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Trigger points for Sunak – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 12,213
edited April 28 in General
Trigger points for Sunak – politicalbetting.com

Blackpool South inFocus.A Parliamentary by-election will be held here on May 2nd.What do voters here think of Sunak and Starmer?What do they think the major parties stand for?What do politicians in Westminster not understand about Blackpool?https://t.co/FWKVe1u3b0 pic.twitter.com/e9Lm5H8suH

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Comments

  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    That does seem possible. An interesting dilemma for those who would succeed Sunak as Prime Minister: get too involved in the Blackpool campaign and you risk being tarred by the same brush; spend three weeks at the dentist and you lose credibility.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    edited April 10
    The Blackpool vox pop video in the header will be mildly encouraging for Rishi, at least on a personal basis, and disappointing for Starmer.
    https://redfieldandwiltonstrategies.com/infocus/blackpool-south/
    https://vimeo.com/932479720
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,457
    Yesterday, ULA successfully launched the final Delta IV Heavy rocket. This was the last launch of any of the Delta family of rockets, which has been going into space since 1960.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_(rocket_family)

    Quite a history.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    Good morning all, Eid Mubarak!
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,721

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    I’d be surprised if 1946-47 was a better harvest than this one is going to be and that’s ‘since the Second World War.’

    But yes, it’s clearly going to be a terrible year for agriculture and it’s about the fifth in a row as well.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    Cass Review has released its final report.

    https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/CassReview_Final.pdf

    (Let’s see how many commentators and campaigners actually read it before wading in, it’s only 388 pages).
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    Peter Higgs obituary: Nobel-prize winning physicist, of Higgs Boson fame. (He didn’t much like the fame!)

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/obituaries/2024/04/09/peter-higgs-boson-nobel-prize-god-particle-died-obituary/
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,457
    ydoethur said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    I’d be surprised if 1946-47 was a better harvest than this one is going to be and that’s ‘since the Second World War.’

    But yes, it’s clearly going to be a terrible year for agriculture and it’s about the fifth in a row as well.
    The Russians threaten grain exports that could cause millions to starve.
    --> US reaction: oh well.
    Ukrainians strike Russian oil refineries.
    --> US reaction: stop immediately, it's WRONG!!!!!
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Sandpit said:

    Good morning all, Eid Mubarak!

    Eid Mubatak to all celebrating!
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,468
    Nothing looks very attractive on those odds. 1.01 for Labour! Maybe 13 for Reform UK is the best bet: they’ve picked who seems like a good local candidate.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693
    Sandpit said:

    Cass Review has released its final report.

    https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/CassReview_Final.pdf

    (Let’s see how many commentators and campaigners actually read it before wading in, it’s only 388 pages).

    CASH.

    Oh, wait a minute..
  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,808
    ydoethur said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    I’d be surprised if 1946-47 was a better harvest than this one is going to be and that’s ‘since the Second World War.’

    But yes, it’s clearly going to be a terrible year for agriculture and it’s about the fifth in a row as well.
    A proportion of winter cereal never got drilled - say 15% and a similar proportion has been so affected by waterlogging that it will barely be worth swlvaging. Combine that with late harvested crops like beet and potatoes which have rotted, or where harvested has caused tremendous damage to soil structure and there will definitely be reduced output and higher prices.

    But agriculture has to work better with nature too. Some of the failed crops will be on fields that really shouldn’t be in arable. Too heavy, too low lying. The climate is changing and we need to adapt to it.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
  • ydoethurydoethur Posts: 71,721

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    You're expecting the government to understand agriculture?

    Why, you'll be asking the DfE to grasp the basic principles of pedagogy next.
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,766

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    This one is funny. Internet traffic provider Cloudflare could accurately map the path of the solar eclipse across the US the other day - because people actually in the path put down their phones and went outside to watch it!

    https://tech.slashdot.org/story/24/04/09/1637217/internet-traffic-dipped-as-viewers-took-in-the-eclipse
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,704
    Well, it didn’t take long for the discussion on this thread to go off topic, did it?

    I’ve been wondering when we were going to get some indication of what was happening in Blackpool; all this suggests is that there’ll be a low turnout.

    And good morning one and all; looks quite promising here, after a miserable day yesterday!
  • Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,766
    edited April 10
    Finishing behind the Fukkers in the Barcelona of the North would definitely finish off Big Rish and the tories would go full Jonestown Massacre. The only question then is how long PM Jenrick (it might as well be him because, honestly, who gives a fuck at this point) can hang on before a GE.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693
    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    Good morning everyone.

    I’m not convinced they would change leader now. They seem intent to head over the cliff like the Gadarene swine.

    Meanwhile the threads seem quite peaceful: has “Leon” been banned again?
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417

    Well, it didn’t take long for the discussion on this thread to go off topic, did it?

    I’ve been wondering when we were going to get some indication of what was happening in Blackpool; all this suggests is that there’ll be a low turnout.

    And good morning one and all; looks quite promising here, after a miserable day yesterday!

    I was idly wondering whether removing party conferences from Blackpool meant politicians became yet more oblivious to its decline, and the plight of similar towns.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,832
    Sandpit said:

    Cass Review has released its final report.

    https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/CassReview_Final.pdf

    (Let’s see how many commentators and campaigners actually read it before wading in, it’s only 388 pages).

    Archives of Disease in Childhood http://adc.bmj.com is also releasing some research commissioned to support the review
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,832
    Selebian said:

    Sandpit said:

    Cass Review has released its final report.

    https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/CassReview_Final.pdf

    (Let’s see how many commentators and campaigners actually read it before wading in, it’s only 388 pages).

