Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
Maybe the UK should remove her passport for encouraging a foreign country to take a hostile act against us. Declare Allison Pearson a terrorist organisation. Can’t see many marches in her support.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
The specific case isnt the issue though, its the perception, the aftermath of Southport and the fact Jones is a Labour councillor. Its a blue touch paper thing.
Again, I'm not sure. The politically aware may see that but it's mid August, holiday time and most people won't take too much notice.
As for the "aftermath of Southport", I presume you're referring to Lucy Connolly and whatever the rights and many wrongs of that case, the truth is Ricky Jones was acquitted by a jury, not let off by a judge. I see some are arguing he was fortunate to be tried at Snaresbrook - I'm not sure of the inference of that, Snaresbrook tries a lot of cases.
Those who want to make a political point out of all this will and they'd have done the same if Jones had been found guilty.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
So she thinks a foreign government should interfere with UK judicial decisions made and she’s asking for economic damage inflicted on the country . She really is a loathsome creature .
Calverton is a very good school but instead of 420 pupils on roll, it's going to start the new year with 229 and as funding is related to numbers on roll, the school is going to take a big financial hit.
IF we are seeing declining birth rates and these are not being balanced (as they were before) by children of immigrants, we are going to see more schools merging and closing and that is going to have significant impacts on local economies and other areas.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
It only adds to that narrative if you don't understand the concept of jury trials. Unfortunately that may be a large share of Reform's supporters.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
Though that was a jury doing what they presumably though was right, without fear or favour. Whereas this (from the Conservatives) just looks stark, raving, tonto from a "playing into Farage's hands" point of view.
REVEALED: The huge list of freebies and perks channel migrants are entitled to once they land in Britain.
Meanwhile, Rachel Reeves is taxing you for every last penny.
The Conservatives are the only Party with a plan to stop this madness.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
So she thinks a foreign government should interfere with UK judicial decisions made and she’s asking for economic damage inflicted on the country . She really is a loathsome creature .
We are a very divided country as indeed is the rest of the world at present and this division shows no signs of ending sadly
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
It only adds to that narrative if you don't understand the concept of jury trials. Unfortunately that may be a large share of Reform's supporters.
The question is does it go wider than Reform supporters and into the general population
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp. JRM is a rightwinger with a brain, not an unthinking populist.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Calverton is a very good school but instead of 420 pupils on roll, it's going to start the new year with 229 and as funding is related to numbers on roll, the school is going to take a big financial hit.
IF we are seeing declining birth rates and these are not being balanced (as they were before) by children of immigrants, we are going to see more schools merging and closing and that is going to have significant impacts on local economies and other areas.
Partly lack of children, partly unaffordability of London. It's been an issue on Hackney for a couple of years now, presumably this is just the same effect rippling out.
Since I mostly do post-16 these days, I'm half hoping it will won't wash over me until I can plausibly retire. (Who am I kidding? I teach physics. They will be dragging me in to do lessons when I'm 1.83 metres under.)
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
The specific case isnt the issue though, its the perception, the aftermath of Southport and the fact Jones is a Labour councillor. Its a blue touch paper thing.
Again, I'm not sure. The politically aware may see that but it's mid August, holiday time and most people won't take too much notice.
As for the "aftermath of Southport", I presume you're referring to Lucy Connolly and whatever the rights and many wrongs of that case, the truth is Ricky Jones was acquitted by a jury, not let off by a judge. I see some are arguing he was fortunate to be tried at Snaresbrook - I'm not sure of the inference of that, Snaresbrook tries a lot of cases.
Those who want to make a political point out of all this will and they'd have done the same if Jones had been found guilty.
For those that do notice (who are perhaps not politically aware), its 'that Labour guy who got let off' Thats the problem Labour have. People who just tune in to 'a thing happened and its the opposite of the other thing' and have heard 'two tier justice' bandied about will be irritated in the extreme, I doubt many will even clock the difference between jury and magistrate cases as this is. And its not really about the case itself, its about a perception and things that (rightly or wrongly) feed the perception are dangerous for the government. Often its 'unfair' stuff that stitches you up for all the shit you got away with. Cakes etc
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Why? The Labour councillor was prosecuted, it was a jury of the public that acquitted him
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
Which we don't right?
It will be interesting to see a poll on this issue
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Why? The Labour councillor was prosecuted, it was a jury of the public that acquitted him
Because that's how it will be and is being viewed by many. Thems the breaks
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Jeez enough of this constant trashing of the country . All countries have problems , there are still many great things about the UK. I really don’t understand why you continue to live here if you hate the place so much . You’re obviously not poor and have a good life with your travels . Some times you need to appreciate what you have and be thankful . We’re very lucky and many would give anything to live in the UK .
