In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Footballers aren't lacking in educational qualifications because they're not intelligent, it's because their clubs don't value their education
It may also be because they are repeatedly heading a ball all the way through childhood. That can't be a good for IQ.
Very rare visit up home for Birmingham v Leeds FA Cup Tie.
Cracking game Cracking atmosphere boosted by Leeds having full Away end Best side lost but no complaints as goals win the game
But massive credit to a Referee who let the game flow, made all the right calls and did it with a smile.
I think football fans thought VAR would be the same as the tv replays the pundits look at, and the bloopers, like those at Villa Park and The Etihad yesterday, would be obvious and sorted out quickly.
Instead we got absurdly granular decisions, offsides to the nearest millimetre, handball for anything that brushes a players arm, and endless delays that have killed the spectacle. They should just use the tv replays we all see and if it’s not clear wave play on
Or just get rid
The idea behind VAR is to prevent clear and obvious errors. If an offside has to be measured with a micrometer then it is not "clear and obvious". No VAR decision should take more than seconds, and it can work that way, for example at the Qatar World Cup.
That said, I am not missing it in the Championship, despite the abysmal decline of my team.
They should change offside so as long as a part of the attacking player is in line with the last defender than it’s good. Would increase the number of goals.
Careful about that, though, increasing the number of goals. Football's appeal (in addition to the strong possibility of rank unfairness) relies on goals being rare events. You don't want it getting like basketball. High scoring games with the best team always winning.
Before VAR the laws gave no assistance in clarifying what 'level' actually meant in connection with offside. It was simply left to the discretion of referees. The precision of the new technology enabled hairline decisions to be made with extreme accuracy, but the authorities were characteristically slow to give any clarification to officials as to whether 'level' meant the arms, the legs, any part of the body or the central mass, or whatever. The result was that widely different and contradictory interpretations applied from game to game. They are starting to sort this out a bit now but they are slow learners and it will be a while yet before we get a sensible all-purpose definition. My own recommendation would be to use the feet, since that would be relatively easy to apply, and kind of makes sense.
I suspect the authorities will just blunder on for a while yet, making it up as they go along (just as they did with 'clear and obvious error' and other basic aspects of VAR.)
Yes, they'll get there but it's not there yet. A match the other week, team wins the ball near its own corner flag and launch a fluid sweeping move up the entire field, 5 players involved, culminating in a final precision pass and a cool as you like finish. Joyous bit of football. The beautiful game. But hang on, what's this? It's VAR. Minutes pass then the verdict. Disallowed because the ball when they first won it was about half an inch out of play. Should have been a throw in.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
Way back there was a footballer called Alan Giwland, he had a university degree but can't remember if he had a career as such.
Gowland
Alan Edwin Gowling
Watched him play for Manchester United from 1966 to the early 70's
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
I see Conway, historically a conservative but a very strong NeverTrumper, is running to be the Democratic candidate in NY-12 - given the seat is around 80% Democrat, winning the primary would be plenty.
It's crazy how one sided a lot of Congressional seats are, even compared to ours.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Footballers aren't lacking in educational qualifications because they're not intelligent, it's because their clubs don't value their education
Yes, there'll be lots of intelligent footballers. A levels and uni aren't the route. Plus it's still a working class sport compared to most others so the pressure and expectation to pursue higher education isn't as strong in any case.
Any response Kemi? Last time I looked Truss was still a member.
It's just so over the top. Like, I'd get if she genuinely likes Trump as a person and a leader (I'd disagree, but I'd get it), but 'right about everything' whilst sucking up for a photo? How lucrative is the american podcast circuit?
Farage likes Trump too and he doesn't gush so blatantly.
As former PBer and postcard-from-the-pub writer @SeanT used to fussily point out, "everybody lives online these days". If you live online, you stop aligning with your nationality and start aligning with your affinity group. When that happens you become detached from your nation-state and, if that is then combined with an algorithmic feed, you will become increasingly radicalised into, and believe the most extreme/ridiculous beliefs of, that affinity group. At the extreme the individual will starting acting against the interest of their co-nationals and nation-state whist claiming they represent the *real* nation.
This happens an awful lot and former PM Truss manifests some of the worst aspects. I think she genuinely thinks she's a member of this new virtual mid-atlantic right-wing group, as opposed to a small remora who can be detached from the big fuckoff bitey sharks whenever they like.
Any response Kemi? Last time I looked Truss was still a member.
It's just so over the top. Like, I'd get if she genuinely likes Trump as a person and a leader (I'd disagree, but I'd get it), but 'right about everything' whilst sucking up for a photo? How lucrative is the american podcast circuit?
Farage likes Trump too and he doesn't gush so blatantly.
As former PBer and postcard-from-the-pub writer @SeanT used to fussily point out, "everybody lives online these days". If you live online, you stop aligning with your nationality and start aligning with your affinity group. When that happens you become detached from your nation-state and, if that is then combined with an algorithmic feed, you will become increasingly radicalised into, and believe the most extreme/ridiculous beliefs of, that affinity group. At the extreme the individual will starting acting against the interest of their co-nationals and nation-state whist claiming they represent the *real* nation.
