don't have any basis for assessing how it's going. I'd trust Richard Tyndall to give us a fair picture if he's willing to, even though his sympathies are with UKIP. What are you seeing?

    "The article that started the story suggested that Labour wasn't going to spend a huge amount of money"

    Ah, in that case it wouldn't mean much.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    ToryJim said:

    BBC on-line, front page - "Labour MP slammed over 'rape' tweet"

    Things have certainly improved over at the Beeb, any mention of a Labour MP used to be filed under Scottish weather...!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27411712

    Stella Creasey's comment is staggering in that article.
    Hmm, 'staggering' ? - just a fairly typical response from the Labour Ladies. – Screaming from the table top when it’s not one of theirs, hiding under a chair when it is.

    See John Prescott and Eric Joyce for details.
    Oh I agree. It's just staggering that we are nearly a decade and a half into the 21st Century and yet still the left think that right wing women aren't "real women". The same attitude is prevalent over minorities and gays the idea that any on the right are "self-hating" or traitors to the cause. It really fecks me off.
  • macisbackmacisback Posts: 382
    JBriskin said:

    ITV4 - LIVE EUROPA LEAGUE FINAL (ko 7.45) - The showpiece match at the Juventus Stadium in Turin, where Juventus or Benfica take on Valencia or Sevilla (Radio times)


    Any betting advice will be accepted.

    Benfica have had a fantastic season and beat Juventus in the semi, so they would have to be favourites. If you want great odds Derby are 4/5 to beat qpr in the play off final, when they are much superior.

  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Anorak said:

    Hmmm. I think rape, and the abuse of the word, is a more sensitive topic than you think. My feeling is that the level of sensitivity varies a lot by age and gender (as you might expect).

    Yes, it has been artificially hyped up so that, even when it is quite obviously a harmless (if silly) figure of speech - as in Austin Mitchell's tweet - people get absurdly het up.

    You can see how absolutely silly it is by substituting another word - for example if he had tweeted 'Pfizer will murder AstraZeneca's R&D facilities', would anyone be up in arms, claiming he'd accused Pfizer of being murderers?
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    Has Louise Mensch weighed in with any pearls of wisdom yet ?

    She's normally first in the queue for a twitter row.
    Perhaps Mrs Bercow can inform us of her opinion too !
  • HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    ToryJim said:

    "But Ms Perry hit back, saying: "Honey I was a feminist while you were in nappies. Now woman up and get your dinosaur colleague to apologise.""

    She said that to Stella Creasy? Arf, Arf! I might even go so far as to give my other dog impersonation, "Woof, woof, woof!" Hilarious and is this available on video anywhere? I'd love to see Creasy's face.

    Afraid it seems it was a twitter spat.
    Dang! Never mind at least someone put that self righteous lady dog in her place for a change.

    Shame about Austin Mitchell though. I used to have a lot of time for him. I didn't always agree with his views but he was worth listening to and he didn't take himself too seriously, even had a column in the Telegraph for a while. Still the old boy is getting on now and at, what 80, may be the odd lapse is no more than we can expect from a man of his age.
  • BobaFettBobaFett Posts: 2,789
    Evening campers!

    Just catching up. Opinium - decent poll for Labour. But that right there is straw clutching as it's a b-league pollster.

    @Hurst FPT - wise words from a wise head

    @Watcher - LOL. Labour have lost the election according to many on here. You can read all about it.

  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406

    Anorak said:

    Hmmm. I think rape, and the abuse of the word, is a more sensitive topic than you think. My feeling is that the level of sensitivity varies a lot by age and gender (as you might expect).

    Yes, it has been artificially hyped up so that, even when it is quite obviously a harmless (if silly) figure of speech - as in Austin Mitchell's tweet - people get absurdly het up.

    You can see how absolutely silly it is by substituting another word - for example if he had tweeted 'Pfizer will murder AstraZeneca's R&D facilities', would anyone be up in arms, claiming he'd accused Pfizer of being murderers?
    Some people go utterly batshit crazy about the word 'rape' in any context !
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    Pulpstar said:


    Perhaps Mrs Bercow can inform us of her opinion too !

