What the late Queen really thought about Boris Johnson – politicalbetting.com

System

What the late Queen really thought about Boris Johnson – politicalbetting.com

These are revelations from my new book OUT, serialised in the Sunday Times. The first remark was made directly to a minister in Nov 2019. The second was relayed by a senior courtier to a cabinet minister at the Privy Council meeting after her death https://t.co/VoXvjibGrl

Read the full story here

DecrepiterJohnL

To be fair, she had met him.

FrankBooth

The question is whether she should have declined his request? Asking a lot of an ageing Monarch but in this instance I would say she should have.

state_go_away

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

DecrepiterJohnL

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

TheScreamingEagles

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

TheScreamingEagles

FrankBooth said:

The question is whether she should have declined his request? Asking a lot of an ageing Monarch but in this instance I would say she should have.

The Queen did not save us.

What she should have done is told the PM is that she would only grant prorogation if parliament voted for it.

It was clear that Boris Johnson did not command the majority of the House.

state_go_away

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

TheScreamingEagles

Hurrah, problems always get sorted when lawyers get involved.

Wall Street giants hire lawyers in Thames Water debt battle

Bank of America and JP Morgan have hired Simpson Thacher to represent them in the unfolding fight over the future of Britain's biggest water company, Sky News learns.

https://news.sky.com/story/wall-street-giants-hire-lawyers-in-thames-water-debt-battle-13251908

MattW

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

state_go_away

TheScreamingEagles said:

Hurrah, problems always get sorted when lawyers get involved.

Wall Street giants hire lawyers in Thames Water debt battle

Bank of America and JP Morgan have hired Simpson Thacher to represent them in the unfolding fight over the future of Britain's biggest water company, Sky News learns.

https://news.sky.com/story/wall-street-giants-hire-lawyers-in-thames-water-debt-battle-13251908

I know the USS pension scheme is massive but still surprised they are still supporting this crap investment in Thames Water

CatMan

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

TheScreamingEagles

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

state_go_away

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

expand?

malcolmg

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Done us up like kippers you mean

Eabhal

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

FrankBooth

TheScreamingEagles said:

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

They're both in the gutter but Johnson looks up at the stars.

HYUFD

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

noneoftheabove

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have refused to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

Did the rest of the conversation go like this:

All right, but apart from sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh-water system and public health, what has the EU ever done for us?
Brought peace?
Oh peace, shut up.

state_go_away

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

Pity the King did not refuse Starmer's request to give up the British Indian Ocean Territory - I assume he was asked

TheScreamingEagles

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

Pity the King did not refuse Starmer's request to give up the British Indian Ocean Territory - I assume he was asked

Charles revealed that he wanted to respond to the widespread fury about colonialism unleashed by the Black Lives Matter campaign, by acknowledging the evils of slavery. Johnson, despairing that even the monarchy had been captured by “woke” ideology, was blunt: “I wouldn’t talk about slavery if I were you, or you’ll end up having to sell the Duchy of Cornwall to pay reparations to the people who built the Duchy of Cornwall.”

When Johnson emerged from this encounter he told Guto Harri, his director of communications, “I went in quite hard.”

HYUFD

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

Pity the King did not refuse Starmer's request to give up the British Indian Ocean Territory - I assume he was asked

Maybe, I think the King though sees the UK's future as closer ties with Europe again ultimately rather than putting the Commonwealth and overseas territories first as his mother did. Remember his first state visit as King was to Germany and he only visited Australia, his first state visit as King to a Commonwealth realm, last month

DecrepiterJohnL

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

In practice, it is hard to imagine any monarch blocking the Prime Minister in that way, especially one willing to claim that the Cabinet was united on the matter.

HYUFD

DecrepiterJohnL said:

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

In practice, it is hard to imagine any monarch blocking the Prime Minister in that way, especially one willing to claim that the Cabinet was united on the matter.

If Parliament overall is opposed to the action it is, the PM and his Cabinet are only the King's chief and other ministers after all, supposed to represent Crown in Parliament. Since the Civil War and Glorious Revolution, Parliament has always been supreme over Crown

Malmesbury

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

Asking a question like that is a standard thing in philosophy - to define "why you believe in X?"

