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So far this year voting intentions barely moved – politicalbetting.com

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  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,246

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
  • numbertwelvenumbertwelve Posts: 6,927
    edited September 2023
    GIN1138 said:

    People have made up their minds. They want the Tories OUT

    Oh and hi, PB.

    And, to be fair, the Tories are doing a great job of reminding people why they want them out on a daily basis.

    I had expected to see some small green shoots of a fightback by now. Not enough to win an election or anything like that, but something.

    I may have to revise my prediction for Lab overall majority (which I thought was a possible, but no means certain outcome). It is starting to feel like we could be heading for a Tory cataclysm.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    Sandpit said:

    Rishi Sunak says it is ‘completely and utterly wrong’ to blame him for school concrete crisis

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2023/sep/04/labour-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-education-raac-schools-building-crisis-shadow-cabinet-reshuffle-uk-politics-latest

    So who's fault is it then?

    Osborne who else ?
    Gordon Brown, for going into the last recession running a deficit, having ‘invested’ in tax credits, and leaving the public finances in an unsustainable position from which they’ve not yet fully recovered.
    I admire your commitment to the Tory cause but I honestly think only the diehards will buy that one.

    Even if you really think Brown caused a sea-change in borrowing (he didn't) how many years would you say we need to allow for competent Tory economic management to turn it around? 15 years? 20 years? 50 years?

    13 years is clearly not enough because the cyclically-adjusted budget deficit which was running at 2.1% before the GFC has now been reduced by the Tories masterful economic management to... oh, 3.1%. Marvellous.

    The voting public are (rightly) not going to blame Gordon Brown for the current shambles.
    Okay, I’ll admit to tongue being a little bit in cheek. It’s been a long day and it’s now beer o’clock!

    Were it not for pandemic and war, the finances would obviously be in somewhat better shape, but you’re right that the blame is heading for the incumbents, as is the case in pretty much every western democracy at the moment.
  • FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,079
    HYUFD said:

    HYUFD said:

    On the most substantive change in the reshuffle, let’s see how Rayner does in “Levelling Up”.

    There seems to be an idea that Rayner can be the next government’s Prescott, but Prescott was a crap minister who pissed money up against the wall.

    Rayner is a liability-in-waiting if you ask me.

    Like Prescott her main role is to connect with Labour's traditional working class vote
    That’s fine, but Prescott was not capable of managing a big-spending ministry. There’s no evidence Rayner is, either.
    We won't know until she gets a Cabinet job, as long as she doesn't punch someone she will have done better than Prescott
    I was no fan of Prescott, but the people he punched deserved to be punched. I think the 'if the other guy starts it, self-defence plus a bit more is justified' argument applies.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,806

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
  • GIN1138 said:

    People have made up their minds. They want the Tories OUT

    Oh and hi, PB.

    And, to be fair, the Tories are doing a great job of reminding people why they want them out on a daily basis.

    I had expected to see some small green shoots of a fightback by now. Not enough to win an election or anything like that, but something.

    I may have to revise my prediction for Lab overall majority (which I thought was a possible, but no means certain outcome). It is starting to feel like we could be heading for a Tory cataclysm.
    The incumbent squatters within the Tory Party who no-one elected have prevented any fight back. Truss was the last one who wanted to do anything worthwhile.
  • HYUFD said:

    On the most substantive change in the reshuffle, let’s see how Rayner does in “Levelling Up”.

    There seems to be an idea that Rayner can be the next government’s Prescott, but Prescott was a crap minister who pissed money up against the wall.

    Rayner is a liability-in-waiting if you ask me.

    Like Prescott her main role is to connect with Labour's traditional working class vote
    That’s fine, but Prescott was not capable of managing a big-spending ministry. There’s no evidence Rayner is, either.
    To be slightly fair to Prescott, the basket case that was DETR was way too large for anyone to manage. It's notable that it's now three departments again (DEFRA, DfT, DLUHC).
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,079

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    It's rather the 'debate' over cash-mandates isn't it? Forcing businesses to handle an expensive, antiquated, unsafe and inefficient form of tender despite very few of their customers using it nor demanding it.

    At some stage, this stuff will fizzle out due to demand becoming so low it is statistically zero. We are probably approaching that point already I'd venture.
    How are you going to deal with the poorest in the population who still use cash ?
    Does that include millions of the poorest Londoners who rely on the bus network here (which hasn't accepted cash for several years)?

    People can very quickly adapt – why are you so pessimistic about human agility?
    Why are you so worried about bankers profits ?
    Somebody has to be.

    Remember this government spent more time on fucking fish during the Brexit negotiations than they did on financial services.

    One is the largest contributor to the Exchequer whilst the other contributes 0.01% of GDP.
    I had to read that a couple of times before I realised that 'fucking fish' was simply an exasperated expletive rather than the description of an activity.
  • HYUFD said:
    Cracking video, though.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,806
    edited September 2023
    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Rishi Sunak says it is ‘completely and utterly wrong’ to blame him for school concrete crisis

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2023/sep/04/labour-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-education-raac-schools-building-crisis-shadow-cabinet-reshuffle-uk-politics-latest

    So who's fault is it then?

    Osborne who else ?
    Gordon Brown, for going into the last recession running a deficit, having ‘invested’ in tax credits, and leaving the public finances in an unsustainable position from which they’ve not yet fully recovered.
    I admire your commitment to the Tory cause but I honestly think only the diehards will buy that one.

    Even if you really think Brown caused a sea-change in borrowing (he didn't) how many years would you say we need to allow for competent Tory economic management to turn it around? 15 years? 20 years? 50 years?

    13 years is clearly not enough because the cyclically-adjusted budget deficit which was running at 2.1% before the GFC has now been reduced by the Tories masterful economic management to... oh, 3.1%. Marvellous.

    The voting public are (rightly) not going to blame Gordon Brown for the current shambles.
    Okay, I’ll admit to tongue being a little bit in cheek. It’s been a long day and it’s now beer o’clock!

    Were it not for pandemic and war, the finances would obviously be in somewhat better shape, but you’re right that the blame is heading for the incumbents, as is the case in pretty much every western democracy at the moment.
    'Twas ever thus. Enjoy the beer! (Are you allowed beer out there btw?)
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,685

    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    An issue where there is some justification in being annoyed about how it is portrayed is the water industry and release of sewage etc.

