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Record breaking Rishi – politicalbetting.com

SystemSystem Posts: 11,736
edited March 12 in General
Record breaking Rishi – politicalbetting.com

?NEW from @IpsosUK / @standardnews: Labour lead at 27 / Conservative vote share (20%) lowest in Ipsos history – going back to 1978 (!) ?Labour 47% (-2 from Jan)Conservative 20% (-7)Lib Dem 9% (+2)Green 8% (+1)Reform 8% (+4)Other 7% (nc)https://t.co/99LCSknk1F

Read the full story here

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Comments

  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    I know people have a go at me for criticising Rishi Sunak but look at the material I have to work with.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967
    Second - the best that the Tories can hope for.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,329
    tick tock...
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803
    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327
    I remember when we all talked about 30% being the hard bottom of Conservative party polling...
  • Options
    MattWMattW Posts: 19,003
    edited March 4
    Fifth

    Rishi and the Rest remind me of a line from an old gospel song:

    "Rushing helter-skelter to destruction with their fingers in their ears."
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967
    That is a pretty good line from Paul Scully tbf.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789

    That is a pretty good line from Paul Scully tbf.

    A former Tory strategist said it sounded like one of my lines.
  • Options
    CleitophonCleitophon Posts: 260
    The tories need a ge right freaking now. Because I suspect these numbers will only get worse. Much much worse.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,707
    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.
  • Options
    FF43FF43 Posts: 15,897
    Sunak almost as unpopular as Margaret Thatcher klaxon.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    Cameron just couldnt do party management, there were huge swathes of the country he just didnt understand.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967
    edited March 4

    I remember when we all talked about 30% being the hard bottom of Conservative party polling...

    I feel the urge to re-post the polling trend graph I posted in 15 November:
    image
    The trend remains the same; time advances:
    image
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484
    edited March 4

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that they could have had in their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the US

    The Lib Dems biggest wrecking ball in UK politics
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    Now this is an interesting point. I would suggest that Cameron killed the party and the post-2016 Brexiteers buried its twitching corpse.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,329
    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
  • Options
    TresTres Posts: 2,275
    Tories last polled 30% or higher in October, even a black swan isn't going to save them now.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,707
    edited March 4

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    And yet, the Tory membership chose Johnson and then Truss. It could be argued they didn't have much to choose from but still...
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,607
    edited March 4
    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    Nah, she would have effectively endorsed Tommy Robinson like she did a few weeks ago.

    Tories would have been in the single digits.
  • Options
    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,244
    edited March 4
    FPT
    Dura_Ace said:

    Am I the only pb.com pureblood? Has anyone else never had the vax?

    Only surviving one, certainly... :D
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    Mwahahahahah

    what tosh, Maybe if Cameron had thought of reforming the creaky ship of state by building houses, cutting back Blair's tsunami of legislation and spending more time in the North and Scotland you's have a point.

    But he didnt He had no vision of what he wanted this country to be,
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,344

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    He bears some responsibility, but it was something of a rolling collaborative project.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    Sunak has had an impossible task and if you think saluting Trump and the extreme right in the US would improve her ratings you are simply in denial
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803
    Nigelb said:

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    He bears some responsibility, but it was something of a rolling collaborative project.
    Of course, bur he set the stone rolling down the hill.
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159
    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    I don't disagree that this was the failure of action.
    But the failure of thinking behind that was a belief that he was clever enough to kill them off for a generation without understanding why that policy wouldn't work.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,344

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    You have a limited imagination, then.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803
    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    But he didnt.

    He couldnt manage a nappy change let alone a political party.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    LEAF CUTTER ANT ALERT
  • Options
    MonksfieldMonksfield Posts: 2,247
    mwadams said:

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.
    The Eurosceptics represented fairy stories to a loose coalition of wreckers, empire nostalgicists, free market ideologues and people with a sense that they had been left behind. But fairy stories was enough. Not sure Cameron or anyone else could have put the lid back on that Pandora’s Box, once it was opened.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013
    edited March 4
    file:///C:/Users/Sean/Downloads/Deltapoll-240304_trackers.pdf

    Slightly better news for the Conservatives with Deltapoll

    Labour 41%,
    Con 27%
    Lib Dem 9%
    Reform 12%.

