Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
Indeed. We are intellectually astute enough on PB to see when a snake oil salesman is trying to sell us a pup ( to mix my metaphors).
Thank you all for your information about lynx. I thought it was a large snarly bitey thing but it appears it is a rather shy creature around a third to a half of an adult human's weight and height. I shall therefore remove the bounty or (per @Luckyguy1983) whichever chocolate bar would have sufficed.
As for dachshunds I shall assume dangerous and buy a small pokey device to ward off attacks from these vicious creatures. Presumably at ankle height, or maybe shin if they leap.
Just received this. A personal email saying "Join me and many thousands of supporters alongside our new mayoral and local election candidates at the Arena Birmingham on the 28th March. With your help, we can win hundreds of seats in May’s local elections. I hope to see you there. Nigel" I'll think about it.
Thank you all for your information about lynx. I thought it was a large snarly bitey thing but it appears it is a rather shy creature around a third to a half of an adult human's weight and height. I shall therefore remove the bounty or (per @Luckyguy1983) whichever chocolate bar would have sufficed.
As for dachshunds I shall assume dangerous and buy a small pokey device to ward off arracks from these vicious creatures. Presumably at ankle height, or maybe shin if they leap.
Won't work. Pack attack, saturation of defence, all over soon. At least one's executors save a bit on the undertakers' bill.
How can anyone look at what has happened to America and still want British Trump with more MPs?
What they want is stuff to happen and things to work. They want GP appointments and an NHS waiting list of less than 6 months. They want the criminals warehoused. Some improvements on the high street would be nice.
Round here, the council is "consulting" about moving bin collections from once every two weeks, to once a month. The well off make extra arrangements. The poor people on the estates have a pile of stinking garbage. But they are all Deplorables or something. So that's all good then.
Telling people that nothing can be done and no one can do it, is a simple recipe for "Well, we will try this lot, then"
This is why Starmer is trying to do stuff.
And when people do try the other lot, as they will with Reform they merely get abused for their choice. But why not when other parties have lied to them and let them down time and time again. Nothing to lose really and those abusing them for their choice were never really on the side of these communities anyway.
The really big issue where I am is a group of youths in the town centre on a Friday and Saturday evening causing problems and the police know about it, have ‘spoke to them’ but it never improves and people and businesses and the town suffers as a consequence. It’s not about ‘being back the birch’ it’s just about making a visit to town enjoyable. It’s been going on a few years. Little happens.
I’ve been impressed with Starmer this year. Not just on Ukraine but on growth and a few other things. There are signs he gets it and is growing into the role.
So many things in the UK are like that. Lots of things have been allowed to slip, lots of people in power just shrug and totality it gives the impression nothing works.
And of course on the flip side of the coin, highest tax for 50+ years.
Too many politicians have in recent past thought give a speech or two and that is that issue sorted.
Some years ago, when I was living in Wiltshire, Blair & Co. had enacted a policy of non-interferences with "travellers", by the police.
So when a group moved in locally, and thefts and so forth happened, the police refused to make arrests, since a riot would develop at the encampment.
The final straw was a violent distraction robbery of a shop (old lady knocked down, ended up in A&E). The perpetrators were identified. The police specifically refused to act.
So a bunch of locals formed a vigilante group - went out to the encampment at night, wearing balaclavas and told them to leave or else.
They left.
The next day the town was full of police trying to find out who threatened the travellers.
I was curious as to the outrage by the authorities - if you withdraw your side of the social contract, what would you expect people to honour their half?
Also the problem for the police, who police by consent, is they end up losing the respect and the trust of the communities they are supposed to protect.
The lack of action on stuff like shoplifting too, apparently down to an edict from Theresa May
The government has now said the police must investigate thefts under £200
How can anyone look at what has happened to America and still want British Trump with more MPs?
What they want is stuff to happen and things to work. They want GP appointments and an NHS waiting list of less than 6 months. They want the criminals warehoused. Some improvements on the high street would be nice.
Round here, the council is "consulting" about moving bin collections from once every two weeks, to once a month. The well off make extra arrangements. The poor people on the estates have a pile of stinking garbage. But they are all Deplorables or something. So that's all good then.
Telling people that nothing can be done and no one can do it, is a simple recipe for "Well, we will try this lot, then"
This is why Starmer is trying to do stuff.
And when people do try the other lot, as they will with Reform they merely get abused for their choice. But why not when other parties have lied to them and let them down time and time again. Nothing to lose really and those abusing them for their choice were never really on the side of these communities anyway.
The really big issue where I am is a group of youths in the town centre on a Friday and Saturday evening causing problems and the police know about it, have ‘spoke to them’ but it never improves and people and businesses and the town suffers as a consequence. It’s not about ‘being back the birch’ it’s just about making a visit to town enjoyable. It’s been going on a few years. Little happens.
I’ve been impressed with Starmer this year. Not just on Ukraine but on growth and a few other things. There are signs he gets it and is growing into the role.
So many things in the UK are like that. Lots of things have been allowed to slip, lots of people in power just shrug and totality it gives the impression nothing works.
And of course on the flip side of the coin, highest tax for 50+ years.
Too many politicians have in recent past thought give a speech or two and that is that issue sorted.
Some years ago, when I was living in Wiltshire, Blair & Co. had enacted a policy of non-interferences with "travellers", by the police.
So when a group moved in locally, and thefts and so forth happened, the police refused to make arrests, since a riot would develop at the encampment.
The final straw was a violent distraction robbery of a shop (old lady knocked down, ended up in A&E). The perpetrators were identified. The police specifically refused to act.
