For some time I have been thinking that taxing Veblen goods more heavily might be a win-win. Making them more expensive strengthens the status signal that some buyers want to display, and the government collects a little more revenue. (And the government can use part of that to detect and keep cheap imitations from cutting into the producer's share of the market.)
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
With Sikhs, ignore the first name. Look out for the Singh or Kaur. Or middle initial S or K.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
Sure, though how often is it necessary to know? Thinking of the various people I work with, other than ones on a day to day level it doesn't seem like it would even come up much.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
This government really hates me, every tax increase seems to target me personally.
I am fully expecting a luxury tax on Apple products and shoes over £700.
Perhaps a tax on modesty?
I would tax anyone who refuses to accept Die Hard is a Christmas movie until the pips squeak!!
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
I can't seem them doing that without bumping up fuel tax.
"each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage."
Eh?
Why not record the taxable mileage at the MOT, as is currently done and charge it at that point?
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Just wait until you start interacting with t'upper echelons (OK, you probably already do but bear with me), when you have to google them individually to find out whether they use Professor, Doctor, Mr/Ms, and whether they have a title, and if so which comes first - is it "Professor Dame" or "Dame Professor". It's all a bit awkward until they email back, at which point you go with "Phillip" or "Lucy" or whatever.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
With Sikhs, ignore the first name. Look out for the Singh or Kaur. Or middle initial S or K.
Good to know, thank you. I know Russian, Icelandic, and Spanish naming conventions, but always good to have another string to my bow.
Gianni Infantino will present the inaugural ‘FIFA Peace Prize’ at the draw for the 2026 World Cup, football’s world governing body has announced.
The award is designed to acknowledge “individuals who have helped to unite people all over the world in peace” with the winner to be crowned at the draw in Washington DC on December 5.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
Two of my best friends are called Priya.
One is a Sri-Lankan Canadian guy; the other an Indian-American lady.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
This government really hates me, every tax increase seems to target me personally.
I am fully expecting a luxury tax on Apple products and shoes over £700.
Perhaps a tax on modesty?
I'd approve of that as I'd be getting a huge tax rebate.
I am not certain you have fully grasped the nature of taxes
"Go home or we will deport you, Germany tells Syrians Friedrich Merz insists war-torn country is safe despite opposition from his own foreign minister" (£)
Could we end up rejoining the EU not for the economics but for their hardline immigration policy?
We're Better Together says PM Farage as he calls a Referendum for June 2031.
It's quite funny because I'd expect many Rejoiners, not that they'd admit it, to flip to Stay Outers because VALUES.
I can't bear Farage and I believe we are out now so we are where we are. I regret that we have left and I would probably vote for the free movement (free movement for me).
The whole idea of PM Farage rejoining the EU after the damage he has done to this nation over the last 30 years is absurd. Anyway using an analogy, I don't believe even Farage can successfully return the eggs from a baked cake to their original form.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
This government really hates me, every tax increase seems to target me personally.
I am fully expecting a luxury tax on Apple products and shoes over £700.
People buying £700 shoes don't need taxing any more, they clearly cannot be trusted to even dress themselves in the morning.
Sadly standard Church's black oxfords are now £940:
They look like they cost £30. Why are rich people so bad at buying expensive stuff?
It's like those houses on sale for tens of millions which have really uncomfortable looking chairs throughout, as though the need to buy something unique requires buying awful furniture.
They look like something a recruitment consultant would wear.
Boris Johnson’s favourites apparently, though like everything else he didn’t take care of them.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
Road pricing would make a hell of a lot more sense than whatever this reported approach is meant to do.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
Suits me I drive a diesel.
For those driving a heavily subsidised, dumped MG, Omoda-Jaecoo or BYD EV, they deserve the surcharge for selling out the European car industry to President Xi.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
Well, we're supposed to be encouraging everyone to do so and phasing out other vehicles.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
It certainly helps disincentivise people to make the switch. Which, if the government is being ideologically consistent (I know, I know) means they’ll surely be upping fuel duty at the same time.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
They need better charging options.
I would support public infrastructure so they can charge vehicles on their domestic electricity bill.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
Well, we're supposed to be encouraging everyone to do so and phasing out other vehicles.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
Remind me in your no tax, no service state how do we pay for the military?
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
It certainly helps disincentivise people to make the switch. Which, if the government is being ideologically consistent (I know, I know) means they’ll surely be upping fuel duty at the same time.
i know there is talk about scrapping the 5p subsidy introduced in 2022. but that still won't be enough as my car does 50mpg so to match the road tax they need to increase the price of petrol by 33p a litre...
Also how is it going to work with plug in hybrids - if Mrs Eek uses my car for work the first 20 miles is on electric, the rest petrol..
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
No worries, I would be entirely supportive of people who have no off road parking getting a house built with off-road parking.
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
Well, we're supposed to be encouraging everyone to do so and phasing out other vehicles.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
Remind me in your no tax, no service state how do we pay for the military?
Everyone should pay for the military equally, not drivers.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
It certainly helps disincentivise people to make the switch. Which, if the government is being ideologically consistent (I know, I know) means they’ll surely be upping fuel duty at the same time.
i know there is talk about scrapping the 5p subsidy introduced in 2022. but that still won't be enough as my car does 50mpg so to match the road tax they need to increase the price of petrol by 33p a litre...