    Lab lead by 42% to 31% on forced choice.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,707

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    And yet, the Tory membership chose Johnson and then Truss. It could be argued they didn't have much to choose from but still...
    Given that Boris Johnson beat Jeremy Hunt, and Liz Truss beat Rishi Sunak, I'd say that's a two for two in members' favour.

    Yes, Truss imploded. She greatly underestimated the opposition there would be to her policies, and paid the price. Sunak never had a plan in the first place.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,355

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    They were essentially right. The difficult bit was managing the politics of it rather than the deal itself.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    edited March 4

    I remember when we all talked about 30% being the hard bottom of Conservative party polling...

    I feel the urge to re-post the polling trend graph I posted in 15 November:
    image
    The trend remains the same; time advances:
    image
    And people pooh-poohed you for it. And I said No, you were on to something

    And it looks like you were
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    edited March 4
    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    Cameron just couldnt do party management, there were huge swathes of the country he just didnt understand.
    It appears he understood larger swathes of the country than the current Conservative party...
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 10,056
    I can imagine the costs of keeping a unicorn would eat through that £10k pretty quickly.

    Tories still haven't achieved a sub-20% under Sunak. I kind of hope we see that at some point. It's an interesting question, whether we see sub-40% from Labour or sub-20% from Conservatives first. I was convinced it would be the former with one of the swingback pollsters.
  • Options
    Big_G_NorthWalesBig_G_NorthWales Posts: 60,484
    Sean_F said:

    file:///C:/Users/Sean/Downloads/Deltapoll-240304_trackers.pdf

    Slightly better news for the Conservatives with Deltapoll

    Labour 41%,
    Con 27%
    Lib Dem 9%
    Reform 12%.

    Lab lead by 42% to 31% on forced choice.

    That is labour -3 conservatives +4
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159

    mwadams said:

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.
    The Eurosceptics represented fairy stories to a loose coalition of wreckers, empire nostalgicists, free market ideologues and people with a sense that they had been left behind. But fairy stories was enough. Not sure Cameron or anyone else could have put the lid back on that Pandora’s Box, once it was opened.
    There were comparatively few of them who caused trouble principally to the party management. The broader Tory coalition held together until it was consciously tested to breaking point by the genius of Cameron's referendum policy. As Alanbrooke says, he kicked the stone down the mountain, rather than trying to keep the cairn together at the top.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327
    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    I'll do that after you join me on a marathon. ;)

    It's the 'eco' part of it that I'm laughing at. There's f-all 'eco' about it.
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159

    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........

    Are YouGov prepared for the consequences?
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    Cameron just couldnt do party management, there were huge swathes of the country he just didnt understand.
    It appears he understood larger swathes of the country than the current Conservative party...
    Yes, those swathes are going off to Reform or sitting on their hands. Tory MPs have been incredibly self indulgent and have forgotten why voters sent them to Parliament.
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 25,147
    Supreme Court says Trump is still on the ballot https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf
  • Options
    TheuniondivvieTheuniondivvie Posts: 40,436
    mwadams said:

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    Now this is an interesting point. I would suggest that Cameron killed the party and the post-2016 Brexiteers buried its twitching corpse.
    Fairly sure that the post-2016 Brexiteers rogered the twitching corpse before burying it, they just seem like those sort of people.
  • Options
    GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 20,890
    edited March 4
    I agree with @Alanbrooke.

    Cameron was guilty of hubristic insouciance.
    No-one with an ounce of sense would have set up the Brexit referendum in the way he did.

    Having said that, no Tory leader from Major onwards has managed to figure out a stable accommodation with Euroscepticism (now effectively indistinguishable from national populism). Expulsion, as recommended above, is daft.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    mwadams said:

    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........

    Are YouGov prepared for the consequences?
    I am about to order the M3 Macbook Air that was announced today which means in a few weeks time I have to hand my old Macbook to the Apple store staff to transfer things across.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    They were essentially right. The difficult bit was managing the politics of it rather than the deal itself.
    Were they fuck.

