Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
Yes - have you not seen vox pops in Israel? I remember when the big riot happened in February seeing young people talk about how all Palestinians need to be wiped off the map and that they were no better than beasts and stuff.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
Yes, people really want to be reminded of the pandemic. That will help just as much as Sunak's other wheezes.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
It was an absolute tragedy for the aborigines. But, if you read the history - and my Aussie daughter’s grandfather is an expert - it was never the intention of the British “settlers” (with the horrible exception of Tasmania). Aboriginal society simply collapsed when confronted with a much more advanced civilisation
It’s quite a warning as we look at the possible first encounter of humanity with advanced AI. This decade
Oh well, at least we only did a little bit of genocide. Even on the most generous reading, Australia is an absolute refutation of the claim that colonisation was good for the locals.
I never claimed colonisation was “good for the locals”
In truth it can be bad - eg the Belgian Congo - or it can be good - Scotland under England. You’d still be eating raw oats if we hadn’t taken over
Or it can be a complex mixture of both. “What have the Romans ever done for us” etc
I think most of the British Empire falls into the third category
So Scotland WAS a colony? Glad we cleared that up.
Has this guy never driven outside the UK, where it isn't exactly uncommon to see bi or tri-lingual signs.
It's the Telegraph, why would he have gone outside the UK?
Even if he did physically, he may have stayed at home in his mind.
But that reminds me of the brick of coffee (remember those?) that came from our local Polish mini-supermarket last week (amazing salami range and prices) with instructions on the back in Polish, Czech and Slovak. No English.
Hmmm.
He wrote: “Signs like this. They are confusing as they contain irrelevant and – to most people – unintelligible information.
“Road signs in two languages are potentially dangerous as it takes longer to determine the message.
If he can't read it in the time he gives himself, he just needs to slow down and give himself enough time, but instead he's doing the endemic "anything else but me" thing.
Is Dr Hunt or the Road Sign the more dangerous item?
The problem with bilingual road signs in Wales is that they are invariably done on the cheap with no thought to intelligibility in either language. A better solution would be to use colour to distinguish between them so drivers will automatically focus on the one they understand better. For example, English in dark blue on a white background and Welsh in white on a green background. It's not rocket science ... in fact it's the polar opposite: graphic design.
"The SNP's Lisa Cameron has announced her defection to the Conservatives. The East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow MP was facing a selection contest to remain as the SNP's candidate at the next general election. She said she quit because of a "toxic" culture in the party Westminster group. Prime Minister Rishi Sunak and Scottish Tory leader Douglas Ross both welcomed her to the party. The SNP has called for Dr Cameron to step down to allow a by-election."
Some good news! Those with long memories may recall me mentioning my involvement in a collision last September when another car drove into the side of me as I was reversing into my drive. Various posters were helpful and supportive - certainly there were helpful contributions from @ydoethur and @Stocky among others, for which I was very grateful. Anyway, I've just heard that, thirteen months after the incident after various wranglings between unmotivated solicitors from either side, the other party has admitted responsibilty. Hooray! How much of the excessive insurance premiums I've had to pay over the past year I'll get back, and whether I get my no claims bonus back, I don't know - but I have the warm feeling of being in the right. Phew!
Well done. I am having similar fun and games with insurers after a tractor and trailor skidded downhill to a halt on my side of the road, having been stopped by my car's bonnet. Farmer refualways take as many photos as you can or video. Esp their guilty look ses to admit liability.
That strikes me as an audacious claim by the farmer! Whose liability is it, if not his?
Well quite! The skidmarks don't exactly help his case...thankfully had the presence of mind to photograph them.
It was an absolute tragedy for the aborigines. But, if you read the history - and my Aussie daughter’s grandfather is an expert - it was never the intention of the British “settlers” (with the horrible exception of Tasmania). Aboriginal society simply collapsed when confronted with a much more advanced civilisation
It’s quite a warning as we look at the possible first encounter of humanity with advanced AI. This decade
Oh well, at least we only did a little bit of genocide. Even on the most generous reading, Australia is an absolute refutation of the claim that colonisation was good for the locals.
I never claimed colonisation was “good for the locals”
In truth it can be bad - eg the Belgian Congo - or it can be good - Scotland under England. You’d still be eating raw oats if we hadn’t taken over
Or it can be a complex mixture of both. “What have the Romans ever done for us” etc
I think most of the British Empire falls into the third category
So Scotland WAS a colony? Glad we cleared that up.
Didn't the Scots king become King of England as well?
Until the last few days, the phenomenon of Western lefties defending barbarism in the name of a desired utopian, egalitarian ideal was a historical abstraction to me.
I had read about Westerners defending Stalin's purges and collectivization campaigns and thought, well, their ideological fervor was probably just amplified by the difficulty of getting good information out of the USSR.
But now I see that's not it.
Then, as now, there was plenty of information to understand what was really going on. It's just that the ideology IS about this, it IS that ends justify the means. It's how we got the Red Terror, the Great Terror and this—Western leftists cheering all the while.
And, if Soviet history is any guide, the only thing that made these can't-make-an-omelet folks reconsider whether that was really true—or if the end was worth it if these were the means—was finding themselves in an NKVD cell and thinking, "There's been a terrible mistake."
By then, of course, it was too late.
If this is the kind of revolution you support, just know: the revolution always eats its young. Always.
As a leftist I can say, honestly, that Stalinism is bad. The USSR was bad. The roughly 60 million killed in the 70 years between 1917 and 1987 was bad.
As a leftist I can also say, honestly, that the British Empire was bad. That imperialism in all forms in bad. The roughly 100 million killed in the 40 years between 1881 and 1920 by the British Empire, was bad.
I will never be treated as if I sincerely believe the first one if I ever make a comment about how the industrialisation of the USSR from serfdom under the Tsar to beating the Nazi war machine under Stalin was still pretty impressive, as was the increase in literacy and numeracy rates and the relative decline in poverty. Whereas people will legitimately defend the second statement by saying "well, we gave them the railways and democracy, so it was fine".
Where does the 100 million come from ?
I guess if you add in WWI and subsequent epidemics, although I don't think they can be laid entirely at the door of the British Empire.
The 100 million deaths seems to be attributed to India alone. Using similar methodologies as to how the USSR count is come to (although some estimates of the USSR death count includes the numbers of Nazi soldiers they killed - which I do not think is reasonable to add).
That all seems pretty fanciful. That would imply that the British killed off 25% of India's population in those 39 years.
It's just made up twaddle.
My bad. It would imply that the British killed off one third to forty per cent of India's population, in just 39 years.
100 million in those forty years is a wild exaggeration, but might be close to the total numbers that died during famines under British rule in India from the C18th to the C20th. That forty year period doesn’t even include the “Great Famine” of 1876/1878 when 8million people are believed to have died.
Obviously a counter to that is that the region suffered famines long before British rule, but even a cursory reading of history reveals that famines under earlier British rule seem to have been much worse, often exacerbated by Imperial policies & taxes. Rather like the famine in Ireland in the C19th, British rulers seem to have cared little for the people they were notionally in charge of & were more interested in tax income than they were in saving lives.
NB: The 100million number seems to come from trying to measure excess deaths: What they are really claiming is that if India was not being held back by colonialist expropriation of wealth, the economy would have been able to feed it’s population even in times of famine. Instead what happened was that agricultural workers lost their jobs in times of famine & were unable to afford to buy what food their was, as the available crops were being exported to the UK out of taxed national income. Without that expropriation, more wealth would have been kept locally & these workers would have been able to afford to buy food during difficult times. Ironically, the period from 1880 to 1920 is when the British Raj had realised that this was the major cause of deaths during famines & had started major works programs to provide income to out of work agricultural labourers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Famine_Codes
It boils down (I think) to a historical position on whether India would have developed differently without the British Raj in power: would have been replaced by an equivalent local regime which extracted just as much wealth & resources for themselves at the expense of the people, or would the economy have developed in a different direction?
There’s no real question that the taxes imposed by the Raj extracted wealth from India & that loss came at a price that was paid ultimately by ordinary Indian people? They didn’t to trade freely with the UK in return after all.
It's pretty well indisputable that the economy of the subcontinent would have developed differently, but quite how it would have done seems utterly imponderable to me, FWIW. It doesn't seem particularly controversial, though, to argue that nations which remained independent during the industrial revolution fared rather better than those which became part of the various European empires ?
The thing is there doesn't seem to be great sourcing on how many people died under British rule - and not because we were so kind as there to not have been any. Partly, as someone said before, because we "won". If you take the Indian sub continent, the British colonies in Africa, the British colonies in the US, the British involvement in the slave trade, and British worker conditions during the Empire are we really going to confidently say that the death toll was less than the roughly 60 million we can reliably put to the USSR? That's without including European wars - I will exclude the direct death toll of the Napoleonic wars and WW1 and WW2. Like, we know how bad the famines were in India during WW2 alone.
My own view is that 60 million killings by the Organs of State Security during the Communist period is an enormous exaggeration. One really can't include WWII deaths for example.
Timothy Snyder estimates 6 to 9 million Soviets deliberately put to death by Stalin, or dying as a result of deportation, or internment in the camps.
The real difficulty is the treatment of deaths by famine. In some cases, famine was used as a tool of policy, to break peasant resistance to collectivisation. In others, it occurred due to callousness and incompetence, and in other cases, pure bad luck.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
I think it is a difficult position to be in as leader of the opposition during a national emergency like the pandemic. However, you hope the opposition will see issue with proposals and be able to nudge government towards a better solution.
