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Why Amanda Spielman Deserves her Peerage – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,399
edited April 5 in General
Why Amanda Spielman Deserves her Peerage – politicalbetting.com

The British constitution, much like a badly organised school sports day, has always valued tradition over efficiency. And among the most venerable traditions of our great nation is the appointment of people to the House of Lords not because they have led with honour, wisdom, or humility—but because, well, someone has to keep the red benches warm.

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,114
    First!
  • kle4kle4 Posts: 98,367
    Sadly my standard Lords reform proposal to prevent ex-MPs and any political donors from getting peerages would not prevent the friends of the 'right' people such as Spielman from getting in.

    And whether failure is rewarded with ermine or not, it does seem the case that failure is rewarded in general. Hold a prominent position and even if you are a complete duffer you will get another great post because, well, you held the last one. So just get your foot in the door and all will be well. Like total business failures and fraudsters who inexplicably still manage to become super wealthy after being exposed because somehow losingmillions or even billions still imbues you with the aura of success. Jordan Belfort is still very very wealthy for example.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,217
    3rd.

    Ruefully nodding along as I read the header.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 54,561
    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,114

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    Translation: "I've tied my wagon to this horse, and it's time to pray."
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,217
    rcs1000 said:

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    Translation: "I've tied my wagon to this horse, and it's time to pray."
    Translation: Bessent has since found out that the Fed is to lose independence on Monday and even if he jumped ship he'd still be working for Trump directly.
  • rottenboroughrottenborough Posts: 65,217
    I thought Rubio would be first out of the door.
  • vikvik Posts: 196
    edited April 6

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    I trust the "inside sources" more than the "senior official" trying to do damage control.

    The fact that they feel that they need to do damage control means that the rumours about Bessent's exit are real.
  • viewcodeviewcode Posts: 23,996
    Oh, that's cynical... :)
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 29,882
    Strangely on topic, Spectator TV has just put up this 10-minute video:-

    'No one is fired for failure' – the dysfunction at the heart of Whitehall | Dominic Cummings
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QmPV8yd3iQ
  • rcs1000rcs1000 Posts: 59,114

    Strangely on topic, Spectator TV has just put up this 10-minute video:-

    'No one is fired for failure' – the dysfunction at the heart of Whitehall | Dominic Cummings
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QmPV8yd3iQ

    Demonic Cummings also deserves a peerage.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,113
    AnneJGP said:

    ... the House of Lords, throughout the war, did nothing in particular and did it very well ... (WS Gilbert)

    Insomniac says good morning.

    It was a more competent institution in those days, then ?
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,113
    vik said:

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    I trust the "inside sources" more than the "senior official" trying to do damage control.

    The fact that they feel that they need to do damage control means that the rumours about Bessent's exit are real.
    How long will it be before the tariffs are walked back ?
    No one voted to be poorer - or rather, a lot of Americans did, back in November, but precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,113
    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,460
    rcs1000 said:

    First!

    Inside job.
  • TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 121,460
    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    ‘Never trust anybody who spells gonorrhoea correctly on the first attempt’ is a maxim that has served me well in life, I am updating that maxim to ‘never trust anybody who believes in the economic policies of Liz Truss.’ I am convinced an overwhelming number of Tory MPs agree with my updated maxim.

    https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2022/10/09/grant-shapps-as-our-next-prime-minister/
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,304

    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c8rg5lp7m8no
    The BBC has a handy table listing all countries by share of US imports with the % tariffs each faces. Several countries have an asterisk, when you scroll down you find:

    *Tariffs given for these countries are those on the White House website and are 1% higher than those given by the White House on X.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 76,113

    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    ‘Never trust anybody who spells gonorrhoea correctly on the first attempt’ is a maxim that has served me well in life, I am updating that maxim to ‘never trust anybody who believes in the economic policies of Liz Truss.’ I am convinced an overwhelming number of Tory MPs agree with my updated maxim.

    https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2022/10/09/grant-shapps-as-our-next-prime-minister/
    With autocorrect, you really have to go with the Truss test.
    Though Trump might now have eclipsed her.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605
    Well done, Robert. Got my day off to an excellent start.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605
    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605
    kle4 said:

    Sadly my standard Lords reform proposal to prevent ex-MPs and any political donors from getting peerages would not prevent the friends of the 'right' people such as Spielman from getting in.

    And whether failure is rewarded with ermine or not, it does seem the case that failure is rewarded in general. Hold a prominent position and even if you are a complete duffer you will get another great post because, well, you held the last one. So just get your foot in the door and all will be well. Like total business failures and fraudsters who inexplicably still manage to become super wealthy after being exposed because somehow losingmillions or even billions still imbues you with the aura of success. Jordan Belfort is still very very wealthy for example.

    You define a Chumocracy very well, Kle.

    We were of course saddled with one for the better part of thirteen years, which is why it will take me a while to grow sick of this one, whatever its shortcomings.

    I'll let you know when the memory fades sufficiently for me to forgive the Tory Party for what it did to this country.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,864
    edited April 6
    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    Somehow the second season of The President Trump Show is already boring. Every day new ridiculous plot lines. Unbelievably stupid cartoon villains. Terrible make-up. Nobody can watch 4 years of this drivel.