This happens an awful lot and former PM Truss manifests some of the worst aspects. I think she genuinely thinks she's a member of this new virtual mid-atlantic right-wing group, as opposed to a small remora who can be detached from the big fuckoff bitey sharks whenever they like.
That makes a lot of sense, I may steal it as my own insight with offline people.
Any response Kemi? Last time I looked Truss was still a member.
It's just so over the top. Like, I'd get if she genuinely likes Trump as a person and a leader (I'd disagree, but I'd get it), but 'right about everything' whilst sucking up for a photo? How lucrative is the american podcast circuit?
Farage likes Trump too and he doesn't gush so blatantly.
As former PBer and postcard-from-the-pub writer @SeanT used to fussily point out, "everybody lives online these days". If you live online, you stop aligning with your nationality and start aligning with your affinity group. When that happens you become detached from your nation-state and, if that is then combined with an algorithmic feed, you will become increasingly radicalised into, and believe the most extreme/ridiculous beliefs of, that affinity group. At the extreme the individual will starting acting against the interest of their co-nationals and nation-state whist claiming they represent the *real* nation.
This happens an awful lot and former PM Truss manifests some of the worst aspects. I think she genuinely thinks she's a member of this new virtual mid-atlantic right-wing group, as opposed to a small remora who can be detached from the big fuckoff bitey sharks whenever they like.
That makes a lot of sense, I may steal it as my own insight with offline people.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
Way back there was a footballer called Alan Giwland, he had a university degree but can't remember if he had a career as such.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Here's another demonstration that the leader of the so-called Green Party is a total that who couldn't give a fuck about the environment. From Sky:
Zack Polanski, the Green Party leader, told Sky's Trevor Phillips that policing waste crime may result in "an arms race of surveillance".
"Unless we're going to surveil people 24/7 all the time, and I think that has to be the last resort, I'd much rather look at behaviour change and get people to feel pride in their place," he said.
Fucking clueless.
I quite that like that sentiment tbh. Comes from the right place, even if preposterously naive. According to the Facebook whoppers the Greens won't allow anyone out of their postcode and track them with 5G guided microchips; this suggests that concern is a bit overblown. It might be the case the Greens under Polanski are actually the most liberal of all the parties.
"Flytipping is fine by me!"
The people who toss bags of dog shit into the tops of the lime trees around my flat would be first against the wall in my Scotland.
Scumbags like that should be fed it for a month
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, Malc, I'm puzzled by their logic. If you have picked the poo up in a bag you have done the difficult bit. Disposing of it properly is then easy. Hanging it in a tree negates the effort you have already made.
I've seen plenty of this strange fruit, but never actually caught someone doing it, so I have never had the opportunity to question them.
Pete , Like the morons that go to Mcdonalds , KFC etc, then drive past a hundred bins into the countryside and throw all their crap out the window
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
And as a consequence, was mocked for being gay. Even in the 90s, when the numbet of things which led to a chorus of "gaaaaay" was quite large (like not liking Oasis), this struck me as quite a bold assumption to leap to.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
According to A I Polly Toynbee is still writing for the Guardian. I don't read it but it I have to say i haven't seen anything posted on here by her in a long time. Is she just so.last year?
Here's another demonstration that the leader of the so-called Green Party is a total that who couldn't give a fuck about the environment. From Sky:
Zack Polanski, the Green Party leader, told Sky's Trevor Phillips that policing waste crime may result in "an arms race of surveillance".
"Unless we're going to surveil people 24/7 all the time, and I think that has to be the last resort, I'd much rather look at behaviour change and get people to feel pride in their place," he said.
Fucking clueless.
I quite that like that sentiment tbh. Comes from the right place, even if preposterously naive. According to the Facebook whoppers the Greens won't allow anyone out of their postcode and track them with 5G guided microchips; this suggests that concern is a bit overblown. It might be the case the Greens under Polanski are actually the most liberal of all the parties.
"Flytipping is fine by me!"
The people who toss bags of dog shit into the tops of the lime trees around my flat would be first against the wall in my Scotland.
Scumbags like that should be fed it for a month
Whilst I agree with the sentiment, Malc, I'm puzzled by their logic. If you have picked the poo up in a bag you have done the difficult bit. Disposing of it properly is then easy. Hanging it in a tree negates the effort you have already made.
I've seen plenty of this strange fruit, but never actually caught someone doing it, so I have never had the opportunity to question them.
Pete , Like the morons that go to Mcdonalds , KFC etc, then drive past a hundred bins into the countryside and throw all their crap out the window
When I'm out on a cycle, I can tell when I'm about a 20-minute drive away from a McDonalds by the quantity of litter in the hedges. Particularly grim in East Lothian around Dunbar.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
According to A I Polly Toynbee is still writing for the Guardian. I don't read it but it I have to say i haven't seen anything posted on here by her in a long time. Is she just so.last year?