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp. JRM is a rightwinger with a brain, not an unthinking populist.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
I’ll tell you what happens with impossible promises. You start with far-fetched resolutions. They are then pickled into a rigid dogma, a code, and you go through the years sticking to that, outdated, misplaced, irrelevant to the real needs, and you end in the grotesque chaos of Conservative shadow ministers- Conservative shadow ministers getting lessons in legal reality from Jacob Rees-Mogg.
Are you calling me a liar @TSE? I find it embarrassing if a couple argue in my space. So much so that if they argue on a train I will move to a different carriage. If they argue in a cafe I will leave. If the usual suspects on here get too aggressive I scroll past.
I’m similar, I suffer terribly from fremdschämen and can’t stand other people arguing or making a public tit of themselves so prefer to move away before the earth swallows me up.
I’m glad I’m not the only one. I didn’t realise there was a word for it. Remember, Fairliered, fremdschämen fremdschämen. Thanks @boulay.
Calverton is a very good school but instead of 420 pupils on roll, it's going to start the new year with 229 and as funding is related to numbers on roll, the school is going to take a big financial hit.
IF we are seeing declining birth rates and these are not being balanced (as they were before) by children of immigrants, we are going to see more schools merging and closing and that is going to have significant impacts on local economies and other areas.
On the positive side, the government won't need to spend so much money on education, and unused school buildings can be sold off.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
Though that was a jury doing what they presumably though was right, without fear or favour. Whereas this (from the Conservatives) just looks stark, raving, tonto from a "playing into Farage's hands" point of view.
REVEALED: The huge list of freebies and perks channel migrants are entitled to once they land in Britain.
Meanwhile, Rachel Reeves is taxing you for every last penny.
The Conservatives are the only Party with a plan to stop this madness.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
You misconstrue
I despise the British state and almost every representation of it. I want a revolution (peaceful) where almost everyone in power is driven into exile or maybe put in jail for a long long time
Would I fight for Britain in a war? I’m no longer sure at all
That’s very different from whether it is a pleasant place to live. Lots of despicable countries can be nice places to live
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Jeez enough of this constant trashing of the country . All countries have problems , there are still many great things about the UK. I really don’t understand why you continue to live here if you hate the place so much . You’re obviously not poor and have a good life with your travels . Some times you need to appreciate what you have and be thankful . We’re very lucky and many would give anything to live in the UK .
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp. JRM is a rightwinger with a brain, not an unthinking populist.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
He doesn't actually know the law, though, if he only thinks Connolly could "probably" have had a jury trial had she pleaded not guilty. She could definitely have had a jury trial, as she was charged with an offence potentially (and indeed actually) attracting a sentence of custody of over six months. So had she pleaded not guilty, she'd have had an absolute right to opt to have a jury trial.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
You misconstrue
I despise the British state and almost every representation of it. I want a revolution (peaceful) where almost everyone in power is driven into exile or maybe put in jail for a long long time
Would I fight for Britain in a war? I’m no longer sure at all
That’s very different from whether it is a pleasant place to live. Lots of despicable countries can be nice places to live
I agree with your disdain for the state. I would still fight for the country because I would, in my mind at least, be fighting for the young Brits who aren’t responsible for the state and given a change, or soft revolution, should have the opportunity to create and live in a Britain that we enjoyed because, if we are fighting, it’s against someone like Russia which. Is going to make the current Britain look like heaven.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Why? The Labour councillor was prosecuted, it was a jury of the public that acquitted him
Because that's how it will be and is being viewed by many. Thems the breaks
So presumably that means Farage and Cleverly will be calling for jury trials to be scrapped and Crown court verdicts left to judges then?
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Why? The Labour councillor was prosecuted, it was a jury of the public that acquitted him
Because that's how it will be and is being viewed by many. Thems the breaks
So presumably that means Farage and Cleverly will be calling for jury trials to be scrapped and Crown court verdicts left to judges then?
Maybe judges aren't so bad after all?
You'll have to ask Farage and Cleverley what they'll be calling for
Calverton is a very good school but instead of 420 pupils on roll, it's going to start the new year with 229 and as funding is related to numbers on roll, the school is going to take a big financial hit.
IF we are seeing declining birth rates and these are not being balanced (as they were before) by children of immigrants, we are going to see more schools merging and closing and that is going to have significant impacts on local economies and other areas.
Partly lack of children, partly unaffordability of London. It's been an issue on Hackney for a couple of years now, presumably this is just the same effect rippling out.