    Where are the classic moments? Season 1 had the mystery of Covfefe (still unsolved), the comedy gold of Four Seasons Total Landscaping.
    Yeah, the Trump Show has jumped the shark.

    Next there will be the introduction of an annoying younger relative as a sidekick.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,133
    Foxy said:

    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    Somehow the second season of The President Trump Show is already boring. Every day new ridiculous plot lines. Unbelievably stupid cartoon villains. Terrible make-up. Nobody can watch 4 years of this drivel.

    Where are the classic moments? Season 1 had the mystery of Covfefe (still unsolved), the comedy gold of Four Seasons Total Landscaping.
    Yeah, the Trump Show has jumped the shark.

    Next there will be the introduction of an annoying younger relative as a sidekick.
    He's already got JD Vance.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 29,882
    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    Somehow the second season of The President Trump Show is already boring. Every day new ridiculous plot lines. Unbelievably stupid cartoon villains. Terrible make-up. Nobody can watch 4 years of this drivel.

    Where are the classic moments? Season 1 had the mystery of Covfefe (still unsolved), the comedy gold of Four Seasons Total Landscaping.
    Even as we speak (well, almost) the Liv Miami Golf tournament is taking place at one of Donald Trump's golf courses, so something might emerge from that.
  • EabhalEabhal Posts: 10,009
    Good morning from a chilly tent. Deep frost overnight, yet an extreme risk of wildfire.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 29,882
    SEA SPIES Putin ‘plants secret undersea sensors in UK waters to spy on Britain’s nuclear submarines by using oligarch superyachts’
    The tyrant's fleets are understood to have been active around the UK for months now

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/34305800/putin-secret-undersea-sensors-uk-spy-nuclear-subs/
  • kjhkjh Posts: 12,405
    I see that if you send $1000 to Trump's spiritual advisor, Paula White, God will assign you a guardian angel. Oh and you will get a crystal glass cross as well.

    Nothing corrupt going on here.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,304
    Foxy said:

    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    Somehow the second season of The President Trump Show is already boring. Every day new ridiculous plot lines. Unbelievably stupid cartoon villains. Terrible make-up. Nobody can watch 4 years of this drivel.

    Where are the classic moments? Season 1 had the mystery of Covfefe (still unsolved), the comedy gold of Four Seasons Total Landscaping.
    Yeah, the Trump Show has jumped the shark.

    Next there will be the introduction of an annoying younger relative as a sidekick.
    Barron "Scrappy Doo" Trump?
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,343
    edited April 6
    This is an unusually articulate header by @rcs1000

    It has a certain prose-style, that I recognise. Almost as if he got serious assistance in the writing from somewhere else. Indeed I am sure he did
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,281
    kjh said:

    I see that if you send $1000 to Trump's spiritual advisor, Paula White, God will assign you a guardian angel. Oh and you will get a crystal glass cross as well.

    Nothing corrupt going on here.

    My own phalanx of robo-angels are ten times more effective.

    And can be yours for only $499.
  • noneoftheabovenoneoftheabove Posts: 24,099

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
  • kamskikamski Posts: 6,304
    Leon said:

    This is an unusually articulate header by @rcs1000

    It has a certain prose-style, that I recognise. Almost as if he got serious assistance in the writing from somewhere else. Indeed I am sure he did

    I don't know, it seems to be a more polished version of his below-the-line style.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,343
    edited April 6
    kamski said:

    Leon said:

    This is an unusually articulate header by @rcs1000

    It has a certain prose-style, that I recognise. Almost as if he got serious assistance in the writing from somewhere else. Indeed I am sure he did

    I don't know, it seems to be a more polished version of his below-the-line style.
    I’m 100% sure. There are certain giveaways

    However he’s the mod so he can do what he likes! And good luck to him

    And BTW a very good morning to everyone from a sunny Almaty, Kazakhstan. The Tien Shan mountains look magnificent, huge snowy peaks looming over the city

    Almost surreal. Definitely beautiful
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,216
    Looked at another way...

    Head of Ofsted isn't a job where a peerage is the standard retirement gift. So it's not that.

    And, desperate as the Conservatives are for supporters, there are less implausible candidates for elevation as party hacks available.

    So: is this yet another ruse by Gove to bring down the British Establishment by highlighting its absurdity? And is Kemi B in in the stunt?

    Britain would have been a much simpler place had his Channel 4 series turned into his lifetime vocation.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,133
    Leon said:

    kamski said:

    Leon said:

    This is an unusually articulate header by @rcs1000

    It has a certain prose-style, that I recognise. Almost as if he got serious assistance in the writing from somewhere else. Indeed I am sure he did

    I don't know, it seems to be a more polished version of his below-the-line style.
    I’m 100% sure.
    Really? You're 100% sure of something?

    I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you.