    My job now requires about 40% more paperwork thanks to Brexit and costs are up to as well.

    Explain to me why that is easy?
    You're earning more and complaining ?

    Try care homes for a living you might appreciate how lucky you are.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,607
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
    You just asked what was wrong with the picture you painted and I pointed it out.

    Don't shoot the messenger.

    Enjoy your mind-expanding experience; let us know if your paradigm changes.
  • Options
    GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,040

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    Nah, she would have effectively endorsed Tommy Robinson like she did a few weeks ago.

    Tories would have been in the single digits.
    I could absolutely have seen Truss's polling declining further. I don't think there's ever been a person less suited to the role elevated to PM. But honestly she was sending the country into a serious financial crisis anyway, so I doubt she'd have ever had the chance to get a decent series of polling data.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    They were essentially right. The difficult bit was managing the politics of it rather than the deal itself.
    Were they fuck.

    My job now requires about 40% more paperwork thanks to Brexit and costs are up to as well.

    Explain to me why that is easy?
    You're earning more and complaining ?

    Try care homes for a living you might appreciate how lucky you are.
    But it is more aggro for the firm, lucky for the UK financial services isn't the biggest contributor to the Exchequer.
  • Options
    Luckyguy1983Luckyguy1983 Posts: 25,707
    Nigelb said:

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    You have a limited imagination, then.
    Her fiscal plans have been shown by hindsight to have been entirely affordable. Had her platform been implemented, we'd have had no CT rise, and a raft of policies aimed at tackling inflation at its root cause by increasing domestic supply of energy and food. I think it very unlikely we'd have dipped into recession, and that would have improved the public finances, which are massively skewed by growth or lack of it.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,743

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    I'll do that after you join me on a marathon. ;)

    It's the 'eco' part of it that I'm laughing at. There's f-all 'eco' about it.
    What if they were called rustic wildlife observation lodges? That's basically what they are.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013

    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.

    9-0 as well.
  • Options
    TimSTimS Posts: 10,056
    Sean_F said:

    file:///C:/Users/Sean/Downloads/Deltapoll-240304_trackers.pdf

    Slightly better news for the Conservatives with Deltapoll

    Labour 41%,
    Con 27%
    Lib Dem 9%
    Reform 12%.

    Lab lead by 42% to 31% on forced choice.

    There's a big swing away from LLG in that poll

    https://x.com/DeltapollUK/status/1764648137061286249?s=20

    Reform are on 12%. It's LLG 56%, RefCon 39%. By far the best right wing showing for ages.

    All fieldwork post-Rochdale.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    Sean_F said:

    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.

    9-0 as well.
    Dissents from Sotamayor, Kagan, and Jackson on quite a few parts.
  • Options
    kamskikamski Posts: 4,342
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
    You're disrespecting the medicine. No good will come of this.
  • Options
    eekeek Posts: 25,147

    mwadams said:

    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........

    Are YouGov prepared for the consequences?
    I am about to order the M3 Macbook Air that was announced today which means in a few weeks time I have to hand my old Macbook to the Apple store staff to transfer things across.
    You really don’t - you can do it yourself by answering about 5 questions and leaving the computers to it.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    No, that was the Brexiteers who said it would be the easiest deal in history/could be sorted out in an afternoon.
    They were essentially right. The difficult bit was managing the politics of it rather than the deal itself.
    Were they fuck.

    My job now requires about 40% more paperwork thanks to Brexit and costs are up to as well.

    Explain to me why that is easy?
    You're earning more and complaining ?

    Try care homes for a living you might appreciate how lucky you are.
    But it is more aggro for the firm, lucky for the UK financial services isn't the biggest contributor to the Exchequer.
    Well that gives us all some satisfaction that you have to do some work for your overegged salaries instead of flitting about on political blogs.

    Jezza for Tory leader.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,013
    TimS said:

    Sean_F said:

    file:///C:/Users/Sean/Downloads/Deltapoll-240304_trackers.pdf

    Slightly better news for the Conservatives with Deltapoll

    Labour 41%,
    Con 27%
    Lib Dem 9%
    Reform 12%.

    Lab lead by 42% to 31% on forced choice.