Since I mostly do post-16 these days, I'm half hoping it will won't wash over me until I can plausibly retire. (Who am I kidding? I teach physics. They will be dragging me in to do lessons when I'm 1.83 metres under.)
Q1. Calculate the half life of a Stuartinromford. (Or is that chemistry?)
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
WRT keeping silent if accused, it’s the best approach if you’re guilty. Competent barristers are very good at detecting liars, and tearing them apart in the witness box.
If you’re innocent, be as upfront and helpful as possible.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
Good evening
No matter the rights and wrongs of this case it just adds to the 2 tier narrative and plays into Farage's hands whether we like it or not
Though that was a jury doing what they presumably though was right, without fear or favour. Whereas this (from the Conservatives) just looks stark, raving, tonto from a "playing into Farage's hands" point of view.
REVEALED: The huge list of freebies and perks channel migrants are entitled to once they land in Britain.
Meanwhile, Rachel Reeves is taxing you for every last penny.
The Conservatives are the only Party with a plan to stop this madness.
This is just politics and they know that they need to be hard on asylum seekers
Indeed the fact it is obviously upsetting labour supporters is probably a positive
Without belabouring (sorry) the point - how many of these "freebies and perks" were available to illegal migrants arriving in March or April 2024? All of them, I suspect and how many of them did the previous Government seek to curtail or remove? None of them I suspect.
The stench of hypocrisy from Conservatives on this is almost unendurable.
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
You misconstrue
I despise the British state and almost every representation of it. I want a revolution (peaceful) where almost everyone in power is driven into exile or maybe put in jail for a long long time
Would I fight for Britain in a war? I’m no longer sure at all
That’s very different from whether it is a pleasant place to live. Lots of despicable countries can be nice places to live
I think you get this sort of sentiment expressed every generation. Sometimes from the right, sometimes from the left.
Given the carnival of grotesques we see most places overseas I'm fairly grateful for what we have in the UK even if Starmer is a bit on the grey side.
BTW, looking forward to @leon taking Sir Keir on in Holborn & St Pancras next time. Would surely be the most memorable context since Auberon Waugh (Dog Lovers' Party) contested Jeremy Thorpe's seat in 1979. Campaign diary in the Speccy?
Calverton is a very good school but instead of 420 pupils on roll, it's going to start the new year with 229 and as funding is related to numbers on roll, the school is going to take a big financial hit.
IF we are seeing declining birth rates and these are not being balanced (as they were before) by children of immigrants, we are going to see more schools merging and closing and that is going to have significant impacts on local economies and other areas.
Partly lack of children, partly unaffordability of London. It's been an issue on Hackney for a couple of years now, presumably this is just the same effect rippling out.
Since I mostly do post-16 these days, I'm half hoping it will won't wash over me until I can plausibly retire. (Who am I kidding? I teach physics. They will be dragging me in to do lessons when I'm 1.83 metres under.)
Q1. Calculate the half life of a Stuartinromfor. (Or is that chemistry?)
My sibling is due to get hit by this outside London, free school opened up down the road rather than where it was needed on the other side of the town, so with falling rolls the school where they work is likely to close, as a classroom teacher at top of the scale, rather than an NQT, job prospects are grim.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Seems to me that the perception of 'two-tier' comes about through the vastly different results for someone who's savvy and has a lawyer compared to those for someone who isn't savvy and doesn't have immediate access to a lawyer.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Seems to me that the perception of 'two-tier' comes about through the vastly different results for someone who's savvy and has a lawyer compared to those for someone who isn't savvy and doesn't have immediate access to a lawyer.
Pretty much yes, with the side order of one being a Labour councillor and other other being the wife of a Tory councillor.
The political narrative is very different from the legal narrative. The “two tier” political narrative was very much already up and running, and this case just adds fuel to the fire.
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
And to Hitler, Poles were nothing.
They were an Oder race to him.
He was Danzig in the streets when he was elected.
But he left Germany with one hell of a Hanover Gdańsk to his behaviour.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
I've lived in Switzerland, Austria and Denmark for periods long enough to feel fairly rootless - on the whole I like Switzerland and Denmark most, because of their majority of people keen to make society work, in a way that one doesn't see frequently in the UK (or Austria). But so many other things decide where one lives, and I'm happy living in the UK, and puzzled by people who feel vehemently against it.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
No, it was probably the fact the jury was from overwhelmingly Labour Walthamstow. Had the jury been from say heavily Reform Basildon the verdict may have been different.
