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A Dismal Spectacle – politicalbetting.com

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    david_herdsondavid_herdson Posts: 17,491

    IanB2 said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    You'll regret asking Big_G - S&M = sado-masochism.

    Liz Truss wears a necklace that Leon advises has an S&M pendant on it. And I am not in a position to say he's wrong tbh.
    My wife maintains that I have a very mischievous side, so maybe it has just been activated with my question !!!!!
    Voting for Boris Johnson created enough mischief for a lifetime, thank you very much
    Better than voting for Corbyn though
    We'll never know will we?

    Personally, I think Corbyn would have been kept in check by the sensible wing of the Labour Party but equally I cannot know that.
    I would go further. I think he would barely have has time to unpack before he was squeezed out in one way or another.
    Extremely unlikely. Corbyn would have been The Absolute Boy for the members, having just won an election. Look how unassailable his position was after 2016, when he screwed up the Brexit vote from Labour's contribution and hadn't just done unexpectedly well in a general election, as after 2017. If he won in 2019, he'd have been there at least until 2022.

    In normal circumstances, he'd have been there for the full 5 years. Covid wouldn't have changed that, though there'd have been grumbling from Labour MPs about Corbyn's innate scepticism and credulousness about Chinese claims. However, Ukraine might have seen him off, as it could have provoked the biggest crisis in Labour since 1931.

    That said, had he won, we'd have had the joy of a second Brexit referendum on a very flawed premise. God know how (or even when, given Covid) that would have played out.
  • Options
    kjhkjh Posts: 10,776
    edited February 23
    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    I lead a sheltered life so it would never occur to me.
    I wonder how many people wear stuff that gives out messages that they are completely unaware of. I imagine lots. I wouldn't have a clue. Luckily I don't wear any jewellery of any kind. I have never worn a wedding ring and haven't worn a watch for decades.
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,477

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,163
    Election timing thought: does delaying the election have an impact due to dempgraphics?

    - The latest YouGov suggests that over 65s break 35-27 for the Conservatives.
    - In contrast the 18-24 yo group break 11-59 for Labour.
    - Delaying the GE from May to November is will see half a year's cohort of 18 yos join the electorate - circa 380k according to the ONS
    - A smaller number of over 65 yos will die in those six months: say, 300k over 65s.
    - Allow for the fact that turnout of over 65s is typically 80%, whereas for 18-24s it's c.50%.

    Net result: delaying the election by six months will cost the Tories 63.1k votes and gain Labour 47.3k votes - unless there is any drift with age* towards the Tories.

    Based on 2017 turnout figures that's a 0.2% drop for the Tories and a 0.15% increase for Labour.

    Not huge but hardly helpful to the Tories.


    https://ygo-assets-websites-editorial-emea.yougov.net/documents/TheTimes_VI_240221_W.pdf

    https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/populationprojections/articles/being18in2018/2018-09-13

    *Frankly, I can't see any evidence for that drift at the moment. Compare the age splits of last comparable YouGov before the 2019 GE with the their lates poll - the 50-64 age group has flipped its allegiance from Tories to Labour.

    https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/itsi0h01ub/TheSundayTimes_VI_Results_191206_w.pdf
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    AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 954
    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    It was pretty well known in the late 2000s, when the 'turnip taliban' were trying to block her selection as a PPC - her old Informed Consent profile was (partly) viewable on the wayback machine...
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 45,102
    a

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    Point of order - the PIRA claimed to be the inheritors of 1798. Which was non-sectarian.
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    PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 76,067
    edited February 23
    Nigelb said:

    Interesting thread on how Sora works (or might work)
    https://twitter.com/MattNiessner/status/1760843660424306727

    Is all this AI generated stuff why Nvidia stock is up like Bitcoin from a few years back ?

    They're essentially selling the shovels for the AI goldrush ? Or is it still bitcoin mining. Probably both...
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    viewcodeviewcode Posts: 19,339

    Interesting thread on Google’s woke AI problems:

    https://x.com/yishan/status/1760859214875132161

    That’s not why this is important. This event is not significant for culture war reasons. You just think so because that’s all anyone is thinking about these days, and everyone has missed the real danger.

    Yes, I think that is very much worth reading. These models are entirely unable to perform the most basic of sanity checks.
    Because they're not conscious. They do not IIUI attach knowledge to data. They don't know that the pink shape with five protrusions is a hand. They can't do sanity checks.

    (you probably know this already, but it's for the kids in the cheap seats)
  • Options

    a

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    Point of order - the PIRA claimed to be the inheritors of 1798. Which was non-sectarian.
    And I claim to be modest and working class, self description isn’t always true.
  • Options

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,477

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518
    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Interesting thread on how Sora works (or might work)
    https://twitter.com/MattNiessner/status/1760843660424306727

    Is all this AI generated stuff why Nvidia stock is up like Bitcoin from a few years back ?

    They're essentially selling the shovels for the goldrush ?
    Most of it, yes.
    The interesting thing is that while it's being given away quite cheaply, AI is a pretty expensive endeavour; similar scale to the NHS budget.
    Though in global terms, that's not all that much, I suppose.

    It will get really interesting when all the new fabs come on stream and costs fall by an order of magnitude or two.
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,256

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    But only after he's finished talking to Leon about multiculturalism.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,163

    In reference to an earlier comment, of course Starmer won't throw out anything good that the Tories have done while in power.
    He'll keep the £2 capped bus fare.
    Er, that's it.