    Genuinely the monitoring of this has changed, and this has led to the impression that things have become much worse, when in reality it is probably not worse than before the increased checks and quick possibly better. Yet the narrative is that after Brexit water companies have started pumping raw sewage into rivers and the sea far more frequently. This is not true.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,806

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    It's rather the 'debate' over cash-mandates isn't it? Forcing businesses to handle an expensive, antiquated, unsafe and inefficient form of tender despite very few of their customers using it nor demanding it.

    At some stage, this stuff will fizzle out due to demand becoming so low it is statistically zero. We are probably approaching that point already I'd venture.
    How are you going to deal with the poorest in the population who still use cash ?
    Does that include millions of the poorest Londoners who rely on the bus network here (which hasn't accepted cash for several years)?

    People can very quickly adapt – why are you so pessimistic about human agility?
    Why are you so worried about bankers profits ?
    Somebody has to be.

    Remember this government spent more time on fucking fish during the Brexit negotiations than they did on financial services.

    One is the largest contributor to the Exchequer whilst the other contributes 0.01% of GDP.
    One puts fish on the table the other fks up the economy
    Well the economy's truly kippered now.
  • boulayboulay Posts: 5,557
    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,806

    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    An issue where there is some justification in being annoyed about how it is portrayed is the water industry and release of sewage etc.

    Genuinely the monitoring of this has changed, and this has led to the impression that things have become much worse, when in reality it is probably not worse than before the increased checks and quick possibly better. Yet the narrative is that after Brexit water companies have started pumping raw sewage into rivers and the sea far more frequently. This is not true.
    Is it too much to expect standards to improve?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    It's rather the 'debate' over cash-mandates isn't it? Forcing businesses to handle an expensive, antiquated, unsafe and inefficient form of tender despite very few of their customers using it nor demanding it.

    At some stage, this stuff will fizzle out due to demand becoming so low it is statistically zero. We are probably approaching that point already I'd venture.
    How are you going to deal with the poorest in the population who still use cash ?
    Does that include millions of the poorest Londoners who rely on the bus network here (which hasn't accepted cash for several years)?

    People can very quickly adapt – why are you so pessimistic about human agility?
    Why are you so worried about bankers profits ?
    Somebody has to be.

    Remember this government spent more time on fucking fish during the Brexit negotiations than they did on financial services.

    One is the largest contributor to the Exchequer whilst the other contributes 0.01% of GDP.
    One puts fish on the table the other fks up the economy
    Well the economy's truly kippered now.
    Im afraid we have to put the bankers back in their plaice
  • FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    An issue where there is some justification in being annoyed about how it is portrayed is the water industry and release of sewage etc.

    Genuinely the monitoring of this has changed, and this has led to the impression that things have become much worse, when in reality it is probably not worse than before the increased checks and quick possibly better. Yet the narrative is that after Brexit water companies have started pumping raw sewage into rivers and the sea far more frequently. This is not true.
    Yes, but the water issue is because the current model - ie the flogging off of public utilities to private equity - remains eagerly supported by this government.

    The narrative is false, but the public know that the government would do it all again, and aren’t promising anything to fix it, either.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,685

    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    An issue where there is some justification in being annoyed about how it is portrayed is the water industry and release of sewage etc.

    Genuinely the monitoring of this has changed, and this has led to the impression that things have become much worse, when in reality it is probably not worse than before the increased checks and quick possibly better. Yet the narrative is that after Brexit water companies have started pumping raw sewage into rivers and the sea far more frequently. This is not true.
    Is it too much to expect standards to improve?
    No - we should aim for zero release of sewage into the rivers and the sea, but that is not the point I am making. Here it is about increased data being portrayed as an increase in release, which is probably not correct.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,792
    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
  • GIN1138GIN1138 Posts: 22,387

    GIN1138 said:

    People have made up their minds. They want the Tories OUT

    Oh and hi, PB.

    And, to be fair, the Tories are doing a great job of reminding people why they want them out on a daily basis.

    I had expected to see some small green shoots of a fightback by now. Not enough to win an election or anything like that, but something.

    I may have to revise my prediction for Lab overall majority (which I thought was a possible, but no means certain outcome). It is starting to feel like we could be heading for a Tory cataclysm.
    There will be some swingback between now and Election 24 and with Labour starting so far behind a majority is a tall order.

    I'm still thinking small (1-20) seat Labout majority in the end... With the Tories left on the end of oblivion in a lot of seats... They better choose their next leader wisely...
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Rishi Sunak says it is ‘completely and utterly wrong’ to blame him for school concrete crisis

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2023/sep/04/labour-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-education-raac-schools-building-crisis-shadow-cabinet-reshuffle-uk-politics-latest

    So who's fault is it then?

    Osborne who else ?
    Gordon Brown, for going into the last recession running a deficit, having ‘invested’ in tax credits, and leaving the public finances in an unsustainable position from which they’ve not yet fully recovered.
    I admire your commitment to the Tory cause but I honestly think only the diehards will buy that one.

    Even if you really think Brown caused a sea-change in borrowing (he didn't) how many years would you say we need to allow for competent Tory economic management to turn it around? 15 years? 20 years? 50 years?

    13 years is clearly not enough because the cyclically-adjusted budget deficit which was running at 2.1% before the GFC has now been reduced by the Tories masterful economic management to... oh, 3.1%. Marvellous.

    The voting public are (rightly) not going to blame Gordon Brown for the current shambles.
    Okay, I’ll admit to tongue being a little bit in cheek. It’s been a long day and it’s now beer o’clock!

    Were it not for pandemic and war, the finances would obviously be in somewhat better shape, but you’re right that the blame is heading for the incumbents, as is the case in pretty much every western democracy at the moment.
    'Twas ever thus. Enjoy the beer! (Are you allowed beer out there btw?)
    Cheers!