Judges in criminal trials normally sentence on the law and guidelines whatever their political views
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
You bring Hitler into the conversation and then add ' Polls are not everything'
Your whole existence on here is based on polls meaning everything
You can be very strange at times but then that not unique in life
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Seems to me that the perception of 'two-tier' comes about through the vastly different results for someone who's savvy and has a lawyer compared to those for someone who isn't savvy and doesn't have immediate access to a lawyer.
Every police station has a duty solicitor if you want one
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
You bring Hitler into the conversation and then add ' Polls are not everything'
Your whole existence on here is based on polls meaning everything
You can be very strange at times but then that not unique in life
No, otherwise I would back government by referendum not representative MPs
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
I've lived in Switzerland, Austria and Denmark for periods long enough to feel fairly rootless - on the whole I like Switzerland and Denmark most, because of their majority of people keen to make society work, in a way that one doesn't see frequently in the UK (or Austria). But so many other things decide where one lives, and I'm happy living in the UK, and puzzled by people who feel vehemently against it.
Again, for the hard of thinking, I despise the British STATE, and virtually all its workings and doings, its corrupted judiciary and its diseased government, all of that
I still like pubs, I still (generally) like and even love London, I have a very nice life, I haven't suddenly developed a hatred of oak trees, the Yorkshire dales, proper pies, Test cricket, the works of John Constable, views of the Inner Hebrides, Kilpeck church or Georgian architecture. I despise the state, I want it overturned, and I want peaceful but serious revenge
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Seems to me that the perception of 'two-tier' comes about through the vastly different results for someone who's savvy and has a lawyer compared to those for someone who isn't savvy and doesn't have immediate access to a lawyer.
Has there been any time in history that hasn't been true?
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
And to Hitler, Poles were nothing.
They were an Oder race to him.
He was Danzig in the streets when he was elected.
But he left Germany with one hell of a Hanover Gdańsk to his behaviour.
Re the trial of the Labour councillor acquitted of encouraging violent disorder at Snaresbrook Crown Court. Had be been tried by a jury at Basildon Crown Court I venture he may well have been found guilty.
That is one of the drawbacks of jury trial it can depend on where the jury is drawn from, especially if a political, racial or religious element. However to his credit Jacob Rees Mogg still accepts that as he believes in juries in principle even if he disagreed with verdicts like the slave owner statue damage acquittal in Bristol.
Shame Cleverly and Philp did not follow JRM but jumped on the populist bandwagon earlier before thinking through the logic of their comments ie that all trials should be judge only with no juries at Crown Court level.
Speaking of which JRM owns Cleverly and Philp.
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.' https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Has he spoken to his great friend Nigel Farage about his view ?
Perhaps he will educate Nigel on thinking a bit more before he speaks?
The only difference is Farage is leading the narrative and the polls and JRM is some rich entitled ex mp
So? Hitler was leading in polls in 1930s Germany, doesn't mean he was right! Polls are not everything
And to Hitler, Poles were nothing.
They were an Oder race to him.
He was Danzig in the streets when he was elected.
But he left Germany with one hell of a Hanover Gdańsk to his behaviour.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
It is better we have juries that sometimes make mistakes, than we don't have juries at all.
And sometimes juries aquit to prevent an injustice. I don't know this particular case, but it will be popcorn time when Palestine Action come before a jury.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Because they are cleverer and have a higher IQ than you. But then, so does everyone with a brain larger than an amoeba.
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Seems to me that the perception of 'two-tier' comes about through the vastly different results for someone who's savvy and has a lawyer compared to those for someone who isn't savvy and doesn't have immediate access to a lawyer.
Has there been any time in history that hasn't been true?
Presumably not; but this may be the time in history when the general expectation of 'fairness' is at its highest. Trouble is, life isn't fair.
It is better we have juries that sometimes make mistakes, than we don't have juries at all.
And sometimes juries aquit to prevent an injustice. I don't know this particular case, but it will be popcorn time when Palestine Action come before a jury.
How many of the hundreds arrested last weekend actually got charged with anything in the first place? Despite their clear support for a recently proscribed organisation.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Because they are cleverer and have a higher IQ than you. But then, so does everyone with a brain larger than an amoeba.
It's 10th April 1998 on BBC4's Top of the Pops re-runs.
1982 with John Peel later too.
Eighties indy music fans might like to catch the Stereo Underground show at 2230 on most weeknights on Rewind TV. Lots of great, and sometimes obscure Indy bands.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Yes, there is undisputed(*) evidence of what he said. It surely then becomes a case of whether what he said was against the law in the context. And IANAL (and neither are you...)