I can hear the protesters tractors rumbling past my window as I write.
Easy restrict mpg to no more than 30 mpg. Back in the day one could only dream of 50mpg.
A 1982 Cortina 1.6 Crusader averaged 29.2 mpg in one test.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
With Sikhs, ignore the first name. Look out for the Singh or Kaur. Or middle initial S or K.
Good to know, thank you. I know Russian, Icelandic, and Spanish naming conventions, but always good to have another string to my bow.
Similarly Nepalis often have a middle name of Bahadur (men) or Devi (women)
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Just wait until you start interacting with t'upper echelons (OK, you probably already do but bear with me), when you have to google them individually to find out whether they use Professor, Doctor, Mr/Ms, and whether they have a title, and if so which comes first - is it "Professor Dame" or "Dame Professor". It's all a bit awkward until they email back, at which point you go with "Phillip" or "Lucy" or whatever.
Professors and Doctors are not the upper echelons.
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Perhaps Dr doesn't. I don't know Foxy's rank.
In pre-woke (and whe insurance docs still cam by snail mail) times, my car insurer used to send me letters addressed to "Dr (male) Selebian". Presumably as their drop-down list for title had "Dr (male)" and "Dr (female)" and no one had thought about this also being used to address letters.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
No worries, I would be entirely supportive of people who have no off road parking getting a house built with off-road parking.
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
Don't petrol car drivers subsidise your use of the roads?
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
Well, we're supposed to be encouraging everyone to do so and phasing out other vehicles.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
Remind me in your no tax, no service state how do we pay for the military?
Everyone should pay for the military equally, not drivers.
Having removed all fuel taxes (well all taxes for that matter) and in return government provides no services, who pays to fill your pot holes? Broken springs can be very expensive!
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
Tesla sales in the first month of any given quarter are always shit. They deliver very few vehicles - never have. Which is why you need to look at the quarter
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
Credit to whichever PBer who observed that the Chancellor will be speaking until Christmas in order to fit in everything leaked in the Torygraph.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Perhaps Dr doesn't. I don't know Foxy's rank.
Perhaps we should go German with Herr Dr etc.
I don't think Foxy would qualify for Herr Doktor without a PhD.
We should definitely use Herr Doktor Ingenieur though - and not for someone fixing washing machines.
I'm always suspicious of engineers with a PhD. It suggests that nobody wanted to employ them when they finished their first degree.
I'm not sure you'd say that of a biochemist, so why an engineer?
Depends on the field.
Because you don't need a PhD to get a good engineering job, and achieving CEng status is much more important than a doctorate in advancing your career.
Depends what career.
All the engineers I worked with had a doctorate, except the ones studying for one.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
No worries, I would be entirely supportive of people who have no off road parking getting a house built with off-road parking.
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
Don't petrol car drivers subsidise your use of the roads?
???
I buy petrol, as I said, I pay £40 per tank of petrol that gets me over 400 miles. Self-charging hybrid, so no plug in element.
And no, the tax on petrol goes into the general pot which funds amongst other things your train subsidies, it does not fund the roads. Expenditure on roads is a tiny fraction of taxes drivers pay.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
No worries, I would be entirely supportive of people who have no off road parking getting a house built with off-road parking.
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
Don't petrol car drivers subsidise your use of the roads?
And his 2.5 tonne Skoda Enyaq EV chews up the road surface faster than a 1.2 litre Corsa.
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
Tesla sales in the first month of any given quarter are always shit. They deliver very few vehicles - never have. Which is why you need to look at the quarter
I'm comparing October 2025 with October 2024 (so same month, just a different yeat).
But if you want me to wait until January 6th - I will happily post the figures then, I expect them to be equally bad...
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
Tesla sales in the first month of any given quarter are always shit. They deliver very few vehicles - never have. Which is why you need to look at the quarter
Do you not think comparing with the same month last year is reasonable?
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Perhaps Dr doesn't. I don't know Foxy's rank.
I think he's a physician so Dr rather than Mr. But it's just a courtesy title, he quite possibly doesn't have a doctorate.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
Well, we're supposed to be encouraging everyone to do so and phasing out other vehicles.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
Remind me in your no tax, no service state how do we pay for the military?
Everyone should pay for the military equally, not drivers.
Having removed all fuel taxes (well all taxes for that matter) and in return government provides no services, who pays to fill your pot holes? Broken springs can be very expensive!
I'm not proposing all taxes, never have done.
But drivers shouldn't be fleeced.
I'd be OK with VED matching the expenditure on roads. It is reasonably close to that already today. Fuel duty does not go on roads.
Maybe just go back to writing letters instead of emails. Might be easier.
Ridiculously expensive now with the cost of stamps, not to mention the unreliability of deliveries nowadays. Last week I got a bill and a reminder posted 2 weeks apart in the same post.
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Perhaps Dr doesn't. I don't know Foxy's rank.
