Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. Sign in or register to get started.

The State of the Union Week 2 – politicalbetting.com

245

Comments

  • Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    IanB2 said:

    Nigelb said:

    For somewhere like the US, this will be absolutely the case
    The UK's poorer insolation makes it a bit more complicated for us.

    What people don't get about solar power:

    The panels are SO CHEAP that we're going to basically have two separate electricity markets: almost free electricity during the day, and expensive electricity at night

    https://x.com/d_feldman/status/1833005212165968326

    I’ve been in the US two weeks now, and have yet to see a solar panel, other than little ones on roadside apparatus and the like. Whereas there are now a few quite big wind farms out in the Midwest.
    Installed wind capacity is around double that of solar, but is growing at less than 20% pa.
    Solar capacity is growing at around 75% pa.
    And accelerating.
  • IanB2 said:

    Nigelb said:

    For somewhere like the US, this will be absolutely the case
    The UK's poorer insolation makes it a bit more complicated for us.

    What people don't get about solar power:

    The panels are SO CHEAP that we're going to basically have two separate electricity markets: almost free electricity during the day, and expensive electricity at night

    https://x.com/d_feldman/status/1833005212165968326

    I’ve been in the US two weeks now, and have yet to see a solar panel, other than little ones on roadside apparatus and the like. Whereas there are now a few quite big wind farms out in the Midwest.
    We are starting to get that now in the UK; those sunny/windy days where energy companies pay consumers to take the electricity off them. As weather-powered generation increases, that's going to happen more often. (To be clear, this is a good thing, since it also implies more days where we don't have to burn any gas, which is a good way to metaphorically kick dodgy despots in their tiny dangly bits.)

    I think it's @rcs1000 who has suggested thinking of solar panels as reasonably cheap building materials that just happen to generate electricity as a bonus. That points to there being a lot of low-hanging energy fruit out there.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    2nd amendment rights...

    The man who opened fire and shot five people on a Kentucky highway today was out on bail after being arrested last month for making terrorist threats. According to police scanners, the suspect purchased an AR-15 and 2,000 rounds of ammo this morning...
    https://x.com/shannonrwatts/status/1832660565044711759
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,177
    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    I think the IQ level has gone down on PV today. The story is not that the government is spending 150 million to build x houses - its the start of a process to get lots of houses built.
  • Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    It doesn't mention them building the houses as such, more planning and setting out the bits between the houses. Which they may also stuff up as well, but it feels a bit early to give up just yet.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    I think the IQ level has gone down on PV today. The story is not that the government is spending 150 million to build x houses - its the start of a process to get lots of houses built.
    My bet Barrats say thanks for the bung, no extra houses get built
  • Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
    It's not even a start. You take no account of the scale of the issue. It's like throwing a tampon in to the Rhine and saying your going to stop the flow.

    Sheer despertion young Eagles.
  • SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 21,965

    "ITV’s Anushka Asthana says the Institute for Fiscal Studies has confirmed 100% take-up [of Pension Credit] would eliminate any [WFA] savings."

    Guardian blog.

    FFS.

    The people who most need the money would have it, rather than those using it for the deposit on a cruise.

    I'm intrigued by the likes of Unite prioritising the interests of wealthy pensioners ahead of those of their members.
  • Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    It doesn't mention them building the houses as such, more planning and setting out the bits between the houses. Which they may also stuff up as well, but it feels a bit early to give up just yet.
    Oh this is in no way a criticism of the plans. Just Barratts are the worst of a very bad bunch. The standard of modern housebuilding by the big developers is utterly appalling.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231

    IanB2 said:

    Wheatcroft:

    … how can we describe the present contest for the leadership of the Conservative party? Half a dozen toothless people squabbling over a toothbrush?

    Fourteen years on [from 1997], it’s not just that last July the Tories suffered their worst defeat since the Reform Act of 1832, which began the gradual process of democratisation: this time it feels different. Alan Duncan retired from parliament in 2019 after nearly three decades as a Conservative MP, holding ministerial office for much of the past decade. His verdict is bleak: “I think the Conservative party is in a far worse state than it was in 1997. It’s intellectually bankrupt; it’s pretty well financially bankrupt; it’s certainly reputationally bankrupt.”

    That last was maybe the crucial point. When Theresa May told the Tory conference in 2002 that the Conservatives were in danger of being seen as “the nasty party”, it was a misprision. No one had ever voted for the Tories because they were “nice”. Their selling proposition was competence, and that has now been utterly lost, to a point where it may be very difficult ever to recover it.

    To return, unenthusiastically, to this leadership contest, it demonstrates in itself the Tories’ plight. When this bedraggled band of Tory MPs whittles the number of candidates down to two, a last choice is made by the members. To which one might respond: what members, and what party? In the early 1950s, the Conservative and Unionist party had 2.8 million members, and was one of the great popular political movements in Europe. Not surprisingly the Tories are coy about the present figure of membership, but it appears to be about 170,000. This is a party heading for extinction.

    And yes, the government will screw up. Because they all do. And right now, the Lib Dems don't look to be large enough, in quite the right place to become the Real Opposition.

    But watching some of our right wing friends leap joyfully over Reeves's problems reminds me of every other time an opposition has said "we've really got them this time". Most times, you haven't.

    (And the fiscal NIMBYdom we are seeing is making me feel less well-disposed to the right wing press, the Conservative Party and the retired. I accept that I am unusual.)
    Not the sort of apologia you expected to be penning at this stage.
  • IanB2 said:

    Wheatcroft:

    … how can we describe the present contest for the leadership of the Conservative party? Half a dozen toothless people squabbling over a toothbrush?

    Fourteen years on [from 1997], it’s not just that last July the Tories suffered their worst defeat since the Reform Act of 1832, which began the gradual process of democratisation: this time it feels different. Alan Duncan retired from parliament in 2019 after nearly three decades as a Conservative MP, holding ministerial office for much of the past decade. His verdict is bleak: “I think the Conservative party is in a far worse state than it was in 1997. It’s intellectually bankrupt; it’s pretty well financially bankrupt; it’s certainly reputationally bankrupt.”