    Archives of Disease in Childhood http://adc.bmj.com is also releasing some research commissioned to support the review
    Better link https://adc.bmj.com/content/early/recent

  • MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,808
    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    On the nail
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Heathener said:

    Good morning everyone.

    I’m not convinced they would change leader now. They seem intent to head over the cliff like the Gadarene swine.

    Meanwhile the threads seem quite peaceful: has “Leon” been banned again?

    No, he flounced when told to stop spamming every thread with guff on AI.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    edited April 10
    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    Good morning everyone.

    I’m not convinced they would change leader now. They seem intent to head over the cliff like the Gadarene swine.

    Meanwhile the threads seem quite peaceful: has “Leon” been banned again?

    No, he flounced when told to stop spamming every thread with guff on AI.

    No, @Leon has a new job editing the Financial Times. Look at today's front page lead.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Selebian said:

    Selebian said:

    Sandpit said:

    Cass Review has released its final report.

    https://cass.independent-review.uk/wp-content/uploads/2024/04/CassReview_Final.pdf

    (Let’s see how many commentators and campaigners actually read it before wading in, it’s only 388 pages).

    Archives of Disease in Childhood http://adc.bmj.com is also releasing some research commissioned to support the review
    Better link https://adc.bmj.com/content/early/recent

    Some interesting reading. This is the conclusion of the only paper on puberty blockers regarded as "high quality" by the reviewers:

    "Transgender adolescents show poorer psychological well-being before treatment but show similar or better psychological functioning compared with cisgender peers from the general population after the start of specialized transgender care involving puberty suppression."

    https://www.jahonline.org/article/S1054-139X(20)30027-6/abstract
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    edited April 10

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    There is a scene in the Brexit film starring Benedict Cumberbatch where Dominic Cummings takes Douglas Carswell to a part of Clacton he did not know existed. It's your constituency, Douglas!

    Cummings understood the importance of levelling up, which meant the Prime Minister did until Boris sacked #ClassicDom over one too many Princess Nut Nut jibes. Rishi sees levelling up as a malign plot to steal money from hard-working, rich Tories.
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417
    edited April 10
    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,214

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    Blackpool is reasonably well connected to large population centres and airports, so it shouldn’t be beyond help and I don’t think tourism need be completely out of the question. But it would probably require huge corporate investment, Las Vegas style.

    Creating a special economic area for places like this, slashing corporate taxes (and possibly personal taxes) and removing all planning restrictions beyond the protection of a handful of existing buildings and the usual building regs might get it somewhere.
  • IanB2IanB2 Posts: 50,145

    Well, it didn’t take long for the discussion on this thread to go off topic, did it?

    I’ve been wondering when we were going to get some indication of what was happening in Blackpool; all this suggests is that there’ll be a low turnout.

    And good morning one and all; looks quite promising here, after a miserable day yesterday!

    It will be illuminating, nevertheless.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,704
    Does that suggest that Thames’ problems are, at least in part, due to the community they serve, not simply incompetence on behalf of the management.
  • HeathenerHeathener Posts: 7,084
    edited April 10
    Foxy said:

    Heathener said:

    Good morning everyone.

    I’m not convinced they would change leader now. They seem intent to head over the cliff like the Gadarene swine.

    Meanwhile the threads seem quite peaceful: has “Leon” been banned again?

    No, he flounced when told to stop spamming every thread with guff on AI.
    Thanks. Wow. Well, I feel that was overdue. It was really tedious.

    It’s a good place this. Let’s keep it as civil as possible in the run up to the General Election.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693
    Heathener said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    It’s a shame this site gets dragged down by men like you being snarky. There’s really no need for it just because someone happens not to agree with your right-wing view of the world. You could learn to be a lot more polite.

    NB I didn’t say the person was a friend. I said ‘close to me’. And it’s a long time since I did any lecturing / teaching. I’ve never written a single note of music. Did you misread when I mentioned going to the opera?

    I don’t think it’s all that unusual for relatively younger people to have multiple portfolios these days. It’s quite a common phenomenon.

    I think the most interesting of these remarks, stripping out the snarkiness, is the one about the tory friend(s). The fact that you dismiss it with such sarcasm is a neat illustration of why the Conservatives are heading for such a crushing defeat: failure to take the pulse of the nation. You will have a long, long, time in the political wilderness to reflect on these words.
    I must say it takes some real chutzpah to be quite rude and add, "I could have expressed it a lot more rudely", and then, in almost the same breath, say, "you could learn to be a lot more polite". It's almost like you feel you're entitled to dish out whatever you like to those you perceive as your political opponents but equally to scream blue murder if you get it back.

    Or, you're completely full of shit and just an early morning internet troll.

    Just a thought.
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,214

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    edited April 10

    Does that suggest that Thames’ problems are, at least in part, due to the community they serve, not simply incompetence on behalf of the management.
    Nah, Thames are just not doing the job, three years working in the water industry taught me that, Sad thing is theyre not the worst.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    *mulling over the notion that CR might be a vegan swampy treehouse-living ER activist with a warped sense of humour*
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
    OMG! I've unleashed a "three Yorkshireman sketch"!
  • JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 43,457

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
    I've worked in a coal mine.

    Well, I drove a minidigger for half a day on a coal mine near Stoke...

    (Silverdale, I think.)
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
    OMG! I've unleashed a "three Yorkshireman sketch"!
    Well you did lead with your chin :smile:

    I reckon I did two full years binning and sweeping as it paid my bills through education.