The biggest problem of the Remain campaign was not coming up with a pithy, positive answer to the question.

FrankBooth

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

Pity the King did not refuse Starmer's request to give up the British Indian Ocean Territory - I assume he was asked

Surely it has to go through Parliament?

StillWaters

Fpt

BlancheLivermore said:

MarqueeMark said:

BlancheLivermore said:

First glimpse of sun in ten days

And now, the moon is also visible.

Just the briefest band of blue sky here

For five minutes after the photo, the sun was blazing and warm, and the clouds were all in the distance. The world was in colour again

Five minutes more, and the colour had gone; every inch of the sky was gloomy and grey

We opened a beer to celebrate the sun. I didn't even get halfway through it

I spent the afternoon walking up to the Villa Jovis, contemplating Tiberius’s Leap and thinking about Elon Musk. In lovely sunny weather for November.

noneoftheabove

TheScreamingEagles said:

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

At least that puts one mass debate to bed. There is no way he could have pulled that off without a muscular physique.

Stark_Dawning

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

Nigelb

DecrepiterJohnL said:

To be fair, she had met him.

“It’s all muscle; from ear to ear.”

HYUFD

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

DecrepiterJohnL

HYUFD said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

HYUFD said:

I suspect the late Queen was a closet Leaver, remember the dinner she asked officials allegedly what the EU had done for us.

The King and Prince of Wales were almost certainly Remainers though, partly also reflecting the generational divide (the late Queen Mother was a rumoured UKIP supporter). I suspect Charles would have chosen not to prorogue Parliament as his mother did and refused Boris' request

In practice, it is hard to imagine any monarch blocking the Prime Minister in that way, especially one willing to claim that the Cabinet was united on the matter.

If Parliament overall is opposed to the action it is, the PM and his Cabinet are only the King's chief and other ministers after all, supposed to represent Crown in Parliament. Since the Civil War and Glorious Revolution, Parliament has always been supreme over Crown

If Parliament rejected it, surely the matter would not have reached the Palace.

state_go_away

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

No_Offence_Alan

state_go_away said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

expand?

He voted with Corbyn against May's Brexit deal.

Sunil_Prasannan

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

Didn't Farage go to the US too?

Nigelb

I approve this message.

Zelensky:
"We aren't ready to give our freedom to this fucking terrorist Putin".
https://x.com/JayinKyiv/status/1855565144052355550

state_go_away

Sunil_Prasannan said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

Didn't Farage got to the US too?

yes he did but at least he was shrewd enough to back the winning side

Fishing

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

That's the sort of thing the EU might do to try to influence us, in reverse, but Trump has plenty else on his plate. He doesn't think strategically, in policy terms, or about anyone except Trump. And Farage, though he occasionally pays court, doesn't have any real influence. So that scenario makes no sense.

FrankBooth

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

TheScreamingEagles

FrankBooth said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

They're both in the gutter but Johnson looks up at the stars.

Yes, talking about, inter alia, piccaninnies and tank topped bum boys is looking up at the stars.

TheScreamingEagles

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

FrankBooth

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrankBooth said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

They're both in the gutter but Johnson looks up at the stars.

Yes, talking about, inter alia, piccaninnies and tank topped bum boys is looking up at the stars.

I'm not defending him just pointing out that his own version of scruffiness was combined with social aspirations. Corbyn just wanted to make a virtue out of being a drop out.

HYUFD

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

Celtic fans, no surprise there

MarqueeMark

Do we have HM the Qs views on Truss organising her funeral?

Or indeed, on killing her?

carnforth

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrankBooth said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

They're both in the gutter but Johnson looks up at the stars.

Yes, talking about, inter alia, piccaninnies and tank topped bum boys is looking up at the stars.

I wonder if Oscar Wilde would have preferred Boris, who voted to repeal Section 28, or your pal Dave who voted to keep it.

Malmesbury

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

According to some people, accidentally putting a loaf of bread on your head on the anniversary of Kingsmill https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingsmill_massacre is free speech.