So a bunch of locals formed a vigilante group - went out to the encampment at night, wearing balaclavas and told them to leave or else.
They left.
The next day the town was full of police trying to find out who threatened the travellers.
I was curious as to the outrage by the authorities - if you withdraw your side of the social contract, what would you expect people to honour their half?
Also the problem for the police, who police by consent, is they end up losing the respect and the trust of the communities they are supposed to protect.
The lack of action on stuff like shoplifting too, apparently down to an edict from Theresa May
The government has now said the police must investigate thefts under £200
Absolutely outrageous HY. We are all with you on this utter waste of taxpayer money.😂
If countries wish to rearm, it's not just the finance they need, there is a whole host of items that need to be considered first.
* The actual plan: Japanese tend to be good at this as they are detail conscious. Chinese just throw people at it. The Brits tend to start and get bogged down in the middle as someone hadn't thought to order the screwdrivers.
* The site: You're talking about space and utilities - air, water, power. Bashing metal takes a lot of power so unless there is spare capacity close by, there may be a restriction on how quickly production can be ramped up. Rheinmetall and their 155mm shell plant is close to completion but ramping up production is going to take time.
* Machinery: Usually you'll take any second hand plant that is close by that can be converted quickly if you are wanting to scale up sooner rather than later. New plant that is not sitting in a warehouse somewhere (unlikely) has it's own lead time. If it's on the critical path then someone grabbing it first (see PPE in Covid) will put you back.
*Raw Materials: Is the grade of material you want available. Can you use substitutes? Are the suppliers friendly or not.
Bringing this all together at scale will be for the next war and not this one. The Ukrainian developments of drones (air and sea) will be seen as an impressive response to their lack of resources. But when Russia changed the battlefield to men (they had some) and machines (they had lots), the nature of the fight changed. Especially when no airpower was offered.
So unless Europe has a few plants ready to go (e.g.Volkswagen) it could be all over if the US refuse to supply from their manufacturing base.
Off-the-wall thought. Could a manufacturer of agricultural machinery be re-tooled for military purposes? Ploughshares into swords, if you like.
You mean like Ransomes in Ipswich who made quite a lot of gear. So answer is yes - but you'd have to put the economy on a war footing so the Nimbys wouldn't object.
Talking of reintroductions, they are planning on reintroducing lynx. If they do, can I offer a bounty to have them killed? The lynx, not the bureaucrats, fun as that would be. There are few things more irresponsible than releasing a predator of humans.
Cats also. Not the lynx kind but the puddy tat kind. And sometimes outdoor too, so not just becasue of being locked indoors with a supply of originally fresh dinner and the loo for water.
Also cute hamsters (Revenge for pop stars?) and ickle little songbirds. Dangerous.
Talking of reintroductions, they are planning on reintroducing lynx. If they do, can I offer a bounty to have them killed? The lynx, not the bureaucrats, fun as that would be. There are few things more irresponsible than releasing a predator of humans.
This is garbage.
In my late teens I was involved in a project at Riber Castle in Derbyshire, where they were breeding lynx for reintroduction into the Vosges Mountains in France. It was a very successful project and there were no attacks on humans. Lynx have also been reintroduced at other sites in France s well as at least 3 sites in Germany. Again, no attacks on humans. I am sure there are valid reasons for objecting to various reintroductions but this is definitely not one of them.
A lynx was found in a cafe in North Tallinn last year. It just wandered off. Estonians certainly don't see them as a threat
Just received this. A personal email saying "Join me and many thousands of supporters alongside our new mayoral and local election candidates at the Arena Birmingham on the 28th March. With your help, we can win hundreds of seats in May’s local elections. I hope to see you there. Nigel" I'll think about it.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
You seem more Reformy than Tory these days. You have been advised that adding Ref and Con together is an unreliable Pandora's box best left unopened.
Perhaps most PB Tories remain Conservative and were it not that the Conservative Party have moved away from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
That's exactly it in my case. I'd be perfectly willing to vote for a Cameron-style sane Conservative party with fresh ideas. Sadly, the Conservative Party is chasing after the Reform-style vote, and that's generally not a position I can vote for.
If countries wish to rearm, it's not just the finance they need, there is a whole host of items that need to be considered first.
* The actual plan: Japanese tend to be good at this as they are detail conscious. Chinese just throw people at it. The Brits tend to start and get bogged down in the middle as someone hadn't thought to order the screwdrivers.
* The site: You're talking about space and utilities - air, water, power. Bashing metal takes a lot of power so unless there is spare capacity close by, there may be a restriction on how quickly production can be ramped up. Rheinmetall and their 155mm shell plant is close to completion but ramping up production is going to take time.
* Machinery: Usually you'll take any second hand plant that is close by that can be converted quickly if you are wanting to scale up sooner rather than later. New plant that is not sitting in a warehouse somewhere (unlikely) has it's own lead time. If it's on the critical path then someone grabbing it first (see PPE in Covid) will put you back.
*Raw Materials: Is the grade of material you want available. Can you use substitutes? Are the suppliers friendly or not.
Bringing this all together at scale will be for the next war and not this one. The Ukrainian developments of drones (air and sea) will be seen as an impressive response to their lack of resources. But when Russia changed the battlefield to men (they had some) and machines (they had lots), the nature of the fight changed. Especially when no airpower was offered.
So unless Europe has a few plants ready to go (e.g.Volkswagen) it could be all over if the US refuse to supply from their manufacturing base.
Off-the-wall thought. Could a manufacturer of agricultural machinery be re-tooled for military purposes? Ploughshares into swords, if you like.
You mean like Ransomes in Ipswich who made quite a lot of gears. So answer is yes - but you'd have to put the economy on a war footing so the Nimbys wouldn't object.