    Started on my 16th birthday. I await Yorkshires reply.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
    OMG! I've unleashed a "three Yorkshireman sketch"!
    Well you did lead with your chin :smile:

    I reckon I did two full years binning and sweeping as it paid my bills through education.

    Started on my 16th birthday. I await Yorkshires reply.
    Fair comment.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693
    Carnyx said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    *mulling over the notion that CR might be a vegan swampy treehouse-living ER activist with a warped sense of humour*
    That is absolute nonsense.

    I'd never have my hair that long.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    I didn't acknowledge anything about anyone's "synthetic" claims. I'll take everyone's word for whatever they claim on here. I was just pointing out that up to my post we all blow our own trumpets. From my post on it seems we are all living in cardboard boxes on the motorway.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    You could have just said "its easier to shoot the messenger".

    We get lot. Your lot are not just going down in flames, they are repeatedly blowing themselves up. When you generously consider your side to the right and everyone else to be wrong, I get how frustrating that would be.

    We need more Tory voices on here. On the inside. Explaining what the plan is and how the party drags itself out of the gutter and rebuilds. So don't get the arse when people point out that you've got the arse. Nobody likes losing. Get that. Not her fault.
  • TazTaz Posts: 15,027

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    One never ceases to be amazed at her ability to find people who share her worldview and then to present them as proof of a trend.

    I rarely find people with a strong view either way on such matters. More concerned about their soccer team, what they are doing at the weekend and the weather. Perhaps I should look harder.

    Don't forget she is also a renowned authority on the trans issue and regularly appears as a talking head to discuss it due to her undoubted knowledge although she did duck a debate on it with Ishmael when he was around these parts. Didn't want to trounce him with her knowledge.
  • OldKingColeOldKingCole Posts: 33,704

    Does that suggest that Thames’ problems are, at least in part, due to the community they serve, not simply incompetence on behalf of the management.
    Nah, Thames are just not doing the job, three years working in the water industry taught me that, Sad thing is theyre not the worst.
    Okay, fair enough. Just tried to see the other sides view!

    Incidentally, I am regularly irritated by advertisements for Anglian Water. AFAIK I have no other choice as a supplier of clean water and a disposer of sewage. if they didn’t pat vast sums for television advertising, they could reduce my bill!
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337

    Carnyx said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    *mulling over the notion that CR might be a vegan swampy treehouse-living ER activist with a warped sense of humour*
    That is absolute nonsense.

    I'd never have my hair that long.
    Have a look at photos of the Colston Four.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    Just as a general point, if you are make some kind of appeal to authority based on personal/professional experience, then you should also expect that it will get scrutinised, even on an 'anonymous blog'.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    You could have just said "its easier to shoot the messenger".

    We get lot. Your lot are not just going down in flames, they are repeatedly blowing themselves up. When you generously consider your side to the right and everyone else to be wrong, I get how frustrating that would be.

    We need more Tory voices on here. On the inside. Explaining what the plan is and how the party drags itself out of the gutter and rebuilds. So don't get the arse when people point out that you've got the arse. Nobody likes losing. Get that. Not her fault.
    Err, this isn't about "my lot" or "your lot" but it's interesting that you think it is because that says an awful lot about how you filter other people's posts, regardless of what they are.

    It's about the fact @Heathener is a hypocritical troll who can't stand being called out on it and who shouldn't be taken seriously by a single person on here.

    Of course, even "her" supporters know this - but they feel they need to defend it through gritted teeth, which explains the wonderful contortions some are going through this morning as they attempt to do it.
  • darkagedarkage Posts: 5,398
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    Looking forward to the 'warmer weather winters' in Finland. This winter has been one of the coldest in recent memory. It was still snowing a few days ago.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Taz said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    One never ceases to be amazed at her ability to find people who share her worldview and then to present them as proof of a trend.

    I rarely find people with a strong view either way on such matters. More concerned about their soccer team, what they are doing at the weekend and the weather. Perhaps I should look harder.

    Don't forget she is also a renowned authority on the trans issue and regularly appears as a talking head to discuss it due to her undoubted knowledge although she did duck a debate on it with Ishmael when he was around these parts. Didn't want to trounce him with her knowledge.
    Though @Heathener vox pops have been ahead of the curve on the Tories. There is a lot of anger out their, and their supporters are unenthusiastic at best and revolting at worse. So far all as she predicted.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963
    Taz said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    One never ceases to be amazed at her ability to find people who share her worldview and then to present them as proof of a trend.

    I rarely find people with a strong view either way on such matters. More concerned about their soccer team, what they are doing at the weekend and the weather. Perhaps I should look harder.

    Don't forget she is also a renowned authority on the trans issue and regularly appears as a talking head to discuss it due to her undoubted knowledge although she did duck a debate on it with Ishmael when he was around these parts. Didn't want to trounce him with her knowledge.
    Two points:
    1. Her observations are in line with the very long established and accepted by practically everyone trend of the Tories crashing and burning
    2. Loads of people have strong views. The header has 9 minutes of people stopped on the street who have strong views. Perhaps people dislike expressing them in front of you for some reason?
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890
    Taz said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    One never ceases to be amazed at her ability to find people who share her worldview and then to present them as proof of a trend.

    I rarely find people with a strong view either way on such matters. More concerned about their soccer team, what they are doing at the weekend and the weather. Perhaps I should look harder.