Jeremy Hunt was actually very good at this e.g. government - shut all schools, Hunt, I think that might have an issue, where do key workers kids go? How about running classes for those.
Overwhelmingly Starmer was always harder, faster, further. His "ideas" were normally even worse e.g. everybody needs to test every time they leave the house to meet anybody. It just isn't practical.
Or the we need to fast track PPE providers, here is a dossier of potential providers we think you need to talk to (who turned out to be even more dodgy than the ones the government used).
Or close the border now, 18 months into the pandemic....because at the outset that would have been racist.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Except that isn't true....the case rates when we had eat out the help out were very low, a lot of outside eating etc. There was limited evidence that small group dining was particular bad compared to lots of other things.
The really massive misstep that will have resulted in excess deaths. Yeah sure you can go on your summer holiday (2020) all across Europe, everybody deserves a holiday after the lockdown. That is how we widely seeded the worst variant all across the country just in time for the autumn / winter. Having mass groups of people all mixing from across Europe is how we got it from Italy in the first place, then we repeated exactly the same mistaken in the summer.
"I just had a brief chat with Lisa Cameron. She won't be standing at the next election, but won't be resigning either, and will spend the next year in Parliament focusing on disability issues. She'll be "staying in touch with people I respect, which isn't anyone in the SNP". -- Wings
13 years of Tory government and the criminal justice system has collapsed.
Even if your rapist is convicted, they still won't go to prison because there is no space.
May as well not bother having trials. Or reporting crimes. If the state won't do its job and protect us, we'll have to revert to older forms of self-protection.
Bastards.
We haven’t had mail delivered for two weeks. That’s such a trivial thing in comparison to everything else, but it seems to typify the country today.
It's nothing compared to schools literally falling down, seven million people on hospital waiting lists, ambulance waiting times leaping past three quarters of an hour, roads pocked with astonishing numbers of potholes everywhere, a massive and ongoing cost of living crisis, our courts backlogged so much that almost any case now takes literally years (three? four?) to come to trial while police ignore simple burglaries and bicycle thefts other than to give you a crime number for your insurance.
But now they can’t jail any more people, anyway. All in the face of the highest tax burden in generations. But billions have gone to scammers who happen to be friends to the ruling party.
Are Tories proud of this? Can they really go around with a straight face and ask the public to extend their rule? All I see from them is the ultimate negativity of “oh, oh, the only other option might be worse!” Nothing positive. No vision for improvement. No vision for rectifying the decaying mess that has unfolded under their stewardship. Just a desperate reliance upon fear and first-past-the-post.
It’s incredible that people don’t mention the part that closing everything down for lockdown has played in ruining the country’s finances. All major parties were behind it, Labour wanted to lockdown harder for longer (the non existent threat of the ‘Johnson Variant” in the Summer of 21).
It was always going to send the country skint, and it has - we are paying for it now & people who cheered it on shouldn’t moan about it. How is it different to spending on the never never and not wanting to pay it back?
Absolutely but your audience is wrong. Just about everyone on PB condemned out of hand as fanciful and insane if not near-murderous even to whisper the idea that lockdowns were bad for a huge number of reasons including financial ones.
I'm sure your post won't get many likes and anyone who agrees with you should look carefully at their own posting history to see how they responded at the time.
I keep banging on about it (this is, after all, PB) but only @contrarian consistently stated what a calamity lockdown was and would be and boy was he right.
There were plenty saying that Starmer was wrong to go harder, longer on lockdowns. We would have lost another Christmas if it had been down to him.
This is the man man would now have as PM? Colour me unconvinced...
“Johnson Variant” - what a prat. Completely wrong too. Still, at least he’s boring
It's the number one thing that concerns me about a Labour government - what they would do if there was another pandemic. I can't shake off that awful time and the idea of a repeat terrifies me.
The Tory government was awful during the pandemic – remember their desire to create a 'climate of fear'. I doubt either party would go hell for leather for lockdowns again – I don't think (or maybe) hope that the public would wear it again.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Obviously I am aware that it’s a risky strategy, but I think it’s worth it to show Sir Keir up as a doom monger that wanted to lock us all indoors (while he was ok with booze ups for himself & friends)
It was an absolute tragedy for the aborigines. But, if you read the history - and my Aussie daughter’s grandfather is an expert - it was never the intention of the British “settlers” (with the horrible exception of Tasmania). Aboriginal society simply collapsed when confronted with a much more advanced civilisation
It’s quite a warning as we look at the possible first encounter of humanity with advanced AI. This decade
Oh well, at least we only did a little bit of genocide. Even on the most generous reading, Australia is an absolute refutation of the claim that colonisation was good for the locals.
I never claimed colonisation was “good for the locals”
In truth it can be bad - eg the Belgian Congo - or it can be good - Scotland under England. You’d still be eating raw oats if we hadn’t taken over
Or it can be a complex mixture of both. “What have the Romans ever done for us” etc
I think most of the British Empire falls into the third category
So Scotland WAS a colony? Glad we cleared that up.
Seems Israel has said the blockade on Gaza will remain until their hostages are released
Regrettably this seems to me a proportionate response to a very serious war crime; it allows the perpetrator to put it right without delay in a way which averts catastrophe upon the people they represent. Hamas being both in charge of the PA of Gaza (elected thereto by its people), and the committer of the war crime.
Not often that you have a first in British political history, which I think an SNP MP defecting to the Conservatives is.
Aye - because they're two parties that couldn't be more diametrically opposed on the Union. And if that colossal hurdle were to be cleared in an MP's mind then surely Labour is the closer fit ?
It was an absolute tragedy for the aborigines. But, if you read the history - and my Aussie daughter’s grandfather is an expert - it was never the intention of the British “settlers” (with the horrible exception of Tasmania). Aboriginal society simply collapsed when confronted with a much more advanced civilisation
It’s quite a warning as we look at the possible first encounter of humanity with advanced AI. This decade
Oh well, at least we only did a little bit of genocide. Even on the most generous reading, Australia is an absolute refutation of the claim that colonisation was good for the locals.
I never claimed colonisation was “good for the locals”
In truth it can be bad - eg the Belgian Congo - or it can be good - Scotland under England. You’d still be eating raw oats if we hadn’t taken over
Or it can be a complex mixture of both. “What have the Romans ever done for us” etc
I think most of the British Empire falls into the third category
So Scotland WAS a colony? Glad we cleared that up.
Didn't the Scots king become King of England as well?
I’m not the one proposing that Scotland was a colony, but James VI/I acceded to the English throne more than a hundred years before the Act of Union/colonisation.
I fear the English who need most education in the subject have not been watching David Olusoga’s Union.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Obviously I am aware that it’s a risky strategy, but I think it’s worth it to show Sir Keir up as a doom monger that wanted to lock us all indoors (while he was ok with booze ups for himself & friends)
You might regret invoking the memory of Sir Beer Korma – Big-G-Wales will be bothering you every five minutes
It was an absolute tragedy for the aborigines. But, if you read the history - and my Aussie daughter’s grandfather is an expert - it was never the intention of the British “settlers” (with the horrible exception of Tasmania). Aboriginal society simply collapsed when confronted with a much more advanced civilisation
It’s quite a warning as we look at the possible first encounter of humanity with advanced AI. This decade
Oh well, at least we only did a little bit of genocide. Even on the most generous reading, Australia is an absolute refutation of the claim that colonisation was good for the locals.
I never claimed colonisation was “good for the locals”
In truth it can be bad - eg the Belgian Congo - or it can be good - Scotland under England. You’d still be eating raw oats if we hadn’t taken over
Or it can be a complex mixture of both. “What have the Romans ever done for us” etc
I think most of the British Empire falls into the third category
So Scotland WAS a colony? Glad we cleared that up.
Didn't the Scots king become King of England as well?
I’m not the one proposing that Scotland was a colony, but James VI/I acceded to the English throne more than a hundred years before the Act of Union/colonisation.
I fear the English who need most education in the subject have not been watching David Olusoga’s Union.
Samuel Johnson thought England had become a colony of Scotland.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Obviously I am aware that it’s a risky strategy, but I think it’s worth it to show Sir Keir up as a doom monger that wanted to lock us all indoors (while he was ok with booze ups for himself & friends)
Who has a police caution for breaking Covid socialising rules, the PM or the LotO?
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
And here it is!
Wow. That is the epitome of a modern, integrated road network for our times.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Except that isn't true....the case rates when we had eat out the help out were very low, a lot of outside eating etc.
The really massive misstep that will have resulted in excess deaths, yeah sure you can go on your summer holiday (2020) all across Europe. That is how we widely seeded the worst variant all across the country just in time for the autumn / winter.
Actually, EOTHO does seem to have had the same type of effect as you note for travel - causing a rise in seeded clusters. Exponential, remember, so arithmetically small numbers grow very fast.
Why is it "disgraceful" not to do something? Hyperbolic, odd, choice of word.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
They did after the bataclan attack. Look, I’m all in favour of getting rid of virtue signalling, but we all know why the FA and PL won’t show sympathy towards Israel.
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
If I read the DtT figures correctly those kind of roads cost £30million per mile to build & then ~£60k / mile to maintain in perpetuity thereafter. This is before including the cost of any bridges or tunnels.
I would love it if, for once, you would do the most basic cost-benefit analysis BR. I’m not saying that we don’t need more roads in the UK, but clearly there’s no point uprooting the entire population to build motorways to their new houses twenty miles further away either.