    Yes, I’m in the most liberal part of a conservative region. There’s bars in hotels and. Free zones, and state-run off licences here, but you can’t get drink in the supermarket. Saudi is totally dry though, as is most of Qatar. UAE, Bahrain and Oman are the more liberal places. I have a couple of local bars I can walk to, and more importantly walk home from!
  • Gillian Keegan authorised a £34m revamp of her offices in April to provide “improved lighting and a muted colour palette” together with a quiet room and a modernised kitchen just at the time when schools were being asked about concrete problems

    https://x.com/paullewismoney/status/1698612486176489729?s=46
  • BenpointerBenpointer Posts: 34,806

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,685

    Gillian Keegan authorised a £34m revamp of her offices in April to provide “improved lighting and a muted colour palette” together with a quiet room and a modernised kitchen just at the time when schools were being asked about concrete problems

    https://x.com/paullewismoney/status/1698612486176489729?s=46

    Thats some office. Presumably refers to an entire building (and a big one at that) and the funding is not from the education budget.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    An issue where there is some justification in being annoyed about how it is portrayed is the water industry and release of sewage etc.

    Genuinely the monitoring of this has changed, and this has led to the impression that things have become much worse, when in reality it is probably not worse than before the increased checks and quick possibly better. Yet the narrative is that after Brexit water companies have started pumping raw sewage into rivers and the sea far more frequently. This is not true.
    Is it too much to expect standards to improve?
    Standards can and will improve, but its down to the regulator to kick the crap out of the water cos. Its a very cosy industry where nobody upsets each other and where the occasional brown envelope turns up,
  • Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Rishi Sunak says it is ‘completely and utterly wrong’ to blame him for school concrete crisis

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2023/sep/04/labour-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-education-raac-schools-building-crisis-shadow-cabinet-reshuffle-uk-politics-latest

    So who's fault is it then?

    Osborne who else ?
    Gordon Brown, for going into the last recession running a deficit, having ‘invested’ in tax credits, and leaving the public finances in an unsustainable position from which they’ve not yet fully recovered.
    I admire your commitment to the Tory cause but I honestly think only the diehards will buy that one.

    Even if you really think Brown caused a sea-change in borrowing (he didn't) how many years would you say we need to allow for competent Tory economic management to turn it around? 15 years? 20 years? 50 years?

    13 years is clearly not enough because the cyclically-adjusted budget deficit which was running at 2.1% before the GFC has now been reduced by the Tories masterful economic management to... oh, 3.1%. Marvellous.

    The voting public are (rightly) not going to blame Gordon Brown for the current shambles.
    Okay, I’ll admit to tongue being a little bit in cheek. It’s been a long day and it’s now beer o’clock!

    Were it not for pandemic and war, the finances would obviously be in somewhat better shape, but you’re right that the blame is heading for the incumbents, as is the case in pretty much every western democracy at the moment.
    'Twas ever thus. Enjoy the beer! (Are you allowed beer out there btw?)
    Cheers!

    Yes, I’m in the most liberal part of a conservative region. There’s bars in hotels and. Free zones, and state-run off licences here, but you can’t get drink in the supermarket. Saudi is totally dry though, as is most of Qatar. UAE, Bahrain and Oman are the more liberal places. I have a couple of local bars I can walk to, and more importantly walk home from!
    One of the most disquieting things I found when I worked in the Emirates in the late 80s and early 90s was the sign on all the bar doors saying 'Western Dress Only'.

    Obviously I don't understand the local mores and custms but it seemed like it would be hugely offensive to the local population.
  • TOPPINGTOPPING Posts: 43,049
    I thought Gillian Keegan sounded very competent vs Nick Robinson on Today this morning.

    She went through the number of schools possibly or likely at risk from RAAC and what had been done about it. I didn't listen to every detail, and she foundered on the Sunak 50% cut, but she seemed reasonably on top of her brief.

    And it didn't sound as bad as some of the headlines are making out. But then that is her mission accomplished.
  • SelebianSelebian Posts: 8,832
    HYUFD said:
    I'd rather be hit by a bike than that plane :wink:
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,730
    edited September 2023

    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    How much RAAC is there in other countries? Be interesting to know how widely it was used.

    I was always taught that voids in structural concrete were a Bad Thing so I'm not sure where the daft idea came from.

    At least (fingers crossed) we haven't had any bridges fall down yet due to bad concrete.

    Gillian Keegan authorised a £34m revamp of her offices in April to provide “improved lighting and a muted colour palette” together with a quiet room and a modernised kitchen just at the time when schools were being asked about concrete problems

    https://x.com/paullewismoney/status/1698612486176489729?s=46

    How does painting a few walls, throwing in a few comfy chairs, and installing a kitchen cost £34m?

    Even if it is four floors.

    I want to see the itemised bill.
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,246

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    Oi Thatcher can I remind you Lloyds have a banking licence and that puts different obligations on them, If they care to give it up they can do what the hell they like subject to the FCA , but I suspect they wont.
    Why would maintaining pass books be a condition of a banking licence?

    AFAIK banking licences are conditional on the institution managing the various risks properly, so the PRA and FCA don't have to intervene.
  • GIN1138 said:

    People have made up their minds. They want the Tories OUT

    Oh and hi, PB.

    HI Gin. Glad to see you are still around.
  • FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    How much RAAC is there in other countries? Be interesting to know how widely it was used.

    I was always taught that voids in structural concrete were a Bad Thing so I'm not sure where the daft idea came from.

    At least (fingers crossed) we haven't had any bridges fall down yet due to bad concrete.

    Gillian Keegan authorised a £34m revamp of her offices in April to provide “improved lighting and a muted colour palette” together with a quiet room and a modernised kitchen just at the time when schools were being asked about concrete problems

    https://x.com/paullewismoney/status/1698612486176489729?s=46

    How does painting a few walls, throwing in a few comfy chairs, and installing a kitchen cost £34m?

    Even if it is four floors.

    I want to see the itemised bill.
    Lulu Lytle strikes again?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    Oi Thatcher can I remind you Lloyds have a banking licence and that puts different obligations on them, If they care to give it up they can do what the hell they like subject to the FCA , but I suspect they wont.
    Lol, and there's me confusing you with someone who supports the free market!
    Of course I do, but the banks have certain obligations theyd rather not have, Banking is going the same way as the water industry with the regulators not standing up to the banks and reminding them of their commitments,

    Should Starling and Monzo be obliged to issue cheque books, accept passbooks and open bricks & mortar high street branches?
    No, they dont have a banking licence, Try reading the posts occasionally.
    What about https://www.chase.co.uk ?