I remember making myself popular by asking if I put a picture of myself on social media, with a tin of black shoe polish on one shoulder and a tin of tan on the other, on the 21st November, would that be free speech as well?

state_go_away

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

they only show up themselves is my opinion - free speech can make people show themselves to be knobs as in this case -

TheScreamingEagles

carnforth said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

FrankBooth said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

MattW said:

What's the issue with bermuda shorts?

Did Churchill not used to give dictation in his bath with a glass of whisky?

Johnson made the most controversial decision of his premiership wearing a pair of Bermuda shorts, black work shoes and formal socks, his T-shirt damp with sweat.

He's a bigger scruff than Steptoe Corbyn.

They're both in the gutter but Johnson looks up at the stars.

Yes, talking about, inter alia, piccaninnies and tank topped bum boys is looking up at the stars.

I wonder if Oscar Wilde would have preferred Boris, who voted to repeal Section 28, or your pal Dave who voted to keep it.

Dave redeemed himself by introducing same sex marriage.

FrankBooth

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

Personally it's regrettable but I don't think it should be a crime unless they directly incite violence.

TheScreamingEagles

MarqueeMark said:

Do we have HM the Qs views on Truss organising her funeral?

Or indeed, on killing her?

I suspect she said something along the lines of 'That bloody Lib Dem republican.'

HYUFD

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

they only show up themselves is my opinion - free speech can make people show themselves to be knobs as in this case -

They are also arguably in breach of the Public Order Act. 'Section 5(1) provides:

"(1) A person is guilty of an offence if he/she:
(a) uses threatening [or abusive] words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour, or
(b) displays any writing, sign or other visible representation which is threatening [or abusive],
within the hearing or sight of a person likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress thereby."'

Nigelb

More than 60 years after moving to the U.S., Florida man discovers he’s not here legally
https://www.abcactionnews.com/news/state/more-than-60-years-after-moving-to-the-u-s-florida-man-discovers-hes-not-here-legally

There will be a lot of people like this.
Probably voted (illegally, as it turns out) Republican.

Will they be part of the deportation ?

state_go_away

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

HYUFD

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

MarqueeMark

Astonishing statistic from the Remembrance coverage. If the dead being remembered were to march past the Cenotaph three abreast, the back of the column would be...

...in Edinburgh.

FrancisUrquhart

MarqueeMark said:

Astonishing statistic from the Remembrance coverage. If the dead being remembered were to march past the Cenotaph three abreast, the back of the column would be...

...in Edinburgh.

At my school, they used to read out all the ex-pupils who died in wars. The reading of WWI, its just went on and on and on and on...in many cases, what seemed like all male members of families.

Theuniondivvie

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

MaxPB

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

DecrepiterJohnL

MarqueeMark said:

Do we have HM the Qs views on Truss organising her funeral?

Or indeed, on killing her?

Do we have Liz Truss's views on sidelining her rival Penny Mordaunt with the non-job of Leader of the Commons, only to see Mordaunt by some quirk of the constitution front and centre of HMQ's funeral and HMK's coronation?

FrankBooth

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

Let's face it, it's not really about trade deals. It's about whether he puts tariffs on stuff.

As I've said. The Iranians tried to assassinate him. Let's tell him we'll give all the intelligence support we can and lend a hand if he wants to go after the IRGC.

viewcode

Arizona Senate. Estimated 88 percent of votes have been counted.

Votes received and percentages of total vote
Candidate Votes Pct.
Ruben Gallego DEM 1,484,205 49.7
Kari Lake GOP 1,436,045 48.1
Eduardo Quintana GRN 63,582 2.1

Lead: 48,160

Malmesbury

FrancisUrquhart said:

MarqueeMark said:

Astonishing statistic from the Remembrance coverage. If the dead being remembered were to march past the Cenotaph three abreast, the back of the column would be...

...in Edinburgh.

At my school, they used to read out all the ex-pupils who died in wars. The reading of WWI, its just went on and on and on and on...in many cases, what seemed like all men members of families.

The big oak boards in the dining hall...

Someone to remember - https://www.londonremembers.com/memorials/fryatt-at-liverpool-street-station

FrankBooth

Theuniondivvie said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

There are plenty of things I personally dislike that I don't want to ban. I wish we could get back to that.