    Don't forget she is also a renowned authority on the trans issue and regularly appears as a talking head to discuss it due to her undoubted knowledge although she did duck a debate on it with Ishmael when he was around these parts. Didn't want to trounce him with her knowledge.
    Well if we are going to doubt integrity, I would question someone who claims to always vote Labour and then bellyaches when posters are "nasty" to the Conservatives.
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,337
    darkage said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    Just as a general point, if you are make some kind of appeal to authority based on personal/professional experience, then you should also expect that it will get scrutinised, even on an 'anonymous blog'.
    Actually, I find Heathener's persona entirely credible. If one wanted a reasonably paid job in a hurry, and one where you could do as much overtime as you liked and then clear off for some walking or writing, the RM makes excellent sense - it's apparently desperate for staff almost anywhere and anywhen.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/apr/08/quit-royal-mail-falling-apart
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    We certainly need to adapt. Which is why trying to cut temperatures is a total waste of time. It's too late. We need to spend our money of future proofing the nation not Net Zero.
  • MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 28,890
    darkage said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    Just as a general point, if you are make some kind of appeal to authority based on personal/professional experience, then you should also expect that it will get scrutinised, even on an 'anonymous blog'.
    That would only seem to apply to posters holding an opposite point of view. We take our own at their word.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    darkage said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    Looking forward to the 'warmer weather winters' in Finland. This winter has been one of the coldest in recent memory. It was still snowing a few days ago.
    I was thinking of our islands, with our maritime climate. Obviously other places get different effects.

    Of course if we greatly reduced civil aviation to help stop climate change, it might be the saving of Blackpool and Clacton. Still Bembridge for me though.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    We certainly need to adapt. Which is why trying to cut temperatures is a total waste of time. It's too late. We need to spend our money of future proofing the nation not Net Zero.
    Why not both?
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693
    Carnyx said:

    darkage said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    Just as a general point, if you are make some kind of appeal to authority based on personal/professional experience, then you should also expect that it will get scrutinised, even on an 'anonymous blog'.
    Actually, I find Heathener's persona entirely credible. If one wanted a reasonably paid job in a hurry, and one where you could do as much overtime as you liked and then clear off for some walking or writing, the RM makes excellent sense - it's apparently desperate for staff almost anywhere and anywhen.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/apr/08/quit-royal-mail-falling-apart
    Royal Mail? Last I heard she was a teacher.

    Maybe she does both: perhaps she squeezes in a round before assembly, or steps up to do it during the school holidays on a flexible contract to supplement her income.

    It's bloody impressive. I certainly couldn't do it. Not around going to the opera, connecting with my friends in government, travelling abroad and going out onto the streets.
  • BarnesianBarnesian Posts: 8,679

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
    I used to be a dishwasher at a holiday camp in Blackpool.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,668
    TimS said:

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    Blackpool is reasonably well connected to large population centres and airports, so it shouldn’t be beyond help and I don’t think tourism need be completely out of the question. But it would probably require huge corporate investment, Las Vegas style.

    Creating a special economic area for places like this, slashing corporate taxes (and possibly personal taxes) and removing all planning restrictions beyond the protection of a handful of existing buildings and the usual building regs might get it somewhere.

    Brighton was very run down and very seedy back in the 1970s and early 1980s. It may not be everyone's cup of tea now but it has clearly bounced back. There are similar things beginning to happen in Margate and other towns on the south coast. What Blackpool needs is a thriving hinterland. Its fate is tied to Liverpool's and Manchester's, just as Brighton's is to London.

  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    We certainly need to adapt. Which is why trying to cut temperatures is a total waste of time. It's too late. We need to spend our money of future proofing the nation not Net Zero.
    Modi needs to be made to pay for turning up the dial to a billion tonnes of coal and lignite.

    He risks making India almost inhabitable for humans in the process, but it's the effect on the rest of us that's unacceptable. And the colonial reachback arguments just won't wash.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    You could have just said "its easier to shoot the messenger".

    We get lot. Your lot are not just going down in flames, they are repeatedly blowing themselves up. When you generously consider your side to the right and everyone else to be wrong, I get how frustrating that would be.

    We need more Tory voices on here. On the inside. Explaining what the plan is and how the party drags itself out of the gutter and rebuilds. So don't get the arse when people point out that you've got the arse. Nobody likes losing. Get that. Not her fault.
    Err, this isn't about "my lot" or "your lot" but it's interesting that you think it is because that says an awful lot about how you filter other people's posts, regardless of what they are.

    It's about the fact @Heathener is a hypocritical troll who can't stand being called out on it and who shouldn't be taken seriously by a single person on here.

    Of course, even "her" supporters know this - but they feel they need to defend it through gritted teeth, which explains the wonderful contortions some are going through this morning as they attempt to do it.
    Blimey Casino, you get angrier every day. I'd get that blood pressure checked if I were you.
    I don't think I'm the angry one on here this morning, mate. In fact, I'm calmly sipping my coffee before I get down to work. The sun is out, and it's going to be a great day.

    Try it.
  • DavidLDavidL Posts: 54,014
    Talking of trigger points Scotland's finest have managed to stop Emperor Palatine's Stormtrooper from invading and taking over Dundeehttps://news.stv.tv/north/dundee-train-diverted-after-man-dressed-as-a-stormtrooper-reported-for-firearm-possession-in-aberdeen

    Where would we be without our heroic men in blue?
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Dura_Ace said:




    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    I recently went to some shit hole near Lowestoft to buy a car (E30 325i, only wanted the ECU. LOL.) It felt like it took me three days and cost a thousand quid to get there on the train and when I got there the place was absolutely fucked in the way you describe. One street had a row of derelict shops with a fucking tree growing out of the roof of one of them. That's how long that place had been completely fucked - long enough for trees to grow out of the abandoned shops.