    They are really an alt-bank, setup by JP Morgan, reusing the Chase brand from the US. The have, IIRC a full banking license.

    They have no branches or cash machines and no intention of ever having them.
  • Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    Oi Thatcher can I remind you Lloyds have a banking licence and that puts different obligations on them, If they care to give it up they can do what the hell they like subject to the FCA , but I suspect they wont.
    Lol, and there's me confusing you with someone who supports the free market!
    Of course I do, but the banks have certain obligations theyd rather not have, Banking is going the same way as the water industry with the regulators not standing up to the banks and reminding them of their commitments,

    Should Starling and Monzo be obliged to issue cheque books, accept passbooks and open bricks & mortar high street branches?
    No, they dont have a banking licence, Try reading the posts occasionally.
    What about https://www.chase.co.uk ?

    They are really an alt-bank, setup by JP Morgan, reusing the Chase brand from the US. The have, IIRC a full banking license.

    They have no branches or cash machines and no intention of ever having them.
    Did we bail them out ?
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    I think the government (see also Nick Gibbs) honestly believe that this is rotten bad luck and it’s because they are more diligent about RAAC-checking than lesser countries.

    And now they’re going to open their “passbooks”, so they deserve gratitude.

    They honestly believe that.
    How much RAAC is there in other countries? Be interesting to know how widely it was used.

    I was always taught that voids in structural concrete were a Bad Thing so I'm not sure where the daft idea came from.

    At least (fingers crossed) we haven't had any bridges fall down yet due to bad concrete.

    Gillian Keegan authorised a £34m revamp of her offices in April to provide “improved lighting and a muted colour palette” together with a quiet room and a modernised kitchen just at the time when schools were being asked about concrete problems

    https://x.com/paullewismoney/status/1698612486176489729?s=46

    How does painting a few walls, throwing in a few comfy chairs, and installing a kitchen cost £34m?

    Even if it is four floors.

    I want to see the itemised bill.
    Lulu Lytle strikes again?
    37,000 page specifications don't just write themselves.
  • boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
  • MalmesburyMalmesbury Posts: 51,148

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    Oi Thatcher can I remind you Lloyds have a banking licence and that puts different obligations on them, If they care to give it up they can do what the hell they like subject to the FCA , but I suspect they wont.
    Lol, and there's me confusing you with someone who supports the free market!
    Of course I do, but the banks have certain obligations theyd rather not have, Banking is going the same way as the water industry with the regulators not standing up to the banks and reminding them of their commitments,

    Should Starling and Monzo be obliged to issue cheque books, accept passbooks and open bricks & mortar high street branches?
    No, they dont have a banking licence, Try reading the posts occasionally.
    What about https://www.chase.co.uk ?

    They are really an alt-bank, setup by JP Morgan, reusing the Chase brand from the US. The have, IIRC a full banking license.

    They have no branches or cash machines and no intention of ever having them.
    Did we bail them out ?
    JPM? No.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,987
    @YouGov
    ·
    2h
    With Friday marking 1 year of King Charles, how have attitudes towards the monarchy changed?

    Answer: they haven't

    Should have monarchy: 62% (same as last poll under Queen Elizabeth, May 2022)
    Should have elected head of state: 26% (+4)
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644509859447157?s=20
    % with a favourable view of each royal

    Prince William: 74%
    Princess Anne: 73%
    Catherine: 72%
    King Charles: 60%
    Prince Edward: 54%
    Camilla: 47%
    Prince Harry: 31%
    Meghan: 24%
    Prince Andrew: 6%
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644525218976103?s=20
  • CarnyxCarnyx Posts: 43,393

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The ones who use their Tory chums to charge us millions for crap PPE certainly spend more, albeit on themselves. And up our taxes too.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,792

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Its an age and wealth thing.

    None of my kids carry cash, I carry cash and cards. They slag me off for carrying cash, bur very so often they get caught short and I dont.

    The better off are likely to use e payment, the less well off less so.

    Cash will probably have its day but until we have covered access to all I see no reason to accelerate it,

  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,079
    HYUFD said:

    @YouGov
    ·
    2h
    With Friday marking 1 year of King Charles, how have attitudes towards the monarchy changed?

    Answer: they haven't

    Should have monarchy: 62% (same as last poll under Queen Elizabeth, May 2022)
    Should have elected head of state: 26% (+4)
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644509859447157?s=20
    % with a favourable view of each royal

    Prince William: 74%
    Princess Anne: 73%
    Catherine: 72%
    King Charles: 60%
    Prince Edward: 54%
    Camilla: 47%
    Prince Harry: 31%
    Meghan: 24%
    Prince Andrew: 6%
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644525218976103?s=20

    That's interesting.
    There were probably a lot of people in the 'don't like the monarchy but do like the queen' category - but they probably all answered 'no' beforehand and continue to do so now.
    Basically people are better at compartmentalising these questions than we might have assumed!
  • boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
    God Save Donald Duck, Vaudeville and Variety.
  • Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
    I guess we can empathise with people better.
  • boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
    I guess we can empathise with people better.
    I can empathise better with real problems.

    Not having cash in your bank account to spend on essentials because it all went on rent - real problem.
    Having too much month at the end of your money - real problem.
    Not having a paying in book - not a real problem.
  • turbotubbsturbotubbs Posts: 17,685

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    Many long years ago I worked in a pub over the Uni holidays. The owner loved having me on the books as I was there legally and officially, one of the very few employees that was...

    I also remember the old brown pay slip envelope.
  • VerulamiusVerulamius Posts: 1,550
    Went swimming yesterday at the local leisure centre.

    They have implemented a cashless system as advertised on their website so I did not bring any cash with me.

    However you still needed a £1 coin to operate the locker.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    The cost of chasing lots of minnows is much higher than harpooning a whale. The money is with the multinats,
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,318
    edited September 2023
    Ed Davey comes off moderately well in his long form interview with Alistair Campbell and Rory Stewart.

    I’m not convinced that liberalism is about “holding powerful people to account”, though.

    How many people know Ed Davey’s life story?
    I’ve said before, he needs to ditch the suit and tie and only wear outdoors gear for public appearances. A subliminal cue that he’s not a pampered southern softie who will privatise your water supply.