Pat Nevin was the guest on Countdown a little while ago. Normally when a sportsperson is on, I fast forward when they do their piece as they are seldom interesting and usually just bore on about diet, etc. But Pat Nevin's anecdotes were fascinating.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Ski Cross
Next Saturday
In the olden days it used to be Ski Sunday. Catchy tune too.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Wait till they get to the Snow Breakdancing. It will be brilliant on radio.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
Way back there was a footballer called Alan Giwland, he had a university degree but can't remember if he had a career as such.
Gowland
Alan Edwin Gowling
Watched him play for Manchester United from 1966 to the early 70's
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Apparently, there's a brand new sport for these games called "Ski Mountaineering". I have no clue either!
According to A I Polly Toynbee is still writing for the Guardian. I don't read it but it I have to say i haven't seen anything posted on here by her in a long time. Is she just so.last year?
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
Way back there was a footballer called Alan Giwland, he had a university degree but can't remember if he had a career as such.
Gowland
Alan Edwin Gowling
Watched him play for Manchester United from 1966 to the early 70's
Was he a sort of Bobby Charlton role back up?
He was lanky and ungainly and not a Bobby Charlton
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Apparently, there's a brand new sport for these games called "Ski Mountaineering". I have no clue either!
Does anyone know who was the last English football plus cricket:
1) Dual international 2) International in one sport and professional level in the other 3) Professional level in both sports
The dual internationals still existed in the 1950s and the dual professionals in the early 1980s.
Discounting Ian Botham with his Scunthorpe Utd games was Arnie Sidebottom the last England international cricketer who had played professional football ?
That Arnie Sidebottom played for Manchester United seems incredible given the way he lumbered around a cricket field.
Does anyone know who was the last English football plus cricket:
1) Dual international 2) International in one sport and professional level in the other 3) Professional level in both sports
The dual internationals still existed in the 1950s and the dual professionals in the early 1980s.
Discounting Ian Botham with his Scunthorpe Utd games was Arnie Sidebottom the last England international cricketer who had played professional football ?
That Arnie Sidebottom played for Manchester United seems incredible given the way he lumbered around a cricket field.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Apparently, there's a brand new sport for these games called "Ski Mountaineering". I have no clue either!
Uphill skiing. To counteract the downhill skiing.
That will surely have to wait until The Woke Olympics, at which everyone wins gold.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Apparently, there's a brand new sport for these games called "Ski Mountaineering". I have no clue either!
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
Way back there was a footballer called Alan Giwland, he had a university degree but can't remember if he had a career as such.
Gowland
Alan Edwin Gowling
Watched him play for Manchester United from 1966 to the early 70's
Was he a sort of Bobby Charlton role back up?
He was lanky and ungainly and not a Bobby Charlton
More of a sub iirc a bit like but not as good as David Fairclough...
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, wasn't hounding her out of her job the entire point of the exercise?
It's a good question. I think supporters of Sandie Peggie would say the point of the exercise is to protect women . But what does that rather abstract claim mean in this specific case? That Beth Upton should stop pretending to be a woman? That s/he shouldn't be a doctor? Or something else?
It means that Upton should not go into a room where women are changing their clothes for work. Its really that simple. Upton wanted to make an issue of this and was enthusiastically supported by a management completely committed to the transgender cause and totally indifferent to women's rights. I accept that as this spiralled out of control Upton became every bit as much of a victim as Peggie. The management responsible should be fired.
He (he is a biological male and does not have a GRC so is not in any sense a woman, despite his absurd and scientifically illiterate claim during his evidence at trial that he was a biological female; it has also been reported that he has fathered a child with his wife) was not that much of a victim. He was offered a private changing space but refused on the grounds that it would "out" him even though he had made a point of telling his employers that he was out as a trans person before his job interview. He also made spurious allegations against the nurse about her treatment of patients, alleging that she had put patients at risk. These claims were found to be unfounded.
The three versions of the judgment are being appealed.
I always thought the downhill skiing needed the element introduced in old N64 game "Snowboard Kids" where you all race down to get the first chairlift back up to the top, and thus introduce multiple laps into it. And a right barney as 3 or 4 people all aim for the lift gate.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Apparently, there's a brand new sport for these games called "Ski Mountaineering". I have no clue either!
I can’t comprehend how fit those people mistakenly be. It’s really annoying and you can get puffed walking to a restaurant that’s uphill from a run or lift and I’m relatively fit. Ok it could be down to the multiple choco-rums on previous runs but still.
If you want a political analogy, the Prime Minister's constituency is abolished in a boundary review but he doesn't make the shortlist for either of the successor constituencies.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Ski Cross
Next Saturday
In the olden days it used to be Ski Sunday. Catchy tune too.
I think 'catchy' undersells it slightly. It merits a place on anybody's playlist of top ten sports programme theme tunes.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
If you lived in the US, and had to listen to American sports commentators mangle player names and the basic rules of the game, you would appreciate British football commentators a lot more.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Footballers aren't lacking in educational qualifications because they're not intelligent, it's because their clubs don't value their education
Yes, there'll be lots of intelligent footballers. A levels and uni aren't the route. Plus it's still a working class sport compared to most others so the pressure and expectation to pursue higher education isn't as strong in any case.