Still more famously Fosters of Lincolm who moved from traction engines to tanks in the Great War.
Or Molins cigarette vending machinery which produced automatic loaders for airborne 6 pdr guns in Mosquitoes in WW2.
Or WAring and Gillows furniture firm which produced wooden bits for planes such as gliders and Mosquitoes.
Of course, they didn't have much choice in a wartime economy. Civvy market badly disturbed and highly regulated, e.g. Utility furniture.
In a way it's a bit of a shame that Reform are doing so well in Runcorn polling, as if they walk it, Farage's fairly bad behaviour over Lowe will be rewarded.
That species of restless treachery is so inimical to Farage that you can't ascribe a moral cast to it like "bad behaviour".
It is as natural and necessary to him as breathing is to me or you.
That’s a terrific line and one Avon used to Servalan in an episode of,the seminal BBC sci,fi show Blakes 7.
Off Topic Anyone seen our resident narcissist recently? It's very quiet atm.
Banned since March 8. Reason unknown to me.
I think he might have hinted at the subject that cannot be hinted.
I might be in a minority of one but I haven't missed him. I haven't missed the personal insults either.
Really given you’re quite keen to dish them.
Have I made directly personal profanity laden disrespectful insults to you or anyone else, except perhaps in a tit-for-tat spat with Leon? I would be surprised if I have. If I am potentially guilty I believe it to be incumbent on you to wade through eight years of posts and flag each one you find to be offensive. Now off you go and come back when you have finished.
If countries wish to rearm, it's not just the finance they need, there is a whole host of items that need to be considered first.
* The actual plan: Japanese tend to be good at this as they are detail conscious. Chinese just throw people at it. The Brits tend to start and get bogged down in the middle as someone hadn't thought to order the screwdrivers.
* The site: You're talking about space and utilities - air, water, power. Bashing metal takes a lot of power so unless there is spare capacity close by, there may be a restriction on how quickly production can be ramped up. Rheinmetall and their 155mm shell plant is close to completion but ramping up production is going to take time.
* Machinery: Usually you'll take any second hand plant that is close by that can be converted quickly if you are wanting to scale up sooner rather than later. New plant that is not sitting in a warehouse somewhere (unlikely) has it's own lead time. If it's on the critical path then someone grabbing it first (see PPE in Covid) will put you back.
*Raw Materials: Is the grade of material you want available. Can you use substitutes? Are the suppliers friendly or not.
Bringing this all together at scale will be for the next war and not this one. The Ukrainian developments of drones (air and sea) will be seen as an impressive response to their lack of resources. But when Russia changed the battlefield to men (they had some) and machines (they had lots), the nature of the fight changed. Especially when no airpower was offered.
So unless Europe has a few plants ready to go (e.g.Volkswagen) it could be all over if the US refuse to supply from their manufacturing base.
Off-the-wall thought. Could a manufacturer of agricultural machinery be re-tooled for military purposes? Ploughshares into swords, if you like.
You mean like Ransomes in Ipswich who made quite a lot of gears. So answer is yes - but you'd have to put the economy on a war footing so the Nimbys wouldn't object.
Still more famously Fosters of Lincolm who moved from traction engines to tanks in the Great War.
Or Molins cigarette vending machinery which produced automatic loaders for airborne 6 pdr guns in Mosquitoes in WW2.
Or WAring and Gillows furniture firm which produced wooden bits for planes such as gliders and Mosquitoes.
Of course, they didn't have much choice in a wartime economy. Civvy market badly disturbed and highly regulated, e.g. Utility furniture.
I know of one medium-sized tech firm that had a big top-level meeting when Covid started five years ago. They sat down and looked at how working from home would work for them, along with all the other implications of the pandemic. A couple of days later, they had another top-level meeting where they looked at the opportunities the epidemic might have for their organisation, and how they could make the most of the terrible time.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
Depends what percentage of Leon's identities are banned at that particular time.
Talking of reintroductions, they are planning on reintroducing lynx. If they do, can I offer a bounty to have them killed? The lynx, not the bureaucrats, fun as that would be. There are few things more irresponsible than releasing a predator of humans.
This is garbage.
In my late teens I was involved in a project at Riber Castle in Derbyshire, where they were breeding lynx for reintroduction into the Vosges Mountains in France. It was a very successful project and there were no attacks on humans. Lynx have also been reintroduced at other sites in France s well as at least 3 sites in Germany. Again, no attacks on humans. I am sure there are valid reasons for objecting to various reintroductions but this is definitely not one of them.
A lynx was found in a cafe in North Tallinn last year. It just wandered off. Estonians certainly don't see them as a threat
So, you're saying that the lynxes were attempting to dewild themselves and reintegrate with human society?
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
You seem more Reformy than Tory these days. You have been advised that adding Ref and Con together is an unreliable Pandora's box best left unopened.
Perhaps most PB Tories remain Conservative and were it not that the Conservative Party have moved away from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
That's exactly it in my case. I'd be perfectly willing to vote for a Cameron-style sane Conservative party with fresh ideas. Sadly, the Conservative Party is chasing after the Reform-style vote, and that's generally not a position I can vote for.
Yet around half the polls give a Tory and Reform seats majority now even without regaining Cameroon Remainers from Starmer Labour and the LDs
We had very good and productive discussions with President Vladimir Putin of Russia yesterday, and there is a very good chance that this horrible, bloody war can finally come to an end — BUT, AT THIS VERY MOMENT, THOUSANDS OF UKRAINIAN TROOPS ARE COMPLETELY SURROUNDED BY THE RUSSIAN MILITARY, AND IN A VERY BAD AND VULNERABLE POSITION. I have strongly requested to President Putin that their lives be spared. This would be a horrible massacre, one not seen since World War II. God bless them all!!!