    Harold Wilson had his pipe.
    Davey needs his weather-proof gilet.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Sandpit said:

    Rishi Sunak says it is ‘completely and utterly wrong’ to blame him for school concrete crisis

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/live/2023/sep/04/labour-rishi-sunak-keir-starmer-education-raac-schools-building-crisis-shadow-cabinet-reshuffle-uk-politics-latest

    So who's fault is it then?

    Osborne who else ?
    Gordon Brown, for going into the last recession running a deficit, having ‘invested’ in tax credits, and leaving the public finances in an unsustainable position from which they’ve not yet fully recovered.
    I admire your commitment to the Tory cause but I honestly think only the diehards will buy that one.

    Even if you really think Brown caused a sea-change in borrowing (he didn't) how many years would you say we need to allow for competent Tory economic management to turn it around? 15 years? 20 years? 50 years?

    13 years is clearly not enough because the cyclically-adjusted budget deficit which was running at 2.1% before the GFC has now been reduced by the Tories masterful economic management to... oh, 3.1%. Marvellous.

    The voting public are (rightly) not going to blame Gordon Brown for the current shambles.
    Okay, I’ll admit to tongue being a little bit in cheek. It’s been a long day and it’s now beer o’clock!

    Were it not for pandemic and war, the finances would obviously be in somewhat better shape, but you’re right that the blame is heading for the incumbents, as is the case in pretty much every western democracy at the moment.
    'Twas ever thus. Enjoy the beer! (Are you allowed beer out there btw?)
    Cheers!

    Yes, I’m in the most liberal part of a conservative region. There’s bars in hotels and. Free zones, and state-run off licences here, but you can’t get drink in the supermarket. Saudi is totally dry though, as is most of Qatar. UAE, Bahrain and Oman are the more liberal places. I have a couple of local bars I can walk to, and more importantly walk home from!
    One of the most disquieting things I found when I worked in the Emirates in the late 80s and early 90s was the sign on all the bar doors saying 'Western Dress Only'.

    Obviously I don't understand the local mores and custms but it seemed like it would be hugely offensive to the local population.
    That’s still the same, although the signs now say ‘no national dress’ in the bars, rather than ‘western dress only’.

    In other words, if you’re a local Muslim then please don’t dress like one. The licencee can actually be in trouble for serving people in local dress, in the same way as there’s certain dress not allowed by law in bars in England - for example, a police officer in uniform.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
    I guess we can empathise with people better.
    I can empathise better with real problems.

    Not having cash in your bank account to spend on essentials because it all went on rent - real problem.
    Having too much month at the end of your money - real problem.
    Not having a paying in book - not a real problem.
    For you.

    Other people like to manage their affairs to suit themselves. Cant see why this should concern you,
  • This chyron probably wasn’t part of the No 10 back-to-school media strategy



    https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1698692502906122732
  • Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    The cost of chasing lots of minnows is much higher than harpooning a whale. The money is with the multinats,
    Multinats aren't typically (I expect) the ones pretending their staff are part time so they can claim benefits, then paying the difference in cash.

    They may get the attention, but the bugger is in the details, not just large fish.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Its an age and wealth thing.

    None of my kids carry cash, I carry cash and cards. They slag me off for carrying cash, bur very so often they get caught short and I dont.

    The better off are likely to use e payment, the less well off less so.

    Cash will probably have its day but until we have covered access to all I see no reason to accelerate it,

    Do parents these days give their teenage kids pocket money as a bank transfer?
  • This chyron probably wasn’t part of the No 10 back-to-school media strategy



    https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1698692502906122732

    Again, why is it proper for ITV to leak remarks made privately in the studios?
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    The cost of chasing lots of minnows is much higher than harpooning a whale. The money is with the multinats,
    Multinats aren't typically (I expect) the ones pretending their staff are part time so they can claim benefits, then paying the difference in cash.

    They may get the attention, but the bugger is in the details, not just large fish.
    Personally Id attack the issue on a pareto basis tackle the big guys and you get the fastest returns,
  • This chyron probably wasn’t part of the No 10 back-to-school media strategy



    https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1698692502906122732

    Again, why is it proper for ITV to leak remarks made privately in the studios?
    Because the lives of children are at risk and it shows the mentality of the government.
  • We never did get that Mid-Beds poll yet that caused a shift to market odds.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    Selebian said:

    HYUFD said:
    I'd rather be hit by a bike than that plane :wink:
    Waste of a nice plane, a Piper Pawnee. Originally designed as a crop sprayer, now often used as a glider tug plane.
  • So Starmer has pledged to 'grow the economy'.

    And that will fund extra spending on everything.

    Well that's alright then.

    Magic wands already ordered I assume.

    I take it your sticking with another 13 years of inch- perfect Conservative Governments then.
    No, this government is exhausted and so incompetent it doesn't even realise what many of its successes are.

    But Starmer is going to face the impossibility of meeting a myriad of spending demands through 'economic growth'.

    Incidentally economic growth includes the public sector increasing output faster than increasing workforce or pay.

    A good thing if it happens but I suspect its the opposite of what the public sector unions want from a Labour government.
    The UK Government spends more on welfare than it does on the entire public sector combined.

    The Tories have sadly replaced Labour as the party of the welfare state. The Tories are spending a higher proportion of state expenditure on welfare today than Labour did in 2010.

    Public sector employee output is higher than welfare recipient output is, so a rebalancing certainly could boost productivity.
    And we have this welfare spending at a time of full employment.

    Too many people are getting too many handouts.

    And the danger is that a critical mass of welfare recipients has been achieved which makes it impossible to reform this.
    The biggest chunk of welfare spending by far is pensions. The next biggest chunk is supporting low paid workers.

    Then you have the disabled and long-term sick. Then far too much subsiding high-rent landlords. Very little spent on people who can work but aren't.
    Pensions are basically a UBI for the over 66s, and just as unaffordable.
    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    @YouGov
    ·
    2h
    With Friday marking 1 year of King Charles, how have attitudes towards the monarchy changed?