It sniffs like a wrong verdict to me, but it's hard to judge cases and jury verdicts without being in the courtroom.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
So you’re trashing the judge because because she committed the sin of doing some voluntary work to encourage under-represented groups to think of a judicial career . And that term which now seems to drive some people into having a meltdown “ diversity “.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
You misconstrue
I despise the British state and almost every representation of it. I want a revolution (peaceful) where almost everyone in power is driven into exile or maybe put in jail for a long long time
Would I fight for Britain in a war? I’m no longer sure at all
That’s very different from whether it is a pleasant place to live. Lots of despicable countries can be nice places to live
Because Britain - or England or Scotland if you prefer - is not 'The State'. Nor is it the Government or the poltical and chattering classes. It is a society, a history, a culture and a 'terroir' (to use the French wine making term) which is inculcated into our souls by years of exposure and familiarity.
Like you I would not fight for 'the state' nor for any of those who lead or control it. But I would fight for all those other things I listed and for the people that share them with me.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Yes, there is undisputed(*) evidence of what he said. It surely then becomes a case of whether what he said was against the law in the context. And IANAL (and neither are you...)
It sniffs like a wrong verdict to me, but it's hard to judge cases and jury verdicts without being in the courtroom.
(*) Did the defence actually dispute it?
Looks like Apple have released some special new kit. Competition for Leon’s analogue devices.
It is better we have juries that sometimes make mistakes, than we don't have juries at all.
And sometimes juries aquit to prevent an injustice. I don't know this particular case, but it will be popcorn time when Palestine Action come before a jury.
How many of the hundreds arrested last weekend actually got charged with anything in the first place?
Three so far, though many more could be charged later. If they are not charged then the government looks ridiculous, and if they are charged even more so. We have a couple of elderly terrorists in my church congregation now.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Because they are cleverer and have a higher IQ than you. But then, so does everyone with a brain larger than an amoeba.
It suggests they were all pretty sure about the verdict before deliberations tbh. I'm not sure it contributes to Leon's conspiracy theory at all.
What has been really fascinating is there has been a widespread but grudging defence of Palestine Action supporters on Facebook. I must admit that was a surprise - instead of piling in on the loony lefties, the boomers/bots see this as yet more evidence of the state's crackdown on free speech.
I wonder if that's what this jury consisted off. Free speech ultras + Antifa types.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
I've lived in Switzerland, Austria and Denmark for periods long enough to feel fairly rootless - on the whole I like Switzerland and Denmark most, because of their majority of people keen to make society work, in a way that one doesn't see frequently in the UK (or Austria). But so many other things decide where one lives, and I'm happy living in the UK, and puzzled by people who feel vehemently against it.
Again, for the hard of thinking, I despise the British STATE, and virtually all its workings and doings, its corrupted judiciary and its diseased government, all of that
I still like pubs, I still (generally) like and even love London, I have a very nice life, I haven't suddenly developed a hatred of oak trees, the Yorkshire dales, proper pies, Test cricket, the works of John Constable, views of the Inner Hebrides, Kilpeck church or Georgian architecture. I despise the state, I want it overturned, and I want peaceful but serious revenge
Surely an "ENOUGH" at the end would have improved this.
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
You misconstrue
I despise the British state and almost every representation of it. I want a revolution (peaceful) where almost everyone in power is driven into exile or maybe put in jail for a long long time
Would I fight for Britain in a war? I’m no longer sure at all
That’s very different from whether it is a pleasant place to live. Lots of despicable countries can be nice places to live
Because Britain - or England or Scotland if you prefer - is not 'The State'. Nor is it the Government or the poltical and chattering classes. It is a society, a history, a culture and a 'terroir' (to use the French wine making term) which is inculcated into our souls by years of exposure and familiarity.
Like you I would not fight for 'the state' nor for any of those who lead or control it. But I would fight for all those other things I listed and for the people that share them with me.
Clearly this is a hypothetical. I am a bit aged to be called up, but as a hypothetical it is interesting
As I said, I genuinely don't know if I would fight any more. To defend this rotten edifice of hypocrisy piled on venality, sired by stupidity? Hmmm
I guess it would depend on the enemy and their intentions. If it was Putin, yeah, I'd fight, if it was some militia of American free speechers, come to help the Brits overthrow the regime, I'd join the Americans
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
So you’re trashing the judge because because she committed the sin of doing some voluntary work to encourage under-represented groups to think of a judicial career . And that term which now seems to drive some people into having a meltdown “ diversity “.
Imagine the scenes here if the judge wasn't white. She does come from that woke hive of scum and villainy though - Brighton.
Sad to see our @leon on X joining in with complaints about justice.
Acquitted by a jury randomly selected has to be better than trial by social media mob.