There must be a point, even in your economic world model, where an incremental mile of road isn’t worth the expense. Where is it? How would you decide that?
Yes infrastructure costs money, but it also allows economic growth and development.
I never said to uproot everyone, or to build indefinitely, but we need millions more homes and new towns and all sorts of development, that requires infrastructure.
Our population has grown massively this century yet the road network has not kept pace with our population growth remotely.
Pretty much every major town and city ought to be connected and not only via spokes like London and Manchester.
Why is it "disgraceful" not to do something? Hyperbolic, odd, choice of word.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
They did after the bataclan attack. Look, I’m all in favour of getting rid of virtue signalling, but we all know why the FA and PL won’t show sympathy towards Israel.
There are a couple of local by-elections today. Both have interesting features, People Against Bureaucracy are a recognised party and they are defending one of their seats in Cheltenham. Caroline Page was a longstanding Lib Dem member of Suffolk CC until her recent death. Her father was a prominent Anglo Saxon scholar and her mother a Norwegian. So it was not surprising that she had a Viking burial on the River Deben. She was co-founder of Save the Deben - her other co-founder is now the Lib Dem candidate for the Woodbridge seat.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
13 flights in ten years is 13 more than me, and I'm not a climate "zealot".
If I think of 2012 - 2022 for me, the same is true in terms of no flights, but before that am I really culpable for my flights when I was a teen going on family holidays (one, because I wasn't aware of the depth of climate change and, two, because I had no option)?
I think it is a difficult position to be in as leader of the opposition during a national emergency like the pandemic. However, you hope the opposition will see issue with proposals and be able to nudge government towards a better solution.
Jeremy Hunt was actually very good at this e.g. government - shut all schools, Hunt, I think that might have an issue, where do key workers kids go? How about running classes for those.
Overwhelmingly Starmer was always harder, faster, further. His "ideas" were normally even worse e.g. everybody needs to test every time they leave the house to meet anybody. It just isn't practical.
Or the we need to fast track PPE providers, here is a dossier of potential providers we think you need to talk to (who turned out to be even more dodgy than the ones the government used).
Or close the border now, 18 months into the pandemic....because at the outset that would have been racist.
I didn't agree with Starmer for much of the pandemic, we would have had an approach similar to Scotland or Wales, or much of Europe too. It would have been better at some stuff and worse at others, but the overall outcomes for the country would be marginally rather than significantly different. Some individuals of course would have preferred and or fared better under different approaches.
And we get a major pandemic on average approximately every 100 years, so voting based on the pandemic is a very bad way to choose a PM.
It was an absolute tragedy for the aborigines. But, if you read the history - and my Aussie daughter’s grandfather is an expert - it was never the intention of the British “settlers” (with the horrible exception of Tasmania). Aboriginal society simply collapsed when confronted with a much more advanced civilisation
It’s quite a warning as we look at the possible first encounter of humanity with advanced AI. This decade
Oh well, at least we only did a little bit of genocide. Even on the most generous reading, Australia is an absolute refutation of the claim that colonisation was good for the locals.
I never claimed colonisation was “good for the locals”
In truth it can be bad - eg the Belgian Congo - or it can be good - Scotland under England. You’d still be eating raw oats if we hadn’t taken over
Or it can be a complex mixture of both. “What have the Romans ever done for us” etc
I think most of the British Empire falls into the third category
So Scotland WAS a colony? Glad we cleared that up.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
Why is it "disgraceful" not to do something? Hyperbolic, odd, choice of word.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
They did after the bataclan attack. Look, I’m all in favour of getting rid of virtue signalling, but we all know why the FA and PL won’t show sympathy towards Israel.
There are a couple of local by-elections today. Both have interesting features, People Against Bureaucracy are a recognised party and they are defending one of their seats in Cheltenham. Caroline Page was a longstanding Lib Dem member of Suffolk CC until her recent death. Her father was a prominent Anglo Saxon scholar and her mother a Norwegian. So it was not surprising that she had a Viking burial on the River Deben. She was co-founder of Save the Deben - her other co-founder is now the Lib Dem candidate for the Woodbridge seat.
I'm no medieval historian but didn't the Anglo-Saxons and Vikings spend most of their time fighting each other?
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
And here it is!
Wow. That is the epitome of a modern, integrated road network for our times.
Why is it "disgraceful" not to do something? Hyperbolic, odd, choice of word.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
They did after the bataclan attack. Look, I’m all in favour of getting rid of virtue signalling, but we all know why the FA and PL won’t show sympathy towards Israel.
Presumably canvassing is now asking people who have already voted by post who they voted for. The Tories might be seeing some green shoots.
Big international news events like wars often tend to help the governing party. Are we all underestimating the effect the Gaza war will have on the Tory poll rate?
Not often that you have a first in British political history, which I think an SNP MP defecting to the Conservatives is.
Aye - because they're two parties that couldn't be more diametrically opposed on the Union. And if that colossal hurdle were to be cleared in an MP's mind then surely Labour is the closer fit ?
Lab gain next election I think anyway.
The SNP always have problems when they select a representative with a brain. Joanna Cherry being another good example. It's not a mistake they make often in fairness but it does cause problems.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
Making the world a better place would be ensuring that everyone could afford a home of their own and to take holidays, not just those rich enough to propose that the plebs stay at home while they continue jetsetting.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
13 flights in ten years is 13 more than me, and I'm not a climate "zealot".
If I think of 2012 - 2022 for me, the same is true in terms of no flights, but before that am I really culpable for my flights when I was a teen going on family holidays (one, because I wasn't aware of the depth of climate change and, two, because I had no option)?
Lost count of the flights I have done for work and pleasure. Not really bothered about flying now.
I would never say I was culpable or felt guilty doing it. If I had my time again I would do the same.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Why is it "disgraceful" not to do something? Hyperbolic, odd, choice of word.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
We tend to. And this example is why we shouldn’t. Eventually sports gets dragged into having to opine on who is a goodie and who is a baddie, and has given up its free pass to say “not my job, I’m just here for the football”.
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
If I read the DtT figures correctly those kind of roads cost £30million per mile to build & then ~£60k / mile to maintain in perpetuity thereafter. This is before including the cost of any bridges or tunnels.
I would love it if, for once, you would do the most basic cost-benefit analysis BR. I’m not saying that we don’t need more roads in the UK, but clearly there’s no point uprooting the entire population to build motorways to their new houses twenty miles further away either.
There must be a point, even in your economic world model, where an incremental mile of road isn’t worth the expense. Where is it? How would you decide that?
NB. To put those numbers in a slightly different context, the interest on the government debt required to build one mile, plus the annual maintenance is ~£1560000 / year. At a UK mean wage of £32k (Sept 2023 figures), you are swallowing the output of approx 50 people / mile / year to add a dual carriageway or motorway to the road network, before considering any other costs at all. It’s instructive to note the impact UK gilt rates have on this balance - interest rates @ 5% completely dominate maintenance costs! Should we include the interest costs? Good question!
Does your proposed road add more than 50 full time jobs / mile / year is an interesting lens through which to view these road projects though. Can we answer that question with any kind of certainty in the modern world?
Why is it "disgraceful" not to do something? Hyperbolic, odd, choice of word.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
They did after the bataclan attack. Look, I’m all in favour of getting rid of virtue signalling, but we all know why the FA and PL won’t show sympathy towards Israel.
"The Football Association is unlikely to light the Wembley arch in the colours of the Israel flag because of fears of a backlash from some communities."
Don't want to show solidarity with a nation that suffered a massive terrorist attack for fear of offending their sympathisers.
Same reason the usual suspects who are normally so vocal on twitter are silent.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
Has this guy never driven outside the UK, where it isn't exactly uncommon to see bi or tri-lingual signs.
It's the Telegraph, why would he have gone outside the UK?
Even if he did physically, he may have stayed at home in his mind.
But that reminds me of the brick of coffee (remember those?) that came from our local Polish mini-supermarket last week (amazing salami range and prices) with instructions on the back in Polish, Czech and Slovak. No English.
Hmmm.
He wrote: “Signs like this. They are confusing as they contain irrelevant and – to most people – unintelligible information.
“Road signs in two languages are potentially dangerous as it takes longer to determine the message.
If he can't read it in the time he gives himself, he just needs to slow down and give himself enough time, but instead he's doing the endemic "anything else but me" thing.
Is Dr Hunt or the Road Sign the more dangerous item?
The problem with bilingual road signs in Wales is that they are invariably done on the cheap with no thought to intelligibility in either language. A better solution would be to use colour to distinguish between them so drivers will automatically focus on the one they understand better. For example, English in dark blue on a white background and Welsh in white on a green background. It's not rocket science ... in fact it's the polar opposite: graphic design.
Colour is already used extensively on road signs for other purposes, so you couldn't use it as you suggest, but there are alternatives. In Ireland the Irish place names on signs are given in an italic script, so it's easy to distinguish between the two.
Has this guy never driven outside the UK, where it isn't exactly uncommon to see bi or tri-lingual signs.
It's the Telegraph, why would he have gone outside the UK?
Even if he did physically, he may have stayed at home in his mind.
But that reminds me of the brick of coffee (remember those?) that came from our local Polish mini-supermarket last week (amazing salami range and prices) with instructions on the back in Polish, Czech and Slovak. No English.
Its not the Telegraph, its Dr Nigel Hunt, visiting professor at Wrexham University....
It's in the Telegraph so one assumes they were willing to publish it .