    That last was maybe the crucial point. When Theresa May told the Tory conference in 2002 that the Conservatives were in danger of being seen as “the nasty party”, it was a misprision. No one had ever voted for the Tories because they were “nice”. Their selling proposition was competence, and that has now been utterly lost, to a point where it may be very difficult ever to recover it.

    To return, unenthusiastically, to this leadership contest, it demonstrates in itself the Tories’ plight. When this bedraggled band of Tory MPs whittles the number of candidates down to two, a last choice is made by the members. To which one might respond: what members, and what party? In the early 1950s, the Conservative and Unionist party had 2.8 million members, and was one of the great popular political movements in Europe. Not surprisingly the Tories are coy about the present figure of membership, but it appears to be about 170,000. This is a party heading for extinction.

    And yes, the government will screw up. Because they all do. And right now, the Lib Dems don't look to be large enough, in quite the right place to become the Real Opposition.

    But watching some of our right wing friends leap joyfully over Reeves's problems reminds me of every other time an opposition has said "we've really got them this time". Most times, you haven't.

    (And the fiscal NIMBYdom we are seeing is making me feel less well-disposed to the right wing press, the Conservative Party and the retired. I accept that I am unusual.)
    Not the sort of apologia you expected to be penning at this stage.
    If you think that, you really don't have a clue.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    "ITV’s Anushka Asthana says the Institute for Fiscal Studies has confirmed 100% take-up [of Pension Credit] would eliminate any [WFA] savings."

    Guardian blog.

    FFS.

    The people who most need the money would have it, rather than those using it for the deposit on a cruise.

    I'm intrigued by the likes of Unite prioritising the interests of wealthy pensioners ahead of those of their members.
    Opposition for oppositions sake.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    Germany to reintroduce immigration checks on all land borders

    https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-border-controls-immigration-clampdown-police-check/
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162
    edited September 9

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    It doesn't mention them building the houses as such, more planning and setting out the bits between the houses. Which they may also stuff up as well, but it feels a bit early to give up just yet.
    Oh this is in no way a criticism of the plans. Just Barratts are the worst of a very bad bunch. The standard of modern housebuilding by the big developers is utterly appalling.
    I used to watch a YouTube account of a guy who snagged new build homes. He was kept busy. Had a broad welsh accent and used the word ‘shocking’ a fair bit. To be fair, with extremely good reason.

    I would never touch a new build. Utterly awful. That, and the Hate new build twitter feed has put me off.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    You're a right miserablist today, Alan.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    Hurrah

    The Princess of Wales says she has completed her chemotherapy and is focussed on staying cancer free.

    That’s good news.
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    Or do more than tiptoe in upstairs rooms.

    Actually, this is quite exciting policy-wise - I have been calling for new garden towns.

    What isn't so great is that it's Government hand in glove with their pals the vast developers. Whilst the pathetic EU nutrient neutrality laws that hold back existing projects already given planning permission (numbering over 100,000) that would have employed a great many smaller housebuilders are on permanent deep freeze.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    Nigelb said:

    For somewhere like the US, this will be absolutely the case
    The UK's poorer insolation makes it a bit more complicated for us.

    What people don't get about solar power:

    The panels are SO CHEAP that we're going to basically have two separate electricity markets: almost free electricity during the day, and expensive electricity at night

    https://x.com/d_feldman/status/1833005212165968326

    That very much depends on the location in the USA, surely - eg Minnesota is around 1/5 less than Florida on average for insolation, based on numbers for Direct Normal Irradiance (DNI).

    I'm not familiar with USA tariffs, but here the peak is teatime, not overnight - and relates as much to demand as it does supply. Plus there is a universal and also regional market for different tariffs, including much discount at night based on that being a time of low general demand.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    IanB2 said:

    On the Bear Creek trail…but didn’t see any bears


    I see the dog made it to Usonia without being detained.

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    It doesn't mention them building the houses as such, more planning and setting out the bits between the houses. Which they may also stuff up as well, but it feels a bit early to give up just yet.
    Oh this is in no way a criticism of the plans. Just Barratts are the worst of a very bad bunch. The standard of modern housebuilding by the big developers is utterly appalling.
    One of the upsides of this particular project being a relatively small one.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    edited September 9

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    It doesn't mention them building the houses as such, more planning and setting out the bits between the houses. Which they may also stuff up as well, but it feels a bit early to give up just yet.
    Oh this is in no way a criticism of the plans. Just Barratts are the worst of a very bad bunch. The standard of modern housebuilding by the big developers is utterly appalling.
    I don't know how good or bad Barratt are as Master Planners.

    Perhaps potential conflict of interest means they won't be able to build any of it? :smile:

    But ime they have a poor record of trying to use their heft to bully their risks onto other parties.
  • Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
    It's not even a start. You take no account of the scale of the issue. It's like throwing a tampon in to the Rhine and saying your going to stop the flow.

    Sheer despertion young Eagles.
    You’re just grumpy because he’s going to sell out Northern Ireland just like the Tories did.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/07/brexit-danger-starmer-dublin-ireland-visit-eu-sammy-wilson/
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    For somewhere like the US, this will be absolutely the case
    The UK's poorer insolation makes it a bit more complicated for us.

    What people don't get about solar power:

    The panels are SO CHEAP that we're going to basically have two separate electricity markets: almost free electricity during the day, and expensive electricity at night

    https://x.com/d_feldman/status/1833005212165968326

    That very much depends on the location in the USA, surely - eg Minnesota is around 1/5 less than Florida on average for insolation, based on numbers for Direct Normal Irradiance (DNI).

    I'm not familiar with USA tariffs, but here the peak is teatime, not overnight - and relates as much to demand as it does supply. Plus there is a universal and also regional market for different tariffs, including much discount at night based on that being a time of low general demand.
    The entire US energy demand could, in theory, be supplied by part of the Arizona desert.
    Regional rates make the prospect of that slightly less theoretical.
    Electricity arbitrage will get very interesting.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    Or do more than tiptoe in upstairs rooms.