DecrepiterJohnL

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

The trouble with a US trade deal is what it has always been: widescale resistance to Frankenstein livestock. Trump would just see this as protectionism.

kle4

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

I'm highly skeptical 100 staffers or intemperate remarks by senior politicians make much difference at the end of the day. Trump is more volatile and potentially more personally motivated and manipulated than most Presidents, but if deals really would be sunk by that kind of thing they were not likely to happen regardless.

FrancisUrquhart

FrankBooth said:

Theuniondivvie said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

There are plenty of things I personally dislike that I don't want to ban. I wish we could get back to that.

David Cameron.....daylight is the best disinfectant.....its easy to spot the absolute dickheads.

kle4

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

they only show up themselves is my opinion - free speech can make people show themselves to be knobs as in this case -

They are also arguably in breach of the Public Order Act. 'Section 5(1) provides:

"(1) A person is guilty of an offence if he/she:
(a) uses threatening [or abusive] words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour, or
(b) displays any writing, sign or other visible representation which is threatening [or abusive],
within the hearing or sight of a person likely to be caused harassment, alarm or distress thereby."'

Ridiculously broad.

FrancisUrquhart

Malmesbury said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

MarqueeMark said:

Astonishing statistic from the Remembrance coverage. If the dead being remembered were to march past the Cenotaph three abreast, the back of the column would be...

...in Edinburgh.

At my school, they used to read out all the ex-pupils who died in wars. The reading of WWI, its just went on and on and on and on...in many cases, what seemed like all men members of families.

The big oak boards in the dining hall...

Someone to remember - https://www.londonremembers.com/memorials/fryatt-at-liverpool-street-station

Did we go to the same school !!!

MaxPB

DecrepiterJohnL said:

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

The trouble with a US trade deal is what it has always been: widescale resistance to Frankenstein livestock. Trump would just see this as protectionism.

I think there's circumstances where certain grades of meat could have restrictions eased but not all and that might placate the US agricultural lobby because they would still be able to access a $3tn economy with expensive and higher margin products.

Politically a UK/US trade deal is good for Trump and they might just push it through Congress with a few small concessions on meat.

Theuniondivvie

FrankBooth said:

Theuniondivvie said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

There are plenty of things I personally dislike that I don't want to ban. I wish we could get back to that.

For measuring consistency purposes, are there things you would like to ban?

FrankBooth

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

UK trade with the US is pretty good already and a trade deal takes years going through Congress. The obvious sticking points before were US Agriculture and the NHS. Has anything changed? The priority is avoiding tariffs.

Malmesbury

FrankBooth said:

Theuniondivvie said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

There are plenty of things I personally dislike that I don't want to ban. I wish we could get back to that.

Likewise.


A true victory is to make your enemy see they were wrong to oppose you in the first place. To force them to acknowledge your greatness.


And there are no statues to this man?

DecrepiterJohnL

MarqueeMark said:

Astonishing statistic from the Remembrance coverage. If the dead being remembered were to march past the Cenotaph three abreast, the back of the column would be...

...in Edinburgh.

Britain was the first nation to honour an unknown soldier as representative of all who fell. French streets were lined by children as the coffin passed by to be brought home on a destroyer escorted by three battleships.

Eabhal

FrankBooth said:

Theuniondivvie said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

There are plenty of things I personally dislike that I don't want to ban. I wish we could get back to that.

There are quite a few things I personally like but do want to ban. Pringles being a good example - once you pop...

MaxPB

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

I don't think this will make any difference. If anything Trump is probably very happy about the 100 Labour activists, it gave him the perfect little anti-globalist boost right at the end of the campaign to fire up activists.

bondegezou

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 Labour MPs did not go to the US. 100 Labour staffers did.

Richard_Tyndall

I am glad all this stuff is coming out and hope there is plenty more. Everything should be public. But I would also say that, even without any of these revelations, the chances of Johnson ever again getting anywhere near power were so vanishingly small as to make them completely irrelevant. He was and is a busted flush and of course lacks both the cult and the political structure that has helped Trump back into the Whitehouse.