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
His position as an XR member was likely the idea of a people's assembly as a true democracy. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that is likely his position.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
That's a fair point. I think it was electoral reform.
Sleeper agent out to undermine the Lib Dems, perhaps !
There are a couple of local by-elections today. Both have interesting features, People Against Bureaucracy are a recognised party and they are defending one of their seats in Cheltenham. Caroline Page was a longstanding Lib Dem member of Suffolk CC until her recent death. Her father was a prominent Anglo Saxon scholar and her mother a Norwegian. So it was not surprising that she had a Viking burial on the River Deben. She was co-founder of Save the Deben - her other co-founder is now the Lib Dem candidate for the Woodbridge seat.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Obviously I am aware that it’s a risky strategy, but I think it’s worth it to show Sir Keir up as a doom monger that wanted to lock us all indoors (while he was ok with booze ups for himself & friends)
You might regret invoking the memory of Sir Beer Korma – Big-G-Wales will be bothering you every five minutes
It’s quite something that people see Boris letting people who were working together indoors all day have a drink after work as 100 on the outrage index, whilst Sir Keir having one himself is a zero, when the difference is just a technicality
More like 52-48 really, which as we know is not all or nothing
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
And here it is!
Wow. That is the epitome of a modern, integrated road network for our times.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
You assume it is once a year, but the article says they were taken in ten years - since he was 18.
It's possible he had a sudden realisation a couple of years ago and hasn't flown since he started campaigning on these issues, but it does make him an easy target for the accusation of hypocrisy - which is the greatest sin in British politics and why the Covid parties were so damaging for Johnson.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
His position as an XR member was likely the idea of a people's assembly as a true democracy. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that is likely his position.
Quite. PB will be attacking the gent for wearing a beard next.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
There's a lot of me me me in these protests. If you really want to be the centre of attention then being a hypocrite is not a good look.
I much prefer positive action to negative campaigning.
If he's bored and doesn't know what to do, why not get involved in habitat restoration schemes or research into green energy?
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Hmm. Revisiting, I think you may have inadvertently swapped numbers around.
It's 10 years, and 13 countries - so it starts at age 18 if he is 28.
Anyway, there are ways to avoid lockdowns and minimise NPIs against future respiratory pandemics. Unfortunately, few in Government seem to care about implementing them, possibly because they're not under the cosh on it any more.
We're going to have future pandemics. And despite hating what happened (as I said time and again when it was happening, I truly hated it. You try getting a severely autistic teenager through repeated lockdowns), and, again, as I said, faster and more targeted action could have reduced the scope of NPIs and potentially avoided the full lockdowns in November and January/February.
1 - HEPA filtration and far-UV treatment. We learned that outside was much safer than inside. So turn inside into outside in terms of the effects of the virus. Roll those out to schools, hospitals, encourage them into bars and restaurants and even offices. The R factor drops.
2 - More into vaccine development and funding. Selling off the Harwell VMIC was bloody stupid. Better education on vaccines and addressing the antivax morons.
3 - Significantly increased healthcare capacity. The more capacity to treat acute and general patients, the more headroom we have to try different things. For all the headlines on deaths, it was always the number hospitalised and in intensive care that drove the NPI increases.
Otherwise those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it. The first time as tragedy and the second as farce.
The COVID-19 Inquiry is ongoing, but some have been trying to read the tea leaves and think the Inquiry will be critical of the decision-making in Jan-Mar 2020, when there were arguments in No. 10 and an uninterested Johnson. If more had been done then to reduce spread and isolate cases and contacts, it may be that lockdowns could have been avoided entirely (compare Japan). The Inquiry may also be critical of those in Govt who supported a herd immunity approach, and of a timidity in early SAGE advice.
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Warrington is not a model that can be transposed on to more densely populated parts of the country, particularly not the south east. You can't just build 10 lane motorways through AONB's and National Parks, which is what would happen if you try and fulfil the demand for car use through building new roads, at some point you need to start reducing the demand for car use and developing other options (public transport) - something we realised about 30-40 years ago.
Also the situation in Warrington and this part of the north west is a product of town planning, not something that has happened because town planning has been swept away. All the roads, infrastructure to go with the housing have to be planned and co-ordinated, along with policies that direct growth to certain areas. You don't just create it by throwing up a few motorways and letting people build wherever they want on vaguely defined zones. Even if you create a zonal system, like Japan and many other countries in Europe, it still has to be planned, it is just a slightly different type of planning.
Yes. I haven't ever advocated anarchy, I advocate zonal planning. Which contrary to what @Richard_Tyndall keeps claiming is not what we have in this country.
In a sensible zonal system, like Japan, you can build whatever you want subject without asking permission first if three conditions are met.
1. You own the land (obviously) 2. It is already zoned for housing. 3. You build to building codes.
Neighbours or Councils don't get a say if you want to demolish your home and rebuild it to something else as it's already zoned.
Plan the public infrastructure absolutely. But the land zoned for housing is NOT the public infrastructure land. Leave that to fill in with whatever people want.
The comment I have is that you purport to be in favour of a radical reform of planning in your posts but when it comes down to it, all you are actually arguing for is for more land to be released for housing (something almost everyone who works in the area agrees with- but subject to it being the right land in the right place which is more difficult to resolve) and a different delivery mechanism - a code based system rather than a discretionary system - something that is also not that controversial to deal with in principle, until you start trying to work out what the code should and shouldn't allow, and how deviations are resolved.
The problem with the last 13 years of planning policy is that the government don't want to tackle difficult decisions about where growth goes, they just keep avoiding it - palming it off to someone else, local authorities, civil servants etc... the Labour party seem to be making the right noises , but lets see.
I don't consider zonal planning a radical concept whatsoever.
But to switch from our current system where politicians and neighbours and assorted NIMBYs get a say in blocking development, to one where they don't, would have radical consequences.
It would end the oligopoly of developers that can play the system to acquire and sit on consent (especially but not only if done in conjunction with a switch to LVT). It would allow more variety in what is built, rather than what is It would allow adaptability as if higher density housing for example were desired people could bulldoze low density housing and rebuild to higher density, without having to get their neighbours or Councillors to approve. It would mean politicians would no longer have to appeal or pander to NIMBYs as codes being set nationally and zoning being approved locally means they have no more input after its zoned.
You may be interested to hear that our house in Finland is in a zoning system. We cannot cut down a tree in the garden without permission. The guy across the road is trying to do a self build and has been waiting for 10 months for permission to knock down the existing building and because the new house is 1m higher than the code allows. And of course, in these established built up areas there are exactly the same grievances and arguments between neighbours, they don't disappear with a code system.
The code system works and it doesn't. On the other hand a relative built an entire housing estate on his farm over the course of about 5 years through a code based system selling the plots off individually. But the latter happened not just because of the code system, also because there is unlimited land in Finland to build on and a low population density and no opposition, also because the Finns keep on top of building new infrastructure, unlike the UK. They've also made mistakes in Finland with too liberal code based systems on similar estates, there are estates where opportunistic developers have crammed in too many single storey houses with no space/gardens, it is the cheapest, poor quality type of development, something must have gone wrong with the plot/space ratios. In our relatives case he thinks it worked better because he employed a landscape architect to design the layout, but that was his choice (and expense)
If its already zoned for residential then I'm proposing abolishing seeking permission [except for special circumstances, like listed buildings]. So if the guy across the road is waiting for permission, then that's not a pure zonal system like I propose.
Absolutely agreed that low density is better, hence the parallel conversation about transport. Some people prefer high density though, so if they do then there should be freedom to do that too.
Of course if we have enough houses able to be built, and a liberal zone/code based system then situations where some developments are badly designed while others are well designed, may mean that the well designed developments are sold and lived in while the badly designed ones may end up vacant and be a burden on the owner who badly designed them as nobody is forced to buy or let them given better alternatives and the stupid owner who screwed up needs to continue paying all taxes on the land himself rather than getting an income from those who have no better alternative.
But is there a code or no code in your preferred zoning system? If there is a code then there has to be a method of dealing with situations that breach the code, hence the requirement for permission. I am not aware of any zoning system in a developed country that does not have some sort of building code that sets out limits that must be followed. The examples you use in support of your proposal all have this characteristic.
Why do you need permission? They don't in Japan.
Yes there should be a code, no there should not be a requirement for permission.
Build to code. If you break the code, then you should face consequences, same as breaking any other law, but if you are operating legally you shouldn't need to ask permission first.
So you want to have a code where there are no exceptions. It sounds to me like this would ultimately be a more restrictive system than that which exists at the moment, where you can apply for anything you want.
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
If I read the DtT figures correctly those kind of roads cost £30million per mile to build & then ~£60k / mile to maintain in perpetuity thereafter. This is before including the cost of any bridges or tunnels.
I would love it if, for once, you would do the most basic cost-benefit analysis BR. I’m not saying that we don’t need more roads in the UK, but clearly there’s no point uprooting the entire population to build motorways to their new houses twenty miles further away either.
There must be a point, even in your economic world model, where an incremental mile of road isn’t worth the expense. Where is it? How would you decide that?
NB. To put those numbers in a slightly different context, the interest on the government debt required to build one mile, plus the annual maintenance is ~£1560000 / year. At a UK mean wage of £32k (Sept 2023 figures), you are swallowing the output of approx 50 people / mile / year to add a dual carriageway or motorway to the road network, before considering any other costs at all. It’s instructive to note the impact UK gilt rates have on this balance - interest rates @ 5% completely dominate maintenance costs! Should we include the interest costs? Good question!
