No idea of the veracity of these posts but there seems to be some evidence that it may have come from inside Gaza. Videos in the links
. First clear footage from the Al Ahli tragedy in Gaza, but what do you notice? this is a surface explosion, almost no soil is thrown up, so it's not an air bomb. Looks like a failed Hamas rocket that landed there, what a tragedy has Hamas brought to the people of Gaza! https://twitter.com/david_lisovtsev/status/1714337392520249522
Gaza hospital bombed. IDF was not operating in the area.
Whoever bombed the hospital, and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it, are guilty of a war crime. Telling Gazans to move south, and then bombing the south, isn’t a good look either. Israel need not to lose the moral high ground, or they will lose the support of reasonable people, which obviously excludes the GOP, HYUFD, etc.
"and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it,"
Why? Hamas are the ones who have been smuggling weapons and rockets into Gaza rather than food and water its citizens require. Why is the onus on Israel to prove its innocence? Surely Hamas also have the same responsibility to prove innocence.
As we saw with the safe route blast; people who dislike Israel have made up their minds that they bombed it when the evidence is far from clear. Israel, not Hamas, automatically gets the blame.
Israel not Hamas has the technology to prove who did it. If it wasn't them it'll be in their own interests to show that.
Technology, but not access. Say part of an Israeli bomb casing was found at the site: is that a slam-dunk piece of evidence, or something Hamas salted? etc, etc.
I would be shocked if Israel don't have cameras, drones, planes, etc all focused on Gaza...if nothing to be prewarned about the constant incoming rockets that are still being sent by Hamas.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
Whoever bombed the hospital, and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it, are guilty of a war crime. Telling Gazans to move south, and then bombing the south, isn’t a good look either. Israel need not to lose the moral high ground, or they will lose the support of reasonable people, which obviously excludes the GOP, HYUFD, etc.
"and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it,"
Why? Hamas are the ones who have been smuggling weapons and rockets into Gaza rather than food and water its citizens require. Why is the onus on Israel to prove its innocence? Surely Hamas also have the same responsibility to prove innocence.
As we saw with the safe route blast; people who dislike Israel have made up their minds that they bombed it when the evidence is far from clear. Israel, not Hamas, automatically gets the blame.
Israel not Hamas has the technology to prove who did it. If it wasn't them it'll be in their own interests to show that.
Technology, but not access. Say part of an Israeli bomb casing was found at the site: is that a slam-dunk piece of evidence, or something Hamas salted? etc, etc.
I would be shocked if Israel don't have cameras, drones, planes, etc all focused on Gaza...if nothing to be prewarned about the constant incoming rockets that are still being sent by Hamas.
Even in an area the size of Gaza, you cannot be looking everywhere at once.
Still, it's a developing story, and there are conflicting accounts incoming.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
No idea of the veracity of these posts but there seems to be some evidence that it may have come from inside Gaza. Videos in the links
. First clear footage from the Al Ahli tragedy in Gaza, but what do you notice? this is a surface explosion, almost no soil is thrown up, so it's not an air bomb. Looks like a failed Hamas rocket that landed there, what a tragedy has Hamas brought to the people of Gaza! https://twitter.com/david_lisovtsev/status/1714337392520249522
Gaza hospital bombed. IDF was not operating in the area.
Does any of this mean anything? Is it a surface explosion and how do you tell? What does that indicate and why does it point to Israeli or Palestinian weapons? Why is everybody quotetweeting things without thought?
If I ever fire a weapon at somebody, I will get a bot to tweet a hundred times that Rishi Sunak did it with a unicorn horn. And everybody on PB will breathlessly repost it here. And the press will go "unicorn horn killer at large!!!"
Whoever bombed the hospital, and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it, are guilty of a war crime. Telling Gazans to move south, and then bombing the south, isn’t a good look either. Israel need not to lose the moral high ground, or they will lose the support of reasonable people, which obviously excludes the GOP, HYUFD, etc.
"and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it,"
Why? Hamas are the ones who have been smuggling weapons and rockets into Gaza rather than food and water its citizens require. Why is the onus on Israel to prove its innocence? Surely Hamas also have the same responsibility to prove innocence.
As we saw with the safe route blast; people who dislike Israel have made up their minds that they bombed it when the evidence is far from clear. Israel, not Hamas, automatically gets the blame.