But I have good news for fans of mobs. You see the wazzocks attacking scouts thinking they were asylum seekers because they had a funny accent (Scottish)? You see the wazzock posting on Facebook that the bus load of sea cadets getting off a bus outside their training centre were immigrants? And the people who ramped this wazzockry?
All are eligible for random selection to serve on a jury.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Because they are cleverer and have a higher IQ than you. But then, so does everyone with a brain larger than an amoeba.
It suggests they were all pretty sure about the verdict before deliberations tbh. I'm not sure it contributes to Leon's conspiracy theory at all.
What has been really fascinating is there has been a widespread but grudging defence of Palestine Action supporters on Facebook. I must admit that was a surprise - instead of piling in on the loony lefties, the boomers/bots see this as yet more evidence of the state's crackdown on free speech.
I wonder if that's what this jury consisted off. Free speech ultras + Antifa types.
I don't think you have to be a Free Speech Ultra or even a raving Corbynista to think that recent actions around Palestine Action have at been at best bloody stupid.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Because they are cleverer and have a higher IQ than you. But then, so does everyone with a brain larger than an amoeba.
It suggests they were all pretty sure about the verdict before deliberations tbh. I'm not sure it contributes to Leon's conspiracy theory at all.
What has been really fascinating is there has been a widespread but grudging defence of Palestine Action supporters on Facebook. I must admit that was a surprise - instead of piling in on the loony lefties, the boomers/bots see this as yet more evidence of the state's crackdown on free speech.
I wonder if that's what this jury consisted off. Free speech ultras + Antifa types.
That's the next step - the Mail will try to track down all the jurors and do a character assassination of any who aren't Reform or Conservative supporters and claim it's "in the public interest".
Sad to see our @leon on X joining in with complaints about justice.
Acquitted by a jury randomly selected has to be better than trial by social media mob.
But I have good news for fans of mobs. You see the wazzocks attacking scouts thinking they were asylum seekers because they had a funny accent (Scottish)? You see the wazzock posting on Facebook that the bus load of sea cadets getting off a bus outside their training centre were immigrants? And the people who ramped this wazzockry?
All are eligible for random selection to serve on a jury.
I posted a great bit of journalism from the P&J about that last night. I think something similar happened in Wales?
Trump can make life v uncomfortable for Starmer. I’d like to see the US impose a Lucy Connolly tariff.
Yes nothing screams "I love my country" more than seeking a foreign power to engage in a hostile act against it.
I don’t love this country any more
I despise what it has become
Don’t be negative, it’s crappy at the moment, compared to some countries I can’t think of, maybe Denmark but they have high taxes and their women sound like drains when they talk whilst looking attractive.
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
I've lived in Switzerland, Austria and Denmark for periods long enough to feel fairly rootless - on the whole I like Switzerland and Denmark most, because of their majority of people keen to make society work, in a way that one doesn't see frequently in the UK (or Austria). But so many other things decide where one lives, and I'm happy living in the UK, and puzzled by people who feel vehemently against it.
Again, for the hard of thinking, I despise the British STATE, and virtually all its workings and doings, its corrupted judiciary and its diseased government, all of that
I still like pubs, I still (generally) like and even love London, I have a very nice life, I haven't suddenly developed a hatred of oak trees, the Yorkshire dales, proper pies, Test cricket, the works of John Constable, views of the Inner Hebrides, Kilpeck church or Georgian architecture. I despise the state, I want it overturned, and I want peaceful but serious revenge
Surely an "ENOUGH" at the end would have improved this.
Sad to see our @leon on X joining in with complaints about justice.
Acquitted by a jury randomly selected has to be better than trial by social media mob.
But I have good news for fans of mobs. You see the wazzocks attacking scouts thinking they were asylum seekers because they had a funny accent (Scottish)? You see the wazzock posting on Facebook that the bus load of sea cadets getting off a bus outside their training centre were immigrants? And the people who ramped this wazzockry?
All are eligible for random selection to serve on a jury.
Do you understand how the jury could have reached the verdict it did?
Sad to see our @leon on X joining in with complaints about justice.
Acquitted by a jury randomly selected has to be better than trial by social media mob.
But I have good news for fans of mobs. You see the wazzocks attacking scouts thinking they were asylum seekers because they had a funny accent (Scottish)? You see the wazzock posting on Facebook that the bus load of sea cadets getting off a bus outside their training centre were immigrants? And the people who ramped this wazzockry?
All are eligible for random selection to serve on a jury.
I posted a great bit of journalism from the P&J about that last night. I think something similar happened in Wales?
Could be worse - we could elect as an MP some numbskull who sees men rowing in a dinghy off shore and assumes they are illegal migrants and incites people to follow the rowers along the beach (pitchforks optional).