Does your proposed road add more than 50 full time jobs / mile / year is an interesting lens through which to view these road projects though. Can we answer that question with any kind of certainty in the modern world?
(That last figure should probably be 50 full times jobs / mile. “per mile per year” could be read as implying a never ending addition of new jobs every year!)
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
His position as an XR member was likely the idea of a people's assembly as a true democracy. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that is likely his position.
If the people's assembly looked at all the options and decided that we should use more North Sea fossil fuels, would he respect its decision?
#BREAKING: Iranian arms smuggling flight en route to #Damascus forced to turn around in the air after the Israeli Air Force makes an appearance near Damascus.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
One of the major demands of XR is for a citizens assembly to be used to decide what policies should be used to tackle global warming. That's the link between the two.
Not often that you have a first in British political history, which I think an SNP MP defecting to the Conservatives is.
Aye - because they're two parties that couldn't be more diametrically opposed on the Union. And if that colossal hurdle were to be cleared in an MP's mind then surely Labour is the closer fit ?
Lab gain next election I think anyway.
The SNP always have problems when they select a representative with a brain. Joanna Cherry being another good example. It's not a mistake they make often in fairness but it does cause problems.
There is a rather good comment below the line on Wings about this:
"Lisa Cameron’s experience and professional skills include working inside the State Hospital, Carstairs (the Scottish equivalent of Broadmoor). So it’s saying something that the atmosphere inside NewSNP was too toxic to bear."
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
His position as an XR member was likely the idea of a people's assembly as a true democracy. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that is likely his position.
If the people's assembly looked at all the options and decided that we should use more North Sea fossil fuels, would he respect its decision?
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Warrington is not a model that can be transposed on to more densely populated parts of the country, particularly not the south east. You can't just build 10 lane motorways through AONB's and National Parks, which is what would happen if you try and fulfil the demand for car use through building new roads, at some point you need to start reducing the demand for car use and developing other options (public transport) - something we realised about 30-40 years ago.
Also the situation in Warrington and this part of the north west is a product of town planning, not something that has happened because town planning has been swept away. All the roads, infrastructure to go with the housing have to be planned and co-ordinated, along with policies that direct growth to certain areas. You don't just create it by throwing up a few motorways and letting people build wherever they want on vaguely defined zones. Even if you create a zonal system, like Japan and many other countries in Europe, it still has to be planned, it is just a slightly different type of planning.
Yes. I haven't ever advocated anarchy, I advocate zonal planning. Which contrary to what @Richard_Tyndall keeps claiming is not what we have in this country.
In a sensible zonal system, like Japan, you can build whatever you want subject without asking permission first if three conditions are met.
1. You own the land (obviously) 2. It is already zoned for housing. 3. You build to building codes.
Neighbours or Councils don't get a say if you want to demolish your home and rebuild it to something else as it's already zoned.
Plan the public infrastructure absolutely. But the land zoned for housing is NOT the public infrastructure land. Leave that to fill in with whatever people want.
The comment I have is that you purport to be in favour of a radical reform of planning in your posts but when it comes down to it, all you are actually arguing for is for more land to be released for housing (something almost everyone who works in the area agrees with- but subject to it being the right land in the right place which is more difficult to resolve) and a different delivery mechanism - a code based system rather than a discretionary system - something that is also not that controversial to deal with in principle, until you start trying to work out what the code should and shouldn't allow, and how deviations are resolved.
The problem with the last 13 years of planning policy is that the government don't want to tackle difficult decisions about where growth goes, they just keep avoiding it - palming it off to someone else, local authorities, civil servants etc... the Labour party seem to be making the right noises , but lets see.
I don't consider zonal planning a radical concept whatsoever.
But to switch from our current system where politicians and neighbours and assorted NIMBYs get a say in blocking development, to one where they don't, would have radical consequences.
It would end the oligopoly of developers that can play the system to acquire and sit on consent (especially but not only if done in conjunction with a switch to LVT). It would allow more variety in what is built, rather than what is It would allow adaptability as if higher density housing for example were desired people could bulldoze low density housing and rebuild to higher density, without having to get their neighbours or Councillors to approve. It would mean politicians would no longer have to appeal or pander to NIMBYs as codes being set nationally and zoning being approved locally means they have no more input after its zoned.
You may be interested to hear that our house in Finland is in a zoning system. We cannot cut down a tree in the garden without permission. The guy across the road is trying to do a self build and has been waiting for 10 months for permission to knock down the existing building and because the new house is 1m higher than the code allows. And of course, in these established built up areas there are exactly the same grievances and arguments between neighbours, they don't disappear with a code system.
The code system works and it doesn't. On the other hand a relative built an entire housing estate on his farm over the course of about 5 years through a code based system selling the plots off individually. But the latter happened not just because of the code system, also because there is unlimited land in Finland to build on and a low population density and no opposition, also because the Finns keep on top of building new infrastructure, unlike the UK. They've also made mistakes in Finland with too liberal code based systems on similar estates, there are estates where opportunistic developers have crammed in too many single storey houses with no space/gardens, it is the cheapest, poor quality type of development, something must have gone wrong with the plot/space ratios. In our relatives case he thinks it worked better because he employed a landscape architect to design the layout, but that was his choice (and expense)
If its already zoned for residential then I'm proposing abolishing seeking permission [except for special circumstances, like listed buildings]. So if the guy across the road is waiting for permission, then that's not a pure zonal system like I propose.
Absolutely agreed that low density is better, hence the parallel conversation about transport. Some people prefer high density though, so if they do then there should be freedom to do that too.
Of course if we have enough houses able to be built, and a liberal zone/code based system then situations where some developments are badly designed while others are well designed, may mean that the well designed developments are sold and lived in while the badly designed ones may end up vacant and be a burden on the owner who badly designed them as nobody is forced to buy or let them given better alternatives and the stupid owner who screwed up needs to continue paying all taxes on the land himself rather than getting an income from those who have no better alternative.
But is there a code or no code in your preferred zoning system? If there is a code then there has to be a method of dealing with situations that breach the code, hence the requirement for permission. I am not aware of any zoning system in a developed country that does not have some sort of building code that sets out limits that must be followed. The examples you use in support of your proposal all have this characteristic.
Why do you need permission? They don't in Japan.
Yes there should be a code, no there should not be a requirement for permission.
Build to code. If you break the code, then you should face consequences, same as breaking any other law, but if you are operating legally you shouldn't need to ask permission first.
So you want to have a code where there are no exceptions. It sounds to me like this would ultimately be a more restrictive system than that which exists at the moment, where you can apply for anything you want.
No, I want a code where if you build to code you don't need to ask permission, its automatic, for normal zoned appropriately land buildings which are not listed.
Want to build an extension to your property? If its to code, build it. Want to knock down your property and rebuild it? If its to code, do it. Want to buy undeveloped land (that is zoned appropriately) buy it and start building on it. No consultations, no discussions with neighbours, no politicians getting involved.
If you want an exemption? Then apply for one. If you want to convert land not zoned for housing to land zoned for housing? Then apply for it.
But only those outside of code, or outside of what is already zoned, would be going through a permission process.
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
And here it is!
Wow. That is the epitome of a modern, integrated road network for our times.
I am old enough to remember when Israel was being pressed to give up land for peace. Well it did that in Gaza. It gave up land. It removed the settlers. And what it got in return was Hamas and rockets and now massacres.
Israel has made many mistakes over the years. Netanyahu is unquestionably the wrong leader for it, especially at such a time. I fear that an invasion of Gaza now will be a strategic error and lead to all sorts of casualties for the innocent.
But the Palestinians have consistently made huge errors, the biggest one of all being their refusal to accept Israel's right to exist. Hamas seeks the elimination of Israel and the killing of every Jew everywhere - not just in Israel. This is explicitly genocidal. There is no negotiation with such a movement. Eliminating it is the only answer. Just as we sought to eliminate Nazism and ISIS and other similar genocidal movements.
Those who worry about what happens next need to provide an alternative to Israel, one that will not make that country prey to genocidal maniacs. Lots of people are willing to speak hard truths to Israel about obeying the laws of war and civilian deaths and the rest of it. Very few are telling Hamas that it is their genocidal ideology which has brought Gaza to the point it is, that it is their deliberate policy of hiding amongst civilians which is putting Palestinians at risk, it is their refusal to accept Israel's right to exist which means there is not the remotest hope of starting any peace talks.
There is plenty of pressure which needs putting on Israel but Hamas must first be eliminated. It cannot - until it changes what it wants - be a player. It has taken itself outside the universe of civilised decency. So if invasion of Gaza is not the solution, what is? And if we don't have an alternative solution, then we can hardly be surprised if Israel does what it thinks necessary to save itself. What would we do were we in their position?
I sometimes feel that commentators are unwilling to provide or even begin to think about what an alternative might be because - after all the condemnations of Hamas - they give up at expecting anything better from the Palestinians and it is, after all, so much easier and more comfortable to revert to criticising Israel.
I was saying something similar the other day. Gaza allows itself to be ruled by Hamas. It does this in the knowledge that Hamas is committed to the death of all Jews. The murderous assaults came from their territory and seem to have been a source of glee.
I fully get that the residents of Gaza have a terrible life, that they are economically repressed by Israel and made to beg for water and electricity. Israel’s policies have been unenlightened at best and self harming all too often. If I lived in Gaza I would hate the Israeli government and want to resist that oppression.