    She's gone very quiet, hasn't she? :|Innocent Face|:

  • JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380
    Meme Alert

    *Now Woman Up*

    And I'm not talking about cross dressing.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,406
    Bloody hell, going to have to make an entry for interest accrual in the accounts. Don't see that too often these days !
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621
    edited May 2014

    Anorak said:

    Hmmm. I think rape, and the abuse of the word, is a more sensitive topic than you think. My feeling is that the level of sensitivity varies a lot by age and gender (as you might expect).

    Yes, it has been artificially hyped up so that, even when it is quite obviously a harmless (if silly) figure of speech - as in Austin Mitchell's tweet - people get absurdly het up.

    You can see how absolutely silly it is by substituting another word - for example if he had tweeted 'Pfizer will murder AstraZeneca's R&D facilities', would anyone be up in arms, claiming he'd accused Pfizer of being murderers?
    It's similar to change in the treatment of race between the 1970s and now. Nicknames such as 'chalky' were not exactly rare, and for the most part thought of as harmless except by a few holier-than-thou cranks. Not many would subscribe to that view now, of course.

    I expect that those thinking a comment like Mitchell's are "a harmless figure of speech" will diminish rapidly in much the same way. The demographics pretty much guarantee it.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Pulpstar said:

    Some people go utterly batshit crazy about the word 'rape' in any context !

    Yes, the funny thing is that we laugh at the Victorians for taking offence or being shocked by the silliest things, and compliment ourselves on being so much more grown-up and enlightened, and then we do exactly the same ourselves. The only thing which has changed is that offence is taken over a different set of words.
  • JBriskinJBriskin Posts: 2,380
    Thanks macisback - I'll go for Derby and just enjoy the football.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    Anorak said:

    I expect that those thinking a comment like Mitchell's are "a harmless figure of speech" will diminish rapidly in much the same way. The demographics pretty much guarantee it.

    Oh, you might well be right. Especially in politics, the verbal minefields are ever more dangerous. That doesn't make them any less silly.
  • AnorakAnorak Posts: 6,621

    Anorak said:

    I expect that those thinking a comment like Mitchell's are "a harmless figure of speech" will diminish rapidly in much the same way. The demographics pretty much guarantee it.

    Oh, you might well be right. Especially in politics, the verbal minefields are ever more dangerous. That doesn't make them any less silly.
    You're sounding a bit "Victor Meldrew" there, Richard :)
  • Yes, the funny thing is that we laugh at the Victorians for taking offence or being shocked by the silliest things, and compliment ourselves on being so much more grown-up and enlightened, and then we do exactly the same ourselves. The only thing which has changed is that offence is taken over a different set of words.

    Soon, no doubt, it will be forbidden to refer to the Rape of Lewes, or its historical importance, for fear of causing "offence".
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821
    edited May 2014
    Anorak said:

    You're sounding a bit "Victor Meldrew" there, Richard :)

    No, I find it amusing. The rules of verbal etiquette, and the list of words you're not allowed to use, are as strict and as hilarious today as they were in 1874.
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821

    Soon, no doubt, it will be forbidden to refer to the Rape of Lewes, or its historical importance, for fear of causing "offence".

    Yes, and the history books will all have to be bowdlerised, for example to excise all references to the Rape of Silesia.
  • HurstLlamaHurstLlama Posts: 9,098
    @Richard_Nabavi

    "Yes, it has been artificially hyped up so that, even when it is quite obviously a harmless (if silly) figure of speech"

    Of course it was a harmless figure of speech, a metaphor which people would not have thought amiss for centuries past until very recently. But we live in the days of Newspeak, Mr Nabavi, and to use a metaphor or even simile that contains a word that the wimmin deem offensive is beyond the pale.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    Soon, no doubt, it will be forbidden to refer to the Rape of Lewes, or its historical importance, for fear of causing "offence".

    Yes, and the history books will all have to be bowdlerised, for example to excise all references to the Rape of Silesia.
    At least the Rape of the Sabines is safe ;)
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976
    edited May 2014
    ToryJim said:

    Soon, no doubt, it will be forbidden to refer to the Rape of Lewes, or its historical importance, for fear of causing "offence".