Evening all. Reference the court case earlier, the jury have at least blessed the country with a new wave of loathing for Labour and Starmer. And they don't even have '14 years' to worm their way out of it.
Don't get that at all - it was a jury verdict.
People may be upset about that but I don't see why they should blame the Government. They might blame the prosecution lawyer for not building a strong enough case.
most of the bad feeling isn’t for the outcome of this particaular case, but that this case appears to have been settled quite differently to a number of similar cases seen elsewhere.
Seems to me that the perception of 'two-tier' comes about through the vastly different results for someone who's savvy and has a lawyer compared to those for someone who isn't savvy and doesn't have immediate access to a lawyer.
Yes. Although that's more than perception it's reality.
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
Only if the jury were as stupid as you are.
How do you think they reached a verdict of Not Guilty in THIRTY MINUTES, given the undisputed video evidence of him doing exactly and precisely what he was accused of doing?
Because they are cleverer and have a higher IQ than you. But then, so does everyone with a brain larger than an amoeba.
It suggests they were all pretty sure about the verdict before deliberations tbh. I'm not sure it contributes to Leon's conspiracy theory at all.
What has been really fascinating is there has been a widespread but grudging defence of Palestine Action supporters on Facebook. I must admit that was a surprise - instead of piling in on the loony lefties, the boomers/bots see this as yet more evidence of the state's crackdown on free speech.
I wonder if that's what this jury consisted off. Free speech ultras + Antifa types.
I don't think you have to be a Free Speech Ultra or even a raving Corbynista to think that recent actions around Palestine Action have at been at best bloody stupid.
I do think you have to be one to find this guy not guilty though (based on my very limited understanding of the case). Or at least someone who has had a rough time with the police or experienced racist abuse from EDL types.
It is better we have juries that sometimes make mistakes, than we don't have juries at all.
And sometimes juries aquit to prevent an injustice. I don't know this particular case, but it will be popcorn time when Palestine Action come before a jury.
How many of the hundreds arrested last weekend actually got charged with anything in the first place?
Three so far, though many more could be charged later. If they are not charged then the government looks ridiculous, and if they are charged even more so. We have a couple of elderly terrorists in my church congregation now.
What made them want to show support specifically for the proscribed terrorist group, rather than simply supporting international action in Palestine?
Comments
Shame her conviction probably precludes her from making a valid Esta application.
As for the "aftermath of Southport", I presume you're referring to Lucy Connolly and whatever the rights and many wrongs of that case, the truth is Ricky Jones was acquitted by a jury, not let off by a judge. I see some are arguing he was fortunate to be tried at Snaresbrook - I'm not sure of the inference of that, Snaresbrook tries a lot of cases.
Those who want to make a political point out of all this will and they'd have done the same if Jones had been found guilty.
https://www.opennewham.co.uk/news/problems-at-calverton-school
Calverton is a very good school but instead of 420 pupils on roll, it's going to start the new year with 229 and as funding is related to numbers on roll, the school is going to take a big financial hit.
IF we are seeing declining birth rates and these are not being balanced (as they were before) by children of immigrants, we are going to see more schools merging and closing and that is going to have significant impacts on local economies and other areas.
Indeed the fact it is obviously upsetting labour supporters is probably a positive
I despise what it has become
'This is self-evidently not an example of two-tier justice as this Councillor was cleared by a jury. Lucy Connolly offered a guilty plea so did not have a jury trial, although she probably could have done had she pleaded not guilty.'
https://x.com/Jacob_Rees_Mogg/status/1956379270445752482
Since I mostly do post-16 these days, I'm half hoping it will won't wash over me until I can plausibly retire.
(Who am I kidding? I teach physics. They will be dragging me in to do lessons when I'm 1.83 metres under.)
Thats the problem Labour have. People who just tune in to 'a thing happened and its the opposite of the other thing' and have heard 'two tier justice' bandied about will be irritated in the extreme, I doubt many will even clock the difference between jury and magistrate cases as this is. And its not really about the case itself, its about a perception and things that (rightly or wrongly) feed the perception are dangerous for the government.
Often its 'unfair' stuff that stitches you up for all the shit you got away with. Cakes etc
You despise what it “has become” because you were living in periods where it was the best place to be.
I love the country, I love what it was and what it could be. It’s not great at the moment and could go down several bad routes but I live in hope someone with a brain will find a way back.
I still have a hankering to live in the UK, I have my eyes on a specific house and do consider it, even if for tax reasons I’m limited in time I can spend there. It’s still a great place with a lot of fun people, we don’t take ourselves too seriously. A lot of great pubs and restaurants, great culture, great free museums.