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, wasn't hounding her out of her job the entire point of the exercise?
It's a good question. I think supporters of Sandie Peggie would say the point of the exercise is to protect women . But what does that rather abstract claim mean in this specific case? That Beth Upton should stop pretending to be a woman? That s/he shouldn't be a doctor? Or something else?
It means that Upton should not go into a room where women are changing their clothes for work. Its really that simple. Upton wanted to make an issue of this and was enthusiastically supported by a management completely committed to the transgender cause and totally indifferent to women's rights. I accept that as this spiralled out of control Upton became every bit as much of a victim as Peggie. The management responsible should be fired.
Which would be a simple policy change on changing room use, or in the case of NHS Fife, having one in the first place. It wouldn't be a suit of victimisation and discrimination, all of which failed at the tribunal. Maybe Sandie Peggie will get this overturned on appeal - we'll see - but it wouldn't then be a simple issue of changing room use. I would also challenge Peggie as a victim - demanding to know your colleague's chromosomes as they get changed are seems aggressive, and she also sued Dr Upton personally for harrassment, claims which were dismissed in their entirety.
NHS Fife quietly changed their policy on changing rooms last year after the Supreme Court judgment and in compliance with it.
I have helped other women and been helped by them when getting menstrual leaks. I would not insist on being present if a woman requested privacy, even though I would have a legal right to remain. It is a matter of common decency, respect for the other person at a vulnerable and embarrassing time and basic human empathy. Dr Upton showed none of those to a woman old enough to be his mother. It is odd that so many of these men who claim to be women show so little empathy for the more brutal and unpleasant realities of what being a woman involves and behave instead like selfish entitled men.
A decent man, even one with gender dysphoria, would have given the nurse the privacy she needed. If he was really in touch with his inner female he would have understood the need to do so.
Not only did that head of iceberg lettuce outlast you, Madam Briefest Prime Minister in the Entire History of the United Kingdom, that lettuce was also much, much smarter than you.
PICTURED: Liz Truss meets with Donald Trump at his golf course in Palm Beach
Liz Truss meets elderly head of state with injured hand.
BRACE!
Oddly, Liz said recently she was starting to play golf. So I suspect the meeting has been planned for some time, and perhaps she even interviewed him for her Youtube programme.
Does anyone know who was the last English football plus cricket:
1) Dual international 2) International in one sport and professional level in the other 3) Professional level in both sports
The dual internationals still existed in the 1950s and the dual professionals in the early 1980s.
Discounting Ian Botham with his Scunthorpe Utd games was Arnie Sidebottom the last England international cricketer who had played professional football ?
That Arnie Sidebottom played for Manchester United seems incredible given the way he lumbered around a cricket field.
Without researching, I would guess Denis Compton.
Not English, but Viv Richards played WC qualifiers for Antigua at football.
Does anyone know who was the last English football plus cricket:
1) Dual international 2) International in one sport and professional level in the other 3) Professional level in both sports
The dual internationals still existed in the 1950s and the dual professionals in the early 1980s.
Discounting Ian Botham with his Scunthorpe Utd games was Arnie Sidebottom the last England international cricketer who had played professional football ?
That Arnie Sidebottom played for Manchester United seems incredible given the way he lumbered around a cricket field.
It was Arthur Milton, of Arsenal and Gloucestershire for (1).
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Well it's Motty and Barry Davies. A great moment from each:
"Look at his face, just look at his face"
"A quality goal from a quality player"
And then Coleman with his iconic deadpan call for the first goal in any match if it came from the team who were dominating ...
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Downhill skiing is about the only sport I've recognised the name of in this Winter Olympics. No TV so haven't been watching, going by name only. Been baffled.
Apparently, there's a brand new sport for these games called "Ski Mountaineering". I have no clue either!
Uphill skiing. To counteract the downhill skiing.
Anyone who has actually done uphill skiing will know how hard that is going to be.
Are they going to swap skis or will they being trying for 10 minutes to fold the skins up in a gale without them sticking to everything?
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Ski Cross
Next Saturday
In the olden days it used to be Ski Sunday. Catchy tune too.
I think 'catchy' undersells it slightly. It merits a place on anybody's playlist of top ten sports programme theme tunes.
Well I don't disagree. Sports theme tunes were one of the things the BBC were unmatched at. I would also nominate:
Soul Limbo (the cricket theme) The theme from Sportsnight The theme from sports report on Radio 5 (or 2, in the old days) The theme from sport on 5 (or 2, in the old days) The Chain (Formula one) The theme from Superstars.
Honourable mentions too to the themes from Grandstand, Match of the Day, the Snooker theme. Time and again they got it right: it was impossible not to feel excited when your sport was about to be covered.
Unless your sport was rugby. The rugby special theme was a bit lame.
Chris Balderstone played two tests in 1976. He also was signed by Bill Shankly for Huddersfield and played First Division at Carlisle in a twenty year career. From wiki.