    Actually, this is quite exciting policy-wise - I have been calling for new garden towns.

    What isn't so great is that it's Government hand in glove with their pals the vast developers. Whilst the pathetic EU nutrient neutrality laws that hold back existing projects already given planning permission (numbering over 100,000) that would have employed a great many smaller housebuilders are on permanent deep freeze.
    Look what happened when the Tories tried to do,something about it. Demented tweets from the RSPB and the very people who’d benefit from housebuilding happily putting the boot,in. Coz Tories innit.
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
    It's not even a start. You take no account of the scale of the issue. It's like throwing a tampon in to the Rhine and saying your going to stop the flow.

    Sheer despertion young Eagles.
    You’re just grumpy because he’s going to sell out Northern Ireland just like the Tories did.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/07/brexit-danger-starmer-dublin-ireland-visit-eu-sammy-wilson/
    Free the Six Counties 👍
  • KnightOutKnightOut Posts: 134
    Taz said:

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    It doesn't mention them building the houses as such, more planning and setting out the bits between the houses. Which they may also stuff up as well, but it feels a bit early to give up just yet.
    Oh this is in no way a criticism of the plans. Just Barratts are the worst of a very bad bunch. The standard of modern housebuilding by the big developers is utterly appalling.
    I used to watch a YouTube account of a guy who snagged new build homes. He was kept busy. Had a broad welsh accent and used the word ‘shocking’ a fair bit. To be fair, with extremely good reason.

    I would never touch a new build. Utterly awful. That, and the Hate new build twitter feed has put me off.

    We moved into a new build in 2010. It was brilliant and everything just worked. When something trivial did go wrong there were plenty of spare parts around to fix it literally seconds away on the development.

    My only regret is that we were renting, and that it was in a very safe Labour seat.

    Conversely the flat we bought (2nd owner so theoretically enough time for issues to be ironed out) has given us nothing but trouble. I suspect it hasn't increased in value at all in the past eight years. I do get the benefits of a Conservative MP though.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    edited September 9
    Nigelb said:

    2nd amendment rights...

    The man who opened fire and shot five people on a Kentucky highway today was out on bail after being arrested last month for making terrorist threats. According to police scanners, the suspect purchased an AR-15 and 2,000 rounds of ammo this morning...
    https://x.com/shannonrwatts/status/1832660565044711759

    In degree of boneheadedness in taking of reckless risks, that's a little like the one a fortnight ago where the 14-15 year old (iirc) shot 11 people at school, killing 4 of them, with the Armalite his dad had given him for his birthday then failed to secure away from Junior.
  • Taz said:

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
    It's not even a start. You take no account of the scale of the issue. It's like throwing a tampon in to the Rhine and saying your going to stop the flow.

    Sheer despertion young Eagles.
    You’re just grumpy because he’s going to sell out Northern Ireland just like the Tories did.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/07/brexit-danger-starmer-dublin-ireland-visit-eu-sammy-wilson/
    Free the Six Counties 👍
    Keep Britain British and Ireland Irish.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 12,720
    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,170
    IanB2 said:

    On the Bear Creek trail…but didn’t see any bears




    Hi dog. Nice to see you again.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    For somewhere like the US, this will be absolutely the case
    The UK's poorer insolation makes it a bit more complicated for us.

    What people don't get about solar power:

    The panels are SO CHEAP that we're going to basically have two separate electricity markets: almost free electricity during the day, and expensive electricity at night

    https://x.com/d_feldman/status/1833005212165968326

    That very much depends on the location in the USA, surely - eg Minnesota is around 1/5 less than Florida on average for insolation, based on numbers for Direct Normal Irradiance (DNI).

    I'm not familiar with USA tariffs, but here the peak is teatime, not overnight - and relates as much to demand as it does supply. Plus there is a universal and also regional market for different tariffs, including much discount at night based on that being a time of low general demand.
    The entire US energy demand could, in theory, be supplied by part of the Arizona desert.
    Regional rates make the prospect of that slightly less theoretical.
    Electricity arbitrage will get very interesting.
    One contrast with the UK is that Usonians use about 250% as much energy per head per annum as we do, or about 300% for electricity.

    That means that if they are going for all-electric and grid level storage, they have a lot more batteries to buy per head, all else being equal.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_energy_consumption_per_capita
    https://www.statista.com/statistics/383633/worldwide-consumption-of-electricity-by-country/
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316
    Nigelb said:

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    You're a right miserablist today, Alan.
    It never ceases to amaze me that our engineers on the board cant do basic maths, You know the scale of the problem, you understand the significance of leadtimes, workforce training and availability you recognise as key factors. Yet when it comes to some daft PR release you chuck common sense and experience out the window and start believing in Santa Claus.

    If you were starting this project today and had to manage it you wouldnt be optimistic you would hit the targets.
  • Andy_JSAndy_JS Posts: 32,170
    edited September 9
    "Germany announces temporary controls on all land borders

    BERLIN, Sept 9 (Reuters) - Germany's government announced temporary border controls at all of the country's land borders on Monday in what it called an attempt to tackle irregular migration and protect the public from threats such as Islamist extremism.
    The controls will start on Sept. 16 and initially last for six months, the interior ministry said in a statement.
    "We are strengthening internal security and continuing our hard line against irregular migration," Interior Minister Nancy Faeser said."

    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/germany-put-temporary-controls-all-land-borders-source-says-2024-09-09/
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    Nigelb said:

    MattW said:

    Nigelb said:

    For somewhere like the US, this will be absolutely the case
    The UK's poorer insolation makes it a bit more complicated for us.

    What people don't get about solar power:

    The panels are SO CHEAP that we're going to basically have two separate electricity markets: almost free electricity during the day, and expensive electricity at night

    https://x.com/d_feldman/status/1833005212165968326

    That very much depends on the location in the USA, surely - eg Minnesota is around 1/5 less than Florida on average for insolation, based on numbers for Direct Normal Irradiance (DNI).