Hamas are evil and I wouldn’t put it passed them to target their own civilians . I’ve not made my mind up and will wait to see what proof gets released either way . I notice Justin Trudeau is already blaming Israel which could be very embarrassing if it wasn’t . If it was Israel then that would be very serious .
Shit. (Not your comment, just a general excalamation). If I, as a keyboard warrior/pacifist* sat in the wilds of Lincolnshire, can see we need to wait until we have some solid facts then what the feckety feck is a supposedly intelligent and well informed world leader doing jumping to conclusions this early in the process.
Whoever bombed the hospital, and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it, are guilty of a war crime. Telling Gazans to move south, and then bombing the south, isn’t a good look either. Israel need not to lose the moral high ground, or they will lose the support of reasonable people, which obviously excludes the GOP, HYUFD, etc.
"and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it,"
Why? Hamas are the ones who have been smuggling weapons and rockets into Gaza rather than food and water its citizens require. Why is the onus on Israel to prove its innocence? Surely Hamas also have the same responsibility to prove innocence.
As we saw with the safe route blast; people who dislike Israel have made up their minds that they bombed it when the evidence is far from clear. Israel, not Hamas, automatically gets the blame.
Israel not Hamas has the technology to prove who did it. If it wasn't them it'll be in their own interests to show that.
Technology, but not access. Say part of an Israeli bomb casing was found at the site: is that a slam-dunk piece of evidence, or something Hamas salted? etc, etc.
I would be shocked if Israel don't have cameras, drones, planes, etc all focused on Gaza...if nothing to be prewarned about the constant incoming rockets that are still being sent by Hamas.
Even in an area the size of Gaza, you cannot be looking everywhere at once.
Still, it's a developing story, and there are conflicting accounts incoming.
Does any of this mean anything? Is it a surface explosion and how do you tell? What does that indicate and why does it point to Israeli or Palestinian weapons? Why is everybody quotetweeting things without thought?
Generally speaking a bomb dropped from a plane will penetrate the ground and then explode, a bomb in say a truck will explode at ground level. People who know a lot more than me could probably eyeball the difference in a video.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
Before it was accidentally hit by a malfunctioning Hamas rocket that unluckily hit a hidden ammo dump that they knew was there despite never having visited the site?
No idea of the veracity of these posts but there seems to be some evidence that it may have come from inside Gaza. Videos in the links
. First clear footage from the Al Ahli tragedy in Gaza, but what do you notice? this is a surface explosion, almost no soil is thrown up, so it's not an air bomb. Looks like a failed Hamas rocket that landed there, what a tragedy has Hamas brought to the people of Gaza! https://twitter.com/david_lisovtsev/status/1714337392520249522
Gaza hospital bombed. IDF was not operating in the area.
Does any of this mean anything? Is it a surface explosion and how do you tell? What does that indicate and why does it point to Israeli or Palestinian weapons? Why is everybody quotetweeting things without thought?
If I ever fire a weapon at somebody, I will get a bot to tweet a hundred times that Rishi Sunak did it with a unicorn horn. And everybody on PB will breathlessly repost it here. And the press will go "unicorn horn killer at large!!!"
Don't be silly.
Nobody will ever believe Sunak is capable of lifting a unicorn horn.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
Whoever bombed the hospital, and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it, are guilty of a war crime. Telling Gazans to move south, and then bombing the south, isn’t a good look either. Israel need not to lose the moral high ground, or they will lose the support of reasonable people, which obviously excludes the GOP, HYUFD, etc.
"and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it,"
Why? Hamas are the ones who have been smuggling weapons and rockets into Gaza rather than food and water its citizens require. Why is the onus on Israel to prove its innocence? Surely Hamas also have the same responsibility to prove innocence.
As we saw with the safe route blast; people who dislike Israel have made up their minds that they bombed it when the evidence is far from clear. Israel, not Hamas, automatically gets the blame.
Hamas are evil and I wouldn’t put it passed them to target their own civilians . I’ve not made my mind up and will wait to see what proof gets released either way . I notice Justin Trudeau is already blaming Israel which could be very embarrassing if it wasn’t . If it was Israel then that would be very serious .
Shit. (Not your comment, just a general excalamation). If I, as a keyboard warrior/pacifist* sat in the wilds of Lincolnshire, can see we need to wait until we have some solid facts then what the feckety feck is a supposedly intelligent and well informed world leader doing jumping to conclusions this early in the process.
Trudeau is a fecking idiot.
*delete as preferred
Never been a fan of Trudeau but his skills in diplomacy have been pretty non existent of late.