    Same-sex marriage, Recall of MPs (although both of those were the coalition, so the Tories probably delivered them under duress).
  • Options

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518
    Actually, they can't even tell you "what he did".

    House GOP increasingly acknowledging they don't have the votes to impeach Biden:

    Bacon estimated 20-30 are not in favor "mainly because it smells bad what he did, it looks bad, but when you ask them what crime is committed — they can’t tell you"

    https://twitter.com/jordainc/status/1761025581494292492
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    Scott_xPScott_xP Posts: 33,786
    @RedfieldWilton
    Labour is more trusted than the Conservatives on EVERY policy issue prompted.

    Which party do voters trust most on...?

    (Labour | Conservatives)

    NHS (44% | 16%)
    Poverty (42% | 16%)
    Education (40% | 18%)
    Economy (37% | 23%)
    Immigration (33% | 21%)
    Ukraine (32% | 24%)
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 45,102

    a

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    Point of order - the PIRA claimed to be the inheritors of 1798. Which was non-sectarian.
    And I claim to be modest and working class, self description isn’t always true.
    I thought your modesty was legendary?
  • Options

    a

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    Point of order - the PIRA claimed to be the inheritors of 1798. Which was non-sectarian.
    And I claim to be modest and working class, self description isn’t always true.
    I thought your modesty was legendary?
    As a few people have noted it is more mythical than legendary.

    Tbf I was modest/shy/self effacing until I went to university.
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,163

    a

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    Point of order - the PIRA claimed to be the inheritors of 1798. Which was non-sectarian.
    And I claim to be modest and working class, self description isn’t always true.
    I thought your modesty was legendary?
    Legend: a traditional story sometimes popularly regarded as historical but not authenticated.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,087
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518

    a

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    Point of order - the PIRA claimed to be the inheritors of 1798. Which was non-sectarian.
    And I claim to be modest and working class, self description isn’t always true.
    I thought your modesty was legendary?
    Legends aren't always true either.

    (See Liberty Valance.)
  • Options
    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,163
    edited February 23

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Simple: no one else would have him.

    And when push came to shove his principles turned out to be Marxist.
    https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/1185-those-are-my-principles-and-if-you-don-t-like-them-well
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,681

    Interesting thread on Google’s woke AI problems:

    https://x.com/yishan/status/1760859214875132161

    That’s not why this is important. This event is not significant for culture war reasons. You just think so because that’s all anyone is thinking about these days, and everyone has missed the real danger.

    What did you think of Liz Trump's speech?
    I haven't watched it yet. :)
    It was 24 carat bollocks, but you'll love it.
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    TheScreamingEaglesTheScreamingEagles Posts: 115,008
    edited February 23
    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    Being mad is unusual for a Cambridge historian, see also Nick Griffin.
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    BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 32,163
    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    ...unlike Powell, who was just a bit mad.
  • Options
    AlsoLeiAlsoLei Posts: 954

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    He was UUP, though, wasn't he? Still wildly sectarian, but too polite to be openly vicious - "Decent people vote UUP" and all that.

    I believe that he was the only UUP MP that the DUP stood against in the 1980s, on the basis that he was "a foreigner and a Catholic" (by which they meant he was high-church Anglican...)
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    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,477
    edited February 23

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    One man's religious extremist is another man's true adherent to the word and law of God and his prophets
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 45,102
    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    One of those people so bright that he disconnected from reality and common sense.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426
    edited February 23

    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    ...unlike Powell, who was just a bit mad.
    Powell paved the way for Thatcher though, much like Goldwater did for Reagan
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    isamisam Posts: 41,118
    edited February 23

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    The road to where we’ve ended up

    https://traditionalbritain.org/blog/road-national-suicide/
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    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 45,102
    AlsoLei said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    He was UUP, though, wasn't he? Still wildly sectarian, but too polite to be openly vicious - "Decent people vote UUP" and all that.

    I believe that he was the only UUP MP that the DUP stood against in the 1980s, on the basis that he was "a foreigner and a Catholic" (by which they meant he was high-church Anglican...)
    The UUP was *supposed* not to be sectarian. The polite ones.
  • Options

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,477

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
  • Options
    IanB2IanB2 Posts: 47,699
    kjh said:

    malcolmg said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    I lead a sheltered life so it would never occur to me.
    I wonder how many people wear stuff that gives out messages that they are completely unaware of. I imagine lots. I wouldn't have a clue. Luckily I don't wear any jewellery of any kind. I have never worn a wedding ring and haven't worn a watch for decades.
    You can have fun with people unwittingly growing pampas grass in their front gardens, as well
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,681
    HYUFD said:

    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    ...unlike Powell, who was just a bit mad.
    Powell paved the way for Thatcher though, much like Goldwater did for Reagan
    I don't believe either of those assertions is correct.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,355

    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    ...unlike Powell, who was just a bit mad.
    Not fair. Powell was very bright. Fellow of Trinity (the Fenland one), sure, but then Professor of Greek at Sydney and then - if the war had not aborted his move - Durham.
  • Options

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,681

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,355

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    That's Liberal Imperialist, surely?
  • Options
    Carnyx said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    That's Liberal Imperialist, surely?
    It’s not imperial, that Union was endorsed in 2014.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,087
    I see Andrei Morozov, the Russian blogger, has "committed suicide" after revealing the extent of Russian casualties, suffered in the fight for Avdiika.
  • Options

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
  • Options
    JohnOJohnO Posts: 4,217

    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    Being mad is unusual for a Cambridge historian, see also Nick Griffin.
    Except Powell read Classics.
  • Options
    JohnO said:

    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    Being mad is unusual for a Cambridge historian, see also Nick Griffin.
    Except Powell read Classics.
    Which is kind of history discipline.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,681
    edited February 23

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
    Welsh rugby fans? Well that covers all of Wales South of and including Aberystwyth and most of North Wales outside the Scouse enclaves and Wrexham.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,826

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    That's not true. It's the Unionist Party in Scotland that merged with the Conservatives after the Unionist Party in Ulster broke their ties with the Tories.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,423
    Sean_F said:

    I see Andrei Morozov, the Russian blogger, has "committed suicide" after revealing the extent of Russian casualties, suffered in the fight for Avdiika.