    Answer: they haven't

    Should have monarchy: 62% (same as last poll under Queen Elizabeth, May 2022)
    Should have elected head of state: 26% (+4)
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644509859447157?s=20
    % with a favourable view of each royal

    Prince William: 74%
    Princess Anne: 73%
    Catherine: 72%
    King Charles: 60%
    Prince Edward: 54%
    Camilla: 47%
    Prince Harry: 31%
    Meghan: 24%
    Prince Andrew: 6%
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644525218976103?s=20

    That's interesting.
    There were probably a lot of people in the 'don't like the monarchy but do like the queen' category - but they probably all answered 'no' beforehand and continue to do so now.
    Basically people are better at compartmentalising these questions than we might have assumed!
    It's not quite where I'd like it.

    Ideally, I'd want 70-75%+ for a monarchy and the republicans back in their box. That is a sizeable minority.
  • HYUFDHYUFD Posts: 123,987

    Ed Davey comes off moderately well in his long form interview with Alistair Campbell and Rory Stewart.

    I’m not convinced that liberalism is about “holding powerful people to account”, though.

    How many people know Ed Davey’s life story?
    I’ve said before, he needs to ditch the suit and tie and only wear outdoors gear for public appearances. A subliminal cue that he’s not a pampered southern softie who will privatise your water supply.

    Harold Wilson had his pipe.
    Davey needs his weather-proof gilet.

    Most of the LD target seats, eg Wantage, Esher and Walton, Cambridgeshire NE, Tunbridge Wells, Wokingham, Guildford, Winchester, Henley, Mole Valley, Cheltenham, Lewes etc are full of well off southerners, so Davey knows his target market
  • Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    The cost of chasing lots of minnows is much higher than harpooning a whale. The money is with the multinats,
    Multinats aren't typically (I expect) the ones pretending their staff are part time so they can claim benefits, then paying the difference in cash.

    They may get the attention, but the bugger is in the details, not just large fish.
    Personally Id attack the issue on a pareto basis tackle the big guys and you get the fastest returns,
    Though its also already done. The big guys are already tackled and already have armies of lawyers dotting the i's and crossing the t's.

    Which is why the big guys don't do this, but your Chinese does.

    And you asked why you should care, that's why you should care.
  • The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5
  • HYUFD said:

    Ed Davey comes off moderately well in his long form interview with Alistair Campbell and Rory Stewart.

    I’m not convinced that liberalism is about “holding powerful people to account”, though.

    How many people know Ed Davey’s life story?
    I’ve said before, he needs to ditch the suit and tie and only wear outdoors gear for public appearances. A subliminal cue that he’s not a pampered southern softie who will privatise your water supply.

    Harold Wilson had his pipe.
    Davey needs his weather-proof gilet.

    Most of the LD target seats, eg Wantage, Esher and Walton, Cambridgeshire NE, Tunbridge Wells, Wokingham, Guildford, Winchester, Henley, Mole Valley, Cheltenham, Lewes etc are full of well off southerners, so Davey knows his target market
    No he doesn’t.
    He needs to work on his profile.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,730

    The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    If investment returns stay as they are that's an underestimate. But how do you do that when so many need the money for their house deposit?

    Please don't tell me we will go down the road of allowing your house to be part of your pension plan...
  • Now 29 here in SW London, just been out for a run.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,079

    The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    Once he has learned to spell 'Aberdeen', I might start to listen to him.
  • The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    If investment returns stay as they are that's an underestimate. But how do you do that when so many need the money for their house deposit?

    Please don't tell me we will go down the road of allowing your house to be part of your pension plan...
    It already is.

    So many people I know whose retirement is going to funded in part by either downsizing or equity releases.
  • This chyron probably wasn’t part of the No 10 back-to-school media strategy



    https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1698692502906122732

    Meanwhile, stand by for the Mail to pin the whole fiasco on Remote Working;

    Timeline:

    DfE became aware of the RAAC issue early in August

    Keegan instructed officials to investigate

    While that work was ongoing, on August 25th she flew to Spain to celebrate her father’s birthday, staying in a holiday home she owns there

    While she was in Spain, she worked on RAAC via video conferencing each day, her office said

    This was equivalent to working from home, just abroad, an ally says

    She led ‘gold’ calls, attended by ministers Nick Gibb and Baroness Barran back home in London

    https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1698683447022117024?s=20

    It's not fair to blame GK for any of this. But since when has politics been fair?
  • NerysHughesNerysHughes Posts: 3,375
    edited September 2023

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    A

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    A local chemist to me does exactly this. The Pharmacist pays the staff £7k per year and the rest is paid in cash. I have reported this many times to the HMRC Fraud online system but they do nothing.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    Christ. We've triggered the anti-cash brigade again.

    Without cash, how would people pay for drugs and prostitutes?

    Or round my way fish and chips.
    I think you'll find your chippie will take card payments. They have also moved way from £ s d now too, just saying.
    Some do some dont. Same with Chinese takeaways. My local one asks specifically for cash not cards ( though they do have a machine ).

    Likewise, as I move away from you little Englanders I still find many European countries are heavy cash users.
    Your local Chinese takeaway is obviously trying to avoid tax; you should be taking a stand against the black economy.
    Why would I want to hit a local business with more tax so some Oxbridge PPE twat can piss it up the wall ?

    In tackling tax avoidance we should start with tech cos and cafe chains since thats where the big money is, But of course the powers that be wont want to take that on.
    There's a difference between tax avoidance and tax evasion.

    The problem with some not paying their due taxes is that it means the rest of us end up paying more.

    The PPE twats don't spend less, they just up our taxes instead.
    The people not paying their taxes adequately are the multinationals. Chasing a chip shop isnt going to fill HMG coffers.
    Couldn't disagree more.

    All those shops dodging their VAT add up.

    But worse, what are they doing with their cash? Paying employees cash in hand?

    Which means they don't just evade VAT, they evade Employer NICs. Their employee evades Employee NICs and Income Tax, and then claims Universal Credit they shouldn't be eligible to on top of that.

    A common trick with these businesses is to register their staff part time, have them work full time, and then pay difference in cash. That way if they get inspected the person working is on their books, but NICs are dodged and the Employee "doesn't lose their benefits".

    It all adds up. Massively.
    The cost of chasing lots of minnows is much higher than harpooning a whale. The money is with the multinats,
    Multinats aren't typically (I expect) the ones pretending their staff are part time so they can claim benefits, then paying the difference in cash.

    They may get the attention, but the bugger is in the details, not just large fish.
    Personally Id attack the issue on a pareto basis tackle the big guys and you get the fastest returns,
    Though its also already done. The big guys are already tackled and already have armies of lawyers dotting the i's and crossing the t's.