    There's a big swing away from LLG in that poll

    https://x.com/DeltapollUK/status/1764648137061286249?s=20

    Reform are on 12%. It's LLG 56%, RefCon 39%. By far the best right wing showing for ages.

    All fieldwork post-Rochdale.
    In terms of Lab v Con it's really a reversion to the mean, but the Reform vote is very high.
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789
    eek said:

    mwadams said:

    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........

    Are YouGov prepared for the consequences?
    I am about to order the M3 Macbook Air that was announced today which means in a few weeks time I have to hand my old Macbook to the Apple store staff to transfer things across.
    You really don’t - you can do it yourself by answering about 5 questions and leaving the computers to it.
    I know, it is part of the part-ex deal I've got on the order.
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,743
    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
    The thing is you have taken the trouble to adventurously get to a sublimely beautiful tropical place replete with wildlife and largely away from humans yet you are about to take mind-altering drugs. If I were brave enough to do that (I'm not) I'd do it at home I think.
  • Options
    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,562
    edited March 4
    I am skim reading the judgment but it looks to me like SCOTUS have punted - they’ve not ruled on Trumps eligibility, just that Colorado can’t deny him ballot access.

    I thought they might do this - a “wait and see if he’s elected” ruling.

    Edit: I have just gotten to the bit where essentially they reserve the power to Congress to execute it. So nope. That’s it.
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159

    I agree with @Alanbrooke.

    Cameron was guilty of hubristic insouciance.
    No-one with an ounce of sense would have set up the Brexit referendum in the way he did.

    Having said that, no Tory leader from Major onwards has managed to figure out a stable accommodation with Euroscepticism (now effectively indistinguishable from national populism). Expulsion, as recommended above, is daft.

    Neither expulsion nor extinction were the right (general) action. Party coalitions are maintained by the moderate use of stick and carrot, and Cameron was in the unique position of having a working majority, a rudderless Labour party and neutralised LD threat. He read the wrong thing into that and tried to "deal with" a critical (if unwelcome to him) part of the Tory coalition "once and for all".

    Muddling on was (as so often in politics) the better choice.
  • Options
    TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 41,607
    Oh god we're not here again, are we? As it stood there were around 4m people (12% of the electorate) who wanted a Brexit referendum and used their democratic welly to bring it about. Exactly as it should be. Had Dave not agreed to the referendum there is every chance that the Cons wouldn't have won the GE. Dave did it for this reason. It's simple (and effective) politics.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    I'll do that after you join me on a marathon. ;)

    It's the 'eco' part of it that I'm laughing at. There's f-all 'eco' about it.
    Actually I agree with that. “Eco” is just a trendy prefix that any slightly rough edged rustic hotel attaches to its name and then they can add 20-30% to the price

    Also this place doesn’t need trendy prefixes. It is genuinely incredible

    People are gathering here from all over the world for this ceremony. European artists, tech bros, bohemian property moguls, some serious scientists, Dutch movie directors

    Right now as I sit by the river I can hear a New York drama dude discussing his experimental use of new age MDMA with a tribal elder right behind me

    Bonkers

    I confess I am slightly apprehensive about the yage
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,327
    Stocky said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    I'll do that after you join me on a marathon. ;)

    It's the 'eco' part of it that I'm laughing at. There's f-all 'eco' about it.
    What if they were called rustic wildlife observation lodges? That's basically what they are.
    The wildlife gathers to watch Leon take hallucinogenic drugs?
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159
    TOPPING said:

    Oh god we're not here again, are we? As it stood there were around 4m people (12% of the electorate) who wanted a Brexit referendum and used their democratic welly to bring it about. Exactly as it should be. Had Dave not agreed to the referendum there is every chance that the Cons wouldn't have won the GE. Dave did it for this reason. It's simple (and effective) politics.