"Balderstone made history on 15 September 1975 by taking part in a County Championship match and a Football League game on the same day. Balderstone was 51 not out against Derbyshire at the end of day two of Leicestershire's match at Chesterfield. After close of play he changed into his football kit to play for Doncaster Rovers in an evening match 30 miles away (a 1–1 draw with Brentford). He then returned to Chesterfield the following morning to complete a century and take three wickets to help wrap up Leicestershire's first ever County Championship title."
Any response Kemi? Last time I looked Truss was still a member.
Indeed.
She needs expelling.
Has the Leader a backbone.
Why would the Tories expel someone for being photographed with Trump and posting the caption 'right about everything'?
Genuinely puzzled.
Implicit in her remark is that it's fine and dandy to destroy British exporting through Trump's tariffs. If that's not treason it must be getting pretty close.
You people taking the piss out of the downhill should look up footage of Innsbruck 76 and Franz Klammer shooting down the slope to a cacophony of noise in his yellow catsuit to win gold for Austria. It's one of sport's all time moments.
Any response Kemi? Last time I looked Truss was still a member.
Indeed.
She needs expelling.
Has the Leader a backbone.
Why would the Tories expel someone for being photographed with Trump and posting the caption 'right about everything'?
Genuinely puzzled.
Implicit in her remark is that it's fine and dandy to destroy British exporting through Trump's tariffs. If that's not treason it must be getting pretty close.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Well it's Motty and Barry Davies. A great moment from each:
"Look at his face, just look at his face"
"A quality goal from a quality player"
And then Coleman with his iconic deadpan call for the first goal in any match if it came from the team who were dominating ...
"One nil"
Tony Currie.
How many other lines of commentary bring to mind a particular player.
Disappointing to discover that the Team Snowboarding does not involve six people all standing on one really big smowboard.
It always disappoints me that the downhill skiers go down one at a time. How much more fun it would be if they were all released together and had to push and fight for position on the way down.
We'd be in with more a chance then. We could get Joey Barton to represent us.
Ski Cross
Next Saturday
In the olden days it used to be Ski Sunday. Catchy tune too.
I think 'catchy' undersells it slightly. It merits a place on anybody's playlist of top ten sports programme theme tunes.
Well I don't disagree. Sports theme tunes were one of the things the BBC were unmatched at. I would also nominate:
Soul Limbo (the cricket theme) The theme from Sportsnight The theme from sports report on Radio 5 (or 2, in the old days) The theme from sport on 5 (or 2, in the old days) The Chain (Formula one) The theme from Superstars.
Honourable mentions too to the themes from Grandstand, Match of the Day, the Snooker theme. Time and again they got it right: it was impossible not to feel excited when your sport was about to be covered.
Unless your sport was rugby. The rugby special theme was a bit lame.
The figure skating theme was stately if not catchy.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Alan Green for me, outstanding in all departments.
The late great Derek Lacey, who commentated for years for BBC Cumbria on Carlisle United was hugely loved, massively mourned at his death, had a cult following and was wonderfully bathetic and inaccurate, sometimes about the score, sometimes about which team had scored, sometimes not noticing that someone had scored, sometimes a bit vague about which teams were playing and so on. I miss him still, and he died 17 years ago.
You people taking the piss out of the downhill should look up footage of Innsbruck 76 and Franz Klammer shooting down the slope to a cacophony of noise in his yellow catsuit to win gold for Austria. It's one of sport's all time moments.
If I could win any individual sporting event it would have to be the Men’s Olympic downhill.
The thrill of the speed even at my level is immense and to be that good and brave is something else.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Well it's Motty and Barry Davies. A great moment from each:
"Look at his face, just look at his face"
"A quality goal from a quality player"
And then Coleman with his iconic deadpan call for the first goal in any match if it came from the team who were dominating ...
"One nil"
Tony Currie.
How many other lines of commentary bring to mind a particular player.
Geoff Hurst and "They think its all over ..."
Barry Davis, "Oh you have to say that is pure football genius" in respect of Maradona.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Alan Green for me, outstanding in all departments.
The late great Derek Lacey, who commentated for years for BBC Cumbria on Carlisle United was hugely loved, massively mourned at his death, had a cult following and was wonderfully bathetic and inaccurate, sometimes about the score, sometimes about which team had scored, sometimes not noticing that someone had scored, sometimes a bit vague about which teams were playing and so on. I miss him still, and he died 17 years ago.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Well it's Motty and Barry Davies. A great moment from each:
"Look at his face, just look at his face"
"A quality goal from a quality player"
And then Coleman with his iconic deadpan call for the first goal in any match if it came from the team who were dominating ...
"One nil"
Tony Currie.
How many other lines of commentary bring to mind a particular player.
At the risk of pointing out the obvious, wasn't hounding her out of her job the entire point of the exercise?
It's a good question. I think supporters of Sandie Peggie would say the point of the exercise is to protect women . But what does that rather abstract claim mean in this specific case? That Beth Upton should stop pretending to be a woman? That s/he shouldn't be a doctor? Or something else?