    Hope you enjoy your trip to Kazakhstan.
  • CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,608
    edited April 6
    Leon said:

    This is an unusually articulate header by @rcs1000

    It has a certain prose-style, that I recognise. Almost as if he got serious assistance in the writing from somewhere else. Indeed I am sure he did

    The content and style has quite the echo of this - https://www1.politicalbetting.com/index.php/archives/2024/11/11/a-british-tradition/.

    Note the opening and closing sentences. Good to see that I am not the only world weary cynic around here.
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 73,133
    edited April 6

    Looked at another way...

    Head of Ofsted isn't a job where a peerage is the standard retirement gift. So it's not that.

    And, desperate as the Conservatives are for supporters, there are less implausible candidates for elevation as party hacks available.

    So: is this yet another ruse by Gove to bring down the British Establishment by highlighting its absurdity? And is Kemi B in in the stunt?

    Britain would have been a much simpler place had his Channel 4 series turned into his lifetime vocation.

    It is ironic to reflect that the only other Head of OFSTED to get a peerage was Stewart Sutherland (1992-1994) the very first one - who was also the only other one never to have worked as a teacher.

    He was however a very distinguished academic and had a long track record of successful work in HE.
  • Sean_FSean_F Posts: 38,385

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,295
    Foxy said:

    kamski said:

    Nigelb said:

    Making Gonorrhoea Untreatable Again ?

    https://x.com/HelenBranswell/status/1908612942968352997
    Hard to make sense of a lot of the cuts that are happening at #HHS & its agencies. But closing #CDC's STD laboratory at a time when #gonorrhea seems poised to develop resistance to the last reliable drug that can cure it has experts aghast and worried.

    Somehow the second season of The President Trump Show is already boring. Every day new ridiculous plot lines. Unbelievably stupid cartoon villains. Terrible make-up. Nobody can watch 4 years of this drivel.

    Where are the classic moments? Season 1 had the mystery of Covfefe (still unsolved), the comedy gold of Four Seasons Total Landscaping.
    Yeah, the Trump Show has jumped the shark.

    Next there will be the introduction of an annoying younger relative as a sidekick.
    He's on it.

    The first is Kimberly Guilfoyle, who may or may not still be Don Jr.’s fiancé, who was tapped to serve as ambassador to Greece. The president-elect has also nominated Charles Kusher, the father of Jared Kushner, as U.S. ambassador to France. Billionaire Massad Boulos, the father-in-law of Tiffany Trump, was appointed a senior adviser on Arab and Middle Eastern affairs.
    https://archive.is/20241223160142/https://www.rollingstone.com/politics/politics-news/trump-appointments-family-tv-hosts-billionaires-1235212536/#selection-1629.100-1645.105

    Not one I've tracked in detail, though.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 62,400
    Good morning, everyone.

    F1: next podcast will contain a section explaining why the race was so boring... On the plus side, I didn't have a bundle of highlights to try and remember.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,216

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    Was it that that slice of the Brexit/Trump vote didn't care about getting poorer, or that they didn't believe it was possible? In which case, they were sadly mistaken.

    In the case of Brexit, there were a lot of supporters who were so comfortable (retired homeowners) that they could afford to send a cultural message. But they needed the downtrodden and desperate slice of the electorate to get to 52%.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605
    Sean_F said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
    I get it, Sean.

    I have a friend in Florida who is a Trump supporter, as is his wife. They hate 'students and liberals'. They are comfortable and secure, and can afford to indulge their prejudices.
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    That doesn't read like a disagreement so much as a qualification, which i would agree with.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,829

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    More they don't think their choices and actions have consequences. Mostly they still think that The most striking thing about MAGA to me, beyond its nastiness, is the self indulgence of everyone concerned.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,281

    Sean_F said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
    I get it, Sean.

    I have a friend in Florida who is a Trump supporter, as is his wife. They hate 'students and liberals'. They are comfortable and secure, and can afford to indulge their prejudices.
    They are likely to come out of the Trump Experiment still prejudiced, but bitter - and poorer.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,147
    edited April 6
    Israel really seems to have gone a bit mental. Presumably these are two Labour MPs who are not Labour Friends of Israel and therefore have not accepted the Israeli dollar (shekel).
    I’m sure Bibi is quaking in his boots after facing the watery wrath of David Lammy.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9133z2v30o
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605

    Sean_F said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
    I get it, Sean.

    I have a friend in Florida who is a Trump supporter, as is his wife. They hate 'students and liberals'. They are comfortable and secure, and can afford to indulge their prejudices.
    They are likely to come out of the Trump Experiment still prejudiced, but bitter - and poorer.
    Oh, when it all goes nipples up, it will not be his fault.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,864
    edited April 6
    The header is a bit over generalised. Yes, there are a number of people in the Lords who should not be there. There are too many. The channels for appointment are too constricted.

    OTOH it has never been a rational institution, as organic developments of a Burkean nature, continuing for (+ or - depending how you count it) 800 years or so won't be.

    Compare this non elected ancient institution with the way in which, at this very moment, the non elected Trump appointments are getting on in the USA.

    The HoL ameliorates arbitrary elected power, and does so without putting Wisconsin cheese on its head and waving a chainsaw. Its religious members are neither murderous sociopaths nor snake oil salesmen.