    Yes, that's an odd one. Was he suicided, or was his apparently rather long and rambling note of despair real?
  • Options
    mwadamsmwadams Posts: 3,175
    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Interesting thread on how Sora works (or might work)
    https://twitter.com/MattNiessner/status/1760843660424306727

    Is all this AI generated stuff why Nvidia stock is up like Bitcoin from a few years back ?

    They're essentially selling the shovels for the AI goldrush ? Or is it still bitcoin mining. Probably both...
    Mostly the shovels for the AI goldrush.

    However, when the hype dies down, their excellent array of shovels will also dig the irrigation trenches for the data pipelines we actually need anyway. So the reality will probably catch up with the market's over-enthusiasm and the analysts will consider themselves far-seeing geniuses.

  • Options
    SelebianSelebian Posts: 7,629
    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
  • Options
    MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 45,102
    mwadams said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Interesting thread on how Sora works (or might work)
    https://twitter.com/MattNiessner/status/1760843660424306727

    Is all this AI generated stuff why Nvidia stock is up like Bitcoin from a few years back ?

    They're essentially selling the shovels for the AI goldrush ? Or is it still bitcoin mining. Probably both...
    Mostly the shovels for the AI goldrush.

    However, when the hype dies down, their excellent array of shovels will also dig the irrigation trenches for the data pipelines we actually need anyway. So the reality will probably catch up with the market's over-enthusiasm and the analysts will consider themselves far-seeing geniuses.

    Short version - they are making the best kit to run neural networks on. The kit is also very useful for any kind of matrix maths problems.

    This will have lots of value even if "AI" vanished tomorrow.
  • Options
    RogerRoger Posts: 19,027
    IanB2 said:

    Chris said:

    I think this kind of attack would be better published above the writer's name rather than under a pseudonym.

    I don't object to it, but am not particularly impressed by it, either. Sometimes the author perhaps slips into preferring to grandstand rather than say something more constructive.
    Nothing goes down on this site better than a bit of repetitive grandstanding
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,423
    Phew! IM's lunar lander is alive in good health. There has not been an update in 12 hours, so I was getting nervous.

    "Odysseus is alive and well. Flight controllers are communicating and commanding the vehicle to download science data. The lander has good telemetry and solar charging."

    https://twitter.com/Int_Machines/status/1761032731729739804

    They had major problems yesterday before landing, as they lost the sensors for terrain avoidance and navigation. Fortunately they managed a software patch to use the cameras on a NASA payload to do this for them. I'm glad I didn't have to create that last-minute software patch...

    https://arstechnica.com/space/2024/02/a-little-us-company-makes-history-by-landing-on-the-moon-but-questions-remain/
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,256
    Roger said:

    IanB2 said:

    Chris said:

    I think this kind of attack would be better published above the writer's name rather than under a pseudonym.

    I don't object to it, but am not particularly impressed by it, either. Sometimes the author perhaps slips into preferring to grandstand rather than say something more constructive.
    Nothing goes down on this site better than a bit of repetitive grandstanding
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLHMxFGqhIs
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,087
    Selebian said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
    It was unclear to me, as well. I think a girlfriend is more casual.
  • Options
    Sean_FSean_F Posts: 36,087
    Cicero said:

    As the frilly fascists on the Tory right come out for Donald Trump, I can not help wondering what happened to the actual Conservatives in the Tory Party. The overwhelming majority of people in the UK would not vote for Trump if he was the last man on earth. So, when faced with late converts to the orange traitor, even the tiny minority that think that DJT isn´t fascist dog dirt are not going to vote Tory, though maybe some will vote for Farage, who has at least been a consistent backer of the fake tan swine.

    For Truss, Johnson et al, It is not just the crawling to a total bastard that makes these cretins unelectable, it is the utterly pathetic way they make themselves look.

    The only good thing about these craven assholes is the way they are driving Conservative voters away from the Tory brand at a fair rate of knots. Last night´s local by elections showing the Lib Dems winning in places like Wilts that used to be Tory heartlands shows that more clearly than ever.

    4 retentions, 1 gain, and 2 losses was, I thought, surprisingly good for the Conservatives.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
  • Options
    williamglennwilliamglenn Posts: 48,477
    edited February 23

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    That's not true. It's the Unionist Party in Scotland that merged with the Conservatives after the Unionist Party in Ulster broke their ties with the Tories.
    It is true. The Unionist bit long predates that merger. Neville Chamberlain always stood as a Unionist, for example.
  • Options
    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
  • Options
    bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 8,256
    Sean_F said:

    Selebian said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
    It was unclear to me, as well. I think a girlfriend is more casual.
    People who supposedly have exciting sex lives seem to spend a lot of time worrying about terminology. This may suggest the sex can't be that exciting if they're spending all their time thinking about labels instead...
  • Options
    Selebian said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
    You don't have to celebrate anniversaries with the mistress, with a girlfriend you have to celebrate three month/six month/annual anniversaries which is a bloody pain when you've also got a wife.