It means that Upton should not go into a room where women are changing their clothes for work. Its really that simple. Upton wanted to make an issue of this and was enthusiastically supported by a management completely committed to the transgender cause and totally indifferent to women's rights. I accept that as this spiralled out of control Upton became every bit as much of a victim as Peggie. The management responsible should be fired.
Which would be a simple policy change on changing room use, or in the case of NHS Fife, having one in the first place. It wouldn't be a suit of victimisation and discrimination, all of which failed at the tribunal. Maybe Sandie Peggie will get this overturned on appeal - we'll see - but it wouldn't then be a simple issue of changing room use. I would also challenge Peggie as a victim - demanding to know your colleague's chromosomes as they get changed are seems aggressive, and she also sued Dr Upton personally for harrassment, claims which were dismissed in their entirety.
NHS Fife quietly changed their policy on changing rooms last year after the Supreme Court judgment and in compliance with it.
I have helped other women and been helped by them when getting menstrual leaks. I would not insist on being present if a woman requested privacy, even though I would have a legal right to remain. It is a matter of common decency, respect for the other person at a vulnerable and embarrassing time and basic human empathy. Dr Upton showed none of those to a woman old enough to be his mother. It is odd that so many of these men who claim to be women show so little empathy for the more brutal and unpleasant realities of what being a woman involves and behave instead like selfish entitled men.
A decent man, even one with gender dysphoria, would have given the nurse the privacy she needed. If he was really in touch with his inner female he would have understood the need to do so.
Thanks. I should have added not having adequate changing room policy was one of the four claims made by Sandie Peggie against Fife Health Board, which the Tribunal upheld.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
I idolised Brian Moore when I was a teenager, mostly thanks to "Arsenal come streaming forward now in what must surely be their last attack. A good ball from Dixon, finding Smith, for Thomas, charging through the midfield, Thomas, it's up for grabs now... THOMAS!!! Right at the end! An unbelievable climax to the league season."
The Neville brothers were outstanding youth cricketers. Phil captained England Schools and was offered a contract by Lancashire. Flintoff called him a "cricketing genius". Gary played alongside Matthew Hayden.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
Well it's Motty and Barry Davies. A great moment from each:
"Look at his face, just look at his face"
"A quality goal from a quality player"
And then Coleman with his iconic deadpan call for the first goal in any match if it came from the team who were dominating ...
"One nil"
Tony Currie.
How many other lines of commentary bring to mind a particular player.
Geoff Hurst and "They think its all over ..."
"Interesting...VERY INTERESTING!" Barry Davies.
David Coleman, "his eyes like blue chunks of ice" in the 1980 Olympic 800m final about Ovett.
Phil Neale was a solid cricketer for Worcestershire and played soccer for Lincoln City.
Worcester also had Ted Helmsley who played for Sheffield United and Paul Pridgeon who played for Stourbridge in non league and in a Welsh Cup Final for them.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
I idolised Brian Moore when I was a teenager, mostly thanks to "Arsenal come streaming forward now in what must surely be their last attack. A good ball from Dixon, finding Smith, for Thomas, charging through the midfield, Thomas, it's up for grabs now... THOMAS!!! Right at the end! An unbelievable climax to the league season."
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Dont forget perhaps the best in any sport - Buncey in boxing.
My list is by no means exhaustive, and I would certainly agree on Steve Bunce, who incidentally is good on other sports too. For example, he commentated brilliantly on Judo at the Olympics.
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
At a bit of a tangent, the worst anchorman was Bob Wilson. So bad that Half Man, Half Biscuit wrote a song about it.
Lord, I'm trying the best i can I lost everybody in Khazakhstan But I still don't understand Bob Wilson, anchorman
I've been to Kent, Gwent, Senegal I've even been to look for Jim Rosenthal Found him on his knees at the wailing wall crying "Bob Wilson, anchorman"
Well I marvel at the things we find beneath the ground And that man can go faster than the speed of sound But I still can't get my head around Bob Wilson, anchorman
Well I'd like to meet Stevenson the engineer And I'd like to meet Faraday and buy him a beer And I'd love to meet the bloke who had the bright idea of Bob Wilson, anchorman
You people taking the piss out of the downhill should look up footage of Innsbruck 76 and Franz Klammer shooting down the slope to a cacophony of noise in his yellow catsuit to win gold for Austria. It's one of sport's all time moments.
I skived the afternoon off school to watch that.
Unforgettable
An Italian produced a great ski and Klammer had huge pressure on him.
He skied down like an absolute mad man it was astounding sport.
One of my favourite sporting moments ever.
Perhaps only surpassed by the Baa Baas try v All Blacks at Cardiff
Chris Balderstone played two tests in 1976. He also was signed by Bill Shankly for Huddersfield and played First Division at Carlisle in a twenty year career. From wiki.