    I'm not familiar with USA tariffs, but here the peak is teatime, not overnight - and relates as much to demand as it does supply. Plus there is a universal and also regional market for different tariffs, including much discount at night based on that being a time of low general demand.
    The entire US energy demand could, in theory, be supplied by part of the Arizona desert.
    Regional rates make the prospect of that slightly less theoretical.
    Electricity arbitrage will get very interesting.
    And all the advances in ultra long distance electricity transmission….
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
    It's not even a start. You take no account of the scale of the issue. It's like throwing a tampon in to the Rhine and saying your going to stop the flow.

    Sheer despertion young Eagles.
    You’re just grumpy because he’s going to sell out Northern Ireland just like the Tories did.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/07/brexit-danger-starmer-dublin-ireland-visit-eu-sammy-wilson/
    If Starmer can persuade the Paddies to take on a £15bn annual liability then good luck to him. As you are well aware nobody in the North does gratitude so that should fk up the RoI for the next century or so.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Filed in the drawer marked....pocketed bungs for big companies who fail to fulfill the promise.

    Explain for clarity to me how you think 150 mill is going to build hundreds of thousands of houses all of a sudden that they couldn't have built anyway ( size of barrats land bank 80,926 plots.). So what did labour give them 150 mill for exactly....they already have 10's of thousands of plots with planning permission they can build on.
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,360
    Andy_JS said:

    IanB2 said:

    On the Bear Creek trail…but didn’t see any bears




    Hi dog. Nice to see you again.
    Nice try but that's a bear.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316
    Taz said:

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    You do realise this is over 20 years.

    Wont even touch the sides,

    We need about another 20 of these.
    I know he’s a lawyer but he’s only been in office for only two months, give him a chance, this is a good start.
    It's not even a start. You take no account of the scale of the issue. It's like throwing a tampon in to the Rhine and saying your going to stop the flow.

    Sheer despertion young Eagles.
    You’re just grumpy because he’s going to sell out Northern Ireland just like the Tories did.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/07/brexit-danger-starmer-dublin-ireland-visit-eu-sammy-wilson/
    Free the Six Counties 👍
    Actually we want our 26 back.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    edited September 9

    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn

    A strange one. A Waily Mail story on 9 September reporting a public hearing held on 30 July with no identity of the woman testifying, or pictures of the alleged encampment on her front lawn.

    I blame Homer Simpson for all the immigrants having heard of Springfield, Ohio.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    MattW said:

    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn

    A strange one. A Waily Mail story on 9 September reporting a public hearing held on 30 July with no identity of the woman testifying, or pictures of the alleged encampment on her front lawn.

    I blame Homer Simpson for all the immigrants having heard of Springfield, Ohio.
    The story was picked up because the clip went viral on social media.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    edited September 9
    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703

    MattW said:

    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn

    A strange one. A Waily Mail story on 9 September reporting a public hearing held on 30 July with no identity of the woman testifying, or pictures of the alleged encampment on her front lawn.

    I blame Homer Simpson for all the immigrants having heard of Springfield, Ohio.
    The story was picked up because the clip went viral on social media.
    I saw the "Haitian Immigrants in Springfield" story covered a few weeks ago, as part of following POTUS election coverage.

    I think it was one of the elements of the JD Vance VP-designate coverage, as he is from close to there (50 miles, which is chip shop distance in the USA), and it is in his area represented as Senator.
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Harris is proposing smaller tax rises than was Biden. Calling her 'communist' is ridiculous.

    Does 'equity' really violate deeply held notions of freedom ? Do they really want, for example, the outcome of a traffic stop to depend on the colour of the driver's skin ?
  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    Taz said:

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    Or do more than tiptoe in upstairs rooms.

    Actually, this is quite exciting policy-wise - I have been calling for new garden towns.

    What isn't so great is that it's Government hand in glove with their pals the vast developers. Whilst the pathetic EU nutrient neutrality laws that hold back existing projects already given planning permission (numbering over 100,000) that would have employed a great many smaller housebuilders are on permanent deep freeze.
    Look what happened when the Tories tried to do,something about it. Demented tweets from the RSPB and the very people who’d benefit from housebuilding happily putting the boot,in. Coz Tories innit.
    Well they didn’t try terribly hard. It got knocked back by the Lords and Gove promptly caved. Even when all the groundwork of buying off the Environment Agency was done. He became a very compromised supine creature late in his political career.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317
    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    The government want to kill off the 'strategic land' industry by taking the land value uplift. This leaves the question of who promotes the land (ie takes it through the planning system), for which there is a significant cost/risk.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    edited September 9
    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
  • TazTaz Posts: 14,162

    Taz said:

    Hurrah, like lawyers, life gets better when bankers get involved.

    Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.

    Building giant Barratt Developments has teamed up with Lloyds Banking Group to build thousands of new homes in a joint venture led by Homes England, the government body responsible for housebuilding.

    The scheme, known as the Made Partnership, will act as master developer for new residential developments ranging from 1,000 homes to more than 10,000 which will be built across the UK.


    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2024/09/09/angela-rayner-150m-barratt-garden-towns/

    Its a great idea and encouraging. Just a shame it is Barratts. Chances are most of the houses will be unliveable until massive amounts of snagging and making good have been completed. Just warn the prospective buyers not to lean against any of the walls.
    Or do more than tiptoe in upstairs rooms.

    Actually, this is quite exciting policy-wise - I have been calling for new garden towns.

    What isn't so great is that it's Government hand in glove with their pals the vast developers. Whilst the pathetic EU nutrient neutrality laws that hold back existing projects already given planning permission (numbering over 100,000) that would have employed a great many smaller housebuilders are on permanent deep freeze.
    Look what happened when the Tories tried to do,something about it. Demented tweets from the RSPB and the very people who’d benefit from housebuilding happily putting the boot,in. Coz Tories innit.
    Well they didn’t try terribly hard. It got knocked back by the Lords and Gove promptly caved. Even when all the groundwork of buying off the Environment Agency was done. He became a very compromised supine creature late in his political career.
    Yup. Folded like a pack of cards at the first sign of trouble.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 22,703
    Nice to see the Beeboids still covering the crucial issues of the day:

    "Is it classist to stop Geordies using the term of endearment 'pet'?"
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m0022cpg
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 49,586
    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    Large company that depends on controlling scarcity of its product, does deal to be in control of product supply with government.