    It sometimes feels like there are two distinct nations living inside the same borders and they have very little contact with each other. One group has eight types of vinegar in their kitchen and the other picks up fag ends in the streets for their kids' birthday present.

    #classicdom was definitely on to something with leveling up but his solution of Brexit was like trying treat dysentery by giving the patient a rotten kebab.
    Though his idea of the North is his father in laws castle in Durham!

    His model for the development of the country seems based on his mysterious years in 1990s Russia. Oligarchs looting the state, while peasants drink themselves to death, kept loyal by culture wars, and real ones.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514
    Foxy said:

    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    We certainly need to adapt. Which is why trying to cut temperatures is a total waste of time. It's too late. We need to spend our money of future proofing the nation not Net Zero.
    Why not both?
    elements of both will overlap. But at present HMGs priority is cutting carbon not future proofing sea defences or protecting bio diversity in a significant way. Our priority seems to be taxing the ass off everyone and forcing pointless legislation instead of investment in projects which would both cut carbon and strengthen our infrastructure for prospective changes in climate.
  • Wulfrun_PhilWulfrun_Phil Posts: 4,780
    edited April 10
    Sunak will be judged on the the nationwide test of the local and mayoral elections, Blackpool will be a footnote. As Blackpool would always have been a nailed on Conservative loss, I don't think it'll have the same impact as a loss in seats where they are defending a much larger majority.

    What's noticeable here is the total lack of Reform candidates on the published candidate nominations. And Conservative councillors will mostly have built up a local reputation will mean that many are judged on their own merits and not against the car crash of this government. None of that applies in a general election of course.

    So I can see the Conservatives significantly outperforming against expectations in the locals. Overall I think the May elections will overall throw Sunak a lifeline by virtue of the results being misinterpreted as if they were a general election, rather than being the catalyst for a leadership challenge.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963
    Back on topic, listening to the people interviewed in Blackpool, the one thing that bound all of them together (even the Tory) was that the town is visibly crumbling all around them. Blackpool can't sustain chain shops despite tourist numbers, and when most of the shops are owned by non-UK companies there is little incentive to do anything other than leave them shuttered and hope values rise naturally.

    Blackpool is unique in some ways and not in others. It has a real problem with former B&Bs that modern tourists don't want to stay in - what to do with them? Which is how so many have ended up filled with migrants and the very poorest, or left to rot.

    The solution? Buy large numbers of empty buildings, bulldoze them, and build homes. Blackpool has a microclimate - you can drive down the M55 where there is drizzle in Preston and find Blackpool free of cloud. It has rail and motorway links, a small airport which could be reopened and a tourist industry. Its the kind of place that people could be drawn to, but it needs politicians with vision. And it has lacked them for a long long time.

    I have little doubt that Labour will win the byelection, and then little will change. Unless we decide that we are going to modernise these places and reinvest in their next phase of development - rather than bemoaning that the old times have gone - then all of these decaying towns will just keep decaying.
  • SouthamObserverSouthamObserver Posts: 39,668
    On topic - I would reverse the pressure point with Blackpool South. Reform has to demonstrate that its national polling numbers are credible. If it is not pushing the Tories very close there on 2nd May it will be hard not to conclude that Reform support is being overstated by the pollsters.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 54,997
    TimS said:

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    Blackpool is reasonably well connected to large population centres and airports, so it shouldn’t be beyond help and I don’t think tourism need be completely out of the question. But it would probably require huge corporate investment, Las Vegas style.

    Creating a special economic area for places like this, slashing corporate taxes (and possibly personal taxes) and removing all planning restrictions beyond the protection of a handful of existing buildings and the usual building regs might get it somewhere.
    They should have built that massive casino resort there, that was talked about 15 years ago, and recruited one of the big Vegas operators to run it. It would have bought a whole load of secondary investment in hotels and other leisure activities.

    Yes I’d run it as a free zone until it’s back on its feet, then setup another similar free zone in Clacton or Margate and repeat the exercise.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Barnesian said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    I used to be a road sweeper ( seriously ! it was my summer job ) Bin man too.
    I used to be a dishwasher at a holiday camp in Blackpool.
    3 months for me flipping burgers, cleaning out deep fat fryers and lugging stock upstairs in a Wimpy!
  • BlancheLivermoreBlancheLivermore Posts: 5,980
    Heathermitty is a leading expert on things and has friends in government, but needs to keep hot water in thermos flasks to save some pennies

    It's almost as convincing as Ange's story about her living arrangements
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693
    Dura_Ace said:




    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    I recently went to some shit hole near Lowestoft to buy a car (E30 325i, only wanted the ECU. LOL.) It felt like it took me three days and cost a thousand quid to get there on the train and when I got there the place was absolutely fucked in the way you describe. One street had a row of derelict shops with a fucking tree growing out of the roof of one of them. That's how long that place had been completely fucked - long enough for trees to grow out of the abandoned shops.

    It sometimes feels like there are two distinct nations living inside the same borders and they have very little contact with each other. One group has eight types of vinegar in their kitchen and the other picks up fag ends in the streets for their kids' birthday present.

    #classicdom was definitely on to something with leveling up but his solution of Brexit was like trying treat dysentery by giving the patient a rotten kebab.
    Sandown in the Isle of Wight is like this.