It’s shitty if you don’t have much but where is good if you don’t?
I’ve only lived in Switzerland and France so they are my only good true comparisons and god they have their faults too, and they speak French just to make it worse.
It’s still on the whole, a good place to be.
That's Reform's key message. The Cons will get sued if they're not careful.
I despise the British state and almost every representation of it. I want a revolution (peaceful) where almost everyone in power is driven into exile or maybe put in jail for a long long time
Would I fight for Britain in a war? I’m no longer sure at all
That’s very different from whether it is a pleasant place to live. Lots of despicable countries can be nice places to live
Actual size
Maybe judges aren't so bad after all?
If you’re innocent, be as upfront and helpful as possible.
The stench of hypocrisy from Conservatives on this is almost unendurable.
https://x.com/chrismid/status/1956315636335833496
Given the carnival of grotesques we see most places overseas I'm fairly grateful for what we have in the UK even if Starmer is a bit on the grey side.
BTW, looking forward to @leon taking Sir Keir on in Holborn & St Pancras next time. Would surely be the most memorable context since Auberon Waugh (Dog Lovers' Party) contested Jeremy Thorpe's seat in 1979. Campaign diary in the Speccy?
"Her Honour Judge Dean is listed as a Diversity and Community Relations Judge (DCRJ), a role that involves promoting diversity and community engagement in the judicial system.
"HHJ Dean covers the area around Snaresbrook Crown Court. She has also supported diversity efforts, such as assisting with visits from Diversity and Community Relations Magistrates at Harrow Crown Court. Additionally, her participation in events like the London Law Collective, where she delivered a keynote speech, highlights her role in inspiring diversity in the legal profession.
"Diversity and Community Relations Judges across England and Wales undertake a huge amount of community engagement in a voluntary capacity. They also seek to encourage legal professionals from under-represented groups to consider a judicial career."
https://www.judiciary.uk/about-the-judiciary/who-are-the-judiciary/list-of-members-of-the-judiciary/diversity-and-community-relations-judges-list/
It was probably her wise and expert legal guidance in the field of diversity that allowed the jury to return a verdict of Not Guilty, despite overwhelming evidence of guilt, in just thirty minutes
The political narrative is very different from the legal narrative. The “two tier” political narrative was very much already up and running, and this case just adds fuel to the fire.
Judges in criminal trials normally sentence on the law and guidelines whatever their political views
It is better we have juries that sometimes make mistakes, than we don't have juries at all.
Your whole existence on here is based on polls meaning everything
You can be very strange at times but then that not unique in life
I still like pubs, I still (generally) like and even love London, I have a very nice life, I haven't suddenly developed a hatred of oak trees, the Yorkshire dales, proper pies, Test cricket, the works of John Constable, views of the Inner Hebrides, Kilpeck church or Georgian architecture. I despise the state, I want it overturned, and I want peaceful but serious revenge
Eighties indy music fans might like to catch the Stereo Underground show at 2230 on most weeknights on Rewind TV. Lots of great, and sometimes obscure Indy bands.
It sniffs like a wrong verdict to me, but it's hard to judge cases and jury verdicts without being in the courtroom.
(*) Did the defence actually dispute it?
Like you I would not fight for 'the state' nor for any of those who lead or control it. But I would fight for all those other things I listed and for the people that share them with me.
What has been really fascinating is there has been a widespread but grudging defence of Palestine Action supporters on Facebook. I must admit that was a surprise - instead of piling in on the loony lefties, the boomers/bots see this as yet more evidence of the state's crackdown on free speech.
I wonder if that's what this jury consisted off. Free speech ultras + Antifa types.
As I said, I genuinely don't know if I would fight any more. To defend this rotten edifice of hypocrisy piled on venality, sired by stupidity? Hmmm
I guess it would depend on the enemy and their intentions. If it was Putin, yeah, I'd fight, if it was some militia of American free speechers, come to help the Brits overthrow the regime, I'd join the Americans
Acquitted by a jury randomly selected has to be better than trial by social media mob.
But I have good news for fans of mobs. You see the wazzocks attacking scouts thinking they were asylum seekers because they had a funny accent (Scottish)? You see the wazzock posting on Facebook that the bus load of sea cadets getting off a bus outside their training centre were immigrants? And the people who ramped this wazzockry?
All are eligible for random selection to serve on a jury.
Which included 2 Nobel laureates - in the field of finance within which they were operating, no less.
They hit the wall harder than anyone else had managed, up to that point. An epic, epic fuck up.
https://x.com/thenewarea51/status/1956417771287253212