    There's also an expectation for gifts and meals.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,826

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    That's not true. It's the Unionist Party in Scotland that merged with the Conservatives after the Unionist Party in Ulster broke their ties with the Tories.
    It is true. The Unionist bit long predates that merger. Neville Chamberlain always stood as a Unionist, for example.
    Oh God. You're right, and I'm wrong again. I always feel the strongest urge towards pedantry when I'm least likely to be right. Aargh.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 48,088
    viewcode said:

    Interesting thread on Google’s woke AI problems:

    https://x.com/yishan/status/1760859214875132161

    That’s not why this is important. This event is not significant for culture war reasons. You just think so because that’s all anyone is thinking about these days, and everyone has missed the real danger.

    Yes, I think that is very much worth reading. These models are entirely unable to perform the most basic of sanity checks.
    Because they're not conscious. They do not IIUI attach knowledge to data. They don't know that the pink shape with five protrusions is a hand. They can't do sanity checks.

    (you probably know this already, but it's for the kids in the cheap seats)
    Can I just say it’s great that ‘@viewcode’ - some anonymous twat off of “PB” - has personally solved the Problem of Consciousness, a question which has vexed the greatest minds since the dawn of time, and never found an answer

    But ‘viewcode’ has!? Huzzah

    Perhaps then he could explain and define consciousness in a couple of easy sentences, and also tell us what is a conscious creature, choosing from a virus, a wasp, a tree, a gorilla, a bee colony, gpt4, a human, a toadstool, a solar system, the universe, and a dog?
  • Options
    CyclefreeCyclefree Posts: 25,269
    edited February 23

    Cyclefree said:

    FFS! This government can't even manage to exonerate convicted subpostmasters properly ..... 😡

    https://open.substack.com/pub/rozenberg/p/flaw-in-the-ointment?r=2ch8i4&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email

    It gets worse.

    More than 250 victims of Post Office scandal have died without justice

    In April The Times found that 59 postmasters who had fallen foul of the Horizon IT fiasco had died. That figure has since quadrupled

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/post-office-scandal-postmasters-dead-d66m3jbv6
    Yeah - I saw that too.

    It is perfectly obvious that the government is stringing this out as slowly and for as long as possible until everyone affected has died or given up. Just as it is doing with the victims of the blood contamination scandal. And getting others to suggest that they were all really guilty anyway. (See the Peters & Peters letter, which is a disgrace and which a mildly intelligent child could pull apart.)

    Were I the Judge I'd tell them this in very crisp terms, simply close the Inquiry on the basis that it is a waste of time given the entirely cynical callousness of the government's policy and say that the judicial process should not be misused to give a fig leaf of cover to such dishonourable conduct.
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,355

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    Of a Northern Ireland still in the UK and where SF and the SDLP combined still get a lower voteshare than the DUP, UUP and TUV combined
  • Options
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    To bring it back on topic, we had to do it, to stop religious extremists killing our MPs because that's what they used to do in my lifetime.
  • Options
    LostPasswordLostPassword Posts: 15,826
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is not within the EU.
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is NOT in the EU, it is not even in the EEA, it just has full access to the single market (and indeed GB effectively now Sunak has ensured no checks on goods going to and from NI to GB)
  • Options
    Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 601

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
    Moi??
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,355
    edited February 23
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is NOT in the EU, it is not even in the EEA, it just has full access to the single market (and indeed GB effectively now Sunak has ensured no checks on goods going to and from NI to GB)
    With inhabitants [edit] most of whom have joint citizenship with the EU, though, remember.

    And a customs border down the Irish Sea, for all that it's not being implemented temporarily.

    Damned odd Unionist Union.
  • Options
    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,681
    ...
    Cyclefree said:

    Cyclefree said:

    FFS! This government can't even manage to exonerate convicted subpostmasters properly ..... 😡

    https://open.substack.com/pub/rozenberg/p/flaw-in-the-ointment?r=2ch8i4&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email

    It gets worse.

    More than 250 victims of Post Office scandal have died without justice

    In April The Times found that 59 postmasters who had fallen foul of the Horizon IT fiasco had died. That figure has since quadrupled

    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/post-office-scandal-postmasters-dead-d66m3jbv6
    Yeah - I saw that too.

    It is perfectly obvious that the government is stringing this out as slowly and for as long as possible until everyone affected has died or given up. Just as it is doing with the victims of the blood contamination scandal. And getting others to suggest that they were all really guilty anyway. (See the Peters & Peters letter, which is a disgrace and which a mildly intelligent child could pull apart.)

    Were I the Judge I'd tell them this in very crisp terms, simply close the Inquiry on the basis that it is a waste of time given the entirely cynical callousness of the government's policy and say that the judicial process should not be misused to give a fig leaf of cover to such dishonourable conduct.
    One interesting feature of the Hoylegate scandal was it rendered the Badenoch incompetent petulance story stone cold, just as it had been coming to the boil.