In pre-woke (and whe insurance docs still cam by snail mail) times, my car insurer used to send me letters addressed to "Dr (male) Selebian". Presumably as their drop-down list for title had "Dr (male)" and "Dr (female)" and no one had thought about this also being used to address letters.
Maybe just go back to writing letters instead of emails. Might be easier.
Ridiculously expensive now with the cost of stamps, not to mention the unreliability of deliveries nowadays. Last week I got a bill and a reminder posted 2 weeks apart in the same post.
I had to cancel and re-order a credit card. A week and a half later it still hasn't turned up.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
Well, we're supposed to be encouraging everyone to do so and phasing out other vehicles.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
Remind me in your no tax, no service state how do we pay for the military?
Everyone should pay for the military equally, not drivers.
A poll tax for the military?
A courageous decision, as they say in Yes Minister.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
No worries, I would be entirely supportive of people who have no off road parking getting a house built with off-road parking.
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
Don't petrol car drivers subsidise your use of the roads?
And his 2.5 tonne Skoda Enyaq EV chews up the road surface faster than a 1.2 litre Corsa.
My Suzuki Swift weighs less than a tonne, so not sure what point you're trying to make.
I'd love to switch to an EV, for environmental reasons, and I'd love to see everyone able to do so, but it seems you're arguing against it? Is that right?
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
Tesla sales in the first month of any given quarter are always shit. They deliver very few vehicles - never have. Which is why you need to look at the quarter
I'm comparing October 2025 with October 2024 (so same month, just a different yeat).
But if you want me to wait until January 6th - I will happily post the figures then, I expect them to be equally bad...
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
Tesla sales in the first month of any given quarter are always shit. They deliver very few vehicles - never have. Which is why you need to look at the quarter
Do you not think comparing with the same month last year is reasonable?
Its quite some drop.
Again, it’s not like for like. Tesla do not deliver cars in volume in month 1 of the quarter. A few trickle out. It’s supply, not demand.
But we know two things 1. Model Y sales are huge in markets where Tesla still sell and poor in markets where they’ve been binned off 2. Model Y will not be the best selling car in the world in 2025
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I presume Tesco is a bit cheaper than charging on the motorway
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I presume Tesco is a bit cheaper than charging on the motorway
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
Mr does the job perfectly adequately.
Just wait until you start interacting with t'upper echelons (OK, you probably already do but bear with me), when you have to google them individually to find out whether they use Professor, Doctor, Mr/Ms, and whether they have a title, and if so which comes first - is it "Professor Dame" or "Dame Professor". It's all a bit awkward until they email back, at which point you go with "Phillip" or "Lucy" or whatever.
Professors and Doctors are not the upper echelons.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
I seem to remember that when I complained about the cost of commuting by train you told me rather unsympathetically that I had the option to move house or change my job. Maybe people who have an EV but no off road parking could just move to a bigger house with a driveway?
No worries, I would be entirely supportive of people who have no off road parking getting a house built with off-road parking.
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
Don't petrol car drivers subsidise your use of the roads?
And his 2.5 tonne Skoda Enyaq EV chews up the road surface faster than a 1.2 litre Corsa.
My Suzuki Swift weighs less than a tonne, so not sure what point you're trying to make.
I'd love to switch to an EV, for environmental reasons, and I'd love to see everyone able to do so, but it seems you're arguing against it? Is that right?
I have a little Fiat 500E in the cheapest "Red" trim. Technically, it's my wife's car while I have a Rivian.
But it's so great; I absolutely love it. If it's just (plus one kid), I'll use it rather than the brilliant behemoth that is the Rivian. (That said, the Rivian is amazing for roadtrips and when we need to shift lots of stuff.)
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
Credit to whichever PBer who observed that the Chancellor will be speaking until Christmas in order to fit in everything leaked in the Torygraph.
Thanks. That was me. I'm now extending it to New Year's Day.
The Richard Tice speech / q&a at Bloomberg today was rather interesting. The comparison vs the current and recent chancellors, in experience, intellectual curiosity and charisma is pretty stark.
I'd be quite interested in a header by someone about what a Democrat controlled House of Representatives could do in the second half of a Trump term to slow him down.
(AFAIK asserting - how effective? - control over money bills, starting impeachments, and being a large sheet anchor.)
Well, it could effectively stop all ICE funding if it wanted to. At the very least, it would be an enormous pain in the arse for the Trump administration.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I presume Tesco is a bit cheaper than charging on the motorway
Oh yes. 60p a kWh, compared to at least 80 odd p.
The 75p I quoted is for my local petrol station, that I fill my vehicle up at £1.309, not a motorway. Not as good as 60p but still not far off.
Re-running the Maths at 60p doesn't change the fact an EV is still more expensive than a self-charging petrol-only hybrid.
Assuming 5 miles per kWh, 400 miles = 80 kWh = £48 for electricity alone. Plus £12 in mooted tax would be £60 total.
Versus £40 for petrol I pay.
Not a good deal, unless you take an I'm alright Jack attitude that you have off-road parking so screw anyone who doesn't.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I presume Tesco is a bit cheaper than charging on the motorway
Oh yes. 60p a kWh, compared to at least 80 odd p.