We still haven’t had this report confirmed but if it was an air strike by the Israelis it’s unforgivable to target a hospital .
I suspect there was Hamas there too, you can't see the full picture until all evidence emerged.
Hamas of course murdered Israeli women, children and babies deliberately targeted so if the Israelis want to wipe out Hamas they won't give much quarter
No ones disputing that Hamas are evil and they couldn’t care less how many civilians die in Gaza and would if they could murder as many Jews as possible .
If Israel have hit a hospital and killed anything like that report then public opinion will soon turn against them in the west .
Yeah I have been unsure about my views so far, but if this turns out to be true, any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone.
It doesn’t matter if Hamas are there. It doesn’t matter if Israel have warned Gazans to move. It is so blindingly obvious that hospital patients cannot move, whether to respond to an Israeli warning or to get away from Hamas.
This is simply unconscionable. Is it fair to say it is worse than anything Hamas have done? Not sure.
That's fair enough: although the other side of the equation is that "any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone" should not become "I don't care if the Israeli state exists".
I'd also make another point. Russia has made a habit - in fact, a policy - of hitting hospitals in Syria and Ukraine. I hope everyone who would rightly condemn an Israeli strike on this hospital (if that is what happened) would not dream of excuse the many, many such Russian attacks.
One your first point, completely agree. If this turns out to be true, and clearly we don’t know that yet, it is the government of Israel that deserves to be obliterated, not the state.
Though, if confirmed, I think it would be legitimate for a UN mandated peacekeeping force to invade Israel to subdue the IDF and enforce the Oslo accords.
On your second point, I can’t speak for anyone else but my condemnation of Russian actions has been just as vociferous as these two posts.
If we are going to invade nuclear armed countries, why not do Russia as well?
Just to reiterate, I wasn’t being entirely serious!
We still haven’t had this report confirmed but if it was an air strike by the Israelis it’s unforgivable to target a hospital .
I suspect there was Hamas there too, you can't see the full picture until all evidence emerged.
Hamas of course murdered Israeli women, children and babies deliberately targeted so if the Israelis want to wipe out Hamas they won't give much quarter
No ones disputing that Hamas are evil and they couldn’t care less how many civilians die in Gaza and would if they could murder as many Jews as possible .
If Israel have hit a hospital and killed anything like that report then public opinion will soon turn against them in the west .
Yeah I have been unsure about my views so far, but if this turns out to be true, any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone.
It doesn’t matter if Hamas are there. It doesn’t matter if Israel have warned Gazans to move. It is so blindingly obvious that hospital patients cannot move, whether to respond to an Israeli warning or to get away from Hamas.
This is simply unconscionable. Is it fair to say it is worse than anything Hamas have done? Not sure.
That's fair enough: although the other side of the equation is that "any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone" should not become "I don't care if the Israeli state exists".
I'd also make another point. Russia has made a habit - in fact, a policy - of hitting hospitals in Syria and Ukraine. I hope everyone who would rightly condemn an Israeli strike on this hospital (if that is what happened) would not dream of excuse the many, many such Russian attacks.
One your first point, completely agree. If this turns out to be true, and clearly we don’t know that yet, it is the government of Israel that deserves to be obliterated, not the state.
Though, if confirmed, I think it would be legitimate for a UN mandated peacekeeping force to invade Israel to subdue the IDF and enforce the Oslo accords.
On your second point, I can’t speak for anyone else but my condemnation of Russian actions has been just as vociferous as these two posts.
If we are going to invade nuclear armed countries, why not do Russia as well?
Just to reiterate, I wasn’t being entirely serious!
I am
Global Thermonuclear War Now!
Are you sure you wouldn't like to play another game.....
We still haven’t had this report confirmed but if it was an air strike by the Israelis it’s unforgivable to target a hospital .
I suspect there was Hamas there too, you can't see the full picture until all evidence emerged.
Hamas of course murdered Israeli women, children and babies deliberately targeted so if the Israelis want to wipe out Hamas they won't give much quarter
No ones disputing that Hamas are evil and they couldn’t care less how many civilians die in Gaza and would if they could murder as many Jews as possible .
If Israel have hit a hospital and killed anything like that report then public opinion will soon turn against them in the west .
Yeah I have been unsure about my views so far, but if this turns out to be true, any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone.
It doesn’t matter if Hamas are there. It doesn’t matter if Israel have warned Gazans to move. It is so blindingly obvious that hospital patients cannot move, whether to respond to an Israeli warning or to get away from Hamas.