Andy_JS

viewcode said:

Arizona Senate. Estimated 88 percent of votes have been counted.

Votes received and percentages of total vote
Candidate Votes Pct.
Ruben Gallego DEM 1,484,205 49.7
Kari Lake GOP 1,436,045 48.1
Eduardo Quintana GRN 63,582 2.1

Lead: 48,160

Looks like the Dems are likely to win.

MaxPB

FrankBooth said:

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

UK trade with the US is pretty good already and a trade deal takes years going through Congress. The obvious sticking points before were US Agriculture and the NHS. Has anything changed? The priority is avoiding tariffs.

A trade deal may be the only way to avoid the tariffs. US healthcare companies can already bid for NHS contracts so I don't think that's a barrier and Trump has previously said he thinks NICE should be replicated for Medicare and Medicaid to stop big pharma from ripping off the federal government so that probably won't be a barrier either.

Andy_JS

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

They should be allowed to do it, but should be regarded as idiots for doing so.

Richard_Tyndall

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

I disagree entirely. We neither need nor should want a trade deal with the US beyond what we already have - which curenlty means a substantial trade surplus with the US. We know from experience (both our own and the experience of others) that a trade deal with the US is a poisoned challice and we should waste no time nor effort in pursuing one.

DecrepiterJohnL

FrankBooth said:

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

UK trade with the US is pretty good already and a trade deal takes years going through Congress. The obvious sticking points before were US Agriculture and the NHS. Has anything changed? The priority is avoiding tariffs.

The odd thing about UK/US trade is that both sides' statistics show a trade surplus.

MaxPB

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

They should be allowed to have their moment and show the nation the kind of disgusting people they are supporting terrorists. The nasty face of the Scottish independence movement, let the rest of the country judge their behaviour. Unless they were calling for violence it was wrong to stop their protest.

bondegezou

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

UK exports to EU (2023): 41.3% + Switzerland 3.6%
UK exports to US: 22.1%

Imports:
EU 51.9% + Norway 3.4%
US 13.3%

Malmesbury

Andy_JS said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

They should be allowed to do it, but should be regarded as idiots for doing so.

The Right To Be A Twat

It will be in my constitution for the country, when I write it…

LostPassword

MarqueeMark said:

Do we have HM the Qs views on Truss organising her funeral?

Or indeed, on killing her?

I suspect that the Queen was expecting Truss to exceed expectations, or surprise on the upside. It's a blessing she didn't live to see what was to come.

Theuniondivvie

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

They should be allowed to have their moment and show the nation the kind of disgusting people they are supporting terrorists. The nasty face of the Scottish independence movement, let the rest of the country judge their behaviour. Unless they were calling for violence it was wrong to stop their protest.

You think the Green Brigade are part of the Indy movement?
Scotch expertise at its very finest!

MarqueeMark

Andy_JS said:

viewcode said:

Arizona Senate. Estimated 88 percent of votes have been counted.

Votes received and percentages of total vote
Candidate Votes Pct.
Ruben Gallego DEM 1,484,205 49.7
Kari Lake GOP 1,436,045 48.1
Eduardo Quintana GRN 63,582 2.1

Lead: 48,160

Looks like the Dems are likely to win.

For many Democrats, Lake winning would be more difficult to take than Trump's win. At least Lake losing means there is a limit to what MAGA can deliver.

HYUFD

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

Tories and Reform may well agree with you.

Starmer doesn't, hence as the Telegraph reports today his team are wargaming sanctions on US imports as his Labour government throws in its lot with the EU, Communist China and Lula's populist left Brazil in the coming trade war with Trump's US

MaxPB

Richard_Tyndall said:

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

I disagree entirely. We neither need nor should want a trade deal with the US beyond what we already have - which curenlty means a substantial trade surplus with the US. We know from experience (both our own and the experience of others) that a trade deal with the US is a poisoned challice and we should waste no time nor effort in pursuing one.