    I think she go away with it!
  • Options
    Penddu2 said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
    Moi??
    Your brethren, absolutely unprovoked, have called me a Nigel (wtf?), told where I can stick the sweet chariot, questioned my parentage, and that's the ones who were being friendly.
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 48,088
    Sean_F said:

    Selebian said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
    It was unclear to me, as well. I think a girlfriend is more casual.
    This may be a misunderstanding of BDSM terminology

    In kink world, a girlfriend is a girlfriend

    A mistress is a different thing entirely: she is a domme, a dominatrix, she wields the whip and administers the paddle

    So if kink woman x is the mistress of kink man y, it means she dominates him and he accepts it as her sub

    Quite a common dynamic, tho not to my taste

    Incidentally, if any pb-ers are thinking of getting into kink, try and be a lesbian domme - they are the rarest and therefore most in demand - so they have the most fun

    The most common are probably heterosexual male subs. Then hetero male doms closely followed or equalled by heterosexual female subs.

    Kinky lesbian dommes are like hen’s teeth! I know this because a good friend of mine runs sex parties and he has to pay them a lot

    This a is a good tip for the post AI world when we all have to become sex workers
  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426
    edited February 23
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is NOT in the EU, it is not even in the EEA, it just has full access to the single market (and indeed GB effectively now Sunak has ensured no checks on goods going to and from NI to GB)
    With inhabitants [edit] most of whom have joint citizenship with the EU, though, remember.

    And a customs border down the Irish Sea, for all that it's not being implemented temporarily.

    Damned odd Unionist Union.
    They could have joint citizenship with EU Ireland even before Brexit, it is still not in the EU.

    And still no border checks now on goods going to and from NI to GB and if Starmer gets in and rejoins a customs union even the technical customs border would effectively disappear too
  • Options
    Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 601
    On the subject of rugby - my predictions for the weekend:

    Wales Ireland. Wales will be very scrappy and in the match for maybe 50-60 mins - but Ireland will eventually be too dominant. Wales 16 Ireland 28

    Scotland England. A very close game with lead changing hands many times - Scotland 22 England 20.

    France Italy. I expect the half assed French team to turn up - letting Italy have a go for a while before waking up in last 15 mis. France 30 Italy 14
  • Options
    LeonLeon Posts: 48,088
    Penddu2 said:

    On the subject of rugby - my predictions for the weekend:

    Wales Ireland. Wales will be very scrappy and in the match for maybe 50-60 mins - but Ireland will eventually be too dominant. Wales 16 Ireland 28

    Scotland England. A very close game with lead changing hands many times - Scotland 22 England 20.

    France Italy. I expect the half assed French team to turn up - letting Italy have a go for a while before waking up in last 15 mis. France 30 Italy 14

    Aren’t you on 6/6 results, so far in the 6N? If so, huge respect

    I agree with your analysis here tho I think Ireland will do a bit better than that and Scotland likewise
  • Options
    CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 40,355
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is NOT in the EU, it is not even in the EEA, it just has full access to the single market (and indeed GB effectively now Sunak has ensured no checks on goods going to and from NI to GB)
    With inhabitants [edit] most of whom have joint citizenship with the EU, though, remember.

    And a customs border down the Irish Sea, for all that it's not being implemented temporarily.

    Damned odd Unionist Union.
    They could have joint citizenship with EU Ireland even before Brexit, it is still not in the EU.

    And still no border checks now on goods going to and from NI to GB and if Starmer gets in and rejoins a customs union even the technical customs border would effectively disappear too
    But the people *are* EU citizens for the asking unlike the rest of the UK, and that's a new change between NI and rUK thanks to your lot. Who wanted the complete opposite.
  • Options
    Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 601

    Penddu2 said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
    Moi??
    Your brethren, absolutely unprovoked, have called me a Nigel (wtf?), told where I can stick the sweet chariot, questioned my parentage, and that's the ones who were being friendly.
    To be fair, your shoes scream 'Nigel'... At least they didnt call you a 'Rupert'.
  • Options
    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,423
    Leon said:

    viewcode said:

    Interesting thread on Google’s woke AI problems:

    https://x.com/yishan/status/1760859214875132161

    That’s not why this is important. This event is not significant for culture war reasons. You just think so because that’s all anyone is thinking about these days, and everyone has missed the real danger.

    Yes, I think that is very much worth reading. These models are entirely unable to perform the most basic of sanity checks.
    Because they're not conscious. They do not IIUI attach knowledge to data. They don't know that the pink shape with five protrusions is a hand. They can't do sanity checks.

    (you probably know this already, but it's for the kids in the cheap seats)
    Can I just say it’s great that ‘@viewcode’ - some anonymous twat off of “PB” - has personally solved the Problem of Consciousness, a question which has vexed the greatest minds since the dawn of time, and never found an answer

    But ‘viewcode’ has!? Huzzah

    Perhaps then he could explain and define consciousness in a couple of easy sentences, and also tell us what is a conscious creature, choosing from a virus, a wasp, a tree, a gorilla, a bee colony, gpt4, a human, a toadstool, a solar system, the universe, and a dog?
    I have a pen sitting on my desk. It is a fairly cheap Parker pen, but I like it.

    I can say with certainty that it is not conscious, even though the stuff I write with it might, on rare occasions, show intelligence and/or consciousness.

    What is *your* couple of easy sentences that define consciousness , which would include the LLM stuff as conscious?
  • Options
    Alphabet_SoupAlphabet_Soup Posts: 2,794
    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    Selebian said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
    It was unclear to me, as well. I think a girlfriend is more casual.
    This may be a misunderstanding of BDSM terminology

    In kink world, a girlfriend is a girlfriend

    A mistress is a different thing entirely: she is a domme, a dominatrix, she wields the whip and administers the paddle

    So if kink woman x is the mistress of kink man y, it means she dominates him and he accepts it as her sub

    Quite a common dynamic, tho not to my taste

    Incidentally, if any pb-ers are thinking of getting into kink, try and be a lesbian domme - they are the rarest and therefore most in demand - so they have the most fun

    The most common are probably heterosexual male subs. Then hetero male doms closely followed or equalled by heterosexual female subs.