    I don't think he meant to win, did he? I thought that was another of those unfortunate surprises, the LDs being easier bedfellows for him than the 4m voters he didn't like at all.
  • Options
    AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 23,803
    LOL Galloway threatening to de-seat Angela Rayner
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,344
    eek said:

    Supreme Court says Trump is still on the ballot https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    The decision is not a surprise.
    The majority going on unnecessarily to rewrite the law regarding federal powers is the level of pitiful jurisprudence we've come to expect of them.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    Stocky said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
    The thing is you have taken the trouble to adventurously get to a sublimely beautiful tropical place replete with wildlife and largely away from humans yet you are about to take mind-altering drugs. If I were brave enough to do that (I'm not) I'd do it at home I think.
    We’re all here FOR the drugs

    This place (I shan’t name it) now basically just does this. Spirit quests. Sun dances. Ayahuasca ceremonies

    It attracts the best ayahuesqueros and the people that run it are famous for it. You could come here for an “ordinary” holiday but few do (it is very remote) and the owner told me yesterday that they are now shifting entirely to this spiritual experientialism

    It’s very trendy and also notably profitable. People pay big money for this
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,344
    ,

    Sean_F said:

    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.

    9-0 as well.
    Dissents from Sotamayor, Kagan, and Jackson on quite a few parts.
    And ACB.
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,816

    I remember when we all talked about 30% being the hard bottom of Conservative party polling...

    Their hard bottoms must be twitching these days.
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,539
    mwadams said:

    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    I don't disagree that this was the failure of action.
    But the failure of thinking behind that was a belief that he was clever enough to kill them off for a generation without understanding why that policy wouldn't work.
    Hubris. The same thing that led Blair to Iraq. Too much success is bad for a person unless they have the (rare) maturity and insight to ascribe most of it to chance.
  • Options
    CatManCatMan Posts: 2,822
    mwadams said:

    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    I don't disagree that this was the failure of action.
    But the failure of thinking behind that was a belief that he was clever enough to kill them off for a generation without understanding why that policy wouldn't work.
    This is what was so stupid. Even if Remain had won 60%, the Leavers weren't going to say "Oh well, never mind, we shall never mention the EU ever again". They'd have carried on exactly as before.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,355
    CatMan said:

    mwadams said:

    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    I don't disagree that this was the failure of action.
    But the failure of thinking behind that was a belief that he was clever enough to kill them off for a generation without understanding why that policy wouldn't work.
    This is what was so stupid. Even if Remain had won 60%, the Leavers weren't going to say "Oh well, never mind, we shall never mention the EU ever again". They'd have carried on exactly as before.
    The theory must have been that having the bulk of the three main parties all campaigning for Remain would deliver a 70-30 win.
  • Options
    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,329
    @jburnmurdoch

    As I said to someone yesterday, we’re moving towards the kind of territory where the Tories could come not second but third.

    Lib Dems would be the leader of the opposition, Tories increasingly peripheral.




    If Richi doesn't go early, the decision will be removed from him...
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,159
    CatMan said:

    mwadams said:

    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    I don't disagree that this was the failure of action.
    But the failure of thinking behind that was a belief that he was clever enough to kill them off for a generation without understanding why that policy wouldn't work.
    This is what was so stupid. Even if Remain had won 60%, the Leavers weren't going to say "Oh well, never mind, we shall never mention the EU ever again". They'd have carried on exactly as before.
    Exactly - this is where I agree with @TOPPING below - there was no clever solution.

    The real question is how many of the 4 million voters he talks about would 'kicking the can down the road' have lost to the Tories. Enough to have lost to Ed Milliband's Labour? My guess is 'no', but YMMV. And what impact would that have had come 2019/2020?
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 47,881
    kamski said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
    You're disrespecting the medicine. No good will come of this.
    I have taken advice from Kunaq the ayahuasquero himself. I’m doing a short dieta

    He said a cup of calming red wine is not a problem. No beer or spirits on the day tho. No red meat. No sex (I wish: there’s a beautiful English costume designer here, who keeps swimming in the waterfall, sigh).

    Oh god she’s swimming again. I may have to pretend to read my simon bolivar biography
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 18,976

    Lord Cameron - chortle.

    The man who wrecked the conservatives.

    Nah, that's the Europhobes. They've destroyed they party several times, and replaced competent leaders with purists.

    And they're still there, like a turd that won't flush.
    Cameron just couldnt do party management, there were huge swathes of the country he just didnt understand.
    The good burghers of Jaywick and Clapton?
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,089

    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.