This is simply unconscionable. Is it fair to say it is worse than anything Hamas have done? Not sure.
That's fair enough: although the other side of the equation is that "any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone" should not become "I don't care if the Israeli state exists".
I'd also make another point. Russia has made a habit - in fact, a policy - of hitting hospitals in Syria and Ukraine. I hope everyone who would rightly condemn an Israeli strike on this hospital (if that is what happened) would not dream of excuse the many, many such Russian attacks.
One your first point, completely agree. If this turns out to be true, and clearly we don’t know that yet, it is the government of Israel that deserves to be obliterated, not the state.
Though, if confirmed, I think it would be legitimate for a UN mandated peacekeeping force to invade Israel to subdue the IDF and enforce the Oslo accords.
On your second point, I can’t speak for anyone else but my condemnation of Russian actions has been just as vociferous as these two posts.
If we are going to invade nuclear armed countries, why not do Russia as well?
Just to reiterate, I wasn’t being entirely serious!
I am
Global Thermonuclear War Now!
Wouldn't you prefer a nice game of Bomb The Hospital Chess?
Does any of this mean anything? Is it a surface explosion and how do you tell? What does that indicate and why does it point to Israeli or Palestinian weapons? Why is everybody quotetweeting things without thought?
Generally speaking a bomb dropped from a plane will penetrate the ground and then explode, a bomb in say a truck will explode at ground level. People who know a lot more than me could probably eyeball the difference in a video.
Unless they are bunker busters, a bomb will detonate on impact. They're bombs. The damage will extend further downwards than a static bomb because the missile is travelling. But in both cases the damage will extend down and out. I think the critical factor is the size of the bomb and the speed of the missile.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
Before it was accidentally hit by a malfunctioning Hamas rocket that unluckily hit a hidden ammo dump that they knew was there despite never having visited the site?
Only the dimwitted or desperate would cling to the hidden munitions cache under the hospital car park story.
Having said that, the 'decapitated babies' Israeli psy-op was a roaring success among the dimwitted and desperate despite the lack of any corroborating evidence so maybe this will work too.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
Speccy index does have 2.6 million followers so you think it'd check sources.
The IDF seem to be playing their cards pretty close to their chest at this moment, which suggests to me they think it might be their fault even if it wasn't deliberate.
And this is exactly the sort of thing that was always going to happen if they attacked Gaza in strength, which, of course, is why Hamas attacked them to provoke it in the first place.
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
The Israeli spokesman is stating that the IDF had given sufficient warning concerning the Al Ahli Baptist Hospital to enable its evacuation. #IsraelPalestineWar
Speccy index does have 2.6 million followers so you think it'd check sources.
Spectator writers are never jittery conspiracy mongers are they?
Its nothing to do with The Spectator...The Spectator Index is the name of a popular Twitter account and website run by Abdul-Latif Halimi, a doctor from Melbourne, Australia.
* The IDF gave the hospital warnings to evacuate * Before the IDF could bomb it, Hamas bombed it first by accident * The Hamas bomb set off a secret ammo dump in the hospital
Some questions * Why did the IDF warn the hospital to evacuate? Before what exactly? * Why do people think there was an ammo site there? Presumably to account for the discrepancy between the putative Hamas missile and the explosion. But nobody knows the size of the Hamas missile.
Whoever bombed the hospital, and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it, are guilty of a war crime. Telling Gazans to move south, and then bombing the south, isn’t a good look either. Israel need not to lose the moral high ground, or they will lose the support of reasonable people, which obviously excludes the GOP, HYUFD, etc.
"and Israel are the ones who are going to have to prove they didn’t do it,"
Why? Hamas are the ones who have been smuggling weapons and rockets into Gaza rather than food and water its citizens require. Why is the onus on Israel to prove its innocence? Surely Hamas also have the same responsibility to prove innocence.
As we saw with the safe route blast; people who dislike Israel have made up their minds that they bombed it when the evidence is far from clear. Israel, not Hamas, automatically gets the blame.
Doesn't mean it was Israel - as Mr Tyndall has pointed out they usually give a shit about civilian casualties - but it is strongly suggestive that they knew that Hamas was using hospitals to hide things they didn't want hit.
BBC reckons the size of the explosion means likely to have been air strike
It is also quite possible there really was an ammunition dump at the hospital, which would be entirely consistent with Hamas' modus operandi going back decades.