    Which is why the big guys don't do this, but your Chinese does.

    And you asked why you should care, that's why you should care.
    I dont.

    I think the onus is on bigger companies to pay their way. Theyll spend endless time on ESG and other nonsense while promply avoiding their tax obligations. The accountant and lawyer nonsense only holds good because HMG wont sort the issues out. HMG sets the rules and can do so to improve tax efficiency.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516

    The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    I suppose he'll be looking to treble his salary if we do ?
  • GardenwalkerGardenwalker Posts: 21,318
    edited September 2023

    The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    If investment returns stay as they are that's an underestimate. But how do you do that when so many need the money for their house deposit?

    Please don't tell me we will go down the road of allowing your house to be part of your pension plan...
    It already is.

    So many people I know whose retirement is going to funded in part by either downsizing or equity releases.
    It is entirely natural to do so, given that one’s housing costs OUGHT to decline in retirement (ie without the kids, and the need to stay commutable to a big city).
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,079

    Went swimming yesterday at the local leisure centre.

    They have implemented a cashless system as advertised on their website so I did not bring any cash with me.

    However you still needed a £1 coin to operate the locker.

    I parked at a parking meter the other day. I didn't need cash, but I did need a 'wave and pay card'. Which, after a moments nonplussed reflection, I deduced must be an idiosyncratic name for a bank card. I realise now I don't know exactly what I'd call it - but I wouldn't have called it that.

  • GhedebravGhedebrav Posts: 3,860

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
    I guess we can empathise with people better.
    Indeed, never mind the fact that I’ve found multiple uses for cash over just the last few weeks. It not what most people use most of the time now, but that doesn’t make it obsolete.

    Interesting how views on the subject don’t seem to correspond to political outlook.
  • FlatlanderFlatlander Posts: 4,730
    edited September 2023

    The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    If investment returns stay as they are that's an underestimate. But how do you do that when so many need the money for their house deposit?

    Please don't tell me we will go down the road of allowing your house to be part of your pension plan...
    It already is.

    So many people I know whose retirement is going to funded in part by either downsizing or equity releases.
    Yes, but officially?

    You can't "invest in property" from pre-tax income which you also happen to live in. Can you?

    Edit: I suppose you could, but would need a commercial mortgage?
  • Pro_RataPro_Rata Posts: 5,352
    edited September 2023
    FF43 said:

    Oh my good God, this video needs to be watched, Gillian Keegan needs sacking.

    Blimey - this is quite something

    Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and that it’s frustrating not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’


    https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1698675650096251294

    Obviously no-one has said, "Gillian, you've done a fucking good job on RAAC.". Why does she think they would say that?
    IIRC, she was ranked the 630odd-th hardest working constituency MP in a survey a year or two back. Congratulations, Gillian.

    EDIT: I do a disservice. 615th....

    https://www.change.org/l/uk/the-people-power-index-how-did-your-mp-score
  • bondegezoubondegezou Posts: 11,491

    Gillian Keegan authorised a £34m revamp of her offices in April to provide “improved lighting and a muted colour palette” together with a quiet room and a modernised kitchen just at the time when schools were being asked about concrete problems

    https://x.com/paullewismoney/status/1698612486176489729?s=46

    I think she might need that muted colour palette to help quieten her mood when she sees the reaction her off-interview comments brings!
  • FF43FF43 Posts: 17,246

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Absolutely – neither you nor probably the majority of the population. Yet the PB Cash Nostalgics will seemingly leave no stone unturned in backing lost causes.
    I admit I almost entirely use card or bank transfer to pay these days, but I don't understand why people are outraged by other people using cash and want to deny them the option to do so.
  • The boss of one of Britain’s biggest fund managers has called for a doubling of minimum pension contributions from 8 per cent of pay to 16 per cent in what would amount to a huge change to the retirement saving rules.

    Stephen Bird, the chief executive of Abrdn, said millions of people were heading for an inadequate income in retirement because the present minimum 3 per cent contribution from employers and 5 per cent from employees was not nearly enough.

    Writing in The Times, Bird said: “To have any chance of achieving decent retirement outcomes, the contribution rate needs to double — taking it closer to the levels seen in other developed economies, or indeed, the Abrdn employee scheme.”


    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/contribution-to-pensions-must-double-says-abrdn-chief-mtlt7ntg5

    I suppose he'll be looking to treble his salary if we do ?
    Needs more money to buy some E's.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 14,079

    So Starmer has pledged to 'grow the economy'.

    And that will fund extra spending on everything.

    Well that's alright then.

    Magic wands already ordered I assume.

    I take it your sticking with another 13 years of inch- perfect Conservative Governments then.
    No, this government is exhausted and so incompetent it doesn't even realise what many of its successes are.

    But Starmer is going to face the impossibility of meeting a myriad of spending demands through 'economic growth'.

    Incidentally economic growth includes the public sector increasing output faster than increasing workforce or pay.

    A good thing if it happens but I suspect its the opposite of what the public sector unions want from a Labour government.
    The UK Government spends more on welfare than it does on the entire public sector combined.

    The Tories have sadly replaced Labour as the party of the welfare state. The Tories are spending a higher proportion of state expenditure on welfare today than Labour did in 2010.

    Public sector employee output is higher than welfare recipient output is, so a rebalancing certainly could boost productivity.
    And we have this welfare spending at a time of full employment.

    Too many people are getting too many handouts.

    And the danger is that a critical mass of welfare recipients has been achieved which makes it impossible to reform this.
    The biggest chunk of welfare spending by far is pensions. The next biggest chunk is supporting low paid workers.

    Then you have the disabled and long-term sick. Then far too much subsiding high-rent landlords. Very little spent on people who can work but aren't.
    Pensions are basically a UBI for the over 66s, and just as unaffordable.
    Cookie said:

    HYUFD said:

    @YouGov
    ·
    2h
    With Friday marking 1 year of King Charles, how have attitudes towards the monarchy changed?