    Kinky lesbian dommes are like hen’s teeth! I know this because a good friend of mine runs sex parties and he has to pay them a lot

    This a is a good tip for the post AI world when we all have to become sex workers
    A mistress is part of the family - to sate the alpha male's libido while his wife is busy in the maternity ward or nursery. There would be no secrecy, just a modicum of euphemism in front of the younger children. It would be very bad form for a chap to have more than one mistress.

    But he may have as many girlfriends as he can afford as long as he keeps it to himself.
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    Penddu2Penddu2 Posts: 601
    Leon said:

    Penddu2 said:

    On the subject of rugby - my predictions for the weekend:

    Wales Ireland. Wales will be very scrappy and in the match for maybe 50-60 mins - but Ireland will eventually be too dominant. Wales 16 Ireland 28

    Scotland England. A very close game with lead changing hands many times - Scotland 22 England 20.

    France Italy. I expect the half assed French team to turn up - letting Italy have a go for a while before waking up in last 15 mis. France 30 Italy 14

    Aren’t you on 6/6 results, so far in the 6N? If so, huge respect

    I agree with your analysis here tho I think Ireland will do a bit better than that and Scotland likewise
    To be fair, it is fairly easy picking the winners - it is the margin that is difficult.
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    Penddu2 said:

    Penddu2 said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
    Moi??
    Your brethren, absolutely unprovoked, have called me a Nigel (wtf?), told where I can stick the sweet chariot, questioned my parentage, and that's the ones who were being friendly.
    To be fair, your shoes scream 'Nigel'... At least they didnt call you a 'Rupert'.
    I've been called a Rupert too.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518

    HYUFD said:

    Nigelb said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    One of the few things Heath got right was peremptorily sacking him.

    Bright bloke, but a bit mad.
    ...unlike Powell, who was just a bit mad.
    Powell paved the way for Thatcher though, much like Goldwater did for Reagan
    I don't believe either of those assertions is correct.
    The Goldwater one holds some truth.
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    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518

    Penddu2 said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    Although you would quite like to jettison Wales, or at least the Welsh.
    Fake news.

    I love Wales and the Welsh, it’s the Welsh rugby fans who I don’t like because they’ve been seriously rude to me for over twenty years when I didn’t provoke them.
    Moi??
    Your brethren, absolutely unprovoked, have called me a Nigel (wtf?)
    That could also be taken as a token of deep respect.
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    MexicanpeteMexicanpete Posts: 25,681
    Leon said:

    Sean_F said:

    Selebian said:

    Sean_F said:

    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    ...

    We need to start keeping a list of these Tory fucktards who are coming out for Trump.

    Jake Berry
    Liz Trump
    Jacob Rees-Mogg
    Boris Johnson

    It’s becoming a thing.
    William Glenn
    The Kitchen Cabinet / Mr Ed
    Has Mr Ed really transformed from a TV horse character into an item of IKEA furniture?

    @Oluckyman or whatever his name is also shills for Tru mp/ss

    Yes, it's one of the more remarkable PB transformations
    William Glenn's transformation from Euro-Federalist Remainer to full frontal MAGA apologist is quite remarkable. Has anyone ever seen Liz Truss and William Glenn in the same rightwing conference room, and does he wear an S and M charm?
    What is a S and M charm ?
    Over to Leon, he is an expert on Truss's (jewellery) charm.
    Truss was wearing - and, indeed, constantly wears - what is called a ‘day collar’. This is a fairly discreet necklace or piece of neckwear with S&M hints - perhaps a chain and/or an O Ring like an O gag

    This is an ‘o gag’ for more sheltered pb-ers

    https://www.etsy.com/uk/market/o_ring_gag

    A day collar is a signal to other kinksters that the wearer is a ‘collared sub’ - she acknowledges one or more sexual partners as her owner or dominant. They can be male or female or whatever

    But it is sufficiently anodyne and vanilla that 99.999% of people won’t ever notice it, only the super smart and observant - ie me, after watching 2 minutes of her on the sunak debate - will ever spot it


    Truss has since worn much more overt bdsm clothing and jewelry and she basically admits it now, and there are multiple stories of her being in this world. It is not disputed that this is her thing
    A very comprehensive explanation. Thank you.
    You’re welcome. And tbf I do have personal experience of this world, which clearly helped me immediately see what she was wearing within 90 seconds of tuning in

    Also she was wearing a blue dress with a bondage lace motif! She obviously doesn’t care who knows. I kind of admire her for that

    It’s just a shame that virtually everything else she does is utterly calamitous
    Truss' girlfriend at university subsequently became the girlfriend of a friend of mine (He had a wife, a mistress, and a girlfriend).
    So, I've clearly led a sheltered life... but what's the difference between a mistress and a girlfriend if one also has a wife?
    It was unclear to me, as well. I think a girlfriend is more casual.
    This may be a misunderstanding of BDSM terminology

    In kink world, a girlfriend is a girlfriend

    A mistress is a different thing entirely: she is a domme, a dominatrix, she wields the whip and administers the paddle

    So if kink woman x is the mistress of kink man y, it means she dominates him and he accepts it as her sub

    Quite a common dynamic, tho not to my taste

    Incidentally, if any pb-ers are thinking of getting into kink, try and be a lesbian domme - they are the rarest and therefore most in demand - so they have the most fun

    The most common are probably heterosexual male subs. Then hetero male doms closely followed or equalled by heterosexual female subs.