At least Donald seems dimly aware that Russia doesn’t tend to take POWs.
Well, actually they do. They murder lots, mutilate lots and torture lots. But a number survive.
Taking POWs is a necessary precursor to murder, mutilation and torture
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
We, inevitably, are overrepresented by people who are either (a) retired, or (b) work in jobs where we have our own computer and are trusted to manage our own time.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
I suspect we have a good few shy Reformers.
I'll start. Former Labour, but not for a while, still never Tory (or Reform).
NOTA.
Tory once back in the era of Thatcher. UKIP once to get a Referendum. Since then local independents or spoiled ballots.
As I think I mentioned once before, at University I was simultaneously a member of the Tory group (Thatcher era, along with Welshowl of this parish), the Labour Group (as I was sleeping with one of the student executive) and Plaid Cyrmu (as the PC Club in Cardiff was the only place you could get a drink on a Sunday evening).
How can anyone look at what has happened to America and still want British Trump with more MPs?
What they want is stuff to happen and things to work. They want GP appointments and an NHS waiting list of less than 6 months. They want the criminals warehoused. Some improvements on the high street would be nice.
Round here, the council is "consulting" about moving bin collections from once every two weeks, to once a month. The well off make extra arrangements. The poor people on the estates have a pile of stinking garbage. But they are all Deplorables or something. So that's all good then.
Telling people that nothing can be done and no one can do it, is a simple recipe for "Well, we will try this lot, then"
This is why Starmer is trying to do stuff.
And when people do try the other lot, as they will with Reform they merely get abused for their choice. But why not when other parties have lied to them and let them down time and time again. Nothing to lose really and those abusing them for their choice were never really on the side of these communities anyway.
The really big issue where I am is a group of youths in the town centre on a Friday and Saturday evening causing problems and the police know about it, have ‘spoke to them’ but it never improves and people and businesses and the town suffers as a consequence. It’s not about ‘being back the birch’ it’s just about making a visit to town enjoyable. It’s been going on a few years. Little happens.
I’ve been impressed with Starmer this year. Not just on Ukraine but on growth and a few other things. There are signs he gets it and is growing into the role.
So many things in the UK are like that. Lots of things have been allowed to slip, lots of people in power just shrug and totality it gives the impression nothing works.
And of course on the flip side of the coin, highest tax for 50+ years.
Too many politicians have in recent past thought give a speech or two and that is that issue sorted.
Some years ago, when I was living in Wiltshire, Blair & Co. had enacted a policy of non-interferences with "travellers", by the police.
So when a group moved in locally, and thefts and so forth happened, the police refused to make arrests, since a riot would develop at the encampment.
The final straw was a violent distraction robbery of a shop (old lady knocked down, ended up in A&E). The perpetrators were identified. The police specifically refused to act.
So a bunch of locals formed a vigilante group - went out to the encampment at night, wearing balaclavas and told them to leave or else.
They left.
The next day the town was full of police trying to find out who threatened the travellers.
I was curious as to the outrage by the authorities - if you withdraw your side of the social contract, what would you expect people to honour their half?
Also the problem for the police, who police by consent, is they end up losing the respect and the trust of the communities they are supposed to protect.
The lack of action on stuff like shoplifting too, apparently down to an edict from Theresa May
The government has now said the police must investigate thefts under £200
That’s good.
The conservatives, party of law and order, acting as the enablers of shoplifters.
And people say security guards in shops should intervene. Why on earth should,they for,min wage. Risk a blade for a packet of cheese and meat some druggie wants to sell in a local pub.
This govt seems to be starting to right some of the Tories wrongs.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
You seem more Reformy than Tory these days. You have been advised that adding Ref and Con together is an unreliable Pandora's box best left unopened.
Perhaps most PB Tories remain Conservative and were it not that the Conservative Party have moved away from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
That's exactly it in my case. I'd be perfectly willing to vote for a Cameron-style sane Conservative party with fresh ideas. Sadly, the Conservative Party is chasing after the Reform-style vote, and that's generally not a position I can vote for.
Yet around half the polls give a Tory and Reform seats majority now even without regaining Cameroon Remainers from Starmer Labour and the LDs
What are you to call this new amalgamated Party of which you regularly claim to be leading in the polls?
Thank you all for your information about lynx. I thought it was a large snarly bitey thing but it appears it is a rather shy creature around a third to a half of an adult human's weight and height. I shall therefore remove the bounty or (per @Luckyguy1983) whichever chocolate bar would have sufficed.
As for dachshunds I shall assume dangerous and buy a small pokey device to ward off arracks from these vicious creatures. Presumably at ankle height, or maybe shin if they leap.
Won't work. Pack attack, saturation of defence, all over soon. At least one's executors save a bit on the undertakers' bill.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
We, inevitably, are overrepresented by people who are either (a) retired, or (b) work in jobs where we have our own computer and are trusted to manage our own time.
This rules out large segments of the population.
True, but then sections of us can happily look down on those people for daring to have the wrong views or vote the wrong way.
Thank you all for your information about lynx. I thought it was a large snarly bitey thing but it appears it is a rather shy creature around a third to a half of an adult human's weight and height. I shall therefore remove the bounty or (per @Luckyguy1983) whichever chocolate bar would have sufficed.
As for dachshunds I shall assume dangerous and buy a small pokey device to ward off arracks from these vicious creatures. Presumably at ankle height, or maybe shin if they leap.