"Balderstone made history on 15 September 1975 by taking part in a County Championship match and a Football League game on the same day. Balderstone was 51 not out against Derbyshire at the end of day two of Leicestershire's match at Chesterfield. After close of play he changed into his football kit to play for Doncaster Rovers in an evening match 30 miles away (a 1–1 draw with Brentford). He then returned to Chesterfield the following morning to complete a century and take three wickets to help wrap up Leicestershire's first ever County Championship title."
His sporting career was astonishing. A capable professional footballer, and all-rounder cricketer, with a very decent batting and bowling average.
In the professional era, sheer size of population and potential player pool is beginning to dominate, in rugby
For decades much smaller countries could, in various ways, punch above their weight
All blacks were the obvious example, but also wales and latterly Ireland
But now the biggest teams are the biggest countries. South Africa, France, England,
Italy rising. Argentina. Japan too
Australia somewhere in the middle
It’s a shame, as rugby was an exception to the law of bigness
I recall being in Jamaica on late 90s.
Not long after Reggae Boyz got to WC98
A few locals told me it would kill Cricket as young lads who were already starting to go to US Colleges for Track and Field scholarships would play soccer too.
The great Welsh teams were honed in the Mines and Steel works.
Gatland fused a side for a decade that punched way above their weight
Maladministration hasn't helped.
So who are all these top level Caribbean athletes and footballers who would have been international cricketers ?
Actual names.
Given how specialised top level sport is now plus how much more money there is in cricket compared with the last century the numbers lost is more probably minimal to zero.
I think the problem is that a lot of good West Indian athletes/sportsmen get picked up for sports scholarships in the US. It’s attractive to them as they get a good uni place and the potential for top class coaching on track and often get sidelined into American football.
Now they might not “make it” but if they have been focussed away from cricket from 16 to early 20s even if they were good cricketers that’s a lot of lost development time and very hard to switch back.
If you can run a crazy 100m time and you are well built run the potential to earn millions a year in American football is probably more a temptation than taking a risk on cricket where the pay and sponsorship will never come close and the employment numbers are lower in cricket.
But I’m not sure this is true. You can make millions in T20 cricket. Indeed it’s probably easier to do it in cricket than in ultra competitive NFL -or basketball where you need to be a physical freak in size
True, but for a lot of 16 year olds, when they have to really start specialising and considering future options if someone from UCLA is scouting you for a track scholarship where you will end up with a good step up the ladder or you have to hope you are one of the cricketers who will be great enough to get the big contracts, a lot will choose the former - totally understandably.
I had friends at school who were scouted by top division football clubs and asked to join but turned it down because their plans were becoming lawyers or bankers etc because it was something they knew they would do well in and benefit financially long term whereas lots of young players disappear and then you’ve thrown away a life career. I know it’s not the same situation but it’s a major consideration for young people and parents.
I think the number of Premier League footballers who might have been top lawyers or bankers is a select band
of ZERO
ISTR Martin O Neil studied law at university
Pat Nevin has a degree and is clearly highly intelligent. Then there's Graham Le Saux who went to uni and would have graduated if it weren't for needing to get going with the pro football. He reads the Guardian and visits museums.
Nevin is a truly outstanding football commentator and is also worth listening to on subjects far removed from football. He doesn't actually do the main play commentaries though. He provides the supplementary comments brilliantly, but not the main description of the play which is given to others. I think this is a pity because he would probably be brilliant at that too, and certainly better than the usual main commentators, who are mostly moderate to poor.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Tony Gubba RIP, as immortalised by Half Man Half Biscuit.
I was trying to decide the most implausible Winter Olympics participant country. I think it's between Singapore and Guinea Bissau. Trinidad and Tobago at least has some mountains, even if not snowy ones.
Comments
Watched him play for Manchester United from 1966 to the early 70's
It's crazy how one sided a lot of Congressional seats are, even compared to ours.
This happens an awful lot and former PM Truss manifests some of the worst aspects. I think she genuinely thinks she's a member of this new virtual mid-atlantic right-wing group, as opposed to a small remora who can be detached from the big fuckoff bitey sharks whenever they like.
It has often puzzled me that football has never had a great commentator (radio or tv). Every other main sport I can think of has its legends - Peter O'Sullivan, Bill McClaren, Richie Benaud, Murray Walker, Ted Lowe, Sid Waddell, Eammon Andrews and so on. Football? Nothing.
Maybe it's harder than I imagine, but I suspect the explanation is more mundane than that.
Even in the 90s, when the numbet of things which led to a chorus of "gaaaaay" was quite large (like not liking Oasis), this struck me as quite a bold assumption to leap to.
Don't worry though, whilst he's resting up in his Biden years JD Vance and Pete Hegseth are running the show.
Next Saturday
Is she just so.last year?
Our eldest started at Llandudno dry slope, and progressed to a professional snowboarder living the life in Europe, US and Canada
Mind you it is intrinsically dangerous and he witnessed a fair number of fatalities
Would be better than Vance and TBF somewhat better than the animated version of Trump.