    Over the years I have known several members, varying from very old money to new Labour. All are decent, kind, thoughtful, loyal and moderate. On balance I would give them more powers than they have, but not much more.
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,281

    Sean_F said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
    I get it, Sean.

    I have a friend in Florida who is a Trump supporter, as is his wife. They hate 'students and liberals'. They are comfortable and secure, and can afford to indulge their prejudices.
    They are likely to come out of the Trump Experiment still prejudiced, but bitter - and poorer.
    Oh, when it all goes nipples up, it will not be his fault.
    They'll have to chalk it up as another win for Soros...
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,216
    FF43 said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    More they don't think their choices and actions have consequences. Mostly they still think that The most striking thing about MAGA to me, beyond its nastiness, is the self indulgence of everyone concerned.
    One of the neat bits of distraction Farage has pulled throughout his career. We all direct our attention on the dispossessed slice of his support, but that's just the icing on the cake. His core vote is extremely comfortable.
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,328
    Nice to read something so eloquenly written. A perfect read for a sunny Sunday morning
  • eekeek Posts: 29,588

    Sean_F said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
    I get it, Sean.

    I have a friend in Florida who is a Trump supporter, as is his wife. They hate 'students and liberals'. They are comfortable and secure, and can afford to indulge their prejudices.
    They are likely to come out of the Trump Experiment still prejudiced, but bitter - and poorer.
    Oh, when it all goes nipples up, it will not be his fault.
    They'll have to chalk it up as another win for Soros...
    I thought Soros was the cause of all Global market crashes?
  • scampi25scampi25 Posts: 81
    I think yesterday's news about Norris, and earlier the snouts in trough for freebies are gifts to Reform as they seem to confirm that the political classes in the UK are totally and irremediably corrupt . This may be unfair but it's easy to see why many feel this way.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,728
    It's feeling a bit like post-2016 Alasatir Meeks this morning on here with his regular articles entitled - and I paraphrase only slightly - 'leavers are dreadful oiks, barely human, and I simply loathe them'.
  • Daveyboy1961Daveyboy1961 Posts: 4,451
    Cookie said:

    It's feeling a bit like post-2016 Alasatir Meeks this morning on here with his regular articles entitled - and I paraphrase only slightly - 'leavers are dreadful oiks, barely human, and I simply loathe them'.

    And?...
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,790
    Morning all.

    I was at a gig last night expecting an evening of culture and entertainment but it all turned a bit political

    The first band played a song dedicated to "keeping Reform out at the local elections"

    This was followed by the next act singing her pandemic anthem "Fuck the Tories"

    The headliners shied away from any contemporary political commentary relying instead on their back catalogue, when Thatcher was in power and Edinburgh was the AIDS capital of Europe
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,790
    Mark Carney compares Trumpski torching the US economy to Brexit

    https://x.com/liberal_party/status/1908643764304044132
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,728
    edited April 6
    deleted
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,295

    SEA SPIES Putin ‘plants secret undersea sensors in UK waters to spy on Britain’s nuclear submarines by using oligarch superyachts’
    The tyrant's fleets are understood to have been active around the UK for months now

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/34305800/putin-secret-undersea-sensors-uk-spy-nuclear-subs/

    I'd call that a bit of a nothingburger. Sun Newspaper suddenly discovers something that everyone else new already!

    I enjoyed:
    "special attachments allowing them to rest at the bottom of the sea"

    ie feet.

    The Times piece it is borrowed from has a touch more.

    It will be interesting to see what HI Sutton says, if anything.
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 3,328
    Scott_xP said:

    Morning all.

    I was at a gig last night expecting an evening of culture and entertainment but it all turned a bit political

    The first band played a song dedicated to "keeping Reform out at the local elections"

    This was followed by the next act singing her pandemic anthem "Fuck the Tories"

    The headliners shied away from any contemporary political commentary relying instead on their back catalogue, when Thatcher was in power and Edinburgh was the AIDS capital of Europe

    Did you pay to attend, or did they pay you?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 29,882
    Sean_F said:

    algarkirk said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    Was it that that slice of the Brexit/Trump vote didn't care about getting poorer, or that they didn't believe it was possible? In which case, they were sadly mistaken.

    In the case of Brexit, there were a lot of supporters who were so comfortable (retired homeowners) that they could afford to send a cultural message. But they needed the downtrodden and desperate slice of the electorate to get to 52%.
    This oversimplifies a complex situation. The impossible aspect of the 2016 referendum was that the EU was too many things. It was both a very excellent trade and customs association but also an ever closer political union.

    IMHO most people wanted the first, and most people didn't want the second. And this I suggest is true of loads of people on both sides who felt they had to pretend otherwise.

    Only Brexit, followed by a Swiss/Norway type deal offered a reasonable balance between the two. This is still the case and should be pursued expeditiously.
    This applies across the board.

    It's why the weakest argument against any independence movement is "you'll be worse off economically", because economics is not what drives arguments in favour of independence.