    Yes, and the history books will all have to be bowdlerised, for example to excise all references to the Rape of Silesia.
    At least the Rape of the Sabines is safe ;)
    A magnificent marble statue imho - although 'rape' in this case is a poor Latin translation when 'abduction' would have been more appropriate.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 37,534
    Anorak said:

    Anorak said:

    Hmmm. I think rape, and the abuse of the word, is a more sensitive topic than you think. My feeling is that the level of sensitivity varies a lot by age and gender (as you might expect).

    Yes, it has been artificially hyped up so that, even when it is quite obviously a harmless (if silly) figure of speech - as in Austin Mitchell's tweet - people get absurdly het up.

    You can see how absolutely silly it is by substituting another word - for example if he had tweeted 'Pfizer will murder AstraZeneca's R&D facilities', would anyone be up in arms, claiming he'd accused Pfizer of being murderers?
    It's similar to change in the treatment of race between the 1970s and now. Nicknames such as 'chalky' were not exactly rare, and for the most part thought of as harmless except by a few holier-than-thou cranks. Not many would subscribe to that view now, of course.

    I expect that those thinking a comment like Mitchell's are "a harmless figure of speech" will diminish rapidly in much the same way. The demographics pretty much guarantee it.
    I'm not so sure. I think one of the things that fuels support for UKIP is peoples' resentment at this obsession with policing speech.

  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053
    ToryJim said:

    Soon, no doubt, it will be forbidden to refer to the Rape of Lewes, or its historical importance, for fear of causing "offence".

    Yes, and the history books will all have to be bowdlerised, for example to excise all references to the Rape of Silesia.
    At least the Rape of the Sabines is safe ;)
    I wouldn't be so sure.
  • CarlottaVanceCarlottaVance Posts: 60,216
    edited May 2014
    Someone spots the Left's hypocrisy:

    And if he won’t, then the party should remove the whip - because that’s what we’d be calling for if a Tory did likewise. And this is no time – and no issue – for double standards.

    http://labourlist.org/2014/05/apologise-austin-because-nothing-but-rape-is-rape/
  • Richard_NabaviRichard_Nabavi Posts: 30,821

    Of course it was a harmless figure of speech, a metaphor which people would not have thought amiss for centuries past until very recently. But we live in the days of Newspeak, Mr Nabavi, and to use a metaphor or even simile that contains a word that the wimmin deem offensive is beyond the pale.

    Very true, Mr Llama - but are you sure that 'beyond the pale' is still OK?
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    Someone spots the Left's hypocrisy:

    And if he won’t, then the party should remove the whip - because that’s what we’d be calling for if a Tory did likewise. And this is no time – and no issue – for double standards.

    http://labourlist.org/2014/05/apologise-austin-because-nothing-but-rape-is-rape/

    Good, some on the left get it.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    "The Rape of Nanking" auto-correct once got me into real trouble.
  • ToryJimToryJim Posts: 4,189

    "The Rape of Nanking" auto-correct once got me into real trouble.

    Trust you

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    Can you believe it. No one wanted to talk politics at Newark train station today.
  • MikeKMikeK Posts: 9,053

    Can you believe it. No one wanted to talk politics at Newark train station today.

    They're all voting UKIP. Get used to it. ;)
  • AlastairMeeksAlastairMeeks Posts: 30,340
    MikeK said:

    Can you believe it. No one wanted to talk politics at Newark train station today.

    They're all voting UKIP. Get used to it. ;)
    If they were intending to vote UKIP, they'd all be shouting their opinions at TSE.
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 96,578
    MikeK said:

    Can you believe it. No one wanted to talk politics at Newark train station today.

    They're all voting UKIP. Get used to it. ;)
    Wouldn't that mean they were more likely to want to talk politics, as they are more passionate, as recent converts tend to be?

  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    My worst auto-correct episode was when I texted a girlfriend

    "I miss you my little [moderated]-bunny"

    Unfortunately auto-correct turned bunny into "bucket"
  • taffystaffys Posts: 9,753
    What about Alexander Pope's classic satire 'The Rape of the Lock'

    Instant ban for trivialising....
  • SimonStClareSimonStClare Posts: 7,976

    Can you believe it. No one wanted to talk politics at Newark train station today.

    Astonishing! - I bet some have not even heard of PB – do they have that interwebby thing up there?
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 119,959
    I think I may have consumed far too much complimentary champagne today.
This discussion has been closed.