    In related news - Mr Vlad Tepes of Transylvania signs deal to manage blood supplies for the NHS. Cites domain expertise.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    As a general thing I think we should stop lauding politicians for announcing initiatives and take a cynical attitude because mostly its all fart and no follow through. If Labour manages to build 1.5 million houses I will be the first to applaud.

    Till they actually do however they deserve no plaudit's for announcing stuff and bunging money at initiatives because lets face it is not like history shows us its easy to make announcements....levelling up, immigration down to 10s of thousand, building 1.5 million houses in 5 years.

    When it happens then its time to say well done, not when some scheme is announced. We would all be better being more cynical about these things and show politicians if they want to reap the benefit they have to actually achieve
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480
    edited September 9

    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn

    To Quote the article:

    "Willing to do the blue-collar jobs locals were unenthusiastic about, the Haitians, who were already in the country legally, moved to the town.

    At a city commission meeting, furious locals used the forum to voice their feelings about the Haitians, making several wild claims in the process.

    Within a few years, 20,000 immigrants arrived, swelling Springfield's population, which was only 58,000 in 2020.

    The Haitians had social security numbers and job permits, paid taxes, and lived in houses that were empty and boarded up as the town shrank."

    So it sounds like a property dispute between legal residents.

  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317
    edited September 9
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
  • Nigelb said:

    2nd amendment rights...

    The man who opened fire and shot five people on a Kentucky highway today was out on bail after being arrested last month for making terrorist threats. According to police scanners, the suspect purchased an AR-15 and 2,000 rounds of ammo this morning...
    https://x.com/shannonrwatts/status/1832660565044711759

    Jimmy Carr joke on why you'd need an AR-15 assault rifle, 40 seconds in:-
    https://www.youtube.com/shorts/3tAPe1vbqC8
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,316
    edited September 9
    Pagan2 said:

    As a general thing I think we should stop lauding politicians for announcing initiatives and take a cynical attitude because mostly its all fart and no follow through. If Labour manages to build 1.5 million houses I will be the first to applaud.

    Till they actually do however they deserve no plaudit's for announcing stuff and bunging money at initiatives because lets face it is not like history shows us its easy to make announcements....levelling up, immigration down to 10s of thousand, building 1.5 million houses in 5 years.

    When it happens then its time to say well done, not when some scheme is announced. We would all be better being more cynical about these things and show politicians if they want to reap the benefit they have to actually achieve

    It's spin .

    We built about 1,2 million houses in the last 5 years. So Starmer is only proposing another 300k new builds. In reality we need 1.5 million houses in the next 5 years on top of the 1.2 million we already build if it is to have any impact.

  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    Foxy said:

    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn

    To Quote the article:

    "Willing to do the blue-collar jobs locals were unenthusiastic about, the Haitians, who were already in the country legally, moved to the town.

    At a city commission meeting, furious locals used the forum to voice their feelings about the Haitians, making several wild claims in the process.

    Within a few years, 20,000 immigrants arrived, swelling Springfield's population, which was only 58,000 in 2020.

    The Haitians had social security numbers and job permits, paid taxes, and lived in houses that were empty and boarded up as the town shrank."

    So it sounds like a property dispute between legal residents.

    Legal = it's the Biden adminstration's policy.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/biden-admin-gives-protected-status-309000-haitians-rcna159438

    Biden administration gives temporary protected status to 309,000 more Haitian migrants
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 48,480

    Foxy said:

    The Democrats still have an uphill battle:

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13828455/Woman-forced-home-45-years-Haitian-Immigrants-Springfield-Ohio-squatters.html

    Woman is forced out of her Springfield home of 45 years after migrants began squatting on her lawn

    To Quote the article:

    "Willing to do the blue-collar jobs locals were unenthusiastic about, the Haitians, who were already in the country legally, moved to the town.

    At a city commission meeting, furious locals used the forum to voice their feelings about the Haitians, making several wild claims in the process.

    Within a few years, 20,000 immigrants arrived, swelling Springfield's population, which was only 58,000 in 2020.

    The Haitians had social security numbers and job permits, paid taxes, and lived in houses that were empty and boarded up as the town shrank."

    So it sounds like a property dispute between legal residents.

    Legal = it's the Biden adminstration's policy.

    https://www.nbcnews.com/investigations/biden-admin-gives-protected-status-309000-haitians-rcna159438

    Biden administration gives temporary protected status to 309,000 more Haitian migrants
    If they have been squatting 45 years then it's Reagan not Biden who let them in.
  • VerulamiusVerulamius Posts: 1,539
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,125

    Germany to reintroduce immigration checks on all land borders

    https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-border-controls-immigration-clampdown-police-check/

    Germany already has "immigration checks" on its borders with Poland, Austria Czechia and Switzerland. Whether there will be more than a rare spot check on people driving from the Netherlands to Germany I find pretty doubtful.
  • eekeek Posts: 28,077
    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/about/

    Barratts major projects leads the project and seemingly provide all the staff.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
    Looked at the page nowhere does it mention new sources of land....try again
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 122,276
    CBS/Yougov

    Wisconsin Harris 51% Trump 49%

    Michigan Harris 50% Trump 49%

    Pennsylvania Harris 50% Trump 50%
    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/harris-trump-poll-pennsylvania-michigan-wisconsin-debate/
  • algarkirkalgarkirk Posts: 12,360

    Pagan2 said:

    As a general thing I think we should stop lauding politicians for announcing initiatives and take a cynical attitude because mostly its all fart and no follow through. If Labour manages to build 1.5 million houses I will be the first to applaud.