    At it's most extreme, take someone like Ona Judge, who was a household slave who escaped George Washington's family, to live poor, but free. To a modern economist, that was an irrational choice, as she would have been better off, in material terms, as a slave to the Washingtons than as a free black woman (and that was a point she conceded in interviews).

    It's simply that material comfort is not the only thing that matters to people - of all political persuasions.

    A more extreme and common version is how "liberators" of countries are revered even after their disastrous peacetime leadership has cost prosperity and even millions of lives. Mao in China, Mugabe in Zimbabwe, Stalin (and even now, Putin) in Russia, to name but three or four.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964
    edited April 6
    Good morning

    Glorious morning here in Llandudno and far too lovely to be disturbed by the idiotic antics of Trump

    Our son and daughter in law with their 3 children, 13, 11 and 3, are off to Cwm Idwal walk with only mobile use in an emergency

    https://eryri.gov.wales/walk/cwm-idwal/
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605

    Sean_F said:

    algarkirk said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    Was it that that slice of the Brexit/Trump vote didn't care about getting poorer, or that they didn't believe it was possible? In which case, they were sadly mistaken.

    In the case of Brexit, there were a lot of supporters who were so comfortable (retired homeowners) that they could afford to send a cultural message. But they needed the downtrodden and desperate slice of the electorate to get to 52%.
    This oversimplifies a complex situation. The impossible aspect of the 2016 referendum was that the EU was too many things. It was both a very excellent trade and customs association but also an ever closer political union.

    IMHO most people wanted the first, and most people didn't want the second. And this I suggest is true of loads of people on both sides who felt they had to pretend otherwise.

    Only Brexit, followed by a Swiss/Norway type deal offered a reasonable balance between the two. This is still the case and should be pursued expeditiously.
    This applies across the board.

    It's why the weakest argument against any independence movement is "you'll be worse off economically", because economics is not what drives arguments in favour of independence.

    At it's most extreme, take someone like Ona Judge, who was a household slave who escaped George Washington's family, to live poor, but free. To a modern economist, that was an irrational choice, as she would have been better off, in material terms, as a slave to the Washingtons than as a free black woman (and that was a point she conceded in interviews).

    It's simply that material comfort is not the only thing that matters to people - of all political persuasions.

    A more extreme and common version is how "liberators" of countries are revered even after their disastrous peacetime leadership has cost prosperity and even millions of lives. Mao in China, Mugabe in Zimbabwe, Stalin (and even now, Putin) in Russia, to name but three or four.
    The Republic of Ireland presents a happier example. In the debates about the merits of Independence many Irishmen argued that the country would be economically worse off, and this proved to be true for the best part of a century.

    Things changed of course when it joined the EU, but that's another story, and another argument.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964
    Scott_xP said:

    Mark Carney compares Trumpski torching the US economy to Brexit

    https://x.com/liberal_party/status/1908643764304044132

    The least surprising comment in all this chaos

    In the meantime Starmer is taking the benefit of Brexit by prioritising trade deals with the US, India and Australia
  • RogerRoger Posts: 20,328

    Israel really seems to have gone a bit mental. Presumably these are two Labour MPs who are not Labour Friends of Israel and therefore have not accepted the Israeli dollar (shekel).
    I’m sure Bibi is quaking in his boots after facing the watery wrath of David Lammy.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9133z2v30o

    Lammy has turned out to be a Jobsworth. Emily Thornberry would have been a much better choice
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964
    Roger said:

    Israel really seems to have gone a bit mental. Presumably these are two Labour MPs who are not Labour Friends of Israel and therefore have not accepted the Israeli dollar (shekel).
    I’m sure Bibi is quaking in his boots after facing the watery wrath of David Lammy.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9133z2v30o

    Lammy has turned out to be a Jobsworth. Emily Thornberry would have been a much better choice
    Actually I agree with you
  • Peter_the_PunterPeter_the_Punter Posts: 14,605
    algarkirk said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    Was it that that slice of the Brexit/Trump vote didn't care about getting poorer, or that they didn't believe it was possible? In which case, they were sadly mistaken.

    In the case of Brexit, there were a lot of supporters who were so comfortable (retired homeowners) that they could afford to send a cultural message. But they needed the downtrodden and desperate slice of the electorate to get to 52%.
    This oversimplifies a complex situation. The impossible aspect of the 2016 referendum was that the EU was too many things. It was both a very excellent trade and customs association but also an ever closer political union.

    IMHO most people wanted the first, and most people didn't want the second. And this I suggest is true of loads of people on both sides who felt they had to pretend otherwise.

    Only Brexit, followed by a Swiss/Norway type deal offered a reasonable balance between the two. This is still the case and should be pursued expeditiously.
    Yes, that's substantially correct, and for the avoidance of doubt I should restate that as well as favoring the trade associations I also favored closer political Union. I did however regret that the Remain side was not more forthcoming and open about this.
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964
    Anyway EDF have awarded us with free electricity from 8.00am to noon today so the washing machine, dishwasher and dryer are working overtime !!!!!
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,281
    eek said:

    Sean_F said:

    @Nigelb

    '... Precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.'