    Answer: they haven't

    Should have monarchy: 62% (same as last poll under Queen Elizabeth, May 2022)
    Should have elected head of state: 26% (+4)
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644509859447157?s=20
    % with a favourable view of each royal

    Prince William: 74%
    Princess Anne: 73%
    Catherine: 72%
    King Charles: 60%
    Prince Edward: 54%
    Camilla: 47%
    Prince Harry: 31%
    Meghan: 24%
    Prince Andrew: 6%
    https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/1698644525218976103?s=20

    That's interesting.
    There were probably a lot of people in the 'don't like the monarchy but do like the queen' category - but they probably all answered 'no' beforehand and continue to do so now.
    Basically people are better at compartmentalising these questions than we might have assumed!
    It's not quite where I'd like it.

    Ideally, I'd want 70-75%+ for a monarchy and the republicans back in their box. That is a sizeable minority.
    I don't think you need to worry.
    I'm not part of the 62%. But what would I put in the monarchy's place? I dunno. But probably not what anyone who advocate's the monarchy's removal suggests. And how strongly do I feel about this? It probably doesn't make the top 200 in my list of Things I Want Something Done About.
    I'd say you have to dig through a lot of soft or apathetic republicans before you get people who actually care strongly enough about this to effect some sort of change.
  • Pierre Poilievre seems to be that rare thing, a genuinely impressive right wing leader.

    https://x.com/pierrepoilievre/status/1697956428797923375?s=46&t=L9g_woCIqbo1MTuBFCK0xg
  • AnneJGPAnneJGP Posts: 3,095

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Its an age and wealth thing.

    None of my kids carry cash, I carry cash and cards. They slag me off for carrying cash, bur very so often they get caught short and I dont.

    The better off are likely to use e payment, the less well off less so.

    Cash will probably have its day but until we have covered access to all I see no reason to accelerate it,

    If we stop using cash before Europe does, it's likely we'll end up using the euro anyway.
  • Sandpit said:

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Its an age and wealth thing.

    None of my kids carry cash, I carry cash and cards. They slag me off for carrying cash, bur very so often they get caught short and I dont.

    The better off are likely to use e payment, the less well off less so.

    Cash will probably have its day but until we have covered access to all I see no reason to accelerate it,

    Do parents these days give their teenage kids pocket money as a bank transfer?
    Yes. The two oldest have bank accounts that we transfer £5 and £3 into each week. For the youngest one we use an App that keeps track of a weekly amount going in (£2) and then we take money off if we buy something for her.
  • PulpstarPulpstar Posts: 78,415
    Heading through the outskirts of the toon.
  • AlanbrookeAlanbrooke Posts: 25,516
    AnneJGP said:

    boulay said:

    For those who don’t know what a passbook is here is mine from 1985 which my mother found the other week in some of my late old man’s belongings as an illustration.







    And this is what we are expecting banks to maintain?

    I've heard it all now.
    What the hell is the frigging point of one of those in this day and age?

    Seems even more pointless than chequebooks.

    Never had one.
    Its an age and wealth thing.

    None of my kids carry cash, I carry cash and cards. They slag me off for carrying cash, bur very so often they get caught short and I dont.

    The better off are likely to use e payment, the less well off less so.

    Cash will probably have its day but until we have covered access to all I see no reason to accelerate it,

    If we stop using cash before Europe does, it's likely we'll end up using the euro anyway.
    Indeed, more than just one form of cash.

  • Education secretary Gillian Keegan is recorded on camera saying others ‘have been sat on their a***s’ on schools Raac crisis and shares frustration about not being thanked for doing ‘a f***ing good job’

    https://twitter.com/ITVNewsPolitics/status/1698674935424581991

    Did she learn NOTHING from Gordon Brown?
  • This chyron probably wasn’t part of the No 10 back-to-school media strategy



    https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1698692502906122732

    Again, why is it proper for ITV to leak remarks made privately in the studios?
    It feels like they may have been a bit naughty, but there is no conversation or comment from Keegan beforehand that she expected the remarks to be treated off the record or on lobby terms. Now I’m sure all sorts of conversations go on every day where that is implied rather than explicitly agreed, but maybe politicians need to be more careful about what they say in these asides.
  • AnabobazinaAnabobazina Posts: 23,792

    This chyron probably wasn’t part of the No 10 back-to-school media strategy



    https://twitter.com/breeallegretti/status/1698692502906122732

    Again, why is it proper for ITV to leak remarks made privately in the studios?
    Because the lives of children are at risk and it shows the mentality of the government.
    Her quotes were off the record.
  • SandpitSandpit Posts: 55,031
    Well ITV won’t be getting any ministers to interview for a while.
  • Cookie said:

    Andy_JS said:

    This is a really bad decicsion imo.

    "Lloyds Bank faces backlash for ditching savings passbooks"

    https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/comment/article-12473147/JEFF-PRESTRIDGE-Lloyds-faces-backlash-ditching-passbooks.html

    Good grief, do these still exist?

    The story, of course, is a non-story.

    "I trust Lloyds Banking Group is prepared for a backlash from customers over its discontinuation of more than three million savings passbooks... Although many banks and building societies have already done away with these books they still remain popular among savers who prefer to use a branch rather than go online."

    Will there be a backlash? Maybe, but it will be limited to a very small number of people. Savings passbooks are clearly being subsidised by other customers, they require branches to be open for vanishingly fewer customers, other banks and building societies have already scrapped passbooks. Why should Lloyds not be allowed to run its business efficiently?
    It's rather the 'debate' over cash-mandates isn't it? Forcing businesses to handle an expensive, antiquated, unsafe and inefficient form of tender despite very few of their customers using it nor demanding it.

    At some stage, this stuff will fizzle out due to demand becoming so low it is statistically zero. We are probably approaching that point already I'd venture.
    How are you going to deal with the poorest in the population who still use cash ?
    Does that include millions of the poorest Londoners who rely on the bus network here (which hasn't accepted cash for several years)?

    People can very quickly adapt – why are you so pessimistic about human agility?
    Why are you so worried about bankers profits ?
    Somebody has to be.

    Remember this government spent more time on fucking fish during the Brexit negotiations than they did on financial services.

    One is the largest contributor to the Exchequer whilst the other contributes 0.01% of GDP.
    I had to read that a couple of times before I realised that 'fucking fish' was simply an exasperated expletive rather than the description of an activity.
    Could be that your first impression is as correct as your quasi-mature reflection!
This discussion has been closed.