But that isn't going to help the Israelis much in PR terms if it turns out they've deliberately or even accidentally blown up a hospital.
We still haven’t had this report confirmed but if it was an air strike by the Israelis it’s unforgivable to target a hospital .
I suspect there was Hamas there too, you can't see the full picture until all evidence emerged.
Hamas of course murdered Israeli women, children and babies deliberately targeted so if the Israelis want to wipe out Hamas they won't give much quarter
No ones disputing that Hamas are evil and they couldn’t care less how many civilians die in Gaza and would if they could murder as many Jews as possible .
If Israel have hit a hospital and killed anything like that report then public opinion will soon turn against them in the west .
Yeah I have been unsure about my views so far, but if this turns out to be true, any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone.
It doesn’t matter if Hamas are there. It doesn’t matter if Israel have warned Gazans to move. It is so blindingly obvious that hospital patients cannot move, whether to respond to an Israeli warning or to get away from Hamas.
This is simply unconscionable. Is it fair to say it is worse than anything Hamas have done? Not sure.
That's fair enough: although the other side of the equation is that "any sympathy I have for the Israeli state is gone" should not become "I don't care if the Israeli state exists".
I'd also make another point. Russia has made a habit - in fact, a policy - of hitting hospitals in Syria and Ukraine. I hope everyone who would rightly condemn an Israeli strike on this hospital (if that is what happened) would not dream of excuse the many, many such Russian attacks.
One your first point, completely agree. If this turns out to be true, and clearly we don’t know that yet, it is the government of Israel that deserves to be obliterated, not the state.
Though, if confirmed, I think it would be legitimate for a UN mandated peacekeeping force to invade Israel to subdue the IDF and enforce the Oslo accords.
On your second point, I can’t speak for anyone else but my condemnation of Russian actions has been just as vociferous as these two posts.
If we are going to invade nuclear armed countries, why not do Russia as well?
Just to reiterate, I wasn’t being entirely serious!
I am
Global Thermonuclear War Now!
Wouldn't you prefer a nice game of Bomb The Hospital Chess?
My favourite bit of dialogue from that :
Jennifer: Well, what kind of an asshole grows up in Seattle and doesn't even know how to swim? David: I never got around to it, okay? I always thought there was gonna be plenty of time!
Comments
An air bomb would throw up soil but a rocket wouldn't?
Edit: a failed Hamas rocket launch might make sense though.
https://x.com/i24NEWS_EN/status/1714348101748559883?s=20
@Pkurzin (Source, X)
Still, it's a developing story, and there are conflicting accounts incoming.
If I ever fire a weapon at somebody, I will get a bot to tweet a hundred times that Rishi Sunak did it with a unicorn horn. And everybody on PB will breathlessly repost it here. And the press will go "unicorn horn killer at large!!!"
Trudeau is a fecking idiot.
*delete as preferred
Nobody will ever believe Sunak is capable of lifting a unicorn horn.
Others indicating Hamas misfire
Global Thermonuclear War Now!
1-0 to Italy
Should make for a better game
If they'd won, Australia would right now be the only winless team at the World Cup.
Having said that, the 'decapitated babies' Israeli psy-op was a roaring success among the dimwitted and desperate despite the lack of any corroborating evidence so maybe this will work too.
And this is exactly the sort of thing that was always going to happen if they attacked Gaza in strength, which, of course, is why Hamas attacked them to provoke it in the first place.
* The IDF gave the hospital warnings to evacuate
* Before the IDF could bomb it, Hamas bombed it first by accident
* The Hamas bomb set off a secret ammo dump in the hospital
Some questions
* Why did the IDF warn the hospital to evacuate? Before what exactly?
* Why do people think there was an ammo site there? Presumably to account for the discrepancy between the putative Hamas missile and the explosion. But nobody knows the size of the Hamas missile.
That's from three days ago.
Doesn't mean it was Israel - as Mr Tyndall has pointed out they usually give a shit about civilian casualties - but it is strongly suggestive that they knew that Hamas was using hospitals to hide things they didn't want hit.
NEW THREAD
New Thread
But that isn't going to help the Israelis much in PR terms if it turns out they've deliberately or even accidentally blown up a hospital.
ITV reported “we are just learning from social media that hundreds are dead at a hospital in Gaza after it was hit by Israeli air strikes”.
And itv won’t be alone. That is now the truth, no matter what the facts of the matter of this horrific incident eventually turn out to be.