    Till they actually do however they deserve no plaudit's for announcing stuff and bunging money at initiatives because lets face it is not like history shows us its easy to make announcements....levelling up, immigration down to 10s of thousand, building 1.5 million houses in 5 years.

    When it happens then its time to say well done, not when some scheme is announced. We would all be better being more cynical about these things and show politicians if they want to reap the benefit they have to actually achieve

    It's spin .

    We built about 1,2 million houses in the last 5 years. So Starmer is only proposing another 300k new builds. In reality we need 1.5 million houses in the next 5 years on top of the 1.2 million we already build if it is to have any impact.

    That won't help as much as it seems. On realistic projections, UK population now is about 67m, and in 2030 will be 69-70m. Another 1.5 million homes will help but not do hugely more than cope with the increase.

    There is also a particular need for vastly more social housing.

    I have no idea what this government's policy and strategy is on net migration. I know that the last government's policy was simple but hard to implement: they were in favour of both reducing it and increasing it. Has there been a change?
  • kamskikamski Posts: 5,125
    Mortimer said:

    On topic, as I've been cautioning for weeks, Trump's far from out of this.

    Harris's 'not Biden' bounce is trailing off...

    Interesting mixed metaphor or maybe bounces do trail off? Harris has gone from being 0.4% ahead on the 25th July, to a peak of 3.7% ahead on the 23rd August down to 2.8% ahead now (538 averages). It's a pretty shallow kind of bounce.
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    The poll shows Trump only leading with men by 5 points and Harris only by 2 with women . Which looks very questionable.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    edited September 9
    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
    Looked at the page nowhere does it mention new sources of land....try again
    How do you interpret the words, "Land Requirements. We are seeking new opportunities", which then goes on to list the types of land they are looking for and the ways they would work with these landowners?
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    edited September 9
    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
    Looked at the page nowhere does it mention new sources of land....try again
    How do interpret the words, "Land Requirements. We are seeking new opportunities", which then goes on to list the types of land they are looking for and the ways they would work with these landowners?
    Those words do not exist on that page and even if they did I certainly wouldn't interpret them as a source of new land
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    The NYT Siena poll showed a lot of undecideds among 'independent' voters.

    They will be repeating the same poll after the debate.
    While I don't trust the absolute numbers in any given poll - there's just too much possibility of sampling error, given the confounding factors - it might be instructive to see what movement there is in the next poll.
  • pigeonpigeon Posts: 4,813

    "ITV’s Anushka Asthana says the Institute for Fiscal Studies has confirmed 100% take-up [of Pension Credit] would eliminate any [WFA] savings."

    Guardian blog.

    FFS.

    The people who most need the money would have it, rather than those using it for the deposit on a cruise.

    I'm intrigued by the likes of Unite prioritising the interests of wealthy pensioners ahead of those of their members.
    I think what underlies the bellyaching from the unions isn't so much a compulsion to butter up oldies at every opportunity (although there is far too much of that,) but rather that they've seen the chance to critique the basis of Reeves' approach to managing the economy, which is basically yet more austerity rather than redistribution from the wealthy to the hard up. "Why are you stealing sweeties from granny but leaving plutocrats to fit out their mansions with solid gold taps entirely undisturbed?" is the general thrust of the argument.

    I've a lot of sympathy with the notion that the genuinely rich are let off way too lightly. With the whining of the pensioner lobby, less so. That said, I've no particular objection to the Government exempting more elderly on modest incomes from this cut - provided that the additional funding that will be needed to offset such measures is extracted from the wallets of the better off olds - rather than being taken from everybody else through yet more tax rises and spending cuts that, like the original sin of the triple lock, are custom built to featherbed the aged through continually fucking over the rest of the population.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,208
    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
    Looked at the page nowhere does it mention new sources of land....try again
    How do interpret the words, "Land Requirements. We are seeking new opportunities", which then goes on to list the types of land they are looking for and the ways they would work with these landowners?
    Those words do not exist on that page and even if they did I certainly wouldn't interpret them as a source of new land
    I copied and pasted from that page.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190
    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    edited September 9
    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    Pagan2 said:

    FF43 said:

    MattW said:

    FF43 said:

    TimS said:

    Pagan2 said:

    TimS said:

    “Angela Rayner, the Housing Secretary, has struck a £150m deal with Britain’s biggest housebuilder to build a string of new garden towns and villages across the country as ministers seek to ramp up their ambitious housing plans.”

    Isn’t £150m more like a few streets rather than a string of new garden towns an villages?




    Yup - it's almost certainly the government offering to smooth the path for the developers. Who will remain in control of project. Especially the rate of completion....
    Though the press release talks about MADE being the master developer;

    A master developer is responsible for overseeing and managing the development of large-scale projects, taking responsibility for the overall vision and strategy, and coordinating the wide range of stakeholders involved. It assembles the land, manages the planning, installs the primary and community infrastructure, disposes of serviced parcels of land to developers, and ensures robust long-term stewardship is put in place.

    https://www.barrattdevelopments.co.uk/media/media-releases/pr-2024/pr-09-09-2024-made-partnership

    There's a potential conflict of interest, but maybe... just maybe... they're going to get it right.
    More evidence that government ministers read PB:

    Alanbrooke
    Alanbrooke Posts: 25,070
    7:52AM
    Any houses being built ? New towns founded ?


    150 mill is 1000 not very big houses.....more like a new hamlet founded than a new town
    150 mil isn’t the amount being spent on the houses, it’s the amount being spent to set up the venture. The plan is to build tens or hundreds of thousands of units.
    Their service according to their website to owners of large areas of land suitable for housing: prepare a master plan, get the planning consents, sort out services and utilities and parcel out the land to various developers..
    I wonder if the Barratt take here is to pivot away from making their money from exploitation of planning gain land value inflation, as they know this is on the menu of potential revenue sources for the Government.
    Interesting thing is the purpose of this venture is to bring on new sources of land which could potentially depress the value of land held speculatively and which depends on shortage.
    Source link supporting that?