    Kinky lesbian dommes are like hen’s teeth! I know this because a good friend of mine runs sex parties and he has to pay them a lot

    This a is a good tip for the post AI world when we all have to become sex workers
    Yep, yep, I've got that up to the end of the first paragraph. I'm struggling from there on...
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    LeonLeon Posts: 48,088

    Leon said:

    viewcode said:

    Interesting thread on Google’s woke AI problems:

    https://x.com/yishan/status/1760859214875132161

    That’s not why this is important. This event is not significant for culture war reasons. You just think so because that’s all anyone is thinking about these days, and everyone has missed the real danger.

    Yes, I think that is very much worth reading. These models are entirely unable to perform the most basic of sanity checks.
    Because they're not conscious. They do not IIUI attach knowledge to data. They don't know that the pink shape with five protrusions is a hand. They can't do sanity checks.

    (you probably know this already, but it's for the kids in the cheap seats)
    Can I just say it’s great that ‘@viewcode’ - some anonymous twat off of “PB” - has personally solved the Problem of Consciousness, a question which has vexed the greatest minds since the dawn of time, and never found an answer

    But ‘viewcode’ has!? Huzzah

    Perhaps then he could explain and define consciousness in a couple of easy sentences, and also tell us what is a conscious creature, choosing from a virus, a wasp, a tree, a gorilla, a bee colony, gpt4, a human, a toadstool, a solar system, the universe, and a dog?
    I have a pen sitting on my desk. It is a fairly cheap Parker pen, but I like it.

    I can say with certainty that it is not conscious, even though the stuff I write with it might, on rare occasions, show intelligence and/or consciousness.

    What is *your* couple of easy sentences that define consciousness , which would include the LLM stuff as conscious?
    I don’t think consciousness can be easily defined, at all. Which is why no one has successfully done it for 3000 years of human philosophy, despite many attempts (and for ‘consciousness’ read ‘intelligence’ or ‘sentience’ - it is the same problem)

    The best definition, feeble as it is, is ‘you know it when you see it’

    I am happy to call a sane adult human conscious, likewise a gorilla, maybe a dog, lower than that I am hazy. Fuck knows about bee colonies. Maybe yes?

    Anyway the point is I CANNOT easily define it, I can only ‘know it when I see it’, and this is the point of the Turing Test. If a machine can successfully appear conscious the way a man can, then it is conscious to the extent that we must treat it like this

    The idea that ‘viewcode’ has personally worked out the age-old problem that is the definition pf consciousness and therefore knows that these advanced machines are NOT conscious is so pathetically comical it is outwith parody. He hasn’t worked it out. He has no fucking clue. I see his comment got a ‘like’ from @bondegezou which says it all. Utter morons
  • Options
    NigelbNigelb Posts: 63,518

    mwadams said:

    Pulpstar said:

    Nigelb said:

    Interesting thread on how Sora works (or might work)
    https://twitter.com/MattNiessner/status/1760843660424306727

    Is all this AI generated stuff why Nvidia stock is up like Bitcoin from a few years back ?

    They're essentially selling the shovels for the AI goldrush ? Or is it still bitcoin mining. Probably both...
    Mostly the shovels for the AI goldrush.

    However, when the hype dies down, their excellent array of shovels will also dig the irrigation trenches for the data pipelines we actually need anyway. So the reality will probably catch up with the market's over-enthusiasm and the analysts will consider themselves far-seeing geniuses.

    Short version - they are making the best kit to run neural networks on. The kit is also very useful for any kind of matrix maths problems.

    This will have lots of value even if "AI" vanished tomorrow.
    Not $14bn a quarter profit, though.
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    NEW THREAD

  • Options
    HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 117,426
    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is NOT in the EU, it is not even in the EEA, it just has full access to the single market (and indeed GB effectively now Sunak has ensured no checks on goods going to and from NI to GB)
    With inhabitants [edit] most of whom have joint citizenship with the EU, though, remember.

    And a customs border down the Irish Sea, for all that it's not being implemented temporarily.

    Damned odd Unionist Union.
    They could have joint citizenship with EU Ireland even before Brexit, it is still not in the EU.

    And still no border checks now on goods going to and from NI to GB and if Starmer gets in and rejoins a customs union even the technical customs border would effectively disappear too
    But the people *are* EU citizens for the asking unlike the rest of the UK, and that's a new change between NI and rUK thanks to your lot. Who wanted the complete opposite.
    They aren't EU citizens automatically any more than they were Irish citizens automatically post GFA pre Brexit
  • Options
    MoonRabbitMoonRabbit Posts: 12,760
    On topic. Don’t over focus on the what happened on the day of parliament disorder, understand all the build up as to why.

    Why are Tories and SNP acting as one? Because Labour are on course to take seats off both, is the political bottom line to the thinking and acting - whatever can be done by one to show Labour is an out of control zoo, is being aided and abetted by the other - and that is what happened this week, this SNP Tory Alliance will go on happening now for years to come.