Our trade surplus comes from services exports to the US so I don't see how anything changes there. If anything we could do even better if there was equivalence in regulations agreed between both sides for data, tech, finance, AI etc... as we'd remove a big barrier for services exports and more US companies would be able to utilise the lower salary structure of the UK to hire loads of £60-150k roles.

On goods I'm not sure it will make a huge amount of difference, the public isn't really ready to accept US food. In the margins I think some premium US imports could do well but people who want parmesan will still buy Italian parmesan, people who want to make bread are still going to get the £1.20 1.5KG bread flour made from UK grain and it's not as though US agriculture is very competitive now, as we've all been discussing food prices are very high in the US so the structural advantage that US agriculture had last time this was being discussed has all but gone.

Sunil_Prasannan

My friend thinks Poppy Day is the epitome of virtue signalling.

Is he right?

MaxPB

I think what might be very interesting in the event of a UK/US trade deal is US companies in Ireland decamping to the UK especially now that Ireland's tax advantage has been hugely eroded by the ECJ.

There's potentially a big chunk of growth that we can grab very quickly with a trade deal.

viewcode

Malmesbury said:

FrankBooth said:

Theuniondivvie said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

The final word should go to Ally McCoist who in the space of a few months went from blasting Scotland fans for booing the national anthem to blasting the Hate Crime act for preventing (some hope) him and his pals singing about being up to their knees in Fenian blood.

That word is of course hypocrite.

There are plenty of things I personally dislike that I don't want to ban. I wish we could get back to that.

Likewise.


A true victory is to make your enemy see they were wrong to oppose you in the first place. To force them to acknowledge your greatness.


And there are no statues to this man?

Somewhat embarrasingly, I didn't have to look it up...

kle4

Sunil_Prasannan said:

My friend thinks Poppy Day is the epitome of virtue signalling.

Is he right?

To a degree. People virtue signal all the time through ceremonies and other actions, we signal virtues with how we express our views, and what views we express. Virtue signalling in itself is not an issue.

People who act like 14 year olds trying to be edgy when criticising such days, the 'decoloniser' lot etc, however, are poor at doing so.

MarqueeMark

Sunil_Prasannan said:

My friend thinks Poppy Day is the epitome of virtue signalling.

Is he right?

If you can't signal the virtue of those who died to keep us free from tyranny...

bondegezou

Sunil_Prasannan said:

My friend thinks Poppy Day is the epitome of virtue signalling.

Is he right?

If Robin Day had had a daughter instead of sons, he should have named her Poppy.

OldKingCole

MaxPB said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

Where to the pro free speech people stand on this?

Celtic fans sing pro-IRA songs as Remembrance Sunday tribute scrapped after nine seconds

Suspected Green Brigade members wave Irish and Palestinian flags in an act of defiance against Britain’s war dead

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2024/11/10/celtic-fans-remembrance-sunday-tribute-pro-ira-palestine/

They should be allowed to have their moment and show the nation the kind of disgusting people they are supporting terrorists. The nasty face of the Scottish independence movement, let the rest of the country judge their behaviour. Unless they were calling for violence it was wrong to stop their protest.

Nothing to do with Scottish independence; more to do with what happened in Ireland a century ago.

Malmesbury

FrancisUrquhart said:

Malmesbury said:

FrancisUrquhart said:

MarqueeMark said:

Astonishing statistic from the Remembrance coverage. If the dead being remembered were to march past the Cenotaph three abreast, the back of the column would be...

...in Edinburgh.

At my school, they used to read out all the ex-pupils who died in wars. The reading of WWI, its just went on and on and on and on...in many cases, what seemed like all men members of families.

The big oak boards in the dining hall...

Someone to remember - https://www.londonremembers.com/memorials/fryatt-at-liverpool-street-station

Did we go to the same school !!!

Every school from the old days seems to have in its dining room the boards from WWI and WWII.

MaxPB

bondegezou said:

MaxPB said:

HYUFD said:

state_go_away said:

FrankBooth said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

100 staff not MPs!!!!