Although that's over twice what I pay at home, even without an EV tariff
Per mile taxation is silly - does nothing to dis-incentivise short journeys while hurting rural communities. At least fuel duty penalises fuel-inefficient urban driving.
Far preferable is a per journey (or per day?) charge, or an urban driving charge. That could mean the tax on a journey between Aberdeen and Inverness would be the same as between your home and the local primary school. If per mile taxation is feasible then surely this is too.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I presume Tesco is a bit cheaper than charging on the motorway
Oh yes. 60p a kWh, compared to at least 80 odd p.
Although that's over twice what I pay at home, even without an EV tariff
Yes, true. Sadly I can't run a cable across a pavement from a terraced house.
I've always wanted an EV though. Quiet, very clean and satisfying
I say keep 'em guessing, and go with something like: she/him/they
It also allows you to tut-tut people who don't get it right.
My emails make it quite clear that I am to be addressed as 'Your Excellency'.
In the event anyone dares ask me, mine are "Ah/Do/Fuck/Off". Anyone offering me theirs will be asked if they want or need remedial English grammar lessons and, if not, classed as a Tedious Narcissist.
Random example of confusion over gender- my wife’s names is also a common boys name, although usually spelt with a y rather than an i. Many years ago when booking a b and b the owner was rather frosty on the phone taking our names, until I explained she was a she.
So if can see a point sometimes.
But mostly it’s just performative shit.
In Leicester it is quite handy as we have many names from other parts of the world for which the gender is not obvious. So as a reciprocal courtesy I append mine to emails.
I dont know your actual name, is it warranted?
I know someone called Brian a white bald man, who declares his pronouns. Dont be like Brian.
In my previous job I interacted at least weekly with people from India - not Indian-descended people in the UK, Indian people in actual India. Their naming conventions aren't obviously gendered so I was endlessly googling their first names to see if, say, "Gunpreet" was a boy programmer or a girl programmer
Why does it matter?
Dear Gunpreet,
Blah, blah, blah.
Blah blah.
Blah.
Kind regards, viewcode.
Why do you need to know their sex?
He needs to know how appropriatge flirting is, given his sexual predilictions.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I know several people in LA who live in apartment complexes and don't have chargers. They use fast chargers (most Tesla Superchargers) once every week or so, and don't seem too bothered by the lack of home charging. Of course, they're probably not saving much money compared to using petrol, but it's their choice.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I fully charge my EV for about £15 on my smart meter for 270 miles.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
Yeah, no shit Sherlock, you have off road parking so have access to your smart meter.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
Would anyone who can't charge at home buy an electric car? If so, why?
I can't charge at home and I've just bought an EV.
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
I presume Tesco is a bit cheaper than charging on the motorway
Oh yes. 60p a kWh, compared to at least 80 odd p.
Although that's over twice what I pay at home, even without an EV tariff
Yes, true. Sadly I can't run a cable across a pavement from a terraced house.
I've always wanted an EV though. Quiet, very clean and satisfying
Visited friends in the Hague, you can get outlets installed at the kerb by the municioality, although I think it tskes a couple of neighbours to want one. It can't be that difficult to run an armour cable under the pavement, I have a similar arrangement to a garage in a block, although on private land obvs
Per mile taxation is silly - does nothing to dis-incentivise short journeys while hurting rural communities. At least fuel duty penalises fuel-inefficient urban driving.
Far preferable is a per journey (or per day?) charge, or an urban driving charge. That could mean the tax on a journey between Aberdeen and Inverness would be the same as between your home and the local primary school. If per mile taxation is feasible then surely this is too.
Declaration: this would really hurt us because we do all our journeys within Edinburgh by bicycle, but still do 17,000 miles a year in the car due to long commutes and spending time (and money) in the Highlands. This feels very unfair to me.
I'd be quite interested in a header by someone about what a Democrat controlled House of Representatives could do in the second half of a Trump term to slow him down.
(AFAIK asserting - how effective? - control over money bills, starting impeachments, and being a large sheet anchor.)
Well, it could effectively stop all ICE funding if it wanted to. At the very least, it would be an enormous pain in the arse for the Trump administration.
Per mile taxation is silly - does nothing to dis-incentivise short journeys while hurting rural communities. At least fuel duty penalises fuel-inefficient urban driving.
Far preferable is a per journey (or per day?) charge, or an urban driving charge. That could mean the tax on a journey between Aberdeen and Inverness would be the same as between your home and the local primary school. If per mile taxation is feasible then surely this is too.
It’s an exclusive in the Reformgraph which hits red tape and EVs in one glorious attack. It’s laughably not true.
I can imagine it. Government wants to raise money from EV drivers which is expects to be the majority of new cars registered in a few years.
Obviously the way to do it is have each individual driver fill in a tax form to guess their forthcoming use and pay the tax outside PAYE. Cheap and simple to administer and as everyone always tells the truth the money is guaranteed. Besides which they’d hire an army of tax inspectors to come and check your car odometer against your tax form. On a clipboard and everything
Per mile taxation is silly - does nothing to dis-incentivise short journeys while hurting rural communities. At least fuel duty penalises fuel-inefficient urban driving.