    True of Trump, and before we get too sniffy, equally true of Brexit.

    I suspect it may well prove true again in respect of Reform, but we'll see,

    Disagree with this.

    Plenty of Trump and Brexit supporters voted at least not caring if they would be poorer as long as it sent a message to the libs, not just a precious few.

    What would be true is enough Trump and Brexit voters would have switched had they known they would be poorer to ensure that neither could have succeeded electorally.
    It’s safe to say that maximisation of income is only one of quite a lot of factors, which drive how people vote, which leaders they support, which revolutions succeed.

    Many economists don’t get that.
    I get it, Sean.

    I have a friend in Florida who is a Trump supporter, as is his wife. They hate 'students and liberals'. They are comfortable and secure, and can afford to indulge their prejudices.
    They are likely to come out of the Trump Experiment still prejudiced, but bitter - and poorer.
    Oh, when it all goes nipples up, it will not be his fault.
    They'll have to chalk it up as another win for Soros...
    I thought Soros was the cause of all Global market crashes?
    Whilst making untold billions in the process to pay Lib protestors to drown out patriotic MAGA Congressmen at town hall events.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,992
    edited April 6

    Scott_xP said:

    Mark Carney compares Trumpski torching the US economy to Brexit

    https://x.com/liberal_party/status/1908643764304044132

    The least surprising comment in all this chaos

    In the meantime Starmer is taking the benefit of Brexit by prioritising trade deals with the US, India and Australia
    How is Starmer's post Brexit "deal" with the US going? Ten percent on all imports from the UK compared to zip in the other direction.

    The art of the deal.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 13,864
    Roger said:

    Israel really seems to have gone a bit mental. Presumably these are two Labour MPs who are not Labour Friends of Israel and therefore have not accepted the Israeli dollar (shekel).
    I’m sure Bibi is quaking in his boots after facing the watery wrath of David Lammy.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9133z2v30o

    Lammy has turned out to be a Jobsworth. Emily Thornberry would have been a much better choice
    Agree about Thornberry. She has been conspicuously both loyal to the government that overlooked her and a sane spokesperson on the media about foreign matters especially. Time her St George flag error was put into the past.
  • TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 43,147
    Cookie said:

    It's feeling a bit like post-2016 Alasatir Meeks this morning on here with his regular articles entitled - and I paraphrase only slightly - 'leavers are dreadful oiks, barely human, and I simply loathe them'.

    Quite a lotta paraphrasing going on I’d say.
    Plenty of, er, strong opinion presented as objective analysis of course, such as those PBers (and I paraphrase not at all) who regard supporters of Scottish Indy as deluded, anti-English, blood & soil nationalists.
    I am objective, you are subjective, they are mad (to paraphrase).
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964
    Trevor Philips on Sky just now

    Darren Jones openly admits to him that the tariffs at 10% ARE a Brexit dividend
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964

    Scott_xP said:

    Mark Carney compares Trumpski torching the US economy to Brexit

    https://x.com/liberal_party/status/1908643764304044132

    The least surprising comment in all this chaos

    In the meantime Starmer is taking the benefit of Brexit by prioritising trade deals with the US, India and Australia
    How is Starmer's post Brexit "deal" with the US going? Ten percent on all imports from the UK compared to zip in the other direction.

    The art of the deal.
    Well it seems Darren Jones on Sky confirms it is a Brexit divided

    And you do not mention the 20% on the EU
  • MattWMattW Posts: 26,295
    Nigelb said:

    vik said:

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    I trust the "inside sources" more than the "senior official" trying to do damage control.

    The fact that they feel that they need to do damage control means that the rumours about Bessent's exit are real.
    How long will it be before the tariffs are walked back ?
    No one voted to be poorer - or rather, a lot of Americans did, back in November, but precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.
    I'm not sure. He's as bull-headed as he is foolish.

    When Mr Chump did it first time around - in I think 2018 - they did not come significantly back down again until Mr Biden was in.

    (I can't easily find a graph of average tariff rate over time with a clear scale.)
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,983
    Hmm.... I think @ydoethur was kinder.
  • Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 37,790
    AnneJGP said:

    Scott_xP said:

    Morning all.

    I was at a gig last night expecting an evening of culture and entertainment but it all turned a bit political

    The first band played a song dedicated to "keeping Reform out at the local elections"

    This was followed by the next act singing her pandemic anthem "Fuck the Tories"

    The headliners shied away from any contemporary political commentary relying instead on their back catalogue, when Thatcher was in power and Edinburgh was the AIDS capital of Europe

    Did you pay to attend, or did they pay you?
    I used to work with the sound guy. He offered to put me on the guest list

    The Mackenzies in full flow



    Big John can barely walk these days, but he can still shred with the best
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 18,216

    Anyway EDF have awarded us with free electricity from 8.00am to noon today so the washing machine, dishwasher and dryer are working overtime !!!!!

    The Net Zero programme working the way it should, then. The more solar panels and wind farms, the more frequent these events will be.

    Someone should point this out to the Leader of the Opposition. And to the other leader of the opposition.
  • FishingFishing Posts: 5,466
    Scott_xP said:

    Morning all.