And they went as volunteers. That happens all the time.

they did not back the winning side though and that is to the detriment of the UK - idiots for doing it in the first place

At the moment I suspect Trump would more likely do a trade deal with Modi's India or Netanyahu's Israel or Milei's Argentina before Starmer's UK

No I don't think so, the Trump team would very much like to cement Brexit in the UK and a favourable trade deal does that as then rejoining the EU has a very high price attached as we would lose the US trade deal. Starmer doesn't enter into the equation IMO, the US under Trump would very much like to drive a wedge between the UK and EU regardless of who the PM is, it is a very high risk double edged sword because there's potential for a really good trade deal to be done but it's going to be like trying to ride a tiger with Trump in charge and a US/UK trade deal also has great potential to piss off the EU and could make any rapprochement less likely.

In pure economic terms a US trade deal should be out priority as it would exempt us from tariffs and allow for our producers to export to a huge market that's bigger than the EU with favourable terms and where our national reputation is really high so receptiveness to UK exports is higher than in lots of EU countries.

UK exports to EU (2023): 41.3% + Switzerland 3.6%
UK exports to US: 22.1%

Imports:
EU 51.9% + Norway 3.4%
US 13.3%

We have a trade deal with the EU and were members of the EU for decades. Backwards looking figures don't necessarily predict the future. A trade deal with the US, an economy about 50% bigger and incredibly more integrated than the EU offers a big potential prize but there's obviously a lot of potential downsides too.

kle4

MarqueeMark said:

Andy_JS said:

viewcode said:

Arizona Senate. Estimated 88 percent of votes have been counted.

Votes received and percentages of total vote
Candidate Votes Pct.
Ruben Gallego DEM 1,484,205 49.7
Kari Lake GOP 1,436,045 48.1
Eduardo Quintana GRN 63,582 2.1

Lead: 48,160

Looks like the Dems are likely to win.

For many Democrats, Lake winning would be more difficult to take than Trump's win. At least Lake losing means there is a limit to what MAGA can deliver.

Yes, she's like Trump but with less charisma and where polling said she had no chance (whereas Trump always had a chance even in positive Dem predictions), a win there would be a blow.

For her, failing twice would hopefully see her star fade. Odious woman.

rcs1000

state_go_away said:

Sunil_Prasannan said:

state_go_away said:

HYUFD said:

Stark_Dawning said:

Eabhal said:

CatMan said:

state_go_away said:

TheScreamingEagles said:

DecrepiterJohnL said:

state_go_away said:

Got brexit done though didn't he ? Sometimes you just need to do something brave and different

Brave, different, unconstitutional in hiding the AG's advice from the Cabinet, and unlawful.

Indeed, it's a violation of the ministerial code, it was designed to ensure we didn't get a repeat of the Iraq war legal advice.

yeah maybe not upsetting the status quo is the important thing but then Saddam Hussein may still be in power (or Uday ) and Brexit still not done ( ie ignoring the largest turnout vote in many a year for Brexit)

One of the main obstacles to Brexit getting done during May's premiership was Boris Johnson.

Otoh, Johnson's comprehensive Brexit trade deal with the US will protect us from Trump's tarriffs.

Right?

It looks increasingly likely that Trump and Farage are laying a trap for Sir Keir. The UK will be offered exemptions from the tariffs only if we concede to various unacceptable demands - essentially that Farage will become Trump's viceroy of Britain with Sir Keir as little more than his puppet. When Sir Keir, rightly, refuses the economy will tank and Reform will win the next election anyway. That'll be the plan. And who's going to stop it?

As I posted last thread Starmer's government is already wargaming sanctions on US imports in response to tariffs imposed by Trump's administration.Though China, the EU and Brazil will be doing the same.

The Tories and Farage will want him to push a deal with the US but it seems Starmer will ignore them and take a gamble that with the EU and China alongside him he can resist Maga America First.

Of course the next UK general election will not be until the final year of Trump's administration in 2028 in which case the Democrats might be back in charge of Congress after the 2026 midterms or if 5 years and a full term maybe even after a Democrat has returned to the White House too

These things might have been easier to negotiate if Lammy could keep his gob shut about personal opinions about Trump and 100 labour mps did not go to the US to try and interfere in a foreign election

Didn't Farage got to the US too?

yes he did but at least he was shrewd enough to back the winning side

He also isn't a member of the government.