Won't work. Pack attack, saturation of defence, all over soon. At least one's executors save a bit on the undertakers' bill.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
You seem more Reformy than Tory these days. You have been advised that adding Ref and Con together is an unreliable Pandora's box best left unopened.
Perhaps most PB Tories remain Conservative and were it not that the Conservative Party have moved away from them rather than the other way around they would have remained loyal. I blame Johnson.
That's exactly it in my case. I'd be perfectly willing to vote for a Cameron-style sane Conservative party with fresh ideas. Sadly, the Conservative Party is chasing after the Reform-style vote, and that's generally not a position I can vote for.
Yet around half the polls give a Tory and Reform seats majority now even without regaining Cameroon Remainers from Starmer Labour and the LDs
What are you to call this new amalgamated Party of which you regularly claim to be leading in the polls?
How can anyone look at what has happened to America and still want British Trump with more MPs?
What they want is stuff to happen and things to work. They want GP appointments and an NHS waiting list of less than 6 months. They want the criminals warehoused. Some improvements on the high street would be nice.
Round here, the council is "consulting" about moving bin collections from once every two weeks, to once a month. The well off make extra arrangements. The poor people on the estates have a pile of stinking garbage. But they are all Deplorables or something. So that's all good then.
Telling people that nothing can be done and no one can do it, is a simple recipe for "Well, we will try this lot, then"
This is why Starmer is trying to do stuff.
And when people do try the other lot, as they will with Reform they merely get abused for their choice. But why not when other parties have lied to them and let them down time and time again. Nothing to lose really and those abusing them for their choice were never really on the side of these communities anyway.
The really big issue where I am is a group of youths in the town centre on a Friday and Saturday evening causing problems and the police know about it, have ‘spoke to them’ but it never improves and people and businesses and the town suffers as a consequence. It’s not about ‘being back the birch’ it’s just about making a visit to town enjoyable. It’s been going on a few years. Little happens.
I’ve been impressed with Starmer this year. Not just on Ukraine but on growth and a few other things. There are signs he gets it and is growing into the role.
So many things in the UK are like that. Lots of things have been allowed to slip, lots of people in power just shrug and totality it gives the impression nothing works.
And of course on the flip side of the coin, highest tax for 50+ years.
Too many politicians have in recent past thought give a speech or two and that is that issue sorted.
Some years ago, when I was living in Wiltshire, Blair & Co. had enacted a policy of non-interferences with "travellers", by the police.
So when a group moved in locally, and thefts and so forth happened, the police refused to make arrests, since a riot would develop at the encampment.
The final straw was a violent distraction robbery of a shop (old lady knocked down, ended up in A&E). The perpetrators were identified. The police specifically refused to act.
So a bunch of locals formed a vigilante group - went out to the encampment at night, wearing balaclavas and told them to leave or else.
They left.
The next day the town was full of police trying to find out who threatened the travellers.
I was curious as to the outrage by the authorities - if you withdraw your side of the social contract, what would you expect people to honour their half?
Also the problem for the police, who police by consent, is they end up losing the respect and the trust of the communities they are supposed to protect.
The lack of action on stuff like shoplifting too, apparently down to an edict from Theresa May
The government has now said the police must investigate thefts under £200
Disappointing that a Labour government is the one to do this, whereas the Tories didn't.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
Quite so, and HYUFD has a good point too if we understand him correctly. But it would be an odd site if we had a purely statistically equivalent sample of every voter. Imagine the conversations!
Thank you all for your information about lynx. I thought it was a large snarly bitey thing but it appears it is a rather shy creature around a third to a half of an adult human's weight and height. I shall therefore remove the bounty or (per @Luckyguy1983) whichever chocolate bar would have sufficed.
As for dachshunds I shall assume dangerous and buy a small pokey device to ward off attacks from these vicious creatures. Presumably at ankle height, or maybe shin if they leap.
I still think you are overestimating the lynx (7 - 16 kg) so the size of a small to small/medium dog or of course you might be a very very very small person.
Oops I have just seen that one variety is a bit more chunky.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
I suspect we have a good few shy Reformers.
I'll start. Former Labour, but not for a while, still never Tory (or Reform).
NOTA.
Tory once back in the era of Thatcher. UKIP once to get a Referendum. Since then local independents or spoiled ballots.
As I think I mentioned once before, at University I was simultaneously a member of the Tory group (Thatcher era, along with Welshowl of this parish), the Labour Group (as I was sleeping with one of the student executive) and Plaid Cyrmu (as the PC Club in Cardiff was the only place you could get a drink on a Sunday evening).
I didn't join any political societies. I was far too busy in the Splottlands from Sunday to Thursday and the Old Arcade and then Kiwis on Friday and Saturday.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
I suspect we have a good few shy Reformers.
I'll start. Former Labour, but not for a while, still never Tory (or Reform).
NOTA.
Tory once back in the era of Thatcher. UKIP once to get a Referendum. Since then local independents or spoiled ballots.
As I think I mentioned once before, at University I was simultaneously a member of the Tory group (Thatcher era, along with Welshowl of this parish), the Labour Group (as I was sleeping with one of the student executive) and Plaid Cyrmu (as the PC Club in Cardiff was the only place you could get a drink on a Sunday evening).
I didn't join any political societies. I was far too busy in the Splottlands from Sunday to Thursday and the Old Arcade and then Kiwis on Friday and Saturday.
When were you there?
Edit: We might have had this convsersation before but I am old and forgetful
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
We, inevitably, are overrepresented by people who are either (a) retired, or (b) work in jobs where we have our own computer and are trusted to manage our own time.