Far preferable is a per journey (or per day?) charge, or an urban driving charge. That could mean the tax on a journey between Aberdeen and Inverness would be the same as between your home and the local primary school. If per mile taxation is feasible then surely this is too.
Declaration: this would really hurt us because we do all our journeys within Edinburgh by bicycle, but still do 17,000 miles a year in the car due to long commutes and spending time (and money) in the Highlands. This feels very unfair to me.
The obvious thing to do if it is becoming impractical to tax something, and the only way of doing it is to disincentivise something you want to encourage, is to tax something else
Liberal Democrat and Green voters would flock back to Labour to prevent Nigel Farage from entering Downing Street at the next election, YouGov polling for The Times suggests
An analysis by YouGov found tactical voting is likely to be a critical feature of the next election, with supporters of all parties prepared to switch their vote to influence the overall result
It found that more than half, or 57 per cent, of all Liberal Democrat voters and 46 per cent of Green voters would give up their first preference and back Labour if they were in a seat where Reform UK looked likely to win
Significantly it found that Liberal Democrat, Labour and Green voters were also prepared to back the Tories in seats that were vulnerable to Nigel Farage’s party
A third, or 34 per cent, of current Labour voters would back Kemi Badenoch’s party to stop Reform, as would 39 per cent of current Lib Dem voters and even 19 per cent of Green voters
Hardly, over a third of Labour and LD voters willing to tactically vote Tory to beat Reform could make the difference for a number of Tory MPs in holding their seats. Probably even more would if Cleverly say was Tory leader at the next GE
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
I can't seem them doing that without bumping up fuel tax.
"each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage."
Eh?
Why not record the taxable mileage at the MOT, as is currently done and charge it at that point?
Several problems with that (and indeed with the scheme in general).
1) No MOT for the first 4 years - how are you going to bill those?
2) What do you do about people who don't take their car for its next MOT, and cars sold between Mots? Whilst the motor industry would doubtless be delighted by MOT's effectively costing hundreds (which would rather shift the balance away from repairing old bangers which are marginal on test anyway), it introduces a terrible set of perverse incentives (including a strong one to just keep driving an old banger without a test until apprehended).
I can't see a workable route to pay per mile that doesn't involve either cameras or "over the air" reporting built into cars. Anything that enables people to end up in expensive arrears is moronic. But then the Treasury is run by morons, so what do we expect...
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
I can't seem them doing that without bumping up fuel tax.
"each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage."
Eh?
Why not record the taxable mileage at the MOT, as is currently done and charge it at that point?
Several problems with that (and indeed with the scheme in general).
1) No MOT for the first 4 years - how are you going to bill those?
2) What do you do about people who don't take their car for its next MOT, and cars sold between Mots? Whilst the motor industry would doubtless be delighted by MOT's effectively costing hundreds (which would rather shift the balance away from repairing old bangers which are marginal on test anyway), it introduces a terrible set of perverse incentives (including a strong one to just keep driving an old banger without a test until apprehended).
I can't see a workable route to pay per mile that doesn't involve either cameras or "over the air" reporting built into cars. Anything that enables people to end up in expensive arrears is moronic. But then the Treasury is run by morons, so what do we expect...
The second issue is solvable, because when you transfer title of a vehicle, you record its mileage.
But given 90% of EVs are in category 1, it's all a bit academic.
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
Utter disgrace. We should not be taxing transportation.
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
I thought anti-net zero Tories would be revelling in this attack on the EV driving wokerati. Greta Thunberg eat your heart out.
I'm pro net zero.
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
It certainly helps disincentivise people to make the switch. Which, if the government is being ideologically consistent (I know, I know) means they’ll surely be upping fuel duty at the same time.
i know there is talk about scrapping the 5p subsidy introduced in 2022. but that still won't be enough as my car does 50mpg so to match the road tax they need to increase the price of petrol by 33p a litre...
I can hear the protesters tractors rumbling past my window as I write.
Easy restrict mpg to no more than 30 mpg. Back in the day one could only dream of 50mpg.
A 1982 Cortina 1.6 Crusader averaged 29.2 mpg in one test.
On the other hand, in 1984 the Perkins Prima powered turbo diesel Maestro and Montego came out. IIRC, the sales reps guaranteed a full refund if you could find a way to make one return less than 50mpg (one of the best set of mechanicals ever fitted to a car, rather unfortunately rather let down by being bolted into a British Leyland parts bin bodyshell with no rust proofing of the paint.
Driven economically on a run, I think someone got one to about 90mpg. My modern diesel estate only manages 70mpg in similar conditions...!
"The meaning of Mamdani Democrats risk drawing the wrong lessons from one good day Moderate governors offer a better model than a charming socialist in New York" (£)
A new pay-per-mile tax will be unveiled in the Budget for electric cars which will kick in from 2028
It will cost the average eco driver £250 a year and longer-distance travellers much more than that
It will be levied at 3p per mile on current Treasury plans. (The equivalent of £12 for an EV drive from London to Edinburgh.)