    "Barratt said the partnership, called MADE Partnership, will act as master developer for multiple large-scale, residential-led developments from 1,000 to more than 10,000 homes in both new and existing communities."

    No mention of new sources of land...oh look they already have 80k plots with planning permission, at best this seems like I bribe to use them

    coincidence maybe just after they announced this a mere 6 weeks or so ago

    https://news.sky.com/story/biggest-housebuilder-barratt-cuts-target-just-as-labour-promises-more-homes-13175928
    https://madepartnership.co.uk/partnership-offer/
    Looked at the page nowhere does it mention new sources of land....try again
    How do interpret the words, "Land Requirements. We are seeking new opportunities", which then goes on to list the types of land they are looking for and the ways they would work with these landowners?
    Those words do not exist on that page and even if they did I certainly wouldn't interpret them as a source of new land
    I copied and pasted from that page.
    Well ctrl f on the page shows no instance of the word requirement, quote the section and even if you could it wouldn't matter because as I said it doesn't imply a new source of land, could as easily be already landbanked land they are going to acquire from another company
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848

    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!

    Judging people on their appearance is the root of bigotry just saying.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
    The point Vance was making in the speech was in support of security at schools. Not that 'kids should accept being shot at'. He does have a solution, just one that you are not giving any weight to, because it does not accord with your belief in more gun controls.

    But in the end, what you or I believe about gun control doesn't matter. The point is that you and many other people on this website appear to be commenting on this election as a participant in propaganda.

  • Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 28,231
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
    As I recall, J D Vance's quote was part of a call for more armed security in schools - that is not doing nothing, albeit that it is a solution that you (using your extensive knowledge and experience on the topic no doubt) don't agree with. So the Tweet you've provided is absolutely a dishonest misrepresentation of his stance, and if you want to pump out such bilge, may I suggest you do so to some people with an actual vote, who are currently planning on voting for Trump. Do let us know how you get on.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,190
    Pagan2 said:

    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!

    Judging people on their appearance is the root of bigotry just saying.
    No, you are quite right. What about the fighting in the car park outside MaccieDs?
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848

    Pagan2 said:

    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!

    Judging people on their appearance is the root of bigotry just saying.
    No, you are quite right. What about the fighting in the car park outside MaccieDs?
    Across the globe fights happen in such car parks. Unless you were pulled unwilling to the altercation then its part of urban living round the world. Arseholes are everywhere
  • NigelbNigelb Posts: 70,513
    edited September 9
    darkage said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
    The point Vance was making in the speech was in support of security at schools. Not that 'kids should accept being shot at'. He does have a solution, just one that you are not giving any weight to, because it does not accord with your belief in more gun controls.

    But in the end, what you or I believe about gun control doesn't matter. The point is that you and many other people on this website appear to be commenting on this election as a participant in propaganda.

    Says the guy who called Harris a communist.

    Well known Democratic propaganda rag.

    School shootings are just a fact of life, says JD Vance
    Republican nominee for vice-president says better security, not gun control, is how to stop school massacres like this week in Georgia
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2024/09/06/school-shootings-fact-of-life-jd-vance-us-election-georgia/
  • nico679nico679 Posts: 6,200
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
    The point Vance was making in the speech was in support of security at schools. Not that 'kids should accept being shot at'. He does have a solution, just one that you are not giving any weight to, because it does not accord with your belief in more gun controls.

    But in the end, what you or I believe about gun control doesn't matter. The point is that you and many other people on this website appear to be commenting on this election as a participant in propaganda.

    Says the guy who called Harris a communist.

    Well known Democratic propaganda rag.

    School shootings are just a fact of life, says JD Vance
    Republican nominee for vice-president says better security, not gun control, is how to stop school massacres like this week in Georgia
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/us/politics/2024/09/06/school-shootings-fact-of-life-jd-vance-us-election-georgia/
    Schools aren’t supposed to be war zones . Republicans care more about wanking over their gun collection than the lives of children . What a truly despicable bunch .
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,317
    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
    The point Vance was making in the speech was in support of security at schools. Not that 'kids should accept being shot at'. He does have a solution, just one that you are not giving any weight to, because it does not accord with your belief in more gun controls.

    But in the end, what you or I believe about gun control doesn't matter. The point is that you and many other people on this website appear to be commenting on this election as a participant in propaganda.

    Says the guy who called Harris a communist.
    I said Harris was being misrepresented as a communist, but noted that her past videos about 'equity' make it challenging for her to rebut. I would also speculate that, in the context of a propaganda war, this line of attack (Harris is a communist) is likely to be more influential on the part of undecided voters than obviously absurd misrepresentations about what Vance has said about school shootings.

  • dixiedeandixiedean Posts: 29,342

    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!

    Chin up and make yourself useful. Paul Simon made a career and a fortune out of his desire to be away from Widnes.
    What's more it's solid middle class compared to Ashington.
  • Pagan2Pagan2 Posts: 9,848
    edited September 9
    dixiedean said:

    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!

    Chin up and make yourself useful. Paul Simon made a career and a fortune out of his desire to be away from Widnes.
    What's more it's solid middle class compared to Ashington.
    In my experience the danger usually comes not from the heavily tattooed and pierced, the wierd hair and the leather clad but the clean cut dressed in designer clothing in any case. I drank most of my life in biker bars, trouble was exceptionally rare...pubs with dress codes were the ones that the trouble spilt from on a saturday night
  • On topic - It should be noted that ElectoralVote give a headline figure but they have always (at least since I started following them in 2012) stressed that the figure of votes beyond the margin of error is the defining one. That has both candidates on around 210 with the rest unclear.

    Meanwhile on state polls the figure to look for on averages is 50%. Since 2008 no candidate has lost a state where they averaged 50% in polls during the previous month. That includes the results in the 'Blue Wall' in 2016 and in Georgia in 2020.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 13,585
    dixiedean said:

    F*** me!

    I'm in Widnes tonight, anyone know where I can get an after hours tat to blend in?