    I was at a gig last night expecting an evening of culture and entertainment but it all turned a bit political

    The first band played a song dedicated to "keeping Reform out at the local elections"

    This was followed by the next act singing her pandemic anthem "Fuck the Tories"

    The headliners shied away from any contemporary political commentary relying instead on their back catalogue, when Thatcher was in power and Edinburgh was the AIDS capital of Europe

    Are you of all people really criticising others for banging on about battles long lost?
  • MarqueeMarkMarqueeMark Posts: 54,281
    algarkirk said:

    Roger said:

    Israel really seems to have gone a bit mental. Presumably these are two Labour MPs who are not Labour Friends of Israel and therefore have not accepted the Israeli dollar (shekel).
    I’m sure Bibi is quaking in his boots after facing the watery wrath of David Lammy.

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cn9133z2v30o

    Lammy has turned out to be a Jobsworth. Emily Thornberry would have been a much better choice
    Agree about Thornberry. She has been conspicuously both loyal to the government that overlooked her and a sane spokesperson on the media about foreign matters especially. Time her St George flag error was put into the past.
    Show me where she has rowed back on her St. George flag error.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 50,864
    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    vik said:

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    I trust the "inside sources" more than the "senior official" trying to do damage control.

    The fact that they feel that they need to do damage control means that the rumours about Bessent's exit are real.
    How long will it be before the tariffs are walked back ?
    No one voted to be poorer - or rather, a lot of Americans did, back in November, but precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.
    I'm not sure. He's as bull-headed as he is foolish.

    When Mr Chump did it first time around - in I think 2018 - they did not come significantly back down again until Mr Biden was in.

    (I can't easily find a graph of average tariff rate over time with a clear scale.)
    Yes, I think the markets are being rather optimistic that the tariffs will be dropped in weeks or months.

    I note that I was the only one in the PB predictions contest to predict negative growth in the USA, just 10 weeks ago. Life comes at you fast nowadays.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,992
    edited April 6

    Trevor Philips on Sky just now

    Darren Jones openly admits to him that the tariffs at 10% ARE a Brexit dividend

    I had a lot of time for Darren Jones, however you have just proved he is a stupid as the rest of them.

    Being done over by Trump to the tune of 10% instead of 20% does not correspond to a win to compensate for losing frictionless trade with our largest trading partner. This does not constitute a Brexit win.

    Our steelworks, JLR factories and Scotch whisky distilleries are still being closed or mothballed. So I'll give you that similarity with Brexit.
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,343
    edited April 6
    Roger said:

    Nice to read something so eloquenly written. A perfect read for a sunny Sunday morning

    Ahahaha

    You do realise who wrote at least half of it?
  • Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 64,964

    Trevor Philips on Sky just now

    Darren Jones openly admits to him that the tariffs at 10% ARE a Brexit dividend

    I had a lot of time for Darren Jones, however you have just proved he is a stupid as the rest of them.

    Being done over by Trump to the tune of 10% instead of 20% does not correspond to a win to compensate for losing frictionless trade with the our largest trading partner. This does not constitute a Brexit win.

    Our steelworks, JLR factories and Scotch whisky distilleries are still being closed or mothballed. So I'll give you that similarity with Brexit.
    I was surprised Darren Jones so openly declared it a Brexit dividend, but I would suggest to Labour supporters that Starmer, Reeves, and the cabinet are moving to worldwide trade deals at a pace that would be impressive if Starmer was a conservative PM
  • StereodogStereodog Posts: 804
    kle4 said:

    Sadly my standard Lords reform proposal to prevent ex-MPs and any political donors from getting peerages would not prevent the friends of the 'right' people such as Spielman from getting in.

    And whether failure is rewarded with ermine or not, it does seem the case that failure is rewarded in general. Hold a prominent position and even if you are a complete duffer you will get another great post because, well, you held the last one. So just get your foot in the door and all will be well. Like total business failures and fraudsters who inexplicably still manage to become super wealthy after being exposed because somehow losingmillions or even billions still imbues you with the aura of success. Jordan Belfort is still very very wealthy for example.

    Having worked around the House of Lords for years I think that ex MPs actually make the most effective Peers. They know the legislative process, are willing to serve on Committees, actually show up and put work in. It's the celebrities and business people who get given peerages that are the waste of space.
  • Sunil_PrasannanSunil_Prasannan Posts: 53,436
    ON TOPIC:

    House of Lords = House of Unelected Has-Beens (or even Never-Beens!*)


    * hat-tip @ydoethur
  • LeonLeon Posts: 59,343
    edited April 6
    ON topic - some will say it’s unfair to judge the House of Lords by the calibre of its members. That’s like judging Glastonbury by the state of the toilets—technically accurate, but missing the point. The Lords isn’t there to lead or innovate or represent. It’s there to exist, immovably, like a stately ghost with an expense account.

    And in that spectral drawing room of ceremonial irrelevance, Amanda Spielman isn’t a misfit—she’s practically furniture. The kind that insists you remove your shoes before sitting, quotes Ofsted reports at dinner, and still believes phonics can fix poverty. Her critics cry foul, but that’s only because they haven’t realised the game was abandoned mid-play decades ago.