The measure will be framed as one of fairness. Fuel duty - which doesn’t affect electric cars - costs 6p a mile on average
It’s also needed to fill a growing black hole in the Treasury numbers from plummeting fuel duty revenues as people switch from petrol to electric
The Treasury will likely play down the pay per mile element. It is being dubbed ‘VED+’ and is an annual charge to be paid alongside Vehicle Excise Duty. No journey monitoring by cameras or anything.
But each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage.
It is the start of a huge potential change in the taxation of cars, from at the pump to by the mile.
It’s been long debated. Now Rachel Reeves will grasp the nettle by announcing a consultation at the Budget.
Up to 6 million people will be driving EVs when the new charge starts in 2028.
It opens the door in the future to all cars eventually being taxed per mile. And what about enforcement? Could drivers one day be made to prove miles traveled?
The Treasury declined to comment on Budget speculation.
I can't seem them doing that without bumping up fuel tax.
"each year drivers of EVs and hybrids will need to estimate how many miles they will travel that year and pay a price directly linked to mileage."
Eh?
Why not record the taxable mileage at the MOT, as is currently done and charge it at that point?
Several problems with that (and indeed with the scheme in general).
1) No MOT for the first 4 years - how are you going to bill those?
2) What do you do about people who don't take their car for its next MOT, and cars sold between Mots? Whilst the motor industry would doubtless be delighted by MOT's effectively costing hundreds (which would rather shift the balance away from repairing old bangers which are marginal on test anyway), it introduces a terrible set of perverse incentives (including a strong one to just keep driving an old banger without a test until apprehended).
I can't see a workable route to pay per mile that doesn't involve either cameras or "over the air" reporting built into cars. Anything that enables people to end up in expensive arrears is moronic. But then the Treasury is run by morons, so what do we expect...
The second issue is solvable, because when you transfer title of a vehicle, you record its mileage.
But given 90% of EVs are in category 1, it's all a bit academic.
We currently don't have to record a vehicles mileage at sale, it's optional. I never do, on the basis that you should never give the government any more information about anything than what you are legally obligated to tell them.
The bigger problem is the general arrears problem. For the average joe, particularly as these cars get older, and are run by poorer people, lots of them will be able to run up a significant liability (say 20k miles - £600) without putting aside the means to pay when the bill comes in. PAYE exists precisely to prevent this problem arising with income tax. But with cars, if usage is only recorded annually (and if not at the MOT, then how?), a lot of people will get caught out and end up in a financial mess.
FWIW, I'm against this whole concept on the slippery slope basis - once the principle is in place, it will magically be extended to all vehicles (so poor or frugal people running older ICE vehicles can pay twice!) and that 3p/mile will mysteriously rise at twice inflation. If politicians wanted all that lovely tax revenue from drivers, they shouldn't have promoted EVs as a solution in the first place (especially when the main benefit for drivers from running an EV is the straight up arbitrage from the fuel being untaxed).
"The meaning of Mamdani Democrats risk drawing the wrong lessons from one good day Moderate governors offer a better model than a charming socialist in New York" (£)
Hmmm. The Democrats (and anglophone centre-left-wing parties) have fallen into a pattern of "we must go more right-wing to get elected" whilst in opposition and "we must go more right-wing to get reelected" whilst in government. It creates parties that can't justify what they are doing other than "we want to get elected". Mamdani offered a better future and was willing to tell the right to eff-off, and did so with humour, and he won. Leaving aside his policy content, his election approach should be noted and copied.
Just had a dinner debate with a charming colleague who is also a Trump fan. Here are his reasons why Trump is great:
- No wars. Democrats are warmongering neocons - Oh and we should just cut all aid to Ukraine and let Russia take what’s rightfully theirs - Law and order on the streets of America: Blue cities are out of control apocalyptic hellholes
He then admonished me for risking my life taking the tram into downtown Houston and refused to leave until I was safely in an uber back to my hotel. Which somewhat contradicted the last point.
Dealers in high end cars are already commonly coming across devices now that rather than roll back mileage interfer with the mileage going on the clock in a way that it only records say 1 in 10 miles. By doing this way it just looks like you have low usage of the car rather than the Arthur Daley roll the clock back resulting in a clear and obvious change on the recorded numbers.
The devices are actually very cheap, but currently only really been found on cars where every 1000 miles knocks off £10ks in value. They are never found via an MOT or even official dealer servicing. High end car dealers are getting caught out as well.
However if there was to be a tax on every mile using a self recorded system that is backstopped only via the mileage being recoded at the MOT, I wonder what would to the usage rates of these devices would become...
Bloomberg: New York Police Commissioner Jessica Tisch is willing to remain in her post under Zohran Mamdani as long as the progressive mayor-elect allows her to keep pursuing her agenda, according to people with knowledge of the matter.
I do have to giggle about the EV per mile exclusive. In the Telegraph - which is the first sign that it isn’t true because so little they print as “news” is.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
As you are around - have you seen Tesla's (lack of sales) in October
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
Tesla sales in the first month of any given quarter are always shit. They deliver very few vehicles - never have. Which is why you need to look at the quarter
IIRC Tesla charters ships to deliver their cars from US to UK, so they arrive in batches of 5,000 rather than steadily as with most other manufacturers who rent space on existing shipping routes.