    In so many respects it should be a flourishing and prosperous resort, the beach, setting and pier is fantastic - it has fun rides and attractions for kids, and it even has a couple of great places for cocktails and food - but every third or forth property on the seafront is totally derelict, falling down, or has trees growing out of it. It looks shit and, like you intimate, probably puts off a lot of investment, even though a new Premier Inn has recently opened and blocks of new flats are going up here and there.

    Talking to a guy there, all are "owned" and a small group got sent down a few weeks back who had one of them, so the thesis is that a lot of the restoration and refurb is cockblocked by organised crime and fraudulent companies for tax dodges, which just take a bloody long time to work through the system.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,074
    TimS said:

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    Blackpool is reasonably well connected to large population centres and airports, so it shouldn’t be beyond help and I don’t think tourism need be completely out of the question. But it would probably require huge corporate investment, Las Vegas style.

    Creating a special economic area for places like this, slashing corporate taxes (and possibly personal taxes) and removing all planning restrictions beyond the protection of a handful of existing buildings and the usual building regs might get it somewhere.
    There's still an astonishing number of people go to Blackpool. With good reason, too: there is more there to entertain you than almost any city in England outside of London, especially if you have kids. I go three or four times a year. I don't stay overnight - it's only an hour away - but I don't think it's a town devoid of function. Yes, it's a little run down in places, but that's true of almost any working class town.
    What it does have a big problem with is a big oversupply of benefit tourists - those subsisting on benefits who have moved there to stay in excess B&B stock. So there is a lot of extreme poverty, but it is imported extreme poverty.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    You could have just said "its easier to shoot the messenger".

    We get lot. Your lot are not just going down in flames, they are repeatedly blowing themselves up. When you generously consider your side to the right and everyone else to be wrong, I get how frustrating that would be.

    We need more Tory voices on here. On the inside. Explaining what the plan is and how the party drags itself out of the gutter and rebuilds. So don't get the arse when people point out that you've got the arse. Nobody likes losing. Get that. Not her fault.
    Err, this isn't about "my lot" or "your lot" but it's interesting that you think it is because that says an awful lot about how you filter other people's posts, regardless of what they are.

    It's about the fact @Heathener is a hypocritical troll who can't stand being called out on it and who shouldn't be taken seriously by a single person on here.

    Of course, even "her" supporters know this - but they feel they need to defend it through gritted teeth, which explains the wonderful contortions some are going through this morning as they attempt to do it.
    Blimey Casino, you get angrier every day. I'd get that blood pressure checked if I were you.
    Besides which, when he says "my lot" as in me filtering people out, which lot does he imagine I am? I am neither Labour nor Tory, yet it reads like if I am not one of his lot (Tory) then I must be the other lot (Labour) and ignore his lot. Did I not post that we need MORE Tories on here? Not less? I want to hear from his lot. Without him calling anyone who isn't him a troll.
  • Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 60,693

    Heathermitty is a leading expert on things and has friends in government, but needs to keep hot water in thermos flasks to save some pennies

    It's almost as convincing as Ange's story about her living arrangements

    Well, those opera tickets don't pay for themselves. In for a penny, in for a pound.
  • StuartinromfordStuartinromford Posts: 17,449
    Foxy said:

    Dura_Ace said:




    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    I recently went to some shit hole near Lowestoft to buy a car (E30 325i, only wanted the ECU. LOL.) It felt like it took me three days and cost a thousand quid to get there on the train and when I got there the place was absolutely fucked in the way you describe. One street had a row of derelict shops with a fucking tree growing out of the roof of one of them. That's how long that place had been completely fucked - long enough for trees to grow out of the abandoned shops.

    It sometimes feels like there are two distinct nations living inside the same borders and they have very little contact with each other. One group has eight types of vinegar in their kitchen and the other picks up fag ends in the streets for their kids' birthday present.

    #classicdom was definitely on to something with leveling up but his solution of Brexit was like trying treat dysentery by giving the patient a rotten kebab.
    Though his idea of the North is his father in laws castle in Durham!

    His model for the development of the country seems based on his mysterious years in 1990s Russia. Oligarchs looting the state, while peasants drink themselves to death, kept loyal by culture wars, and real ones.
    Maybe he fancies being Britain's Putin in 2040 or so. Create the mess so he can be the strongman who sorts it out.
  • FoxyFoxy Posts: 49,122
    Cookie said:

    TimS said:

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    Blackpool is reasonably well connected to large population centres and airports, so it shouldn’t be beyond help and I don’t think tourism need be completely out of the question. But it would probably require huge corporate investment, Las Vegas style.

    Creating a special economic area for places like this, slashing corporate taxes (and possibly personal taxes) and removing all planning restrictions beyond the protection of a handful of existing buildings and the usual building regs might get it somewhere.
    There's still an astonishing number of people go to Blackpool. With good reason, too: there is more there to entertain you than almost any city in England outside of London, especially if you have kids. I go three or four times a year. I don't stay overnight - it's only an hour away - but I don't think it's a town devoid of function. Yes, it's a little run down in places, but that's true of almost any working class town.
    What it does have a big problem with is a big oversupply of benefit tourists - those subsisting on benefits who have moved there to stay in excess B&B stock. So there is a lot of extreme poverty, but it is imported extreme poverty.
    Yes, that is true of a lot of coastal towns, whether Sandown or Skegness. Its a sort of early retirement for people who are skint. Life on disability benefits in old boarding houses, and with all the economic, health, social and addiction that goes with it.
  • Morris_DancerMorris_Dancer Posts: 61,950
    Good morning, everyone.