    Look at the recent appointments. We’ve gone from bishops and war heroes to whatever floated past a minister’s WhatsApp at 2am. One minute you’re at a party holding a tray of canapés; the next, you’re Baroness Vol-au-Vent of Southwark. Spielman, at least, has the distinction of failing upwards in a recognisable direction—education, that most British of oxymorons.

    So let’s not clutch our pearls. Let’s hand her the ermine, the title, the right to nap through bills on cybercrime. She belongs. Not despite her record—but because of it. In a chamber increasingly defined by its theatrical pointlessness, her appointment is less a scandal and more a reassuring reminder: the great British tradition of rewarding confident mediocrity is alive and well.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 30,992
    ...

    Trevor Philips on Sky just now

    Darren Jones openly admits to him that the tariffs at 10% ARE a Brexit dividend

    I had a lot of time for Darren Jones, however you have just proved he is a stupid as the rest of them.

    Being done over by Trump to the tune of 10% instead of 20% does not correspond to a win to compensate for losing frictionless trade with the our largest trading partner. This does not constitute a Brexit win.

    Our steelworks, JLR factories and Scotch whisky distilleries are still being closed or mothballed. So I'll give you that similarity with Brexit.
    I was surprised Darren Jones so openly declared it a Brexit dividend, but I would suggest to Labour supporters that Starmer, Reeves, and the cabinet are moving to worldwide trade deals at a pace that would be impressive if Starmer was a conservative PM
    Remember we had comprehensive reciprocal trade deals across the World as part of the EU. It is interesting as Starmer is sending trade missions to St Kitts and Nevis, Canada and Mexico are looking for comprehensive agreements with the EU to counteract Trump.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 126,619
    Most Lords have achieved success in business, law, academia, the media, science, sport, culture, education, religion, politics etc. Even if the success of some like Spielman is debatable.

    Having an appointed second chamber also often leads to better debates focused on the facts not point scoring as is often the case in the elected Commons. Focused on revising not making legislation
  • TazTaz Posts: 17,262
    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    vik said:

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    I trust the "inside sources" more than the "senior official" trying to do damage control.

    The fact that they feel that they need to do damage control means that the rumours about Bessent's exit are real.
    How long will it be before the tariffs are walked back ?
    No one voted to be poorer - or rather, a lot of Americans did, back in November, but precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.
    I'm not sure. He's as bull-headed as he is foolish.

    When Mr Chump did it first time around - in I think 2018 - they did not come significantly back down again until Mr Biden was in.

    (I can't easily find a graph of average tariff rate over time with a clear scale.)
    Not true, tariffs increased under the Biden administration.

    He kept many of the trump tariffs from 2016-20 and added some of his own

    https://x.com/danobrien20/status/1907369341827371394?s=61
  • geoffwgeoffw Posts: 8,979
    edited April 6
    AI war on PB via proxies
  • another_richardanother_richard Posts: 27,449
    Nigelb said:

    vik said:

    vik said:

    I posted this interview yesterday before having had chance to listen to the whole thing but Scott Bessent is probably the best advocate for the Trump administration at the moment. Far more gravitas and experience than JD Vance.

    He makes a good case for what Trump is trying to do economically:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLnX1SQfgJI

    Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent is reportedly looking for a way out of the Trump administration following the Republican president’s disastrous tariff rollout damaged his “credibility,” alleged MSNBC host Stephanie Ruhle on Friday.

    ....

    Ruhle suggested that Bessent, who built his $521 million fortune managing massive hedge funds, can’t stomach Trump’s “absurd tariff math,” which some critics have slammed as a “kindergarten-level understanding” of international trade.

    According to Ruhle’s sources, Trump is “not listening” to his treasury secretary, “the odd man out” in the president’s inner circle.


    https://www.thedailybeast.com/msnbc-host-stephanie-ruhle-alleges-trumps-treasury-sec-looking-for-an-exit-door/
    https://x.com/SRuhle/status/1908250911769506289

    NEW:
    Investors may be running for the hills, but Bessent is NOT.
    In response to talk that Secretary Bessent is potentially eying an exit to the Fed-
    A senior official inside the administration telling me.
    “Secretary Bessent is more committed than ever to his role as treasury secretary - he is meeting with the president several times a day and communicating with the rest of the cabinet.
    Obviously this week’s market reaction is painful - but this is about an economic reset.
    The secretary has no interest in moving to the Fed and his core focus of addressing our crippling debt/deficit”
    I trust the "inside sources" more than the "senior official" trying to do damage control.

    The fact that they feel that they need to do damage control means that the rumours about Bessent's exit are real.
    How long will it be before the tariffs are walked back ?
    No one voted to be poorer - or rather, a lot of Americans did, back in November, but precious few of them would have voted to be poorer, had they realised the full consequences of what they were doing.
    I wonder if this makes the possibility of a few individual trade deals more likely.

    Trump needs to show he is behaving reasonably and practically, even if he isn't.
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