But if you want to be listened to, if you want things to change, you do not start with the beheading of babies because they are Jews.
It is 17 years since there was an election in Gaza. 17 years during which Hamas has done it's best to kill anyone who actively opposes them. The Palestinians there 'allow' themselves to be ruled by Hamas about as much as the inhabitants of Kabul 'allow' themselves to be ruled by the Taliban.
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Hmm. Revisiting, I think you may have inadvertently swapped numbers around.
It's 10 years, and 13 countries - so it starts at age 18 if he is 28.
At which point it *was* all his decisions.
Oh, sorry, my bad. I would still give a mulligan for the first few years
Not often that you have a first in British political history, which I think an SNP MP defecting to the Conservatives is.
Aye - because they're two parties that couldn't be more diametrically opposed on the Union. And if that colossal hurdle were to be cleared in an MP's mind then surely Labour is the closer fit ?
Lab gain next election I think anyway.
The SNP always have problems when they select a representative with a brain. Joanna Cherry being another good example. It's not a mistake they make often in fairness but it does cause problems.
An area post Ruth in which the SCons are admirably error free. RD was so smart she rapidly saw in which direction a prosperous career lay.
Until the last few days, the phenomenon of Western lefties defending barbarism in the name of a desired utopian, egalitarian ideal was a historical abstraction to me.
I had read about Westerners defending Stalin's purges and collectivization campaigns and thought, well, their ideological fervor was probably just amplified by the difficulty of getting good information out of the USSR.
But now I see that's not it.
Then, as now, there was plenty of information to understand what was really going on. It's just that the ideology IS about this, it IS that ends justify the means. It's how we got the Red Terror, the Great Terror and this—Western leftists cheering all the while.
And, if Soviet history is any guide, the only thing that made these can't-make-an-omelet folks reconsider whether that was really true—or if the end was worth it if these were the means—was finding themselves in an NKVD cell and thinking, "There's been a terrible mistake."
By then, of course, it was too late.
If this is the kind of revolution you support, just know: the revolution always eats its young. Always.
As a leftist I can say, honestly, that Stalinism is bad. The USSR was bad. The roughly 60 million killed in the 70 years between 1917 and 1987 was bad.
As a leftist I can also say, honestly, that the British Empire was bad. That imperialism in all forms in bad. The roughly 100 million killed in the 40 years between 1881 and 1920 by the British Empire, was bad.
I will never be treated as if I sincerely believe the first one if I ever make a comment about how the industrialisation of the USSR from serfdom under the Tsar to beating the Nazi war machine under Stalin was still pretty impressive, as was the increase in literacy and numeracy rates and the relative decline in poverty. Whereas people will legitimately defend the second statement by saying "well, we gave them the railways and democracy, so it was fine".
Where does the 100 million come from ?
I guess if you add in WWI and subsequent epidemics, although I don't think they can be laid entirely at the door of the British Empire.
The 100 million deaths seems to be attributed to India alone. Using similar methodologies as to how the USSR count is come to (although some estimates of the USSR death count includes the numbers of Nazi soldiers they killed - which I do not think is reasonable to add).
That all seems pretty fanciful. That would imply that the British killed off 25% of India's population in those 39 years.
It's just made up twaddle.
My bad. It would imply that the British killed off one third to forty per cent of India's population, in just 39 years.
In similar vein, a large majority of the total comes from guesses and assumptions.
Correction that claim publicised by Hickel is $ not £.
One the perceptional inflationary tricks is that we are all used to £1 = $1.25-$1.5, but the calculation uses £1 = £4.8 dollars as that was the approx exchange rate 100-250 years ago.
Another is that 150-250 years of compound interest at 5% is included. Just 150 years of compounding at 5% increases a sum by 1500 times.
It doesn't matter what the method of calculation is. A figure that is manifestly absurd (such as killing 33-40% of the population in 40 years) is manifestly absurd. $45 trillion dollars is about 15 times modern UK GDP, and two and a half times the entirety of UK net wealth.
Even if the the British had taken every single penny of Indian income between 1763 and 1947, one could not come close to such a figure.
I am old enough to remember when Israel was being pressed to give up land for peace. Well it did that in Gaza. It gave up land. It removed the settlers. And what it got in return was Hamas and rockets and now massacres.
Israel has made many mistakes over the years. Netanyahu is unquestionably the wrong leader for it, especially at such a time. I fear that an invasion of Gaza now will be a strategic error and lead to all sorts of casualties for the innocent.
But the Palestinians have consistently made huge errors, the biggest one of all being their refusal to accept Israel's right to exist. Hamas seeks the elimination of Israel and the killing of every Jew everywhere - not just in Israel. This is explicitly genocidal. There is no negotiation with such a movement. Eliminating it is the only answer. Just as we sought to eliminate Nazism and ISIS and other similar genocidal movements.
Those who worry about what happens next need to provide an alternative to Israel, one that will not make that country prey to genocidal maniacs. Lots of people are willing to speak hard truths to Israel about obeying the laws of war and civilian deaths and the rest of it. Very few are telling Hamas that it is their genocidal ideology which has brought Gaza to the point it is, that it is their deliberate policy of hiding amongst civilians which is putting Palestinians at risk, it is their refusal to accept Israel's right to exist which means there is not the remotest hope of starting any peace talks.
There is plenty of pressure which needs putting on Israel but Hamas must first be eliminated. It cannot - until it changes what it wants - be a player. It has taken itself outside the universe of civilised decency. So if invasion of Gaza is not the solution, what is? And if we don't have an alternative solution, then we can hardly be surprised if Israel does what it thinks necessary to save itself. What would we do were we in their position?
I sometimes feel that commentators are unwilling to provide or even begin to think about what an alternative might be because - after all the condemnations of Hamas - they give up at expecting anything better from the Palestinians and it is, after all, so much easier and more comfortable to revert to criticising Israel.
I was saying something similar the other day. Gaza allows itself to be ruled by Hamas. It does this in the knowledge that Hamas is committed to the death of all Jews. The murderous assaults came from their territory and seem to have been a source of glee.
I fully get that the residents of Gaza have a terrible life, that they are economically repressed by Israel and made to beg for water and electricity. Israel’s policies have been unenlightened at best and self harming all too often. If I lived in Gaza I would hate the Israeli government and want to resist that oppression.
But if you want to be listened to, if you want things to change, you do not start with the beheading of babies because they are Jews.
It is 17 years since there was an election in Gaza. 17 years during which Hamas has done it's best to kill anyone who actively opposes them. The Palestinians there 'allow' themselves to be ruled by Hamas about as much as the inhabitants of Kabul 'allow' themselves to be ruled by the Taliban.
Quite a large proportion of the population wouldn't even have been born back then.
(Guardian) The British Metropolitan police, which covers London, says it will not see the holding of a Palestinian flag as a criminal offence.
In a letter to London’s Jewish community, the Met deputy commissioner Dame Lynne Owens said: “What we cannot do is interpret support for the Palestinian cause more broadly as automatically being support for Hamas or any other proscribed group, even when it follows so soon after an attack carried out by that group and when to many the link seems indisputable.
“An expression of support for the Palestinian people more broadly, including flying the Palestinian flag, does not, alone, constitute a criminal offence.
“Of course, behaviour at protests goes beyond what is and isn’t seen as support for proscribed groups. I know that in the past we have seen people use these opportunities to make statements that are quite clearly antisemitic and a hate crime.
“Abuse or intimidation that is religiously motivated will not be accepted and officers will act when they see it. “
I am old enough to remember when Israel was being pressed to give up land for peace. Well it did that in Gaza. It gave up land. It removed the settlers. And what it got in return was Hamas and rockets and now massacres.
Israel has made many mistakes over the years. Netanyahu is unquestionably the wrong leader for it, especially at such a time. I fear that an invasion of Gaza now will be a strategic error and lead to all sorts of casualties for the innocent.
But the Palestinians have consistently made huge errors, the biggest one of all being their refusal to accept Israel's right to exist. Hamas seeks the elimination of Israel and the killing of every Jew everywhere - not just in Israel. This is explicitly genocidal. There is no negotiation with such a movement. Eliminating it is the only answer. Just as we sought to eliminate Nazism and ISIS and other similar genocidal movements.
Those who worry about what happens next need to provide an alternative to Israel, one that will not make that country prey to genocidal maniacs. Lots of people are willing to speak hard truths to Israel about obeying the laws of war and civilian deaths and the rest of it. Very few are telling Hamas that it is their genocidal ideology which has brought Gaza to the point it is, that it is their deliberate policy of hiding amongst civilians which is putting Palestinians at risk, it is their refusal to accept Israel's right to exist which means there is not the remotest hope of starting any peace talks.
There is plenty of pressure which needs putting on Israel but Hamas must first be eliminated. It cannot - until it changes what it wants - be a player. It has taken itself outside the universe of civilised decency. So if invasion of Gaza is not the solution, what is? And if we don't have an alternative solution, then we can hardly be surprised if Israel does what it thinks necessary to save itself. What would we do were we in their position?
I sometimes feel that commentators are unwilling to provide or even begin to think about what an alternative might be because - after all the condemnations of Hamas - they give up at expecting anything better from the Palestinians and it is, after all, so much easier and more comfortable to revert to criticising Israel.
I was saying something similar the other day. Gaza allows itself to be ruled by Hamas. It does this in the knowledge that Hamas is committed to the death of all Jews. The murderous assaults came from their territory and seem to have been a source of glee.