There’s very few other American-made cars sold in UK or Europe, there’s a 10% tariff on non-electric American cars in the UK.
Dealers in high end cars are already commonly coming across devices now that rather than roll back mileage interfer with the mileage going on the clock in a way that it only records say 1 in 10 miles. By doing this way it just looks like you have low usage of the car rather than the Arthur Daley roll the clock back resulting in a clear and obvious change on the recorded numbers.
The devices are actually very cheap, but currently only really been found on cars where every 1000 miles knocks off £10ks in value. They are never found via an MOT or even official dealer servicing. High end car dealers are getting caught out as well.
However if there was to be a tax on every mile using a self recorded system that is backstopped only via the mileage being recoded at the MOT, I wonder what would to the usage rates of these devices would become...
Modern cars are really difficult to roll back, because the mileage is stored in a number of different computers on the car so the dealer can spot it easily. Yes there would be an explosion in defeat devices if tax was based on mileage, and sales of cars easy to fake mileage would rise.
Clocking has been a problem at the luxury end of the market for decades, there’s loads of ‘80s-2000s Ferraris with fewer than 10k miles recorded, but clearly having done a lot more than that! For most of them, unplugging a physical spedo cable from the back of the gearbox is sufficient to stop it recording mileage.
Comments
Also means that EVs will be even more expensive than modern petrol vehicles can be, even though the petrol price is ludicrously overtaxed already. For anyone who has no off-road parking and needs to pay public charging rates, it will be absurdly expensive.
It costs me £40 to buy a tank of petrol (at £1.309 per litre) that gets me 400-420 miles on average.
I believe 5 miles per kWh is as good as it gets, so that's 80-84 kWh. My local station advertises it is 75p per kWh, so 80kWh x 75p = £60. Add in 3p per mile tax you'll be adding another £12.
So 400 miles works out at £40 for my hybrid for petrol, or £72 for an EV.
Not exactly economic.
This is the first year I have had to pay for a virtual road tax disc.
One is a Sri-Lankan Canadian guy; the other an Indian-American lady.
Dear Gunpreet,
Blah, blah, blah.
Blah blah.
Blah.
Kind regards,
viewcode.
Why do you need to know their sex?
The whole idea of PM Farage rejoining the EU after the damage he has done to this nation over the last 30 years is absurd. Anyway using an analogy, I don't believe even Farage can successfully return the eggs from a baked cake to their original form.
What about people without off road parking that need to rely upon public charging solutions?
I'm alright Jack?
This is anti net zero and incentivises people to rely upon petrol.
For those driving a heavily subsidised, dumped MG, Omoda-Jaecoo or BYD EV, they deserve the surcharge for selling out the European car industry to President Xi.
That means everyone, including those who can't charge at home, ending up with an EV should be the ambition.
Not economic at current prices, even without taxing mileage. Utterly farcical if mileage is taxed.
I would support public infrastructure so they can charge vehicles on their domestic electricity bill.
Also how is it going to work with plug in hybrids - if Mrs Eek uses my car for work the first 20 miles is on electric, the rest petrol..
Unfortunately, NIMBYs object to that.
Of course your train journey is heavily subsidised, not taxed. You forget that element.
Easy restrict mpg to no more than 30 mpg. Back in the day one could only dream of 50mpg.
A 1982 Cortina 1.6 Crusader averaged 29.2 mpg in one test.
Comedy - it’s pay per mile. But no monitoring. Honest motorists will fill in EV bureaucrat paperwork each year and self declare how many miles they have driven.
What do Telegraph owners hate? Government bureaucrats and EVs. So of course they have magically conflated the two.
So the SMMT have published sales figures for October
Battery EV sales rose 24% compared to October 2024
TESLA however sold only 511 cars compared to 971 cars in October 2024 - that’s a 47% drop
So the new models were a very temporary boost and the reality is that a Tesla car is not something people seem to want.
All the engineers I worked with had a doctorate, except the ones studying for one.
If you were doing the R in R&D it was expected.
Admittedly that was all 30 years ago....
I buy petrol, as I said, I pay £40 per tank of petrol that gets me over 400 miles. Self-charging hybrid, so no plug in element.
And no, the tax on petrol goes into the general pot which funds amongst other things your train subsidies, it does not fund the roads. Expenditure on roads is a tiny fraction of taxes drivers pay.
But if you want me to wait until January 6th - I will happily post the figures then, I expect them to be equally bad...
Its quite some drop.
But drivers shouldn't be fleeced.
I'd be OK with VED matching the expenditure on roads. It is reasonably close to that already today. Fuel duty does not go on roads.
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/dear-rich-bastard/
A courageous decision, as they say in Yes Minister.
I'd love to switch to an EV, for environmental reasons, and I'd love to see everyone able to do so, but it seems you're arguing against it? Is that right?
I don't do a lot of miles so I charge up at Tesco once a week. Only up to 80%
And Again, it’s not like for like. Tesla do not deliver cars in volume in month 1 of the quarter. A few trickle out. It’s supply, not demand.