    Mr. L, maybe they'll arrest him for hate speech for condemning 'rebel scum'.
  • MattWMattW Posts: 23,899
    Good morning everyone.

    Just off to the clinic to be stabbed in the back.
    viewcode said:

    Pagan2 said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    viewcode said:

    For all those of you who do cruises, can you tell me if the bathrooms have a bath (as opposed to just a shower)?

    If you want a bath, you’re likely in an expensive suite rather than a standard room. But yes, you can get bathrooms with baths. 90% of the rooms will have only showers.

    My wife too.
    ??
    I usually get in trouble if hotel rooms only have showers, as she likes her bath!
    Ah right, I'm with your wife there.

    (Er...)
    For the bath lovers a little add, I have made a couple of sets of stainless steel chain mail now so you can bathe without worrying about being stabbed nods...or going rusty
    Whilst this is a response to my question, I'm not sure it constitutes an answer...😀
    Advise drysuits, which can be folded and filled with a jug.

    Good luck with the divorce.

  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,108
    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Because, in both cities, the drains and sewage systems are pretty much the same thing.

    So rain water inflates the volume of sewage.

    This is because they are old, old systems.

    Th ere are some newer stuff being built which separates the two, but rebuilding to separate fully is impossible.

    So more capacity is pretty much the only option.

    Apart from reducing the population.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,805

    TimS said:

    I was briefly in clacton last year after a camping trip in Essex. What a deplorably run down place it was. Drug dealers on the streets. People in dirty worn down clothes. People had hard lives etched in their faces.

    When I listen to people like in this video, it hammers home to me that there are several kinds of poverty: lack of money, lack of network, lack of information and knowledge, lack of opportunities, lack of power and voice. They seem decoupled from any participation in the collective project that is our country.

    And behind that are locations that have no overall economic function or connection with the broader national and global economy - they don't participate in the structural circulation of money, goods, people, ideas that is necessary for them to be viable. These locations are literal dead ends.

    The citizens talk about being a holiday town. They were killed off by easy jet and Ryan Air and being a holiday town won't ever properly recover. Those times are gone. Why would you go to blackpool or clacton if you can be in Malaga for £80 return?

    They talk about fixing the buildings.... to what end? The buildings need a role to play in the town, which itself needs a role in a broader economy. There needs to be a total rethink about the purpose of these towns... because it isn't tourism. Not till these seaside towns are integrated into the broader economic circulation of the nation will we begin to address these issues. Saying it is an issue of individual tax cuts or individual moral fortitude totally misses the point of what is going on in my mind.

    Blackpool is reasonably well connected to large population centres and airports, so it shouldn’t be beyond help and I don’t think tourism need be completely out of the question. But it would probably require huge corporate investment, Las Vegas style.

    Creating a special economic area for places like this, slashing corporate taxes (and possibly personal taxes) and removing all planning restrictions beyond the protection of a handful of existing buildings and the usual building regs might get it somewhere.

    Brighton was very run down and very seedy back in the 1970s and early 1980s. It may not be everyone's cup of tea now but it has clearly bounced back. There are similar things beginning to happen in Margate and other towns on the south coast. What Blackpool needs is a thriving hinterland. Its fate is tied to Liverpool's and Manchester's, just as Brighton's is to London.
    There are signs that even my old hometown Hastings is beginning to improve, mainly fuelled by renters from London looking to buy and finding Brighton too expensive.
  • RochdalePioneersRochdalePioneers Posts: 28,963

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    You could have just said "its easier to shoot the messenger".

    We get lot. Your lot are not just going down in flames, they are repeatedly blowing themselves up. When you generously consider your side to the right and everyone else to be wrong, I get how frustrating that would be.

    We need more Tory voices on here. On the inside. Explaining what the plan is and how the party drags itself out of the gutter and rebuilds. So don't get the arse when people point out that you've got the arse. Nobody likes losing. Get that. Not her fault.
    Err, this isn't about "my lot" or "your lot" but it's interesting that you think it is because that says an awful lot about how you filter other people's posts, regardless of what they are.

    It's about the fact @Heathener is a hypocritical troll who can't stand being called out on it and who shouldn't be taken seriously by a single person on here.

    Of course, even "her" supporters know this - but they feel they need to defend it through gritted teeth, which explains the wonderful contortions some are going through this morning as they attempt to do it.
    Blimey Casino, you get angrier every day. I'd get that blood pressure checked if I were you.
    Besides which, when he says "my lot" as in me filtering people out, which lot does he imagine I am? I am neither Labour nor Tory, yet it reads like if I am not one of his lot (Tory) then I must be the other lot (Labour) and ignore his lot. Did I not post that we need MORE Tories on here? Not less? I want to hear from his lot. Without him calling anyone who isn't him a troll.
    Given your ambition to be an MP I am surprised we havent had a photo of your genetalia.

    Send us a pic, youre among friends we wont do anything that might embarass you.

    Honest.
    Sorry, I don't send free dick pics. But there is a sale over on my Onlyfans!
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,514

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    This post is quite interesting because, buried beneath the slightly frustrated obligation you feel to defend one of your own side there, is a recognition that you also acknowledge much of "her" claims are synthetic and insincere.

    Why does it matter?

    Because if people are going to make a claim to authority in support of one of their arguments that can only credibly be done if it's true.