I fully get that the residents of Gaza have a terrible life, that they are economically repressed by Israel and made to beg for water and electricity. Israel’s policies have been unenlightened at best and self harming all too often. If I lived in Gaza I would hate the Israeli government and want to resist that oppression.
But if you want to be listened to, if you want things to change, you do not start with the beheading of babies because they are Jews.
It is 17 years since there was an election in Gaza. 17 years during which Hamas has done it's best to kill anyone who actively opposes them. The Palestinians there 'allow' themselves to be ruled by Hamas about as much as the inhabitants of Kabul 'allow' themselves to be ruled by the Taliban.
So send the military in to liberate the populace and destroy Hamas.
(Guardian) The British Metropolitan police, which covers London, says it will not see the holding of a Palestinian flag as a criminal offence.
In a letter to London’s Jewish community, the Met deputy commissioner Dame Lynne Owens said: “What we cannot do is interpret support for the Palestinian cause more broadly as automatically being support for Hamas or any other proscribed group, even when it follows so soon after an attack carried out by that group and when to many the link seems indisputable.
“An expression of support for the Palestinian people more broadly, including flying the Palestinian flag, does not, alone, constitute a criminal offence.
“Of course, behaviour at protests goes beyond what is and isn’t seen as support for proscribed groups. I know that in the past we have seen people use these opportunities to make statements that are quite clearly antisemitic and a hate crime.
“Abuse or intimidation that is religiously motivated will not be accepted and officers will act when they see it. “
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
His position as an XR member was likely the idea of a people's assembly as a true democracy. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that is likely his position.
If the people's assembly looked at all the options and decided that we should use more North Sea fossil fuels, would he respect its decision?
I assume so
We have a people's assembly that says we should use more North Sea fossil fuels, its the House of Commons.
Although Sleepy Joe is not up to the job, the big difference is the "professionals" (many ex-Obama officials) are actually running the government, compared to Trump often weird / poorly qualified picks.
Uncle Barty always makes Warrington sound bloody awful, soulless identikit housing surrounded by motorways. I have been to Warrington, it’s not that bad in real life. At least not the bit I visited.
Hmm, a look at TripAdvisor throws up cultural activities like Zombie Scavenger Hunts (not sure if the undead are doinf the scavenging or being eaten), though there is a nice looking trad municipal museum with mummy and paintings and dino and all. Okay. Walton Hall is No 1 Best Thing to Do in Warrington, and the Museum is No 3., but it 's a bit worrying that Gullivers World Theme Park is no 2 and an alpaca farm is no 4. Really trad Lanc culture that, of a part with parkin and faggot and so on. It thins out a bit later, No 105 being a bcobblestoned street, which at least doesn't take long to inspect.
Of course people are mobile and via motorways you can get elsewhere within the NW within a very reasonable time too. Want to be in Liverpool, or Manchester, or Chester, or North Wales? All easily accessible.
"Of course people are mobile [...] via motorways [...]".
Lots of people don't have cars. As much reminded on here.
Not a problem.
There's these things called buses and coaches that can go on motorways for the small minority who have no access to private transport.
Maybe you have heard of them before?
Sadly, the cost of bus travel has increased even while fuel duty has been cut, punishing the disabled, poor and young.
That's if the bus actually exists. 1,500 routes have been cut just since 2021. 10% of all services were cut in the last year. 50% since 2010.
I extend a compromise - no new motorways until bus travel costs are cut to the same extent as fuel duty, and the number of services return to pre-2010 levels?
The one all-day last service through this small town was recently re-routed. We can get to Stansted Airport on one bus. However, getting to either of the two local hospitals requires two buses. We used to be able to get a bus directly to one.
Good morning to all. That’s a greeting, not a comment on the weather, grey and damp.
Good morning too. On the contrary, for a change in Scotland the weather here is bright and sunny, if chilly at night - have had to put the heating on briefly in the morning and evening as it was otherwise too cold for comfort at the desk all day.
Beautiful and Autumnal in South Manchester too. Off to Scotland in a week and a half (Dunkeld) - a few days like this would do very nicely.
Anyway, looking back up this thread - Bart is being a tad obtuse. You COULD get tge bus from Warrington to Manchester or Liverpool or Chester, but 99% of people making those journeys by public transport would take the train, what with Warrington also having really good rail connections to those places.
[Citation Needed] on 99% because the facts don't represent that I believe.
Yes if you want to get from Warrington Town Centre to Manchester City Centre then the train is absolutely fantastic. I've used it myself I'll have you know, when I went to Manchester Christmas Market and wanted to drink so wouldn't drive.
But if you want to go either from or to other places then buses can be better. Want to get from your home, not town centre, to the Trafford Centre for instance? Buses can work very well for that too. There's options and choice either way. Of course cars are far better, but I've met people there before for days out who took a bus rather than drive.
Plus as Rochdale said I'm in favour of building public transport as well as motorways. Indeed I can't see any reason why we couldn't with investment have a Northwest tram network that operates all the way from Liverpool to Manchester and covering all the towns in-between.
The only fanatics here are those who oppose any investment in roads just because they despise roads and cars. I'm not opposing investment in public transport, even though I don't use it.
Fair enough. It has to be said, the bus is an often-overlooked mode of transport and can often work out surprisingly efficient - both halves of this statement are especially true outside of big urban areas, where the lack of congestion can mean a well-planned bus journey is often just as quick as driving.
Buses reduce congestion, of course.
The most stupid people in the UK are drivers who oppose bus lanes.
Don't be silly. There is no reason to reserve an entire lane for a bus that carries 2 people plus the driver on board and is empty then for a few minutes until the next bus uses it.
Just let the bus and cars all the lane, same any other traffic.
Hahaha. Proven.
The only response you have as you know you're talking shit.
There's this wonderful thing called bus stops that can be built, little lay-bys that the bus can pull into when it wants to, then rejoin free flowing traffic.
Hundreds of vehicles per hour using the lane is better than 10 vehicles an hour using the lane.
Check my edit out: People don't use buses when they spend the whole journey stuck in traffic. Which means more people take the car. Which leads to more traffic. And so on
Edinburgh is introducing 24/7 bus lanes shortly.
If you have sufficient road capacity, then traffic isn't a problem so its moot.
Unless I'm at a traffic light I spend almost all of my time driving in town at the speed limit, whether it be 30, 40 or 50mph.
Cars and buses driving at 50mph allows far more throughput of vehicles, people and goods than restricting your lanes and creating traffic jams.
You can magic capacity out of nowhere if you take 50 cars off the road and pop those people on a bus.
Same logic for traffic signals for Trams - 250 people onboard have priority over the drivers.
But the buses don't go from door to door, don't take a direct route, and have to stop to let other people on and off. So they'll always be inferior to driving.
Which is why only 2-3 people are on board, not 50.
You seem to be living in a bizarre universe where congestion is the problem. Try living outside of a city, build lower density, and have enough capacity.
If congestion isn't a problem, why do you need more roads?
Buses round me are completely packed. But then we don't have the terrible bus service you have in Warrington, much maligned in your local paper.
Have you not been paying attention?
We need more roads to make more direct routes from point to point. As well as to release capacity by allowing cars to travel fast wherever they're not intending to ultimately be, and allowing local roads to only serve local traffic. The default speed of vehicles moving around should be 50-70mph if they're not in the first or last mile of their journey most of the time.
I don't advocate widening motorways, I see it as a mostly pointless exercise.
I advocate building new roads where they don't currently exist.
Don't widen the M6, build a new M59, a new M580 etc
And here it is!
Wow. That is the epitome of a modern, integrated road network for our times.
This is probably the 'missing motorway' that was needed, although maybe with more tunnelling if it was done now.
lol - I was guessing when I drew that map. (And I do literally mean drew. That's my map you just linked to...)
LOL from me as well (though not as good as yours). I see you mention the Stocksbridge bypass. I helped build that back in 1987. Out of university during an oil price crash and after applying unsuccessfully for around 200 jobs I ended up working with a Tarmac road crew for the summer and autumn of 87 building the A616.
Has this guy never driven outside the UK, where it isn't exactly uncommon to see bi or tri-lingual signs.
It's everything that is inane and tragi-comic about Britain today.
I don't know what's worse. The fact that he wrote it, that fact that he posted it, that fact that his university apologised for it, the fact that the Telegraph published it, the fact that you posted it on PB or the fact that I'm replying to it.
Sunak seems doomed, but one thing he should try, in my opinion, is to contrast his ‘Eat out to help out’ optimism with Sir Keir’s “we better all stay in for a few more months this summer, even though the worst was way behind us” strategy,
“Johnson Variant”, Jesus Christ. He must have been secretly hoping for more cases when we opened up against his advice
"Guys, remember that time I used your money to pay people to go out for pizza and a load of them caught Cofid and died" doesn't sound like a vote winner to me, but I'm happy for the Tories to give it a go.
Obviously I am aware that it’s a risky strategy, but I think it’s worth it to show Sir Keir up as a doom monger that wanted to lock us all indoors (while he was ok with booze ups for himself & friends)
You might regret invoking the memory of Sir Beer Korma – Big-G-Wales will be bothering you every five minutes
It’s quite something that people see Boris letting people who were working together indoors all day have a drink after work as 100 on the outrage index, whilst Sir Keir having one himself is a zero, when the difference is just a technicality
More like 52-48 really, which as we know is not all or nothing
It's simple - if you set the rules you need to stick to them.