We had very good and productive discussions with President Vladimir Putin of Russia yesterday, and there is a very good chance that this horrible, bloody war can finally come to an end — BUT, AT THIS VERY MOMENT, THOUSANDS OF UKRAINIAN TROOPS ARE COMPLETELY SURROUNDED BY THE RUSSIAN MILITARY, AND IN A VERY BAD AND VULNERABLE POSITION. I have strongly requested to President Putin that their lives be spared. This would be a horrible massacre, one not seen since World War II. God bless them all!!!
At least Donald seems dimly aware that Russia doesn’t tend to take POWs.
Well, actually they do. They murder lots, mutilate lots and torture lots. But a number survive.
Taking POWs is a necessary precursor to murder, mutilation and torture
Actually no. Killing by not accepting surrender is an old thing.
In The Goode Olde Days, not accepting surrender was considered OK in certain circumstances. For example, an RN boat crew had their officer shot by slavers as they boarded (early 19th cent). It was considered unremarkable that they Gave No Quarter.
In WWI certain groups, such as the stay behind machine gunners who covered retreats, were killed on the spot.
Shooting SS or any Germans in camouflage was common in WWII
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
We, inevitably, are overrepresented by people who are either (a) retired, or (b) work in jobs where we have our own computer and are trusted to manage our own time.
This rules out large segments of the population.
Indeed - we're self-selecting and unrepresentative, and most of the time we don't fall into the trap of pretending otherwise. I think it's more interesting to consider how this is also true of the IRL circles we move in. Most people I speak to IRL are also middle class - middle class public sector workers are highly overrepresented, as are parents, as are suburbanites. It was only really when my daughter started playing for a football team from a *cough* less middle-class background that it really struck me how skewed my own experiences are. I find conversations there highly enlightening because views get expressed which simply wouldn't in the circles I move in 5 days out of 7.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
I suspect we have a good few shy Reformers.
I'll start. Former Labour, but not for a while, still never Tory (or Reform).
NOTA.
Tory once back in the era of Thatcher. UKIP once to get a Referendum. Since then local independents or spoiled ballots.
As I think I mentioned once before, at University I was simultaneously a member of the Tory group (Thatcher era, along with Welshowl of this parish), the Labour Group (as I was sleeping with one of the student executive) and Plaid Cyrmu (as the PC Club in Cardiff was the only place you could get a drink on a Sunday evening).
I didn't join any political societies. I was far too busy in the Splottlands from Sunday to Thursday and the Old Arcade and then Kiwis on Friday and Saturday.
When were you there?
Edit: We might have had this convsersation before but I am old and forgetful
I'm the class of '89. I worked as a rep for a few years before I went.
I do remember during exam fortnight in 1987 getting absolutely bolloxed in the Horse and Groom and the Philharmonic and falling asleep in a curry house at the bottom of City Road on the Saturday between the two weeks. I assumed I was half way through failing my first year exams. Fortunately I passed.
Weird how so many posters who don’t like/don’t miss Leon bother to take the time to post something about him.
For someone who is banned from the site he’s done well to be still spamming it.
That has been one of the benefits of his temporary absence- considerably less spamming of irrelevant shite.
I think I am the only poster who has made the comments you have suggested, so you can blame me, but no one else.
The problem with the absence of Sandpit and Leon etc is in a nation where 25% now back Reform and at least 45% the Tories or Reform this site is now dominated by left liberals and Remainers.
The number of Tory voters on here now is in single digits and I can't think of a Reform voter except maybe Lucky guy who would be Tory if Jenrick was their leader
We should run a poll. I think you’d be surprised on the Tory count.
When you’re at one end of the political spectrum it’s no surprise everyone else seems to be at the other. BJO would doubtless tell us the whole forum is full of Tories.
At a guess, I’d say Lib Dems and Tories are over represented here vs polls, Reform and Green are underrepresented, and Labour is in line.
Reform are vastly underrepresented on here, there are probably more Green than Reform voters on PB
You're implicitly assuming PB is a random sample of the UK voter. Which it certainly is not. Income, education, age, IT cluedupness, all score differently from the average voter. For all I know the proportion of RefUK on here is actually correct when those factors are considered, together with their interaction.
To be fair to HYUFD, I think that is his point - that this board isn't representative - implicitly (?) for the reasons you set out.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
We, inevitably, are overrepresented by people who are either (a) retired, or (b) work in jobs where we have our own computer and are trusted to manage our own time.
This rules out large segments of the population.
Is there a (c) neither?
It is however true....most people who post here are home owners, with good pensions, or if not retired good wages. I would go as far as to say those still in work most here are earning in the top 5%.
Very few people who rent and fall into the lower tax bracket here even if retired
I'm still Labour. Not sure how you can be enthusiastic for doing a small proportion of what has to be done in very difficult circumstances. Often in a cack-handed manner. TINA right now.
On the subject of @Leon, I'm sure he will return and regale us with the latest stories of his travels (and travails).
Will he return as @Leon or as an exciting new character, and if so, how long before we tumble that it is indeed Leon?
He has already been here for several weeks....
He hasn't regaled the story of s***ing a minor celebrity in a church in Southern France yet then. That is what always confirms the new identity for me. Exciting!
We had very good and productive discussions with President Vladimir Putin of Russia yesterday, and there is a very good chance that this horrible, bloody war can finally come to an end — BUT, AT THIS VERY MOMENT, THOUSANDS OF UKRAINIAN TROOPS ARE COMPLETELY SURROUNDED BY THE RUSSIAN MILITARY, AND IN A VERY BAD AND VULNERABLE POSITION. I have strongly requested to President Putin that their lives be spared. This would be a horrible massacre, one not seen since World War II. God bless them all!!!