Yes, he's slightly smarter than Donny, but nobody worships him. The clown car would fall apart faster than Laurel and Hardy
Bath has now won more Winter Olympic golds than Canada
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2026/jan/26/andy-burnham-labour-new-leader?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other
My point is (and it really baffles me) that I cannot name a single outstanding football commentator. (I'm not counting expert assistant commentators, such as Nevin, of which there are many who are very good.)
He witnessed a boarder plummet over 2,000 feet off a French mountain
1) Dual international
2) International in one sport and professional level in the other
3) Professional level in both sports
The dual internationals still existed in the 1950s and the dual professionals in the early 1980s.
Discounting Ian Botham with his Scunthorpe Utd games was Arnie Sidebottom the last England international cricketer who had played professional football ?
That Arnie Sidebottom played for Manchester United seems incredible given the way he lumbered around a cricket field.
(About 2034, at a guess?)
The three versions of the judgment are being appealed.
French 'ultra-left' behind killing of right-wing youth, says justice minister
On more serious matters, if you want to see sport shooting itself in the foot, the saga of CONSTITUTION HILL's flat run won't disappoint:
https://www.racingpost.com/news/britain/constitution-hill-set-to-miss-out-on-southwell-run-barring-withdrawals-after-sensationally-falling-on-wrong-side-of-ballot-line-aACJF7l9091a/
If you want a political analogy, the Prime Minister's constituency is abolished in a boundary review but he doesn't make the shortlist for either of the successor constituencies.
I have helped other women and been helped by them when getting menstrual leaks. I would not insist on being present if a woman requested privacy, even though I would have a legal right to remain. It is a matter of common decency, respect for the other person at a vulnerable and embarrassing time and basic human empathy. Dr Upton showed none of those to a woman old enough to be his mother. It is odd that so many of these men who claim to be women show so little empathy for the more brutal and unpleasant realities of what being a woman involves and behave instead like selfish entitled men.
A decent man, even one with gender dysphoria, would have given the nurse the privacy she needed. If he was really in touch with his inner female he would have understood the need to do so.
"Look at his face, just look at his face"
"A quality goal from a quality player"
And then Coleman with his iconic deadpan call for the first goal in any match if it came from the team who were dominating ...
"One nil"
Genuinely puzzled.
Are they going to swap skis or will they being trying for 10 minutes to fold the skins up in a gale without them sticking to everything?
/Ski Scotland
Soul Limbo (the cricket theme)
The theme from Sportsnight
The theme from sports report on Radio 5 (or 2, in the old days)
The theme from sport on 5 (or 2, in the old days)
The Chain (Formula one)
The theme from Superstars.
Honourable mentions too to the themes from Grandstand, Match of the Day, the Snooker theme. Time and again they got it right: it was impossible not to feel excited when your sport was about to be covered.
Unless your sport was rugby. The rugby special theme was a bit lame.
He also was signed by Bill Shankly for Huddersfield and played First Division at Carlisle in a twenty year career.
From wiki.
"Balderstone made history on 15 September 1975 by taking part in a County Championship match and a Football League game on the same day. Balderstone was 51 not out against Derbyshire at the end of day two of Leicestershire's match at Chesterfield. After close of play he changed into his football kit to play for Doncaster Rovers in an evening match 30 miles away (a 1–1 draw with Brentford). He then returned to Chesterfield the following morning to complete a century and take three wickets to help wrap up Leicestershire's first ever County Championship title."
How many other lines of commentary bring to mind a particular player.
Geoff Hurst and "They think its all over ..."
The late great Derek Lacey, who commentated for years for BBC Cumbria on Carlisle United was hugely loved, massively mourned at his death, had a cult following and was wonderfully bathetic and inaccurate, sometimes about the score, sometimes about which team had scored, sometimes not noticing that someone had scored, sometimes a bit vague about which teams were playing and so on. I miss him still, and he died 17 years ago.
The thrill of the speed even at my level is immense and to be that good and brave is something else.
@RestoreBritain_
Introducing Restore Britain's first ever councillor,
@MariaBowtell
.
A patriot!
https://x.com/RestoreBritain_/status/2023091198605283578
Phil captained England Schools and was offered a contract by Lancashire. Flintoff called him a "cricketing genius".
Gary played alongside Matthew Hayden.
Lord, I'm trying the best i can
I lost everybody in Khazakhstan
But I still don't understand
Bob Wilson, anchorman
I've been to Kent, Gwent, Senegal
I've even been to look for Jim Rosenthal
Found him on his knees at the wailing wall crying
"Bob Wilson, anchorman"
Well I marvel at the things we find beneath the ground
And that man can go faster than the speed of sound
But I still can't get my head around
Bob Wilson, anchorman
Well I'd like to meet Stevenson the engineer
And I'd like to meet Faraday and buy him a beer
And I'd love to meet the bloke who had the bright idea of
Bob Wilson, anchorman
Unforgettable
An Italian produced a great ski and Klammer had huge pressure on him.
He skied down like an absolute mad man it was astounding sport.
One of my favourite sporting moments ever.
Perhaps only surpassed by the Baa Baas try v All Blacks at Cardiff