    OK, so as I understand that, they duck the question of whether Trump is disqualified, by ruling that whether he is or is not cannot be up to individual States, so attempts by States to kick him off the ballot fail. Yes?
  • Options
    StockyStocky Posts: 9,743
    Leon said:

    kamski said:

    Leon said:

    TOPPING said:

    Leon said:

    Fpt for @JosiasJessop

    “The idea of jetting halfway across the world to stay for a few days in an 'eco' lodge is hilariously ridiculous.”

    Why? I’m having a lovely time. It’s beautiful



    Come and join me in by the waterfall for a cup of excellent Malbec. When it gets too hot you can swim in the river. Its idyllic

    What’s wrong with that??

    Red wine in the tropics is all wrong. You should stick to the local beer. And spirits if you must.
    Dude, I’m about to take one of the strongest hallucinogens known to man with one of its most famous exponents, surrounded by a team of world class scientists (and a film crew) investigating its extraordinary, possibly paradigm-changing entheogenic qualities, I don’t need a lecture on my choice of more minor intoxicants. But thanks anyway
    You're disrespecting the medicine. No good will come of this.
    I have taken advice from Kunaq the ayahuasquero himself. I’m doing a short dieta

    He said a cup of calming red wine is not a problem. No beer or spirits on the day tho. No red meat. No sex (I wish: there’s a beautiful English costume designer here, who keeps swimming in the waterfall, sigh).

    Oh god she’s swimming again. I may have to pretend to read my simon bolivar biography
    Time for one of your holiday pics? Hide behind a leaf and zoom in or something.
  • Options
    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,562
    Scott_xP said:

    @jburnmurdoch

    As I said to someone yesterday, we’re moving towards the kind of territory where the Tories could come not second but third.

    Lib Dems would be the leader of the opposition, Tories increasingly peripheral.




    If Richi doesn't go early, the decision will be removed from him...

    The Lib Dem’s won’t come second on vote count. If the Tories collapse to third or lower it will be because Reform has supplanted them.

    I suppose that theoretically there is an outcome where the LDs come second on seat count but I wouldn’t count on it.
  • Options
    Dura_AceDura_Ace Posts: 13,126
    Looks like May 2nd is out the window on those numbers.

    It'll have to be January. Tumour King is wowing the Antipodeans in October with his unique brand of testy incoherence and then we are into Season 2 of The Trump Show and then it's Christmas.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,355
    mwadams said:

    CatMan said:

    mwadams said:

    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    I don't disagree that this was the failure of action.
    But the failure of thinking behind that was a belief that he was clever enough to kill them off for a generation without understanding why that policy wouldn't work.
    This is what was so stupid. Even if Remain had won 60%, the Leavers weren't going to say "Oh well, never mind, we shall never mention the EU ever again". They'd have carried on exactly as before.
    Exactly - this is where I agree with @TOPPING below - there was no clever solution.

    The real question is how many of the 4 million voters he talks about would 'kicking the can down the road' have lost to the Tories. Enough to have lost to Ed Milliband's Labour? My guess is 'no', but YMMV. And what impact would that have had come 2019/2020?
    I've made this point before but if only Cameron had come down on the side of Leave and said that his deal just wasn't good enough, then it would have avoided most of the political problems, both for him and the country. He would have been ideally placed to carry on as PM and negotiate either a soft Brexit or genuinely reformed membership terms.
  • Options
    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,562
    edited March 4

    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.

    OK, so as I understand that, they duck the question of whether Trump is disqualified, by ruling that whether he is or is not cannot be up to individual States, so attempts by States to kick him off the ballot fail. Yes?
    Yes but unless I’ve misread it the majority have also said that section 3 is not self executing i.e Congress is the one that needs to decide if someone is eligible or not first. So essentially the chances of Trump being held ineligible are pretty much zero.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 31,967

    Nigelb said:

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    You have a limited imagination, then.
    Her fiscal plans have been shown by hindsight to have been entirely affordable. Had her platform been implemented, we'd have had no CT rise, and a raft of policies aimed at tackling inflation at its root cause by increasing domestic supply of energy and food. I think it very unlikely we'd have dipped into recession, and that would have improved the public finances, which are massively skewed by growth or lack of it.
    Who by? Can you post a link? Thanks!
  • Options
    kinabalukinabalu Posts: 39,539

    Nigelb said:

    Perhaps MarqueeMark, Casino Royale, and HYUFD would like to explain why they felt so strongly that this useless article was the key to restoring the party's electoral fortunes.