Defections to the Conservatives from any party are very unusual. The only previous examples since 1945 seem to be Reg Prentice (1977), Alan Brown (1962), Ivor Thomas (1948), Alfred Edwards (1948).
Although Sleepy Joe is not up to the job, the big difference is the "professionals" (many ex-Obama officials) are actually running the government, compared to Trump often weird / poorly qualified picks.
Biden was almost catatonic in his dreadful presser yesterday. I still have grave doubts he will stand in 24. He’s just too old and getting older
THE eco-zealot who dumped glitter on Sir Keir Starmer at the Labour Party conference while demanding “democracy” is a privileged globe-trotting rich kid.
Jobless XR moaner Yaz Ashmawi, 28, studied at a private school in the oil-rich UAE and enjoys a £750,000 second home in Devon.
As much as he as an individual will annoy me - so what? Like, 13 flights in ten years is not that much and if he has realised that the privileges of his upbringing give him some ability to make the world a better place - good? That's exactly what people with power and money should do. I understand why poor and precarious people don't protest - they have little option but to do what they must.
You're right. It's not that much. However if you are a protestor for XR or JSO then for your message to be effective you have got to practice what you preach. Otherwise you are just a hypocrite.
I suggest it's actually quite a lot. Given his wealth it may also be business class:
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
He's 28 - 13 years mean some of these flights he would have been 15? So family holidays where he may not have had a choice? Also - like maybe he got a better understanding of climate change in his early 20s (like me)
Was the Yazmeister protesting about climate change in this instance? He shouted something about democracy iirc.
His position as an XR member was likely the idea of a people's assembly as a true democracy. I don't necessarily agree with that, but that is likely his position.
If the people's assembly looked at all the options and decided that we should use more North Sea fossil fuels, would he respect its decision?
I assume so
We have a people's assembly that says we should use more North Sea fossil fuels, its the House of Commons.
Direct democracy and representative democracy are two different things. You can argue that one is more efficient or moral than the other, but to ignore the distinction is not particularly useful.
Comments
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/feb/27/israeli-settler-violence-in-west-bank-escalates-huwara
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VmJyK9aVMA
Glad we cleared that up.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-67087840
"The SNP's Lisa Cameron has announced her defection to the Conservatives.
The East Kilbride, Strathaven and Lesmahagow MP was facing a selection contest to remain as the SNP's candidate at the next general election.
She said she quit because of a "toxic" culture in the party Westminster group.
Prime Minister Rishi Sunak and Scottish Tory leader Douglas Ross both welcomed her to the party. The SNP has called for Dr Cameron to step down to allow a by-election."
Timothy Snyder estimates 6 to 9 million Soviets deliberately put to death by Stalin, or dying as a result of deportation, or internment in the camps.
The real difficulty is the treatment of deaths by famine. In some cases, famine was used as a tool of policy, to break peasant resistance to collectivisation. In others, it occurred due to callousness and incompetence, and in other cases, pure bad luck.
Presumably the Sun are in favour of Labour's raid on private schools given this is the kind of person they turn out?
Jeremy Hunt was actually very good at this e.g. government - shut all schools, Hunt, I think that might have an issue, where do key workers kids go? How about running classes for those.
Overwhelmingly Starmer was always harder, faster, further. His "ideas" were normally even worse e.g. everybody needs to test every time they leave the house to meet anybody. It just isn't practical.
Or the we need to fast track PPE providers, here is a dossier of potential providers we think you need to talk to (who turned out to be even more dodgy than the ones the government used).
Or close the border now, 18 months into the pandemic....because at the outset that would have been racist.
https://news.sky.com/story/wembley-stadium-arch-not-set-to-be-lit-in-colours-of-israeli-flag-12983094
The really massive misstep that will have resulted in excess deaths. Yeah sure you can go on your summer holiday (2020) all across Europe, everybody deserves a holiday after the lockdown. That is how we widely seeded the worst variant all across the country just in time for the autumn / winter. Having mass groups of people all mixing from across Europe is how we got it from Italy in the first place, then we repeated exactly the same mistaken in the summer.
Lab gain next election I think anyway.
I fear the English who need most education in the subject have not been watching David Olusoga’s Union.
Do we light up the arch in every country's flag everywhere in the world that is under attack or has had atrocities committed against it?
https://warwick.ac.uk/fac/soc/economics/research/centres/cage/news/30-10-20-eat_out_to_help_out_scheme_drove_new_covid_19_infections_up_by_between_8_and_17_new_research_finds/
https://academic.oup.com/ej/article/132/643/1200/6382847
https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/comment/treasury-eat-out-help-out-reputation
I never said to uproot everyone, or to build indefinitely, but we need millions more homes and new towns and all sorts of development, that requires infrastructure.
Our population has grown massively this century yet the road network has not kept pace with our population growth remotely.
Pretty much every major town and city ought to be connected and not only via spokes like London and Manchester.
And we get a major pandemic on average approximately every 100 years, so voting based on the pandemic is a very bad way to choose a PM.
He has jetted to 13 countries on four continents in ten years
I would say that if he is serious about what he alleges are his beliefs, he should be aiming not to fly at all and substantially achieving it.
It reminds of the attention-seeking XR convict featured in the media from my area, who when I followed up turned out to live in a valuable farmhouse renting out holiday barn conversions for a living, and neither the farmhouse nor the barn conversions had even half-decent energy efficiency.
In my book hypocrites don't deserve a hearing, particularly hypocrites who are not modelling whatever they seek to impose on everyone else.
But I know that's not a popular view on PB.
https://pathetic.org.uk/unbuilt/m67_manchester_to_sheffield_motorway/
This is probably the 'missing motorway' that was needed, although maybe with more tunnelling if it was done now.
What next. The players take the knee for Hamas ? Spineless, gutless, cowards at the FA.
I would never say I was culpable or felt guilty doing it. If I had my time again I would do the same.
Does your proposed road add more than 50 full time jobs / mile / year is an interesting lens through which to view these road projects though. Can we answer that question with any kind of certainty in the modern world?
"The Football Association is unlikely to light the Wembley arch in the colours of the Israel flag because of fears of a backlash from some communities."
Don't want to show solidarity with a nation that suffered a massive terrorist attack for fear of offending their sympathisers.
Same reason the usual suspects who are normally so vocal on twitter are silent.
LAB: 46% (=)
CON: 30% (+3)
LDM: 10% (-1)
RFM: 5% (=)
GRN: 3% (-1)
SNP: 2% (-1)
Via @savanta_UK, 6-8 Oct.
Changes w/ 29 Sep - 1 Oct."
Sleeper agent out to undermine the Lib Dems, perhaps !
https://medium.com/britainelects/previewing-the-cheltenham-and-suffolk-by-elections-of-12th-october-2023-182d96d2823a
More like 52-48 really, which as we know is not all or nothing
As well as other examples that were never proposed that should be.
The M59 is a good one as well as the M64 for example.
It's possible he had a sudden realisation a couple of years ago and hasn't flown since he started campaigning on these issues, but it does make him an easy target for the accusation of hypocrisy - which is the greatest sin in British politics and why the Covid parties were so damaging for Johnson.
I much prefer positive action to negative campaigning.
If he's bored and doesn't know what to do, why not get involved in habitat restoration schemes or research into green energy?
It's 10 years, and 13 countries - so it starts at age 18 if he is 28.
At which point it *was* all his decisions.
Not immediately obvious why they’d do that
https://x.com/mylordbebo/status/1712429014512439400?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw
https://x.com/israelwarroom/status/1712428592271876169?s=46&t=bulOICNH15U6kB0MwE6Lfw
"Lisa Cameron’s experience and professional skills include working inside the State Hospital, Carstairs (the Scottish equivalent of Broadmoor). So it’s saying something that the atmosphere inside NewSNP was too toxic to bear."
Want to build an extension to your property? If its to code, build it. Want to knock down your property and rebuild it? If its to code, do it. Want to buy undeveloped land (that is zoned appropriately) buy it and start building on it. No consultations, no discussions with neighbours, no politicians getting involved.
If you want an exemption? Then apply for one. If you want to convert land not zoned for housing to land zoned for housing? Then apply for it.
But only those outside of code, or outside of what is already zoned, would be going through a permission process.
EXCITING
Even if the the British had taken every single penny of Indian income between 1763 and 1947, one could not come close to such a figure.
The British Metropolitan police, which covers London, says it will not see the holding of a Palestinian flag as a criminal offence.
In a letter to London’s Jewish community, the Met deputy commissioner Dame Lynne Owens said: “What we cannot do is interpret support for the Palestinian cause more broadly as automatically being support for Hamas or any other proscribed group, even when it follows so soon after an attack carried out by that group and when to many the link seems indisputable.
“An expression of support for the Palestinian people more broadly, including flying the Palestinian flag, does not, alone, constitute a criminal offence.
“Of course, behaviour at protests goes beyond what is and isn’t seen as support for proscribed groups. I know that in the past we have seen people use these opportunities to make statements that are quite clearly antisemitic and a hate crime.
“Abuse or intimidation that is religiously motivated will not be accepted and officers will act when they see it. “
2 birds, one stone.
Although Sleepy Joe is not up to the job, the big difference is the "professionals" (many ex-Obama officials) are actually running the government, compared to Trump often weird / poorly qualified picks.
I don't know what's worse. The fact that he wrote it, that fact that he posted it, that fact that his university apologised for it, the fact that the Telegraph published it, the fact that you posted it on PB or the fact that I'm replying to it.
OK, it's me. I'm the worst (goes to beat self up)