    No-one asks the same of Dura on Defence, Ydoethur on Education or Foxy on Health, MarqueeMark on Media, JohnO on being a lead councillor, MaxPB or TSE on financial services, Roger on the Oscars, and Leon on flintknapping, even when all of us may not always fully agree with them.
    You could have just said "its easier to shoot the messenger".

    We get lot. Your lot are not just going down in flames, they are repeatedly blowing themselves up. When you generously consider your side to the right and everyone else to be wrong, I get how frustrating that would be.

    We need more Tory voices on here. On the inside. Explaining what the plan is and how the party drags itself out of the gutter and rebuilds. So don't get the arse when people point out that you've got the arse. Nobody likes losing. Get that. Not her fault.
    Err, this isn't about "my lot" or "your lot" but it's interesting that you think it is because that says an awful lot about how you filter other people's posts, regardless of what they are.

    It's about the fact @Heathener is a hypocritical troll who can't stand being called out on it and who shouldn't be taken seriously by a single person on here.

    Of course, even "her" supporters know this - but they feel they need to defend it through gritted teeth, which explains the wonderful contortions some are going through this morning as they attempt to do it.
    Blimey Casino, you get angrier every day. I'd get that blood pressure checked if I were you.
    Besides which, when he says "my lot" as in me filtering people out, which lot does he imagine I am? I am neither Labour nor Tory, yet it reads like if I am not one of his lot (Tory) then I must be the other lot (Labour) and ignore his lot. Did I not post that we need MORE Tories on here? Not less? I want to hear from his lot. Without him calling anyone who isn't him a troll.
    Given your ambition to be an MP I am surprised we havent had a photo of your genetalia.

    Send us a pic, youre among friends we wont do anything that might embarass you.

    Honest.
    Sorry, I don't send free dick pics. But there is a sale over on my Onlyfans!
    LOL
  • DecrepiterJohnLDecrepiterJohnL Posts: 28,417

    Carnyx said:

    darkage said:

    Heathener said:

    Dura_Ace said:

    Farmers warn of first year without harvest since Second World War
    Unprecedented flooding and wettest 18 months on record mean crop yields will be significantly down, with risk of food shortages

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/04/09/farmers-warn-food-shortages-no-harvest-world-war-two-rain/ (£££)

    This is a very significant strategic problem, particularly since wet, warm and stormy winters are now likely to become the norm here.

    Some agricultural land may need to be surrendered to extended flood plain, the EA will need to improve defences and drainage, and the government will need to give more support to farmers.

    Has any of this been thought through?
    Recent tory Environment Secretaries have included O-Patz, Truss, Leadsom, Ada Shufflebottom and "Big" Steve Barclay so, no.
    Owen Paterson was actually quite a good one. And he did understand it.

    His big flaw was scepticism about climate change, but understanding the countryside wasn't one of them.
    Hmmm. Some mutual contradictions in there. If you want to ‘understand the countryside’ you do need to have an understanding of climate change as the latter is impacting massively on the former. And any plan for the future has to take it into account.

    Unfortunately the current Conservatives have a tendency to equate environment with farming. There are overlaps, of course, but the two are not synonymous.

    As someone close to me works right at the top of Government on this I could have expressed it a lot more rudely.
    Yes, you're quite brilliant.

    You teach, you travel, you pen books, you write music, you have friends at the top of Government, you have Tory friends who agree with you, you have time to go out on the streets and hear what people are saying..

    It's a wonder you have any time to yourself at all.
    What's your problem? Whether @Heathener has that back story or not, who cares?

    People can claim all sorts of things on an anonymous blog. There aren't many road sweepers or refuse collectors living in trailers in Weston-Super-Mare from what I can see on PB. We are all millionaires from the right side of the tracks, captains of industry posting 24/7. Maybe if any of us could be arsed, so to do, we might even question your back story, but as we aren't really interested we won't.
    Just as a general point, if you are make some kind of appeal to authority based on personal/professional experience, then you should also expect that it will get scrutinised, even on an 'anonymous blog'.
    Actually, I find Heathener's persona entirely credible. If one wanted a reasonably paid job in a hurry, and one where you could do as much overtime as you liked and then clear off for some walking or writing, the RM makes excellent sense - it's apparently desperate for staff almost anywhere and anywhen.

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/apr/08/quit-royal-mail-falling-apart
    Royal Mail? Last I heard she was a teacher.

    Maybe she does both: perhaps she squeezes in a round before assembly, or steps up to do it during the school holidays on a flexible contract to supplement her income.

    It's bloody impressive. I certainly couldn't do it. Not around going to the opera, connecting with my friends in government, travelling abroad and going out onto the streets.
    Isn't BlancheLivermore our postie?
  • TimSTimS Posts: 13,214
    Foxy said:

    TimS said:

    Fares fair. The Paris transport company runs buses in London.
    Doesn’t surprise me, it’s rained almost non-stop in the Seine’s watershed for the last several months. I assume they have similar sewage overflow issues as London.
    Sounds pretty bad in Russia and Kazakhstan too.

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/09/russia-kazakhstan-evacuate-tens-thousands-worst-floods-decades

    Climate change is real, and we need to adapt. It seems that warmer wetter winters are our future. In Leics we have had hardly any frosts. The clay soil here is waterlogged. Better for planting rice than barley!

    We’ve actually had a run of a few pretty dry winters (but warm). Until a few months ago large parts of Western Europe were in severe drought restrictions mainly because of winter deficits.

    What is happening with a warmer climate though is more extremes, and rutty weather.
This discussion has been closed.