    But even when you are going down to defeat, you still must do the right thing, by your democracy, by your country and its values, do the right thing by your political opponents.
    But What this week showed us, in their modern Trumpian politics, SNP and Tories can’t do the right thing, they didn’t put MP safety and defusing the dangerous build up in pressure over this Arab Israeli conflict, first and foremost - quite the opposite, SNP and Tory’s together sought to EXPLOIT that dangerous pressure and threat of violence on Labour MPs, for their political advantage.

    There’s bits of this PB header sailing close to the siren voices of myopic fantasy that does not represent the full truth and history of the week.
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    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,889

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The Rugby Union?
  • Options
    SandyRentoolSandyRentool Posts: 20,889

    Carnyx said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    That's Liberal Imperialist, surely?
    It’s not imperial, that Union was endorsed in 2014.
    I don't recall getting a vote on that in 2014!
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    JosiasJessopJosiasJessop Posts: 39,423
    Leon said:

    Leon said:

    viewcode said:

    Interesting thread on Google’s woke AI problems:

    https://x.com/yishan/status/1760859214875132161

    That’s not why this is important. This event is not significant for culture war reasons. You just think so because that’s all anyone is thinking about these days, and everyone has missed the real danger.

    Yes, I think that is very much worth reading. These models are entirely unable to perform the most basic of sanity checks.
    Because they're not conscious. They do not IIUI attach knowledge to data. They don't know that the pink shape with five protrusions is a hand. They can't do sanity checks.

    (you probably know this already, but it's for the kids in the cheap seats)
    Can I just say it’s great that ‘@viewcode’ - some anonymous twat off of “PB” - has personally solved the Problem of Consciousness, a question which has vexed the greatest minds since the dawn of time, and never found an answer

    But ‘viewcode’ has!? Huzzah

    Perhaps then he could explain and define consciousness in a couple of easy sentences, and also tell us what is a conscious creature, choosing from a virus, a wasp, a tree, a gorilla, a bee colony, gpt4, a human, a toadstool, a solar system, the universe, and a dog?
    I have a pen sitting on my desk. It is a fairly cheap Parker pen, but I like it.

    I can say with certainty that it is not conscious, even though the stuff I write with it might, on rare occasions, show intelligence and/or consciousness.

    What is *your* couple of easy sentences that define consciousness , which would include the LLM stuff as conscious?
    I don’t think consciousness can be easily defined, at all. Which is why no one has successfully done it for 3000 years of human philosophy, despite many attempts (and for ‘consciousness’ read ‘intelligence’ or ‘sentience’ - it is the same problem)

    The best definition, feeble as it is, is ‘you know it when you see it’

    I am happy to call a sane adult human conscious, likewise a gorilla, maybe a dog, lower than that I am hazy. Fuck knows about bee colonies. Maybe yes?

    Anyway the point is I CANNOT easily define it, I can only ‘know it when I see it’, and this is the point of the Turing Test. If a machine can successfully appear conscious the way a man can, then it is conscious to the extent that we must treat it like this

    The idea that ‘viewcode’ has personally worked out the age-old problem that is the definition pf consciousness and therefore knows that these advanced machines are NOT conscious is so pathetically comical it is outwith parody. He hasn’t worked it out. He has no fucking clue. I see his comment got a ‘like’ from @bondegezou which says it all. Utter morons
    But that's the point; you could be so deluded that you think that the Parker pen on my desk is conscious, or a piece of pink granite - because you ‘know it when I see it’.

    So it can easily be put the other way; that it is pathetically comedic to think the current LLMs are conscious. Which was a 'debate' three decades or more back about Eliza bots. In fact, it's even got a term for it:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ELIZA_effect

    (There's also the difficulty of people using 'intelligence', 'consciousness' and 'sentience' interchangeably, when there are important differences between them.)
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,340

    On topic. Cyclefree - you have called this utterly the wrong way round.

    It’s not radicals in UKs Jewish community targeting MP homes and offices. Don’t you know who the para-glider wearers are out there?

    Labour MPs who don’t vote for the SNPs mischievous Pro Hamas motions, are the ones who then live in fear.

    It definitely was the SNP Tory alliance who sought to exploit this tinder box of fear for political advantage this week, by adding heat to the tinder.

    What an appalling header. How could you have read this so wrongly?

    Looney
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    malcolmgmalcolmg Posts: 42,340
    HYUFD said:

    Carnyx said:

    HYUFD said:

    Religious extremists in this country have murdered thousands in this country including MPs but Norn Iron is another country and their parties are in power in parts of this country.

    Religious extremist propped up Mrs May’s government too.

    I'm not sure many people would regard turning the rest of the UK into Northern Ireland as a success.
    Enoch Powell would like to have a word with you.
    I'm sure he'd like to have a word with all of us.
    Has always been one of life’s mysteries that a man worried about sectarianism decided to move to Northern Ireland and become an MP for the party/side that was engaged in vicious sectarianism.
    Why did you join a unionist party?
    I’m in favour of the Union between Scotland and England.
    The union in Conservative and Unionist is the one between Britain and Ireland.
    I helped change the Tory party, by 2019 the Tory Party was prepared to destroy that Union for Brexit.
    Yet here we are 4 years after Brexit was delivered and the Union is still in place
    But with a Sinn Fein First Minister.
    And a distinctly odd Union with part of it within the EU. It's not what the Unionists of old would have accepted.
    Northern Ireland is NOT in the EU, it is not even in the EEA, it just has full access to the single market (and indeed GB effectively now Sunak has ensured no checks on goods going to and from NI to GB)
    An elephant dancing on teh head of a pin there. It is in the EU, suck it up
This discussion has been closed.