    Perhaps everyone attacking the Tory membership 'loonies' and their role in leadership elections should apologise, given that clearly they realised that he was a completely empty suit in the hustings and voted as wisely as possible given the choice that they were presented with by MPs.

    I would just say Truss was worse, much worse, and handed labour the biggest gift on fiscal probity that could have had on their wildest dreams, far far worse than ' there is no money'

    And of course in the last week she has been making an utter fool of herself in the USv
    But yet at her polling nadir, she polled better than Sunak is now, and it's almost impossible to conceive of a situation whereby the passage of time would not have improved her polling still further.
    You have a limited imagination, then.
    Her fiscal plans have been shown by hindsight to have been entirely affordable. Had her platform been implemented, we'd have had no CT rise, and a raft of policies aimed at tackling inflation at its root cause by increasing domestic supply of energy and food. I think it very unlikely we'd have dipped into recession, and that would have improved the public finances, which are massively skewed by growth or lack of it.
    She's assuming the glamour of the rock star died young in your mind, isn't she?
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 44,975

    mwadams said:

    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........

    Are YouGov prepared for the consequences?
    I am about to order the M3 Macbook Air that was announced today which means in a few weeks time I have to hand my old Macbook to the Apple store staff to transfer things across.
    You mean you don’t use iCloud backup?

    I encrypt anything I want confidential and backup to iCloud, and a NAS (which mirrors to another storage provider).
  • Options
    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 114,789

    mwadams said:

    So YouGov are offering me 30 points a week if I will share my browsing history once a week with them.........

    Are YouGov prepared for the consequences?
    I am about to order the M3 Macbook Air that was announced today which means in a few weeks time I have to hand my old Macbook to the Apple store staff to transfer things across.
    You mean you don’t use iCloud backup?

    I encrypt anything I want confidential and backup to iCloud, and a NAS (which mirrors to another storage provider).
    I do.

    But I have a lot of video recordings on there.

    Family stuff, usually in 4K.
  • Options
    Casino_RoyaleCasino_Royale Posts: 55,869
    Scott_xP said:

    mwadams said:

    As a broadly Europhile ex-Tory, I have to agree with @Alanbrooke - it was Cameron who destroyed the Tories by failing to understand what it was that the eurosceptics represented, and to whom.

    Nah.

    His mistake was appeasing them.

    He should have expelled them.
    Over 60% of Conservative voters voted Leave, and almost 45% of the parliamentary party.

    Such a policy would have reduced them to a rump.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,344
    Nigelb said:

    ,

    Sean_F said:

    SCOTUS rules Trump wrongly removed from the Colorado ballot.

    https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-719_19m2.pdf

    But it is great to see SCOTUS can move quickly when required.

    9-0 as well.
    Dissents from Sotamayor, Kagan, and Jackson on quite a few parts.
    And ACB.
    There is one interesting part of the judgment (though given the limited amount of time before the election, it's probably moot anyway).

    ...That law made engaging in insurrection or rebellion, among other acts, a federal crime punishable by disqualification from holding office under the United States. See §§2, 3, 12 Stat. 590. A successor to those provisions remains on the books today. See 18 U. S. C. §2383...

    Probably not an invitation to charge Trump under 18 U.S. Code § 2383 - Rebellion or insurrection, but it could be read as that.
    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2383#
  • Options
    numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 5,562
    edited March 4
    Dura_Ace said:

    Looks like May 2nd is out the window on those numbers.

    It'll have to be January. Tumour King is wowing the Antipodeans in October with his unique brand of testy incoherence and then we are into Season 2 of The Trump Show and then it's Christmas.

    October surely not out of the question now as it’s highly questionable KCIII will be undertaking international travel for the foreseeable, successful treatment or no.
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