At least Donald seems dimly aware that Russia doesn’t tend to take POWs.
Well, actually they do. They murder lots, mutilate lots and torture lots. But a number survive.
Taking POWs is a necessary precursor to murder, mutilation and torture
Actually no. Killing by not accepting surrender is an old thing.
In The Goode Olde Days, not accepting surrender was considered OK in certain circumstances. For example, an RN boat crew had their officer shot by slavers as they boarded (early 19th cent). It was considered unremarkable that they Gave No Quarter.
In WWI certain groups, such as the stay behind machine gunners who covered retreats, were killed on the spot.
Shooting SS or any Germans in camouflage was common in WWII
These surrounded Ukr troops only exist in Putin's (and therefore Trump's) mind.
We had very good and productive discussions with President Vladimir Putin of Russia yesterday, and there is a very good chance that this horrible, bloody war can finally come to an end — BUT, AT THIS VERY MOMENT, THOUSANDS OF UKRAINIAN TROOPS ARE COMPLETELY SURROUNDED BY THE RUSSIAN MILITARY, AND IN A VERY BAD AND VULNERABLE POSITION. I have strongly requested to President Putin that their lives be spared. This would be a horrible massacre, one not seen since World War II. God bless them all!!!
At least Donald seems dimly aware that Russia doesn’t tend to take POWs.
Well, actually they do. They murder lots, mutilate lots and torture lots. But a number survive.
Taking POWs is a necessary precursor to murder, mutilation and torture
Actually no. Killing by not accepting surrender is an old thing.
In The Goode Olde Days, not accepting surrender was considered OK in certain circumstances. For example, an RN boat crew had their officer shot by slavers as they boarded (early 19th cent). It was considered unremarkable that they Gave No Quarter.
In WWI certain groups, such as the stay behind machine gunners who covered retreats, were killed on the spot.
Shooting SS or any Germans in camouflage was common in WWII
Perfidy (eg offering to surrender, or playing dead or injured, before opening fire), certainly justified giving no quarter, in WWII. The Japanese were notorious for it, so the US soldiers were frequently uninterested in taking prisoners.
Reading Nemesis by Max Hastings, a group of GI's were in a foxhole, trying to rest, and an injured Japanese kept screaming in agony, interspersed with cursing the Americans, and tunelessly singing folk songs. Eventually, one of them leapt out, and they heard a single gunshot. "Try yelping now, you bastard", said the man as he jumped back in.
The other example were no quarter was allowed, up to WWII, was when the defenders to a city refused quarter, and it was taken by storm.
I'm still Labour. Not sure how you can be enthusiastic for doing a small proportion of what has to be done in very difficult circumstances. Often in a cack-handed manner. TINA right now.
It must be getting harder with sweeping policy revolutions like the unpleasant rhetoric surrounding benefits. Yes the benefits system needs reforming, but othering the disabled is downright nasty. I'm coming over all BJO.
I'm still Labour. Not sure how you can be enthusiastic for doing a small proportion of what has to be done in very difficult circumstances. Often in a cack-handed manner. TINA right now.
It must be getting harder with sweeping policy revolutions like the unpleasant rhetoric surrounding benefits. Yes the benefits system needs reforming, but othering the disabled is downright nasty. I'm coming over all BJO.
Can you suggest how to reform the benefits system without othering someone? It will always be portrayed as such by the left
I've spotted a better report of that "You were not legally entitled to sack all the thousands of probationary workers, and you will reinstate them all within 7 days" injunction. Quite a few quotes from the actual court order.
It's a corker, and the Elon Musk "tear it all down" unit has been quite significantly disembowelled, subject to Appeal.
We had very good and productive discussions with President Vladimir Putin of Russia yesterday, and there is a very good chance that this horrible, bloody war can finally come to an end — BUT, AT THIS VERY MOMENT, THOUSANDS OF UKRAINIAN TROOPS ARE COMPLETELY SURROUNDED BY THE RUSSIAN MILITARY, AND IN A VERY BAD AND VULNERABLE POSITION. I have strongly requested to President Putin that their lives be spared. This would be a horrible massacre, one not seen since World War II. God bless them all!!!
At least Donald seems dimly aware that Russia doesn’t tend to take POWs.
Well, actually they do. They murder lots, mutilate lots and torture lots. But a number survive.
Taking POWs is a necessary precursor to murder, mutilation and torture
Actually no. Killing by not accepting surrender is an old thing.
In The Goode Olde Days, not accepting surrender was considered OK in certain circumstances. For example, an RN boat crew had their officer shot by slavers as they boarded (early 19th cent). It was considered unremarkable that they Gave No Quarter.
In WWI certain groups, such as the stay behind machine gunners who covered retreats, were killed on the spot.
Shooting SS or any Germans in camouflage was common in WWII
Perfidy (eg offering to surrender, or playing dead or injured, before opening fire), certainly justified giving no quarter, in WWII. The Japanese were notorious for it, so the US soldiers were frequently uninterested in taking prisoners.
Reading Nemesis by Max Hastings, a group of GI's were in a foxhole, trying to rest, and an injured Japanese kept screaming in agony, interspersed with cursing the Americans, and tunelessly singing folk songs. Eventually, one of them leapt out, and they heard a single gunshot. "Try yelping now, you bastard", said the man as he jumped back in.
The other example were no quarter was allowed, up to WWII, was when the defenders to a city refused quarter, and it was taken by storm.
They don't seem to have been surrounded, according to other reports (Ukr sources). Partially surrounded - yes - but not cut off.
Given that Trump is a congenital liar, the other reports are perhaps more credible.