But we know two things
1. Model Y sales are huge in markets where Tesla still sell and poor in markets where they’ve been binned off
2. Model Y will not be the best selling car in the world in 2025
But it's so great; I absolutely love it. If it's just (plus one kid), I'll use it rather than the brilliant behemoth that is the Rivian. (That said, the Rivian is amazing for roadtrips and when we need to shift lots of stuff.)
I'm now extending it to New Year's Day.
Re-running the Maths at 60p doesn't change the fact an EV is still more expensive than a self-charging petrol-only hybrid.
Assuming 5 miles per kWh, 400 miles = 80 kWh = £48 for electricity alone. Plus £12 in mooted tax would be £60 total.
Versus £40 for petrol I pay.
Not a good deal, unless you take an I'm alright Jack attitude that you have off-road parking so screw anyone who doesn't.
Far preferable is a per journey (or per day?) charge, or an urban driving charge. That could mean the tax on a journey between Aberdeen and Inverness would be the same as between your home and the local primary school. If per mile taxation is feasible then surely this is too.
I've always wanted an EV though. Quiet, very clean and satisfying
I dont think the Labour rank & file are stupid enough to re-vote in a proven GE loser. If I recall correctly, it was a pretty thumping defeat with it.
I can imagine it. Government wants to raise money from EV drivers which is expects to be the majority of new cars registered in a few years.
Obviously the way to do it is have each individual driver fill in a tax form to guess their forthcoming use and pay the tax outside PAYE. Cheap and simple to administer and as everyone always tells the truth the money is guaranteed. Besides which they’d hire an army of tax inspectors to come and check your car odometer against your tax form. On a clipboard and everything
Cameron's in or out EU Referendum blindsided the hapless Milliband and by rights should have kept Cameron in Downing Street for decades.
1) No MOT for the first 4 years - how are you going to bill those?
2) What do you do about people who don't take their car for its next MOT, and cars sold between Mots? Whilst the motor industry would doubtless be delighted by MOT's effectively costing hundreds (which would rather shift the balance away from repairing old bangers which are marginal on test anyway), it introduces a terrible set of perverse incentives (including a strong one to just keep driving an old banger without a test until apprehended).
I can't see a workable route to pay per mile that doesn't involve either cameras or "over the air" reporting built into cars. Anything that enables people to end up in expensive arrears is moronic.
But then the Treasury is run by morons, so what do we expect...
But given 90% of EVs are in category 1, it's all a bit academic.
Driven economically on a run, I think someone got one to about 90mpg. My modern diesel estate only manages 70mpg in similar conditions...!
"The meaning of Mamdani
Democrats risk drawing the wrong lessons from one good day
Moderate governors offer a better model than a charming socialist in New York" (£)
https://www.economist.com/leaders/2025/11/05/democrats-risk-drawing-the-wrong-lessons-from-one-good-day
The bigger problem is the general arrears problem. For the average joe, particularly as these cars get older, and are run by poorer people, lots of them will be able to run up a significant liability (say 20k miles - £600) without putting aside the means to pay when the bill comes in.
PAYE exists precisely to prevent this problem arising with income tax. But with cars, if usage is only recorded annually (and if not at the MOT, then how?), a lot of people will get caught out and end up in a financial mess.
FWIW, I'm against this whole concept on the slippery slope basis - once the principle is in place, it will magically be extended to all vehicles (so poor or frugal people running older ICE vehicles can pay twice!) and that 3p/mile will mysteriously rise at twice inflation. If politicians wanted all that lovely tax revenue from drivers, they shouldn't have promoted EVs as a solution in the first place (especially when the main benefit for drivers from running an EV is the straight up arbitrage from the fuel being untaxed).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6-0h95Xtls (9 mins)
Pause
Go to bed, viewcode
(narrator: viewcode is going to bed now)
Just had a dinner debate with a charming colleague who is also a Trump fan. Here are his reasons why Trump is great:
- No wars. Democrats are warmongering neocons
- Oh and we should just cut all aid to Ukraine and let Russia take what’s rightfully theirs
- Law and order on the streets of America: Blue cities are out of control apocalyptic hellholes
He then admonished me for risking my life taking the tram into downtown Houston and refused to leave until I was safely in an uber back to my hotel. Which somewhat contradicted the last point.
The devices are actually very cheap, but currently only really been found on cars where every 1000 miles knocks off £10ks in value. They are never found via an MOT or even official dealer servicing. High end car dealers are getting caught out as well.
However if there was to be a tax on every mile using a self recorded system that is backstopped only via the mileage being recoded at the MOT, I wonder what would to the usage rates of these devices would become...
https://x.com/bohuslavskakate/status/1986204779731886473?s=12
Meanwhile, the Schengen visa zone is to stop issuing new tourist or residency visas to Russians.
https://x.com/tweet4annanafo/status/1986194987038490817
The NY fire chief already announced his resignation yesterday.
There’s very few other American-made cars sold in UK or Europe, there’s a 10% tariff on non-electric American cars in the UK.
Clocking has been a problem at the luxury end of the market for decades, there’s loads of ‘80s-2000s Ferraris with fewer than 10k miles recorded, but clearly having done a lot more than that! For most of them, unplugging a physical spedo cable from the back of the gearbox is sufficient to stop it recording mileage.