    I was less nervous when a hooker I had declined pulled a knife on me in Ikeja Island, Lagos, and a Nairobi taxi driver wanted to pick up his mate between the Nairobi Club and the Lillian Towers hotel. The Toby Inn in Widnes is far, far scarier. Presumably this national decline is post July 4th.

    You Northerners really are brave!

    Chin up and make yourself useful. Paul Simon made a career and a fortune out of his desire to be away from Widnes.
    What's more it's solid middle class compared to Ashington.
    I was in Widnes last week. Took the kids ice skating, followed by a Nando's.
    You do notice a certain 'type' there, especially among young females. It's being in the outer orbit of Liverpool that does it. Liverpool's women have very much their own views on how to present themselves.
  • StillWatersStillWaters Posts: 8,095

    "ITV’s Anushka Asthana says the Institute for Fiscal Studies has confirmed 100% take-up [of Pension Credit] would eliminate any [WFA] savings."

    Guardian blog.

    FFS.

    But the spend would be much better targeted
  • williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 51,320
    https://x.com/iapolls2022/status/1833215926679806266

    🇺🇲 National poll by @pewresearch


    🟦 Kamala Harris: 49%
    🟥 Donald Trump: 49%

    August 11 poll 🔵 Harris +1
    ——
    • White: Trump 56-42%
    • Black: Harris 84-13%
    • Hispanic: Harris 57-39%
    • Asian: Harris 61-37%
    ---
    • Male: Trump 52-46%
    • Female: Harris 52-46%
  • mercatormercator Posts: 815
    darkage said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:


    Nigelb said:

    darkage said:

    darkage said:

    DavidL said:

    The big momentum for Harris has clearly petered out. She has more money, more offices, more volunteers and is getting more of the new registrations and yet, somehow, Trump is edging back.

    The suggestion I have read is that pollsters generally did make changes to their weighting after underestimating Trump in 2016 and 2020 but have they overdone it and are we comparing like with like when Harris seems at least as far behind as Clinton and nowhere near where Biden was in 2020?

    Its tight. I was reluctant to believe that for a time, now I am kinda hoping for it.

    Harris has only just entered and hasn't said very much, definitely hasn't really been tested. So the situation is likely to be a lot more volatile than any other comparable presidential election. It could go well for her or it could go very badly.

    I don't follow the election in the same level of details as others posting on this website, but I would observe that Trump has been making efforts to appeal to 'centrists', ie with the Kennedy and Musk endorsements, and by going on the Lex Fridman podcast, and driving the idea that this is actually a 'coalition to save America', which is quite a big change in strategy and something that might be influencing the improvement in the polls.
    I read a poll finding somewhere this morning that indicated that Americans view Trump as less extreme than Harris.
    All the 'Communist Harris' shit that's being thrown at her.

    Which is odd, as she isn't in any way Communist, whilst it's easy to argue that Trump has at least some fascist traits to him.

    America's fucked.
    “Equitable treatment means we all end up at the same place.”

    https://x.com/kamalaharris/status/1322963321994289154
    That isn't Communism though, is it? Far from, in fact.
    Why far from it?
    https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm
    She even borrows directly from his argument that "equality" entrenches the bourgeoisie.
    Yeah, right. How about all the rest of it?

    Harris's views are not exactly remarkable for (say) a European perspective for centre-left (or even some centre-right) people.

    But I see you also ignore the Trump veering towards Fascism point. To help you:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Definitions_of_fascism#Umberto_Eco

    (I'm not saying Trump matches all of these, but he does match a worrying number of them.)
    Harris got well in to the 'woke' era around 2020 including stuff like this. It is all up there online. 'Equity' is a vague concept but in these illustrations suggests equality of outcome which violates deeply held American notions of freedom, free enterprise, self determination etc. In all seriousness I think it could be determinative in relation to the election - ie it is being used by Trump as evidence of 'communism' which is quite hard for her to rebut.

    My point earlier was that Biden always steered well away from this stuff and it is off putting for lots of voters who are sceptical of DEI stuff.
    Another example of 'equity' versus 'freedom' in the context of the election.

    So Tim Walz believe kids should be fed at school so they can learn better and JD Vance believes kids should accept being shot at school as a "fact of life."
    Vote accordingly.

    https://x.com/VABVOX/status/1832532091088588824
    This post (the one on Twitter) is an example of the prevailing low quality political discourse.
    The 'liberals' are misrepresenting Vance as someone who supports school shootings, in the same way that the other side misrepresent Harris as a communist.
    Both Vance and Harris lack the political skill to avoid this, because they provide the source material in the first place.
    I don't think it is 'equity' vs 'freedom', it is just an exchange of propaganda.
    No they aren't. Only on imbecile would believe that.
    They are pointing out that Vance says it's an unfortunate reality Republicans won't do anything about.
    Only one of the two parties favours gun control; the other is a strong supporter of a maximalist interpretation of the Second Amendment and has legislated and appointed judges accordingly, for at least the last two decades.

    It's not dishonest to quote Vance, selectively or not, to reinforce that point.
    The point Vance was making in the speech was in support of security at schools. Not that 'kids should accept being shot at'. He does have a solution, just one that you are not giving any weight to, because it does not accord with your belief in more gun controls.

    But in the end, what you or I believe about gun control doesn't matter. The point is that you and many other people on this website appear to be commenting on this election as a participant in propaganda.

    Says the guy who called Harris a communist.
    I said Harris was being misrepresented as a communist, but noted that her past videos about 'equity' make it challenging for her to rebut. I would also speculate that, in the context of a propaganda war, this line of attack (Harris is a communist) is likely to be more influential on the part of undecided voters than obviously absurd misrepresentations about what Vance has said about school shootings.
    You have to understand that Usonians are weird about commies and anything hinting at communism. You say on a US heavy MTB site that at least the NHS will patch me up after a crash, you quickly learn how much better it is to die because you can't make the Land of the Free co-pay than have your life saved by "socialized medicine."

This discussion has been closed.