The struggling water company is racing to find a buyer over the next eight weeks and is trying to persuade the regulator Ofwat to grant it significant leniency on penalties and extra costs, to attract bidders. That would mean customer bills rising by far more than the 35% it has been allowed...
Comments
As for dachshunds I shall assume dangerous and buy a small pokey device to ward off attacks from these vicious creatures. Presumably at ankle height, or maybe shin if they leap.
Just received this.
A personal email saying "Join me and many thousands of supporters alongside our new mayoral and local election candidates at the Arena Birmingham on the 28th March.
With your help, we can win hundreds of seats in May’s local elections.
I hope to see you there.
Nigel"
I'll think about it.
That's exactly it in my case. I'd be perfectly willing to vote for a Cameron-style sane Conservative party with fresh ideas. Sadly, the Conservative Party is chasing after the Reform-style vote, and that's generally not a position I can vote for.
Or Molins cigarette vending machinery which produced automatic loaders for airborne 6 pdr guns in Mosquitoes in WW2.
Or WAring and Gillows furniture firm which produced wooden bits for planes such as gliders and Mosquitoes.
Of course, they didn't have much choice in a wartime economy. Civvy market badly disturbed and highly regulated, e.g. Utility furniture.
Not only is this site something of a middle class bubble (though I certainly wouldn't say a left-leaning middle class bubble - we have the full range of middle class opinions on here) - for many of us we all exist pretty much in middle class bubbles. So (and I think this was HYUFD's point) it is at the very least interesting when we get someone on here with views from outside that bubble.
And to Mexicanpete's point - I quite like the random shite that some people post. I mean, I like politics, or I wouldn't be here - but it's nice to broaden our range beyond politics.
Yet around half the polls give a Tory and Reform seats majority now even without regaining Cameroon Remainers from Starmer Labour and the LDs
This rules out large segments of the population.
Tory once back in the era of Thatcher. UKIP once to get a Referendum. Since then local independents or spoiled ballots.
As I think I mentioned once before, at University I was simultaneously a member of the Tory group (Thatcher era, along with Welshowl of this parish), the Labour Group (as I was sleeping with one of the student executive) and Plaid Cyrmu (as the PC Club in Cardiff was the only place you could get a drink on a Sunday evening).
The conservatives, party of law and order, acting as the enablers of shoplifters.
And people say security guards in shops should intervene. Why on earth should,they for,min wage. Risk a blade for a packet of cheese and meat some druggie wants to sell in a local pub.
This govt seems to be starting to right some of the Tories wrongs.
sometimes I can have opinions
What are you to call this new amalgamated Party of which you regularly claim to be leading in the polls?
Refry?
No firm decision.
Nothing yet on bears.
Oops I have just seen that one variety is a bit more chunky.
Edit: We might have had this convsersation before but I am old and forgetful
In The Goode Olde Days, not accepting surrender was considered OK in certain circumstances. For example, an RN boat crew had their officer shot by slavers as they boarded (early 19th cent). It was considered unremarkable that they Gave No Quarter.
In WWI certain groups, such as the stay behind machine gunners who covered retreats, were killed on the spot.
Shooting SS or any Germans in camouflage was common in WWII
I think it's more interesting to consider how this is also true of the IRL circles we move in. Most people I speak to IRL are also middle class - middle class public sector workers are highly overrepresented, as are parents, as are suburbanites. It was only really when my daughter started playing for a football team from a *cough* less middle-class background that it really struck me how skewed my own experiences are. I find conversations there highly enlightening because views get expressed which simply wouldn't in the circles I move in 5 days out of 7.
I do remember during exam fortnight in 1987 getting absolutely bolloxed in the Horse and Groom and the Philharmonic and falling asleep in a curry house at the bottom of City Road on the Saturday between the two weeks. I assumed I was half way through failing my first year exams. Fortunately I passed.
Very few people who rent and fall into the lower tax bracket here even if retired
Not sure how you can be enthusiastic for doing a small proportion of what has to be done in very difficult circumstances. Often in a cack-handed manner.
TINA right now.
I have gone Inotherwayurthinkin to win and EW on Corbetts Cross.
I haven't a clue about horses though.
NEW THREAD
Where on the actual battlefield are they?
Reading Nemesis by Max Hastings, a group of GI's were in a foxhole, trying to rest, and an injured Japanese kept screaming in agony, interspersed with cursing the Americans, and tunelessly singing folk songs. Eventually, one of them leapt out, and they heard a single gunshot. "Try yelping now, you bastard", said the man as he jumped back in.
The other example were no quarter was allowed, up to WWII, was when the defenders to a city refused quarter, and it was taken by storm.
It's a corker, and the Elon Musk "tear it all down" unit has been quite significantly disembowelled, subject to Appeal.
https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/-a-sham-federal-judge-blasts-trump-admin-on-improper-firings-of-federal-workers-orders-rehiring-234398789993
Given that Trump is a congenital liar, the other reports are perhaps more credible.
This is beyond taking the piss; its outright contempt for government, regulator (who merits it), and customers.
Why the fuck should we bail them out again ?
Thames Water begs to be spared fines and costs warning bidders will walk away
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2025/mar/14/thames-water-asks-ofwat-to-be-spared-fines-costs
Thames Water is asking to be spared billions of pounds of costs and fines over the next five years and heap more on to bills so it can attract new investors, the Guardian can reveal.
The struggling water company is racing to find a buyer over the next eight weeks and is trying to persuade the regulator Ofwat to grant it significant leniency on penalties and extra costs, to attract bidders. That would mean customer bills rising by far more than the 35% it has been allowed...